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EP. 71: Kindergarten Redshirting Part 1: Can You Learn To Read At Home Depot?
368 Plays24 days ago
The principal is BACK. Part 1 or 2 with principal, educator and friend of the pod: Jon Arens. We are answering all ALL your questions about learning to read and starting kindergarten.
Questions YOU asked and we discuss in these two episodes:
🧠 Decision-Making Factors
- What factors would make you consider redshirting as a good fit aside from age alone?
- Is it better to make the decision based on academic readiness or emotional/maturity?
- Does birth order influence the choice?
- Does research show it’s better to hold back a boy vs. a girl?
- Where do we draw the line? (March birthdays redshirted)
- HELP! 4YO July Bday. Language/reasoning/comm 💯, Social-emotional 😱
⚖️ Pros, Cons & Impact
- What are the top 3 signs to redshirt?
- Long-term implications of 6–7-year-olds in K — does it raise expectations too much for 4–5-year-olds?
- Is fear of “boredom causing behavior issues” a reason NOT to redshirt?
- Can kids get bumped up a grade if it ends up not being a good fit?
💡 Situational Scenarios
- My child is smart, early Aug birthday, but can’t sit still and struggles to participate.
- My child can read since 2.5 and is advanced in math but struggles emotionally (Sept bday).
- Late August birthday — can tell social/emotional differences but not academic ones.
- Very extroverted, very tall, late July birthday, reading level H — teacher says she’s okay.
- Twins with developmental delay — early intervention or more time?
- Late birthday + IEP for ADHD — repeat K or will the IEP be enough for 1st?
📍 District/Policy Questions
- Why don’t some schools (like CPS) allow redshirting?
- Is it allowed in every school district? Is it really up to parents?
- NYC with a Dec 31 cutoff — is that developmentally inappropriate?
🛠 Practical Tips
- I’m holding my son back (Aug 17) and sending him to TK — tips for avoiding regression?
- We’re redshirting KG but likely going to 1st — what should we focus on?
- Should we repeat kinder in a multi-age class (K/1) or switch to a different class?
- When would you do it?
😅 Other
- I already did it. How do I explain it to him?
- How common is this?
- Did it — bad idea. Had to fight to skip ahead due to immature classmates.
- My answers as a principal were easier than as a parent.
For more support visit bigcityreaders.com
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Kindergarten Redshirting
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome back to the plan words podcast from big city readers. It's miss Beth. And today we're talking about one of the, I would say most dramatic and biggest decisions families face around elementary school.
00:00:15
Speaker
And it's kindergarten. And the drama is to red shirt or not to red shirt. And to join me, I've invited one of my friends and favorite guests we've had here on the podcast, John Aaron's principal, parent, big city believer. Big city believer. Yes. Big city believer.
00:00:38
Speaker
How are you? Good. and need to get that on a bumper sticker or something. Big city believer. I just, I don't know why. i I never like write out a script for the podcast because I, you're probably like me and I'm like, I need to be able to shift and just flow. And if it's too structured, i can't do it.
00:00:57
Speaker
Yeah. I actually was looking at bumper stickers today because I feel like I've gotten to the bumper sticker part of my parenting journey where I feel like I want people to know more information about me than they probably care about.
00:01:09
Speaker
So if you do make those bumper stickers, I'll probably take one.
Discount Offer for Chicago Listeners
00:01:13
Speaker
Okay, before we jump in, I've got a fun little treat for my local Chicago listeners. My incredibly talented friends at a little photo studio are offering $50 off a professional photo session when you use the code BCR 50.
00:01:27
Speaker
And trust me, these are fun photos. I actually have a few that I've done at a little photo studio hanging in my house. They are creative. They are different and you will have fun at this shoot. I promise.
00:01:40
Speaker
This is an offer good through September 1st. So grab it now. If you've been thinking about family fall photos or even updating your headshots, this is your sign. I will link all of the info in the show notes. Go grab this offer
Personal Anecdotes and Reflections
00:01:54
Speaker
right now.
