Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Briony Benjamin ~ Life Is Tough, But So Are You
3.9k Plays2 years ago
I am just so excited to share this chat with my Pass Around the Smile community. I know you’re going to love it! Briony Benjamin is an extremely inspiring storyteller, content creator and speaker who has lived her fair share of ups and downs.
While Briony was living her best and most busy life as the executive producer for Video at Mammamia, her time was rudely interrupted by the dreaded C word, cancer. Throughout her journey fighting cancer, she documented and created a short video called You Only Get One Life, which quickly went viral and led to a publishing deal. Her book, Life is Tough But So Are You, is absolutely INCREDIBLE. It was created to help people who have had a massive setback. This book is also extremely insightful in being able to support those around you who are going through a hard time.
In this chat, we discuss A LOT! Briony openly shares how she dealt with the shock and overwhelm that came with her cancer diagnosis, the process and mindset she tried her best to maintain during chemotherapy and the long road to healing afterward. For me, Briony’s story really helped me put things into perspective and her analogies, quotes and positive attitude that helped her through a hard time, is not only inspiring, but SO helpful to anyone - regardless of what you are going through.
Briony has put so much love and energy into her healing process and has found spiritual and self development miracles along the way through journaling, the power of positivity, self love and self care. She even shares the most beautiful, serendipitous love story, which I know my community will LOVE! A reminder that when we trust the process, incredible things can unfold. Briony is a shining light, so get ready to feel INSPIRED!
Briony's Links Below
Briony's Website
Briony's Instagram
Watch You've Only Got One Life
The Lightning Process (Course Briony was chatting about!)
Pass Around the Smile Links Below
View my website here! (My very own oracle cards, journals, meditations + more magical stuff available!)
Find me on Instagram here!
@passaroundthesmile
@cleomassey
Join my Facebook community group here!
The Pass Around the Smile podcast is recorded on Bundjalung Country, in South East Queensland, Australia. We acknowledge the Yugambeh people of the Bundjalung Nation, the traditional owners of this land. We pay our respects to Elders past, present and emerging.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Pass Around the Smile
00:00:01
Speaker
Pass Around the Smile is like your go-to friend, the one that lifts you up and backs you to the end. She's there to guide and inspire, challenge and teach, and remind you that your best self isn't out of reach. Self-development, manifestation, self-love and more, it's time to trust the process more than ever before. Welcome to Pass Around the Smile, the podcast. I'm your host, Cleo Massey, and I am so glad you're here. Let the magic begin.
Introducing Bryony Benjamin: A Story of Change and Resilience
00:00:30
Speaker
I'm so excited to introduce you to the wonderful Bryony Benjamin. To be honest, I actually really struggled writing this intro because how do you articulate, in a few sentences, someone so amazing, inspiring, strong, and clever? I will give it a go. Bryony is a storyteller, content creator, and speaker who has lived her fair share of ups and downs. After beginning her career by completing a commerce finance degree, she quickly ditched the numbers and studied film instead.
00:00:57
Speaker
She then began putting her love, time and energy into making entertaining content for change-making organizations like World Wildlife Fund and Get Up. She was then quickly snatched up by Mamma Mia as the executive producer for video. While Bryony was living her best and most busy life, it was rudely interrupted by the dreaded C word, cancer.
00:01:18
Speaker
Throughout her journey fighting cancer, she documented it and created a short video, You Only Get One Life, which quickly went viral and led to a publishing deal. Her book, Life is Tough But So Are You, is absolutely incredible. It was created to help people who have had a massive setback. And this book is also extremely insightful in being able to support those around you who are going through a tough time. Bryony is a shining light and spends her time inspiring audiences through her words and content.
00:01:47
Speaker
I am so honored to have her on, so let's get into the conversation.
Cancer Diagnosis and the Journey to Acceptance
00:01:52
Speaker
Hi, Brian. Hi, Cleo. Thanks for having me here. It's so nice to meet you in person. I know. I feel like I know you quite well. Yeah, I feel a bit the same. Yeah, it's so nice. Spiritual connection. Yeah, exactly. No, thank you so much. And I have interviewed you already. So I mean, my listeners will already know about your book, but I do just want to start by talking about your book and how absolutely incredible it is. Oh, thank you.
00:02:16
Speaker
I've just finished reading it and I personally, thankfully at the moment I am not going through a hard time but your book was so insightful for me to be able to be a good support in a different way that I have never kind of learnt about to those around me going through a hard time and of course then your book is perfect for people going through a hard time. But yeah, it's just incredible and I guess I was hoping
00:02:41
Speaker
with this episode to kind of go through your life journey and then we'll kind of pull bits from the book as we go because there are so many elements I want to talk about like I loved so much of it. So yeah how does that sound? That sounds great yeah looking forward to chatting about all the things. Yeah well I thought if it's okay with you we might start off with
00:03:03
Speaker
Kind of that time where you were living in Sydney you were Executive producer for video at Mamma Mia you were living your busiest most successful city girl corporate life Yeah, how is that like talk us talk us through that?
