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Star Trek the Next Generation - In Theory
36 Plays6 years ago
Patrick Stewart's Directorial Debut is an interesting episode where Data is faced with having to support a romantic partner when his fellow crew member, Jenna falls in love with him. The whole thing is painful and funny and even sad to watch and to top it all off the Ship is dealing with Dark Matter in a nebula that can threaten everyone's lives. Find out what my guests and I think and let us know what you think of this exciting episode.
Recommended
Transcript
Intro and Star Trek Discussion
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Starfleet Boy, where we have a casual and informal discussion about our beloved series, Star Trek.
00:00:34
Speaker
Oh shit, it was like negative seven before we were live on the air. Hello, and we're back. On another exciting episode of Starfleet Boy where we have a casual and informal conversation about Star Trek. Star Trek the next duration is our focus and today we are talking about the penultimate episode of season four. That means the one before the last.
Complex Vocabulary and Hangout Setup
00:01:00
Speaker
Um, I love that word. It's like, uh, I like the other word. What is it called? Petrichor, which is the smell of dust when it's about to rain. Are those related? No, penultimate petrichor.
00:01:16
Speaker
petrichor cellar door anyways we're talking about the episode in theory and I started the hangout right away normally we do a little like catch-up time and stuff like that and it's it's twofold I feel I did it for two reasons one we could catch up
00:01:37
Speaker
you know, like not on the air public stuff if we even have that off after the episode.
Audience Feedback and Controversial Topics
00:01:44
Speaker
And also because it's like nine o'clock and so I want to like get our full energies into it. So I hope you don't mind that abrupt start. No, all good. We like to go late. We're loaded up on synth, the whole ready to go.
00:02:00
Speaker
I'm glad you remembered. Hey, I gave you guys another data episode to watch. Because I think it's kind of cool. I know you can't watch the show, or you guys haven't really been watching the show in order. So I think it's cool if there's at least some kind of thread tying it all together. That is nice. It's very
Data's Romantic Endeavors Begin
00:02:25
Speaker
thoughtful.
00:02:25
Speaker
For our audience who I'm talking to, you've seen them before if you're one of our very few return audience members. Oh, don't short sell yourself. Please. Hello to all our fans. Returning for the umpteenth time. There is a fan of you guys because I never got such a
00:02:50
Speaker
response as I did to your last episode. That's true. Our last episode was cause for controversy. Yeah, I decided in a previous episode I kind of almost brought it up because several Starfleet Boy irregulars know about this situation and I decided that
00:03:13
Speaker
I'm not going to go fully into the details because we just can't give... I just don't want to give that energy to our show. Yeah, I agree. But I will just say it was very interesting and so I feel like, yes, there are fans, especially of you guys. Definitely. Big, big. And I'm your biggest fan. That's cool.
00:03:39
Speaker
Wow, Jamie's so confident. No, I mean, you are. He's right. I have a lot of notes for this one. Do you guys either of you guys want to do the episode summary or should I do it?
00:03:54
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I can do it in a nutshell unless you... Yeah, go for it. Okay, so basically the episode opens with Data repairing some torpedo stuff with Jenna. Is that right?
00:04:11
Speaker
Yes. You gotta be more confident with your story. I just wasn't sure if it was a first name or a last name, so Jenna. Jenna DeSoto. Jenna DeSoto. Cool. That's such a Star Trek name.
00:04:27
Speaker
Yeah, and so basically she makes this comment about like having been asked to dinner by her ex And she asked Data to recite the list of reasons why she did not want to be with her ex She's like clearly lonely and tired of being alone, but also She's just been in a bad relationship
00:04:54
Speaker
With Jeff, Jenna and Jeff. That's right, with Jeff. So I'm not sure if Jeff is a character we ever see at any point on the show. I don't recall. I don't think so. Yeah, okay. So he's just Jeff, you know? He's just red-shirt Jeff. And yeah, they kind of get to talking and...
00:05:15
Speaker
And I think she, in passing, she needs a man. She wants a man. And Data's kind of like, yeah, OK. That's not me. And then the episode starts. Credits take like 10 minutes.
00:05:38
Speaker
And then we get to, let's see, it opens with like a band recital, right? Is that the first thing after the credits? Actually, it was a quintet. Oh, OK. I'm sorry. Is there music available on Spotify for streaming? Apple Music? Yeah, it's Reicher. So if you want to look it up, it's Reicher's Woodwind Quintet in E-flat major. Wow.
00:06:07
Speaker
So clearly you did look this up, yeah. Are you impressed? No, if you turn the subtitles on on Netflix, it tells you the name of the freaking song that's playing. Oh. That's crazy. So this was actually a first for me. I'd always wondered what's that piece that's playing. And then the pogo thing I sent you later.
00:06:26
Speaker
I didn't know what that sample was until I saw this episode. I'm like, holy shit, that's the song from the pogo. And that's what Data's singing. And that's an aria from La Boheme, which I didn't know until tonight. So I'm super stoked about all the music. So everything's coming together right now. Yeah, sorry. I didn't mean to interrupt. No. Go on with your awesome. No. That's cool. I'm glad. This is the information listeners want. So let's see. We have band recital and then
00:06:55
Speaker
Uh, I, I'm, I'm not even sure what happens. That's basically data. Oh yeah. Okay. Can I cut, can I cut in? So then there's like this other couple and they ended up going to like for drinks or something. And at some point Jenna like puts her arm around data and she's being very like chummy. What I would say with him and very like, um, awkward.
00:07:20
Speaker
Yeah. Well, he's kind of awkward and the funniest, I think one of the highlights of this episode is when he winks. Yeah. Um, so he does this thing. He tells that he says something and they laugh and he winks. And anyways, that was my little, sorry.
00:07:36
Speaker
Yeah, no, he gives a really good wink. I took that note down. I was going to get to it later, but I mean, we'll get back to it. But basically, yeah, we can just, yeah, I mean, get through the summary. You're doing a great job, by the way, both of you. I like that you're all three of us, I think, are doing a great job. Yeah, definitely are. And we're all carrying even portions of this.
00:07:57
Speaker
Yeah, so Jenna and Data end up going on a date of sorts. Not before Data, of course, goes around asking every single crew member on the ship about whether or not he should try to have a romantic relationship with Jenna.
00:08:20
Speaker
And so they try, they go on a date and it kind of works and Jenna's into it. And then there's this whole other plot with P-card that starts about halfway through the episode, which is...
00:08:34
Speaker
Kind of weird like I didn't even realize he was going to be in the episode. I knew there'd be a subplot. I just wasn't sure like Where how it like it would find itself into the episode and by the end of the episode kind of like why it was there The black the black matter balls that whole subplot. Yeah. Okay, cool. Yeah
00:08:56
Speaker
I have a lot of thoughts on this, but it would like totally interrupt and derail the summary, so I'm going to try to remember to talk about it. Okay, cool. Yeah, I guess we'll get to it. So, yeah, Data's relationship with this, Jenna starts to develop, and they have like a few dates, and Data even tries to like program a subroutine that like emulates a solicitous mate.
00:09:24
Speaker
I believe is the wording that he used.
Dark Matter Subplot Unfolds
00:09:30
Speaker
And there's a scene where he's dancing and trying to seduce her and having a drink with her and stuff. And things get a little weird. He clearly knows how to go through the motions based on whatever information is available to him.
00:09:51
Speaker
But he doesn't feel anything, and this becomes obvious to Jenna. And by the end of the episode, she actually breaks up with him, citing his lack of emotion as a reason for the breakup. Yeah, and then something happens to Peacart and the rest of them. OK, so can I explain the subplot? Oh, yeah, go for it. So the subplot is essentially there's weird things that are kind of weird things that are displaced.
00:10:20
Speaker
Anomalies like a one-point date is cats like out in the hallway and then P card comes into his office and all the furniture has been kind of put on the floor and There's another like anomaly. There's just like little anomalies that happen and at one point there's like something kind of like major that happens and then they all try to figure out what it is and They all become aware of the fact of something is happening They're not sure what and I should add at this point. They're exploring a dark matter nebula and
00:10:49
Speaker
And so at one point they get this other like, we'll call it like attack type thing that's happening to them. And data is able to figure out what's happening, which I'm not quite even sure how to explain, but it's essentially just like that they're going through these pockets of dark matter and it's like warping the space around them.
00:11:10
Speaker
creating pockets of like weird space and that's kind of it and then at the end of the episode they realize that like they try to get out of that nebula but they realize that the dark matter pockets are everywhere so they try to do this thing where P card goes on this like mini ship to like help guide the
00:11:32
Speaker
Oh, the shuttlecraft. Shuttlecraft. That kind of works. But then at one point, the shuttlecraft explodes. So yeah. It's hard. And you didn't even mention the craziest shit where that woman gets stuck halfway between decks. Crazy. Oh, wow. That was like so it made me go, oh, shit, space is dangerous. At first, it's not all symposiums and quartets or quintets. It's also the dark side. And her facial expressions. Yeah, it's pretty harsh.
