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Should Christians Drink? - FF S2 E9
6 Plays1 hour ago
In this episode Tony and Jarod discuss an important issue all dads should have an answer for as we live in the world: What role should alcohol have in our lives? Should it have ANY role at all? And what does snake handling have to do with this subject? All of this and more as we determine what guidance the Scriptures give us for this issue.
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Transcript
Introduction and Episode Theme
00:00:09
Speaker
Well, hello, you 12 or 13 listeners out there. Thank you for joining us today. This is Fatherhood Friday brought to you by the Preacher Dad podcast, and we're glad you're here with us.
Should Christians Drink Alcohol?
00:00:19
Speaker
Today, we're going to talk about an interesting, controversial topic.
00:00:23
Speaker
Should we drink alcohol or not? Is there moderation? Is there modifications? is there Is there a scale or is it absolutely black and white?
00:00:35
Speaker
what What
Sponsor and Church Invitation
00:00:36
Speaker
is the truth here? And so myself and my good brother, we discussed this subject and I hope that you find it enlightening, enriching and helpful as you consider this important subject also. Please remember that this podcast is brought to you by Cornerstone Fellowship. Cornerstone Fellowship is a small country church Way out in the middle of nowhere, Georgia. And we would love to love on you if you want to come on by. You can go to That's cornerstonefellowship, all one word, dash ga, as in Georgia, dot o-r-g. And we would love to see you. If you want to come and visit us, you can find an address there.
00:01:16
Speaker
And we would just enjoy that so much. So let's go ahead and dive into Fatherhood Fatherhood Friday.
00:01:32
Speaker
Hello, everybody. We're so glad to have
Hosts' Perspectives on Alcohol
00:01:34
Speaker
you here. I'm Jared, and I'm here tonight with my brother, Tony. Tony Russell is a long friend. He's a long friend.
00:01:42
Speaker
He's long both directions. He's tall and wide. No, he's... He's been a good buddy of mine for quite a long time, and we just enjoy having a lot of fun together. Tonight, we're going to talk about a subject that we feel is important. It's certainly not one of those primary things that's going to keep you out of heaven, but it's a very important thing in our day in society to consider, to consider.
00:02:07
Speaker
You might say debate, although we're not so much debating, I don't think, tonight as we are discussing what Scripture says about the subject of alcohol. Should a Christian drink or not?
00:02:18
Speaker
And I would say I definitely come from the background of saying any drinking is wrong. You should never do it. That's certainly my background, although I still got cough syrup when I was growing up. So it's not a absolute in that sense, but drinking strong drink. I think I come from this background of the position that says scripture teaches us not to drink.
Christian Liberty and Alcohol
00:02:39
Speaker
But Tony has some other perspectives, so we're going to talk about those tonight. So, Tony, you have something, though, that you want to share with our audience that's, I think, pretty important. So go ahead. Absolutely. So I i do have the Presbyterian beard, so obviously I like you know bourbon. But the the point of tonight is not to evangelize alcohol.
00:03:01
Speaker
I am not an advocate for of alcohol in the sense that this somehow is some great improvement upon your life and your spiritual walk with the Lord. I am of the opinion that it is a liberty that we have as Christians, but...
00:03:14
Speaker
There are an enormous amount of parameters that the Bible is not ambiguous at all about to try to guard us from drunkenness and excess and even finding things that violate our own conscience that would not otherwise be sin unless we partake in.
00:03:27
Speaker
And that's there are are issues with this particular subject. I do not want anyone to take any of the things that I say as somehow an argument for that rave party you're getting ready to go to with your, what would Jesus do? T-shirt. Hey, Lord, the guys on fatherhood Friday said it was okay. So I'm shooting up.
00:03:48
Speaker
They, i I like to sit and sip, and I think that it is a gift of the Lord. However, if you're sitting and sipping, and that leads you to all kinds of crazy lasciviousness and stupid thoughts and dumb friends and a terrible lifestyle, this is not in favor of you. I am not in your corner, and I have not come to support you with the things I have to share today, neither does Scripture. However...
Unity Among Christians on Alcohol Views
00:04:14
Speaker
The actual point of all this is that if you are on on the fence out there and you have decided that you need to part ways with your brother because you found out he has a wine cabinet, i want to help encourage you that he is still a brother and may still be in good standing with the Lord just because his communion is a little better than yours. Oh, I don't know about that.
