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Episode 73: A Sports Entertainment Hangout (NXT's Takeover XXV, NJPW's Best of the Super Jrs, and a Sad Ass Hockey Game)
76 Plays6 years ago
This week Garrett recounts the saddest experience of his sports viewing career, then 16 minutes later the boys talk wrestling! They're talking NXT Takeover, Jon Moxley's NJPW debut, Basebrawl 2005, Southern Underground Pro, Beyond Wrestling and more!
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Transcript
Introduction to the Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of Predetermined, a Pro Wrestling Hangout. I'm
Legalization of Marijuana in Illinois
00:00:04
Speaker
your host, Garrett Callender, and with me, as always, a man who of January 1st, 2020, will be able to buy legal weed in the state of Illinois, Derek Alpin.
00:00:16
Speaker
And as long as my employer says it's okay, that's exactly what I'm going to do. So if you're looking for a weed dealer, Derek said he'd mail it to all of us.
High School Pothead Misunderstanding
00:00:26
Speaker
I didn't say that I was going to get in the business of selling it and distributing it. I just said I might be interested in smoking a little bit more often than I have in the past.
00:00:36
Speaker
And you know what? It's gonna be perfectly fine, buddy. You're gonna be able to walk in a store and buy it the same you would a Twix bar or like a sleeve of Fig Newtons. Maybe you should tell the story really quick about how in high school, despite us being good boys, not just Las Vegas good guy Garrett, not Las Vegas good boy Garrett, no, no, no, no, no. In college, or let me back up. In high school, when we were nice children,
00:01:05
Speaker
People thought that we were the potheads. They thought we were a little bit corrupt. And we weren't. How wrong they were. But we didn't find this out until what? Basically after we graduated? Oh yeah, it was, yeah, probably our freshman year of college. We found out that basically the entire high school thought that Derek was the king of the potheads. Yeah.
00:01:30
Speaker
I don't even know if I had been around pot at that point. No, neither of us had. We were truly good boys. I mean, surely there was some pot at some of those shows we went to down in St. Louis, but we didn't know. Yeah, no, that wasn't our game. We didn't drink, we just played Halo and what the fuck else did we do? Like probably eat a whole pie way after midnight.
00:01:53
Speaker
For those who don't know, Garrett and I used to go down in his basement and play video games until three in the morning and we would share snacks, sometimes a whole pumpkin pie. And I would watch him play games like Resident Evil four for hours on end. And we've channeled all of that into this. So you're there in the basement with us now bullshitting about pro wrestling.
Podcast's Casual Vibe and Sports Entertainment
00:02:13
Speaker
Cause that's what we do. We hang out and we talk about sports entertainment. If that's a couple, no, no words I'm not supposed to use.
00:02:21
Speaker
You're not supposed to say that, right? Wait, you mean like pro wrestlers would be mad if you said sports entertainment? I feel like the kind of people who listen to this podcast would be like, oh fuck Derek, he said sports entertainment. I agree. I said it tongue in cheek. It's pro wrestling. We're predetermined a pro wrestling hangout. Can you imagine if we were predetermined a sports entertainment hangout?
00:02:43
Speaker
That actually does sound pretty good because it sounds like obnoxiously pretentious. I actually like being able to say my favorite sports entertainer is Kazuchka Okada.
Garrett's Emotional Sports Story
00:02:58
Speaker
The truth is you were sports entertained in this past week in a way that has nothing to do with pro wrestling. And I will tell about that. Oh man, I witnessed the biggest bummer of my sports loving career. And we will talk about that after you hit our goddamn music.
00:03:53
Speaker
Garrett, I don't know how relevant this story is going to be in the long run, but for the time being, this is kind of an important story to you. And for those of you who know us by now, as we said last week, there's always a little bit at the beginning of the show where we talk about our lives and ourselves, and then we use that to transition into talking about pro wrestling. So
00:04:15
Speaker
I guess if you don't want to hear a fun fucking story, you can go ahead and fast forward like five, 10 minutes and you'll get past all that stuff. But in the meantime, if you want to hear Garrett be really, really sad and really, really upset and I get to interview him about it, then stick around because you're in for a great fucking story. You know, we should we should start putting a time stamp in the description, like 15 minutes, seven seconds is where we start talking about wrestling.
00:04:41
Speaker
15 minutes, seven seconds if you don't give a shit about us. Thanks, curtain jerks. You've made us self-aware.
Stanley Cup Final Experience
00:04:50
Speaker
In fact, we're putting ourselves out there. Garrett, you and I have frequently started this show by talking about the NHL and your hockey team, the St. Louis Blues are in the Stanley Cup final right now against the Boston Bruins. And you got to go to the first
00:05:12
Speaker
Stanley Cup final home game for the St. Louis Blues in how many years 40 some odd years 49 years Derek 49 years you got to be there for game three in st. Louis, Missouri watching that I've always associated you with one sports team and that's the st. Louis Blues
00:05:31
Speaker
Yeah, I think you'll occasionally root for the Cardinals, but I don't think you really give a shit much about that. You like hockey. This is true. This is true. I wouldn't even say I enjoy baseball, really. You know, the Cardinals are a team I grew up around. I'll root for them if it gets to a point where they're in a thing.
00:05:48
Speaker
But it doesn't break your heart if the Cardinals lose, right? No, I've never been sad about any other sport but hockey. And it has given me a long run of sadness. Think about how all of us have felt walking out of a WrestleMania the last few years, not counting the most recent. It was like that times a million, Derek.
00:06:10
Speaker
So what happened, my friend? You made a drive from Nashville, Tennessee to St. Louis, Missouri, which is what, about five hours? That is about five hours from here to there. Got there pretty early so we could find parking. So I went with my family, with my parents and my wife, and I have never seen my father more excited in his entire life. That's adorable to me. It really was. I am smiling so big right now.
00:06:38
Speaker
I don't know how many times I've seen him, like, that pumped for anything. Like, he said at one point to me, like, I have been watching this team since I was 14 years old.
00:06:53
Speaker
Okay, answer this for me right now before you continue. Did you hug him? Did you two sweet him? Did you fist bump him? Did you do anything? Did you do like any of that Otis and Jizz shit? Did you pump fists or do some cool taunt together? I was like, come on, dad, just do this. Shake your body like you're having a good come. I'm coming!
00:07:18
Speaker
I don't talk about Otis and Jizz enough anymore. I think that they're probably sad. They've probably tuned out at this point. I hope not.
00:07:27
Speaker
Well hopefully they get that AEW contract soon so we can keep talking about them somewhere else. I don't know man, maybe Vince loves them and they'll stick around and they'll get a push. But you know who didn't get a push? Oh Garrett, you made this long drive. You're with your family, your loved ones. It's this big moment. If you're just a pro wrestling fan and you don't have any sports fandom, if you've waited a long time for something that you really love,
00:07:55
Speaker
then you'll understand how important this game in this moment was for Garrett and his family. And apparently even more so for his dad, because he's watched this St. Louis Blues hockey team since he was 14 years old. And I mean, you get this, you get this as a sports fan. Like you love the same team regardless of how good they are. Like you've been there for a White Sox World Series and you've also been there ever since.
00:08:22
Speaker
Yes, which from what I understand, there's been some sad years for you as well. But this was a lot of sad years. This was but you know, we're finally there. The crowd, the atmosphere is this amazing fucking thing. And it's you know, I've never felt
00:08:40
Speaker
the energy in a room like that before the only other thing that i can you know even compare it to was the first wrestlemania i went to where that is how you know the amount of joy i felt inside you had goosebumps did you have pretty good seats i mean we were like way the fuck up in a corner but it was like more about just like we were in the building
00:09:01
Speaker
Well, for sure, but like, we're in the building, you can see the ice. Yeah, we had a fine view. Fine view. You know, everyone's so excited. I mean, our national anthem singer, this is his last year singing for us, so we're like, oh, we get to hear him sing, maybe it's, you know, one of his last games.
00:09:22
Speaker
You know, they play the video. There's a whole pre-show thing where they just get you pumped up. I'm covered in goosebumps. I got a fucking deer rolling down my cheek because I'm witnessing history, baby. So the Storybrooke version of how this should play out is the city of St. Louis has waited however many decades to be back in this spot.
00:09:42
Speaker
Here they are, their first home game in the Stanley Cup final. They need to come out and win or at the very least kick some ass in the show St. Louis, they're here and they're serious about winning this championship. What happened next? We lost seven to two. So they didn't play Gloria. No, at one point they played ball with the ball and I out loud said, we deserve what's happening to us.