00:12:05
Speaker
I don't think she was CGI. I think she was actually like a dummy or maybe it was just someone who could hold still really Yeah, that was that scene felt out of place. It was so shocking
00:12:18
Speaker
It was, I remember as, I'll tell you as a kid, it was like, I was like, uh, yeah. Now it was like, okay. Yeah. But it was still like, Oh, it's pretty shocking when they cut. I think, I think they need it to create a sense of like urgency about this issue because otherwise it's just like, Oh, the furniture got misplaced or like got moved around, but then it's like someone actually died.
00:12:42
Speaker
Right. And I think you want a little horror in your sci-fi space drones. Totally. Well, Casey, I needed to balance out all that romance with a bit of horror.
00:12:53
Speaker
a little action and all. But then, sorry, so then, yeah, so you're absolutely right though, 100%, so they use the shuttle to guide their way out. They escape from the nebula and then comes the breakup. Yeah, what a sad scene. Data just doesn't know what's happening to him. He's like, oh, Jenna comes in, she's like, we need to talk.
00:13:21
Speaker
And, uh, she's like repeating things and data's kind of like, oh, you're repeating things. That usually means you're, you're thinking of, you're like distracted. You thinking about something else. And, um, she, uh, of course is kind of like, look, we need to stop doing this. I just got out of a relationship with an emotionless man and now I'm in a relationship with another emotionless person and someone who, well, who's, who's incapable of it.
00:13:49
Speaker
Emotions, human emotions. Yeah, and the acting is really interesting. You can see that Data's blank in the moments where he should be feeling something. And he literally has to ask Jenna, like, is this over?
00:14:07
Speaker
And she's like, yeah. And he's like, all right, I'll delete the subroutine. And it's like a really jarring moment. But it's great. I thought it was like a really, really cool thing to say. Next time I break up with someone, I'm going to actually say, OK, thank you. I'm going to delete my subroutine now on you. Yeah. It is really, but it is. It's like a burn. It's cold.
00:14:29
Speaker
It's cold, but what's beautiful is that, well, I guess we could just start right with that scene because it is the most powerful scene in the episode, and great job, excellent summary. I think we did it. We rehearsed.
00:14:49
Speaker
It's such a powerful scene and what's interesting is that depending on where you are in your life, you can read that ending in multiple ways. This time I actually like was like, I had that reaction of like, oh, that's cool. That's so harsh. Like, you know, like, yeah.
00:15:07
Speaker
Does he not real like he may not have emotions but does he not realize that that could elicit like a really you know a really sad emotional response from a human and then I wonder if data himself is somehow unaware that he is capable of things like love because When spot jumps on or yes spot hops up on his lap and he's like the scene ends with him You know petting is his cat
00:15:33
Speaker
Which was great. That was such an awesome top. It kind of looks like Arthur.
Data's Emotions and Symbolism
00:15:39
Speaker
And it's just like, you know, obviously now I have a cat, so I was like, oh. And he's an orange tabby, so they're both orange cats. But it was cool. I guess I have a question.
00:15:53
Speaker
You mentioned the acting being superb, and I think definitely Brent Spiner, the actor who plays Data, pulls off the unemotional thing. But he adds something special in his performance, which always makes you wonder if there's something there that Data's just not realizing. And it pays off if you guys don't mind me giving you spoilers. No, please. So, excuse me.
00:16:22
Speaker
Later and you'll you'll probably I'll probably assign this episode Data meets his his maker so to speak. Oh actually sorry This already happened Yeah, you did assign this episode to us. I did sign this episode to you. Sorry. I was like timey-wimey wibbly-wobbly He like makes it an offspring
00:16:46
Speaker
No, so Lal has emotions. But there's an episode where Data reunites with his father, Dr. Soon, and then he meets his evil twin brother who steals his emotion. The emotion chip that was intended for Data, his brother, Laura, steals it, and now he's insane or psychopathic or something like that. Yeah.
00:17:15
Speaker
But later in Star Trek Generations in the movie, Data does, with Geordi's help, reintegrate the emotion chip into his positronic brain. And it's like a kind of a neat thing because in this episode, in the scene where he's
00:17:40
Speaker
tasting that drink for Guinan and he just reacts like sort of with would like oh this is comprised of this this and that you know and then she's like what what does all that mean is it too sweet like he doesn't like actually tell her how it feels how the drink feels that's you know whoopee was great oh yeah she gave him such great advice
00:18:03
Speaker
It's such a good scene. And then later in Star Trek Generation, she hands him a drink with his emotion chip.
Listener Engagement and Sponsorship Humor
00:18:11
Speaker
And he drinks it. And he's like, ugh, this is awful. And she's like, do you like it? And he's like, more please. So there's a really nice little payoff from this, or like nod to this episode that happens later, which I, again, totally forgot about it. So that's why rewatching stuff is so fun sometimes.
00:18:36
Speaker
So you guys were watching this episode and Did you guys ever wonder at any point like is this what life with a sociopath might be?
00:18:50
Speaker
It might be, it might be. If anyone's listening and... Do you know, when you're a sociopath, is it something you're aware of and you're trying to work on or is it something that you have to be... I don't know, psychology people out there? Yeah, if you're listening, call in.
00:19:09
Speaker
We don't have that ability Jamie but I think one of these days we'll have more bandwidth at the Starfleet headquarters and I'll be able to do like a live event where people can hop on and chat with us and things like that. I'll see if we can experiment with that in a future podcast. Yeah, when you come to Montreal.
00:19:30
Speaker
Oh, yes. That's an ongoing for people listening. This is just an ongoing endeavor to get so hail to Montreal. So the go fund me is get so hail to Montreal. We're looking to hit our our our our objective of five hundred dollars Canadian to get so hail up here. So that's awesome. Yeah.
00:19:58
Speaker
Sorry, that's- If you actually start this GoFundMe, I'll fund it. You'll fund yourself? I'll fund it like every, whatever, I guess if you could do intervals, right? I'll fund it like a little bit every month and then we'll have met our goal, so I encourage you to do this. Let's do it. Yeah. I'll get my website guy going, you need a website guy to start a GoFundMe, right?
00:20:24
Speaker
No, it's all done. It's all on there. Yeah, sure you can just it just happens No, it's gonna be like an off-brand go fund me. It's gonna be like in my domain Go fund me with two E's, you know
00:20:38
Speaker
If this GoFundMe is successful, maybe we can start one for the photography. Oh, okay. So for listeners listening, we're also trying to start a not-for-profit organization, which is nothing like Instagram or any other just random grouping of people with cameras.
00:21:04
Speaker
We use Instagram as a tool, but we're a conglomerate. It's kind of like the very...
Episode's Emotional Depth
00:21:10
Speaker
It's like a responsible kind ethical Scientology. That's what the photography conglomerate is. You know, it's funny when we like first thought of this, like, I don't know how many years ago, I remember like I
00:21:26
Speaker
Actually talked to like people that are photographers about and they're like, oh that sounds so cool. Like I'd be interested So find the patreon Sign up become a patron and we're trying to hit our objective of $12 each month So far we've got two cents Coming in every month. So
00:21:52
Speaker
Wait, there's a real page. Wait, no. There's no Patreon. There's no Patreon. I got so excited. Well, there's no Patreon yet because my website guy is still working on it. But do we? Okay. Question. Question. I remember we did go on GoDaddy and like, did we buy the domain? Oh crap, we might have. Because I remember we did that. Do you remember this? Wow. Jokes imitate life. I might be the owner of the domain. I don't know if I've reviewed it. Because we like saved it. I remember that.
00:22:19
Speaker
That's amazing. Wow. Look at us. OK, that was a huge departure from us. A Star Trek departure. I know. Remember, we established in our last episode together that we have these friendship moments. And so the audience will occasionally witness our friendship moments. So that was one of them. By the end of this, by the time we're done with all the different shows, everyone will feel like our friend.
00:22:46
Speaker
Oh my gosh, that's such a beautiful thought, Jamie. Yes, thanks. Did you pull that from your programming? Yeah. That's part of a subroutine that you wrote. Long distance friendship. I thought that the episode
00:23:08
Speaker
had a lot of humorous moments and then of course it got sad and then it got dark so it was like a roller coaster yeah it was kind of a roller coaster of an episode which i think lended to its realness if if you will i feel like
00:23:27
Speaker
When I first saw this episode, I don't think I had any... No, I'm certain that I didn't really understand all the romantic stuff at all. I was just kind of like, really... And this is why I'm excited that you guys want to know about the dark matter balls. I was super interested in the science.
