Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Tear the Picture Down! - FF S2 E2
28 Plays14 days ago
How far should we go in defending our families and our fellow brothers in Christ? When does civil disobedience go too far? Our fatherhood panel discusses how to wisely address problems in our society and what lengths we should go to in being a warrior for Christ!
Check out PreacherDad.com
Email us: Dads@PreacherDad.com
Recommended
Transcript
Debating Appropriate Actions
00:00:00
Speaker
but basically there was a photo on the wall and there's a photo on the wall of a very scantily dressed female. What I did next is what sparked the debate amongst my peers.
00:00:14
Speaker
um So you might think in that situation, okay, well either you look at the photo or you don't. I found option three and that was to rip the photo off the wall and throw it away. But two, out of respect for the woman in the photo,
00:00:26
Speaker
um I chose to not participate in the objectifying and the spiritual abuse of objectifying her. um So that's, I think, is the the core of it.
Introduction to Moral Boundaries
00:00:44
Speaker
Hello everybody, welcome to Fatherhood Friday brought to you by the Preacher Dad Podcast. And today we have an episode for you about tearing the picture down. What does that mean? Well, gonna have to listen to find out.
00:00:55
Speaker
ah But it's really about being intent and how far is too far when it comes to protecting ourselves and our brothers in Christ and our families from the onslaught of evil in the world. So I hope that you'll listen in, get some wisdom, enter the debate,
00:01:12
Speaker
And as always, this podcast is brought to you by Cornerstone Fellowship. Cornerstone Fellowship is a little church just a little north of Tombsboro, Georgia. You can find us online at cornerstonefellowship-ga.org. And we would love for you to come and check us out. You can listen to sermons, find out more about what we believe.
00:01:33
Speaker
And come on down and let us love you and point you to Jesus. Cornerstonefellowship-ga.org. And without any further ado, let's find out how far is too far.
Nate's Personal Story
00:01:45
Speaker
Listen in.
00:01:46
Speaker
Welcome to Fatherhood Friday.
00:01:52
Speaker
Well, hello, everybody. You've made it. Here it is. It's Fatherhood Friday brought to you by the Preacher Dad podcast. My name is Jared, and I am one of the hosts here on the show and my co-hosts tonight are matt stewart and nate eisner and these are my uh very beloved brothers in the lord and we are all dads in various places and various situations in our lives and we just want to encourage you tonight and this evening we're going to talk about um
00:02:27
Speaker
Well, I'm not sure exactly how to set this up, Nate. Why don't you just go ahead and tell us the story and and and get us going here tonight? Yeah, so this is this is something I threw out. this is we We talked about this a little while back.
00:02:43
Speaker
um This actually is a story that took place about four years ago, i'd say. um Yeah, I'm going to try and be somewhat discreet here and not name the precise location where this occurred. um for specific reasons. but um So i'll just I'll just jump right into it. So about four years ago, I took my family to a restaurant, and ah it was you know it was any other day, and you do what you got to do before you
Removing the Photo: Motivations and Reflections
00:03:16
Speaker
leave. So I decided to go go in for a restroom break.
00:03:19
Speaker
And when I walked in, um i was a little bit rattled to see what I saw. And perhaps I'm a touch naive, um but basically there was a photo on the wall. this this oh me Let me back up a little bit.
00:03:35
Speaker
This particular restaurant has um is is known for a lot of framed pictures and lots of decor. And so maybe that'll drop some hints as to where it was, but there's quite a few of them out there that do that. So good luck. But anyways, I walk in the restroom and there's a photo on the wall of a very scantily dressed female. And perhaps I'm a touch naive when it comes to, you know, I guess I'm still, I'm still learning how, how depraved the world can be. And the thing is the, the, the photo is not any, any worse than what you would see in a typical lingerie ad, you know, walking through the mall, um, or what you would see, you know, in maybe a department at the store. But the fact that it was just there and so blatant really caught me off guard because,
00:04:24
Speaker
um
00:04:27
Speaker
I think the the the normalization of pornography in our culture, um while it's been going on for a long time, it still it still caught me off guard.
00:04:39
Speaker
um And so as someone that has formerly dealt with pornography addiction, facing a situation like that behind closed doors in a single stall restroom, I think for one, it's a It's a test of integrity because you're in a place where no one's looking. um And so I've always i've always learned or what was taught from from my youth group age that it's not the first look that gets you in trouble, it's the second.
00:05:08
Speaker
And you know we're going to do a whole episode on, or probably two, on the issue of ah pornography and lust. um But I guess what I did next is what's just what sparked the debate amongst my peers.
