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EP 17: ADHD-friendly approach to eating (with Erin from Balance and Bite)
88 Plays3 months ago
Trigger Warning: disordered eating content.
I love this episode, I hope you will too. This episode we I chat with Erin Murnane, an Accredited Practising Dietitian and body image coach with over 12 years’ experience in Australia and the UK. As an ADHDer herself, she’s on a mission to help women stop binge eating, ditch food guilt, and finally feel calm and in control around food.
After years watching smart, driven people waste energy battling diets, Erin created a more compassionate, ADHD-friendly approach to eating — one that focuses on intuitive eating, body acceptance, and small, realistic changes (not perfection).
When she’s not supporting clients, you’ll find her cooking up something new, travelling, or saying yes to anything that involves good food and a little adventure.
This chat with Erin is fun, honest, informative and I hope you'll all have a little Erin on your shoulder by the end of this episode.
Host:
Jade Bonney
www.awakeninsights.com.au
Guest:
Erin Murnane (she/her) BFoodSc, BNutDiet
Accredited Practising Dietitian, Certified Intuitive Eating Counsellor
https://balanceandbite.com.au/
Recommended
Transcript
Podcast Introduction
00:00:06
Speaker
You are listening to Awaken ADHD, a podcast where people share their ADHD stories, life before and after diagnosis, support strategies, strengths, and challenges.
00:00:17
Speaker
Hi, I'm Jade and I'll be your host. I'm a counselor, ADHD coach, and fellow ADHD-er. So join me as we Awaken ADHD.
Acknowledgment of Indigenous Land
00:00:31
Speaker
This podcast was recorded on the land of the Boon Wurrung people of the Kulin Nation, and we wish to acknowledge them as traditional owners. We recognise First Peoples of Australia as the original storytellers, and pay our respects to Elders past, present and emerging.
Guest Introduction: Erin Monane
00:00:50
Speaker
Hello and welcome to another episode of Awaken ADHD. I am joined by a lovely special guest today and I was just asking her before I pressed record, how do I usually start my podcast episodes? to know if I start with what number we're up to, but you know what? We're just going to say this is a special episode with Erin Monane.
00:01:17
Speaker
She's an accredited practicing dietitian and body image coach with over 12 years experience in Australia and the UK.
Erin's Mission and Approach
00:01:26
Speaker
She's also an ADHDer herself. She's on a mission to help women stop and not just women, sorry, help all individuals stop binge eating, ditch food guilt.
00:01:39
Speaker
And finally, feel calm and in control around food. Hallelujah. After years of watching smart and driven individuals waste energy battling diets, yep, been there, done that, Erin, as she created a more compassionate, ADHD-friendly approach to eating, one that focuses on intuitive eating, body acceptance, and small, realistic changes, not perfection. So to all you perfectionists out there,
00:02:09
Speaker
I'm challenge that. and When she's not supporting clients, you'll find her cooking up something new, travelling or saying yes to anything that involves good food and a little adventure. Erin, you sound like my kind of people. Hello. Welcome.
00:02:23
Speaker
Hello. Thank you so much for having me. As i was saying before, I'm very excited to talk to you Me too. Wonderful. car Thank you. Okay, so let's just kickstart and just I want to know what inspired you to become dietitian and work with the neurodivergent community?
Career Journey and ADHD Diagnosis
00:02:44
Speaker
Well, i i I wanted to be dietitian originally because I wanted to be a sports dietitian. That's the honest answer. Because honestly, i wanted to marry a footballer.
00:02:58
Speaker
Okay. Okay. That was not what I was expecting at all. You know, as like a 15 year old Australian girl whose dad played football and was just very into that world. Now, as a 35 year old, it's my furthest goal in life. and So it's quite funny the path we take in life. But yeah, that was the honest answer. I thought, you know, if I get into nutrition and get into that sports field,
00:03:28
Speaker
Then as I was studying dietetics, realised it's so open and there's so many avenues you can go down as a dietitian. You can work in gut health, work hospitals. My first job out of uni was in Indigenous health, working in rural communities in New South Wales. It was a really great opportunity. But the reason I started working with neurodivergent folks was actually I found myself working in eating disorders.
00:03:56
Speaker
And there's a really large crossover between eating disorders, disordered eating and people who are neurodivergent. Because I wanted to ask you about that crossover, but I'm wondering if that'll come along a little bit later. Yeah, definitely. We can talk about it yeah more later. It's definitely going to come up.
ADHD Traits Impacting Career
00:04:17
Speaker
Yeah, so that's how I started working with neurodivergent people and in that process actually was diagnosed myself with ADHD.