00:04:37
Speaker
But yeah, this isn't a thing for Christians to break break apart over. This is something that Christians ought to still be able to get their arms around and love each other. And there are certain behaviors, obviously, that are associated with this particular partaking, that there is no defense on either side. And I hope that in what we talk about tonight, you don't hear any defense for anything that is evil or wicked or violates the Word of God.
00:05:01
Speaker
um That is not the the heart that I bring to the table tonight. Absolutely. Well, I 100% agree
Biblical References to Alcohol
00:05:07
Speaker
with that. And, um you know, I think ah setting the table here really well, it reminds me of Romans 14. And in Romans 14, Paul is talking about the meat offered to idols and how some Christians felt it was perfectly fine to do. And some felt that that was, you know, a violation. It was honoring those idols and participating in worship of those false gods. And so, you know, Paul said, hey, look, don't offend the conscience of your brother ah just for the sake of meat, because who what's more important, your brother or meat?
00:05:40
Speaker
No. So he said, if you if you know your brother is offended by that, don't do it. And so it's kind of like, ah you know, I think, Tony, if if I was bringing my family over to your house to hang out have a nice evening, I think that you would refrain from offering alcohol to myself and you would refrain from... ah drinking in front of my children, because you know that that would bother our sensibility. So, you know, at the same time, I'm not going to sit and wag my finger at you in this respect.
00:06:10
Speaker
um Yeah. in the reverse of that is also true. If I come to your house, I expect you to have my favorite. No, it's not.
00:06:20
Speaker
That is not in the context of Romans 14. Not in any way. You are misapplying scripture. That was very funny, though. Oh, well there So this is, I actually, in part of the prep for tonight, I have 1 Corinthians 8, which is a very similar topic. is I think, I don't know if it's ah a complete repeat of that exact same.
00:06:40
Speaker
Go ahead. Go ahead and read Let's jump right into the Bible. Go. Well, verse 7 through 13, however, not all possess this knowledge, but some through former association with idols eat food is really offered as, I'm sorry, I forgot that I can't read when it's right in front of my face like this. So, um,
00:06:56
Speaker
Through former association with idols. Hang on. What verse are you in? I am starting verse 7. First Corinthians 8. First Corinthians chapter 8, verse 7. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. ah Let me start again since I have have royally bungled this up. Since you've messed it up, they've already stepped on to another video. That's it. We're done. I mean. Look, we lose half our team and all of my professional skills are out the window. So.
00:07:19
Speaker
Go ahead. right however not All
00:07:29
Speaker
food will not commend us to god we are no worse off if we do if we do not eat and no better off if we do but take care that this is right that this right of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak for if anyone sees you who have knowledge eating in an idol's temple, will he not be encouraged if his conscience is weak to eat food offered to idols? And so, by your knowledge, this weak person is destroyed, the brother for whom Christ died, thus sinning against your brothers and wounding their conscience. When it is weak, you sin against Christ. Therefore, if food makes my brother stumble, I will not eat meat, lest I make my brother stumble."
00:08:08
Speaker
The interesting part to this whole passage to me, and I think this is the proper framing that we get into the way that we talk about this discussion, is if what I'm doing causes you to feel the liberty to do evil and then you do evil, that's my sin.
00:08:23
Speaker
because I have misled you. And that's that's why I opened the way I did. i am very nervous. And I think people ought to be, if they're talking about this, if you so feel the liberty to be able to partake in this thing, be so cautious that in the presentation of such a thing, that people don't take what you say as liberty to sin, because you've liberated ah their conscience in a way where God meant it to be constrained.
00:08:47
Speaker
Yeah, I think that part of the thing that we're trying to do here tonight for all of you listening out there is especially if you have decided to allow alcohol in your life and and you participated in it on a regular basis and you know you don't have any problem getting drunk and you you justify that behavior with scripture, we kind of want you to say to say, wait a minute, that's not really applying scripture the way you ought to. We're kind of trying to encourage a degree of temperance here.
00:09:17
Speaker
No matter where you actually land on this subject, you know there needs to be an understanding of what the Bible truly does teach us. And so we felt that coming from kind of kind of differing sides on this a little bit, um certainly different practices and different approaches, that we would still be able to say, hey, this is the Bible says this, the Bible says this.