00:05:23
Speaker
um So you might think in that situation, okay, either you look at the photo or you don't. um I found option three, and that was to rip the photo off the wall and throw it away. um And so the the question, I guess, is yes, it's destruction of property. And that was something that I did because it may or may not have damaged some of the sheetrock in the process. But anyways, that's ah that that happened, and it is what it is.
00:05:47
Speaker
um So I guess the thing to do now is to kind of break down my thought process and reflecting on that moment, what drove me to do that.
00:05:57
Speaker
um
00:06:00
Speaker
For one, um something that I always knew in the back of my mind when I was, you know, a young lad in my high school years is I knew that every single one of these girls that is in the situation of the porn industry is one of God's daughters.
00:06:20
Speaker
um Yet, ah when you're caught in sin, you do things that you're ashamed of, but I guess I'm kind of getting off topic here, but anyways, um trying to see how I want to, how want to frame this a little bit better. What was it about, what was it about that moment that just yeah drove you to to just rip the picture off the wall?
00:06:45
Speaker
So knowing that, I guess I was going somewhere with that. I, was telling them earlier, I kind of, in preparation for this episode, I kind of brain dumped onto a big PDF here and I'm not super organized with it. It's just paragraph after paragraph. So finding myself here, but yes, thank you, Jared. um
00:07:03
Speaker
Not only is it one of God's daughters, every single one of those women is, is another man's daughter. It's another woman's daughter. It's someone's sister. um And whether they realize it or not in, Again, we'll probably get into this. Not every woman in the porn industry is there by their own by their own will. But whether many of them are and whether they realize it or not, they have ah they have bought into a lie that tells them that they're not made in the image of God and that they're not worthy um to be loved by a man, that they're not worthy or beautiful enough to be cherished.
00:07:42
Speaker
And that is something that is at the core of my beliefs. And so I think what drove me to take the picture down is, number one, out of respect for my wife, um I chose to avert my eyes in the process of removing it. But two, out of respect for the woman in the photo, um I chose to not participate in the objectifying and the spiritual abuse of objectifying her.
00:08:06
Speaker
um So that's, I think, is the the the core of it. And we can remember from Jesus's words that um All physical symptoms and manifestations of sin are at a deeper root, and that is the heart. you know if you If you are angry with your brother without cause, you commit murder. If you look at a woman with lust, you commit adultery with her in your heart.
00:08:28
Speaker
And in that same light, I would say that um participating in objectifying or condoning a woman that is ah participating in the act of pornography, um you're participating in spiritual abuse. and in a Yeah.
00:08:44
Speaker
I would say you are in the spirit of abuse in that moment if you are choosing to condone that and and participate in it. And so out of respect to the woman, I took the photo down. um Out of the thought and care for other men like myself that believe the way I do and they themselves are trying to um walk in purity and who genuinely want women to see themselves as they were created in the image of God. um I took it down for those men. I took it down for the high school boys that were once like me that would stumble because of a photo like that. I took it down for the prepubescent boy that has no business being exposed to something at such a young age. This is a public restroom. This is a place where, I mean, think about hundreds of people are going to go in and out of that single stall throughout any given day. And so um that, I think, is the the reason, you know, reflecting on it that drove me to do it.
00:09:51
Speaker
And I guess you can ask, well, I guess let me let me wrap up my my thoughts here. At the end of the day, did I destroy someone else's property? Yes,
Limits of Christian Intervention
00:10:00
Speaker
I did. um Does that open the conversation about how far is too far when it comes to Christians intervening intervening in our godless culture? Absolutely it does.
00:10:09
Speaker
um in the grand scheme of life. Did the message that I send by ripping the picture down, is that going to change the world? No, not ah not at all. If anything, I probably upset the ah the male employees, sadly. They probably thought I just took it for myself, but they obviously didn't check the trash can possibly. But um ah what I did do at the very least was is in the microscopic corner of society that is that public restroom. um I removed a stumbling block for other people. And so that is that is where I've landed. I figure at the very least for for those out there that have seen The Chosen, i mean, it's in the Gospels as well, but when I think The Chosen depicts it very well when James and John want Jesus to call down lightning from heaven, and he has to shake their his head at them and calls them the sons of thunder. I think I probably would have gotten a similar response from Jesus where he physically standing next to me, you know, kind of a easy there tiger moment. But that's that's where I think I'll land on that. But um I also have intentionally kind of waited to to really think through the pros and cons of how far is too far, because I really wanted to flesh that out in this discussion. I'm really curious to hear what you guys have to say and what your thoughts are on the matter.