00:04:26
Speaker
Ah yes right so it was because you were working with it that you were seeing it in yourself married back? Yeah, absolutely. And I had some people close to me as well, who in my personal life that were being diagnosed with ADHD, and then just talking more about their challenges and things that they were finding out about themselves in their diagnosis that I was starting to resonate with. And so, yeah, I actually got diagnosed earlier this year.
00:05:01
Speaker
So 35 or 34 at the time when I was. So welcome to the club. Thank you. Happy to be here. Happy to have you. um i'm I'm curious about your own experience, whatever you want to share, but ah what were you really noticing in others or what were the people close to noticing you in you that was, you ticking that ADHD box?
00:05:29
Speaker
For me, it was time blindness, hyperfixation, getting distracted easily, forgetting things, struggling to, I could initiate tasks.
00:05:40
Speaker
but executing them was a whole different story. So i love sewing and I would just have so many half-finished projects everywhere around my house.
00:05:53
Speaker
And work-wise, by the time I turned 30, I'd had over 30 different jobs because I would just get bored. What did you say? By the time you turned 30, you'd had over 30 different jobs. I mean, say no more. Yeah.
00:06:11
Speaker
I just get so bored. I would find a new job so exciting and get that dopamine rush and throw myself into the deep end. Love her And then I would just within sort of six months, 12 months, get so bored and find it physically painful to actually keep going to that role because it was just. Wow.
00:06:33
Speaker
Really challenging. Physically painful. That is something the neurodivergent individual will use to describe something that other individuals might say, oh, I didn't like it or I didn't think it was good. But that that very visceral experience of discomfort.
00:06:53
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And so for me, it's been quite an interesting process because in 2017 I was diagnosed with general anxiety disorder. by a psychologist and they they suspected that's what I had. And we did a lot of talk therapy and it was helpful, but things never really got better.
00:07:16
Speaker
And then in 2000, I can't remember when the 2023, I started taking medication for anxiety, which was incredibly helpful for my busy mind.
00:07:30
Speaker
But having... being diagnosed with ADHD now has been so, so helpful and very validating. Validating. Yeah. it's like, okay, it's not just anxiety. Anxiety is a feature of the experience of the challenges of ADHD. It's been a process.
00:07:50
Speaker
Absolutely.
ADHD and Eating Disorder Connection
00:07:51
Speaker
What a journey. So if we talk just a little bit more about your work, many people describe, you know, forgetting to eat or binging you the the fact that there is this comorbidity and for those that aren't in the that lingo just the two diagnoses of some sort of disordered eating and adhd or other neurodivergence can you help me understand a little bit more through your lens yeah absolutely it's it was very anecdotal when i first started working in the eating to disorder of space noticing the crossover of diagnosis of
00:08:31
Speaker
ADHD or people on the spectrum and then an eating disorder diagnosis. So I was curious and started to do my own research and found out that people who are neurodivergent are three times more likely to have an eating disorder than neurotypical. That's a lot.
00:08:48
Speaker
Isn't it? Yeah, absolutely. And then as you start to think about some of the challenges that people are neurodivergent face, it is a bit of a perfect storm for an eating disorder or disordered eating Yeah, there's so many facets that come into play, isn't there?
00:09:08
Speaker
You know, if I think when we first had a quick chat a few weeks ago, i was saying that i I like to dabble in all of the disordered eatings, but I just couldn't choose or follow through with one. That's ah some dark ADHD humour, but it is true. And I think that if I look retrospectively back on my own disordered eating,
00:09:31
Speaker
There was so many different pieces to that puzzle. What do you notice the most? What are some of the pieces that you think really impact?
00:09:43
Speaker
Yeah, the the biggest, the most common thing that I see when I work with, we're talking about people with ADHD is that they don't eat regularly enough.
00:09:54
Speaker
And that's because of a multitude of factors. It's often unintentional food restrictions. because they have very low interceptive awareness, which means they don't often feel hungry, but they don't recognise those signals of hunger until they're really extreme. Also often get hyperfixated on tasks, so they might forget to eat or just doesn't cross their mind that they need to feed themselves.
00:10:21
Speaker
They might have sensory challenges, it's really hard to know what they feel like eating, nothing feels appetising. And this is a challenge because when they, often when this happens is people don't eat until like three or four o'clock in the afternoon.
00:10:39
Speaker
And by this stage, it's the first thing they're eating in the day and they're ravenous and they don't really feel like eating something quote unquote healthy or So, so what they tend to do is then go for foods that are going to give them that quick fix of energy, get rid of that intense hunger quickly, which are, you know, usually things that are maybe takeaway foods or we'd label as junk food, bad foods.
