Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
When Does a Hobby Turn Into Escapism? - Episode 64
23 Plays3 months ago
Okay folks, we got a bit heavier than we expected on the show today, but it's a topic that is near and dear to our hearts. Both of us have personal experience in this topic, and we want to know if you did too.
Have you ever had a favorite hobby or pastime, whether it's TV, movies, books, video games, exercise, literally anything, take a little too much control of your life? Have you ever gone through a time in your life where something is wrong, and you cover it up by isolating, or escaping into a hobby? We're been there, and we think this is a niche, yet important subject to get out into the open. What is the line between engaging in a fun hobby, and using it to isolate from the world around you?
We get open and honest about some of our past experiences in this episode, and with that, we want to remind you that we are two human beings behind the microphones here at AOI, and we care about each and every one of you listening. If anything in this episode resonated with you, and you would like to continue the conversation, or confide in someone about what you're going through, then you are welcomes to reach out to us @artofintentionpodcast on Instagram, or you can email us at [email protected]
We post every Tuesday, so we'll see you again next week!
xo - Beth and Ayla
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Hobbies and Escapism
00:00:00
Speaker
As you may know, if you've been a listener of the Art of Intention for a while, you know Beth and I are multi-passionate, multi-hobby ladies, and we have a pretty good time. I mean, between the two of us, aside from our jobs as a photographer and a photo editor, Some of our hobbies include reading, painting, drawing, hiking, freediving, camping, fishing, gaming, playing music, thrifting, and probably more. So we do a lot of things. We think hobbies are incredibly healthy and oftentimes promote healthy time by yourself. But did you know that there's a line between having a healthy hobby and using it as means of escapism?
00:00:35
Speaker
along those same lines that there's a difference between introversion and isolation. Yeah. Have you ever noticed that a casual hobby starts to take over your life just like a little too much? Like it started as something fun that you get to do after work and now it feels like something you have to do or something you need to do to de-stress from your day. But furthermore, are you a more introverted person who worries that you might be self isolating or maybe you haven't thought about it till just now. Maybe right now you're thinking about it, reflecting on that. and you want to break out from some unhealthy habits, ah well, we're gonna break all of that down as best we can in today's episode.
Podcast Introduction: 'Art of Intention'
00:01:11
Speaker
We're gonna be talking about some really interesting stuff, and it was a topic that really gripped both of us while we were brainstorming about it, so stay tuned for that. Welcome to the Art of Intention podcast with Beth and Ayla. Two best friends turn creative entrepreneurs. This is a place for us to discuss everything business, friendships, and faith, and occasionally more. We're so excited for today's episode. We think you're gonna love it. Stay tuned.
00:01:37
Speaker
Okay, so jumping into this, we kind of have multiple topics to visit here. So we're gonna be talking, like we said, about hobbies and how to identify engaging in a hobby versus escapism, like not being able to deal with the world around you and completely like isolating and shutting in.
Personal Experiences with Hobby Escapism
00:01:56
Speaker
Beth said in the intro, have you ever noticed a hobby starts to take over your life a little too much? Like it started out as something fun. I'm a big i'm a big reader. and say it just starts out as something you do before bed or for a couple hours when you get home and then over time it evolves into your coming home and just reading for like nine hours a day and then going to bed. That's not
00:02:21
Speaker
To a large extent, that's not really a bad thing on my mind. There's probably worse things you could be doing with your time. But then what is your mindset like when you're doing that? like why Why are you doing it that much? What are you thinking? Are you avoiding anything? You might not be, and that's completely fine. But is there something in life you're running away from? And this falls under any hobby, exercising, the gym. um, reading, gaming, uh, gardening, I don't know, whatever your hobbies are. I think there is potential for all of them to maybe become a little too much depending on what your mindset is. So like, I don't exactly know the line of how much a hobby is physically too much. Like I said, is it a bad thing if you spend your whole Saturday from dawn till dusk reading? Well, probably not reading is a very healthy hobby. It exercises your mind and your imagination. But I'm thinking the difference between engaging in a hobby like that and trying to escape.
00:03:14
Speaker
is all in your mindset and pattern. Like what happens if you don't get to read all day or game all day? Do you get irritated? Do you get impatient with the people around you? Or what if a friend asks you to hang out on a Saturday? Do you keep saying no over and over? A time or two I can understand saying like, oh no, I'm just taking time for myself today. But do you find yourself consistently turning people down over and over to keep giving into this hobby slash habit you've created? That's where I think you might be dipping into isolating and escaping. Absolutely. Yeah, I think that's a really good way to summarize the difference. um And I think that like, so I can kind of give a little bit of a personal example here if it helps kind of define the difference too. um And this is kind of a deep like Ayla and I were talking about this before the show and like kind of again, then the days leading up to talking about this topic. like
00:04:04
Speaker
It's definitely one that can get a little more raw and real and especially as the realization kind of sinks in that this has happened to you or whether like because the realization kind of sunk into me um when it was happening but more so when we were actually talking about this. Like when Ayla brought this up I was like dang this has definitely happened to me. I just don't think I ever put a name to it like escapism. I just kind of noticed a behavior in myself and was like okay I need to make sure I'm not doing that. But as we unpacked this, it was really interesting. And I reflected on the couple of times this has ah started to happen to me. And I do think I have a tendency towards this. And so, for example, I have to be very careful with the shows that I watch and them even like movies, but more so shows because you kind of like it's a longer time period thing um because I get too attached to all of it. I mean, to the characters, the plot, the whole world, um the whole fake world.