00:09:39
Speaker
How would this apply? You dads that are listening and anyone else that chooses to listen in to a fatherhood podcast, you need to be able to have an answer in this area for your kids. And you need to be able to, for your own life too, ah for your you yourself and your wife, if you have one, you need to be able to address this subject in a godly biblical way.
Guidance for Fathers on Discussing Alcohol
00:10:01
Speaker
And while I might not see totally eye to eye with my brother, Tony, he's still my brother. And I do believe that he is approaching this in a godly biblical way with an adherence to the authority of God's word. God's word is absolutely.
00:10:17
Speaker
an authority in our lives, both of us. And so we're goingnna try to apply the scripture to this subject because we want all of you listening to do the same thing. You need to be doing that in the subject of alcohol and really in any Christian liberties um or what people think are liberties. But um ah we we wanted to just broach the subject with you because, Daz, this is an important thing to do.
00:10:44
Speaker
So, um Tony, um I will let you have the first volley here. already shared the first scripture, which is really a good way to set the table in and set the tone here.
00:10:55
Speaker
But why don't you share with me why the Bible says it is okay to drink alcohol. Well, it doesn't just say it. It promotes it vigorously quite a few times through. Lord Jesus, protect and preserve his life. Mercy, please.
00:11:13
Speaker
All right, so that that might be too strong of a statement. But what you will find all throughout the Old Testament, especially whenever we're talking about um various feasts of of celebration and praise to God, it's there. Not only is it there, it's in heaven.
00:11:28
Speaker
Before the throne room of God, when he brings us all home, the master feast, there's a reference to well-aged wine. as being part of God's table. I personally think that's probably what Jesus turned the water into whenever he was doing his first miracle, was some sampling of that, of the wine from God's table, to kind of prepare a little bit. But that's, you in part why this those members who partook had no ability to recognize it and couldn't understand why The bridegroom would would hide such a great quality thing until everybody had deadened senses and was not able to fully enjoy it.
00:12:09
Speaker
But anyway, that's obviously pure conjecture. that doesn't I'm not going to hang my whole theology on that. But the ah for me and my background, I came up very much like you, Jared. i was I come from a home where you just
Personal Journeys with Alcohol
00:12:23
Speaker
didn't talk about this stuff. It wasn't... that you You could not possibly understand the Bible and walk away from it thinking that there could be anywhere where a real drop of alcohol touched a Christian's tongue and he didn't immediately lose his salvation. It was very, very strongly hated sin in the household that I grew up in, that you would, you, you needed to separate yourself from this at all costs. And then as I grew and as I read more, especially as I read more through the old Testament, I started finding that there's really.
00:12:52
Speaker
not quite that heat against this particular subject that was in my culture while I was growing up. And I just ran into passage after passage after passage where you start seeing wine presented in a positive way, not necessarily the, well, not ever in any of the cases that I would reference here in just the simple watered down grape juice kind of way, but in the fully fermented, fully powerful, strong drink kind of way.
00:13:22
Speaker
And so, so, so give me one of those, give me one of those. Okay. So here's this. I'm not sure that I have seen those, you know, passages you referenced that are referring to wine, the strong drink version, because there really is, you know, more than one way to understand what wine is. And I've always, for sure, it needs to be the weaker kind, you know, new wine, grape juice.
00:13:45
Speaker
grape juice Yeah. So what are the passages you're talking about that refer to the strong drink variety? as That's a very good place to start. Let me show you the most compelling. So this is the one that shattered the entire way that I think about wine or think about alcohol generally.
00:14:03
Speaker
altogether i had never read this before up until about two years ago, having devotions with my kids. And this passage comes flopping along in Deuteronomy and left me with a little bit of explaining to do to my children. But so let me let me pick this out here for you. This is Deuteronomy chapter 14. I'm going to make sure I get to the right spot here.
00:14:22
Speaker
Verse 22 through 26. through twenty six So in this passage here, the preface to what's going on is, is this is part of the explanation of the ties. And specifically, this is an explanation of the tithing process for the people that have come into the promised land that live way too far away from where God will decide to build the tabernacle.