00:11:07
Speaker
And then when you layer in diet culture we've been taught to not have those foods and maybe there's this perfectionistic mindset at play, it really opens up this mindset of what the hell, I've had a bad day now, I've not eaten perfectly. And that can really kick off the binge eating.
00:11:25
Speaker
And that's the most common eating disorder that I see with people who have ADHD. And there were so many things I was thinking as you were talking. ah you You mentioned the the sensory experience in the sensory seeking as well, you know, not just the type of food, but I have to have something crunchy in my mouth. I have to have something sweet or not something savory. Do you find a lot of the the sensory stimming?
00:11:55
Speaker
and that's a another factor. So, There's so many layers to it that I find, which is helpful in a way because then we can systematically work through recovering from it. It's not just guessing, which I find really helpful. And so stimming or dopamine seeking by using food is so common that I see in the people that i work with. It's because there's often that dysregulation of dopamine.
00:12:23
Speaker
So they need food to help them execute tasks. So again, I hear people, particularly in the afternoon, reaching for those crunchy, sweet, salty foods or fizzy drinks, caffeinated drinks. That in itself can create this sense of, oh, I shouldn't be doing this. These aren't healthy foods. And again, can
ADHD Challenges with Food Choices
00:12:44
Speaker
spiral into a binge.
00:12:45
Speaker
I also find that when people aren't eating regularly enough, that in itself can drive more dopamine seeking behaviors because they're more emotionally dysregulated. Yep. That makes sense.
00:12:57
Speaker
Yeah. And then once they, you know, if maybe talking about myself here, but if I haven't eaten or like ah I eat regularly, I eat breakfast, lunch and dinner, but if it's been a while since I've eaten, cause I like to eat regularly, yeah And then I'm past the point of hunger. Yeah.
00:13:20
Speaker
Then I can't decide. yeah And then I become completely overwhelmed and and then don't eat because I'm too overwhelmed to choose.
00:13:32
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. And that's executive dysfunction. Right. And then so you're emotionally dysregulated at that point. You've got the executive dysfunction. You you can't think clearly because you haven't eaten. Then you're too overwhelmed. And then i will either just eat a banana, like walk out of maybe a food court. Heaven forbid, should I ever be found in a food court because they are sensory nightmares for me.
00:13:59
Speaker
and But I think i if I look back through my life, all of my experiences in a food court are just of complete overwhelm, decision paralysis and and maybe some little adult tantrums where just, I don't know what to do i don't like it. Everything's either too expensive or too gross or too much and I and i just flee.
00:14:23
Speaker
to Do you have, am I the only person that experiences this? No, I'm not. No, I'm not.
00:14:31
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. So there's the dysregulation and um and that's where people could be just choosing the the dim sims instead of going and being choosing a more complicated meal.
00:14:45
Speaker
know Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's going to give them that nourishment. And so it ends up being a bit of a cycle, unfortunately, where people then become very reliant on quick so quick fix foods and that can further disrupt those neurotransmitters, which means then we rely on them more and can get really stuck in that cycle. So when I work with clients, the first thing we work on is closing that gap of eating.
00:15:13
Speaker
How can you go from eating every eight to nine hours to every three to four hours? And by doing that, you're giving your brain the fuel it needs to reduce those neurotransmitters to improve your executive functioning.
00:15:27
Speaker
So then planning and decision-making is easier. So then the actual food preparation later is not a panic and overwhelm. yes exactly yeah yeah i think that's really true like if i if i need to eat and i'm overwhelmed by it i now will just go and throw a handful of you know raw cashews in my mouth yeah so that i've got something give it a minute and then start the process is this kind of the thing you're talking about exactly online first
00:16:03
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. And a lot of the work that I do with clients, they do come with me come to me with quite a complicated relationship with food. A lot of food rules, a lot of guilt, a lot of judgment towards themselves for not being healthy or good enough.
00:16:19
Speaker
And so, for example, when we're talking about closing that gap of eating, to start off with, people might have really low capacity. And so we're talking about using pre-packaged food or pre-prepared food, things like up and goes or muesli bars or yogurt cups. And that in itself can create challenges because it's challenging that mindset that they need to prepare everything themselves or it's not a healthy enough option.
00:16:49
Speaker
It's got added sugars or it's got whatever these rules around food they've been taught are coming up. So it's quite a multi-layered system that we have to unpack when it comes to something that seems so simple is just eat every three four hours. It's actually not that simple for people with ADHD. I find that's part of it. And then even just remembering to eat, we have to talk about. setting reminders, adding calendar reminders, using apps, sticky notes and getting quite creative to actually action that. I talk about being
Diet Culture Impact on ADHD
00:17:29
Speaker
ah cyclical rather than, you know, structured routine and consistency.