00:01:55
Speaker
Well, that's funny. I actually was just having my niece help me make a bucket list. And I was like, what are some things I could do? And she said, you could make like more big city readers. Merchandise could be on your bucket list. So maybe this is a sign.
00:02:11
Speaker
Okay. So you are ah not a stranger to this podcast because first of all, I think, I think you might stick out because you are one of two men that have been on the podcast.
00:02:22
Speaker
So maybe that's why people are like, I remember the principle. Yeah. Yeah. um But also because you um famously, I'll say famously, said on the podcast, you were like, I saw somebody. We talked about behavior charts before. And you said, um no, there's no way that's not legal. That's not ethical. There's no way a school would pass that. And people were like, oh, my school does. And you were like, that's a lie.
00:02:48
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, that was surprising. mean, I guess it shouldn't be surprising. There's less, there's not as much regulation around schools as people realize it's a lot of local control mostly. um so things,
00:03:03
Speaker
things do have a tendency to stall out um and not get changed um unless there's, you know, someone pays for like a consultant to come in or, you know, there's a change of leadership at the top of a district or an organization where they're um going to come in and change something.
00:03:20
Speaker
Every once while you see it with school boards, but even most school boards I would say are, you know, much higher level than the building level things, but they won't be, you know,
00:03:32
Speaker
knowledgeable about a behavior chart or a specific type of behavior chart. Right. I think that that actually is an interesting point is that people think schools are more regulated than they are.
00:03:43
Speaker
Like I have have had parents be like, oh, I'm in this district. Do you know if they use the science of reading? I'm like, babe, classroom to classroom in a specific school is going to be different. Not this district. I mean, they can be like in general, but there's just so much nuance. Yeah.
00:04:02
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, therere you can have ah science of reading curriculum that's being implemented and have staff, different staff in different units within a building, which happened in in my school.
Challenges in Reading Education
00:04:18
Speaker
Yeah.
00:04:19
Speaker
where there it just takes a while to train that and to get things off the ground. And so you might have certain teachers that are trained who are then in charge of training other teachers, or you could have a um a very specific rollout. It's not like a light switch. so and And some teachers come in with experience with different types of systems too.
00:04:41
Speaker
i mean, I think the the what I heard recently is I think the average turnover rate Maybe this was in Wisconsin, but the the average turnover for a school is like 25 to 30% a year in terms of teachers. So you are going to have teachers that come in needing things or bringing things.
00:05:02
Speaker
So I do think that a lot of the science of reading push has been ah really good. I was really pleased with it from um you know my perspective as an administrator, as a parent.
00:05:14
Speaker
um I think you know it' it's definitely pushing things in the right direction but it is definitely not a light switch and there districts right next to each other that are in totally different places and um a lot of it depends on the knowledge of the staff and the knowledge of the administration and um you know how you know, what you're using already versus what you have to completely buy new.
00:05:41
Speaker
um But things are definitely kicking into gear um in Wisconsin. And I think nationally, it's it's becoming a much more discussed topic, which is ultimately really good. I mean, I think that for a long time, parents had no idea how reading worked. And I think you, you posted recently something about like, do you remember learning to read?
00:06:04
Speaker
no one remembers learning to read. It's, um, it's not like walking. It's not like, um, you know when compared to talking because obviously there's you know speech therapy is a thing but um and obviously there's physical therapy too but it's not something that like it just happens um it does require you know explicit instruction and specific types of skills and if and you you're often way to pull you know far apart from it as a parent to remember how you learned how to read. So it's really hard for you to help your kids sometimes because you you don't remember your own journey through through it unless you are maybe in, you know, a specific reading intervention program or something like that, that you like remember the name of, or you really remember the teacher.
00:06:53
Speaker
Or if you had a specific trauma around it, like I remember it cause I, it was traumatizing to me. Yeah. Yeah. So there's not usually like, I would love to know the percentage of people that can remember learning to read. It's got to be, you know, 10, 15%. I certainly don't.