00:11:35
Speaker
So you don't regret it, Nate, right? I, at this moment would say, no, I do not regret it.
00:11:45
Speaker
I'm, it's, it's an intriguing question because the, the father in me and the warrior in me says, i just cheer for you.
00:11:55
Speaker
in that moment to yeah, you know, take it to him. Um, but then there's another part of me, that says, uh, you know, it's, I'm not sure how persuasive that is.
00:12:11
Speaker
i don't know if it's too far or not. I've, I've never been one really to damage property. Felt like I ought not to, but I certainly am not above civil disobedience or um you know even breaking the law if it means you know ah ah following christ um peter and john said very clearly you know we cannot follow man and disobey god we have to we have to follow we have to obey god first ah rather than men
00:12:53
Speaker
Um, and so, you know, things like the things that this is really a deep question because men like Dietrich Bonhoeffer wrestled with this question about, you know, is it a righteous thing to murder a wicked man? You know, they were not dealing with anything. you know, people accuse everybody of being a Nazi.
00:13:13
Speaker
They were actually dealing with real life Nazis and and an actual monster in Adolf Hitler who, you know, he was involved in conspiring to assassinate Adolf Hitler.
00:13:29
Speaker
And I, said I think I would have supported that. I think it would have been on his side and helped them, but that is not the position many Christians take. And even right Christians in Bonhoeffer's day were opposed to that, adamantly opposed to it.
00:13:46
Speaker
You should not kill at all. Anyone, even the most wicked men, of our society. So it's kind of a catch 22.
00:14:01
Speaker
Hey folks, I want to tell you about 7 Weeks Coffee. They are a company that believes every life is worth fighting for. When you purchase 7 Weeks Coffee, you're directly helping to fund their network of over 750 pro-life organizations across the country. That's because with every purchase of their delicious coffee, 7 Weeks is donating 10% of that sale to pro-life pregnancy centers that reach women and men in crisis every day.
00:14:27
Speaker
In the last two years, Seven Weeks Coffee has donated $250,000 to help save the lives of children and also rescue their parents from years of regret and suffering.
00:14:38
Speaker
But you don't have to endure poor quality coffee to make a difference. Their coffee is harvested in the most organic way possible, and you can taste the difference in every sip. It really is quite good, folks. I really am loving in this coffee. These coffee beans are mold and toxin free, and they use organic farming practices.
00:14:55
Speaker
And the coffee is ultra low in acid. When a baby reaches seven weeks from conception, it is the size of a coffee bean. And that is also the point at which a heartbeat is first detectable. Seven weeks coffee is committed to the pro-life cause and you can get an outstanding product while contributing to the important work of pregnancy centers across the United States.
00:15:17
Speaker
Now, in order to get 10% off, you can go to preacher dad.com and use my special link, or you can go to seven weeks, coffee.com and use the promo code preacher dad for 10% off.
00:15:28
Speaker
And then you can join me in saving lives. One cup of coffee at a time, go to seven weeks, coffee.com today and use the promo code preacher dad.
00:15:40
Speaker
Yeah. I was just thinking, I was just thinking about what I would do in a situation like that. um And if I would have had like my son with me and I saw it, I would obviously, i think I would just say, look, don't go in that stall. You're going to go over here in this one. Don't, you know, whatever. And if that was the only one to go in, um might done the same thing. I don't know.
00:16:04
Speaker
But, um but yeah, I agree. we We do have to, we do have to go to um kind of extraordinary measures at times to, to protect our, our children and our families.
00:16:17
Speaker
nate I think, I think that, um, if I were in that place, I think I maybe he would have taken the picture down and then taken 20 bucks to the manager and said, uh, this is for the stall in the bathroom yep and walked out, you know, like, yeah, here I'm, I'm compensating you. I'm going to actually pay for your repairs, but don't you dare put a picture like that up in the wall again.
00:16:42
Speaker
that yeah That's the kind of, to me, I think that's a, um balanced godly manly thing to do to tear the wall tear the picture down yeah um but then to also maintain a positive Christian testimony with unbelievers is to say okay out of my own pocket here you go here's some money to help for pay for repairs but I'm not apologizing you know a solid
00:17:16
Speaker
And I think that more men need
Maintaining Positive Christian Testimony
00:17:19
Speaker
to have that attitude. It needs to be more, um i mean, everybody talks about being nice and you know we don't need to be nicer than God, you know kind of stuff people say.