00:10:14
Speaker
That's not an appropriate hype song in 2019. At that point we were six to two, Derek, and they're playing Baw with the Baw trying to get me hyped. There's, what, five minutes left in the game? Fuck you. Fuck you, Baw with the Baw. Fuck you, Kid Rock. Fuck you, Imagine. You know, just every song they've got, fuck you.
00:10:34
Speaker
So you lose seven, you lose seven to two, but you need to elaborate on why this was so miserable. Like, was it because there were so many Boston Bruins fans there? Was it just the attitude in the building? What did you stick around for the whole game? Give me the whole scoop.
00:10:49
Speaker
It's a Stanley Cup game. And I'll tell you, if I was at home, there's a certain point where I would have had to just turn it off because it was making me too sad. But you know, you drove five hours to sit there with your family and purchase Stanley Cup tickets. So you got to sit there and just take it. It felt like
00:11:09
Speaker
I was being punished for something. I feel like maybe that time you ate the hot dog for the Boba Fett and I still haven't gotten you that 15 years later or whatever, probably longer. I think that's what happened to us, Derek. You know, I thought about that around goal five.
00:11:29
Speaker
In the words of the Iron Sheik, they fucked our ass and made us humble. And just to add insult to injury, like you said, there were so many Bruins fans and they were lining the entire top side of the arena we were on in the boxes. And they were waving their rally flags down, or rally towels down at us. And I was filled with so much sadness and rage.
00:11:57
Speaker
And, uh, yeah, I, you know, I, I wanted to, I wanted to die, Derek. It just wasn't, life wasn't worth living after that. So you get your ass handed to you. Is it just like being at a funeral? Are you just sitting there kind of solemnly with your hands kind of, you know, your fingers interlocked and you're just taking it and then you have to get up and make that walk back to your vehicle?
00:12:22
Speaker
The story of our year is similar to Daniel Bryan's run to WrestleMania 30. We were in last place. We got all the way to the top, Derek, and it felt like it was going to happen. It felt like it was going to be great. This would be like if at WrestleMania 30, Daniel Bryan beat Triple H and he comes back in the main event just to job to Randy Orton in 30 seconds.
00:12:51
Speaker
So you had a miserable sports experience.
Dilemma: Game 6 or Wu-Tang Clan?
00:12:53
Speaker
Oh, it was so sad. I don't know if I've ever been that sad leaving sports or anything. That might be the saddest I've ever been leaving any building.
00:13:03
Speaker
Was there a part of you that asked this question that we all ask ourselves after a terrible sports loss, which is why do I do this? Why do I play this game? Like where I commit myself to something so much emotionally and then when it doesn't go my way, it hurts and I just have to take it and then I come right back the next day wanting more.
00:13:26
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, you just, you fall in love with something and you just want to see it succeed, even if your team sucks. You just, you want to play it out in the payoff like after this many years should be great. And this is where I was though, so months ago.
00:13:43
Speaker
I bought tickets to see the Wu-Tang Clan this Sunday at the Ryman. They're going to be the first hip-hop act to ever play the stage of the Ryman is what I understand, which is the original Grand Old Opry here in Nashville. So that's a pretty big deal. I had pretty decent seats to that. They're playing 36 chambers straight through for the anniversary of the album. Nice. I guess we should clarify, though, what happened a couple of nights ago.
00:14:08
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Well, let me we ended up beating the shit out of Boston and it was awesome. So we just physically dominated them. We were Randy Orton, you know, throwing a sing brother through a table. We got to be that guy. So you were there for the game three loss in St. Louis. You weren't there for game four where they won and beat Boston, even the series two, two. But you have tickets for game six.
00:14:36
Speaker
And after game three, all I could think was if they win one more and then I have to go to St. Louis to watch Boston win the Stanley Cup and Miss Wu Tang Clan, I don't know what I'm gonna do with myself. You handled Roman Reigns losing to Brock Lesnar in the main event at WrestleMania last year pretty well.
00:15:05
Speaker
Like I think like you made it out of that. OK. Let me let me ask you. Let me ask you this because this is an important question that I want to have on record. If you don't win the cup.
00:15:21
Speaker
How heartbroken are you going to be? Or are you going to have the mentality of I didn't think we would be here in the first place, so I'm just happy we got this far. I'm very happy they got this far. You know, I never thought this would happen. It's cool just to see it happen. I want to win it now, Derek. The fans have been so mean online. I read the comment sections.
00:15:43
Speaker
You're not supposed to do that. Yeah, but I read it and everybody's being so mean to each other It turns out wrestling fans aren't the only ones that are assholes. It's everybody So you're missing you're missing Wu-Tang Clan for the hope that your team
00:15:59
Speaker
Does it possibly win the Stanley Cup or possibly lose the Stanley Cup on your watch? If you're listening to this the day of its release, the St. Louis Blues are in the Stanley Cup tonight. Show them some love. We're 16 minutes in, Derek. This is too much. We got to get on to wrestling. No, that's fine. And speaking of showing...
00:16:21
Speaker
We're speaking to showing people love. Show us some love. Hop on iTunes. Give us five stars. Leave a nice review. You do those things for us. You show us that love. We'll show you some love. You can recommend something that's pro wrestling related and we'll check it out and we'll talk about it on this podcast. We might even do it during the first 15 minutes of the show when we normally talk about other things. You might get the opening match. Wouldn't that be something for us to talk about pro wrestling out of the gate instead of Garrett being really sad about other things?
00:16:51
Speaker
That would actually make me very happy if we got a review and just their request was that we don't not, you know, we just talk about wrestling. Just do it, fuckers. I like you guys. Just do the thing that you're supposed to do. This is what you brought me in for and I can tell you're slowly stopping talking about it at the beginning and it's apparent. Listen, I love our listeners, but you guys need to chill a little bit. You signed up, you're with us now. We're in this thing together.
00:17:18
Speaker
If you don't like us, you wouldn't be listening anymore. You're probably not even listening to this now if you don't like us.
NXT Takeover Highlights
00:17:25
Speaker
So, hang in there. We have a ton of pro wrestling to talk about in this episode starting now. Garrett, where would you like to begin? We've got a few things we gotta get out of the way.
00:17:36
Speaker
and so much to talk about. I do want to start with a correction from last week's episode. I got a message from my buddy Matt that I told the story about him being drunk and booing Dave Meltzer. Yeah, I saw the response.
00:17:53
Speaker
He wanted to clarify that he was booing Dave Meltzer because he is a LA Dodgers fan and Meltzer had on a Giants jersey. But he said he also wasn't afraid to just humble him. So he didn't really deny what he did. He just said, I just want to clarify, I was booing him over sports fandom. I don't know if Meltzer knew that though, and I think that was the most amusing part.
00:18:21
Speaker
I mean, whatever. Meltzer was upset that he got booed. In Vegas. I mean, if by upset, it's like his smile turned to a frown in front of my eyes. And if I had a gif of that, holy shit. That'd be the most popular one in the wrestling community. Well, thank you for the correction. We now know that sports fandom is ruining Dave Meltzer's day too. So you tie that back in. Shit. Did you watch takeover?
00:18:50
Speaker
No, I skipped takeover because I don't NXT. So I'm just kidding. Of course I fucking watch takeover. Take over. Here's the thing. I wanted, I had a gripe with you about takeover. You made kind of like a, like a passing comment to me through texts the other day about you basically not giving a shit about takeover. Where the fuck does that attitude come from? Mr. I just haven't been named. Can you name a bad takeover?
00:19:17
Speaker
Anytime I'm not excited- No, you can't. No, I can't. And anytime I think I'm not excited to watch an NXT show because I'm just kind of tired with everything else on the network, they hit me with something where I'm just like, well, you got me again. You just fucking nailed it. 100%. You actually maybe got 105%. You got the bonus question right at the bottom. You can go hang this on the fridge. Is it a possibility that we take how great NXT is for granted?
00:19:45
Speaker
Yes, I think it's 100% a possibility. The fact that we don't watch that show every week because they have one of the most talented rosters on the planet of some of the best indie wrestlers imaginable, and I just, you can't pass that off as a WWE, just regular WWE product. They have something so special that is insane to me that they don't make that easily accessible for the world to see and grow it.
00:20:14
Speaker
I think this was takeover 25. I didn't get to watch this live and neither did you. And if you want to know why Garrett didn't get to watch this live, it's because he was talking about that miserable experience we opened the show with. Yeah, I was going to say, just go back and re-listen to the first 15 minutes and that's why I didn't get to watch a really good takeover live.