00:03:18
Speaker
Yeah, look, it was great fun. I mean, working at Mama Mia was, it was just a heap of fun. It was, you know, there were about in the Sydney office, 80 women, all fabulous. You know, I was really shocked actually, before I started working there, the comments, people would say, Oh gosh, working in an all female environment, like, Oh God, is it going to be like a pack of, you know,
00:03:38
Speaker
nasty kind of be arches which was really surprising that that's that was people's just initial response to a big group of women working together but my experience couldn't have been more different it was just full of seriously fun very clever switched on women we'd start every day with a stand-up so people from all around the company you know you'd literally stand up in a circle pitch ideas throw it was hilarious like
00:04:02
Speaker
the conversations that were going on. And so the video team that I headed up with would all be part of that conversation and just the ability to spark different creative ideas every day, but be drawing in from all these really clever news brains that are across world events and current affairs and just riffing ideas each day. It just was like a creative brain Jim, you know? Yeah. And so, yeah, to be in that position where you could just have an idea
00:04:28
Speaker
And as a team, sit down and work out how to make it that week. And we made some seriously funny,
Navigating Cancer Treatment with Support
00:04:34
Speaker
ridiculous videos, you know, that went really viral out there in the world. And yeah, it was great fun. Having said that throughout that whole, I suppose, year, my first year at Mamma Mia, I just had this tired, exhausted, icky feeling all of the time.
00:04:55
Speaker
And, you know, monthly we would do this shoot that was a very high octane, high energy video that I would be in. It was like a with and without. So it was like with heels, with sneakers. I've seen the video. You know, very, very serious, important content, but the audience loved it. And I remember always just feeling really sick after one of those shoots. And this went on for months and months and months. And so, yeah, over that period, I kept going back to my GP asking
00:05:23
Speaker
You know, is there something up? Is there something up? And I kept getting told, you know, it basically kept getting put down to stress.
00:05:30
Speaker
And, um, but I didn't feel that stressed. I thought this is the least stressful job I've had probably in my adult career. This is great. Um, you know, and because it was full of women and a lot of them were moms, like they were out the door at five. There wasn't an expectation to be responding late in the night to emails. It was a really great work environment. And so it didn't really add up, but I suppose at that time I didn't yet know how to listen to my body and trust my instincts because if someone's telling you you're fine, well,
00:06:00
Speaker
suck it up and get on with it. And if it's a doctor, like a position of power, you're like, yeah, whatever you say. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And there was no obvious things that we could point it to from the test that we were doing. So I thought, okay. Uh, you know, and then of course they start to ask, well, may, you know, is it, maybe you're depressed, maybe, you know, like, is it a mental health issue? And I just,
00:06:22
Speaker
I kind of deep down just knew it wasn't. I knew that that wasn't really, I felt exhausted and I wasn't looking forward to much because I remember getting an invite for a girlfriend's wedding, like a really good friend and that should be a joy filled, exciting thing. And I remember my first thought being,
00:06:40
Speaker
Oh, you know, this is gonna take so much energy. Wow, okay. Which is a sure sign that something's not right. Something's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, gosh. And then I guess you were kind of then led to the doctor for the results on a random Thursday morning. Yeah, exactly. So it was actually my mum. She was just on my case. She's going, you know, you're having nights where it's...
00:07:04
Speaker
You're not yourself, you're just exhausted all the time, you know, and I think, gosh, my mother's intuition, they just don't, they just know, don't they? And my dad's a vet, so she kept prodding my dad going, Anthony, you know, what could it be? What could it be? And he sort of had to think about it and they sort of surmised that maybe I had lymphoma.
00:07:24
Speaker
Right. Because from the night sweats, you know, like night sweats is I now realize a red flag. We call it a red flag in the medical, you know, community that it's, you can be cancer. So I was being told it could be hormonal, but you know, I was 31. It wasn't like I was going through menopause or any big changes.
00:07:44
Speaker
And certainly I don't want to alarm anyone listening because sometimes night sweats can just be a hormonal change. But for me, it was over a 12 month period on and off, on and off. And by the end, I was having them night after night after night. I was waking up, you know, dripping, having to change my pajamas, change my sheets. And yet I realized when I went back to the doctor, she had never really interrogated that much, you know, because my dad ended up actually calling her up and saying, you know, she's having really bad night sweats. She said, oh, they're not that severe, are they?
