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Let's Talk About Money Trauma - Episode 50
38 Plays7 months ago
Alright, let's get right down to the brass tax. Money is hard, and talking about money is hard. I think a lot of us can relate to the idea of feeling very "out of control" regarding our money. Now, we are NOT money gurus (not at all, actually), but we wanted to talk today about our upbringings regarding money, and how our education regarding money as children and teenagers, manifested in adulthood. Not gonna lie, this episode made us get VULNERABLE. Beth opens up about how she developed a shopping addiction in her college years, after feeling like the money she made in her childhood wasn't "hers", whereas Ayla grew up as a "Serial Saver," and how she had to work through the stress of not always having a "comfortable" savings account. We dive into our personal stories, but we also share the practical steps we took to better ourselves when it came to being good stewards of money. Our goal for this episode is to shed some light on the mindset of, "just save all your money," that we learn at home and in school, and to help those of you out there who relate to some of our struggles to not feel alone. EVERYONE struggles with money at one point or another, so we're here to share ours, and to encourage you to FACE yours. You've got this, and we've got you.
xo - Beth and Ayla
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Transcript
Learning Responsible Money Skills
00:00:00
Speaker
As adults and business owners, something we've had to learn to tackle is responsible money skills. You might be surprised to learn our previous experiences with the topic of money and the road we both took and are taking to reach financial freedom. Money problems are complex. Some people may struggle with wanting to spend too much of it while some may feel guilty for spending any money at all. Today we share our experiences with our feelings about money as we grew up, our current challenges, the money traumas we've had to and even currently have to unlearn.
00:00:26
Speaker
We get vulnerable talking about how money can cause stress with even the smallest purchase, and we will even cover how it manifested for one of us as a shopping addiction. Stay tuned for all things money today.
Introducing the Art of Intention Podcast
00:00:38
Speaker
Welcome to the Art of Intention podcast with Beth and Ayla. Two best friends turn creative entrepreneurs. This is a place for us to discuss everything, business, friendships, and faith, and occasionally more. We're so excited for today's episode. We think you're going to love it. Stay tuned.
Childhood Money Perspectives
00:00:57
Speaker
Okay. So Ayla, do you want to share what your view of money was kind of like growing up, what shaped your actions around money? Just all of that. Kind of like starting from as a kid. Right. Yeah. Oh man. So growing up, let's see.
00:01:14
Speaker
Where do I start? Okay, so growing up, I was pretty carefree, really didn't know much about our family situation. Money wise, like when you're a kid, hopefully you just don't really think about that and don't know about it. Like you're just chilling. But looking back and after I've kind of, you know, talked to my parents as adults and learn more about our life and stuff.
00:01:34
Speaker
But looking back, I think we probably would have been qualified for mid to lower middle class. We were always fed, always had a roof over heads, eight good meals, all of that stuff, which I'm beyond thankful for. And we were really, really fortunate to have. But of course, I also remember there were times where my mom did have to say no to certain snacks or a new toy or a new book or whatever. I think it really ebbed and flowed. I think we talked about it in one of our Christmas episodes, but there was a year for Christmas.
00:02:02
Speaker
Where are my older siblings? I don't know what was going on or what they knew, but we kind of talked about how like, oh, it might be a bit of a different year for Christmas. Like let's just be thankful for whatever mom and dad can do. And then it was like one of the crazy best Christmases we had. And my brother was like, I don't know what they did. Like we don't like, you know, I think they just like worked so hard to be able to give us stuff like that. I think so.
00:02:25
Speaker
So, of course, I won't disclose all of our situation, but I think there were some years where we weren't living off
Importance of Saving
00:02:30
Speaker
of very much. But as far as I can remember, my parents were pretty good, like I said, about not letting us in on all the money problems. However, once I started getting my own money through chores, doing yard work for other people, whatever, like whatever kind of money you make at 10,
00:02:44
Speaker
or 11, I became a very, very conscious saver. And I still am to this day. My dad taught me a lot about how to save money and talked to me all the time. I think, you know, I earned $5 from cleaning the house once. And he was like, okay, here's the best way to like utilize this. You could have put that in a dry, you know, like was talking big money to me. And I was like, dad, it's just five bucks. Like I don't, but you know, he just taught me a lot about saving, not getting into debt, stuff like that, how that was like the best
00:03:13
Speaker
kind of way to go and principles like if you want to buy a car, you save up the cash and buy it outright. You don't want to pay it off so that you'll never be in debt.
Disciplined Saving for Goals
00:03:22
Speaker
Not bad advice. I don't really believe that kind of thinking holds up now in this economy, but I understand why he taught me that and why that was important to be taught that.
00:03:31
Speaker
So basically all this to say when I first started making my own money, my mindset was if you want something, you have to save up for it. And that's what I did for a very, very long time. And I should mention like my family traveled and stuff and we used to do mission strips to Mexico, which I really loved to do and it was around, I don't remember.
Growing Up Budget-Conscious
00:03:49
Speaker
what we saved up I want to say like $400 to be able to go which is crazy that was so much money as a kid when I was like 10 11 for now it's just like I'd spend that to exist daily but not daily but you know uh you think that's so much money as a kid so I always had this very I have to save up throughout the year to pay for this thing
00:04:10
Speaker
So I would work for it, I'd put it in a jar, I'd put it aside, and I did not touch that jar because that was for something else. And anyway, so that's what I did for a very long time. That was money to me. You saved it, and you didn't go into debt.
00:04:22
Speaker
It just cracks me up. Well, it is funny what you said too about nowadays the save up to pay for everything in cash concept. I'm sure we'll talk more about it later, but that's very interesting because I do think that's changed a lot even since our parents were kids.
00:04:42
Speaker
But yeah, it's funny. There are some things they definitely relate to you with that. I do funny, funnily enough, I do remember you being very much a saver when we were kids. I actually remember a couple of times when I was over at your house, like I think I saw at least at one point you had, didn't you have like some coin machine that like, did it count the or something? I don't know what it was. You put the coins in and it separated it so you could roll it, but then it also counted the amount that you had.
00:05:05
Speaker
in there and then I don't know if you remember I had a giant plastic jug that must have been like an apple cider jug or something that was a plastic or glass might be glass it was glass the apple cider jug right yeah yes that was all of my spare change and like money went into
00:05:22
Speaker
Always. Yeah. I remember that.
Early Realizations and Fears of Debt
00:05:27
Speaker
And it's so funny because I remember, um, we weren't allowed to, so we had a piggy bank. Actually they were bunny banks. They were so cute. They were little bunnies, but, um, we weren't allowed to have them in our rooms. Like we, um, if we all talk more about this, I guess in a second, I'll go into my, my backstory with this, but we had to save our money in these little piggy banks, but we were not allowed to have them in our rooms. Whenever I had a friend that like had their piggy banks or whatever in the room, I was like, whoa, that's crazy. Like we're not allowed to.
00:05:52
Speaker
We have to ask for permission to even see ours. Anyways, okay. I think my dad did something similar sometimes. If I had a lot of money, like if I got paid a lot from a job, around $100 or so, he would put that in a safe sometimes. Oh, good. Well, that's probably good. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So I could collect stuff, but then big amounts, I think we kept it in a safe.
00:06:10
Speaker
Yeah. That makes sense. I mean, parents, that makes sense. They're like, well, we can't get money. They're like, you can't just have money in your room. We're going to put it in a safe and you're like, what do you mean? But yeah, it's my money. Exactly. So, okay. So my view of money was very much shaped during having, uh, I would say budget conscious parents. Um, I guess it's similar to yours, I think.
00:06:31
Speaker
To be honest, I don't know though if that was, how much of that was by necessity or how much of it was like by choice. Like if that was their way of getting debt free and being responsible with money. I know they're very into like Dave Ramsey, but I never felt like we had a lot of like fun spending money as a kid. Again, never like, I'm not saying I felt like we were starving or anything. My parents made sure we always, like you said, had a roof over heads. We always had food. Definitely not destitute by any means, but
00:06:58
Speaker
We like yeah, we weren't like kind of like you said it we weren't always going out and buying new toys And if my friends went and got new things like I I would just feel like I wasn't always getting that as many times Not necessarily worried about it or frustrated with it. But yeah so also as far as money what I was just talking about we
00:07:16
Speaker
like any money we got as kids we had to put in these little piggy banks that like my parents kept in their rooms like uh which i guess is good for teaching kids to save money so we didn't blow it all and that's what my mom i think would express to me is that she would be worried that i would like spend it all and to be honest i think i probably would have knowing myself looking back now i don't know how she saw that and like a five-year-old but a hundred percent i think i probably would have done that
00:07:41
Speaker
Or if you earned money, like you and I did the same job, earned money.
College Financial Habits
00:07:45
Speaker
You were like, we're going to go get ice cream. We're going to go do this. And I was like into the jug. It goes for me. Yes. And so, yeah, exactly. But I will say quick note, looking back on this, I wonder if I'm a spender.
