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With Jonny Somerville
89 Plays5 years ago
Your hosts Andy Bannister and Kristi Mair are joined by Jonny Somerville for the first episode of the Persuasive Evangelism Podcast.
Jonny Somerville is a Dublin native who’s worked for more than ten years in Irish schools and churches across denominations. He’s passionate about faith development and the opportunity to supplement school curriculum that helps young people grapple with their faith. He currently leads the NUA Film Series for Alpha and Scripture Union Ireland. Find him on Twitter @jonnysomers
Questions about the show? Contact Andy on Twitter @andygbannister
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Transcript
Introduction to Peptalk Podcast
00:00:08
Speaker
Hello and welcome to this pilot episode of Peptalk, the persuasive evangelism podcast. I'm Andy Bannister and my co-host and I, Christy Mayer, every episode we're going to be talking to a guest who's got something to share to help us think about how we can share and communicate the message of Jesus in a skeptical age, an age full of questions. Christy, great to be doing this show with you. Who have we got lined up for this first episode of Peptalk?
Introducing Johnny Somerville and Newa Film Series
00:00:36
Speaker
We're joined with Johnny Somerville. Welcome, Johnny. Thank you so much. Great to be with you guys. Welcome. Welcome to the show. Now we hear that you've produced a wonderful series that will serve the church and society. Could you tell us a little bit about that, please? Yeah. Well, we endeavor to do just that. It's called the Newa Film Series. Newa is the Irish word for new. And we were looking to not create new theology, but to look into big questions.
00:01:02
Speaker
with a fresh perspective to help engage with young people and young adults. I'm really encouraged to hear that there's no kind of new theology going on because that sort of tends to go straight in there, straight in the heresy file. So it's good to hear we're not here. We did our best to stay clear as best we could.
Common Questions from Young People
00:01:18
Speaker
Yeah. So what are, you know, as you've looked at people's kind of questions, Jonny, what are some of the big ones that we're hearing from young people?
00:01:25
Speaker
Well, I've been there. I've been with scripture union since 2008. And I started with the schools outreach team and that led us to whole school groups. We would be given like 100 people for a day to work with them. And we would have like all sorts of faith talks. We'd have all sorts of Q and A's and like time and time again, similar questions were coming up. And I think at the start it was very daunting to try and engage with these questions. Certainly when it came around evil and suffering, the goodness of God,
00:01:56
Speaker
And as you can imagine, when I started out 10 years ago, questions on the church were so common. And then even around just the historical nature of things, I suppose I was taken aback by how much the credibility of Jesus is under attack, even his own historicity, whether or not the scriptures can be trusted. But I think ultimately the real thirst that we found is young people
00:02:22
Speaker
being inquisitive about Jesus and who he was, is he trustworthy? And as much as I love apologetics and want to engage the mind, really, my heart is for people to be compelled by the love and impersonal Jesus. That's wonderful. And I think one of the things that really struck me about some of your videos is just how you do that. And
00:02:46
Speaker
I noticed that you said in one of them, let's start with a question. Why did you choose to set it up like that? Why are questions, why are they so important?
Importance of Mentorship in Faith Journey
00:02:55
Speaker
You know, some of them exercise probably about eight or nine years ago, and it was a very simple question. Think about it and write about it, but it was simply why do you think that you are a faith-filled person today? And obviously the credit goes
00:03:14
Speaker
God the Holy Spirit for drawing me to Him. But as I was thinking it through, I identified these key people in my life who had walked with me.
00:03:28
Speaker
As I thought more about those relationships, and it was used, it was usually with older people, maybe a couple of years, maybe sometimes even 10 years older. These, these were people that sat with me. Um, these were people that, um, gave me the time of day and helped me walk through my own difficult questions. Um, and I was so struck when I reflected on their approach, how they weren't just giving quick answers. They were, they were enabling me think through to think deeper.
00:03:54
Speaker
And that really affected me. And the reason why I was able to grow in my own faith was because these people had walked alongside me. And so one of the reasons why I made NUAH and why I suppose I wanted to bring this resource to the market is because I want to help people to give them the tools to walk with other people, because you can't, most things are a journey. Most things are a process, even our relationship with God, even making that decision to trust God, to trust Jesus, it is a journey.
00:04:24
Speaker
And I think we need to, I think, be more aware that things take time. And a resource like Nua, I think, will help start that journey, start help these really good conversations, but not to see it as a means to an end, but a means to a beginning, to deeper friendships or deeper relationships, or just being able to open people up. Yeah, but I love that whole, you know, approach to questions.