00:14:45
Speaker
to be able to bring their sacrifices to the tabernacle before they rot. And God makes a provision for what they should do instead if their tithes and their offerings are going to spoil before they end up being able to be sacrificed at the temple. So verse 22, or at the tabernacle, I'm sorry, this is pre-temple. So um verse 22, you shall tithe all the yield of your seed that comes from the field year by year and Before the Lord, your God in the place that he will choose to make his name dwell there, you shall eat the tithe of your grain and of your wine and of your oil and the firstborn of your herd and flock that you may learn to fear the Lord, your God always. That's the ideal is that you bring it to the tabernacle and this is, this is how you partake. So you bring your, your surplus goods to the tabernacle and you consume, you have a feast there at the tabernacle.
00:15:37
Speaker
And if the way is too long for you, this is verse 24, so that you are not able to carry the tithe when the Lord your God blesses you because the place is too far from you, which the Lord your God chooses to set his name there, then you shall turn it into money and bind up the money in your hand and go to the place that the Lord your God chooses and spend the money for whatever you desire, oxen or sheep or wine or strong drink, whatever your appetite craves, and you shall eat there before the Lord your God and rejoice you and your household.
00:16:07
Speaker
So the separation of both wine and strong drink is present there. The point is take your offering, turn it to cash, and go eat somewhere nice. go Go take your family out for a meal.
00:16:19
Speaker
And the prohibition here is nothing. Eat whatever it is that you have desire to have because it's part of God's gift. i
00:16:32
Speaker
It's part of of his demonstration to you of the faithfulness of his provision. And that's the supposed to be the context of it. So while you're eating, while you're drinking, now there's absolutely nothing in here that gives license for drunkenness. There's nothing in here that is you know, woohoo, rave party, let's smash it up all night long. That's not at all what is going on here. This is meant to be a worshipful feast.
Biblical Call to Sobriety
00:16:56
Speaker
It just so happens that it allows for this particular element to be a part of that worshipful feast. Well, do you think it's perhaps a part of the law that's kind of like God allows this because of, you know, like with divorce, it says that Moses allowed divorce because the hardest of your heart, but that's not really what God wanted out of you. Do you think that's at all part of this?
00:17:23
Speaker
No, not at all, because God doesn't allow divorce as an act of worship. Oh, yeah, that's a pretty good point. Yeah, those two things wouldn't be connected, and I suppose.
00:17:34
Speaker
I did a quick search on that word that's translated strong drink there in that in that passage, Deuteronomy 14, 26.
00:17:45
Speaker
yeah And it's just some interesting things here maybe for those scholars out there that are listening. Leviticus 10 verse 9 says, Do not drink wine nor strong drink thou nor thy sons with thee when you go into the tabernacle of the congregation lest ye die.
00:17:59
Speaker
It shall be a statute forever throughout your generation. So... Was that for the Levites or is that for everybody? Well, I you know had to get greater context there in Leviticus 10. That's the thing that gets kind of kind of sneaky in Leviticus is the Levites had all the strict that's Baptist rules and everybody else is allowed to be Presbyterian. Well, so now listen, Hebrews says that we are a royal priesthood, so we should add adhere to a higher standard as the priests did.
00:18:29
Speaker
um but that's That's why you don't get drunk. Well, I'm just saying it's awfully interesting to me that this one the first reference of that word in the Old Testament is admonishing someone who's entering the tabernacle of the congregation.
00:18:45
Speaker
So see, that would be what that what that would be it would be a very significant moment of atonement or something. And God's saying, if you come into the tabernacle of the congregation, whether he's talking to Levites or priests or every every Israelite, he's saying, if you come into the tabernacle congregation and you have drunk, you shall die.
00:19:03
Speaker
Yeah. Um, and there's, there's, there's, there's a lot of other biblical reasons for, I mean, the, the call to sobriety is significant and everywhere. Uh, there's, there's no, um, there's no allotment anywhere in scripture to makes, makes it a good case that you should get smashed, that you should lose your faculties, that you should somehow be out of control or owned by some other you know vice.
00:19:23
Speaker
That's not there. That's, you'll never find support for that on any side of this argument.
Podcast Promotion
00:19:30
Speaker
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00:19:40
Speaker
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00:19:58
Speaker
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00:20:05
Speaker
Um, and, uh, the, um, the Bible doesn't prohibit wine only in that situation. There are other areas, uh, where the drinking and consuming, even for those who believe it's okay, should not, um,
00:20:20
Speaker
But at least in this particular case, for me, this reflects a little bit of how God, um, how God thinks about this particular substance that it's not outright on its face in the fence. It's how it's used that can become an offense.