00:07:59
Speaker
naturally or if it's because of that like I so for me as I got a little bit older whenever I would get money I felt like I had to spend it right away or it was gonna be locked away because that's how that felt to me a little bit okay but anyways so
00:08:16
Speaker
I feel like because of that, I never really fully learned how to like responsibly budget or like how to spend responsibly. I was also very, very afraid of debt. I think you kind of mentioned this to Ayla, is that like same with you? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yes. Literally refused to have a credit card until well after I was married.
00:08:37
Speaker
Like literally. I didn't have one till after. That's so crazy. You too? Oh no, I'm feeling so crazy. Yeah, I just thought like, and people would talk to me too, like around college, like how do you not have a, like, how do you not have credit? How do you have a car? I'm like, well, I saved up cash. What do you mean? Like a guy I don't need. I was like, you would be surprised. I remember I told someone once, I'm like, you'd be surprised. You actually can do everything without a credit card. You just have to like do it the right way.
00:09:00
Speaker
And I want to go and slap myself. Okay, we're actually very similar with how that comes because I always had a debit card and you can go ahead and finish your story. I know you can. I know so much off of that debit card. And Chris was like, how are you doing this? And I was like, I just save. And then, but again,
00:09:16
Speaker
I'll get into it in my next little bit here, but I, I just, I didn't pay for anything as a college student. Like you didn't have as many bills. So you're like, obviously you're just not why it's with your penny. And then you go pay rent for the first time and then you buy a car and then you buy all this and yeah, you want to slap 18 year old you.
00:09:31
Speaker
Exactly. Well, and it's hard to, one of the reasons I want to slap myself in the face is because I was doing that. I understand my aversion. I'll talk more about it though. I understand my aversion to not wanting to have debt, but the problem is debt is a tool. And since I had no debt, I was building no credit, which means that the things I need good credit for now are a little bit more of a struggle because my credit history isn't as long. I could, everything I was paying for a debit card for, not everything, but like
00:09:57
Speaker
Obviously, like some big things. I could have been putting big things that I pay off right away on the credit card and literally been building credit.
Managing Money in College
00:10:05
Speaker
Chad, I don't know if I should say this. Chad has an over 800 credit score. He has had a credit since I think high school. He said he had a credit card.
00:10:14
Speaker
Again, was very mindful with it and he taught me, sorry, this is so random, such a side note, folks. I don't know. We can like... Go for it. No, it's all good. Okay. He taught me, you can use a credit card like a debit card if you're afraid of debt. He said, you literally just go pay for your thing on a credit card and two seconds later, log into your bank and pay it off if it scares you.
00:10:34
Speaker
And so I was like, that's so interesting. No, that's why I don't acknowledge. Well, actually, no, it's not because I didn't have a credit card. What am I talking about? When I did get a credit card, I only paid, I think for my gas on it, and then I paid it off right away. You want to hear something hilarious? I have really good credit in the United States. My credit there is very good because I was able to have a good credit card. It sucks in Canada.
00:10:55
Speaker
What? That's stupid that it's not the same. That's how is it not the same? Yeah, like what? Yeah, no, that hurts me. Like it's somehow it's still really good in the States. Wow. It's not awful in Canada. It's just again, I don't have a very long credit history and then having stuff on a credit card more consistently.
00:11:14
Speaker
Yeah. Doesn't make it look very good. So it's just like, yeah. Yeah. It's annoying that it didn't carry over because I could have come here with good credit, but they're like, Oh, we don't actually care about that. You have to start completely over. That's crazy to me because like someone being responsible with money in one country is going to be like, it's the same. It's not a credit is just, it's just information. Like, I don't see why country big. No, that doesn't apply. We don't believe those purchases and payments. Whatever. I'm sorry about that. That's such a bummer.
00:11:42
Speaker
But all that to say, I think I was very, I came out of my childhood very afraid of money. I didn't really, I was very avoidant about it. Like I didn't want to have to like, I don't know. I was very afraid of money. And I think Ayla, this actually goes back to how I used to say I wanted to live on an island when I was a kid so that I could avoid bills. I think I just was afraid of having to deal with money, budgeting, saving, avoiding debt.
Fear of Financial Responsibilities
00:12:08
Speaker
No, you said you wanted to die before you got old so that you didn't. There's also that. Like, yes, we always talked about, we're like, we're just gonna run away. We're gonna find an island with literally nobody on it. And that's what we're gonna do. We're just gonna get plopped there. So we don't have to worry about money, bills, but there are times you're like, I don't know if I could just die before I'm like 20. And I was like, I was like, Beth, what do you mean? You're like, that's when bills happen. And I just, I don't want to make a budget. Like, I'll just die. And I was like, you can't say
00:12:40
Speaker
I'm telling you, dude.
Financial Challenges in Business
00:12:43
Speaker
I think we already started our own businesses, which is like literally the worst thing you could do if you don't want to deal with taxes and bills. Yeah, we dove headfirst into that one right there. Joke's on us by ourselves. Anyway, so yeah, there you go. That's my little backstory. I think I really wandered there a couple of times on points, so I apologize for that. If you're listening, you're like, well, Beth, that was a whiplash right there. But there's that.
00:13:05
Speaker
No, that was good. I think that's really crazy how similar, similar upbringings and stuff what you said about you would spend the money or else it would get locked away. Yes, really resonates like that's a really interesting mindset because I think, like I said, I was a saver and stuff.
00:13:22
Speaker
And I think I was confused as a kid that the money just went and sat there, you know, in a jar. I mean, obviously, it wouldn't grown up money, you put it in the bank, you would put investments like it does a little bit more for you. But as a kid for it to just go sit there, I think I do remember being like, so do I ever get to use this? But like I said, I also saved up for things like, yeah, trips or whatever. So I knew I'd spend it at some point. But I can really understand that like, you make the money, but you're like, I'm never gonna get to use this. So I'm using it right now.
00:13:49
Speaker
and how that would carry over I think that's that's really interesting so it sounds like yeah we both had some learning to do about money by the time we hit college and even with opposite mindsets because all right
00:14:03
Speaker
Because yeah, once you started making your own money, you're like, well, I'm going to spend this now or else it's going to get taken away. And I was like, this goods put aside, I don't touch it. It's really interesting. Here's the thing as I kind of get more into like growing up and where money troubles kind of started to really show up.
00:14:20
Speaker
I think I'm kind of living out some money trauma right now, like right now as a 26 year old, and I'll explain why. But I'll talk about when I was in college first and what money meant to me because that's when I was really working, making my own money, building a savings, like all of that. When I was going to college and working, I want to be really honest about the fact first off that I didn't have
00:14:41
Speaker
very many expenses. I was able to save very well but it's because I didn't have any expenses. I lived out of an apartment that my parents owned and the rule was when I was in school I didn't have to pay them rent. So during the summers I paid rent and when I was done school but still living there I paid rent.
00:14:58
Speaker
But that was a lot of years that I didn't have to pay rent and rent is the number one bill for a lot of people. So I understand you can save a lot quicker without that expense. I didn't pay a phone bill, car insurance, healthcare, like any extra bills. I paid for my gas and groceries and then anything else I wanted and then rent sometime.
00:15:17
Speaker
So I want to say I know I was in a very fortunate situation that not everyone gets to be in. And because of this, I became a big saver. I loved watching the amount in my savings just go up and up and up to just sit there. But I did not buy anything that I didn't need. I very rarely bought new clothes, barely even thrifted. I think I bought new clothes maybe once a year.
00:15:39
Speaker
uh if i went to a wedding or something i just went off of dresses that i already had my mom offered you know my mom would as we were all moving out of the house my mom would take us on shopping dates so she offered to buy anything that was fine yeah i think i would there were a few times where i would yeah have to buy a couple new pairs of pants and if it was more than $60 i would pan i'd get so mad that i had to spend that even if like all my jeans were literally dead and i needed new ones once i bought them i would just be so mad that it was i think
00:16:09
Speaker
I think one time I was mad that I got tuna periods of jeans and a few bras and it was $65 and that cracks me up because that's super cheap. No, like it's not even that much. But I was just so mad about it. So I think I spent most of my money on food because I didn't cook for myself a lot in college.
00:16:24
Speaker
So I bought food and then every few months I did give in to some like Amazon therapy, just some online shopping therapy. But if it wasn't cute new things for my apartment on Amazon or food or gift for someone, I really did not like to buy anything day to day.
00:16:39
Speaker
Like I said before, I did like going on trips. I went on lots of road trips in college, I went to concerts, things like that, but I had to calculate the amount and put that money aside. It kind of hurts me because I built up a good savings doing this that's been long gone ever since getting buried moving countries, immigration, traveling full time, like bye bye.
Missed Financial Opportunities
00:17:01
Speaker
But for a long time, every single solitary purchase I had to make made me feel sick.
00:17:05
Speaker
I hated spending money. I buy myself lunch at school and oh my gosh and I mean it's also really stupid because you know a salad at university is 850 and ramen was 50 cents so I was like what are we gonna do here but like just yeah buying my own groceries or paying for school books made me feel guilty because I wasn't putting that money aside for savings.
00:17:27
Speaker
even though I really needed it, every time I spent it, I was like, this could have gone into savings. This could have gone into savings. And like a lot of my first adult purchases that I was really happy about like a TV and some furniture, I saved up. So I looked up, like I shopped for what I wanted, got the cost.