Humility and Openness in Faith Discussions
00:04:49
Speaker
I mean, not least, I think that sometimes I think as Christians, we have a reputation for being people who are not interested
00:04:55
Speaker
I often tell the story that I remember a few years ago, it was on holiday in the Lake District, my wife and I became friends with another couple across that week, we're not Christians. And over the course of the week, we got to know each other, they found out we were, and various conversations about faith. But on the last night, over supper, the wife looked at my wife and I, and she said, she said, I can't figure you guys out. She said, you're clearly into Jesus. And that's, you know, I can see that. It comes through loud and clear. She said, but you're not crunchy. And I said,
00:05:22
Speaker
What does she mean? She said, oh, you know, crunchy Christians. Yeah, it sounds like a kind of cannibalistic breakfast cereal and the kind of people you just can't talk to because any topic, you know, results in sort of like people making all noises and it becomes like, you know, tap dancing through a through a minefield. I think it really sadden me, actually, I was reflected on that, that sometimes we get an impression of being people who you can't talk to. And I wonder where the questions
00:05:48
Speaker
just break some of that down that we show we are genuinely interested in others, even if we disagree. Yeah, I think as well we, I suppose need to be, it's the right word humble or just open enough to be okay to not have the greatest answer or even to think your answer is going to solve everything. If we start change our thinking and allow ourselves to enter into a relationship like that or into a conversation, not wanting to win it,
00:06:17
Speaker
are not wanting to be the superior one in it either. It can open itself up to, I suppose, to an equal relationship, you know, an equal conversation where there can be sharing and listening, respect. To nurture how to be a good conversationist takes time. Like, I have been there. I have been an 18, 19, 20-year-old. I have been an arrogant so-and-so. I have been caught up in my own superiority thinking that I knew better.
00:06:47
Speaker
And it was it mostly brought about destructive conversations. They weren't wholesome. They weren't helpful. And I think Jesus, the Holy Spirit and him working through others has really helped me to become a much better conversation. That's because it's not just the love of the truth that we love, but it's also the love of the person. And then it starts to alter how you then approach explaining the hope that you have questions.
Production and Intent of Newa Film Series
00:07:14
Speaker
They really serve the other person, don't they? And
00:07:17
Speaker
That's the other thing that really stood out to me, just having seen some of these videos, is how the whole setup of the series really serves those who are listening and watching it. I mean, how did you find creating these videos? Because they're so high quality, such high quality. They're engaging, they're thoughtful, they're creative. You have moments where you can pause for discussion. What kind of made you think that this was a good kind of forum, kind of platform to be able to engage with these kind of big questions on faith and God?
00:07:47
Speaker
Well, videos are so common and I don't know on average how many videos a young person will watch on a daily basis. But I suppose we wanted to enter that sphere, but to do so in a video that would cause a disruption to the day, not just one that would be passively watched, but one that would make you stop and think and to dialogue with. I think being from Ireland, it's not often that we make resources of this quality.
00:08:15
Speaker
I think a lot of people were shocked even myself when we went to fundraise for this and when we were able to get the appropriate funds to do it well. And what that meant was I was able to get people around me with real skill, you know, like a really good director, some really good co-writers, a great production team, an animator, sure that everything that we did was to the best of our ability. It was well thought out. It was intentional. Like there's no way I could have done this alone. This was a huge collaborative effort.
00:08:44
Speaker
And if anything, I'm just the guy who brought people together to, I suppose, yeah, to create what we have today at Newham. Do you know, as I listened to you say that, Jolyne, I too was hugely impressed watching Newham. One of the things I loved was like, whenever you're opening shots, it's like a drone shot. And I'm like, as a drone pilot myself, some of my hobbies, I was like, oh, that is so cool. I should have thought of that. But very seriously was that sometimes as,
00:09:11
Speaker
as Christians, I think we have this slightly sort of odd relationship with the arts, especially in a more evangelical end of the Christian community, where we sort of tend to be very content-based, very word-based. And I love the fact that you put serious effort into how this looks, that it looks good, the quality is good. Yeah, I just interested your thoughts on that really, because I think that was one of the things that stood out for me, that this is a model in how we can do this well. Yeah, the director, Greg,
00:09:38
Speaker
from Holz, he's an Irish American author, he's an ex-youth worker, he loves the arts, he loves creative communication, where I might be more linear in my creative approach, where I might be more literal, he loves the abstract. And to allow him enter the process to bring his ideas, I think that's where some of the best bits of NUMA are, where it's not just, yeah, I suppose the
00:10:06
Speaker
the linear line, you kind of go on a journey to help people maybe ask different questions or to see things from a slightly different perspective. And so I've learned so much from people like him, because if it was just me, if I was the director of NUMA, it probably wouldn't have that creative edge.
00:10:24
Speaker
I gather as well from talking earlier, Jonny, am I right in thinking not everybody involved in the production of this were Christians, right? You had some non-Christians. Yeah, as part of the production team, there was a bit of a mixture. The production team did have some old friends of mine that had started this company, a really good company. And some of their colleagues would be... of different descriptions. So it was really cool, particularly actually with one of the technicians.