00:23:46
Speaker
That was like the thing and I think that's maybe why an answer to your question during the summary This episode might be actually a pretty good episode because Star Trek the next generation Was written in such a way that it could appeal to a younger audience as well as an adult audience, right? right and so now that I am an adult audience member and
00:24:10
Speaker
I do find a lot of things, I find myself going, oh that's really interesting and I had no like clue about it when I didn't remember this aspect of an episode because you know I had no clue about it so I am just as interested to talk about the romantic stuff but at that time at like age 11 or 12 I didn't really care like what date it was going through and in fact I might have, it may have influenced the way I acted later on in really
00:24:40
Speaker
I think a few of my first relationships were, but I think to be fair, I think that the mistakes data is making are kind of hyperized versions of mistakes we all really do make in relationships.
00:24:57
Speaker
A moment that I thought was particularly humorous, because it was uncomfortably close to experiences that I've had in my own life, was when he's trying way too hard, and he's like, am I not paying him enough attention to you? So he's going from this guy, he's oscillating between these extremes, and then he's like, maybe you're the problem. You're my mom. All that kind of stuff.
00:25:26
Speaker
And I feel like, you know, like my very, my first, my youthful, passionate, whatever, you know, you want to say about your youthful relationships. But many of them were heated in that same manner, you know, where it's like, you're not my mom. Right. Yeah. And I think there's a few things like I find also
00:25:49
Speaker
like try not to be your true self in a relationship. I feel like that is the thing where people just try to pretend to be someone else. And then another thing was like asking everyone's advice, because I feel like a lot of people do that. Which was quite funny. That was great humor too. So Guinan gives the best advice to her. She's like, there's really no advice one can give when someone's having their first romantic affair. I think she said something along those lines. That's true.
00:26:17
Speaker
But then Data is like not satisfied with that and he asked Jordy and his response is hilarious because he just keeps canceling out his argument by giving both sides. And then he's like, he's like, find someone who's better at giving advice. And it goes to the counselor choice scene, which is awesome because she kind of like, she kind of like hits home at what she says, I think was really impactful because, and I feel like parents say this and like, you know, our mentors say this to us when, you know, when we're,
00:26:45
Speaker
Endeavoring to get into like you know deeper relationships is that it's not it's not a test or a game or like some kind of experiment like this is something you have to be extremely Like sensitive to and you especially because you don't have the emotions to Understand it the way that a human would you know and so I think like you see him kind of like you know kind of take pause and then he references that he
00:27:14
Speaker
had been studying about relationship and then she changed relationships and then she changes her tone a little and she's a little warmer and she's encouraging even and she's like that being said you know try it out like see what happens yeah like it was a really cool scene I like that but then I loved Riker who's just a hundred percent focused come on
00:27:36
Speaker
He's such a pro, but he's 100% focused on like maybe you're gonna get laid and that's the best thing ever, Data. Yeah. It was quite dorky, actually, I thought. Yeah, but like you can see, he got so excited about the idea that Data was gonna, you know, be in like a sexual relationship as well. Wait, I have a question though, can Data have sex?
AI Development Speculation
00:28:03
Speaker
Yes, so that's established actually like in the second episode of Star Trek The Next Generation. The crew get a virus that makes them kind of like act inebriated and drunk, and so they lose all their inhibitions. And one of the characters, her name's Tasha, she died in season one.
00:28:28
Speaker
She she's just like, you know very serious all the time and so when this thing happens to her she like Completely is the opposite and she gets like she goes it like almost you know like the way they they portrayed it's like she was sweating and like Palpitating and she was like it's almost like she went into it like like an animalistic kind of like heat if you will and so she's just
00:28:50
Speaker
she's very horny and so she grabs Data and pulls him in because he's just like coming to give her like a message or something and she's like wait wait wait Data are you like capable of and he goes I'm fully functional in every way and and Trey and he's like and I'm programmed to provide sexual pleasure in something like 700 different cultures right
00:29:18
Speaker
So he's basically saying, yes, I'm also programmed to be a sex bot, which is how our first androids, 100%, and I wonder what you guys think, but like, it's already happening in Japan. Totally. The first humanoid looking robots are gonna be probably, and this is unfortunate maybe, or maybe it's not, depending on your perspective, they're probably gonna be sex robots. Oh yes, they are definitely gonna be sex robots.
00:29:43
Speaker
It's true. Audience, I wonder what you think. I would love to know. I'd hate to be the guy who has to repair those. That's all I'm going to say about that.
00:29:54
Speaker
I hope the designers create some kind of flushing mechanism that allows the androids to clean themselves maybe, I don't know. That would be nice. Maybe we should get together after this and have a brainstorm session and start a real GoFundMe, which is the world's very first realistic sex android. I feel like that would get tons of funding.
00:30:18
Speaker
Too much, too much. Yeah, maybe too much funding. I don't know why we're talking about GoFundMe. Oh, that's right, because we're sponsored by GoFundMe. That's right. Just like a few episodes, we were sponsored by Mind node. All right. No, audience, just kidding. And I don't know if any lawyers are watching,
00:30:45
Speaker
Maybe we are sponsored by those things, but I don't know if we're supposed to. I don't know. If you're a lawyer listening to this. We could be. How about this? The potentials there would be sponsored by this. If you are someone who works for GoFundMe or MyNote and would love to sponsor Starfleet Police, please send all inquiries to the email. Sponsor that shit.
00:31:06
Speaker
which is sohale at starflipoy.com or starflipoy at gmail.com or you can reach out to us on twitter at starflipoy or on instagram yeah slide into the dms slide into those dms that's a cool that's a cool phrase it's pretty sexual your headphones remind me a little bit of princess leah oh mine
00:31:30
Speaker
And this is a Star Trek podcast.
Star Wars and Solo Release
00:31:33
Speaker
I know. And Jamie looks a little bit like Chewbacca. Whoa! This is being recorded on the eve of Solo being released. Yes, it's true. And, Jamie, we no longer have a bank of episodes, so this will be also published on the eve of Solo. How's that? My goodness. Good luck. Good luck. Solo, the movie. I don't think it's going to do well.
00:31:59
Speaker
You don't think it's going to do well? I don't think it will do well financially. I think it's going to be phenomenal. I think it'll do well financially. So it's going to be awesome to have a follow-up discussion about it. And incidentally, I'm continuing my 40th birthday celebrations into this weekend. Here in the States, we have Memorial Day weekend coming up. It kind of starts unofficially on Friday, but I'm still working tomorrow. But then Saturday, Sunday, and Monday,
00:32:29
Speaker
We have Memorial Day weekend and on Sunday I'm going to go to Disney World to watch Solo there at Disney World and then I'm going to go to Star Wars Galactic Nights which is an awesome thing and if by any weird chance we have a Starfleet Boy listener
00:32:47
Speaker
You're there or you're going to Star Wars galactic nights reach out to me, please because I would love to meet up with you so yeah, that's gonna be on Sunday and then I return
Picard's Role in Subplot
00:32:58
Speaker
home on Monday and then I ship out again to Lake Tahoe to Attend and photograph a friend a dear friend's wedding. So that'll be cool. That's so cool
00:33:10
Speaker
That's my plan. That's pretty sweet. Speaking of like weird paths, I think we need to address P-card in this episode. Because that whole, that like dark matter storyline, that shit came in like, it was like halfway through the episode. Like I thought P-card wasn't going to be in the episode and then, um,
00:33:37
Speaker
Yeah, he just like halfway through the episode. They're like, what's happening on this ship? I mean, they talk about it a little bit. Majority right there. Well, it kind of it kind of fits the timeline of the episode. So like what I liked about this episode.
00:33:53
Speaker
And again, this is kind of like what I caught this time around. I've seen this episode maybe a handful of times, like less than a handful, perhaps. But what I liked about watching it this time, I guess I watched it with a little more intention, was to answer your question, I think that the subplot was actually kind of woven in there and maybe it wasn't successfully done, but like in a kind of like interesting way because
00:34:18
Speaker
You start off with Data and Jenna in the torpedo room and they're preparing this torpedo so that the crew can launch it into this nebula, light up the nebula so they can study some aspect about it because there's a lot of dark matter there so their sensors are kind of like
00:34:37
Speaker
not able to penetrate it, you know, and find out what's going on in there. And after, so there's a casual scene later on where they mentioned that the result of the, by the way, that was a romantic scene. I think that was an interesting scene because that effect was pretty cool. And she's, and like, it's the first time she's very vulnerable. She's talking to data. He's charmed her. And then that happened. She's like, that's so beautiful. And then she kind of looks over at him and I thought that was kind of cool and far as far as like showing where her head was at.