00:17:44
Speaker
worked for a few weeks, put that aside in tips, paychecks, whatever, and then went and bought it. And that was how I bought everything for the longest time. Wow. Even though you had enough money in your savings where you could have bought it right then, you're like, it's a new purchase. So I still saved. Oh, wow. Yeah, absolutely. That is so interesting. We could not have been different, like even any more different in college.
00:18:04
Speaker
Like that is just so like, wow. And it's funny because the way you were saving, I know you're going to talk more about what that has led to now and stuff, but like the way you were saving is like the way that I would have thought I should have been doing things, but I just couldn't and didn't in college. Like, of course, I know you're so strict with yourself though. So it's just like, yeah, but okay. So for me, I was, like I said, the opposite. I was a big shopper.
00:18:29
Speaker
And, um, I think the first manifestation of like my childhood money trauma, I guess you could say, I hate. Okay. I know that's a big word that we're using that like saying trauma, but that's a legit like phrase. Like it's just, yeah, that's just like how our irresponsibility with money has just manifested now.
00:18:50
Speaker
Okay. Anyways. Yeah. Okay. It's a big word, but I, you know, kind of appropriateness time. Cause it's just like a reaction of upbringing, you know? Yeah, exactly. Okay. So for me, I developed a little bit of a shopping addiction in college.
00:19:06
Speaker
looking back I really like I spent so much money and I don't even remember what I bought there's no way I could have even kept it all because I lived in a dorm room for multiple years and I just didn't have space for so I don't understand what I was buying even like looking back I know I definitely bought a lot of food like for a period of time I was spending just so much money on like really just like nice food not going out to eat I never did that that's
00:19:31
Speaker
Funnily enough, I actually never went out to eat either, really. Like Chad and I didn't go on food dates very much, and I didn't like eating out at restaurants because I thought it was quote unquote irresponsible, yet you're going to laugh because the other stuff I did is hilarious. But yeah, so I was shopping. I never cooked for myself in college. I didn't even know what I ate. Like how did I even, I did sometimes, but I know I didn't out for every meal. So I don't know. I don't know what happened, but I think I did just buy like fast food and like college food a
Shopping Addiction and Financial Health
00:19:58
Speaker
lot. Yeah. That makes sense.
00:20:00
Speaker
especially when you're out busy doing stuff, like wherever food is around you, you're just going to grab that. Um, but anyways, I was very conscious about like cooking at home and I enjoyed cooking though. So for me, it was really fun. Okay. But so at the worst of it, I was shopping about once a day at like TJ max Ross target thrifting as well. We had some really good thrift stores in college. Not going to lie. I would spend my paychecks usually within a couple of days of getting them.
00:20:27
Speaker
And the entire thing, like everything, but sometimes a couple of dollars, a few dollars. Like if I knew I would need to get gas a few days later, I'd leave like $40 or something. Or sometimes I would accidentally be down to like 20 cents and be like, shoot, like I guess I am going to be walking to school if I run out of gas this week. And I literally would just like walk to school if I didn't, couldn't get gas in my car. And I would sometimes put like a dollar of gas in my car, just whatever I had.
00:20:53
Speaker
And like, yeah, so I had zero, when I say I had zero savings, zero. You say that you stressed me out, but. You would have, I don't think you were aware of my money situation in college. You would have had an actual heart attack. I would have brought you to an early grave, but anyways.
00:21:15
Speaker
Yeah, every time I, so and here's the thing too, every time I thought about starting a budget, I would go out and shop and tell myself, I have to go out one last shopping trip if I'm going to stop spending money. So okay, I'm going to start a budget next week. So this week, spend it all. Literally almost like an addict mindset. Oh, for sure. Like that's what happens when people want to quit drinking. They're like one more party and then, you know, not to get super dark, but that's, that's a very real mindset to have.
00:21:44
Speaker
depending on something like that. That is insane. Absolutely. Well, yeah, no, it was very much an addiction. Like, and I'll kind of explain, keep explaining how. So it was, it was so all or nothing with me. Cause in my mindset, I was either spending everything I had, like my money was mine to do what I wanted with.
00:22:00
Speaker
It was very like I get to spend it all or it had to be like a Dave Ramsey program or like being locked away when I was a kid. Absolutely don't touch it. I didn't really know. I didn't know I have a concept of a healthy middle ground. So I started to realize that I had a problem. I started to realize when like I wouldn't be able to concentrate on homework if I hadn't gone shopping that day.
00:22:25
Speaker
Like quite literally. It was my coping mechanism. It was how I celebrated. It was how I, it was just, it was just such a big part of me. I had to shop and it's funny because I always thought I was being kind of responsible because I would thrift or I'd go to Ross, you know, I hadn't stepped foot in like the bougie stores, but I was just nickel and diming it all away. Um, anyways, so something kind of funny.
00:22:49
Speaker
this also helped me realize how much of a problem i had but chad started to point out of course that it's not normal to like spend all of your money within a few seconds of getting it like immediately sometimes it was bad sometimes i would get my paycheck and quite literally go cash or go like cash to the bank or what is it deposit it and then literally go straight to the store and spend all of it
00:23:09
Speaker
Like within seconds, it was bad. It was so bad. Even it's kind of embarrassing talking about it, but okay. That must've been like, we were both just deep into school and not talking about it. Cause I had no, I had no clue. Well, I was, I didn't think, why would I talk about it? I didn't think I was doing anything wrong. I wouldn't visited you at school once. And I think I remember.
00:23:30
Speaker
We were joke because we're both in college and you were like, oh, like, no, I can't do this in this. I'm broke. And I would be like, yeah, same. Like I had a savings, but I also thought I was like the broke college student, which like, I wasn't making tons of money, but again, because I didn't have very many bills, but everyone just makes the broke college student joke.
Journey to Financial Responsibility
00:23:49
Speaker
But then we would go. Yes.
00:23:50
Speaker
You know, we went to like the mall. Oh, we went, we did go shopping one day and we went to a mall, bought some food. And I remember thinking like that just said she's broke, but I thought it was like me. Like you just didn't, you had money that you just didn't want to spend, but it cracks me up. That was probably like what you had at that time. You know, I probably, so yeah. So for stuff like that too, if I knew it was coming in advance, I would obviously, I could quote unquote, I'm using like air quotes right now, save money. Like if you were visiting, I obviously probably set aside a couple hundred dollars, but.
00:24:19
Speaker
that was literally all the money i had in the world like it was quite literally very it was interesting so it's funny that you say that because one of the things that just it made me so mad at first but the more i sat on it i realized that that's actually a good good kind of mindset okay so
00:24:38
Speaker
just like you said, you would say like, oh, I have no money left, but you really have savings. So I remember I would say like, I have no money left and it would mean I have like minus 30 cents in the bank account. Like literally would be in debt to the bank for 30 cents with a debit card somehow. And Chad one time said he was out of money and I was just kind of like, oh no, how much do you have left? Like I was like panicking like, oh, do you need me to like give you some money? Like I was like, oh no. He was like, yeah, I'm down to like a thousand dollars. And I was like,
00:25:05
Speaker
It blew my mind. I was like, oh, so you're rich. Like what? What do you mean? Like what? Like, and for him, he was panicking. He was like, I not panicking. I mean, it's chat. He's like a rock, but you know, he was like, Oh, you know, money's getting a little tight, but yes. And I was like, what do you mean? What do you mean? That's such a great shopping spree right there. Let's go. I did not encourage him ever to spend his money. And to be honest, I think he bailed me out a couple of times. Like,
00:25:32
Speaker
I had like a payment coming up and he like paid it in like within 24 hours, like paid him back. But I didn't like that. That also kind of woke me up. I think we did that once. And I was like, Oh, not a fan of that. So anyways, that was that was my
00:25:47
Speaker
A lot of people don't know that about me. It's funny. I was just talking to a friend the other day and I mentioned, um, like I was actually talking about money trauma and like being bad with money and having a shopping addiction. And she was like, what do you know about that? Like your house is perfect, which was so sweet of her to say it's not. But I was like, dude, why, like I,
00:26:06
Speaker
Like I had a huge problem in college like there's a reason that I'm very try to be very minimalist now and I'm very Calculated and and like this because there's a lot of reasons but one of the reasons is also because I've I've been through a pretty bad shopping addiction Yeah, so little fun fact for people there That was what my college years look like played it fast and loose with my money quite quite a lot Thanks for sharing that though because that I definitely know you're probably not alone and
00:26:35
Speaker
In that, and it's just crazy, I think that could be a lot of jokes about shopping addiction or whatever. It's just people might not think it's super real, but everything you described is just kind of like everything else. You couldn't focus unless you went and got to do that.
00:26:53
Speaker
And no, that's just crazy. Well, and to be fair, I think I'm one of the lucky ones where like I didn't, and here's the thing too. I regret not having a credit card earlier, but at the same time, thank God, because I think I would have been in more debt. Like I would have been in so much debt. I don't think I would have handled that well up until, you know, I started to get more responsible with my money. But so I know I'm one of the lucky ones line of 2000, 5,000, whatever it is on a credit card.