00:04:56
Speaker
And it happened to me twice in college where I accidentally got very hooked on a couple of shows. um And when they ended, I was like deeply distraught. Like to a level I absolutely should not have been. And most people are. It's more than just a joke. Like it's more than just, yes yeah, exactly. Right. Like we made joke about this kind of thing, but it's so unhealthy and I didn't like, I didn't get work done. I didn't go to classes. I didn't leave my apartment. Um, and I just, and overall I literally hated life, um, after they ended. And by the way, this is besides the fact that while I was binging these shows, I didn't want to hang out with anybody. I avoided my life completely. I got absorbed into these fake worlds.
00:05:38
Speaker
And this and like didn't want to like talk to anyone and the same goes for books I have to be careful as well I'm not my very big reader but in the couple of times that I have gotten into series I have noticed a similar pattern is with TV shows um and Honestly, even with music to an extent, all of that is much easier for me to avoid and not get like sucked into. But I don't really listen to music in general at all. And there's actually a few reasons behind that. It'd also be just not being as interested in it. But a little known thing about that is because ah this it actually affects me in such a deep way, similar to the shows.
Emotional Impact of Escapism
00:06:14
Speaker
um It puts me very deep into my feels, depending on the kind of music or like what the song is. And I disassociate
00:06:20
Speaker
Very quickly like almost instantaneously from the world and start feeling ways that I just like don't want to be feeling and like it starts bringing up memories I don't want to break interesting and it's just it's so weird So um not that I I mean I have I watch TV all the time Like I can watch TV and movies and all that stuff, but I have to be careful about what it is um Because I I know that I have this tendency and so again with the first time it happened in college I didn't The first time I happened in college, I legit, it was just like, oh, I'm i'm depressed now. Like i I actually was depressed for the first time in my life. And I was like, oh, ah life just sucks. This is like, this is my new normal. Like I hate life. Everything is terrible. And I didn't realize it. Right. Then this, oh my gosh, it was so crazy. And the second time it happened, I started to put two and two together. I was like, oh, I don't think I can
00:07:06
Speaker
I can do this. I don't think I should be doing this kind of thing. I think it's the content. um and um anyway so it was it Sometimes you don't understand what's happening to you until you pause and look back. and anyways so hopefully that makes sense yeah anyway so All that to say There is kind of, you know, once I noticed that I was doing that um and that that was happening to me, it's a little more than surface level. And I was like, okay, let's kind of figure this out. So if you're using your hobbies, whether it's TV shows, movies, whatever it may be, books, it doesn't matter. to so If you're using them to escape your life, whether you know it or not, you're digging yourself into a deeper hole, right? If you don't like your life, escaping it through books or shows won't help you as much as getting out there and living and making real life changes that will help you. So, you know, if books and movies affect you in this way, then you just prove to yourself that you don't like your life, at least part of your life in some way. So instead of delving back into escaping it, look at how you can change your life. And that's kind of like the next category that we're going to talk about. and tackle. It's like, what's the deeper reason behind your desire to escape? If you have this tendency of this happening to you, what's the deeper issue on a lower level? Yeah. And I remember when Beth and I were preparing for this topic, she asked me that,
00:08:23
Speaker
um if I'd ever felt that feeling of like finishing a book or TV series and then just like, and also Beth, you asked me specifically with like finishing a series and being like, do you feel like you're portraying the series if you try to move on to a next one? Like you can't move on because you because you haven't properly like grieved that it's over. And then you feel bad for the characters because you're about to go like read about new characters or watch new characters. And I was like, yes, it is so real. Like i I always feel a little bit of that when I'm between book series or TV series, but I don't think quite to the same
00:08:53
Speaker
extent but i have felt it in like small pockets sometimes larger ones where something ends and i'm actually like distraught like i was telling beth chris and i watched alice in borderland at one point last year and we were physically like ill when that one oh god ended like it was crazy like is that and wait real quick sorry to interrupt does that one is that intended to make you feel that way oh yeah like it's it's like a it's is that it's like suspense Okay. That's another, not to interrupt, but that's also another distinction I forgot to mention before. It's just like, also, are you getting de depressed at things that are supposed to end happy or like if it's meant to, there's also another thought on that. It was meant to make you sad, but if it's like a happy thing, like it ended well and you're feeling this way, it's also like a sign, maybe you escaped.