00:20:34
Speaker
Um, and the, uh, That word there, that strong drink, I i did a little word so search on that thing too because i I didn't want to come in here start throwing around this word I'm going to hang my hat
Cultural Context of 'Strong Drink'
00:20:48
Speaker
on. and It turns out that it just means wine that's two days old because that's that's not my favorite brand of whiskey. so the so You're saying that that word strong drink is just wine that's two days old?
00:21:01
Speaker
No, that's why I wanted to search this out because i didn't want to find that out on the live stream here in front of you. gotcha So essentially it's it's a drink that's fermented long enough inside of the juices and inside of the um what whatever they call that fermented particulate thats that kind of sifts its way down to the bottom.
00:21:20
Speaker
that it's had a very, very long time for that stuff to fall out of the the drink. So the the flavoring inside of the beverage, typically wine, but it could have been a number of other things. They had honey. They had forms of beer and rice that they would use to make the strong drink type stuff in and around this part of the world at the time. Egypt had a lot of varieties of it.
00:21:41
Speaker
But the ah the idea is essentially that it sat long enough that the – the flavoring, essentially whatever you're using as your, your main substance has had a long chance to enrich and suck out every possible ounce of fermentation from the yeast and everything else that's inside of it. And then whatever's inside of it is very, very finely sifted out. So you don't have any contaminant. in front of it it's the same uh same concept as well aged wine um the same same kind of a very long respectful process of trying to make something that's very tasty and flavorful but because it's maximized the amount of alcohol it can absorb from the yeast particulate and it's also um ah condensed and and simmered in its own flavors long enough that has a very rich deep flavor
00:22:32
Speaker
So it's it's kind of ah it's a luxury item. It's ah it's a luxury beverage. It certainly wouldn't have been something that you know lots and lots of people would have had access to, and it certainly wouldn't have been something that you would consume all the time unless you were a king. And that's one of the things that made a particularly special element of this tithe offering. is that it is you know is giving liberty to these people to understand that God does indeed want you to have good things. God does want you to have good enjoyments and good pleasure, not the kind that take you away from him, but the kind that allow you to enjoy what he's created. And these types of things are not not off limits. if you If God has so blessed you with a portion large enough and you are in a place where you can consume and you desire it, you can do it for the worship of God. Yeah.
Cultural and Scriptural Warnings
00:23:26
Speaker
Well, that is, I have to admit, a passage of Scripture that I kind of wrestle with and struggle with to some degree because I've always believed that Christians should not consume alcoholic beverages.
00:23:38
Speaker
And, um you know, I believe that Scripture forbid it. Although I think I can understand why you know you would come to the point of saying, hey, script scripture allows it within Christian liberty.
00:23:52
Speaker
um But I also think that in the culture in which we live, where so many people fall to alcoholism or yeah make justifications for um incredibly lascivious license and and lifestyles that they live, where alcohol plays a prominent prevalent part in their behavior and in their removal of inhibitions. I mean, I think we have inhibitions on for a reason.
00:24:22
Speaker
And when those things are removed, I think that that's dangerous. And I think that the scripture also, you know, gives us a lot of warning. so I guess, you know, within the context of what you're saying here,
00:24:35
Speaker
without completely you know Without completely agreeing with you, Tony, I'm not sure yet. That scripture is challenging, but there's a number of other scriptures that I would like to bring up sort of as a warning.
00:24:46
Speaker
And if there's somebody out there listening who's like you know justifying a – and I have had friends, Tony, whom I loved very much. that, you know, they were raised in a strict, you know, conservative home where they weren't supposed to drink alcohol.
00:25:02
Speaker
And then they come around to believing that, well, like ah the Lord actually does allow us to drink alcohol. And they just dove off into, you know, yeah tasting everything every weekend. And there's a new brew for this for this day. And then, you know, they're just drinking all the time.
00:25:21
Speaker
i can't imagine that they never got drunk. I think they probably got hammered. ah But, yeah you know, that's not what we want to see happen. That's not the kind of godly lifestyle that we should advocate for. And I know that you're not, but I want to bring up some scriptures that,
00:25:36
Speaker
that talk about the warning. So even if a person is like, wow, you know, okay, the Lord says, you know, worship me with strong drink. Yes, sir, I will do it. You know, even if someone is going to take that, you need to hear the warnings that scripture gives about drinking, about strong drink, especially.