00:27:21
Speaker
And when you're already in that place, you'd be like, Oh, great. All I see is 5,000 that I get to go use, right? Yeah. Or you know, a couple weeks because, because one of my rules, I, I kept this up for the longest time. And then again, with life and stuff, it's difficult. But for me on a credit card, I still wasn't allowed to use it unless I could pay it within two weeks. Like the next paycheck, I need to be able to pay it that I do not like buy that now. I want to tell everyone right now. You know, like,
00:27:47
Speaker
we're not yeah anyway I'll get into kind of our situation now like we don't have serious debt problems or anything but it's definitely I don't get to like pay off my credit card as I use it and that's yeah like that's just realness but yeah like if you I remember when I first got one because I'd been living off of debit for years and when I first got a credit card and I got approved for a decent line I was like
00:28:07
Speaker
I could see how this would be dangerous. Like I could see how this would be. Exactly. Like that's the exact same with me. I'm so glad I didn't have one in the beginning, but I do. I'll talk more about this later, but I do wish I had maybe gotten one a couple of years earlier than I got. Then I ended up getting one just to build more credit and stuff.
00:28:23
Speaker
But also, I don't know, at the same time, who knows? Money has been a struggle for me. Um, responsibility with it, I should say. Okay. So now we both kind of like given our backstories with that. So if we want to kind of go into present day a little bit or to more when the shift, when shifts have started to happen, I think it is where Ayla and I are going to kind of talk, separate a little bit and talk about slightly different. Um, we kind of went in slightly different ways and we're both dealing with different things.
Learning Financial Tools and Habits
00:28:50
Speaker
So Ayla, if you want to start and talk about whatever you want with that.
00:28:53
Speaker
Yeah, so like I said, I was just coming out of this very conscious money spending time and you know, a couple years have gone by, you know, traveling, getting married, all of that. And like I said, all that was on debit. I don't frickin know how like it was savings for sure.
00:29:10
Speaker
But it's just yeah, it was crazy and I just want to say a side note before I get into it We were talking about credit cards and stuff I just want to say there was a brief bit of time at our high school where we learned they They tried to teach us about like taxes a credit card They didn't do a very good job about it and the only thing I learned about credit cards was don't get one because debt you'll get one and that's just gonna happen to you and it's gonna Multiply and you're never and your credits gonna go down like your credit score is gonna go down and you'll just never get it back up like it was this big scary thing and that's
00:29:40
Speaker
That's the worst case scenario with a credit card is that you do get it and you're irresponsible and your credit score does go down. And it's just stupid to me that it goes down so easily, but it's so hard to get it back up. Like you can be behaving so well for months and the numbers go up a little bit, but then if you're bad for like a month, it's like, like you're the worst, you know? Not even bad for a month. It can be like you made one little mistake and it's like dropped. It's so frustrating.
00:30:07
Speaker
And then, so that's what school taught. And I really wish they could have taught like, oh, this can be a good thing to have as an adult for things like, not really car payments, because I think we pay that on my debt. But it's showing you more as a tool. Again, for emergencies as a tool to build credit. Absolutely. Because yeah, how are we going to tell kids that you shouldn't get this because debt and then shoot them out into a world that relies on your credit score. If you want to rent your credit score doesn't really matter. I think they just want to see
00:30:33
Speaker
No, they do care a little bit though about it sometimes because I know for me, I didn't have enough in like quite enough. Like they didn't really love my income situation during one of my college apartments. And they're like, okay, well, what's your credit score? And I was like, Oh, I don't have a credit card. And they're like, that's hilarious. You can't rent here. And they actually have to get a co-signer so that you do even to rent, even to rent. They want you to have credit. Like, Oh my gosh. Sorry. That's crazy. Yeah. Cause whenever we've rented here, they just want to see that we have jobs and get like a rough estimate.
00:31:02
Speaker
estimation of our like yearly income. So we just gave them that, but they just want to see that you're holding down a job. So I haven't had to show my credit score. They looked when we had a car and we showed them Christmas credit score because mine's not very good in Canada. So yeah, anyway, just dumb. But it's just dumb that that's what like is taught about credit cards are so bad, but it can be a tool. It can help you build up credit. And if you learn how to use it responsibly, it's fine. Like getting your credit card does not automatically need huge gaping hole of that.
Misconceptions About Credit Scores
00:31:29
Speaker
So anyway, yeah, just had to get that off my chest. So
00:31:34
Speaker
This could probably be a whole thing about how we teach kids about money in school. I'm aware if you teach taxes in school, kids might not pay attention, might not care, but let's at least give them a little something. What the heck is that? Yeah, because some kids will remember it and obviously they're children so they may not fully
00:31:53
Speaker
do it right, right away, but at least planting the seed that like being realistic about what it is and how it's supposed to be used. And I feel like they should have just given you like, they should have given us more strict, like here's ideally how you should be using it. And here are some ways where here are some benefits you're going to get from it. Um, and here's the real warning. Like don't do this.
00:32:13
Speaker
Yeah, your Netflix subscription, that was what I learned later in college, like your Spotify, your Netflix, your subscriptions, put that on your credit card and then pay them off because monthly you'll be building right away, just little things like that. Exactly. It's hard when you just like
00:32:29
Speaker
learn it yourself. So yes. And when you, and learn it through trial and error, which I think that's what you and I have kind of been talking about. We had to learn all these things the hard way. We're lucky that we, you know, we've been pretty lucky I'd say, but still have had to learn some of these things the hard way and it's, it's not good. Also, this is not necessarily an advice episode. Right. No, this is a, here, here we are.
00:32:54
Speaker
Yeah, this is more transparency. There are some things I think we'll share that might be helpful if you are in some other situation that we used to be in. Of course, we think that we can learn from each other, but we're in no way financial gurus.
Outdated Financial Advice
00:33:11
Speaker
Yeah, it's more of a fun. I think we can offer some advice to maybe people who are a little younger, but we're not. Don't be taking notes. We're having a good time here, basically. I probably have the average budget tip, but it's just like,
00:33:24
Speaker
Yeah, it's more the common sense stuff anyway. All right. Well, I'm sorry, common sense. Anyway, well, Christian, I've talked all the time, if we have the means when we have a family to offer them something like what I have, like an apartment that they can live out of and learn how to buy their own groceries and learn absolutely how to do like gas and
00:33:42
Speaker
and maybe slowly get their own phone bill and stuff but not have rent put on them so they can just figure themselves out that's 100% what i want to pass on because life's not going to get any easier money-wise for anybody and i don't consider that spoiling a kid at all if you're still slowly teaching them about money but without it just being like dropped on them
00:33:59
Speaker
all at one time because I've seen so many friends who didn't get the situation that I had and just like graduated and got kicked right out into the world and all the money problems it comes with and they just they feel like they're still as everyone gets to their closer to their 30s are finally like coming around and getting a handle on it so if I can like exactly at any point that's 100% what I want to do and hopefully teach to the best of my abilities
00:34:23
Speaker
what to do, like we're gonna sit and do your taxes together, we're gonna sit and go what this looks like together.
Financial Planning and Family Support
00:34:29
Speaker
Even if they don't care, because I remember my dad definitely tried to teach me about money stuff when I was like 10 and I was like that, I don't care, but you know, age appropriate, like money.
00:34:38
Speaker
Yeah and it's always something you can revisit like if they don't pick it up well at 10 maybe you try again at 12 you try again at 15 and then at some point you have to be like okay well you're doing it for yourself right now so let me walk you through it but you have to sit down and do it but yeah but yeah so anyways anyways so like Beth said how we decided to change what's kind of going on now how we knew
00:34:59
Speaker
uh that our money like things had to get better like Beth's kind of shopping thing my obsessive savings let's go so right now like I said right now present day 2024 I'm at this weird place with money uh I should also mention that Chris my wonderful sweet husband is a spender and I'm a saver so we really had to communicate that right off the bat when we got married we we luckily in some pre-marital counseling learned that about each other very quickly who's the saver who's the spender and it's actually I think that's a really healthy
00:35:28
Speaker
relationship. Some people might want to jump to that could cause problems and it can money be a huge problem in marriage but I think it worked out really well with us because over the years I was able to teach Chris how to be a better saver and how to say no to certain things when shopping even if you really want it like just how to be a little bit more conscious about what's coming in and out and he's taught me that it is okay to spend some times and that I don't need to feel guilty for buying first off the literal food we eat
00:35:53
Speaker
But can I stay out or some clothes or things that can make my life easier like I I just invested in a new laptop for my business that was a big expense that I was avoiding doing avoiding doing but I was so stressed with my old one it was dying it was done.
00:36:08
Speaker
And it stressed me out so much. And he was there to be like, you are literally causing so many problems for yourself that can be fixed if you just purchase that you can afford, you know, through, through your business. And then I did it was fine. Anyway, we've been able to teach each other a lot of things that are really nice. The thing is, though, right now, open and honest, I feel more
00:36:29
Speaker
out of control with my money than I ever have before. A lot of it comes down to the economy and the current cost of living, especially in Canada right now. I think the whole world is really feeling it. Money just doesn't get you as far as it used to these days, and I think people all around the world are feeling that. Beth and I were chatting a bit before we hopped on this call about the cost that our parents bought homes at, and I don't even want to know. If you bought a home in the 80s or 90s, I don't care what you bought it for, don't you?