00:09:35
Speaker
you were using first ga um yeah But I think there's also something to that, because Beth, I think you and I are similar, like you like to escape into things that make you happy. And then if it's accidentally sad, then you're just like horrified. like can say oh yeah It's unpreparedly sad. You're like, oh my gosh, no. I escape into things that make me feel sad, not to be like, it's emotional. But like, that's always how I listen to music and shows. Like, yes. I have a pretty strong threshold for shows that are sad and I'll feel sad in the moment. And it's just like, I don't know. I don't know when that started or what, but like, um, I had to go through a big shift of music because like, if I'm sad, I'll listen to music that's even sadder. So I think he's there and like he's sad. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, you could never know. Absolutely. When I was going through it, I like, and it wasn't even just your typical like email music. Like I did listen to some of that, but
00:10:27
Speaker
okay this is like i didn't i wasn't ready to get this person on the podcast but here we are but i remember going through this one event in college it
Recognizing and Addressing Escapism Tendencies
00:10:35
Speaker
was sad it was like this um what was it what was i what was i so upset about i think i was having a fight with an exit of time that was like ah a big what like a very uncomfortable one and I drove around our hometown at like midnight once and I was playing Something in the Way by Nirvana before it blew up like in the last couple of years like it it's made its rounds I think because of the Batman movie with Robert Pattinson or whatever everyone knows that song now but this was back in like 2017 and
00:11:02
Speaker
I drove around at midnight and played that song like 50 times and just drove and listened to it over and over. And Beth, I won't even show you the song because it's so, it's actually kind of like disturbing. know it's You might hear it from like the memes, but it's really slow and monotone. It's an Nirvana song. um I don't really know who that is. Anyway, oh it's it's the guy who killed himself, allegedly. Well, his wife actually killed him. But she says, okay, I know this whole world, I'm dying. Okay, you whoa. This is where our world's diverged. Anyway, I was like going through this fight with with this ex at the time, and I drove around listening to that for like hours, because it made me even sadder. And that song, like ah used to like I used to struggle with like suicidal thoughts and stuff like that, and that made me
00:11:49
Speaker
And I was like, perfect, I'm gonna listen to this and feel this way. Like I feel myself in those places. um So it's kind of hilarious. You like to escape into things that are happy or like worlds that are super cool and like a romance that ends really well or things that end well. And I still like that stuff. I'm not saying i I don't like that. Like I like to have stuff too. But I get really caught up into like really twisted like diabolical plots. And it I don't know if I needed to feel something. I don't know. But like I still really like really intense. shows. like you and I have to be careful with what I recommend to you because our taste is so different. I appreciate that so much that you recognize that in me and that I didn't take me saying that more than once for you to be like, oh, I will not be recommending her yeah this horrible, sad thing. I was telling Beth about Alice in Borderland before we hopped in the call and she was like, oh, how was that? And I was like, don't watch it. No. like you're not You're not going to like it. Look it out for me. Protecting my heart.
00:12:42
Speaker
Yeah, but yeah, music used to be such a big one. I didn't even think about that when we were going into this conversation. But you you said like you started to reflect on moments you thought you were escaping. And music was huge for me. like I used to drive to school just listening to like sludge metal and grunge music. And like ah you, again, won't know the song, but Twist by Chord was like one of my top listen to songs. And the people who get it will get it. it's like It's insane. I used to put that into my headphones and walk into class. And then I wondered why. other aspects of my life weren't doing very well. like my thoughts It's just like you know what you surround yourself with. Why was I like that? And I remember unpacking a lot of that kind of as I reopened my relationship to the Lord and like let him come in and heal a lot of that stuff. i can And I'm a very self-aware person, so I kind of knew I was doing this to myself anyway. like I generally ah always know what I'm feeling and why. And I remember in the moment that music made me feel gross
00:13:37
Speaker
I remember making it, we feel gross and angry and sad. And that's what I wanted. Like, I don't know. It's super weird. Escapeism. Yeah. Yeah. Super weird thing to like escape into. And all that to say, usually if you see that coming in your life, um whether it be positive or negative. So sometimes it's positive movies or shows or music too, but it's still in the same aspect of you want to feel something other than what you're feeling in your daily life. So why, what's the reason, and how can we possibly start turning our escapism into healthy habits again, or fix the part of our lives that escapism has revealed to be broken?
Reasons Behind Escapism
00:14:16
Speaker
We we fix this by figuring out what that more deep-seated root cause is. Because i I do believe while hobbies are fine, and like I said, if you read for a bunch of hours a day, and you're like generally happy and things are good with your life, I might not be speaking to you at this point, but it's like you have other things going on,
00:14:34
Speaker
and you are depending on things like this for your happiness, or to get away from the world, or because you're unsatisfied with something, or even, sorry, just add to that, or even just when you're participating in these things, they make you feel a certain type of way, like either when they're over, you're depressed, or when you're in it, you're so sucked in that the rest of the world doesn't exist, or when you go back into that world, you hate your your life, yeah like serious. So generally a few reasons that Beth and I broke down, For why these hobbies might like grow into this whole thing, like escapism, all that is one, a need for control. Two, a deep need to de-stress kind of more heavily than the average person. Number three, trauma past, present, like past or present, you're either going through it or you have gone through it. Um, or for disliking your own life.