00:35:06
Speaker
Then you have the planet, then you have another scene where they're like, well, the results of the probe showed that there's several M class planets in the nebula and M class in Star Trek, which is short for Men'shar class, is a planet that has a atmosphere, basically an Earth type planet. It's an atmosphere composed mostly of nitrogen and oxygen and the conditions are ideal for
00:35:35
Speaker
humanoid type life forms to have developed on the planets, right? So that's when they hear that, when Data reports that information, in that scene, Picard says, oh, great, we can continue to, he kind of gets excited. And without doing the full investigation of the Nebula, he's like, we can continue to like, monitor the data from the torpedo.
00:36:03
Speaker
probe or whatever, but let's go and see one of these M class planets. So that kind of forces them, like that's the bad decision they made in a sense, was to go
Anomaly Effects and Picard's Leadership
00:36:13
Speaker
see this planet. And if you remember when they get to the, that's when the weirdness starts happening in the episode too, because right after that scene, they have the spot, you know, where the spot is not inside the quarters, right? And you're meant to think that, oh, did Jenna go into his quarters while he wasn't there, right?
00:36:32
Speaker
But then the computer says that no one has been in the quarter, so then that's where the mystery actually begins. But I think it's easily overlooked because it's like, it's like really kind of like, you know, not, I don't think it was like too overt, you know? Uh, yeah. It also just felt, it, hmm.
00:36:50
Speaker
Like yeah, but then wait. Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, I feel like maybe overt is the right word because I feel like maybe just a line of data being like is Jenna going through my stuff or I don't know just something to like
00:37:06
Speaker
Maybe connect the two plotlines a little bit more. Um, I don't think that was necessary. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, they're not related. It's kind of what I liked about is that like random shit can happen in space while normal shit's happening in your life. You know what I mean? Like here's data dealing with like trying to figure out this relationship thing. But in the meantime, like a mystery starts cropping up. That's true.
00:37:29
Speaker
What I don't like is that like, I guess you can explain that too, so it's fine. But initially I was like, why is it that like the anomalies become increasingly more severe, but I guess it could be more dense as they get closer to the center of the nebula. So that kind of explains that.
00:37:48
Speaker
But anyways, they get to the planet. The planet's not there. That's another clue. And then it appears all of a sudden. So as these black matter balls, which can be huge, apparently, they can be the size of a freaking planet, right? Pass over you, you get shifted or phased out of normal space, as it were, right? So the enterprise has like these little, you know,
Character Humor and Leadership
00:38:10
Speaker
Black Matter balls Traveling, you know through it. And so that's like the one of them could have been for a moment It opened the door and data's, you know quarters another one it shows it's actually after another scene It's like an it's like the scene where she brings him Oh where she comes into his quarters and she's like, oh you should have stopped painting. Remember that scene, right?
00:38:34
Speaker
after that scene she's all like happy because he did exactly what she wanted and when she walks away you see that weird thing happening on the on the wall there so then you know from there on I don't think I have to really talk about it because then it gets like pretty they start hitting you over the head with it after
00:38:52
Speaker
It's just kind of cool, but then what what was odd to me was but it but it was also kind of like badass is that like Picard was really insistent on flying the shuttlecraft, you know and he obviously he fails at it because it's such a complicated maneuver that he has to do but he does help to get the Enterprise so far where they can just kind of gun it to the end. I just want to add that I
00:39:16
Speaker
at the end when they like the thing explodes and they're like did we get him like no one for a second was like oh no like we all knew also p-card was just like yeah i got some good jokes to crack right now like he was like right about to die and he was like did i go you had a mindset of damn he's like he's like yeah yeah i don't know he's like kind of being cocky i guess but it's it built out of character
00:39:43
Speaker
I thought there was another thing that was kind of a little out of character, but I enjoyed it. There was two times actually in this episode, and I wonder if the writers weren't experimenting with trying to do something different with Picard because when Data comes up to him to ask his advice, he's like, I know you're looking for advice. As soon as I have some, I'll let you know. Oh, it's like snarky.
00:40:05
Speaker
Yeah, it was super snarky and then later when he when in his when one of the anomalies Passes through his ready room and the all his things drop off of his desk Pardon me Pick hard's like maybe it's a poltergeist and you know Which is something so ridiculous and then like you know like and he turns to work and goes like a mischievous spirit You know and I did think it was funny, but I also thought oh like I don't think they ever did that
00:40:35
Speaker
smoke like smoking up on the side I think that he would actually be drunk
00:40:46
Speaker
That's true. Like, I actually think that he, because as we established, they're drinking synthahol like crazy, so until an emergency situation comes up where they have to snap out of it, like when he was piloting the shuttle, he was totally fine. But like, before that, he might have just been like casual and really drunk. Yeah.
00:41:10
Speaker
I'm starting to wonder if everyone, except Data, is not just drunk all the time off of Syntha Hall on the ship. Yeah. There's a lot of drinking in Star Trek. I mean, there's a lot of drinking in adult life, so... It's true. There is a lot of drinking in adult life. That's just how it is.
Relationship Dynamics and Data's Experiences
00:41:30
Speaker
Cheers to that. Hey, there we go. The pathos. Not quite. Sadness. No. Sadness. Just plain sadness.
00:41:40
Speaker
I wanted to know, I have here in my notes a question, do you and Simon have anything that you might want to share that's a funny story about your relationship and maybe some hardships that you might have had in the beginning or struggles with misunderstandings, but obviously you've hammered most of those out now that you guys are married. You know what's a funny story that happened today?
00:42:06
Speaker
Oh, there was one today. That's awesome. It's super relevant. Oh, yeah, sure. Go for it. So we just moved into this apartment. We've been living here since Saturday. Congratulations, by the way. It looks cool. Thanks. So yeah, we've been living here for less than a week. In our front door, we have two locks, like one on the top and one on the bottom. And we got, like, Jamie's had the set of keys we've had for, like,
00:42:28
Speaker
like, since we moved in, then we had to get another set of keys for myself. And the top lock wasn't like working properly. And like, Jamie had told me like, oh, it's okay, we won't use the top lock for now. This is what I understood. And so and all the keys that I got all for like, they all look identical. And so I figured for now, I'll just take the one key that I need. And I know this one works, because the others all look the same. And rather than like, every time I come home, like putting four keys and trying to figure it out, I'll just take the one that I need.
00:42:58
Speaker
And so today I come home and I had like a really long day and I was at this conference and I was very much looking forward to coming home and relaxing. And it's like 3 p.m. and I like come home and I put in my key and then the top lock is locked and I don't have the key for it. So the door was an opening so I was locked out of the apartment.
00:43:17
Speaker
They called Jamie and he's like, I thought you knew the lock was fixed. And I was like, no, I didn't. When did you tell me? He's like, I thought you knew. Like, how would I know? So then I was like a lot. And it was so it was really hot outside today, actually. And I was like wearing a blazer because I was at a conference. I was really sweaty anyway.
00:43:33
Speaker
So then I was kind of hungry and I had bought a mango and I love mangoes and I was like, I'm gonna eat this mango and I get home. And then I realized that it'd probably be like 6 p.m. by the time Jamie gets home. And so I went to a park because I had no where else to go and I ate the mango with my hands. I felt so gross. It's like raw dog the mango.
00:44:06
Speaker
Oh my gosh, that's a great, thank you for sharing that.
Data's Emotional Complexity
00:44:11
Speaker
And Jamie, so how do you, are you gonna update your subroutine to like exclude mind telepathy? Yeah, that's exactly what I'm gonna do. No longer will I assume that the things I've deduced about the front door, I've also been deduced by my partner,
00:44:34
Speaker
I, you know what, I actually find data to be pretty relatable in that if you're emotionally awkward, uh, data is pretty much just a super hyphen version of you, right? Um, yeah, he's like, well, I mean, he's like a nerd kind of. Yeah, exactly. He's like every comic con convention attendee, like pre, pre it being cool. Like.
00:44:58
Speaker
pre-2005 or whatever. But fortunately for you Jamie, you actually do have human emotions. I do. So Simon doesn't have to break up with you. It's true. Everyone in this virtual room has witnessed my human emotion on at least a few occasions.
00:45:19
Speaker
This is true. I know you're human because I witnessed your emotions in France. I know, yes. So do you care to explain? I feel like that's a good story to parlay into this discussion. It's a good story because I want to say, first of all, that I was completely in the wrong.