00:17:35
Speaker
But sometimes I talk to clients about anchoring things two things together so if it was food and whatever it else they they do even if that is you know something on their phone checking their emails like anchoring things together does that make sense is that something that would yeah you would offer to clients as an idea absolutely yeah and we often do that with their medication they've become quite great at taking medication in the morning and that's the time when they'll have their up and go and then use the bar or cheese and crackers something easy that they can
00:18:12
Speaker
gives their body some fuel to get going they're not running on it. I'm imagining that part of it is also, you know, you're talking about diet culture, the hyper focus and hyper fixation of, oh, okay, so I might need to do something about maybe it's a weight or or something that I've seen as an issue, but then getting really stuck and fixated and and having to do it to the nth degree, does that show up as an issue? So often, i see that so often as a challenge and that's, again, talking about those layers is something to help clients with as well and it's setting expectations from the start and being really transparent with how I work so that I'm not setting people up for failure because those past attempts that people have always tried to be healthier
00:19:08
Speaker
which usually is around weight loss or dieting has set them up for failure. And as a result has led them to feel not so great about themselves and making changes quite hard. So when I am working with someone, we will talk about, like you said, like cycles, not consistency and setting realistic goals and talking about how weight is not actually a behavior.
00:19:38
Speaker
And so we can't control that, which in itself can be quite a hard thing for people to accept and sit with. Absolutely, because not only is it not a behaviour, but it's not attached to your worth or who you are. Yeah, which is the hard thing to unlearn for people. And most of my clients work with,
00:20:04
Speaker
counselors like yourself, therapists, to unpack some of those core beliefs and worth, self-esteem as well. Because what I find is this work around food is really tricky when there is such a strong desire for thinness still or weight loss or being accepted.
00:20:24
Speaker
for that part of themselves. And until that's feeling safer for people, they can really struggle with food still because there's a lot of subconscious calorie counting and food rules and expectations on themselves still.
00:20:42
Speaker
around diet culture. Again, thinking back to early twenty s so I'm 47 now, and a long time ago, or maybe even like 21, I remember just having, you know, the the diet that came in at the time and just being so obsessed and focused on it just you know channeling all of my energy into that to the point I think I passed out at work because I had counted so many know I was just counting calories and restricting so much that you know wasn't functioning anymore but I think that that we're very good at hyper focusing on something we really
00:21:27
Speaker
you know, are interested in. as soon as it's an interest, even if that interest is about, you know, come from a place of shame or what have you, we can go hard and fast in one direction. Absolutely, absolutely, yeah. And I resonate with that too from my dieting experiences in my 20s as well. and And I hear these stories from clients all the time, that hyperfixation and, you know, i was really good at dieting, they might say, and I could stick to it until I couldn't. And it does give people that, that boost and that motivation and that feel good energy as well. And so what I try and do is shift that away and we can focus on some metrics if it's helpful. Like, have you eaten three meals this day or have you gone to the supermarket this week and giving them that sense of ticking things off still, but without it being so rigid. and that's what helps them keep at this for longer They might still be going through cycles, but they're not hyper fixating on the food. That's be a difficult balance there, right? To get the balance.
00:22:43
Speaker
Oh, we need to pay attention to this. We need to look at this. But I don't want this to become your, your everything. You're all. Absolutely. That can be uncomfortable for people, I think, because there is that familiarity to what they've always done in the past. And what I find is helpful is when they do start to get that evidence that this more gentle approach to nutrition, to food planning, feeding themselves is something they can maintain.
Self-Compassion and Managing Food Issues
00:23:16
Speaker
And as a result, they do have more consistent energy, a more consistent mood, better sleep, better focus, that that in itself can help them. Some, you know, everyone, everyone's different, but most people shift away from those extremes.
00:23:31
Speaker
Right. So that is talking about a question I had here. but You know, how do we begin to break some of those patterns of binging or restricting without turning it into another shame control or hyper fixation?
00:23:47
Speaker
You know, the off on. Because I think that the shame, what you said before, you know, we're great at dieting until we're not. There's that shame of lack of consistency.
00:24:02
Speaker
yeah I'm not consistent. Why can't I ever just stick to anything? yeah And so we're talking about breaking patterns rather than it being about consistency.
00:24:13
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And a lot of the work that I do with clients is educating them on these systems that set them up for failure as well because they often aren't even aware of it. because it's so normalised and validated in our society, diet culture. And perhaps they still live in a very close circle of friends or family members or health professionals that are still pushing these narratives, that it's their personal responsibility to stick to healthy eating or be consistent.