00:20:35
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I was downstate in my hometown, helping my mom move some shit from our old house, so I didn't get to watch it live, but I did get to watch it this week. Matt Riddle, fucking awesome. Roderick Strong, fucking awesome. Great opening match on this card.
00:20:51
Speaker
See, and that was a match I wasn't excited about initially because I'd seen it before. I'd seen those two fight, I believe, at PWG or something. And I was like, I have seen it. But as that match went on, goddamn, like, just the way how hard hitting those two guys are, I love it when WWE does some shit that makes me feel like it could happen in New Japan.
00:21:14
Speaker
Absolutely. And these two fucking rocked it. I think the other thing you can always count on with NXT doesn't matter who the names are, whatever the opening match is, you know it's going to be, as we say often, a banger. And this was. And they always find a way to put one in that I'm just not like super pumped about and then just immediately make me realize I fucked up thinking that.
00:21:46
Speaker
So I'm like so sold on Matt Riddle being a star. He's got his niche. I don't know how much longer they'll be able to keep him down there because he's going to be awesome when he gets up to the main roster, assuming they let him be. I still stand by if they find because he sold that shirt on the Indies that had his checklist of shit.
00:22:10
Speaker
And the last one was the only one unchecked on his list, and it just said, retire Brock. And that was on the shirt he was selling in the Indies. So now that fucking Lesnar's back, can we have that? Can we give Matt Riddle this thing that he wants that I think we all agree would be awesome?
00:22:29
Speaker
He was teasing it on social media. He was teasing that he was gonna be on Monday Night Raw this week to confront Lesnar. It didn't happen, but I think he's pushing for it to happen. Or at least he knows that his fans are aware that that's a thing he's wanted to happen for a while via his t-shirt. Speaking of his tweets, did you see his tweet this morning about Goldberg? God damn right I did. Made me like him even more. He took a fucking swipe at Bill Goldberg, which is a quick way to get into Derek's heart.
00:22:59
Speaker
because Goldberg had him blocked on Twitter and he said can't wait to see how good you wrestle this Friday. Derek immediately knows that means Goldberg can't fucking wrestle and we're all in on that joke and that's fucking hilarious. However, the joke's on us because Goldberg's gonna go work a 30 second match and probably make two and a half million dollars doing it.
00:23:23
Speaker
God, today I said to Leah, I said, I'm sure Ambrose is going to Japan to do a 15-minute match and then just immediately fly back. Like, can you imagine flying there for 15 minutes? But then I think about Bill Goldberg flying to Saudi Arabia, probably on a private jet, go out there, he is gonna maybe spear Undertaker, who gives a shit, and...
00:23:48
Speaker
Like, I can't even fain. The only thing on the Super Showdown card that I would even consider watching is that clusterfuck of a battle royal they're having, and I hope to God they start all 50 in there at the same time. Oh, they're doing a battle royal I didn't even know. Yeah, they're doing a 50-man battle royal, Derek. That's fucking dumb. The greatest battle royal you've ever seen, and I believe Matt Riddle's in it.
NXT Ladder Match and Tyler Breeze's Return
00:24:17
Speaker
Lovely. Lovely, lovely. Garrett, what was the next match on this takeover card? Was it the ladder match? Was it... Was it the ladder match, or was it Tyler Breeze and Velveteen Dream? I think it was the ladder match. You're right. Once again... Oh, I'm sorry, go ahead. I was gonna say, if you guys haven't seen TakeOver, which I'm sure you have,
00:24:41
Speaker
This could easily be considered Match of the Night, right? Oh, for me it was. I mean, you could argue the main event as well, but to me, this was Match of the Night probably because when I saw the teams that were listed in it, this was another one that I'm like, there's no way I'm gonna give a shit about this. So, I may say this a couple times in this podcast, so forgive me if I'm a little repetitive, but every now and then,
00:25:07
Speaker
You had made the comparison a few weeks back. You said that it seems like we are pushing pro wrestling in the direction of being more like Cirque du Soleil with a lot of high spots and acrobatic athletic maneuvers. Every now and then, I love a match where it's so fucking mean and sloppy.
00:25:31
Speaker
Guys are just dumping them getting dumped on shit awkwardly falling off shit stumbling grabbing guys chucking them this fucking ladder match had all of that and then some and Everyone was fucking awesome in this and it was brutal and I
00:25:50
Speaker
I don't know what's the guy's fucking name. Who did he did the fucking dive out of the ring and he basically speared the ladder and I he did he did that and I thought he's fucking dead.
00:26:08
Speaker
It was the most brutal. I'm like, I don't know where you get the courage. Like I get, I think that's again, it's the thing I take for granted when I watch pro wrestling is that because it is predetermined, because the guys know what they're fucking doing to themselves, you have to willingly.
00:26:23
Speaker
in a situation where you're not actually in danger. Nobody's trying to actually hurt you. You're performing. You're putting on a show. And as part of that show, you have to willingly hurdle your body through the air and be like, OK, this is going to end with my shoulder and my face crashing into that metal ladder. And then I'm going to fall to the ground. And people are going to love it.
00:26:45
Speaker
People are gonna be so into that shit and it's gonna hurt. And then some asshole online is gonna make some snarky comment about that was being, that was a botch. Garrett, this ladder was such a fun fucking match.
00:27:01
Speaker
Yeah, so if you remember from Money in the Bank, Finn Balor was the one taking the crazy ladder shit. Oh, yeah. This one I felt like Kyle O'Reilly decided he was going to be the guy, whether or not he chose to. Now, God, one of the things you were talking about is when that ladder got tipped over and he just fell over onto it as it was tipping over.
00:27:24
Speaker
It was nasty. And then, oh God, also- The double German suplex? Yes, the fucking forgotten sons have, they are, they just need to have more ring awareness of the people around them because they're gonna fucking kill somebody with that ladder. They almost decapitated Kyle O'Reilly as they just launched that ladder while they're both taking German suplexes wearing that ladder like a necklace.
00:27:50
Speaker
Make no mistake, Kyle O'Reilly is a professional, and that man bled from the back, from the face, and from the mouth during this match. And I'll always have a soft spot in my heart for Kyle O'Reilly, because anytime I wore a blues hat to PWG, he would always stop me and talk about the blues.
00:28:12
Speaker
Does this mean he was a Blues fan or was he just a hockey fan? I think he said he used to work in St. Louis a lot or lived in St. Louis. Fair enough.
00:28:22
Speaker
Um, so yeah, I guess street profits end up winning this match. But if you haven't checked this one out, because holy shit. Okay. The good sloppy spots and this fucking fucking banger of a match. I, okay. I really like the street profits and I think we all know that there is a street profit that everybody likes a lot more. Yeah.
00:28:47
Speaker
I believe when I was talking to John, he texts me and told me that he's the, there's the Wesley Blake of the street profits. And at one point, cause I actually, as I was texting with John, as I was watching this and I said, that guy better do some shit in this match because he better do some crazy ladder shit because his buddy's really carrying him. And it wasn't his big thing. He speared somebody at the end of the match out from under the ladder.
00:29:15
Speaker
and that was that looked fine but earlier in the match his high spot was jumping off the top rope onto a bunch of guys really miss style he really gave a miss dive where that guy was up there and just had a look on his face like i don't do this
00:29:32
Speaker
they should have a checklist when you're down in the performance center like they make you jump off shit and then they should be like that looks like shit never do that in a match you you don't make that look like it's natural and other guys they get the stamp of approval and they could do it anytime that guy was not a natural diver
00:29:49
Speaker
I'm happy they have the titles. I mean, I like that those guys kind of left NXT for a minute, went back to the endies. You know, they went to evolve and evolved and into what they did. And those guys are talented, especially one of them. So I'm excited to see where they go. What did you think and how do you feel about them officially sending talent from the main roster back to NXT the way they have with Tyler Breeze?
00:30:20
Speaker
Is he there forever? Is that confirmed? Like he is just an NXT guy again? I mean, I don't know if he's there forever, but I mean, it makes sense that he's there for now. I mean, obviously working this match with Velveteen Dream, he's gone back to his old character that he had when he was an NXT and when he was a staple there. Is he the same character? He didn't have the frilly pants anymore. He seemed, he seemed a little like slightly more serious.
00:30:44
Speaker
Well, I mean, maybe for the purposes of this match, but he's got to remember, he's been one half of the fashion police the last couple of years. So that has been a couple of years, hasn't it? It has. And with Fandango being out with an injury, I mean, I think they've kind of let him go back to, I mean, good for him because it means on some level he got to work a really long match for the first time in a while. A solo match one on one. And I thought he and Velveteen actually put on a pretty damn good match.