00:45:43
Speaker
I don't know if I've ever admitted that to you, but I was definitely not I won't I'll let you take a little credit for for a wrongness if you want it like an 80 But if you don't want it, no, I'll take the 20. Yeah, you could take a 20 you could take 20. Okay, cool Alright, so we've decided mutually that I wasn't completely I was mostly wrong and so so
00:46:08
Speaker
I did this thing called the Camino de Santiago de Compostela and I met Jamie in France because Jamie was also doing the Camino de Santiago de Compostela and our friend Eddie who was on the show a couple of episodes ago.
00:46:32
Speaker
and Roxanne did it the year before so there's a lot of there's a lot of us that walk this thing and audience if you want to know more about the Camino you can write to any of us because as pilgrims we're happy to talk about the experience and or you can just look up the Camino that Santiago online and you'll find a lot more information than I had access to in 2010 when I did it
00:46:54
Speaker
With Jamie, but anyways, we're walking along and I had gotten injured in such a fashion where I couldn't really carry my heavy 60 pound backpack and so it became like a kind of a Mission and I had to I had to like ship it ahead to the next stage and there's a service for this they have like everything set up but the promise is that like
00:47:17
Speaker
Yeah, my the problem is that like my French all I had all I had learned at like all stupid Americans that travel to France is Right
00:47:30
Speaker
And in France, in Paris, that's great because most people are really, they think that it's cute that you learn that much French. So they'll try to help you out. But we're in like the the the lua, which is like the the the highlands of the lua valley and or the lua region. And and we're we're we're in the deep like the country country places of France. Very deep mountain.
00:47:55
Speaker
Rural friends. So every attempt at doing that came with consternation or miscommunication or whatever. And one time out of the kindness of his heart, actually more than one time, out of the kindness of his heart, Jamie would get on the phone and facilitate my shipping. And it was wonderful. And he did that for me. So thank you, Jamie, if I didn't thank you then. You're welcome.
00:48:23
Speaker
So, uh, we get to this one location and I forget we somehow it was raining and there was some kind of strife. I can't actually remember the, the real reason for the strife, but what it came down to is, um, I was behind Jamie and Eddie. They had gotten there ahead of me and they just kind of like had a little time to relax. And instead of saying hello and how is everyone? The first thing I say is like, Hey, have you guys seen my bags? Jamie, can you translate for me? And he goes,
00:48:53
Speaker
And he goes, I don't care about your fucking bag. Except, except, hold on. Wait, what else? Hold on. What did I leave out? You didn't say, hey, has anyone seen my bag? You said, where's my bag? Oh, where's my bag? That's what it's like. And like the bitch at the start of the sentence was implied. It was like, bitch, where's my bag?
00:49:15
Speaker
And also, real quick, we had been rained on, we had like thoroughly on our way there. Everyone was in a bad place. It was a bad mood day, yeah. Okay, thanks for reminding me about those things. So eight years later, guys, we laugh about the story so much that I forgot those pesky little details, but I'm glad you still remember Jane.
00:49:36
Speaker
I'll never be able to forget it. No, I know And then that led to like a little kind of I guess you could just say like our Jamie and I's first argument Yeah, it was like a real argument. We had to make a real argument and like we had to make up There's a photo that documents the moment. It's really interesting. It's in a steamy basement. We're having our dinners and
00:50:01
Speaker
I don't... What does that photo look like? I don't remember... You don't remember it? If you find some... If you can tell a little bit, put a little more color or detail into the story, I'll look it up for you. I think I know where it is. Yeah. Well, I remember that night. Did we duck or something? Or maybe the people who were staying at the place.
00:50:25
Speaker
I thought the reason we made up is because despite my horrendousness, I made you dinner. You definitely made me dinner at that point in the trip. You were like big on cooking dinner at that point. You were so into it.
00:50:40
Speaker
I think you had predicted, because we didn't know each other very well, and I think you may have predicted that, oh, this guy's going to be an asshole all the way and not... Oh, no, I definitely didn't. I was enamored when I met both of you, because I was like, Americans! Yeah! I'm not American. But it was nice to... I was stuck with a bunch of people.
00:51:01
Speaker
I had run into a bunch of people as soon as I got in France who were from Quebec where I'm from and it was just like didn't feel like a trip because I was just with a bunch of people who live like 30 kilometers away from me in
00:51:16
Speaker
and where I live in my home country so I was so excited to meet you guys because I can also speak fluent English fluent English and yeah I can also speak fluent
00:51:34
Speaker
I was like, oh, English speakers, I can communicate with them. And I was like, they're under the age of 40. And this would be nice. And so I was great. So I just like to interject and say Jamie wants to learn or do.
00:51:50
Speaker
Oh, Jamie, when are you going to start learning? We could learn it together because I don't speak or do. It'll depend on when I subscribe to Rosetta Stone, like when I can budget it in. But probably sooner than later. For those listening, if you don't know what Urdu is, just do a Google search. Jesus, just do a Google search.
00:52:11
Speaker
Yeah, we're due is a predominantly spoken language. Well, I haven't found that picture yet We're getting close, but there's this delightful picture that I did find which I'm happy to share With the audience here. Let's hear this. Okay We're good son. Oh there I am for anyone who's listening
00:52:34
Speaker
At home, that's a photo of me reaching for SoHale's dick in the middle of dinner. Looks like I'm going for a hand job. It's pretty great. I think you were genuinely trying to do a cool pose. I was definitely trying to do a cool pose where I lean on your dick.
00:52:55
Speaker
You both look so young in that photo. I look incredibly young, and so do you. We were just kids. I think I want to balance these two awkward stories with a very romantic story, and that is that during this Camino, this walk through France and Spain,
00:53:14
Speaker
The whole time Jamie couldn't stop thinking about you, Simon. You were like his, you were like the, the gold at the end of the rainbow. This is true. This is true. I actually recently. We actually, I think that's one of the things that like definitely endeared you to us was your devotion to Simon. Oh yeah. We hadn't, no one had met you at this point. No one, no one. It's crazy. Like later on that, like I never existed.
00:53:45
Speaker
That truly would be like data. That's so dark. That's such a dark thing. I love it.
00:53:53
Speaker
I mean, that could still be happening. Like, I could be still imagining you and so, Hale, like, I'm just projecting, you know what I mean? Or you've taken it further and you hire this local actress. Every time we either, like, when you travel to Seattle, you're like, oh, I'm traveling to Seattle, are you available this weekend? Let me squeeze it into my schedule.
00:54:17
Speaker
Yeah, and there's like a whiteboard somewhere with your whole story So she doesn't forget like any of the right. Yeah, you gotta learn your your character Yeah, like on the flight over I always have to like go over my lines that are at my back story. Don't tell them the secret
00:54:33
Speaker
Then you'd be creepy. That was another friendship moment brought to you by GoFundMe. That's a good campaign. A friendship moment brought to you by GoFundMe.
00:54:51
Speaker
I recently this is uh, this is just a time-killing story, but I recently like came home slightly tipsy on a night out and like just found a go fund me and donated to it at like four in the morning
00:55:07
Speaker
That's a really cool thing. Is it something worth? Yeah. Is it something worth others funding? It was something that came up on my Twitter feed. It was about it was a campaign for a U.S. immigrant sister in her home country of Kenya, I believe.
00:55:29
Speaker
to basically have her not enter a forced marriage to basically smuggle her out of a very bad situation. Wow. Yeah. I forgot that I had actually donated to it because it was like 4am and I was tipsy. But then I saw it on my credit card statement like two days later.
00:55:50
Speaker
And I was just like, oh, I'm a good person. Yeah, this is the right thing to do. It was a weird moment. And you're a good person when you're kind of delving in and out of consciousness. Yeah, yeah. It's comforting to know. There's not a Mr. Hyde. You're only Dr. Jekyll. You're not Mr. Hyde. There you go.
00:56:16
Speaker
I don't know if the campaign was successful. I haven't heard anything since then. I hope it was. Um, I've done that. I feel like really kind of a shame now because I've done that kind of thing too, but I usually end up buying like, you know, a Star Trek model or like some kind of like, you know, like tickets. Last time when I was visiting you, you were like watching a video for, you might've been a go fund me for like a cat litter.
00:56:46
Speaker
Smart litter and it came true. It's real. Oh, that's great. Did you get one? No. As cool as smart litter is, I've learned that like
00:57:00
Speaker
If you are consistent with your cat's routine, it's not likely that they'll have urinary problems. I think that that smart litter is great for folks that have never cared for an animal before or maybe don't...
00:57:23
Speaker
don't want don't have the time to look at examine their animals and like look at their behavior because it's an instant indicator of health problems, but I chose because it's synthetic like I felt I think it's synthetic even though they're saying it's safe, but something changes the color of Litter so that you know right so I decided even though I did fun
00:57:48
Speaker
help and fund that project. I decided to stick with what Arthur Mycat uses as a grass-based litter, and it's wonderful. It's very absorbent of his fluids and waste matter, and there's hardly a smell.