00:15:24
Speaker
And Beth and I kind of talked about this before the show, like just in our own circumstances, like Beth kind of had her reasons in college. And then I realized I'm a big need for control person. Like every single aspect in life, whenever I delve into something a little too deeply, I'm a big need for control. Like the pandemic was the worst for me because we all had control taken away from us. And I just like, I could not deal with not being in charge of the next year of my life or the next, the next whatever. Like that's something I talked to the Lord about all the time. and I think back to my music choices and then I have a story coming coming up here in a minute where actually like last year I started delving in and trying to escape and part of it was de-stress and then part of it was a need to control because like
00:16:06
Speaker
I'm such a busy person sometimes I feel like my time is not my own so when it is I'm doing exactly what I want and nobody else gets to say yeah and I don't like when it when it gets to that point. In really extreme cases you honestly may need to go to therapy, may need to talk to some people, do some soul searching to heal the parts of you that's causing escapism because It's a big joke on the internet, like, ha ha ha, I buy books instead of going to therapy. And to a level, that's fine. if It's a certain joke, but I think there's definitely a point where it's not so funny anymore because you're playing with your own mind, you're playing with your own heart. And that's serious. Like if a conundrum comes up in your life, like a minor inconvenience and you need to go
00:16:46
Speaker
shop or you need to go watch the same show for the fiftieth time and shut everyone out i i strongly advise you get that out in the open and talk to somebody about it because it just opens up doors for way unhealthy happens later um or if you're lucky having your eyes open to it might be all you need to get you out of that slump to get you to actively choose to work on that area of your life, pick up different hobbies, take a break, realize if you're isolating or not, like anything like that. and Again, kind of going to what I was talking about, like a big need for control thing. um so i
00:17:20
Speaker
i kind of had a period of time like this about like a year ago so it was after last year's busy season so like fall of 2023 kind of after that like i just had a busy year in business which is great i am a happily busy person i like being busy but my vices last year my vice last year was like gaming that's another one of my hobbies like a self-proclaimed gamer don't ask me which ones i play because because they' they're not that hard it's just fun but um It didn't help that a game that I was looking forward to dropped right before my busy season last year, so I just wanted to like play it, but then I was spicy. And it's fine. like I could have delegated better time off or or whatever, but it got to the point, it was it was the Legend of Zelda, Tears of the Kingdom. It's phenomenal. I've since gotten to beat it, but I was really excited about it.
00:18:13
Speaker
and Every second I was spending working or at my day job, I was just thinking about my game and hopping back into the game. like yeah And actually, it's not like a good sense of productivity, but I was working as fast as I can so that I could go do that. yes And then other things in my life got completely neglected, like um my home got neglected, time with my husband got neglected, because once I had that time, that's all I wanted to do. Like that's just what I wanted to do. And the part of that's burnout too, like part of that's a ah sign of burnout is like,
00:18:46
Speaker
not delegating your time properly anymore because it's ah if it's off, you just want to completely shout out. And I do see that too. But I would actually build resentment in my mind when I heard like other people I knew got to spend time in their hobbies. Like people around me would talk about, you know, if they got to go gaming or if they were reading or if they were going to the gym, the gym's a big one. If I fall behind in that too, I get like mad when other people are going. Yeah. Like that's, yeah. Like that's another one. Um, all things I love and my mind, I got this big holier than thou complex where I was like, I wish I could have time for my hobbies, but I'm just busier than they are. I would just be working harder than they are. Like I just, you know, we all have the same 24 hours in a day and I'm spent working and they're blah, blah, blah. But I was actually just like bitter that I couldn't spend my time doing that, that thing. And I even at one point would build a silent resentment for my dear sweet husband who I love. if he had the time for his hobbies, and that's not fair at all. I'm the one with two jobs. He naturally has more time in the day than I do just during my busy season. Again, this is like a few months out of my year. but and And he had done what I needed him to do that day. So like dishes are all good. you know The house is clean, cooking's done. So then he would do what he completely has the right to do and go do right hobbies. And I would be like,
00:20:03
Speaker
That's not fair. I'm sat here working and like blah, blah, blah. And i hate I hate that side of myself when that happens. They all do it though. Yeah. And then when I did finally have the time to game or to paint or do one of the other ah hobbies that I like to do, I was so fixated on it. And I'd get crabby if I didn't get to do it. like It was to the point I'd finish my work and go straight to like our room and go game in there and not talk to Chris and not whatever. And it wasn't his fault. I just was like, this is my time
Balancing Work, Hobbies, and Productivity
00:20:31
Speaker
now. um So I think the line is hard for me, but I think it's somewhere in there. Like, yes, after working my butt off for four months straight, I am totally allowed to take a Saturday and veg out and game and do the thing I want or spend time in one of my other than any other hobbies. But I think the mindset is what changes it from being fun and relaxing and distressing after some work to this is finally my time and I need to spend exactly how I want and no one can interrupt me and I don't want to see anybody. No one can come in here. This is my like,
00:21:00
Speaker
me, me, me kind of weird thing. And I would also just get really bothered if like someone wanted to hang out with me. Like if I finally had the time to stay home and and not have to work, do any other hobby, even if it's just watch TV. And a friend wants to hang out. I'd be like, ah this is my time. I need my introvert. to This is my time. And it's not their fault like I'm looking at people who want to see me so ah that was like that was just a year ago so this is like super, super fresh as like, I have all kinds of things I like to ah that I enjoy and that I like to do but it gets really ugly when I want to do it too much and start behaving.
00:21:37
Speaker
hurtfully to the people around me and neglecting the actual responsibilities. Oh, that was another part of the story was like, right. So my work's very seasonal. I have a busy season and a slow season. Slow seasons are generally spent bettering other aspects of your business and doing some background work and resting. But Beth and I have a whole episode about what you spend your slow season doing. I could not be bothered to do so many slow season projects I had in mind. like I had a very unproductive slow season, which is fine. like It's whatever. I'm not beating myself up about it. I just had a very unproductive slow season because of that time control. I was like, I don't have any actual work to be doing, like nothing that needs to be returned to clients, then why would I be in office at all? This is my time.