00:24:46
Speaker
So I'm almost like this other voice in their head until they can develop their own that is a lot more self-compassionate and gentle and empowering because they've always had this very critical, judgmental inner voice around weight or health or nutrition. um which is why I'm like, yeah, sorry. I was just imagining, ah you know, I just zoned off a little bit. I was there with you, but I was just imagining a little version of you on my shoulder, right? Because I often say that about my mentors and the mental health field that I, you know, they're like,
00:25:22
Speaker
I can hear them whispering in my ear at times. And then I hear quite beautifully clients of mine say, oh yeah, heard your voice. So I want to hear some sound bites, Erin, of what you would sound like sitting just on my shoulder in my ear if I was struggling with any kind of disordered eating or or shame. what Give me a few sound bites. What would I hear?
00:25:49
Speaker
So a client said this to me yesterday, actually. it was about 4 o'clock in the afternoon. they were going into a meeting and they hadn't eaten since maybe like I think it was 11. They were hungry. And they grabbed a handful of trail mix and ate it before the meeting. And so she said to me, i had your voice in the back of a your ma of my mind. Have something to eat before you go into the meeting. It doesn't matter what it is. Just give your body that bit of fuel, that brain your brain that fuel to get through the meeting.
00:26:19
Speaker
Whereas that that client previously was so scared of nuts, you know, too high in fats and too many calories and that's not the right food to have but could have my voice there. Something's better than nothing.
00:26:32
Speaker
That's a big one. Absolutely. Little voice, little voice on the shoulder, little Erin on your shoulder. What else? What else is some phrases you could just put into the listener's ear?
00:26:47
Speaker
I love this. We talk a lot about capacity. So there's a lot of expectation around nutrition to be perfect. And that would often look like I hear a lot about ingredient households. i don't know if you've heard that term. I either grew up in an ingredient household or like a prepackaged household. And there's this expectation that cooking things from scratch is the best.
00:27:11
Speaker
I don't know if you've heard this sort of narrative. Yeah, well yeah um yes, yeah. So I'm more of an ingredient household now, but I didn't really grow up in that. But now I'm a ah combo of the two.
00:27:23
Speaker
Yeah, yes. And that's a really nice way to be, I would say, a combo of the two. And so another voice that my clients might hear is, It's okay to have the pre-prepared meal if you're tired, if you've had a big week, if that's all you have capacity for.
00:27:39
Speaker
Oh, Erin, I need that again in my ear. It's okay to have the pre-prepared meal.
00:27:51
Speaker
It is. Yeah. Because that is, that's probably still a hard one for me as I, you know, went into my parenting, know, years know,
00:28:08
Speaker
And will still push myself past my capacity after working all day yeah to get a really complete whole food. Like, you know, there's not even a curry paste.
00:28:21
Speaker
Like I would make all of that from scratch always. And so it's always a full cooked meal every night. And I need that voice on my shoulder. Yes, feel free to steal it. Yeah, and I think that also comes from, you know, the the person I chose to marry who was also very food focused and very whole food focused and um a fantastic cook. I'm like, I've got to up my game, you know, I've got cook well, but it means sometimes yeah I push it.
00:28:59
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. And that is the biggest thing I would say i do for clients is give them that permission to be more flexible. and to not have such high expectations of themselves when it comes to nutrition.
00:29:14
Speaker
But I have another soundbite, if it's okay, to share. Give it me. Which I think your clients would find helpful if they struggle with binge eating or they use food as a coping tool, which is
Food as a Coping Tool
00:29:25
Speaker
it's not a bad thing to use food as a coping tool.
00:29:29
Speaker
We're very much taught it is a bad thing to use salty, sweet, crunchy, sweet, quote-unquote junk food to cope with our emotions or self-regulate.
00:29:42
Speaker
But it's actually an incredibly helpful tool because it's cheap, it's accessible, it's very low capacity and it does make us feel better, even though it's usually for a short period of time.
00:30:00
Speaker
The bad thing about it is if it's our only tool and we're really reliant on it, And it's also how we view it as a coping tool. yeah absolutely. um so almost...
00:30:17
Speaker
snack as stim is okay absolutely it's okay and we don't need to to stim for hours on end but snack as a stem as an emotional regulation or a discharge of energy or an enjoyment some stims are just seeking enjoyment not even soothing Yeah. There's the soothing and the seeking. And so if it is a crunch, oh, what are my variations of crunch options that I have?
00:30:48
Speaker
Exactly. yeah What are my salt options? What are my sweet options? And what combos do I want? So when you said not your only the option, also you've only you don't need to have only one option with the sweet, salty, crunchy, soft food options.