00:07:12
Speaker
yeah I've talked to so many parents who say, like, I don't remember these rules, but they make so much sense. I'm like, you probably didn't actually learn the rules that kids are learning now. Because I definitely was whole language. And I like i know, because I remember the moment as an adult that it clicked for me. I mean, obviously, I learned to read and I did well in school. But not, it didn't come naturally to me. It did not come easily to me. And I know that if I had been taught like the science of reading and phonics strategies and all these things, I know that I would have remembered that when, because I remember it being in my twenties and be like, Oh my gosh, because I know my brain and I know that I like to like look for ways to solve puzzle puzzles and
Wisconsin's Education Reforms
00:07:54
Speaker
problems. And
00:07:55
Speaker
So like it clicked to me finally that it's not just a mystery that there's actually a method to the madness because until then I, I was just like, I'm just not good at this. Yeah. And i there's, there's ah you know, I have, I have lots of theories about, about kind of like pushing reading versus not pushing reading, you know, like, yes, yes.
00:08:18
Speaker
you know, all three of my kids are very different in how they've approached reading. And obviously I, I'm not a formal license, formally licensed reading teacher, but I was, you know, like two classes away from getting that license if I had wanted to.
00:08:35
Speaker
And I, you know, help design reading intervention and support reading intervention and instruction reading intervention programs as my job. And for my kids to now want to read with me at the beginning of their reading journey, it's very frustrating. on the front end And then I realized that,
00:08:53
Speaker
um You know, it didn't need to be me that was trying to teach them how to read and learning to really trust trust the school and and figure out the processes and get familiar with the things that you can do your home parenting level.
00:09:10
Speaker
you know at your home parenting level So there is some kind of like separation between like church and state in terms of what the kids are learning at school versus, you know, practicing those skills at home and associating their parent with, you know, like explicit skill instruction is not a bad thing.
00:09:29
Speaker
ugly Agree. You said you're pleased with Wisconsin and where things are going. I have a lot of friends that teach in Wisconsin, behavior specialists or learning specialists or speech pathologists. And they all at different places have said like about the whole district getting letters trained, which is a really big science of reading approach. And it sounds like Wisconsin has is as a whole is making a lot of shifts. Are they one of the states, do you know, that have banned three queuing?
00:09:57
Speaker
Yes. So there's a law in Wisconsin called Act 20, which was passed bipartisanly, which is amazing in Wisconsin because things do not happen that way in Wisconsin. and yeah It still hasn't been fully funded, um which is kind of like the last hurdle, obviously an important hurdle. But the...
00:10:18
Speaker
the the state you know allocated or said, you know, these are the curriculums that you can use. And then all the districts went through and in trial, different ones. And especially in the last year, the awareness of um just what the movement was going towards in terms of like phonics instruction and explicit instruction came a long way. i think it became something that was a real talking point. and It was a part of every professional development um updates. You know, it was constantly updated at staff meetings. People knew who was, who were getting trained.
00:10:53
Speaker
People were aware of the companies that had been approved. um People saw the boxes of curriculum coming in and out of the building. So I think that, Once those kind of tangible things happened, that was really when it started to take root. I think the year before was actually the year that a lot passed.
00:11:11
Speaker
um And people were still like, you know, I'll believe it when I'll see it, you know, like things pass all the time and nothing ever happens. And then I think this year was like the real big year where it was, you know, you had principals and district level people, especially like curriculum, um curriculum people were getting pulled into, you know, pretty,
00:11:32
Speaker
heavily recurring meetings discussing, you know, what a personal reading plan looked like, which is what they call them Wisconsin and like the different, um the different facets and the different kind of things that had happened before grade three and, you know, where they retaining kids at grade three, which is an option that they've left up to individual
Understanding Educational Methods
00:11:53
Speaker
districts. But I think all in all, the the law being passed and implemented and obviously the funding piece is like the last big piece. Um, but that I think that it's gone really well as a whole in the state. And I think that, um, you know, I haven't heard a lot of parents that have had children on PRPs or personal reading plans that have been like really upset or confused by PRPs.
00:12:20
Speaker
Um, and I think that the curriculum teams have done a good job of working with special education teams and special education leadership, um in navigating the like tough conversations between a PRP is not special education, ah PRP you know is this, and special education is this. And i think that that conversation especially has gone really well. And I think that a large part of that is because um they started talking to us, like the specialists special ed people, probably like months ago.