00:22:21
Speaker
And and I just like it was a way ah more unproductive slow season so But that's okay. That's all so interesting. I'm so glad you shared that and um I think it's interesting that you noted The difference is like it be with it being seasonal for you So like during it was like worst or it may be tend to be worse during busy season because that's when you have less control And so like this kind of comes out of like you were saying for you personally It's a more of a need for control that can stem something like this whereas like so There's like the seasonal versus like content so for me it's more so the content that I'm consuming and that can kind of trigger it um or kind of the deeper reason it might be if I'm unhappy with a certain aspect in my life and then combine that with certain content that can make me like spiral into this. So that's also interesting um to kind of see the differences that trigger it but and the deeper reasons behind it.
00:23:11
Speaker
But we also just want to say, I guess, to round out this point specifically of the deeper reasons behind it. um I like what Ila said about how you know ah you might need to go to therapy or maybe it's just enough to realize this is happening and make some changes. But we aren't therapists, so we can't talk you through that part. Only point out that escapism has um always a deeper cause behind it that's worth looking into. um for you know Like I said, for me personally, I noticed I got caught up in escapism years ago when I didn't like my life at the time. or Because although my life was bad, there were just certain parts of it that I didn't like. And um I had to decide in the moment whether I was going to continue picking up new ways to escape or fix things in my life that I didn't have. So if you're listening to this, it may just come down to that choice for you. And we're hopefully going to be encouraging you to make the right choice.
00:23:58
Speaker
Yeah. So we covered potential causes for escapism. And again, because they got kind of like mesh in my story there, I'll say, and there's probably more, we're not experts. Like we are, this topic came out of our yeah brains only, but you know, a need for control, a deep seated need to de-stress more heavily than the average person trauma or disliking or unsatisfied with your own life can be some of the causes. And again, if any of that resonates with you, actually like feel free, like if we're not therapists, but feel free to reach out to us and let us know if this impacted you and just like, We want to be here for you guys. We actually really care about this stuff. Yeah. And we can talk to you on a personal level. If you relate to like what's done with Alo or something that happened to me, like we're happy to talk with, with you one-on-one of course.
Triggers and Content-Driven Escapism
00:24:39
Speaker
Yeah. And talk to the people around you, whatever. But so potentially those are the potential causes and wanting to possibly just escape certain aspects of your life. And then I felt like there was another factor to this discussion and that's the content of your hobby. And that's kind of like been in my mind for the last few days, but the content of your hobby.
00:24:56
Speaker
or whatever you are using to escape. Like in the hours that you're delving into a hobby, what are you actually surrounding yourself and your home with? Absolutely. And with that, I think we should probably distinguish that there's two types of hobbies. So some don't really have content per se, um like let's say gardening, DIYs, knitting and boardery, general things like that, crafting, like that doesn't really have content. yeah um Yeah, there's no harmful content. Yeah, I mean, oh yeah i mean get sure yeah I'm sure somebody can figure something out with that. But yeah, ah but what we're saying is once you get into music, video games, reading and TVs and movies, you're taking an actual content. So those are the two separations of that. And if someone is overindulging in a specific hobby, you know, we can't help but think about the content playing a part in it um with all of this.
00:25:44
Speaker
Yeah, kind of what I said earlier about music and the kind of music I was taking in. And I'll say right now, I'm not going to sit here and tell you that I think, you know, like video games cause violence. That was a big discussion a little while ago. I personally don't believe in that. um There's been lots of studies to disprove that. I think it's a correlation, not causation deal, but. and it's the same with music you know there's violent like metal music out there i don't i generally don't think that causes violent people but just however if that's all you listen to all the time i just kind of question why and question how that might affect you like it might not make you violent but like why is that
00:26:19
Speaker
what you're listening to like why is that the choice as someone who used to fully listen to only like heavy metal sludge metal grunge like i do question are you okay because i'm right so it might not be causing a problem but like you said correlation there might be something else going on there there that makes you doing this yeah yeah yeah um but exploring the idea on the content of what you're indulging i think it could possibly reflect something yes that you think you might be lacking in life or something you want to control over. um Not all of the time. I'm not saying that every guy who plays Call of Duty longs to be a soldier. you know oh my goodness They might just be chilling and having fun. I'm not saying that. But you know kind of what Beth and I were talking about, like getting really invested maybe in a fantasy world or pretend things in books or movies. Take TV, for example. Say you've begun to isolate more.
00:27:07
Speaker
you're you're indulging in more and more things and getting more invested in a certain type of show. So say your way into fantasy like Lord of the Rings, Game of Thrones, Narnia, and you seek out more and more shows like that and you're filling all your spare time and maybe neglecting other people to give in into something like that. um It's harmless to start, but say every spare minute you have spent diving into this, but one like what if after a while you do start to feel depressed when they're over you are disappointed in your day-to-day life you are something kind of like what Beth describes just disappointed with the day that you have to go tackle after you may be surrounding yourself in this content because you're not happy about something in your real life
00:27:45
Speaker
This could also go for a heavy indulgence in highly romantic, highly sexual TV or books. From time to time, I don't think explicit content is the end of the world. right But if you surround yourself with that all the time, like super intense, super emotional, like roller coaster and then like highly explicit content in your books or movies, I just can't help but question why and if that translates to something in your daily life. that you're either looking for or curious about or you just want to feel something.