00:17:31
Speaker
um i think that we should be less weak. am I think being nice is fine. Nice has a negative connotation now, but there's a difference between being weak and being polite um i think it's okay to be polite and it's good to be polite well there's a different i tweet it there was a difference between nice and kind that's a good that's a good way to say it too and i don't i don't i don't like making nice a negative uh but that's true but we we don't need to necessarily redefine that word as a negative word but we do need to identify the negative
00:18:14
Speaker
attitude in men that causes them to be, you know, ah really soft on sin and really, yeah you know, being willing to justify people's, uh, misbehavior and well, you know, let's, let's try to, you know, find a good reason why that was justified behavior.
00:18:38
Speaker
You know, you you just need to call sin by its rightful name and that's in the scripture too. A man who calls sin by his rightful name is to be praised. And so we need to, like, you know, there I think his name is Nick Fritas.
00:18:51
Speaker
ah He does some stuff on social media, which is hilarious, but it's also courageous to just say the truth and speak the truth for what it is and call out sin. And we need we need more of that in our society. And so my my feeling is tear the picture down.
00:19:13
Speaker
take it down, fight back. And, you know, if that means a little civil disobedience, it means a little bit of, uh, you know, bending some rules, then so be it that, I mean, we're talking about our kids hearts.
00:19:27
Speaker
Yeah. talking about our brothers. Well, uh, so, you know, in, I figured we might get into this on the, uh, the, the porn episode and,
00:19:39
Speaker
we We certainly ought to because I don't have the stats in front of me, but I was doing some research on this um in prep for this and the psychological um impact that it has on a prepubescent child to be exposed to pornography or, I mean, let's be real, you know, pornography is not just full-blown nudity.
Psychological Impact of Inappropriate Content
00:20:02
Speaker
um But the the early exposure has lasting psychological impact on on children that that are exposed to it before puberty.
00:20:13
Speaker
um Obviously stress, it it's not a it's probably not quite as intense as full-blown assault, um but it absolutely can be scarring and can cause a trauma response. And so, I mean, that alone, you know, And that's the thing, like how far, well, it's so pervasive in our culture. And I guess it has been, but it seems to be getting worse and worse to the point where now that the age that it seems to be acceptable to present this to children seems to be getting lower and lower and lower um across the board with with all things. um
00:21:00
Speaker
I was, you know, you even just look like movie ratings, for, um ah you think about like what what a PG movie was 10 years ago, 15 years ago. oh There are some PG movies now that it's amazing they're not PG-13, if not are. And so it's it's just so pervasive. And, you know, like I said, you know, it's always been at the mall, you know, walking by the lingerie store. It's always been on billboards. It's on pop-up ads. And so,
00:21:33
Speaker
you know how the the question is like how do you fight it but um aside from christians christian men standing up and acting like men um and it's one it's going to be small steps um but this is also part of probably a bigger conversation of um of strengthening the church and men showing up in the church and beginning to act like men because really the church can have a massive impact on society.
00:22:08
Speaker
Um, it's certainly felt like we've been the losing team for a while. Um, but it does not have to stay that way. And that kind of changed, especially when it comes to our influence on society and culture is not going to happen overnight, but we cannot give up the fight in, in doing so. And I don't believe we will because,
00:22:30
Speaker
um I mean, well, that's probably a different conversation with eschatology and such, but, you know.
Collective Responsibility in Culture
00:22:38
Speaker
I think what you're talking about is, you know, what what difference does taking one picture down in one stall make? Yeah, yeah. And the answer to that is if every Christian man took down every nasty picture in every bathroom stall they went into, that would make a big difference. True. And it's not my job to handle every uh every picture out there it's my job to handle the ones in my sphere and it's my job to handle my wall you know in the bible in the book of nehemiah uh the walls of jerusalem had been torn down and the enemies of jerusalem could come and go as they pleased and wild animals coming in and out and so nehemiah says we got to build this wall back up but we also have to defend our homes at the same time yeah
00:23:28
Speaker
so each man was responsible for his section of the wall. And each man had to not only repair his area near his home, but he also had to defend that section as well.
00:23:41
Speaker
And there's no way that just one of them could have done that entire incredible task, but all of them working together, each one taking their part of the wall meant that the wall got built in record time and meant that the people were protected at the same time.
00:23:57
Speaker
And so as men, I can't do your job. I can't, I'm not, I don't live where you guys live. You know, you don't live where I live, but I need to take care of my part of the wall.
00:24:09
Speaker
And I think all of us Christian brothers and those Christians listening ah to this podcast today, you know, we all need to take care of our spot of the wall yeah and be willing to um be courageous when it comes to pushing back and fighting back against the onslaught of wickedness in our society.