00:12:51
Speaker
Okay. Right. At first pass, I was kind of like, am I going to get invited to these meetings? Like, you's going to just like design this thing. Cause we were all sitting there in the meetings and we were like, this really looks like special ed.
00:13:02
Speaker
They got to be careful that they don't make this too similar to special ed or they're going to have a huge referral problem. Yeah. And, um, I would say like 16, 17, 16, 18 months ago, i feel like they started bringing people in and that's where like, it was pretty obvious that like the design and the implementation were um influenced by special education and but not a direct overlap, which is really important because I think that, um,
00:13:32
Speaker
it's going to be one of those things that parents need to know the difference between those, those things. And it can be really hard to navigate that. I know that that's like one of the biggest barriers in special education is just having parents understand like the difference between five or fours and special education. And now there's like this additional element of personal reading plans. So, um but all in all, I think it's gone much better than I would have guessed.
00:13:57
Speaker
Good. Yeah. So really pleased with it. Okay, so I know that people, this is a question I get all the time whenever I talk about like the states that have banned certain reading methods. And I realize 3Qing, I didn't, I've mentioned this before, but 3Qing is like the base in the basic way. It's like when you tell kids like look at the pictures or guess at the words. um And it's banned in I think at this point 16 states, I have to confirm. Yeah, that sounds about right.
00:14:23
Speaker
Right. And so hopefully all soon. But how do you think this has happened in Wisconsin? Like what got you here? Well, I mean, for me, I I went I was a career changer for for teaching. So when I went back to get my teaching license, I got taught the three cueing method.
00:14:42
Speaker
Same. In grad school a. this is this is how we teach reading. And it was really confusing to me. And then when it came time to take the, um we for it is what it's called, but that's the um the test that you have to pass to get your teacher's license in Wisconsin, or you used to have to pass.
00:15:01
Speaker
um It's a very difficult test. It's modeled off of tests in Massachusetts um that they've used for a long time. And the pass rate on it is really low.
00:15:12
Speaker
And I noticed that the um the people that were in the early education program or cohort were passing at a much higher level than the students.
00:15:23
Speaker
early adolescence and adolescence cohort. And it was because that group was learning 3-Qing, but they were also mostly learning heavily phonics-based things.
00:15:34
Speaker
um And then, so there was a huge disconnect there. um And then that that is ultimately what I did my my master's thesis on, was that disconnect in reading intervention and instruction um between the early elementary school and elementary middle school and high school years. So i have lots of thoughts about that. I i think that this, um all this push has been really good, but it's it's really interesting to me that, you know, learning this, I still have the notes from the class and I and i was like, this doesn't make any sense that this is this is how we're teaching reading.
00:16:15
Speaker
um I don't remember being taught these skills at all, but I, you know, I just kind of absorbed it. I don't think I ever really used it outside of, um you know, instances where I had to, because I never felt like it was really working that well. Well, you're better than me. I used it.
00:16:37
Speaker
So, yeah, I mean, I'm i'm glad it's gone, but it it it was interesting to be like at the nexus of it. taught and then watching everyone fail this test.
00:16:50
Speaker
I passed the test with ah the lowest score you could possibly get to pass. Um, I remember that. Um, and I was like one of the only people in my cohort to pass the test. Um, and, but I studied for two weeks straight, um,
00:17:05
Speaker
to do it and it was really it was really hard. And i don't I don't think that that test is a requirement anymore in Wisconsin because it's such a barrier to entry for teachers. But I think a lot of the the push to change the law did come from the inability for the state to get teachers in the classrooms because of this reading test.
00:17:25
Speaker
And then with reading tests, went away or got changed and they realized that what they were teaching in this test was not happening in the schools. And I feel like that big disconnect, which is what I did almost all my research on, was this specific thing.
00:17:42
Speaker
um So to see that kind of like change in real time while I was a teacher and then as administrator was really interesting. I feel the worst for the kids that were kind of like stuck in that time period where they were still kind of trying to use some of this stuff that's been banned in states.