00:36:58
Speaker
Well, I do care if I'm happy for you, but I was one years old in those times. I think it bugs me people have a bad attitude about young people not being able to buy homes or homes. That's what it is. If they're like, why don't you have a home? It's like shush. Yes. They're like, well, I did it at your age. Yeah, exactly. Did not sit there and say I did it at your age because at your age, your house was, when you were my age, sorry, it was like $25,000.
00:37:22
Speaker
Well, and income versus what the house was. You still had to save up, but like our income now versus what a house is, it didn't inflate the proper way.
Current Financial Mindsets
00:37:32
Speaker
So now it's just off. Anyway, so it feels so right now with all that I kind of have this really big like F this mindset with money. It feels like the world's not allowing me to save my money the way I could before. And granted, yeah, I wasn't paying rent. But still, that's a huge expense. I think also in high school, we had this other role that your rent shouldn't be
00:37:52
Speaker
It was the 30% rule. Your rent shouldn't be more than 30% of your monthly income. Let's all laugh at that. Because most people, our province right now, Saskatchewan is actually the most affordable rent market right now. The average cost of rent is like $1,000 a month. We're in Toronto, 24%.
00:38:13
Speaker
That's not average. I'm saying those are some big amounts. I think average is maybe 16 to 17. Those might be wrong. No one came after me, but you know, it's huge amounts and their monthly income. So say their monthly rent is 14, their monthly income might be what 15.
00:38:30
Speaker
Like, I'm not even kidding. Like, some, depending on what the job is, like, we've long passed that 30% rule. So it just cracks me up when people are like, don't spend more than 30% of your income on rent. That's a joke. Yeah, so I have this big just like, the world's not allowing me to save money the way I could before. So why should I? I'm just gonna go buy lunch instead of making my own. I'm gonna buy a coffee instead of making my own. I'm not gonna put aside the money for a fun concert night with Chris. I'm just gonna buy it because I have a credit card and I can.
Practical Spending and Saving Strategies
00:38:56
Speaker
So I'm kind of like currently in the place that you were in in college, Beth, maybe not so intense, like an addiction, but just like, I'm not saving for things as much anymore. Because I'm like, I can't. So if I have the money, I'm just gonna buy the thing because I'm not getting a house in this lifetime anyway. So why bother saving?
00:39:14
Speaker
This is, again, not in the advice column. This is just realness I'm going through right now. Keep in mind, big spending for me probably isn't that big of spending, but it just feels like it is. Big spending for me is probably eating out more than the average person would a week. All time it is later, we've really cracked down on how much we eat out because that's a big weakness for Chris and I.
00:39:35
Speaker
opposite to you Beth I love going out to restaurants and like getting some drinks and trying new things so that's like that's my money therapy but yeah so like you know being strict budgeting budgeting and then letting go of that probably just means like eating out a lot more like I know some people could really go crazy
00:39:51
Speaker
with their money if they wanted to me it feels out of control and like big bending so that's just kind of that's like what all those years have gotten me through was like save save save now saving doesn't matter so whatever is kind of feels yeah no i totally get that first of all thank you for sharing that and being so vulnerable about that
00:40:10
Speaker
I think too, what you're saying, you're like, I know it's not like we're spending so much, but it feels like we are also, cause I think for you, saving is such a big thing that if you're not saving, it's kind of like it makes the other thing look bigger. Like if you're, if your savings isn't going up, but you're spending is even if it's just by a little margin, it looks so much so drastic. I should be, I should be, but then you just, you don't want to. Yeah. Yeah.
00:40:32
Speaker
And to be fair, nickel and diming is such a real thing. And I think one of the things that I had to start thinking about was if we're not nickel and diming to save or like, what is it? Basically you're going to be nickel and diming either way. Like you're either nickel and diming throwing it away or you're nickel and diming saving.
00:40:50
Speaker
And so even though it doesn't feel big, it'll all add up. So even if it doesn't feel big like you're spending it, it might not feel big like you're saving it, but you're still saving it. But also just wanted to say it's so funny how you said you and Chris are like opposites in the way that you are. Chad and I are also opposites, but we're the opposite of you. Obviously I'm the spender.
00:41:07
Speaker
obviously I'm the spender. Oh, what if Chad was the spender? Oh my gosh. First of all, we would quite literally be homeless. Like the only reason Chad has held our finances together so long. No, but all that to say I like you were saying I learned a lot from Chad.
00:41:23
Speaker
how to just yeah save my money and be responsible with it and even learning what debt is and how debt is a tool and how you can do it safely and Also, I've read some resources and stuff set in the last few years that teach a little more about like not being afraid of debt
00:41:39
Speaker
but also not trying to be in it either. But I don't know. I don't know if I've taught Chad really anything about money. I may have made it more loose, which is probably not a good thing. I'm like, sure, buy that $200 lure. You deserve it. I definitely know he bought his first expensive, like really expensive fishing lure, like after we were already married. So like, just do it. Yeah.
00:42:02
Speaker
Oh, Chris has told me and I'll tell him to because like I said, I've chilled out a lot of my obsessive like saving. Yeah, we'll straight up be in the store and we'll be like a little treat. And I know if we're on the fence, I'll be like, it could be a treat.
00:42:18
Speaker
But it's a reward. It's a reward for a living today. Yes, it's so bad. I worked my normal job, little treat. Exactly. Oh my gosh, I woke up this morning. What a taxing day. Okay, so anyway, so very funny, very similar, just swapped with that one.
00:42:36
Speaker
Um, but yeah, I think it's funny how we, um, Oh, oh, and just to say, I'd say now we're much more savers. I, um, well, I'll get into that, but okay. So it's funny though, when you were talking, I was thinking it's funny how we won't spend $20 on something. That's like an investment in ourselves. Maybe it's a new pair of jeans that will last us for years. Or maybe it's like, I don't know, some kind of health thing. It doesn't matter. Something we actually.
00:43:02
Speaker
Need yes, like I just got gifted like I talked about a few episodes back a shuttle pro for my business I think it was a hundred and twenty dollar purchase that I was just not doing For you I finally got it gifted and I've been using it and I'm like, oh this actually could have upleveled my business You know, like whatever was worth it
00:43:19
Speaker
But yeah, but then, but then, oh, coffee and breakfast with Chris $40. No worries. Like, you know, it's weird. It's a mindset thing, but then also in the same way, yeah, we won't spend like a hundred dollars here or there. We won't spend $20 on things that are maybe necessary or whatever. But for me, what I noticed, but I'll spend $5 10 times on little stupid snacks or on little stuff like that. So that's also something I had to kind of be like, Oh crap. That's when I really learned what like nickel and diamond was. I was like, okay, it makes a big difference.
00:43:45
Speaker
So that's interesting. I always thought about that. We definitely got to get out of that mindset for sure.
Relying on God's Provision
00:43:50
Speaker
So anyways, just kind of like going back to the transition. So from college, still in college here, I was just so stressed about money. I was afraid to lose it because it meant I couldn't buy anything anymore. So I would spend all my money on buying things.
00:44:05
Speaker
So it's hard to explain, but if you are listening and you used to or currently struggle with this, I'm sure you will know what I mean. It makes no sense to some people, but it's a cycle where you spend money because you're afraid of losing it. And I remember I was pretty angry at people who would suggest that I budget and I am very stubborn as a person. So I have more of a, I'll fix it when I need to, or like cross that bridge when I come to a mindset. Yeah, I get that.
00:44:32
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. And honestly, in a way, it was kind of true. I did fix it when I was good and ready. But like, you know, obviously I could have avoided a lot of like heartache if I had started sooner. But when I started doing photography, and I wanted to save it for a camera, I think this was like the first shift that started to happen, like the first action I changed.
00:44:51
Speaker
I wanted to save it for a camera and like lenses and obviously I couldn't cover it in a single paycheck so I started like to realize that I could maybe save money if I was saving for something and you kind of mentioned that Ayla how it was a little bit like I think well maybe you haven't mentioned that I don't know but
00:45:07
Speaker
Yeah, saving up for something helped a lot. Yeah. So that kind of eased me into that a little bit. Well, and it gives you something to look forward to as well. Like you do have to put the money aside. You don't get to spend it, but you get to look forward to the thing it's going to bring you later. Exactly. Okay. So Ayla, now that we've given all this backstory and talk so much, let's run through some tips of things that helped. Um, and just kind of explain how we slowly learned to get organized of how we view money differently now. Um, like what.
00:45:36
Speaker
like let's just kind of run through some things. So one of the first areas again the biggest thing I had to work on was saving and feeling guilty for spending anything. So back up to like before getting married when I was traveling full time and in my time in YWAM I had no choice but to let go of a lot of money worry in order for you to participate in it. Like you pay your own way to be there. You don't get paid for being there, you pay your own way to be there and you have to raise your own money to be there.