00:25:58
Speaker
Proverbs 20 verse one says, wine is a mocker. Strong drink is raging. And that word raging, it means to make a loud sound.
00:26:11
Speaker
Great commulsion or tumult. Whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise. And I'm not quoting the King James on purpose. It's just the only one that has the connection to the you know the the root word meanings, you know the the actual Hebrew and Greek here.
00:26:30
Speaker
Proverbs 31 verse 4 says, It's not for kings, O Lemuel. is not for kings to drink wine, nor for princes strong drink. Two verses later it says, Give strong drink unto him that is ready to perish, and wine unto those that be of heavy hearts.
00:26:44
Speaker
So, you know, I suppose, you know, there's some justification for drinking sometimes. ah yeah heavy hearts a good place Heavy hearts is not like, you know, I just got dumped and so I want to drink some wine. yeah um You know, we're talking about extreme anguish of soul here.
00:27:02
Speaker
um Well, and and so youre this is actually a pretty significant point. And this is, I did not prepare correctly for all of the various passages and Psalms that speak to wine in this particular context. But one of the framings of wine is that it is a way to bring gladness of heart that is meant as a a mechanism to celebrate what God has blessed you with, but also a mechanism that helps you be glad, be of good spirit, be cheerful.
00:27:36
Speaker
It's meant as a tool for that in some kind of a capacity. That is not something that you will ever see on a drunk person. Now, gladness of heart, sure. Soundness of mind, no, it's not there. ah Worshipful state, no. it's It's like what you're talking about. It's loud rage. Even in happiness, it's loud rage. That's almost the more obnoxious kind.
00:27:59
Speaker
But the the idea of the of giving wine to an afflicted isn't is a pretty consistent way that wine is understood through Psalms, Proverbs, and several other places in the Old Testament that reference wine, at least in that positive light.
00:28:15
Speaker
It's meant as a mechanism for cheeriness. And that's that's kind of almost like a medicinal thing. Like it's not in this particular case saying smash this guy so that he doesn't remember what planet he's on anymore. it's more of kind of modest medicinal context of, okay, this guy's tum tum hurts. Give him some NyQuil or in this particular case, you know, Hey, this guy's spirit is broken. Give him an uplift.
00:28:40
Speaker
Um, and it's the, it's kind of it's the same mindset. It's not, it's not, this isn't a drink, the sorrows away kind of accommodation. Yeah. Well, you know, I have a friend who has struggled with alcoholism and, uh, you know, he told me about it and, um,
00:28:58
Speaker
you know, it's very subtle. And, and he was always, he would he told me, you know, I always felt like, Hey, I i can stop whenever I want to. And it's, it's really not, it's, it's, it's very easy to fall to that.
00:29:12
Speaker
Yeah. You know, that
Handling Alcohol Like a Venomous Snake
00:29:15
Speaker
trap. I mean, I, I look at it this way. I've, I've compared it this way. You know, I can't remember the scripture passage. I could look it up, but there, I think it's in Isaiah or one of the,
00:29:27
Speaker
major prophetic books. It compares strong drink, it particularly strong drink, not so much wine. Compare strong drink to a snake. And you know the snake, you could hold a snake and not get bit.
00:29:45
Speaker
you You could handle one. There's lots of people that do and God bless them for you know getting us anti-venom and stuff. you know That's not my career choice, but hey, got more power more power to you. There are people that can handle a snake, even a venomous one, and not be bit.
00:30:00
Speaker
But the longer you handle that snake, the higher your chances are of getting bit. And so in my life, I choose to not even handle the snake.
00:30:11
Speaker
I have another friend who, you know, lived kind of a party lifestyle. And in his life, he said, you know, I just can't drink any alcohol at all. He told me, he said, it just opens doors. Even if the scripture allows it, it opens doors for me into other things that are, you know, much more damaging, much more addictive. I just need to stay away from alcohol completely.
00:30:36
Speaker
Well, and that's that's a good bit of so of good self-awareness. like that yeah Anytime you find yourself saying, well, I could stop anytime I want, you need to stop. You need to want that now. yeah there nothing Nothing should be able to to put its chains on you. That's one of the dangers of this and and many other things. It's not alcohol. You know, you're There's so many things that can be addictive. You're so right.