00:31:13
Speaker
I agree. I mean, it's nice that Tyler Breeze did get that opportunity to be able to show everyone, hey, I can still do this. You just haven't seen it in a while. Right. I don't know. I don't see him as a guy that's going to like climb the ranks and be the top guy there because they just have too many new top guys coming in all the time. Right. But not everybody gets to be that top guy anyway, regardless of how good you are. So.
00:31:39
Speaker
I don't know, I think it was an interesting dynamic. I think it's them testing the waters to see if they can turn NXT into a brand where they can actually send guys down, or it doesn't kill them, or it makes them more exciting. I don't know how that's gonna work, but this was definitely an experiment, and I thought the match between Velveteen Dream and Tyler Breeze was good. Obviously, Velveteen Dream retained. They had the respect selfie at the end. The respect selfie. God damn right.
00:32:07
Speaker
Hey, are you still into Shayna Baszler being Women's Champ? Because guess what? She still is. I was thinking about that. I didn't realize how long she's held that. I mean, are they trying to get to a point where she holds longer than Asuka? Or I don't really know where we're headed with this. Who do we have? Well, keep in mind, she did lose it to Kairi Sane for a little while. Yeah. Oh, shit. That was like a little while though. Yes. It was like a month or so.
00:32:36
Speaker
Damn, I forgot about that because it just feels like she's had it so long. But honestly, it's a title reign that has felt long, but it isn't a super noticeable blemish or anything.
00:32:49
Speaker
No, not at all, because it feels like it, I mean, I'm not in a bad way for Kyrie, but they booked it to kind of be like Kyrie got lucky and she got the title and it gave her a big moment, but it didn't hurt Shayna and she's continuing to dominate the women's division on that brand. And I don't know, it's been a while since you've seen them do this where they've had one character kind of control, I mean, I guess other than fucking Brock on the main roster.
00:33:18
Speaker
but now Shayna's kind of a badass. She is a badass and the MMA thing, she's legit. I don't know, there's been so many women, Bianca Belair grew on me so fast and she was the one I was hoping to take the title from her. And when she didn't, I just had no clue who it was gonna be. So now I'm just kind of sitting back waiting until we find out who they think is gonna be the next person.
00:33:46
Speaker
Right. I was happy to see Candace make an appearance in that match. Yeah, yep. Which she was managing what, Io Shirai? Or came out to be her buddy or something like, and Io Shirai at the end is trying to make Candace do heel shit and Candace looks unsure, but it's like, all right, guys, here you go. Take a chair.
00:34:07
Speaker
Speaking of Candace, we, not to like leave the takeover discussion, but Joey Ryan, you know, he made his announcement that he chooses the indies, that the blonde girl that's been missing from his life is all of us and it is indie wrestling.
00:34:26
Speaker
So you have a theory. I do. My prediction is he will come to AEW, but it will be after Candace's contract runs out and the world's cutest tag team will return. So are you assuming that Candace LeRae is not happy with where she's at? It's hard to say because her husband's in such a great spot. Well, but I mean like you're assuming that because she signed there to begin with.
00:34:55
Speaker
and she hasn't really had much time or a moment, what makes you think that she's just gonna drop everything to go be with Joey Ryan again, to go to AEW as the world's cutest tag team? I don't know if she's good friends with the Bucks, the Bucks have said, because I remember this was actually asked at one point, if you could, it wasn't even, this was before even asking, you know, like, who do you want to bring to AEW? They were asked if you could have
00:35:21
Speaker
any female joined the Bullet Club, who would it be? And they've said Candice LeRae. And then once again, when they asked if you could sign any female wrestler to AEW, who would it be? And I believe one of the bucks again said Candice LeRae. And I think that they see the potential in her and see that how likable she is. And if you think that they will always have a spot reserved for her there.
00:35:43
Speaker
I think so. I mean, they had, to me, one of their most memorable matches is them versus world's cutest tag team. So I would love to see if we got not only Candace at AEW, but in an intergender tag team, where you would actually get to see her go up against people like Pentagon and the Young Bucks. And taking that like the intergender tag team thing mainstream. Yeah, I think that could be a cool thing if that is allowed on TNT.
00:36:13
Speaker
So let's get right into it here. Main event to take over is Johnny Gargano versus Adam Cole 2 for the NXT Championship.
NXT Championship Classic
00:36:23
Speaker
Promo package for this was pretty fucking rad. I mean, I'm not saying that the other ones weren't, but this stood out to me for whatever reason.
00:36:30
Speaker
Really good job hyping this match where the idea is can Adam Cole beat Johnny Gargano by himself? And it was pretty hard to top that match they had last time in New York. But holy shit, this was fucking awesome.
00:36:50
Speaker
Every fucking match on this card, Derek, I thought to myself, I've seen this matchup before, I'm not that excited for it. Every single match. I mean, and like with Shayna, it was like, you know, Shayna is probably going to win, not super excited. This match was, you know, the same thing once again, fucking wrong.
00:37:11
Speaker
It felt like another match that at the end you're like, well, they did another classic. It's their NXT is I feel like at least once a show puts on a very memorable classic match to the point that it's hard to remember all of them. And that's true. And that's a good problem.
00:37:34
Speaker
It is a good problem. I will say off the top of my head cuz there have been so many. This may have been my favorite NXT match I've seen.
00:37:46
Speaker
It's really fucking good, Derek. It's so good. And that's with all the Tommaso Champa Johnny Gargano matches, which were all fucking awesome. That's including Ricochet and Adam Cole. That's all the Velveteen Dream matches I've seen. And again, we just pointed out a million matches you could go down.
00:38:05
Speaker
This one, I thought the psychology on the match was fucking amazing. They beat the holy shit out of each other where the story is, you know, Johnny's got the fucked up knee and Johnny's been working over Adam Cole's elbow. And there's always the threat of is Adam Cole can actually. Keep this one on one and keep undisputed error out of the match is you see, this is the other thing. What is it? How do you get the audience to this point where
00:38:36
Speaker
the baby face and the heel are equally over. And so much so that like when the heel does win, the crowd still pops and reacts as though a baby face just won because they're that into the match. Like to me, that's what's amazing about pro wrestling.
00:38:53
Speaker
is that you can have a character who's the clear cut heel and people are so entertained by the match that it doesn't fucking matter because they're excited about the title change, they're excited to see a guy get his moment. And I think a lot of that too though has to do with just how entertaining Adam Cole is as a heel. Correct. Like I said, when I was at PWG,
00:39:19
Speaker
I always in my heart wanted to cheer for him because he got everyone so pumped and he's got a fun thing to do with him. And you want to be able to do that at the end and celebrate. But it is amazing that, yeah, you're right. It's hard to hate Johnny Gargano. The guy can take a beating like no other. I think after the Champa trilogy that they did, everybody's wondering, will his matches still have the same emotions?
00:39:47
Speaker
Yes, because dude is going to take a fucking beating from everybody, but also give it back in a way that you just wouldn't expect two guys of that size to like, they don't look, they're a lot smaller than they look. You know what I mean? Like when you're watching them, they feel bigger. Like I don't know what I'm trying to say, Derek, I'm dumb. Do you mean size wise or?
00:40:14
Speaker
I think they're star power and just overtakes how big they are physically to where they feel like they fill that arena. Like their charisma.
00:40:33
Speaker
Pro wrestling really kind of only works at the highest level when everybody is in on this. Like you know how people will talk about inside jokes and inside jokes only work if all the people know what the fuck you're talking about. And I think with the NXT crowd,
00:40:51
Speaker
And this has kind of always been the issue when NXT people go to the main roster is not everybody who watches Raw and SmackDown necessarily gives a shit about NXT, which is a fucking shame because it should be in their rotation regularly. But the NXT crowds, like the people that are there for those shows know who the stars are and know who they want to cheer for and they know who's the shit.
00:41:17
Speaker
And those crowds are so, that's the other thing. NXT crowds are fucking awesome.
00:41:24
Speaker
They're just so amped for every match. They're really good, I mean, it's night and day. It's so crazy going on a Saturday night from an NXT TakeOver crowd to the way the crowd behaves at a Sunday night WWE normal pay-per-view. It's where they kinda wanna rebel a little bit. They're not necessarily into everything. They're tired, three matches into the show. Sorry, I didn't mean to rant there, but it's just,
00:41:54
Speaker
No, you're completely right though, it is. There is a completely different vibe to both of them and the NXT vibe is so positive and everybody's going in just ready because they know they're about to see something killer. And on the other hand, you've got like the pay-per-view crowd that's headed to whatever pay-per-view ready to be like, this probably isn't gonna be great and we just spent a bunch of money on it because why?