00:31:07
Speaker
Exactly. yeah And then this is where I love working with people is that we can get really creative. So then we can use tools like Canva with visual images of those foods that they like and we can put it on a visual format that they can print out, put on the fridge. So when they are dysregulated they go into the fridge, they have that resource to see what are my crunchy foods what are my sweet foods what do i feel like i have more options i'm not just going to the default that i've always used absolutely like i i love nuts and my favorite would probably be salted cashews
00:31:52
Speaker
yeah Yeah. Raw cashews, raw unsalted cashews are better for me, but I really like the salted ones. So yeah I have both options. And now I know the the raw ones are sweeter, softer texture, and they're going to meet a different need.
00:32:11
Speaker
They're probably going to meet the need of I need to get my executive functioning back online, so i'm going to have a handful of those or almonds. yeah But the salted roasted cashews are...
00:32:22
Speaker
more when i when i want the enjoyment part of the snacking and so we'll different options it's not hard and fast rule you can't have the salted roasted cashews i can have both they both serve a different purpose exactly i love that example yeah as you're picking up there's a lot of factors that are creating challenges for people with adhd around food Absolutely. so many and the self-worth is, is part of it. Um, the, the way they're cycling,
00:32:56
Speaker
through the hyper focus, the hyper fixation, the shame, the sensory, the executive function. What else am I missing?
00:33:09
Speaker
Body image distress. Body image distress is huge ruminating thoughts around food noise and that mental load that people feel. And then I find what I notice a lot is that when they're using food to cope with emotions, because they see that as a bad thing, they can further disassociate from that behavior, which means they usually don't stop doing that behavior until the food is all gone.
00:33:39
Speaker
That's their cue to stop eating. Yeah. Help me understand a bit more. Yeah. so because people, I mean, everyone grows up in this diet culture world and men, women, everyone is is exposed to these very rigid rules around food and what we should shouldn't do So what I noticed is that when people use food to cope with their emotions, to self-soothe, they see that as a bad thing. And because they're seeing that as a bad thing, they can often disassociate with just...
00:34:11
Speaker
tune out from what they're even doing they're very mindless yes yes yes i'm i'm with you i've got the packet i'm just gonna eat eat eat until i can no longer put my hand in the packet and eat yes exactly yeah and then they get to the end of the packet and there's that huge feeling of shame and guilt and frustration which can for a lot of people kick off getting more food because they're needing to cope again for that emotional response and they've already screwed it so what's the point who cares we'll start again tomorrow yeah yeah or next week al i'll just i'll just yeah it doesn't matter anymore uh absolutely and i was also thinking when you were saying that that there's
00:34:59
Speaker
I don't know, for me, and it probably is the not ah the lack of mindful eating at times, or a little bit of my generation, eat what is in front of you, all of it.
00:35:12
Speaker
Eat everything that is on your plate. There are starving people in the world, eat it all on your plate. which means i I have to consciously look at what is left in my bowl and kind of check in with myself to stop myself finishing what is there.
00:35:33
Speaker
yeah It is awfully hard. So for me, one of the strategies was, and I know this is probably an old and a cliche one, but it really is only meant to address that mindless finishing the bowl is actually have a smaller bowl with what I, and then I know that I can get up and get more.
00:35:55
Speaker
And so, and I do, i often go, oh no, I need a bit more. Yeah. Yeah. That's a great strategy. Yeah. But I don't have the compulsion to eat everything that's on my plate, especially if it's dessert.
00:36:06
Speaker
and Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's something that what you just shared is one of the most common phrases that I hear, which is there's starving people in the world. I have to eat what's in front of me. There's a lot of morality around food waste now.
00:36:22
Speaker
And that's seen as a bad thing if you're wasting food. And ah if you want another soundbite of me in your ear around this is these two things. It's it's so valid to think those things. It's what we've always been taught. But it doesn't matter how many plates you finish, there will unfortunately always be starving people. Absolutely. And the other thing is that we aren't bins. like You are not a bin.
00:36:50
Speaker
Yet we often treat ourselves as a bin because we see it's We think it's better to finish the food than throw it in the bin. so in a way we're treating ourselves as that bin.
00:37:02
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Just get you yourself some animals. ah ah My scraps go to the chickens, yeah the guinea pigs, if they're nice and still fresh or the lizards or the dog and occasionally the cat. So yeah oh do some composting. Composting. I'll suggest as well, you can always donate money. to these charities that are helping reduce food waste, that are helping feed people who are starving. So you take some of that personal responsibility away from you needing to
00:37:41
Speaker
constantly stop food waste in your own space as well. Yeah. Absolutely. It's very layered, all of these challenges. It's very, very layered and complex. um So did we mention about the body image distress? Is there something particular about neurodivergence individuals that have this body image to distress?