00:17:59
Speaker
And then they got the pandemic, you know, like, and then, you know, people there was, you know, the whole soul of the story, like change, change movement that happened kind of like during, you know, during the pandemic and after the pandemic. And, but there's like a group of kids that,
00:18:16
Speaker
And I don't know, like the birth years, but there's a group of kids that really kind of got nailed by that transition. Yeah. And I really hope that stays.
00:18:28
Speaker
And I think that states, I think that like buildings acknowledge that kind of bubble, but I don't think that the states and the larger like entities have acknowledged that there is a pretty sizable group of kids between a certain age range that really got kind of like screwed out of good reading instruction. And like, how are we supporting these kids in high school? You know, because those kids are like on the cusp of going to high school right now.
00:18:53
Speaker
Yeah. And, uh, Yeah, I think they're all in like upper, they're like sixth, seventh, eighth graders right now, I would guess. And I would hope that schools, especially high schools, are beefing up their you know literacy teams and and having... So you would hope that or you think that?
00:19:13
Speaker
I would hope that. I mean, like, I think that high schools are kind of hit or miss with if they have literacy teachers in the building. Yeah. And sometimes literacy teachers can teach students with IEPs, and sometimes they can't.
00:19:26
Speaker
Wisconsin just changed the law um very recently, like in the last six months, that literacy teachers can now teach students with special education plans, um which is huge because that was a massive barrier to entry.
00:19:42
Speaker
when I was teaching. So, um, you know, that's a very specific Wisconsin thing, but there, there was for a long time, this thought that if you had a reading related IEP goal, you could only get taught by your special education teacher, but special education teachers were getting taught this like three queuing system and there, they weren't allowed to be in um the reg ed environment with the literacy teachers.
00:20:10
Speaker
So you could make the argument that if your kid had a reading need, it was better for them to not have an IEP and have access to literacy teacher um than to have an IEP. And that just, that little like kink just changed in Wisconsin, at least like six months ago.
00:20:27
Speaker
okay That was again, like what I did in research round. That was like, this is a massive problem. And, um, I talked to middle school parents about it all the time. Um, especially if they were like getting dismissed from special education and I would be like, you know, it's not, you know, go find the school that has a literacy teacher employed and, um tell them when you're enrolling them that you, or when they're scheduling them, that you want them in some sort of literacy class and, um, be very explicit about it. And, um, yeah.
00:20:58
Speaker
Wow. That's good
Parental Involvement in Education
00:21:00
Speaker
advice. i think in general, um, what would you say, do you have any tips? Cause parents, okay. So I'll share this information, right. That we're talking about, or they'll hear this in this episode and parents just kind of feel helpless. Like, okay, so what, like some States are doing it right. Some States aren't, there's this, like, how do I, they say like, how do I get involved? What's the, what's like the entry level of getting involved? Is it like going to school?
00:21:28
Speaker
ah open school board meeting. I know you love to listen to school board meetings.
00:21:34
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, it's that's a tough one because by the time a school board is getting presented with curriculum changes, it's already been you know picked for the most part. I mean, yeah you you present those changes to a school board and then the school board takes that information, has obviously read it before, and then they vote.
00:21:54
Speaker
um They're not processing that at the school board meeting, which is the you know open meeting that parents would go to. So I would make the argument that going to a school board meeting
00:22:05
Speaker
it's not the way to be involved. I mean, I think, um you know, I think that it's really hard for for people who aren't in schools to pick up on the like little, the subtle things that indicate that schools are moving in a direction or moving towards a curriculum change.
00:22:24
Speaker
Because it'll just be like, we allocated money for this construction consultancy to come in and present these options to us. And then the administrative team will present to the board at like this meeting and then the board will read it and then they'll vote. And then the parents think that like the vote meeting is like the meeting they need to go to. Like they're to use hand and like, you know, in public comment and change something.