00:42:21
Speaker
Do you want to know what the difference is, I think? Can I come up with a theory here that I would love to hear feedback from our listeners on? Yeah.
00:42:28
Speaker
There is a general feeling when you watch a takeover pay-per-view that whoever you're watching in a given match is going to give fucking everything to kill themselves to put on a damn good show and that you can expect them to lay ever- and I don't mean that like in a rah-rah fucking sports way like they're gonna give it their all because it's a fucking work, I get it.
00:42:52
Speaker
But you know that they're gonna go to whatever links they have to to put on an entertaining match and that they're going to take a lot of abuse if they have to for your entertainment. So you know you're in for the ride. When you watch a main roster WWE pay-per-view, there's always that underlying feeling that they're holding back because they have something else they wanna do down the line.
00:43:17
Speaker
Yeah, that makes, yeah, makes sense. That's, it's, it's why we felt that way coming out of the Nakamura styles match at WrestleMania last year. There's always a feeling of like, Oh, they're going to give me one or two big spots in this match. And then they're going to do like safe shit.
00:43:36
Speaker
and it never feels like the guys hate each other the atmosphere never feels intimate it feels like the 300 level is a million miles away and it's i mean we've talked about how the show looks and everything a million times but there's literally a feeling on the main roster of they're just gonna hold back to fuck with me and i've never gotten the vibe from takeover that they're gonna hold back for a later show
00:44:03
Speaker
Could that be too that their pay per views are so spaced out? That you don't get that monthly show that the feud has longer to build? But maybe, but I would also argue that the same rules should apply on the main roster, which is that if you need, this is what I don't understand.
00:44:29
Speaker
I see people and I'm talking, I have, you know, friends I've talked about this with about, I think I've talked about this with you. All I hear people talk about is long-term booking. I hear like long-term booking and I want my champions to have long title reigns so that the title reigns mean something.
00:44:48
Speaker
I just want to say to all of you, I don't see NXT fucking around with that model that you're talking about. And they are killing it every show. You would never think that it was just the last takeover that Johnny Gargano finally won the NXT championship. And he's already lost it. Yeah, nobody gives a shit. So what the fuck are we talking about?
00:45:13
Speaker
We talk all the time with WWE about how awesome that fucking roster is. If there's 15 guys that could potentially be Universal Champion, it doesn't devalue the title. If you're watching 15 guys, let them go work. Let them go wrestle and show how fucking awesome they are. And you're not gonna care if the title changes hands every month and a half, two months. If the match that got you to that point was a banger.
00:45:44
Speaker
Yeah. And that was a rant that came out of nowhere, but I felt like I stumbled on to exactly what I think. I think people are in love with the idea of lengthy title reigns, but I think when it actually comes to practice in 2019, people are bored with it after like a month and a half.
00:46:03
Speaker
I think if a match is good, people will feel like that person earned it. Like if the main roster did what NXT did, I'm not saying like do the same level of crazy shit in every single match, but have a match that feels important enough that that guy looks like he just fucking killed himself and worked his heart out, you would buy him as a champion. Correct.
00:46:28
Speaker
And that's absolutely correct. And NXT, you know, when you're getting a show of you're usually going to get four or five matches, the show is going to be about two and a half hours. And you know, when you're tuning into that, you're not going to get Samoa Joe versus Rey Mysterio at WrestleMania, which a match that I'm sure there were a lot of people excited about. I thought, you know, we were going to get to see the blowout match and you just see like some 30 seconds of bullshit.
00:46:55
Speaker
Well, you say that, but we also just, like what, a couple months ago, we got to see Matt Riddle knock the fuck out of Cassius Ono. And people went, but that was also, I don't know, did that work more though, because it was a surprise match? Maybe, maybe it did, but they still fucking went apeshit for it. I mean, I don't know, I think you're right.
00:47:15
Speaker
That's, but I think that goes back to what I was saying though. I think when you, when they give you that card, as much as you said like, well, there's matches I look at and I go, well, I've already seen that or whatever. At this point, takeover's reputation is that when you tune into the show, you're going to get entertained the entire two and a half, three hours, however long the show is.
00:47:38
Speaker
And when you settle in for a five hour main roster pay-per-view, there's always that feeling of like, oh, I have to worry about pacing.
00:47:48
Speaker
They're gonna give me a great opening match, and then they're gonna do some shit where the second match is kind of whatever, and then they're gonna have a surprise match where it lasts 10 seconds, and then these people, we've been waiting for this match for five years, so they're gonna put on a decent match, but they're gonna hold back because we know they're gonna do it at the next pay-per-view. And you might not get the match you want until the third installment of it. Right! Right, you have to sit there as a fan who's seen this shit a million times, and you worry about it, and you're aware of it.
00:48:18
Speaker
With NXT, it's just like, yeah, we're gonna let them go out there and be pro wrestlers for 20 minutes. And that's what they do, and that's why the show fucking feels organic and awesome.
00:48:31
Speaker
Adam Cole's your new NXT champion. He did it all by himself. Fucking brilliant match, another great takeover. We'll see where it goes from here. We talked about that for a long time, but I think it deserved it. Yeah, NXT deserved a little dick sucking. Yeah, they need to know they're doing a good job over there. They're the Joey Janela this week.
00:48:55
Speaker
So where would you like to take it from here? Cause we do have a couple more things we definitely need to talk about. So I gave you a couple of things and I said, Hey, do you think you'll have time to watch these? And I'm going to be perfectly honest with you, Derek. I got home pretty late today. You watched a match. I haven't gotten to see that. I'm very, very excited about, and I would, I don't know the end yet.
Best of Super Juniors Anticipation
00:49:17
Speaker
I didn't get to watch the finals to the best of the super juniors.
00:49:22
Speaker
You didn't get to watch Shingo Takagi and Will Ospreay? It basically just was starting right before we were recording as I was trying to catch up. And then when I thought, maybe I have enough time, can we delay recording? I looked and saw that there was an hour and 10 minutes left on the feed and thought, holy shit, how long is this match going to go? I probably can't delay this now. I'm going to warn you, not all that hour and 10 minutes was the match.
00:49:47
Speaker
Okay, well what happened in the match? I don't care if you spoil this for me right now, because I'm bummed that I didn't get to see it, and we're not gonna wait to talk about it. You're not gonna be surprised to know that these two kicked the ever-loving shit out of each other. And I think one of the things that's difficult for me to watch with New Japan matches, every two minutes, somebody hits a move on somebody that I think is their finisher, but it's not their finisher.
00:50:18
Speaker
Because it looks devastating as fuck and the crowd reacts like that's it. Do you think that's a problem with New Japan?
00:50:29
Speaker
I think it's like, I've noticed this with you. It's like watching, like whenever we talk about pro wrestling, like when I use this as a point of comparison, I'm going to until I die probably. I remember months back when I was like, can you just imagine if we got AJ Styles versus Seth Rollins? And you were just kind of like, huh, whatever.
00:50:49
Speaker
What the fuck? Like how desensitized do you have to be to not be excited about that? I think after you watched a lot of New Japan and you've seen guys just fucking knee each other in the face and elbow each other in the fucking head and dump each other under these fucking tiny little hard tables, I don't understand why the tiny tables are sturdier and like whatever.
00:51:16
Speaker
Osprey and Takagi beat the shit out of each other. And there are so many false finishes. Do you want to know who wins? Well, for how long did it go?
00:51:29
Speaker
Like was there, throughout the match was it like, was it pretty evenly split or was there like a big segment of like, this guy's definitely gonna win. No, this guy's gonna win. I thought it was pretty evenly split back and forth where they beat the shit out of each other. Obviously towards the end, the winner ended up taking over the match. Yeah, who won? That's the way it's supposed to be. Will fucking Osprey. No shit, I really thought Shingo was gonna take it. Will Osprey wins the best of the Super Juniors?
00:51:58
Speaker
So we're gonna get Osprey versus Dragon Lee. Hey man. Check the match out. Because holy fuck. I will say, and I think I said this after I went to that freelance show a couple weeks ago, is the RKO the new superkick?
00:52:18
Speaker
You see a lot of cutters and diamond cutters, like a lot of stone cold stunters and diamond cutter-esque moves now. The lost cutter's been around for a good amount of time, though. Isn't it very similar to Jay Lethal's? Yeah, Jay does that. Do they do the same thing? Does Osprey do the bounce off the ropes first? I don't know. It has the same feel to it. Are you over the diamond cutter a little bit?