00:10:52
Speaker
And we had a great time. I loved building a friendship with him and just as opposed to be able to engage on these topics as he was the one hearing me all day long because he was the same recordist. So he had no choice but to chew on the content that we were delivering to take the camera. That's excellent. That's wonderful. How can we actually access these resources,
Accessing Newa Film Series Resources
00:11:16
Speaker
Johnny? If we were just listening to this, I'm like, wow, this sounds great. Where would we go? How could we get hold of this?
00:11:21
Speaker
Yes, so the the new film series, you can you can go to the new film series dot com or dot org. It's just new is a film series. And I think, you know, going to that site, there's lots of different ways in which you can get it through digital formats. It's all, I think, as easily accessible as as as it possibly can be. But it really is eight videos. As you say, they're broken into three parts. We also have
00:11:48
Speaker
a user guide to help people facilitate NUMA through reflective activities, small group questions, that kind of thing. So it really is a ready to go resource to, I suppose, give practitioners the confidence to start these conversations with whoever they have the opportunity to work with.
Future Plans for Newa Film Series
00:12:11
Speaker
That's great.
00:12:14
Speaker
You know, as we sit here and record this, Johnny, that you're, I think even the next few days, you're starting work on the next kind of venture for newer. Gather, you want to be sort of taking the material and aiming it as an even younger audience. Yeah, we are daring the impossible to try and make a film series that is engaging for 11 to 14 year olds. It's a tough market, but
00:12:39
Speaker
I suppose our research in Ireland has showed that the exit out of church kind of groups or places is in and around that age. And we'd love, I suppose, to engage with young people right there and then as they're making decisions. They're very formative years. And so although NOAA has been really successful, you could almost argue that it's too late for young people. And so we want to give practitioners another version, a slightly different version,
00:13:06
Speaker
to engage with a younger audience, to help them make their own faith decisions. For people who are listening to this and being intrigued by this idea of exploring questions, using questions more in conversations, you know, if there's like one tip that you can give someone who's listening to this, who would love to get better at more conversational evangelism, that doesn't know how to begin, okay, there's a newer film series, but what else would you say, perhaps not even personally, from your own journey that you've been on, and as you said, being quite an arrogant 20-year-old, through something that's more open,
00:13:34
Speaker
What's the kind of, how does someone start that process of using questions and conversation more in evangelism? Yeah, I think in my own life, I'm not sure which particular mentor that really instilled this in me, but I've always tried to ask the second question. And so when you're chatting with someone and they might be sharing, I think for most of us, our reaction is to share back or maybe to
00:14:02
Speaker
throw in a story that we might relate to that. But sometimes it's better to ask a second question on what someone has just shared in order to go to, I suppose, go deeper, scratch beyond the surface. And you might actually find out maybe what questions that they're really struggling with. So I think, is it in, is it the Apostle Peter who tells us to listen twice, speak once? Quoting probably, yeah, I should have looked that one up. But somewhere in the scripture,
00:14:32
Speaker
It could even be a proverb, but it definitely encourages us to be quicker to listen than to speak. And I think there's a lot of wisdom in that. And we really need to be more aware of how to truly invest in a conversation and not just to come into that conversation, but what we want to say, but just how much we can hear and take it from there. So like when
00:15:00
Speaker
When Peter's talking about always having the, you know, to have the reason for the hope that we have, he says that when we get those opportunities to do so with gentleness and respect. And I think we need to spend more time working at what it means to be both gentle and respectful as we're engaging with our friends and our family. That's great. Absolutely. Thank you so, so much, Johnny. I was just thinking as you're saying that, what kind of
00:15:22
Speaker
responses have you had to the newer series
Feedback from Educators and Youth Ministers
00:15:26
Speaker
so far? Do you hear much about how people are engaging with it at the moment and how they're reflecting on it? I think back home, particularly in our schools, it's been really encouraging to hear feedback. There's been a lot of teachers, religious education teachers who have very kindly said that it's the best resource they've come across in 20 years or sometimes
00:15:51
Speaker
teachers have shared that they've been shocked that the quieter ones in the class have been the most outspoken and just how it has ignited conversation in the classroom. And even with youth ministry, both in Ireland, the UK, in the States, it really has served to help young people. I suppose to be better equipped for sharing their faith. And when I hear feedback like that, I just, it really warms my heart.
00:16:20
Speaker
that new has been used in that way and is encouraging young people because that's ultimately what we want to be able to do is to encourage young people to grow in their faith, but also to own it and share it with confidence, but with respect. That's so good. That's fantastic. Johnny, thank you so much for taking the time to join us on the show today. And for those of you listening, I really hope this has just made you think a little bit about perhaps some different perspectives, some different approaches on how we can
00:16:49
Speaker
and share our faith and engage with people's big questions. And look out for future episodes of PepTalk coming soon. Christy and I are gonna take some different guests each time, aren't we? And just really, perhaps just be more effective communicators of the message of Jesus in today's age. Till next time, thank you for joining us on PepTalk.