00:46:05
Speaker
So you completely are depending on your savings, God's provision, donations, support from others, whatever. So I had to completely let go of control. And I'm a very control oriented person. I like to be in control. Just like with my finances, with work especially. So that was just like, I had no choice but to let go. We were taught so much about God's provision, how he will not leave you to starve. He won't leave you any of this. Like learning about God's character, I think, and that helped a lot. And there's
00:46:35
Speaker
There's lots of Bible verses that really back up God's provision towards you and stuff like, don't worry about tomorrow, tomorrow, worry about itself. There's one in Matthew, I should have pulled it up before this, but there's a verse in Matthew that talks about if he, you know, the flowers in the field bloom every day and the birds go out and get the food of what they need for the day and they always have what they need every day, how much more valuable are you then?
00:46:56
Speaker
the birds and the flowers of the field, like they get what they need every day. And you as a person are immensely more valuable to God than them. So why wouldn't he get you what you need, right? Each and every day really helped a lot. And it kind of just reminded me that my money's never been mine. It's never been mine in the first place, because I can get very proud about working for it. And this is mine and I work for it and blah, blah, blah. It's actually it's always been God's he gave it to me through work or through whatever else.
00:47:21
Speaker
And it's his when it goes back into whatever I sew it into. Just learning how to be a good steward of money and learning God's character and stuff really shifted a lot. And yeah, not getting so obsessive because it was his anyway. It was actually never mine. And I... Sorry, go ahead. Sorry, real quick because when you're talking about the Bible verses, I don't remember where the parable is. I actually think it might be in Matthew as well.
00:47:42
Speaker
But when you're talking to that, reminded me how there was the parable of those people, I think they were servants or something, they were given money. One of them went and dug a hole and hid it and like saved it. And the other went and used it to make more money. And it's just, yeah, kind of mindset to thinking about that, like what God wants us to do with our money. Like you said, be a good steward. Like we're supposed to use money as a tool and be responsible with it and use it to grow our lives and use it to grow more money in responsible ways as well.
00:48:09
Speaker
not just like hide it in a hole and save it, but also not blow it all either. Yeah. Yeah. And that servant was the wise one who went and invested it in something. And then the servant who buried it, I don't know, got punished or got kicked out or something. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. That one, no, now that you bring that up was a big one, because that's what I wanted to do. And I wasn't even investing anything. It was just like, we don't spend this, this is put aside. And I also want to mention I, in the years leading up to this experience, I was putting work
00:48:37
Speaker
over my relationship with the Lord a ton because of money. I worked weekends and like didn't go to church basically in between a choice of like going and hanging out with some friends or church friends or money.
Practical Budgeting Tips
00:48:48
Speaker
I chose money and through all this God made it pretty clear that I worried about money way more than I gave our relationship time and like the time of day. So that made me promise to God years ago now this was in 2018 that I would never ever put money over my relationship with him again. That's why I never work Sundays anymore
00:49:07
Speaker
I mean, I'll work a Sunday, but like, it doesn't go over church, or in a time where I'm going to church, we still respect the Sabbath because money is not more important than that. And even when I'm in busy season with photo editing, work does not come before church, Bible study, etc. Because it'd be so easy for me to get in the cycle of no, I can't go do the stuff I have to work. So I cannot allow myself to do that again, because
00:49:29
Speaker
the income I make is not more important than the time I give to God. And because of his character and stuff, he's not gonna punish me for spending time with him by not giving me the money I need. That wouldn't make any sense. And it helps me chill out a lot and really lean into God's provision. One of God's name is Jehovah Jireh, the God who provides.
00:49:47
Speaker
It's literally who he is, so I just didn't have to worry. And it's, again, I feel like people could take this and be like, oh, so I don't have to do anything. God will just provide. No, the Bible still encourages work and investment, you said. But the Bible actually commands so many times. I think it's hundreds of times where it says, do not worry.
00:50:06
Speaker
which I need to like continue to remind myself because I'm a big worrier but that's a huge thing and it talks about worrying about money and about your food and security and to not do it so there's that right then and if you're working yeah if you're doing what you're supposed to do and you're working and doing the right things you shouldn't worry because um
00:50:25
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, that's not to worry. You'll be provided for. So like I said, this did make me enter a time where I was so I'm worried about money that I think I did lose some good saving habits that were and maybe still could be hurting our household, pushing, you know, travel dreams farther away. So it started in 2023. And continuing now the best we can, Chris and I are implementing new habits to get into a better money space. So I'll go through those really quickly.
00:50:48
Speaker
like I mentioned Chris is the kind of spender of the family and we know this so he's made some certain choices about how often he brings his credit card with him to work because yeah it was those little purchases oh a little snack after work a little this so that's just like I know that's not me but like for our household that was a choice and I think it's yeah the smart one is just like if you know that your credit card like we talked about earlier seems a little too magical to you well leave it at home unless you need to buy gas or something like that yeah we pretty much do not
00:51:18
Speaker
eat out or pick up fast food almost at all anymore. We get to get dinner once a week on Friday night and it's not expensive dinner that's like.
00:51:27
Speaker
like the deals dinner we find like the deals in the city we pick that up we take it home and if we want drinks or something like a beer or something it can't be more than $20 worth so it's just like a six pack or something like that and if those prices are easy it's because they are because it's Canada. Food was a big thing that was killing our savings so that was the hardest one to crack down on. I still make exceptions for
00:51:48
Speaker
dates like anniversaries and birthdays because like what is like without celebrating those kinds of things so I don't yeah I don't care when important stuff comes around I'm like we're gonna go have a nice dinner and we cut down on alcohol overall for health reasons of course but the truth is alcohol is insanely expensive in our province and it just doesn't make sense to be spending on it
00:52:09
Speaker
The Americans will understand a case of like 24 beers is about $60 Canadian, which converts to like 52 American. And that's just too much to be spending on that. So cut a lot of that out. Like again, now if we do have it, it's once a week and it's a specific amount we're allowed to spend. So just some quick budgeting that happened there. We minimized unnecessary purchases. There's virtually none now.
00:52:32
Speaker
If Chris or I want a little treat, like I said, we both talk about it. And at the end, I'm making the decision on whether we can have it or not. And that's something that Chris and I've talked about and established that probably will work the best because I am the more money conscious like one. So some days I'm pretty loosey goosey. Some days I'm like, we're gonna go shopping and we're gonna buy this and that's fine. And then some days I do have to like crack the whip and say no, even if I want it to, but we both talk about it. We don't just go like buy stuff without each other knowing about it.
00:53:00
Speaker
Smart. Yeah. And then learning the most cost-effective ways to shop, when to buy in bulk and shop at Costco versus whether to shop small and only get what you need. I don't have a lot of advice for that, it's just trial and error. And actually using the things you buy, like don't buy in bulk if it's all just going to go bad and you're not going to use it, you know, so learning how to do that the best. And then actually working more.
00:53:23
Speaker
If you're tired of your money situation, I'm very like, okay, just work for like, it's okay if we want to eat out, if we want to buy new clothes, if we want to do things, but I'm a very big, you have to earn it and again, save for it person. So if we have a trip or something coming up, we're going to California this summer.
00:53:39
Speaker
I'm gonna be picking up extra shifts at part-time, I'm gonna be making sure I can take on as many weddings as possible for editing, pick up, do some yard work, pick up like a side gig and actually go get more money, and I know that's easier said than done, I know like not everyone's situation is gonna allow for that, but in my mind, maybe this isn't super healthy, but in my mind if you've got like
00:54:00
Speaker
a ton of hours in the day where you're not doing anything and you're conscious about your money, there's probably side gigs you can do. There's probably two day a week jobs or something you can pick up and not to like work up into the ground. But if you're super concerned about your debt and you're spending and you want to be able to spend a little more throughout the day, then I just don't know, try to work more.
00:54:20
Speaker
Yeah. That one's like case by case. I'm not saying like everyone has to do that. But and then my last one was just how to make things fun without money.
Finding Joy Without Spending
00:54:31
Speaker
This probably is without explaining but I'll go ahead and explain it anyway. Like there's Chris and I are big quality time people so really we can go be doing anything and typically when you want to go do an activity that comes with money but it's just a matter of figuring out
00:54:44
Speaker
what you can do without money and how to make things fun or with very minimal cooking at home and actually making it a nice experience and sitting at a table and eating. We call that we call those dates all the time when we sit at our own house. This is like a date right now or going on walks or all these things like I feel like that hasn't been a secret for a while but just like making things fun without money like you don't need to go spend a lot amount to to go have fun and getting just really creative with with what that looks like.
00:55:12
Speaker
Yeah, I love that those are also good. And I think I definitely had applied some of those to myself as well with the in regards to like just thinking through and discussing before you buy things and thinking through like what you want to budget and how so and even little things make a difference. And then also yeah, finding free things to do that are fun. I will say we're very lucky here. There's like like Chris nice rift all the time. That's money, but it's low cost. Sorry.