00:52:44
Speaker
I'm not saying I'm over it. It's just one of those things where it's like, well, I, for all the times I defended the super kicks, I can't say anything now. I felt like I got into so many arguments when people were like, God damn too many super kicks. I was like, guys, it's fine. It's a fucking awesome move. It's a kick. Everybody should be able to do it. And then it's like the wrestling guys were like, Oh yeah, cool. Watch. Everyone has a cutter now. Well, it seems like a fun move to do.
00:53:14
Speaker
The coochie cutter. The coochie cutter.
00:53:18
Speaker
God damn it. Fuck. We haven't talked about Todd Chrisley in years. And he got a spin-off show for his kids. No, he didn't. Is there a second Chrisley show I don't know about? There's a second Chrisley show that I have not seen in a second. Well, why don't you go ahead and just tell me what this fucking show's about, Derek? Because I'm going to go watch it right now. I haven't watched a single fucking episode of Chrisley in California or whatever the fuck it is, where they send their kids to live somewhere in a mansion by themselves. I don't know, Garrett. I just see the previews.
00:53:46
Speaker
Like many of you out there, I have not necessarily kept up with Raw and SmackDown as closely as you would expect for somebody who has a fucking pro wrestling podcast.
00:53:57
Speaker
But you know what? That's why Ron Smackdown sucks, so we just remove it from the show and we added 15 minutes of bullshit at the beginning. Nope, we talk about you being sad hockey games. You can blame all of that on Ron Smackdown. When they start doing some shit that actually gets me back, we'll start talking less about ourselves.
00:54:16
Speaker
Well you know, you've got a lot in common with the next guy we're gonna talk about, cause his name is John Moxley, formerly Dean Ambrose, and he's got a lot of problems with Raw on SmackDown, and as a result, he has signed with AEW, and on top of that, he's working matches in New Japan against Shane, or Juice Robinson, I about said Shane Robinson for sure. Like Shane McMahon. See, that would be the ultimate blow to the McMahon family if Shane left for New Japan. That would be fucking awesome.
00:54:45
Speaker
When are we gonna get that? He goes for being so hated by the wrestling community and then he goes to Japan and Meltzer starts giving him five star fucking matches. He's working in jeans and showing off his...
00:54:58
Speaker
There's coast to coast. They try and do the like Monday night wars thing where you watch both at the same time, but really it's just Shane FaceTiming his dad at 3 a.m. in Japan. You would shit if you were watching a New Japan pay-per-view at 3 a.m. and towards the end of the show before the main event, Shane came out and he started giving the same speech that he did on Nitro where he's like, surprise, dad.
00:55:24
Speaker
Everyone in the fucking pro wrestling industry got sick of your shit and all your creative fucking miscues So I decided to buy your competition. That's right. I am the new owner of New Japan Pro Wrestling The whole crowd falls silent because that's just normal for them
00:55:45
Speaker
But then, oh man, that would be such a bummer. And what's funny is then he looks in the camera and is just like, just kidding, dad, I bought you this present. And then he calls out Okada and just puts a dog collar on him and makes him eat out of like a dog bowl and is just kicking him. He's like, this is what we're doing now, killing it, killing the business. Lay down, Ibushi, lay down. Zips his fly. You high-fived my dad, bitch. Guess who's a young lion again?
00:56:15
Speaker
So I'm assuming when you say you didn't get to see the finals, it means you did get to see Juice Robinson versus Jon Moxley.
Jon Moxley's New Japan Debut
00:56:22
Speaker
I did. I definitely put that on first. It's hilarious to me that Tanahashi J. White was a lead-in to Jon Moxley's New Japan debut.
00:56:34
Speaker
God damn right. Now, I want to put into perspective, I go into my job at 4 a.m. And when New Japan shows are going on in the middle of the fucking week, when I go into my job at 4 a.m., it is the weirdest thing for me to get to work, open up Twitter and seeing like my timeline, getting live updates of people just losing their fucking minds about a pro wrestling match. And I have to like go check to make sure I don't have the wrong settings on.
00:57:02
Speaker
where it's giving me things that happened like a few days earlier and it's like no everyone's raving about how great this match is and this is another example of a match where it's sloppy as fuck and I think that's gonna be Moxley style and that's not a bad thing where it's hard-hitting it's it's violent and I think I wasn't the only one I think a lot of people enjoyed this match I did see somebody give it four and a half stars I don't know if I would go that far
00:57:31
Speaker
but it was fucking fun. It is a jarring match to see in a New Japan setting because it feels very like WWE 90s hardcore, but I don't mean like nothing negative about that. Like it's like having these amazing matches. Like, like what you said, I mean, I haven't watched the main event yet, but this is kind of a weird lead in that New Japan has into their best of the super juniors juniors final.
00:58:01
Speaker
This is kind of weird hardcore brawl for a title where a lot of favorite line of the match though is Juice Robinson looking at red shoes and saying shut the fuck up.
00:58:16
Speaker
I would never tell Red Shoes to shut the fuck up. No, no, no, no. To me, the best line in the fucking match was after Juice tried to do something to Moxley on the table, the table doesn't break and he sets it up again and he puts them on it and you hear him yell, I'm going to break this motherfucker.
00:58:37
Speaker
because he was frustrated the table didn't go the first time. And I understand. You know, I've heard you talk about how hard those new Japan tables are. I don't get it. It's like a fucking magic table where it looks like it would be brittle and not something sturdy. And yet you'll see them do a spot on it and it it stands strong.
00:58:59
Speaker
I have to imagine that the combined weight of Juice Robinson and Jon Moxley coming off of the top rope should be enough to break a table. You would think. Not, it is not. It is not. It's enough for Juice to just take a real fucking chair shot to the face though.
00:59:16
Speaker
was it jarring just in general to see the guy who's been playing Dean Ambrose all these years suddenly entering to Japanese ring announcers and in a new Japan ring and not wearing jeans and a tank top
00:59:34
Speaker
not wearing shield gear he's out there and you know little pro wrestling tights with little barbed wire around the leg and uh basically ufc shoes pro wrestling shoes yeah he had on like ufc kind of trunks like the little matt riddle shorts
00:59:50
Speaker
Yeah, how did you feel about that? I saw mixed reactions to that. Yeah, I saw people not like him, but didn't Moxley used to, like, he used to wrestle in just black trunks, right? He kind of dressed like a young lion. Yeah, I don't know. I didn't mind it. I think him coming out there in the MMA shorts with just, you know, regular shoes, you know, like MMA shoes or, you know, wrestling shoes.
01:00:11
Speaker
I kind of like the difference of that, you know? Like, he's dressed like an MMA guy and we're all kind of trying to anticipate what is Jon Moxley in New Japan like? And it's like, oh shit, it's still Jon Moxley. It's still this like crazy brawler. He's just like kind of buff his shit now.
01:00:28
Speaker
I think if everyone's perception of him is based on who he was in WWE, if he picked this to just be as far removed from that as possible, I totally get it. It's like he Jericho'd himself and he said, well, what do people know me as? I'm gonna not be that anymore.
01:00:44
Speaker
which did you notice in the opening when it was showing because the opening to the match I guess the what am I trying to say like the promo package for it is in Japanese so when you're watching these you don't get English commentary or anything over it and you actually heard the person say Dean Ambrose
01:01:03
Speaker
Yes. And I was I want to know so bad what he said is he's like formally Dean Ambrose. And then throughout the the whole match, though, I mean, they referenced NXT. They reference WWE. They don't like they're not afraid to talk about it. But I mean, is that a should they be talking about it, though? Is this a bragging right that they have one of their guys that they the WWE really didn't want to lose?
01:01:26
Speaker
I don't know. To me, it's one of the things that WWE has been so bad about is they can't seem to make a decision on whether or not they want to acknowledge a wrestler's prior history.
01:01:41
Speaker
And it's to me, it's easy to work with it. It's, it's just found material. If you just acknowledge, Hey, this guy used to work here and he used to have these problems with this guy. And you can just build that into the story. And I think that it's cool that new Japan is willing to be like, yeah, he used to be in WWE. You all know what that is. We're not going to, we're not going to sugarcoat it. You fucking know what we're talking about. You know who this is. We're not going to pretend like you don't.
01:02:06
Speaker
And they even went further back in that and they said these two have fought each other in FCW. And they basically said the training ground for NXT or what used to be NXT. You know, NXT before NXT. Just hearing them casually say it is a little refreshing to acknowledge that other wrestling exists within the same universe.