Healthy Hobbies vs. Escapism
00:28:12
Speaker
I don't know. And I just, I just think if left unchecked, this can get to a serious mental health spiral. And generally if you're indulging in a lot of this alone, like if you go to your job and then you go home and your life is fixated on a fantasy world that you really wish was real.
00:28:27
Speaker
or or music that puts you in a really dark, sad place, or in shows that are highly sexual, highly erotic, and that's all you're taking in, I just want you to be okay. I just want you to be all right. And to question why, like why is that the only thing you like right now? Why is that the only thing that makes you feel something, whether it's positive or negative? And if that's the case, like seriously, look inward, I guess. I don't mean to get so passionate. Oh, exactly. yeah I love that. i I think that's very important. I mean, again, we said this was going to be a little bit of a deeper, ah more raw conversation today, because there's really no other way to tackle this. I think when we first talked about talking about this, it was kind of like casual, like, oh, this is a fun topic. And then it got very quickly, very serious. And it's important. I've also been there too. so like Which we didn't expect.
00:29:15
Speaker
Yeah. No, I didn't know that about you like at all. Yeah. Right. Exactly. Which goes to show us, again, it kind of told us like, okay, pray to everyone. If not most people, it will, if not everyone, most people have, have dealt with this too. So we just think that it's important to talk about this. And again, talking with Ayla about this, open some things in my eyes and kind of put it into a different perspective. and i think vice versa in some ways. So hopefully that we can be doing that for you right now. um Maybe you can also talk with a friend about this. um So I think actually what you said, Ayla, like as you were rounding out your last point kind of leads us right into the introversion, extroversion and isolation conversation if you want to, unless you're not done with what you're saying.
00:29:52
Speaker
no i think that's yeah No, I think I can pretty much pretty much just jump into that. um I could probably just keep going on everything we talked about so far. We already said we might need a part two or you know yeah another form of this discussion. But yeah, the other fire that was lighting inside me while we were talking about this was also just the differences between introversion and isolation. And I think some of the things that we're talking about, like overindulging in a hobby that started out fun, but now you're isolating and neglecting the people around you and sometimes neglecting your responsibilities. I think, yeah, that kind of goes into this point. But I think introverts can especially be prone to escapism because you have time to spiral and sit in your own head. ah But that's not what introversion is supposed to be. So we want to talk to our fellow introverts for a minute and share about how you can avoid this. um my husband like Both me and my husband are very introverted. Our closest friends are. A few of my siblings are very introverted. like i
00:30:53
Speaker
It's a bunch I am proud to be a part of, but I couldn't help but kind of think about this and observe this while we we're getting into this topic. by i think okay here we are I think being introverted is being more welcomed into society, which is definitely a good thing. I think the world's generally built for introverts and people understand for extroverts and people understand them a lot more than the introverts. but I think it's beginning to excuse strange behavior. I think it's beginning to excuse behavior like cutting out family and friends who did no wrong to you. Like not a healthy and cutting out, like just cutting them out because you you don't want to be around them. Isolating, delving too deeply into hobbies and not taking care of yourself.
00:31:36
Speaker
It's excusing rude behavior, it's excusing poor performance at work, and it's excusing unhealthy habits. Like being an introvert and being comfortable with your own company and recharging with your own company is different than isolation. And I think some of the things we've been talking about overindulging in a hobby is leading to isolation, and I think this is a particular group of people very prone to that. Yes. and Yes. To every single thing you've said. And I'm so glad we brought this conversation around to this point. Cause again, it's one of those things where when you talk ah or think about this topic, you may not go this further step to talk about this. And especially with exactly what you said, introverts being more prone to this. And um when you even said like cutting out things like family and friends for no reason, just because maybe you don't want to be around them or not even that you don't want to be around them. But like we're saying with this escapism, you have a whole nother world that you can maybe go to.
00:32:29
Speaker
that you're using to substitute the real one because you might like it more because more exciting. Facts. Even if it's not a fantasy world, like we were talking about movies, books, TV shows, even if it's your own little house, like if you live alone too, or even with roommates in your own room that you design a certain way and you have all your stuff there, like even that's your own little world that you're escaping into that you'd rather be.
Introversion vs. Isolation in Modern Society
00:32:51
Speaker
Right. with other people. Oh, that is exactly interesting. Right. Right. So, um, so it does tie in, you know, very well to all of this, but, um, and to your point that you were making, if you need to like charge up, you know, by being alone, like, you know, how introverts a very good way that people explain introversion is like, how do you recharge? How do you get your energy? If it's by being around groups of people, you're extroverted. If it's by being with yourself, you're introverted. That's kind of like the most basic
00:33:15
Speaker
simple definition, like the true definition of an introvert versus extrovert. It's not outgoing or, or whether you're shy, it's actually how you recharge, right? So hopefully people know that by now, but not everybody does. Um, but anyways, so if you, but here's the thing, if you really, really, really need to recharge before you see somebody like very heavily and then also after you see them and like someone really close to your life, we're talking your best friend, we're talking a family member, someone who you supposedly like and care about, even if it's just after being with them for an hour or two and you need to recharge so much after like brief interactions with them, then just so you know, that's not introversion. That's a person who, that's either that person is toxic to you and maybe doesn't even cut out of your life or you are being toxic and using introversion as a mask for your laziness or your intolerance towards other people and their personalities. So Ayla, I love something you used.