00:31:00
Speaker
Yeah. the i ah Just being truthful with you and in several things that I've done to try to lose weight over the last couple of years to try to get my health back in order. It has been significantly harder to cut out sugar than it has been to cut out whiskey.
00:31:17
Speaker
I believe you.
00:31:24
Speaker
There's, there's a lot of ways that things will ensnare you, but if you ever in the mindset that I know I've got this, I've got control over this, you need to prove it. Step away from whatever it is. Uh, if it's nicotine, step away from your nicotine. If it's, you know, you're, you're, I, I need to have just a little bit of sip to take the edge off, step away, give yourself opportunity to break the chains. There's, you should never allow these things to overcome you or control you. And if you have the awareness that I'm going to be weak to this particular thing, it is not wise for you to try to find some scriptural pass to go out and put yourself in deep temptation.
00:31:57
Speaker
You're not meant to be there. Absolutely. And, you know, i would also say it's not weakness to admit that. No, it's not weakness to say, you know, I can't handle this. Good. yeah yeah's It's good to be self-aware enough to say that is something I can't go down. And that's not weakness to deny your flesh something because you know it will damage No, not at all. That is good. That is strong. That is spiritual strength to deny your flesh.
00:32:25
Speaker
And so, you know, I think that yeah ah there's another passage in 1 Thessalonians, I think it's there, that says every man should possess his vessel with honor. Now that's a reference to sexual sins.
00:32:38
Speaker
But it's also, i think, applicable to you know beating your body into submission, you know controlling the flesh, the the desires of your your body, and being careful to maintain that in honor and and not allowing your body or your your fleshly desires to drive you or control you.
Personal Decisions on Alcohol
00:33:00
Speaker
So, you know, i guess, I guess, Tony, I think where I kind of come on this is that I can see where someone is coming from, where honestly, brother, where you're coming from that says, hey, God meant this to be something that we enjoy, that we can do. And I can see where you're coming from and why you get there.
00:33:20
Speaker
I just think that it's probably better for me in my life, at least. um There's a ah lot in the scriptures that warns us about,
00:33:31
Speaker
um, partaking in alcohol in any way. And, you know, for me and in my life, I know that I would just prefer to kind of stay far away. I don't want to, i don't want to take a chance of getting bit by that snake.
00:33:45
Speaker
And so I'm just not going to pick it up. Now. I suppose that there is some people that can pick it up and be fine, but I'm not one of those guys. Um, and I think I would like to read this scripts scripture in, uh, Proverbs 23. Um,
00:34:00
Speaker
um It says, and I think that you would completely agree with this, Tony, because, you know, you're not an advocate for drunkenness and that's what this is talking about. It says, um, it says,
00:34:21
Speaker
um it says In verse 29 Proverbs 23,
00:34:29
Speaker
who has sorrow who has strife who has complaining who has wounds without cause who has redness of eyes those who tarry long over wine those who go to try mixed wine do not look at wine when it is red when it sparkles in the cup and goes down smoothly In the end, it bites like a serpent and stings like an adder.
00:34:51
Speaker
Your eyes will see strange things in your heart, utter perverse things. You will be like one who lies down in the midst of the sea, like one who lies on top of a mast. They struck me, you will say, but I was not hurt.
00:35:03
Speaker
They beat me, but I did not feel it. When shall I awake? I must have another drink. And that to me is just a very sober and serious warning about, hey, don't even look.
00:35:18
Speaker
Don't even get close. you know Try to um
00:35:25
Speaker
try to stay far away, if you will, from the the dangers that that wine and strong drink can bring to you. So that's that's kind of my...
00:35:36
Speaker
you know my approach to this is why why take a chance to get bit just just don't even look yeah and i do apologize i don't know if it showed on your side but i'm my everything just glitched out there real hard but i'm back now so welcome back the the thing is like i i do not have any conviction of my conscience when i sit down with my sip.
00:36:00
Speaker
It is to me a ah gift from God that i greatly enjoy because of you know the way it makes me feel and like coffee makes me feel and I enjoy that too for the same reason. But it would never be my goal to convince you otherwise of whatever is and is your conviction within your heart. I would never want you to stray away from something that you feel confidently prescribed to do in the way that you're leading your home based off of the way that you're understanding Scripture.