01:02:28
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. I agree completely. I thought this match was brutal. I thought it was fun. Were you surprised that they put the IWGP United States title on Amber or Amber's Moxley? My bad. I was I'll be honest. I mean, I saw the spoilers for it before I watched the match or the spoiler of him winning. But when I got that, I was a little shocked. I mean,
01:02:52
Speaker
Do you think Juice is a little bummed out that that's who he had to lose to? Or do you think that's cool for him? I don't know. Like that's this match was bigger than when he fought Cody, right?
01:03:04
Speaker
I think so. I think that, I mean, worldwide Dean Ambrose or Moxley was a bigger name or a bigger face if you're going to go by the face rather than the name. I mean, maybe there's a selfish part of you that's frustrated that a guy comes in and immediately takes the title. But at the same time, it's also the biggest match you've had in your career.
01:03:24
Speaker
that's true so so I mean like it it's kind of like when people I'm gonna piss people off with this but it's when people complain to me about punk dropping the title to the rock to end his streak I say well who the fuck else was he gonna drop it to that was bigger than that yeah
01:03:43
Speaker
Like, it's hard to get too upset after a while. We were like, well, that was the biggest, biggest name he ever faced. Well, I think the question, too, with Ambrose going in was how long is this guy going to be there? And I mean, this could just last until October because I know he signed a multi-year deal to AEW. But is it the Jericho deal where he's going to do both? Because that's pretty cool, too. And I've heard that New Japan keeps saying that they don't have a working relationship with AEW.
01:04:12
Speaker
I don't know how true that is, but that's what I keep hearing. Well, it seems like they don't have a working relationship, but AEW has a good relationship with their wrestlers that they're not going to fault them for going and doing New Japan. Fair enough. I think that's the way to go about it, too. Keep wrestlers happy. It keeps the fans happy. We get to see some fresh matches. You know, I I'm into it. I'm excited to see where it goes from here. I don't know who I loved that Ambrose was hitting the young lions like Suzuki.
01:04:42
Speaker
Yeah. And when he hit those young lions, my first thought was, oh, Suzuki is going to be like, that's my deal. Fuck you. And then that's the match. So he makes his, you know, big, you know, surprise debut in AEW double or nothing, but he hasn't worked a match there yet, obviously. So he's worked a match in New Japan. He's probably turning a lot of eyes to the New Japan product by doing this match. People who previously had not seen anything over there.
01:05:09
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. And it's definitely a smooth transition into a because it's like, oh, that's that other guy that used to be in NXT and they don't feel like they're watching a Japanese wrestling match. Maybe they stick around and see the finale to best of the super juniors and get sucked in. And you haven't seen that. So you need to go back and watch that, dude. I plan on it like that's a tonight thing for me. I was really sad that I didn't get to watch it before the show. But you know what makes me laugh a little bit?
01:05:37
Speaker
that I did watch the other match you had me watch?
TNA Basebrawl 2005 Nostalgia
01:05:40
Speaker
Yep. I was just about to say that. You didn't get to see the main event for best of the super juniors, but you did get to watch TNA turning point 2005. You got to watch the baseball match Garrett.
01:05:58
Speaker
Yeah. Oh yeah I did. I. Sorry I thought you were having more lead in. No. This is I just I you had asked me what if I had any ideas to do this week and I'd been sitting on this one for a while basically since we started the podcast but we are we are balls deep in the middle of baseball season. Wink wink.
01:06:21
Speaker
And I thought this was as good a time as I need to bring up the baseball, which involved my favorite sports team a little bit, my favorite baseball player a lot, and some pro wrestling. If I said that your favorite baseball player looks like he could be James Ellsworth's more successful brother, is that offensive? I can see it a little bit.
01:06:51
Speaker
Cause he's not, he's not James Ellsworth, but there's some of that in there. Okay. At this point in TNA, where are they? So this is 2005. Is this like a time when people were like, no TNA had some good shit going on or was this like a dog shit? No, this was actually a good time for TNA. In fact, here's the fucked up thing. So.
01:07:13
Speaker
AJ Przyลski is my all-time favorite baseball player. This may surprise some people who know who that is. If you don't know who that is, AJ was widely regarded as the heel in Major League Baseball for years. Some of that was deserved, a lot of it was not. But he played for my favorite baseball team. And before I even knew, AJ was my favorite player for the White Sox.
01:07:38
Speaker
And I didn't even know that he was a diehard pro wrestling fan. And then when I found that out, made it even bigger, you find out that the trainer for the Chicago White Sox is Dale Torborg. I think he's still there. As a matter of fact, he used to wrestle in WCW as the kiss demon, which is hilarious that just a gimmick that was never meant to make you successful. That was you knew you were going to be there for three months or whatever. Well, well, kiss was doing something on the show.
01:08:05
Speaker
Yep, basically like you're like a walking pro wrestling advertisement.
01:08:11
Speaker
But yeah, so when I found out AJ was a big pro wrestling fan, by the way, AJ has done stuff on Monday Night Raw. I don't know if you knew this. I did not. Was it well received? It was. They had Bob Barker on as the host of Monday Night Raw and they did it in Chicago and they did the Price is Right on Raw. I think it was called the Price is Raw or whatever. And AJ was one of the contestants. So AJ is a big wrestling fan, but
01:08:36
Speaker
This is some peak TNA action. I was paying attention to TNA at this time, Garrett. I was a freshman in college, and Socks had won the World Series, and Christian. You know what a big fan of Christian I am. It's always surprising. I feel like I'm the only guy out there really waving the banner for Christian, but he does have some peeps out there.
01:08:57
Speaker
I'm still sad that you didn't meet him at Starcast. I am sad about that. I'm very sad about that. But I will say Christian had just made the hop from WWE to TNA and it was kind of a big deal at the time because
01:09:16
Speaker
Christian had a little bit of that Cody vibe to him where people felt like he got himself over in WWE and then they just didn't want to do anything with him because they thought he was undersized and couldn't hold down a main event spot. So he jumped TNA. So this was like right after that happened. So it was a big deal that Christian was there. There were a lot of eyes on TNA at this time and
01:09:38
Speaker
They decided to do this gimmick match in TNA called baseball, where they had Chris Saban, Dale Torborg, and Sanjay Dutt. They were managed by my boy, AJ Przyลski. And they had a six man tag match against the diamonds in the rough, David Young, Alex Skipper, and Simon Diamond.
01:09:54
Speaker
It was an eight minute match. No big deal. Nothing too fucking fancy. Finishing the match is AJ clunking Simon diamond over the head with home plate. And then the good guys pick up the win. They pile on top of them and uh, nothing's like I said, nothing spectacular about this match. There's some fun spots in there.
01:10:15
Speaker
And AJ at one point pulls somebody off of another guy while he's penning. And the referee's like, what the fuck's going on? And they have Bobby Heenan run over, who's just going, he didn't know. He didn't know. He didn't know. That's the other thing. Bobby Heenan is calling this match and getting involved in this match. If you didn't understand the level of TNA was at at this time, they had Bobby Heenan working there. I think this, I don't know, to me,
01:10:46
Speaker
There's so many times where you bring in celebrities or athletes in to do stuff with pro wrestling and it doesn't work and every now and then it's alright. I think there was a scenario where it was kind of fun. I think the idea was alright.
01:11:00
Speaker
Yeah. What did you think from watching this from an outsider's perspective? From one, all the behind the scenes stuff was hilarious to me. Like I was enjoying having to watch the baseball players act and like your team's manager being part of it and actually swearing.
01:11:20
Speaker
That's right, Ozzy Gain cracked Simon Diamond across the back with a steel chair and told him to get off the field, you piece of shit. And when you tell me now that he was kind of a heel on the field, it makes things make more sense of him being kind of a heel in the ring. But as he was in the ring, I'm just thinking like, this guy seems like a dick. Am I supposed to be cheering for this guy? He just AJ has that vibe about him.
01:11:45
Speaker
and yeah I saw after I watched the match like the first neck the next YouTube video to pop up just said like baseball's lovable asshole AJ presents your baseball's favorite asshole or something so what kind of heal shit was he doing in real life um
01:12:03
Speaker
See, this is one of those things where it's so much hype, and when you ask people, why don't you like him, people are just like, he's a jerk, he's got a punchable face. And that's basically it. I know I have a couple stories. The big one is, I believe when he was playing for the San Francisco Giants, but you only played for them for one year.
01:12:24
Speaker
There was a pitcher on his team. I can't remember who it is. I want to say it was Brett Tomko or something. But none of us know who that is, by the way. That's that's fine. He shared.