00:34:05
Speaker
No, but it's so true. I love something that Ayla said, like you said this, you just said this a little bit ago. You said, put four introverts in a room and we'll talk each other's ear off because that's so true. Your col closest people to you shouldn't drain you that bad. You can be, and Ayla and I were talking about this, right? You can be physically drained and after hanging out with somebody, but emotionally drained? You can be physically and even mentally drained after hanging out with your best friend, but you shouldn't be emotionally drained. and Again, if someone around you does that to you after just a little short interaction, then either those people need to not be as close to you in your life or you need to do some self-reflection and you need to change. You're not ... You're the one emotionally draining. every You also, exactly, or if you just have something going on that's making you unable to handle these interactions, maybe it is escapism, maybe it's something, maybe you'd rather just, again, be going back and escaping, you're too hooked on escapism to even have interactions with people, and maybe it's something different. But you also don't get to use in introversion as an excuse to say, this person's toxic, like they stress me out, like that's not how that works, that's wrong, you're doing yourself more harm than good in the long run. But yeah, being introverted doesn't mean being alone 100% of the time, it doesn't mean always having an excuse
00:35:20
Speaker
when you want to do escapism, but I think it just means like if you're doing that, you just don't know how to be an introvert properly. Yeah, I agree because oh my gosh, I'm like, I could just keep going on this. It's so crazy. But one of the other things is yeah, like you said, it doesn't mean you're alone 100% of the time. And I think people are taking it that way. I think our generation is having our generation and the generations to follow us are in a completely different social atmosphere. than ever before like in ah in an atmosphere that absolutely excuses introversion like my brother and i grew up completely good in our own company we would each sit in our own room and just do things like we read redraw he would build stuff i would listen to like a radio show for hours and we were all good but it doesn't mean that when we had to go have family dinner we were like i have to emotionally prepare for that like exactly and like and i am like
00:36:14
Speaker
I completely understand. It happens to me all the time where I do go to my job. That's customer service. So I talk to like a hundred different people a day. I come home a little tired and yeah, like emotionally tired. And then yeah, I spend my time at home to recharge. Like that's completely normal, but there was a like, it was a difference between being content in your own company and then like The basic human interactions that everyone has to do are trying to be excused by introversion. I don't think the pandemic helped. like I think a lot of us realized we were too comfy in our own company. yeah and We're just in this really weird social sphere. and Then again, people will go out and like bear their souls online, but they can't have a normal conversation with their close friend over coffee. That's emotionally draining. like That freaks me out.
00:36:56
Speaker
now that I kind of get into it, but also it should not mean that you're alone all day. It's more so that you, you have a small amount of time each day to recharge, not escape, but recharge. So yeah, so you go to a party and you do feel a little drained maybe sooner than the other extroverts there. That's fine. You go home, you do your little night routine, you spend some time alone, you decompress. Like that's a lot more normal, but I don't think any introvert ever was meant to spend weeks and weeks and weeks without human interaction. I don't believe that over anybody. Like I don't believe that over the biggest introverts That's isolating like going days and days and days and days and like, and it's the same. One of the other things I was telling Beth was like, so this one argument I have between like introverts and extroverts, I i say it all all the time. I'm about to say the words introverts and extroverts so much. Don't take shots. Um, but but like one of the arguments is extroverts always try to get their introvert friends out of the house and they say like, come on, just get out of your shell. Come on, like come have fun.
00:37:52
Speaker
but no one ever tells the extroverts to like go back into their shell and make it a more calm environment for the introverts to be a part in. like Extrovertism, I guess, is a lot more normal and accepted and the introverts were like the weird ones who had to come out of their shell. Why don't we tell the the extroverts to be more quiet? But in that same sense, extroverts aren't expected like to be around people every single second of the day. Like you still have some errands that you run alone. You still have some time in the evening, probably where you're home alone.
00:38:23
Speaker
introverts are taking this excuse of, oh, I need to be alone all of the time because I'm an introvert. But that's not how extroverts work. Like they have their times where they're alone. Like they're not constantly in a group all the time. Like we were never built to constantly be one way or another. And just because you like being alone more doesn't mean that you're supposed to do that 100% of the time. And also I think I'm seeing an uptake of people claiming that they're introverted, but then talking about not being comfortable in their own thoughts and always having a show going or having a hobby so that they don't have to be alone with their own thoughts. And I'm like, well, you know, you should be content with your own company. Like I'm pretty sure with where I'm at in life right now, you could take away like TV, phone, laptop. You could take away my artwork. You could take my away away my reading, everything. You could put me in a room for an hour and I would be okay. Absolutely. absolutely
00:39:12
Speaker
And I don't know an hour. You could put me alone in a day and I would be fine. I don't know how many people in our generation can say that.