00:55:39
Speaker
Yeah exactly yeah and you have to have your own everybody has different things they prioritize some people can't live without a coffee or whatever and I literally could care less so we don't ever spend a dime on coffee because we don't drink it so there but then there are some things we don't want to live without so we spend money on that so
00:55:57
Speaker
It's just different for everybody. And I think that's the first part about learning to manage your money is figuring out what your priorities are. Because also when we were talking about rent, some people are not comfortable spending 70% of their income on rent. And some people, they're like, that's totally fine with me because it's the main part of my life. I want to enjoy the home I have. I want to, maybe they work from home and like this is my situation. I work from home, so I want to have a nice place.
00:56:22
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. And they're, if they can afford everything else after that, then it's fine.
Adapting Shopping Habits
00:56:26
Speaker
Like it's whatever you want the biggest chunk of money to be spent on with some people. I know some people who are like, I will live in the cheapest place, even the sketchiest place because I don't want to spend money on the place that I just sleep.
00:56:38
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's different for everybody. But okay, so for me, just kind of running through a few things that when I'm looking back, the stuff that helped me get over that hump of like, and that challenge of the shopping addiction. One of them I kind of was hinting at it earlier, but just, I've mentioned in earlier episodes, that I get very stressed around too much clutter and too much stuff. And I was obviously accumulating a lot of stuff.
00:57:01
Speaker
And I then had to, in college, I had to purchase a storage unit to store my stuff. And looking back, also that's so not normal. Like a college student normally doesn't have a storage unit. Oh my gosh. Yeah. They had a bunch of stuff in it. And so that's what got it out of my home. So I wasn't looking at it. So I was still like peaceful in my house. But I still started to think about it. And like it, this storage unit always like raises rent. So I started having to like not be able to afford it.
00:57:30
Speaker
and so like that just little things started waking me up and then it helped watching chad and listening to chad when he talked about like how he budgeted and all that stuff so just that's again kind of self-explanatory easy um i started doing when i was shopping because i couldn't just cut myself off obviously cold turkey
00:57:48
Speaker
So I started doing a couple of different mind games when I was in the store. I would ask myself, would I rather have this item or the money? So if I really liked a cute bowl, I was like, would I rather have this or the $5? And then that helped me put a lot of stuff down because I was like, okay, well, because my mindset, again, it was all about mindset for me because I was like, maybe I'll find something I like better in the next store.
00:58:10
Speaker
And although in the long term, that's not the best mindset to have because even just the act of putting something down and not buying that and what's at the next store, you know? Yeah. Yes, exactly. It just helped me realize that I didn't have to put like buy everything I touched, which I also learned was a big problem for me. Like physically, when I physically touch something in a store at 90%, like 90% I'm going to buy it. So anyways, I started asking myself that and it helped me be able to like physically let things go.
00:58:38
Speaker
And then I also set the rule for myself if I don't love it, like, yes, love it, I don't buy it, which I actually think I learned from you, Ayla. Well, no, I was just gonna say to interrupt, but I was gonna say something I started doing and I still always do is well, yeah, if I don't love it, I don't buy it for sure. And actually, what you said about picking it up is
00:58:59
Speaker
If that is like psychological fact, like once you've picked something up, you're attached to it, you already kind of gets yours. So you're like putting it in your cart, you're much less likely to walk around with it and
Entrepreneurship and Financial Responsibility
00:59:11
Speaker
then put it back. Like once it's in your cart, you're like, this is mine, I own it. Fun tip, just don't touch anything. But what I do, even if I do pick up something and look at it, if I'm really like not sure about spending the money, I put it back.
00:59:24
Speaker
I walk around the store, if I'm still thinking about it, by the time it's time to leave, like a dress or something, I'll go back and get it. Because 95% of the time I've forgotten about it. By the time I've like, he's talking about the store, if it is like a mug or a bowl or something, if I'm, you know, shopping for other stuff, again, still sending money, but this is just how I cut down on so many things. If I'm like, Oh, maybe, maybe I put it back, do a laugh on the store. Usually I've forgotten about it by the time and then you didn't need it. Exactly. I do that every single day.
00:59:53
Speaker
Yeah that concept I think I definitely I remember going to the mall a couple times with you searching for swimsuits or something and I think you'd mentioned like oh if you don't love it don't like or I think you'd even said like yeah put it down if you're still thinking about it by the time I want to leave stuff like that. My mom also I think gave me the rule when I was a kid I just kind of forgot about it. If you don't love it don't buy it you know like you have to love it. Or do you need it or want it? Yes that was probably it too.
01:00:18
Speaker
But anyway, so I started to again, I'm very stubborn and strong willed. So oftentimes I have to come upon these thoughts myself or remind myself of them when I'm good and ready, which is not great. I'm working on that. But you know, so anyways, started implementing that myself. Another thing that I did is I started only carrying cash with me. And this was something that actually Chad disagreed with me on, but it ended up helping me a lot. So Chad was like, just check. So I was afraid to check the bank account. I literally didn't even know my login for my
01:00:47
Speaker
bank account because I was like afraid to check it because I knew I had nothing and I just wanted to be oblivious. I just wanted to, when I got a paycheck, I knew how much I had and now I knew how much I had to spend and I didn't want to look at it, whatever. So, but Chad was like, just check your bank account. I log into my bank account every day. And I was like, you think I'm going to log in every day? That's a joke. So instead I started carrying cash with me so that when I would go to buy something, I physically watched the amount of money lower. That's a very, yeah, that's right. That's really exactly.
01:01:16
Speaker
Thank you so much. I don't do it anymore obviously, but it helped me again kind of get in the mindset of like, you know, when you're buying these things, you're losing this money and like it's not going to come back. So another thing we kind of touched on before a few times, just finding motivations to be good with money. So like I said, I wanted to save it for like a camera lens camera. I had, I wanted to travel. So I was saving up for specific things, which of course helped. That's kind of again, a no brainer.
01:01:42
Speaker
Another big thing that kind of led to my change is a marriage. So before I got married, I wanted to enter the marriage being a little more financially responsible. Chad was very aware that I couldn't handle money, but I didn't want that to really be the case. And I didn't want to be like a burden in the relationship. So I had that also as a big motivator.
01:02:02
Speaker
Motivator to change and I kind of we had had conversations before we got married of like, okay What point do you want me to be at before we get married? Like how what improvements do you want me to make? So yeah, there was a little bit of that and of course Chad was helping me through that Another thing I did is I didn't box myself into any like specific program I've always felt a bit of an aversion to things like Dave Ramsey and so I just I wanted to find ways to help myself that weren't like boxing myself into a program and
01:02:29
Speaker
So that and I don't really know if I need to expand on that, but that was just something that was really big for me. Okay. Well, I was going to say, I actually don't remember if I've already said this on the podcast or if we just talked about it before we hopped on. I like literally don't remember, but I'm not a big Dave Ramsey fan.
01:02:44
Speaker
I think a lot of kids who grew up in the church listening to this will know who we're talking about, maybe other people too. I think a lot of his tactics worked in the 80s and 90s, because he's very much a, you know, save up, you know, if you want a house, you got to save up for it and then buy it. And that's just, Beth and I already talked about it. That's just not real anymore. So there's certain budgeting tips that I think are fine. But no, the actual programs
01:03:08
Speaker
he had another one about multiple bank accounts like between husband and wife you each have three or something like that like you have the joint bank account that's for rent and then you have the joint bank account that's for fun and then he has his own bank account and she has her own bank account and I was like bro like how am I supposed to split $20 between four
01:03:27
Speaker
You're like, what is this? I don't love stuff like that either. I agree. I think that, and again, we're not necessarily money gurus over here, but I think what I've started to notice is that a lot of these programs that for decades have been really helpful,
01:03:45
Speaker
With the rise of new modern problems with money and with the economy, I think we need more modern solutions and new ways of thinking about money and dealing with them. It's just not going to be the same as it was before. I know a few people who are still really devoted to Dave Ramsey and stuff like that. I think maybe if you're really deep in debt, he might have some good ways that get you thinking differently and maybe that'll be good.
01:04:08
Speaker
But I just I've because I've been my eyes have been open to so many other resources and my with my own experiences With money and I'll again I'll keep talking about it I just think there are other options out there if you feel like that won't work for you Which happened to be the case where you and I?
01:04:25
Speaker
Okay, sorry. So run through the last couple things really quickly. So one thing, becoming an entrepreneur, this was really big because it kind of kicked me in the pants. You can't be like a CEO, a business owner if you're really reckless with money. And I felt like it was easy caring about money when the prospect of like being a business owner was on the line, you know, like I, it was up to me. It was either going to make it or break it on my own accord. I was either going to sync this business or I'm going to help it grow. A couple of things too. Funny you mentioned separate bank account.
01:04:54
Speaker
Chad and I agreed when we first got married, we wanted one bank account. I didn't really at first, but I think it's more so just because I was embarrassed about my money situation. But then we ended up doing it, had a joint bank account. But then when I had my photography business, I got my own bank account just for business. And that has helped me a ton because it's something that I check every day. It's all my money I'm responsible for. And it just kind of all comes, flows together with helping me get better about this.