01:12:35
Speaker
He was on the same team as this pitcher, but he didn't really like him that much. And he apparently put a flyer out to the other team or like the memo or something, basically saying, first guy to hit a home run off this guy, I'll give a hundred bucks. And everyone thought it was a joke. And then in spring training, I guess it fucking happened. And he left a hundred dollar bill and the player's locker. See, I kind of like that. I like a little bit of a heelish figure in real life.
01:13:05
Speaker
AJ was controversial but he never did like it wasn't like he hurt people it wasn't like he was he was just a character and I think he got under the skin of a lot of people because he chirped and he knew the rule book back and forward and he could exploit things that most people wouldn't even think about on a field like getting interference for being a base
01:13:27
Speaker
None of this stuff is related to pro wrestling but it just AJ was a character that made sense and it was so awesome to know that he's a big pro wrestling fan. I was kind of expecting at some point for him to like take a dive on to somebody or do something crazy. I guarantee you if he had not been signed to Major League Baseball at the time
01:13:48
Speaker
He would have loved to have done something like that. Do you think this is a match worth checking out? Is this a match people need to go seek out? I don't know if the match is. I know that, like you said, a lot of the promo interaction material between AJ and the wrestlers and stuff. I think that stuff is more worth checking out.
01:14:11
Speaker
I don't know. It was fun. So at the end of this match, AJ cracks that guy with the home plate. And after he loses, AJ walks over and signs the home plate. Do you wish that you could have that broken home plate signed by him? I absolutely do.
01:14:30
Speaker
Do you think there's someone out there who can get you the ultimate sports memorabilia for you? A piece of baseball memorabilia used in pro wrestling? I would love to go to a pro wrestling event with A.J. Przyลski. That is a dream of mine.
01:14:46
Speaker
Sorry, I just thought of another thing out of the promos. There's a spot with AJ and Bobby Heenan, and he goes, okay, what's this? And he goes, it's a baseball bat. He's like, wrong, this is pro wrestling. That's a foreign object. He's like, you're right. I forgot.
01:15:02
Speaker
That's absolutely true. Yeah, I thought it was fun. Like I said, baseball season. I don't know if you knew this. I think they did another one of these like a year later after the Cardinals won the World Series in 2006 and they brought in Cardinals World Series MVP David Eckstein and they did something similar like a year later.
01:15:21
Speaker
I did not know that. T and A did this a couple times. Bass brawl, man. It's witty. Bass brawl, you get it? That's one of those things that you come up with a name and you're like, well, we have to do something with it. It's such good shit.
01:15:43
Speaker
So we're pretty far into this. I do want to say this. I did not get to see Southern Underground Pro this week once again because...
01:15:53
Speaker
of a very sad game. So what were you doing the night before? I was in a really sad game, Derek. I was just crying my eyes out. You know, like that night I got a new hat. I'm like, you know what? It's time for a new hat. I'm sitting there. Leah's got her foam finger on. And it's just sad. Leah had a foam finger? Oh, she loves foam fingers at sporting events. That was the first thing she asked, is like, do they sell foam fingers? And I said, yeah. So she immediately is walking around with a foam finger on.
01:16:21
Speaker
And... God damn. So I missed Southern Underground Pro's show this week, which the main event is Kevin- And we tried to watch this. I don't know when it comes on IndependentWrestling.tv, but every video I've seen of this main event, Derek, looks wild. It was Kevin Ku and Dom Gorini versus Marco Stunt and Cabana Man Dan. And what I don't think anyone was expecting to be a fucking deathmatch.
01:16:50
Speaker
You said that Cabana Mandan had a flip-flop covered in thumbtacks.
01:16:57
Speaker
Yes, and the next day on Kevin Koo's Instagram, he posted a picture that just said, these aren't freckles. I took a flip-flop covered thumb, a thumbtack covered flip-flop to the face. The dude looked like Raggedy Ann. Like he had those perfect, like freckles across his cheeks and nose, which were holes. They were in his face from getting smacked with a thumbtack, thumbtack flip-flop. That's hard to say.
01:17:26
Speaker
It looked like at one point Marco took a handful of Shabab like kebab skewers stuffed him and Kevin Koo's head Cabana man Dan's gushing blood This shit looked wild and it was for the the new Southern Underground pro tag team championship, which was revealed that night I can't fucking wait to see this goddamn thing and it has me wondering Are they doing this match to kind of get basement East prepared for GCW's appearance?
01:17:56
Speaker
they're warming it up.
01:18:15
Speaker
in Nashville.
Effie vs. Orange Cassidy
01:18:16
Speaker
I have wanted to see Effie come back so badly since his Southern Underground Pro debut. He is such a good wrestler, like just a fun wrestler to watch. He's very flamboyant. He has a really cool purple spiky jacket and he's taken on Orange Cassidy. I can only imagine how goddamn fun that's going to be.
Independent Wrestling Discussion
01:18:37
Speaker
IndependentWrestling.tv, man. Which- Are you gonna plug that again? I am gonna plug it again, because since I couldn't find that match, I ended up watching a show from last year that was like American Rana, I believe, 18, the main event, Joey Janela versus David Starr, and his final death match, which was a no rope barbed wire match.
01:19:03
Speaker
Garrett, I don't like watching matches with a lot of barbed wire. I always feel like I'm gonna see somebody's back get ripped off. Yeah, you see that a lot in this. And they did this thing, they have this perfect camera view two times where once it's happening to David Starr, once it's happening to Janela, you just see the skin pulling out way too far and you're grossed out. And the other immediately goes and just whips their head down for a DDT to where that barbed wire tears through their flesh.
01:19:33
Speaker
And just so you know, who is on commentary for this match, Derek? Nick fucking Gage. A man that you got to throw up a middle finger with last week. And now, officially, my two favorite commentators of all time, Nick Gage and Chuck Taylor. And I would love the commentary team of those two, because I'll tell you this, Nick Gage, pretty serious on commentary.
01:19:59
Speaker
I'm surprised you didn't throw Kevin Steen on there. He was trying to talk to the Young Bucks to their entire match while on commentary. Nick! Nick! Nick! Nick!
01:20:13
Speaker
But yeah, Nick Gage being on commentary for this deathmatch and just him showing respect for two guys who aren't typically known as deathmatch wrestlers was a hell of a lot of fun. Also on that show, you got to see a tag match that did involve Matt Riddle fighting Nick Gage. This was at Beyond Wrestling. This was my first time watching their promotion. Looks like they got some really interesting shit going on over there, so might check out some more Beyond.
Social Media and Community Engagement
01:20:42
Speaker
We are so deep into this episode, Garrett. Plug our social media. Let's take us out of here.
01:20:58
Speaker
Twitter. I am at Gartet on social media. Derek is at Halloween helping. Remember, please rate, review, subscribe. It really does help us out. Helps the show. We're giving you this free every week. We're giving it to you for free. This shit ain't free for us. This shit ain't free. Still waiting on that fan fiction.
01:21:15
Speaker
Yeah, we still waiting on. Yeah, if you really want to do something nice, write us a fan fiction. Let's hear a story of Derek and I fucking. But if you don't want to do that, just leave that review. Tell us something you want us to watch the weirder, the better, or just a really great match you want us to watch. I don't care. We'll watch whatever you want. It'll be great. You know, you know, it'd be a good idea, Garrett. We should have a contest or to see if our listeners can design us a sweet new logo.
01:21:43
Speaker
Just put these guys to work. Put these guys and gals to work. Just take advantage of our listeners. Take advantage one listener at a time, but not in a weird way. We're good. We're good. I'm good boy. I'm good boy Garrett on the streets and good boy Garrett in the sheets.
Episode Close and Banter
01:22:00
Speaker
I'm very boring in the sheets. And then you're even better. What is the city... Uh, hit our goddamn music, man. No, no, no, no. Not yet. Not yet. No? What is the city that's gonna make me shitty? Like, what... Ah, that's... I didn't want that to rhyme like that. But, like, if I go to Vegas... It's such good shit! It's such good shit! If I'm a good boy in Vegas... Like, where... You're an asshole in Seattle. It's like, I'm a good boy in Vegas? I'm a butthole in Branson.
01:22:29
Speaker
That's probably true. Really, I guess I held off on you saying head or goddamn music so that I could make a joke about Branson, Derek. I'm sorry about that. That's okay. You want me to say it now? Yeah, I think now feels appropriate. All right, let me try this out. Head or goddamn music? That's some good shit.
01:23:22
Speaker
you