00:38:09
Speaker
I'm curious of your thoughts as well on this, but i what I see all the time is that there's a real connection between acceptance, people pleasing and perfectionism with neurodivergent folks that I work with. And I know it's not just neurodivergent people that struggle with those traits, but because it's such a it's seen as such a positive thing to be thin in this society,
00:38:39
Speaker
And to be accepted in this society is to be thin.
Body Image and ADHD
00:38:44
Speaker
People who are neurodivergent can sometimes really struggle with body distress a lot more because of those need need for acceptance or people pleasing or wanting to be accepted is something that I have found a lot.
00:38:59
Speaker
Yeah, already feeling like they don't fit in quite fit in yeah So I don't want to not fit in in another way. Exactly. And because we're already being stigmatised for being different, I don't want to also be stigmatised for my body.
00:39:17
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. and i'm probably there's probably, you know, a lot in there as well. I think that could be multifaceted and and layered depending on on where you are or if you're on a disordered eating you know journey to what severity. I remember when I was you know close to anorexia. I wasn't actually ever formally diagnosed, but a lot of body dysmorphia, you know, looking in the mirror and seeing a different version of myself in my early twenties. So do you have people that that tend to have this body dysmorphia that are seeing a different version of themselves?
00:40:05
Speaker
Absolutely. Absolutely. And it's, I find it interesting as well. a lot of the clients that I've worked with that body distress is intergenerational as well. It's things that they've picked up from their parents, from their grandparents and from a very young age, I would say, particularly for women that I've worked with, the average age that they say they've had body image distress is anywhere from six to 10 years old.
00:40:35
Speaker
And now I'm working with them when they're 35, 45, 55, and it's been with them for such a long time. And I think for anyone, it's hard to let go of those really deep subconscious beliefs around bodies.
00:40:51
Speaker
But I think in particular for neurodivergent folks who struggle with those really sticky thoughts and ruminating thoughts, it's even trickier.
00:41:02
Speaker
As you say that, I'm reminded of several individuals I've, you know worked with over the years that are neurodivergent and have had somebody of influence in their life, some family or friend, make a body related comment at one of those very early ages. and like you said, it is stuck.
00:41:29
Speaker
it's It's just stuck like glue and it is on just repaint in their head over and over again. I'm sure that's not just specific to the neurodivergent community. I'm sure that is a widespread issue.
00:41:46
Speaker
But we do like to ruminate and and stick with those ideas. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. I can think of so many clients as well who've shared similar stories where they've had a comment made, whether it was from an uncle or a boy at school or some a health professional about their weight. And it's just like, just so sticky and it's really hard for them to let go of it. And so, know, when people are feeling body distress and they come to me, we do talk a lot about we validate a lot of their thoughts and we start to challenge a lot of their beliefs and expose them to a lot of other narratives as well because they've only ever been taught one narrative which is it's good to be thin bad to be fat absolutely it's it's interesting i've got a 14 year old daughter and 11 year old daughter but my 14 year old um
00:42:41
Speaker
she's she's pretty confident yeah kid yeah very intelligent kid and last night we we were actually at a uh out for a burger yeah um and she the burger was in front of her and she just like devoured was devouring it so fast because we had eaten late because we'd been at a show and i turned her i'm like okay, you were hungry?
00:43:08
Speaker
and it was playful and light. And she stopped. She dead stared me in the eyes and she said, would you have said that to me if I was a teenage boy? like, yes, I would have because I was being playful but absolutely on point for questioning. Yeah, and it's great to hear that that I think that generation as well is learning to to advocate for themselves and protect themselves and And they're learning that from their parents as well, yeah I think. yeah Yeah. I love the pushback because it absolutely would, I would have said it to anyone because I was just being playful because I had only just turned around and she's halfway through it. She was hungry.
00:43:47
Speaker
And she is a fantastic eater and she does say fantastic eater as in she's just got a really great appetite and she really loves all kinds of foods. And and she loves it.
00:44:01
Speaker
But she does also, she is playing with that commentary. And I'm sure it's from, you know, being in high school now, she yeah she's noticing and even commenting on how much she ate for breakfast because that's when she eats.
00:44:15
Speaker
her kind of biggest meal and she's like oh i guess i'm eating like a teenage boy i'm like you're eating like a growing teenager teenager yeah because boys are allowed to eat teenage boy appetites are allowed to be ravenous and you know 20 wheat bix and but a teenage girl obviously the messaging is not the same Oh, and the amount of stories that I've heard from clients who were put on, they were put on diets, the girls, but their brothers were allowed to eat whatever they wanted.