00:22:51
Speaker
No, that's like way past. So um I would say... um You know, there's a lot more involvement in it, like parent and public involvement in curriculum type things now, which is, you know, very controversial in a lot of districts. But um I would say like the most important thing that you could do as a parent is just to know you know what's going on in the classroom in the sense of what are the skills being taught explicitly in the classroom and then talking with your teacher about like how can we reinforce these but not in the same way that you're teaching it at home. you know like i I tell parents all the time that like one of my favorite things to do
00:23:40
Speaker
with kids and I do with my own kids is help them with like the grocery shopping list. So like they can make the grocery shopping list with you. Um, and it works on like early writing skills. Um, do you know, this is my favorite thing to recommend too.
00:23:54
Speaker
Yeah. There's some like executive functioning things. If you're like, put the put them in order of like where they are in the, in the store. And then you always like tell them, you know, If you do this, you you can pick something like you will. It will get you a donut right at the start or at the end. Or you get to pick some a candy at the checkout lane.
00:24:12
Speaker
um But I like, you know, sometimes it's hard to read what they wrote. But you can say, like, we need hot dogs and they have to, like, write the hot dog. And then there's the reading element comes back into place when they're in the cart with you, you know, trying to read their own handwriting. um And some kids are like right on it.
00:24:31
Speaker
And then some kids don't immediately recognize it. And that process of them trying to figure it out is really good for them learning wise. Um, so I, I love the grocery list thing. um I think it's, you know, it kills two birds with one stone. and A lot of people don't bring their kids grocery shopping with them. Um, I, I love to do it because I think it's, it makes a very dull thing more fun.
00:24:54
Speaker
And it also, you can like insert little like parts of it, um, into their, um, into kind of like their real world. What I think the more real world you can make reading and writing or anything for kids, it makes sense. There are so many kids that are like resistant because it it just doesn't they think it doesn't matter. They're like, I don't care about reading. And you say, like well, you you're going to have to learn how to read because it's going to I love reading and I want you to love reading as much as I do. or And it's like your kid does not care that you love reading. They're they're only thinking about right now. They're not thinking about becoming an adult and high school like you are. what they need to know, oh, this is going to get me to be able to get candy. Like they need shorter goals. Yeah. Like I had the kids write out the sign for like a lemonade stand we just did recently.
00:25:44
Speaker
And I think they honestly made more money because they clearly wrote it. Yeah. You know, think they it was a good business decision, like a good marketing decision. Oh, totally. um So I think, you know, having, um you know, putting like whiteboard signs on your kids' doors and like allowing them to like say, you know, like be back later. Like I keep out, keep out like my My daughter always writes things like,
00:26:12
Speaker
She calls her siblings the brothers, which is one of my favorite things. She'll write like, like B-R-U-D-D-E-R-S, like the brothers, please like keep out. Cute!
00:26:27
Speaker
And so i think, i do think that like the early writing stuff is easier to organically bring into the like,
00:26:38
Speaker
world that you live in at home than early reading skills. I mean, yeah, you could cover your house and like, you know, printed words and things like that. You know, I've seen parents that do that. And I know that was like something that would often get like recommended to yeah parents. They'd be like, oh, like, you know, spend eight hours like printing out every single word, like you're moving, you know, and like putting it like on every single thing.
00:27:05
Speaker
And then people are going to go into your house and think you're like an absolute psychopath. You're like, I'm teaching my kids how to read. and know like like that's, that's way too much. Like you don't need to do stuff like that. No, I would rather have ah you have your kid like take some post-its and write the beginning sound and put them on things. And or like if you go to a museum or an aquarium or a zoo, you know, like having them like try to figure out um signs and things like that is important.
00:27:32
Speaker
You know, even things when people are like, oh, I have them read the signs on the road. Why? You know, like you really want like it to be like, turn off on this exit and be like, no, we're not. And they're like, turn off on this exit.
00:27:44
Speaker
yeah i'd rather I'd rather be in like the trenches with my kid learning how to read not on highway. Yeah. Like, you know, an elephant exhibit where they're like trying to read like what the elephants eat.
00:27:56
Speaker
yeah Yeah, that's good. So I think a lot of the like stereotypical things that have always been told parents to do with like learning how to, especially like learning sight words and things like that, I think they just don't fit like the reality. you know like No one wants the little like pictures. all I like the Post-it thing. The Post-it thing's good.
00:28:17
Speaker
um You know, I...