00:58:09
Speaker
and he seems to like it and Fortunately, he's not a litter eater, but some cats actually eat their litter So if he were to be a litter eater, this would be totally harmless to him. So That's another reason that I like it. Well, that's really cool. I wonder if Data's cat uses smart litter
00:58:29
Speaker
What we learned in a previous episode, I bet he does have a litter box, but what's neat about the future in Star Trek is we learned in a previous episode that the ship actually kind of somehow cleans up after you. So there's just like an exhaust port somewhere on the ship that's like dumping a bunch of
00:58:47
Speaker
Well, I think it's a little strange and we get a little bit more color in this episode, way to bring it back to this episode. In the scene where Miles, O'Brien and Keiko, his wife, that's the couple that are with them in that scene after the concert where she starts hugging him or whatever.
00:59:12
Speaker
In that scene, Keiko's telling a funny story about how Miles doesn't pick up his socks and so Keiko thought, maybe he'll do it after a day, he won't be able to stand it. But then a week went by and the socks just kept piling up and so she finally just acquiesced and gave in.
00:59:34
Speaker
and started to do the laundry. And she says something about the cleaning processor. That's what she said. I started putting the socks in the cleaning processor, which I thought was interesting. It's not a laundry machine, per se.
00:59:52
Speaker
But in in that scene we learn that like so you get I guess you do have to do like tell the enterprise or put it into clothes and things like that but I think like poop and pee like the enterprise just beams it off of the floor and transports it into like a waste reclamation area of the ship or something like that you can see anywhere.
01:00:15
Speaker
You could do yeah, you could be a total you drop food on the floor like there's not really drunk like they all do and throw ups Yeah, and spill spill wine everywhere you mean like when they're on the holodeck and like they're in the middle of everything like Peacock's just like taking a leak. He's like steer the ship this way also
01:00:35
Speaker
Can someone beam my turret out of my pants into the, like... It's automatic. It's 100% automatic. That is insane. Why is there not a whole episode about, like, people having so much defecation in their pants? I'm just saying.
01:00:52
Speaker
This is like a very like cuz like it still has to like it doesn't get transported right from your butt To the it has to come out sit in your clothes and I don't think it sits in their clothes I think they probably go so I think I think here's how I
01:01:08
Speaker
i think here's how the enterprise is designed in this for this function right so once they build the ship the the the moment they're finished with construction there the enterprise takes like a snapshot of all the surfaces and it's like okay this is a pristine
01:01:25
Speaker
ship, right? And so it's like, okay, well, you know, you don't want it to beam away a cup or a decorative item, you know, like something that's out of the pristine state. So you program and say, like, only look for these materials, like recognize the signature of the chemical signature.
01:01:45
Speaker
Yeah, or even a little bit more complex than that because if it was just like, let's say it could only sense like chemicals and like, you know, particles or whatever, they wouldn't be able to really distinguish between too many things. But you're right, maybe compounds and things like that. But whatever the programming is, it knows the difference between like, you know, a sock on the floor and like mud or, you know, or poop or pee or whatever. Yeah.
01:02:13
Speaker
But I don't know if it would beam it out of your pants. I think it has to actually fall out of your pants and, like, onto the ground. See, that's what I'm saying. I'm saying, why is there never a scene where they're, like, in the middle of it and you just peek hard, like, shaking his leg a little bit to, like, get that down there? You know what I mean? Because it's just gross. But it would be like a real horrors of war type thing, you know? Like you said, you've got to have some horror in your sci-fi.
01:02:42
Speaker
It's true, I agree with you. Maybe that's something that Star Trek Discovery can do because it's obviously too late for Star Trek The Next Generation to integrate your idea. It's not too late for season 9 everyone. Patrick Stewart still looks the same.
01:03:00
Speaker
I know. And we'll take this moment to talk about some Star Trek news. We don't know where these projects are at right now. They're just like barely not even rumors anymore. But Quentin Tarantino is reported to be directing a Star Trek film. And Patrick Stewart said he would be very interested in working
01:03:25
Speaker
you know, to work with Quentin Tarantino. That's exciting. And so he would don his spacesuit once more for that opportunity. And a personal mission on Starfleet Boy is, I think that Star Trek, the Star Trek, the next generations, the last movie that they did, it wasn't meant to be like a finale. You know, like it wasn't meant to like be their greatest adventure, if you will, because I think they genuinely thought they were going to make more
01:03:55
Speaker
you know, maybe one or two more films, right? But unfortunately, like after Star Trek Nemesis didn't do so well in the box office, Star Trek went into like kind of a deep sleep, you know, for a while. And so there were no new movies for like many years and, you know, and there was nothing of Star Trek on TV and you just kind of like, you know,
01:04:17
Speaker
whatever was on syndication on television and then the 2009 Star Trek movie by JJ Abrams came on and it was about the original series crew and had this like really clever way of going all the way back in time to like you know when they were young and stuff like that and it was a huge hit but that kind of like
01:04:39
Speaker
was like okay that's great but we're now we're still not going to make a star trek the next generation movie because now this is so successful our focus is going to be on this new star trek right so i have been it's a personal mission for me because personally i've been like just there's such great actors like if you watch the show you know like how good
01:05:01
Speaker
Their chemistry is like, and I'm a believer that like when an actor has like portrayed a part for so long, it becomes that person's like, in a way that character belongs to that actor, right? So just on a personal level, I would like to have that crew reunited for just one epic send off movie.
01:05:21
Speaker
I know it's not fiscally responsible or necessarily going to be the most, it might not generate the most money in the box office, it might be a risky bet, but it's such a nice gift to both fans of this program and these characters as well as to these wonderful performers who have
01:05:43
Speaker
have put part of their lives and their souls into these characters. So I'm hoping that the Quentin Tarantino project and Patrick Stewart's clout and his desire to work with Quentin Tarantino turn into a Quentin Tarantino Star Trek The Next Generation movie, which would be, I imagine, insane. I've never seen you so excited before. That's my pitch. I'm surprised I haven't brought this up with you in previous episodes, but I'm very excited to see what happens with that development.
01:06:13
Speaker
He's also writing it if I'm not mistaken, right? Oh my gosh. I mean even better I I actually appreciate Quentin Tarantino as an auteur like I really think his films while they are indeed Sensational and and and you know, perhaps even you know, it's it would be fair to call them gratuitous There's so much depth and meaning and heart and like sometimes even like, you know Just like such such great like the writing is great like the direction
01:06:41
Speaker
I appreciate his work a lot. He may be a controversial figure and what's true and what's not true about him remains to be known, but I'm hoping that he's a good soul.
01:06:57
Speaker
and that this project happens and that it brings a new chapter to Star Trek and maybe opens Star Trek up to other directors who didn't think they could do a Star Trek movie that are just as interesting and unique as Quentin Tarantino. Definitely. I think he's got another movie coming out next year.
01:07:17
Speaker
and then his next project is Star Trek. But it seems, yeah. There's time, audience, that's the real, okay, so that's the real, like, I don't know if it needs to be a GoFundMe, but like, the campaign I think I need to boost up is this like, get Quentin Tarantino to do a next generation movie. I think that's the campaign. That would be fundamentally crazy. What if he did like, almost like a Pulp Fiction style, like non-linear narrative, and it jumped from series to series?
01:07:48
Speaker
Oh, I'd be all about that too, but I want... I want the focus to be on the next generation. Like, somehow, that film, I hope, gives this crew, like, then after that, like, so... The reason I say this is you guys haven't really watched any of the Star Trek movies, have you? Except maybe the newer ones? No, all I know about Nemesis is that Tom Hardy's in it.
01:08:10
Speaker
Yes, that's right. And she plays someone vaguely related to Picard or a clone or something? Yeah, it's basically a clone of Captain Picard. Well, if you watch the original cast, Captain Kirk and everything, if you watch their movies, there's kind of like a tie-in in every film. There's a progression, if you will,
01:08:37
Speaker
basically the characters, but also Star Trek II, III, and IV are story related as well. Star Trek V's kind of an anomaly, and then Star Trek VI just kind of like, it's just a great adventure. Sometimes it's a little over the top, but mainly it was made to give that crew a send off. And even at the end of the film, their signatures flash up on the screen, right?