00:44:49
Speaker
and that really creates such a scarcity mindset. And then as they get into those, you know, in their 20s and they have more control over what they are able to access and eat, that's when a lot of binging starts. They rebel. They rebel, yes, that inner rebel, yeah The rebel is a powerful force. If the rebel has been put in a box and and punished and put away yeah and, you know, it's is's going to come out with a vengeance at some point.
00:45:20
Speaker
Absolutely, yeah. And that's why so much of the work I do is reducing the shame, promoting acceptance of these behaviours to cope so that it reduces and using that, you know, your rebel is trying to protect you.
00:45:35
Speaker
in a way Absolutely. i love the rebel. It's my favourite, you know, archetype, if people are familiar with that term, or part of self. And, yeah, I don't think we ever want to squish it.
00:45:48
Speaker
No. But ask, is it helpful right now or is it actually... Yeah, getting you what you want. The rebel's wanting to feel, you know, if we think of a rebel coming out in teenager, it's wanting to feel somewhat in control, to push back, to question for self whether this is right or wrong.
Burnout and Self-Care in ADHD
00:46:08
Speaker
Now, if the rebel is suppressed in, you know, teenage years when it's really, you know, forming, that's when I think the rebel comes out and is making...
00:46:19
Speaker
more childlike decisions or or less you know yeah less in control decisions later in life a hundred percent yeah yeah and that's what I think is hard for people with ADHD because they do experience more burnout and their self-care is more vulnerable and they can struggle with boundaries and people pleasing it can And they're, I guess, they're just more fragile, I would say, and more vulnerable. And I know this for myself is i do often then fall back into these lower capacity tools to cope and don't always have capacity for maybe the more productive things.
00:47:02
Speaker
tricky and that's where we go back to cyclical not consistent so we can trust ourselves to go okay not that cycle right now i'm in this cycle and i trust that i'll come back to that again yeah absolutely yeah yeah Well, I'm just wondering, you know, it's been a fantastic conversation. i've absolutely loved talking with you.
00:47:28
Speaker
I'm wondering for if there are any other, you know, for anybody listening who might feel stuck or might feel hopeless in their relationship with food, is there one little gentle first step that they could take today?
00:47:42
Speaker
Absolutely. the first thing I would say to them is that you're not alone because often There can be a real sense of shame in reaching out for support because they feel like they're the only one that's struggling with this.
00:47:58
Speaker
so I really want them to know they're not alone. And the other thing is they can reach out to me if they want to talk and learn how they can work with me.
00:48:09
Speaker
I offer one-on-one coaching. and would love to help them. yeah, sometimes just having a chat can be really helpful. They don't need to book in, but just to, yeah, start that conversation. so they can email me to start that. And then I also have a course, a self-paced course that people can do, which is called EATS for Executive Functioning.
00:48:35
Speaker
And so it's a short- Yeah, it's a short, it's just 10 videos. They're only 10 minutes long each. And what it goes through is the foods that we can use to help boost executive functioning by producing more of those neurotransmitters and not just what to eat, but really simple systems and tools that they can implement to help them actually do it.
00:49:01
Speaker
So really ADHD friendly tools. Fantastic. So where where can people um access that and purchase that? If they go onto my website, that's probably the best place. that it will all be on there that they can access it and reach out if they have any questions. So that's balanceandbyte.com.au. Fantastic. Of course, I'll put it all in the show notes. Thank you so much for joining us today. This has been fabulous and hopefully very useful.
00:49:35
Speaker
Thank you. And thanks for sharing some of your stories well. appreciate hearing that. ah Well, I'm going to have a little Erin on my shoulder. I'm sure many of the listeners will have a little Erin on our shoulder. um And I would love to speak to you again at any time.
00:49:54
Speaker
i think it's been a great conversation. So it'd be great to hear from listeners too. if If you're out there and you have a story to share your own ADHD story or perhaps you're working with the neurodivergent community or have some other insights, I would love to hear from you. So reach out. You can reach out via my website, awakenadhd.com.au or you can reach me on Instagram as well, which I very rarely post on because I never get around to that. and But I would love to hear from you Anyway, so thanks again, Erin, and take care.
00:50:34
Speaker
Thanks, Jade. Thank you for having me. Bye. You're
00:50:40
Speaker
welcome. Bye.
00:50:44
Speaker
This podcast is not a licensed mental health provider. It represents the personal opinions and experiences of individuals. No content should be taken as professional advice or recommendation.