00:28:22
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I, I, I think that like reading within the structure of like a game great. I'm like, don't, you don't need to read books. Like actually in fact, like drop the books, just use a yeah whiteboard, write messages to each other. Right. yeah Right. We're having spaghetti for breakfast and see if your kid can decode part of that word. and then be like, what did I write the word the wrong way? We're not having spaghetti. We're having, you know, and then let them try to write what you're actually having.
00:28:52
Speaker
Yeah, I like, yeah, the grocery list thing works really well. I mean, like, a more advanced version of that is taking your kids to someplace like like Home Depot, you know?
Integrating Learning in Daily Activities
00:29:03
Speaker
I didn't do that for a really long time because it's very intimidating, but, like, if you...
00:29:10
Speaker
can get your kid like down an aisle with all the little like signs and stuff like that and be like, this is what we need. And you can like ask people in an orange you know vest for help. And like you and you just like stand on the end of the aisle and let them go through and try to like read all the things. First of all, like you're not doing it anymore.
00:29:30
Speaker
But you can interact with someone. and um Hopefully that understands their children um and in kind of like a customer service capacity.
00:29:40
Speaker
I think stuff like that is more meaningful than your, you know, like I said, those, the two examples earlier or, um, you know, reading road signs, you know, like honestly, like reading road signs is, you know, I, the last thing in the world I want is like my kids, like yelling out things when I'm driving, like of signs, like as I'm passing, like,
00:30:02
Speaker
Yeah. Well, like a person is telling me where to go to, you know, like the person's telling me the directions and my kids are just blurting out every single sign that they see. no thank you. I'll just, you guys can learn to read some other times.
00:30:16
Speaker
This is time to be quiet. And also that Home Depot thing seems advanced. Like that would be an advanced task for me to navigate Home Depot. So you're right. That is the advanced. Yeah. that Home Depot be a tough one for anything more than like two kids, I would say i don't And it's a great activity. I feel like that's such a good life skills activity, like kids learning how to ask for help when they're when they need it. I feel like so many kids don't know how to like call someone on the phone. You know, like they they're just like missing these skills. They think like, oh, I'll just look it up. I mean, I have been in a store before and I'm like, i don't want to talk to a person. I'm going to look up what aisle this is in on my phone.
00:30:57
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you can there's like some back. Honestly, the Home Depot works a lot for like math skills too and like number recognition, probably more so than reading.
00:31:08
Speaker
yeah But yeah, like i've I've had to go and get, you know, wood for something and I've taken taking the kids and been like, this is what I'm making and I need these. I give each of them something that they have to find.
00:31:25
Speaker
And I just kind of like let them run around and figure it out. and And I usually tell them like, don't take it out. Like, just go to the place where it is and like ask me if you're right. Because what I used to do is be like, go find it. And then they would like, you know, like I'd have like one kid dragging like a two by four, you know, and then I'd have like another kid with like,
00:31:44
Speaker
you know, a block sander and they would just be like dropping stuff all over the floor. So you need to, there's like definitely some strategy to it, but I think that if you can incorporate, um, the reading stuff into your errands, I think it, it's, it's big. Um, you know, reading, reading directions and like a recipe is all fine and good, but you know,
00:32:07
Speaker
if you're if the recipe is you know time-bound or requires some kind of you know fast processing, again, it's like the driving thing. It's like everyone says, oh, cook with your kid, or like oh have their kid read the signs. These are situations where if you mess up, there's like a negative consequence.
00:32:24
Speaker
there's There's really no negative consequence to your kids like bringing you the wrong you know type of cereal at a grocery store. That's true. your kid need... is like we need You know, it says like two cups of flour and they put like three cups of flour and you just like destroy whatever you were trying to make.
00:32:46
Speaker
So that's good point. I try to not do teachable moments in situations where like the downside is like a huge mess to clean up. Yeah.
00:32:56
Speaker
That makes sense. yeah Okay. That's a great, that's a great tip. Um,
Revisiting Kindergarten Redshirting
00:33:01
Speaker
okay. So speaking of the learning to read age and stage, should we talk about kindergarten red shirting?