01:09:05
Speaker
And it felt really appropriate because like at that time When Star Trek 6 came out like Star Trek was like in its Renaissance if you will, you know, like next generation was extremely popular And then and it's around this time That we're talking about coming up. I think in season 5 that Star Trek 6 comes out. So there were two, you know, there was the original series and the next generation they had concurrent kind of
01:09:34
Speaker
Stories and so Star Trek six was like just a nice note perfect send-off for them not everyone agrees with this of course But I I think it's a very it's like a very commonly held opinion And then and then strut they hands the movies over to start trick the next duration so
01:09:55
Speaker
Obviously, because of the way that the two series that followed Star Trek The Next Generation happened, we're technically not past the story of The Next Generation. That story hasn't closed, if you will.
01:10:13
Speaker
There's no continuing story of the crew of the Enterprise. Since then, we've had stories that deal with the crew of Starbase, Deep Space Nine. We've had a story that deals with the Voyager. And we've also had a story now that deals with the Starship Discovery, the USS Discovery, right? But no more stories have been told about either the next generation or the generation after that. Like, what's going to be the next Enterprise crew? Because it's waiting.
01:10:42
Speaker
because you got to close out that other chapter, you know, so I'm excited because there hasn't been an enterprise based, you know, there was actually, it was called Enterprise, but it's set in the past and so, and it didn't do well and it got cancelled in its fourth season. But anyways, the story needs to continue and in order for it to continue, I feel it would be wonderful if you closed, if you properly closed the chapter of the next generation.
01:11:07
Speaker
I'm right there with you. Let's do it. Quentin, we know you're listening. We went so deep there into my personal feelings about search. Also, I just like to add, I feel like we redeemed the podcast a bit and brought it back to Star Trek. We were on topic this whole episode.
01:11:24
Speaker
I think like, honestly, like the moments that we shared about our relationships, I think kind of, yeah, like I feel like they are loosely tied to this episode, but it definitely, the watching this episode brought those themes up in our conversation. And I think, I think that, so yeah, it kind of helps. Yeah. Definitely.
01:11:44
Speaker
Is there anything we're missing about, I think we've covered so much about this episode. Yeah, I think we've. Yeah, I think that's about it. Oh, I just thought just this random but like when Jenna is like sharing things about her childhood.
01:12:01
Speaker
Um, with data and she's like, I wish you could have been there. And he's like, well, what did he, he's just like the way time works, you know, I can't, that was a good, that's right. I just, I thought that was really like funny. Did you think any of the stuff that data said was romantic at all? Like when he was, when he was just like his himself, like not imitating something. No, no.
01:12:31
Speaker
Sorry, Data. He says something, he says something interesting. I just like to add that, like, you don't necessarily always have to be, like, romantic, right? Right. Well, also take it from me, an expert of romance, that if you want to be romantic, you got to talk like this. And if you got to talk like this, you got to say, you know, got to get up in a lady's ear and start whispering. You know, Data just can't do this. You know, is that how Jamie would you, Simon? Does that really work?
01:13:01
Speaker
No. Hey, what's your name? Do you want a drink? You want to? No, no, no, no. It's a nice alleyway. Oh my god, it's kind of creepy. This is what Jamie Long does. You're not my mother. Don't tell me what to do. I don't give a fuck about your bag.
01:13:28
Speaker
I did. I did so much. I kind of felt like he was like in a weird way like almost like her servant. Okay so let's talk about her for a second. I don't think we really actually have given much attention to her. We've definitely I think covered Data a bit and stuff like that but
01:13:48
Speaker
What kind of person who gets into a relationship with an android? I think that's really interesting like what do you guys think of Jenna? I agree and it's like weird how she's like so like uh
01:14:02
Speaker
Like when she tells them to go back to his painting and he does and she's like, uh, or like, it's like, well, what did you expect? Like he's the most direct thing in the world. Like you can't, you know, I don't know. She's obviously not in a good emotional place. Like she's, she's very, she's lost. I think, uh, Jordy brings it up where like, she's probably just rebounding. Like she's emotionally vulnerable. She's lonely. She was rebounding.
01:14:32
Speaker
Yeah, I think she's also maybe a little bit Curious like do you think hat let's say the Jeff thing didn't happen. I wonder what what do you guys feel like a robot fetish? Well, I mean like maybe maybe a robot interest now like I mean, okay, so humans have a tendency to anthropomorphize
01:14:55
Speaker
you know, all the time. Like I feel like I do it with my car or like a beloved object, right? Like an object that you love or like somehow, you know, like cherish. We tend to like give it life in a sense. And so like, do you think that it's possible that let's rule the Jeff, you know, her being fucked up from Jeff. Like let's take that off the table for a second. I also would love to see who Jeff is as a side note.
01:15:23
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. We'll go on to the, there's a cool website called Memory Alpha that has a lot of factoids, so maybe there'll be a mention of Jeff. We'll read off of there. In fact, if one of you guys want to pull it up, you can just type, like Google search TNG, in theory, Memory Alpha, and it should come up, and then you can kind of peruse the facts there.
01:15:50
Speaker
But yeah, so what do you guys think of that though? Like, do you think that like... Is that something that... Okay, Blade Runner. Right? Like, the robot in Blade Runner, K, is kind of like data. That's true. You know, in a sense, but...
01:16:12
Speaker
And then that's a little bit more, and I'm talking about Blade Runner 2049, but even let's just talk about the original Blade Runner. Rachel is kinda like Data as well. And Deckard kind of like totally falls for her.
01:16:30
Speaker
You know, and then that film gets even crazier because like it makes you wonder, well, what makes you an Android or your synthetic versus, you know, like what, what is unreal about a synthetic being as opposed to a, as it, as opposed to a biologically created being, right? Yeah. I mean, I think data.
01:16:51
Speaker
So, well, his programming's really good. Of course, he has flaws, but for the most part, what I notice is that he emulates human behavior really well. So I think it could be easy. You could get curious. It might even be easy to forget that he's not capable of emotions or some of the things we need in a relationship. Yeah. So just some fun facts. This is the first episode to be directed by Patrick Stewart.
01:17:21
Speaker
I did not know that. That's why he made these weird character choices. That is definitely why he's not in the first little bit of the episode. There you go. That's a great explanation. And, uh, Jamie, that also might explain some of the experiments with the character. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Those might've been, those might've been Patrick Stewart's own, uh, improvisations or whatever. Definitely improvisations.
01:17:47
Speaker
I want to mention one thing. When Jenna first kisses Data, she like kisses him on the cheek and then goes back in for a kiss on the lips and leaves the room. And she's kind of like, I'll see you later type thing, you know? And immediately after that, they just have a shot. It's like a shot of Data going like,
01:18:11
Speaker
It's like, it's not acted so obviously, but he like, he looks- Don't you think he had a response? He looks down and then looks back up and it's very clearly meant to say he has a robot erection and it's like his first time and he's not sure what's going on. Uh, just a little thing. I totally missed that. That's funny. Do you guys want some more fun facts?
01:18:35
Speaker
Yeah, we do. I think the facts are great because they fill in some of the questions. So this is the last episode of Data's Cat Spot as a Simali cat. After this episode, the cat was replaced by an orange, short-haired tabby.
01:18:50
Speaker
which is what Arthur is. Yeah. Um, also the Nebula appears to be re appears to be a recolored version of the Mathura Nebula from Star Trek to the Wrath of Khan. Sorry, it's the Mutara Nebula. And this is the only episode with scenes inside one of the torpedo bays of the Enterprise D. This is true. Oh,
01:19:17
Speaker
So, yeah, and apparently in like those when this series came out on DVD and special features, Patrick Stewart says this is his favorite episode of the series. This is his favorite. He directed it. Very cocky.
01:19:35
Speaker
I don't know that that's true, because I think I almost think that his, I've heard him say his favorite episode is called The Inner Light, which I hope you guys can experience. It's a really good episode. Yeah, I have heard of it. We were at a talk with Patrick Stewart a few years ago, and I think he did mention that The Inner Light was the inner light. So maybe he like said this in our DVD thing later, just be like, hey, I directed this.
01:20:02
Speaker
I wonder if we need to flag that on memory alpha as a correction, I wonder. That's it. Here's one of my favorite quotes from the episode is, Worf with Klingons do not pursue relationships, they conquer that which they desire.
01:20:20
Speaker
Yes, Worf says a lot of weird shit like that. He's also been, he's also said that a human could not survive Klingon lovemaking. Yeah. Right. And we all remember that. Oh yeah. With the hands and the blood. Oh man. So intense. Pretty gnarly.
01:20:37
Speaker
super gnarly stuff, but I like that in his scene he's very protective of DeSoto, of Jenna. I thought about one of the things that I thought about and I wrote down in my notes is that I wondered if like characters like Data and especially the character of Data because Data is really well fleshed out over the seven seasons of TNG. If like
01:21:04
Speaker
the way his positronic brain works and some of the kind of, you know, some of the science fiction that was, it was just techno babble at the time. Like, for example, writing a subroutine or, you know, this and that, these are actually kind of processes that like processes that like AI designers are looking at because the human brain works much in the same way. Like if you were to pretend that your brain is a computer, we actually do create subroutines to deal with different situations.