00:36:30
Speaker
I would never want you to try to throw that away on my account and try to somehow adopt my philosophy when you don't believe it. um I think that there is there is space inside of Christianity itself for people to make those small divisions amongst themselves without breaking fellowship. I think for me, the big thing is that I don't want people to use this, to use alcohol as a shibboleth, to discard great brothers and sisters in the body from good fellowship and good counsel.
00:37:01
Speaker
There are a lot of... Especially church forefathers who are great, mighty, wise men and giants in the faith who believe like I do that having a little bourbon is fine, that having a little part of this in your life was a part of celebrating what God's created and the great good things that he's made. And this is, those people should not be discarded for some um some extracurricular criteria that the Bible does not put out there that needs to be thrown out as a filter on who's good and who's bad in the way that they decide to communicate in this world.
00:37:36
Speaker
And that's, I think that some some so struggle with that. Some can't see the wisdom in others because of this thing, because of, you know, a hang up on one particular thing, because it's your struggle, because of something that you might be weak to. And they may not.
00:37:56
Speaker
And it's something that the Bible itself does not necessarily prescribe as some sort of a filter, like fornication and idolatry, as whether or not a pastor is a good pastor or not, or whether or not somebody has any any good spiritual insight to dump into your life. And one of the things that for those that wish they could particularly partake but aren't certain whether or not they can, don't.
00:38:21
Speaker
Don't. it's It's not time for you yet. It will be one day. And I do want to encourage you with this one thing. This is Isaiah chapter 25.
Future Heavenly Feast and Patience
00:38:32
Speaker
This is speaking about God in heaven.
00:38:34
Speaker
On this mountain, the Lord of hosts, verse 6, I'm sorry. On this mountain, the Lord of hosts will make for all his people a feast of rich food, a feast of well-aged wine, of rich food full of marrow, of aged wine well-refined.
00:38:48
Speaker
the very best brewer ever to create anything has got something special for you whenever you get up there. So you're not going to miss out. You're just going to miss out on all the garbage that we made trying to get. Well, I will, ah I will wait for that because I'm sure that whatever the, the, the lamb serves at his marriage supper is to be drunken freely and happily.
00:39:15
Speaker
And that'll be the best meal we can we can even imagine.
Engagement and Podcast Close
00:39:20
Speaker
So anyway, well, thank you, Tony. I appreciate your time and insight and you know your your biblical understanding here as well.
00:39:29
Speaker
I think that you presented the case well. So ah dads out there, fathers, we hope that we have given you a little bit to think about tonight. And we hope that you will apply the scriptures fully in your life and that certainly you will not make any allowances or justifications for
00:39:51
Speaker
for drunkard behavior. We don't want to encourage any drunkards out there, but we want you to, wherever you end up landing on this issue, to really seek out the scriptures and seek out the direction of the Lord in your life. And both Tony and i and are intent upon that.
00:40:08
Speaker
in our own hearts, in our own families. And so we want to encourage you to do the same. So don't just take our word for it. Go dig into the scriptures on your own. Take some of the references we've given you tonight and go see what the Holy Spirit will say to you and where you need to land on this.
00:40:25
Speaker
And we want to advise, again, a great degree of caution because we know that there's just a ah large amount of danger in this area. So we want to encourage you to be careful.
00:40:36
Speaker
But we do appreciate your time and your interest. and if you want to reach out to us and and get in contact, you can reach us, dads at preacherdad.com. The email address is dads, D-A-D-S, at preacherdad.com. We would sure love to hear from you. Tony, we got our first...
00:40:58
Speaker
uh, fan letter. Hey, the other day, i don't know if you've got to say it's not a fan letter. Exactly. It's just ah it was just an email where someone had a comment. And, uh, so when we have the full panel here, at least most of the panel, uh, we're going to bring that email out and we're going to read it. We're going to have, uh, uh, letters from the audience segment on the fatherhood Fridays. But um send those emails out or you can comment on this video. You can like and subscribe to this channel. You can send us 10 or $20. Hey, we would love that. it would we would get all get a cup of coffee on your $20 when we eventually all sit together in studio, Irish Kyle, one day
00:41:38
Speaker
think ah My $20 is not paying for Tony's Irish coffee. but But we would we would just love to hear from you if you have time.
00:41:51
Speaker
So God bless you folks. And may the Lord cause his face to shine upon you and give you peace. And we'll see next time on Fatherhood Fund. Good night.