Influence of Social Media and Pandemic on Escapism
00:39:20
Speaker
yeah And that's kind of where we come back to this hobbies and escapism thing. I think people need something occupying their mind all of the time. these days because they don't want to sit with their own thoughts or yeah they are uncontent not content with something going on in their life and they fill it with whatever. Whether that's romantic movies, whether that's dark music, whether that's whatever, either way it's just like no one can be comfortable in their own thoughts anymore.
00:39:45
Speaker
and I would say first of all, yeah, I would say that's even another whole conversation we could have um about how I think that actually social media maybe mixed with the pandemic created um like this made this problem worse, but almost in its own separate way. Because I think escapism has always been a problem. And I think the root causes of like need for control, trauma, you know, need for relaxation or distressing, and then also like being happy in your own life, it's kind of been like, pretty constant and then there's just just this whole thing of like almost what I feel like you could be branching off to right now of saying like not being able to be alone with your thoughts again that's always been a problem and for different people but like so heavily with everybody in this generation always needing to be entertained not being able to be alone with your own thoughts
00:40:32
Speaker
just having all these excuses for always like getting out of things because of like introversion or whatever or mental health like there's just so many things like that um yeah but anyways so yeah i thought but it's still very interesting like and i think it still kind of ties in but um it again like you said we could talk for days about this and like yeah and i know we kind of branched to two directions like once i got to the end there kind of brought it back with like we started out by talking about like how hobbies can easily become well maybe not so easily i don't know hobbies can become a form of
Maintaining Balance Between Hobbies and Reality
00:41:02
Speaker
escapism. And I think this dire need for people to be alone is a part of that. And I'm just, I'm just kind of curious to see where it keeps going. I just want everyone to be okay. And I want everyone to enjoy their books, movie shows, but also just like yeah be happy when everything gets turned off, when the TV gets turned off, when the books closed. And if you're not, please talk to somebody like whoever you need to talk to.
00:41:25
Speaker
and and like figure I don't know, figure it out. Figure it out, she says. No, and I'll tell you what, when you see somebody who does have that balance, it's so obvious. like I have um a few friends and I would i would think, Ayla, that you're one of them, but um who you can see, they have their hobbies, they have their there's things they love to get into, but then they also like have a wonderful life. They have a really solid grounding. you know Their feet are on planet Earth and um there's just It's just, it's just very healthy and it's, it's hard to explain, but also even with introversion, extroversion, like if they're an introvert, they're good at getting their recharging time, but they're also good at saying yes to doing activities. They have like, life's outside of like being isolated. And then if they're an extrovert, they're really good at, you know, having their extroverted time, but I've also seen them be alone and be perfectly content. Maybe their hobby. Like I know an extrovert, I have a good friend who is, I know she is an extrovert. Like I know it to be the fact,
00:42:21
Speaker
We've never talked about it, but this, this girl is always hanging out with people and I love it. But I've also, I know for a fact, she can sit for like seven hours and like read a book and I'm just, and she's so happy. It's just, it's so impressive and it's his balance. oh yeah that's Yes, exactly. You're not a hundred percent either one, even if you're very much an introvert or very much an extrovert, there needs to be balance. And that's again, almost very into another conversation. So the point is what? The bottom line, I think we would say, is hobbies are good. And Ayla and I have said before, you have to have hobbies. Hobbies are good, but they shouldn't be heavily distracting you from your obligations and real life productivity. They shouldn't be making you feel sad past a day or so past the intended purpose, you know, if it's like a movie or something or a book.
00:43:04
Speaker
and they shouldn't ever be making you feel depressed, lethargic, unmotivated, or life like life is not worth living like you hate your life at all. So it's like, you know, there you go. That's our summary. Hopefully we explain that. Oh, fire. If you skipped the whole episode till this point, that's
Conclusion and Listener Engagement
00:43:20
Speaker
fine. she says but I mean, please don't. I don't know why you skipped it just now, but if if this is all you heard, rewind 20 seconds and listen again. oh my gosh That was like the heart of what we were really trying to say here. And yeah, thank you so much for listening today for your support of the Art of Intention. We truly do care about you guys. We care about the deeper topics like this. We care about your input too. We always want to hear your thoughts on each episode we love when you reshare, when you tag us, when you tell us how the episode made you feel. It's a huge motivator for us to keep going and just a huge sign that we're that we're that we're doing something right with this show here.
00:43:55
Speaker
um A few ways to support the show that are completely free to you, if you like what we do, is to make sure you're following us on whatever platform you listen on. We are on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Zencaster. If you haven't already, please leave us your five-star rating and review. and Feel free to follow and review us cross-platform. Even if you're not, if you're an Apple listener, you can still for free head over and do all that on Spotify and vice versa. It just continues to tell the podcast world that we're out there. Exactly. And another way to support the show and make sure you don't miss an episode topic um that we put out there is to make sure you're following our Instagram and get another free way to support us. We love that. It's just super fun. We're both Instagram girlers. We're on there all the time. Probably too much.
00:44:37
Speaker
um we We post all kinds of info and we try to do resources too that are kind of extra for some of our episodes and it's just a great place to engage with us, engage with our other listeners um and tell us your thoughts whenever you want, whether it's in DMs or the comments. So we can't wait to see you there and we'll catch you again next week with a new episode. Bye. bye