01:21:32
Speaker
right and you know and things like that so it I thought that was interesting like watching it now to like to like be like oh like the general populace is so much more educated with how programming works and how like you know and like we're all kind of like being
01:21:50
Speaker
we're all kind of seeing artificial intelligence developing. Like, you know, right now, like the smartest computer, which is probably Watson or some equivalent, has the like, you know, cognitive abilities of like a three year old. You know, it is it is fascinating to watch these things develop, but then to have like almost kind of like a
01:22:14
Speaker
Think characters like data portray a kind of like goal post for designers to reach, you know They're like oh when when I get my AI to act like data. I know I'll be as successful as Like that so and I think data overall is a positive example of what it might be like to Live and work with and with artificial intelligence if you will. Yeah, definitely
01:22:41
Speaker
Definitely. Also, just as a side note, Jeff's character. So his full name is Jeff Arton, and he was only mentioned in dialogue. Boo.
01:22:56
Speaker
Audience, here's a new challenge for you. Let's do an imaginary, well let's do it first with our crew here, and then this can extend to the audience, but imaginary casting of Jeff. Like if you were, who would you? Current or like in the past? It doesn't matter from any time period, any actor. Question, do you think he was like a good looking guy?
01:23:21
Speaker
based on what you know of Jeff. So like, so we do know one thing. He was emotionally unavailable. Oh, okay. And then also he know he, sorry, he makes noise when he eats soup. He makes noise when he eats soup. Okay. Nicholas cage. You know what I've been, I, I, I'm going to throw something out, but go ahead. You first. Nicholas cage. I do like that. Oh, I got one. I got one. Keanu Reeves. Keanu Reeves. Wow. Good one.
01:23:53
Speaker
It'd be great if either Nick Cage or Keanu Reeves could be in that Quentin Tarantino movie and just randomly, if we were writing it, we would have put Jeff in the story. The whole thing would be about Jeff. Knowing how intense Star Trek fans are, do you think if he wrote, if there was a character in
01:24:11
Speaker
a Quentin Tarantino movie called Jeff Arton, people would like know, or they'd like flip out. If they said Jeff Arton, if they said the full name, 100% people would know. There's people out there who would know. We'd definitely be looking out for it, because we're now obsessed with Jeff, right? Yeah. That's all I can think about.
01:24:29
Speaker
There's at least three people that would think about it. I think that something that would have been ironic and funny is if they got Brent Spiner, the actor who plays Data, to play Jeff, but just out of his makeup. It might have been a really funny twist on the whole reason why Jenna fell for Data. Oh, that's great. Also, as a side note, I realized how
01:24:55
Speaker
weird his makeup is like how It's so oddly done like I don't know like I was looking at his face and I was like I could see like his skin Coming through like I think he maybe like I think if they did it now like a thicker layer of like makeup and would be better
01:25:18
Speaker
Yeah, I think that also when Star Trek The Next Generation was remastered, they used a process that, you know, they captured it from the original film negatives, but I think old-school TVs kind of... That's true.
01:25:35
Speaker
and made it look better than it actually. So I remember that being an issue when HD television started being a thing. People were saying, oh wow, we have to really redo the makeup because what stood the test of television before it doesn't stand the test anymore. Some nasty looking stuff out there.
Episode Rating and Discussion
01:26:00
Speaker
Great observation.
01:26:04
Speaker
What else do you got in your notes? We already talked about the musical pieces. I think, like, that's it from me on my notes. This was a really fun conversation. Yeah. And now it's come to the time where we rate the episode. Oh, thumbs up or down, right? Would you guys like me with that? Is it thumbs up or thumbs down? No, no, we do. Oh, I'm glad you remembered that. But no, we're doing a scale to one to ten. OK, OK.
01:26:31
Speaker
I'll give this a seven nice Yeah, I'd say seven as well. I think seven is a perfectly fine score I really liked the all the data stuff. I just thought that other storyline didn't really need to be in this episode I'm gonna throw a little
01:26:57
Speaker
a little bit of a higher rating out. I'm going to give it an 8.5 and only because of this discussion. I think I would have been probably a 7.5 or maybe just an 8 before.
01:27:12
Speaker
I think,
Riker and Tech Industry Parallels
01:27:13
Speaker
yeah, when I started the conversation in my head, I had like around an 8 actually. But I think I want to give it an 8.5 because A, this was a delightful episode of Starfleet Boy and it was fun sharing stories and having a fun time with you guys. And that colored it a little bit better. But learning that this was Patrick Stewart's first directorial
01:27:36
Speaker
effort kind of makes it a little bit more special, and I think that that deserves a little extra bump in my rating. That's a good point. It's a fair point. But otherwise, I think we're pretty aligned in what we think of this episode. Yeah, I think that's awesome.
01:27:58
Speaker
Oh, what Riker says in that scene, I actually wrote it down, Jamie, was when you get involved with another person, there's always the risk of being hurt, which was kind of good advice. But then he's like, and then if it goes really well, sha-bang, sha-bang. Oh, yeah. It's pretty. Ho, ho, ho. Is there any question in the future? Are there like, or have there been, or will there be any like Riker personal episodes?
01:28:27
Speaker
Yeah, there's going to be a lot. Are you guys interested in doing some of this? Oh yeah, for sure. Now that I know he's a bro, I'm interested. He's a fascinating character. You know Riker might have been the bro template. At least he might be the template for bro grammars because Star Trek, we touched on this just really earlier, Star Trek's pretty nerdy.
01:28:50
Speaker
So like the people who watch Star Trek who are bros are also programmers and those guys are known as brogrammers. So I feel like... Like Silicon Valley type guys? Yeah, and there's a lot of programmers at Amazon too. But you know, I think Amazon's actively working to change that reputation, which since we brought up Amazon who could also sponsor us if they wanted to.
01:29:19
Speaker
Yeah, Jeff Bay's Jeff Bezos is a huge Star Trek fan like his whole space program is based on his love for science fiction and Star Trek and I'm sure he dresses up and cosplays this company has to I mean like a hundred percent like if he dresses up as like Councillor Troy like I this is just everyone's
01:29:42
Speaker
Like, that dude has to be a P-card. Of course. Right, he's like totally... And there's a really cool photo of him and Patrick Stewart, which is just like, really cool. And I'm like, oh my gosh, it's like... Okay, now look this up.
01:29:58
Speaker
So, yeah, that's
Sustainable Event Promotion and Sign Off
01:30:00
Speaker
all we got. Anything else, guys? Any shoutouts? Anything? Oh, since this is, like, very timely, is there any, like, kind of thing you want to promote that you're doing this weekend or any time soon? Has anyone approached you at your sketch comedy and said, I heard about your show from Star Fleet Boy yet? Has any of that happened? No, no, but, hey, you can keep hoping.
01:30:22
Speaker
There's nothing wrong with that. Okay, I'll plug something. If you live in Montreal and you're free on June 8 from 4 to 7 p.m., come down to McGill University's Thompson House. Gradlife McGill is organizing a clothing swap.
01:30:40
Speaker
Oh, what's a clothing swap? The clothing swap is like a way for people who you want to like get rid of your old clothes or like maybe like new or unworn clothes that you don't want anymore and you bring them to like a location and other people bring their clothes and you can like swap and take some of their clothes and then whatever is left. So it's like supposed to be a sustainable and cost-effective kind of thing and whatever is left over we will be donating to charity.
01:31:11
Speaker
I think that's awesome. So that's very cool. I fully endorse this clothing swap. Yeah, I don't have anything to plug, but if you want to hang out, I'm free most Tuesday nights, occasionally on Wednesday, Thursdays. Find me on Facebook. And how would you do that? Just find me. Just find me on Facebook.
01:31:38
Speaker
Well, you could definitely find, I think, an easier way to find people. Twitter. Then Facebook is Twitter, and Jamie's handle is brain doo-doo. That's brain, D-O-O, D-O-O. And then Syma, you just recently joined Twitter, so if anyone wants to follow Syma on Twitter. Yeah, follow. Underscore. Underscore Syma at it.
01:32:03
Speaker
Okay, and spell that please for the audience. So underscore and then it's S-A-I-M-A-A-H-M-E-D. Correct. And I'm brain doo-doo. B-R-A-I-N-D-O-O-D-O-O. And I'm Starfleet boy and that's all folks. We'll see you next time. Live long and prosper.
01:33:41
Speaker
you