00:24:37
Speaker
So that's, I, I, you know, it can be, if we let ourselves think what, what, but what big difference does this make? Why should I take the time take down one photo? Well, it can make a big difference, uh, when everybody does their part in their area. So,
00:24:56
Speaker
think that's the mindset we should have. And I think that goes as far as to even being vocal about it to your to your peers. um I know there have been moments where I have asked someone not to show me raunchy images on a cell phone anymore after he was showing it to multiple people in the working environment that we were in. And, you know, that's a probably an uncomfortable thing to do,
00:25:22
Speaker
but again, you have to you have to have the courage to to speak up when speak up for your beliefs. um Yeah.
00:25:33
Speaker
Matt, do you have ah any insight to give us here? No, I was just trying to think of some other examples of times that, you know, something like that might come up.
00:25:46
Speaker
um You know, it could be in a restaurant and they've got TVs going and something's on that shouldn't be shown. Don't want to not rip the the TVs off the wall. yeah But I go talk to them and ask them to to change it.
00:26:01
Speaker
I was one more too, but I can't remember. but But yeah, I agree with you. Just we do need to be courageous. I really can't think of anything I've done like that. um Here's one that it comes up around here sometimes is when you know I'm standing, I'm there with my wife or my children.
00:26:20
Speaker
If someone nearby is swearing or using foul language to be willing and courageous enough to say, excuse me, my family can hear what you're saying. Would you please stop? yeah And I think that would go a long way if men would be willing to stand up and have courageous courageous conversations about doing that.
00:26:41
Speaker
but that's a But Matt, that's a good example. you know Be willing to say, excuse me, that is offensive to me would you please change the channel or you know just just basically be willing to call it out to confront you to confront sin we need more people we need more men especially who are willing to be confrontational when they they stop like and you know here we go again they stop being nice and they start being manly you know yeah not that that nicety keeps you i i don't want to offend keeps you from being courageous to confront the the problem you need to you need to stand up and kindly confront the problem yeah and manliness masculinity is a good thing it's a good thing we need we need more of it you're right we should be encouraging it we should be encouraging it in our sons yeah and in ourselves and and displaying it for our sons because
00:27:42
Speaker
That's really how a boy learns to be a man is by watching his father behave. Yeah.
Encouragement for Courageous Confrontation
00:27:48
Speaker
but However, his father behaves is either an, an advantage or a disadvantage to him in his development of manliness.
00:27:55
Speaker
Sort of, sort of off topic, but today was a snow day. And so we watched the second half of a movie called big country. Y'all ever heard of that old Western no movie? I've, I've heard the name big country, but anyway, um we all liked it. All, all of our, all of my kids, but,
00:28:12
Speaker
um the main character, they wanted him to, they wanted him to fight somebody. They wanted him to to to shoot in a duel. They wanted him to do all of these things and they kept making fun of him and his fiance left him because he wasn't being manly or he wasn't being normal or whatever. But in fact, he was, it showed, ah he was having a ton of self-control and he was, and so I,
00:28:40
Speaker
Anyway, he he didn't do just what people wanted him to do. he didn't He didn't give in to their demands. he he um He stood his ground. And at one point, she's like, do you not care what I think? And he's like, well, I care about doing what's right.
00:28:54
Speaker
And I did not think fighting him was the right thing to do right then and there. So anyway, it's a good good little lesson yeah for my son. Like, you know, being a man, and sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes you have to fight.
00:29:05
Speaker
But other times you have to, it's self-control. and You've got to, you know. do something different. But anyway, good stuff. Okay. Well, thank you guys. And hopefully, you know, we have, uh, encouraged someone out there to have some, some courage to be confrontational and to be willing to, um, push some boundaries when it comes to standing up for what is right and what is true.
00:29:32
Speaker
And, uh, if you, what we would love to know what you think.
Listener Engagement and Support
00:29:36
Speaker
So if you would like to comment on this video, if you're watching it or, ah or if you're listening to the podcast, or maybe you'd like to just send us an email, you can sure do that.
00:29:47
Speaker
The email address is dads, D-A-D-S, at preacherdad.com. Dads at preacherdad.com. We would love to hear from you and know what you think about whether or not this is an important thing for us to be doing. Would you tear the picture down?
00:30:08
Speaker
What would your solution be? Let us know. And while you're letting us know, you might as well just click that's this that subscribe button. It's really easy. Just click and you're done.
00:30:19
Speaker
And that would make make our day and really help us out. So God bless you. And we look forward to sharing more with you next time on Fatherhood Friday. Thanks so much for tuning in.
00:30:32
Speaker
See you next time. Bye.