01:05:22
Speaker
I think business too, entrepreneurship and business really forces you to be better about your money because suddenly once you're working so hard for it and that money, it's not like you're an employee and the money you get is yours to deal with. Now it's like, what's going to taxes? What's going to business expenses? If you're not a money conscious person, it forces you to be. Exactly. I learned a ton about
01:05:45
Speaker
And like money with starting a business. I think that's an underrated. And when you're not good with money, you start a business. Well, no. And it's kind of true though, because when you're forced to do it, you kind of realize it's not that hard. Like not well, not to discount. It is difficult, but like you realize that it's doable and they're in what you're going to find the way that works for you. I think the last thing that
Inspired by Financially Savvy Friends
01:06:06
Speaker
really helps me kind of get to the point where I'm at now.
01:06:08
Speaker
And I'll explain what point I'm at now is being around friends who are at a different stage of money than I am So I have a few friends who are currently in the investment stage of life and they literally have investments they have stocks they're they know about bonds and like they're not like
01:06:24
Speaker
crazy into it, like geniuses or anything where a level where I think it's not attainable. What's actually inspiring about that is that they're like the same age as me. And I feel like they are doing it in an attainable way. And I have one friend who taught herself, she sat down on a computer and learned how to invest herself.
01:06:41
Speaker
It's not she's not nothing crazy But she sets aside money every month and does it and she has an investment now and she's she's gonna keep going with it And so talking with her and I was in a group of friends. We were just like at the beach I don't know a few months ago and they're like, okay guys, let's talk about money and I was like, whoa I've never been a group of friends and we're all like pushing 30. I don't know. We're not really pushing 30. We're like 26 27
01:07:03
Speaker
But we didn't want to talk about useless stuff. We wanted to talk about, hey, do you guys have a joint account with your husband or boyfriend? What do you guys do? How do you invest? How much did you start with? And it was just little things that made it feel like this is what you're supposed to do. This is just another step of life and it's attainable. It's
Starting Small in Financial Growth
01:07:22
Speaker
doable. So that's kind of the step I'm at now. I'm by no means rich.
01:07:26
Speaker
still obviously, obviously. But I'm just very much embracing the concept of like, little by little will make a big difference. And I just starting somewhere is very important. And I have some like books and stuff that I've read books, I know what, who am I? Not full books, just kind of started them. Yeah, or I follow accounts of like women who are good with money.
01:07:47
Speaker
I kind of teach about investing in stuff too. So I don't know. It's like, it's just, I, my mindset, I'm just still trying to work on cleaning out my mindset and not being afraid of the growth being slow and try not to compare myself to others. Cause I know some people who right now their money situation and you know, it got really good and it's hard when it's like, Oh, that's not me. And it's just, everyone's different and you can't compare. So stuff like that.
Accessible Financial Learning
01:08:10
Speaker
Yeah.
01:08:11
Speaker
That's so good that I know we said this was an advice but I I really like I think what stuck out to be the most what you said Beth like with you getting it together was like initially you weren't interested at all in Budgeting or a program and I actually like had a reaction when people brought that up But then being around people you're already friends with and then hearing what they're doing and not in a way to be like Oh, I should be doing but in a way. It's like oh, they're my age and they're doing this. Well, I can do it, too Yeah, I think that's super powerful and just
01:08:40
Speaker
I think we're really lucky right now in our technology age to be able to learn about this stuff in short form content. Yeah, two minute video on a couple things you can do that are easier. I think that's a more digestible way to learn about this than like learning box and bonds in a stuffy classroom or you know, in just in different ways. Like I people's attention spans are so different now. But we actually we have ways you can learn so much.
01:09:05
Speaker
in a very short amount of time. And granted, you know, a two minute video is not going to teach you everything about investing, but there's a lot of people that can kind of help get you started. Like it's easy to sit and think about budgeting as this whole big monster, but there's lots of resources to kind of take it day by day now and make it easier to learn about. If you're nervous, it's
Positive Mindset Shifts in Finance
01:09:24
Speaker
a really good time.
01:09:25
Speaker
And I'm preaching to my absolute self, too. It's a really good time to just start taking that in piece by piece and learn about it. And it doesn't mean you're bad for not doing it. Because I think that's what I think is I'll learn about people, like you said, who are making investments and buying homes in their 20s. And it's easy to take that personally and be like, well, I'm so bad because I haven't done that. And that's not it at all. If anything, hopefully it inspires you that you can be that. It's just exactly.
01:09:50
Speaker
It's a mindset change. It's all about mindset. So don't get caught up in the actual facts of what's happening. Just, it's just a mindset thing. And so I think that just some encouragement to like the economy is bad right now. You know, money feels even harder than ever to manage and to get, it feels really hard for people, but we also have more potential
01:10:10
Speaker
than ever before to make our money grow for us and more resources than ever before to learn and to teach us. So when you're starting to get stressed about it, just change. It's just so much of it is mindset, honestly, because nothing's going to change unless you take the steps to change it. And if you're depressed and stressed, you might not take those steps. So be around people,
Small Financial Gains
01:10:27
Speaker
listen to resources that are going to encourage your mindset to flip and be positive and be like, look, it may not change tomorrow, but if tomorrow I take one step towards change, then maybe in two years I won't feel the same way.
01:10:40
Speaker
That's all it is. Even, sorry, I know this stuff's getting longer, but, uh, even, um, I'll, I'll check that this is okay to talk about before this episode comes out, but he's started doing Uber Eats just in his spare time. Cause one of those things, again, we've got spare time. It's easy to set up. He started to do it and we calculated that, um, with gas and stuff, it's still.
01:11:05
Speaker
that's not that big of a deal. We had bought a pretty fuel efficient car, so it's a good gig for him to do anyway. He went and did his first day of it a couple weeks ago, and I think he made like 25 bucks for the whole day. The pessimist mindset could be like, 25 bucks isn't going to get me out of debt, but I looked at it and I was like, that's 25 more bucks than we had yesterday.
01:11:28
Speaker
It's easy to look at your debt or whatever as a huge monster and be like, well, $5 isn't going to fix it. It's five more than you had yesterday. No, it's not going to fix it overnight. Yeah. That mindset change, that extra little something is more than you had. So Oh my gosh. I adore that. Exactly. And would you rather
01:11:45
Speaker
lose five dollars or gain five dollars. So think about it that way too. You'd rather spend it or gain it. Always. Always gonna want to gain. And so
Budgeting and Financial Freedom
01:11:52
Speaker
and on the topic of Bible verses you were talking about earlier Proverbs 13 11 says wealth gained hastily will dwindle but whoever gathers little by little will increase it. So there's no shame in gaining anything little by little, saving little by little, earning little by little because it's still just as valid and it's going to grow and if your mindset is
01:12:13
Speaker
I'm going to save I'm going to earn even if it's little by little That is that's a powerful mindset that no matter how much you earn is gonna benefit you Or to just gonna take you to the next thousand dollars shows up in your account somehow by like the lottery or whatever, you know exactly Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. I loved all of that. So now present day
01:12:35
Speaker
We are people who really do care about being fiscally responsible, even if we're not the best at it every single day. That's the goal. That's the goal to strive to constantly learning and working, learning how to be more responsible with our finances. I think right now, kind of where I'm at, like I said, it's a good time for me to get back into a saver mindset.
01:12:55
Speaker
like not so pessimistic and I'll just spend it if the world wants me to. It's a good idea to get back into a bit of a safer budgeting mindset, but also I'm pretty confident that I won't be feeling guilty for buying the things I need. And even a few things that I've done, I want to really start learning how to utilize the money that Kristen and I do make and make it help us the most. And I think for the longest time as a wife, I didn't want to nag about money. So I just let us spend whatever we wanted, when we wanted, but now I feel more secure in like putting my foot down,
01:13:24
Speaker
for both of us and I'm not saying that Chris is like just willy-dilly spender I'm just saying like to help make the decisions without feeling like a nag I feel more confident in doing that writing and establishing a budget enforcing it in ways that are fun free dates cooking together all that stuff like I think now is a good time in our life to be more wise about money but without feeling guilty and without feeling like bad on ourselves for having to save it's just a smart thing to do and so that's kind of where we're at
01:13:49
Speaker
I love that. That's amazing. And yeah, I would say for me right now, similar, similar boat as well, being responsible with money is more second nature now. I'm so glad to say that I'm not afraid to talk about it now, that I'm not stressed to check my bank account really now. Even if it's low, I still can check it and just be like, okay, well, what are the next steps I'm going to take? How am I going to improve next month? If I wasn't responsible this month, what am I going to do next month?
01:14:15
Speaker
It's not stressful. The budget is just a part of life. And once you make that initial mindset shift, like we're talking about, it really does get so much easier. Money is a powerful tool and one that can cause a lot of stress and lock you down or one that can lead to lots of freedom. So just decide how you're going to use it. If you
Engagement and Interaction
01:14:32
Speaker
guys like this,
01:14:33
Speaker
We liked it. We hope you guys did too. If you enjoyed listening to us talk about a kind of more serious, more unique, but also you got to laugh with us a little topic, just follow along for more messages. If you ever have an idea for an episode, we definitely want to hear it. You can shoot us an email at art of intention podcast at gml.com or contact us on Instagram at art of intention podcast and make sure you're following us there too. Cause as much as we can, we share resources.
01:14:59
Speaker
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