00:08:14
Speaker
my dad sort of said, you know, well, have you actually asked, you know? So I think that's a really good thing to look for in a GP. Someone who's actually just goes that bit deeper. Ask that history is really on the case, you know, because I think, um, I say now GPs are just, they're used to seeing the worried. Well, people who are well, but are worried that they're not. So, and, and for me, I presented well,
00:08:37
Speaker
I looked well like I was bubbly. Even when I was exhausted, I was bubbly. And so I think that they just have this health bias again, you know, sort of against young people too.
Mental Resilience and Managing Overwhelm
00:08:46
Speaker
You don't, you don't jump to the worst case scenario, even if there's been a year of sort of unexplained issues going on. So yeah, basically I went, um, at my parents' insistence to go and see a specialist hematologist, which is a blood
00:08:59
Speaker
a blood specialist. And she was the first person I realized that actually took my pain seriously. I said, look, I'm waking up every night, I'm in sweats, I'm aching. And I remember her just looking at me and saying, oh, so this is actually having a really big impact on your life.
00:09:15
Speaker
Oh, it's sort of like this relief, like, oh someone understands. Yeah, that this is actually like, this isn't normal to be feeling like this. She sent me off for some tests and said, basically, come back in a fortnight and we'll give you the results. And my mum, bless her, flew down from Queensland to be with me. And I was like, mum, I've got a really big day. We're interviewing Sophie Monk. You know, I'm busy. I'm busy. I'm really busy and important.
00:09:40
Speaker
Uh, and, and literally that's where my head was that morning, you know, racing into the hospital thinking, Oh, another dead end. Like blah, blah, blah. And I'll get into work. How hard, you know, how busy is the traffic going to be? And I sat down in that appointment and the specialist who was the most beautiful woman and so gentle and kind. And she just said, so the results are back and I'm really sorry, but it is lymphoma. Let your parents were worried about it. It's a blood cancer. And so what that means is we just need to clear the next six months immediately.
00:10:12
Speaker
and it's just like the biggest and the most surreal moment of your life because you just
00:10:20
Speaker
You know cancer is something that happens to other people, right? You never think it's going to happen to you, especially when you're 31 and it feels like life's just sort of beginning, taking off. It was just a huge, huge shock. Oh my God. Yeah. I can't even imagine. And so in the kind of initial stages of that shock and overwhelm, what helped you?
00:10:44
Speaker
Yeah. So having mum there, you know, she just grabbed my hand. I remember we just looked at each other. I, you know, I sort of welling up, but she was so strong the whole way through. Never saw her cry. Um, and.
00:11:01
Speaker
The specialist gave me some really great advice then and there. That's something I just come back to all the time. She just said, I don't want you to Google it. I don't want you to think too far ahead. We're not going to talk about treatment today. We're just going to focus on the next three steps. So that I think is just great life advice when anything is feeling overwhelming.
00:11:22
Speaker
And sometimes I say, break it down even further. Just say, okay, what's one thing I can do right now to make this better? And it's not going to solve it. It's not going to take my cancer away, but it will at least give me a manageable step to focus on and take the overwhelm away because, you know, it's incredibly overwhelming. There's nothing more overwhelming than
00:11:41
Speaker
you know and not just health issues but like a huge curveball being thrown at you like that and so I think that's good yeah just the next step and a beautiful girlfriend who is an illustrator she lives in Amsterdam she said to me some great words that stuck with me in that first week and she just said some things don't have to be understood just accepted
00:12:03
Speaker
Oh, that's so powerful. Yeah. That's so nice. Because, and she could give that advice because she'd been herself through a major sort of mental health breakdown some years before. You've got to be very careful giving advice and write in the book about just don't give advice. But I think when it's a trusted friend like that, and I was going to her going, this is what's happened. And I think a nice way sometimes to say, can I offer up an idea?
00:12:28
Speaker
Yeah, and then you can kind of give permission or not. No, I don't want, I just don't want to, I don't need advice right now or I don't. But that was a really helpful thing because you can just waste so much energy. You know, I could have wasted so much energy in that first week. How did the doctor miss this? Why me? How long has this been going on for?
00:12:47
Speaker
what caused this, but you're never going to get answers to any of those questions. And it's not going to make you feel any better. No. And also what I've since learned is those kind of thought patterns. All they really do is they release cortisol and adrenal into your body, which just physically exhaust you, but keep your body in this kind of fear, kind of alert fight or flight mode. And when your body's, you know, you're dousing your own body basically in this cocktail of
00:13:15
Speaker
hormones and chemicals and
Post-Treatment Challenges and Emotional Recovery
00:13:17
Speaker
when you're in that state sleep is harder your immune system can't function you know all these things there's all these flow-on effects so it was a really calming idea I think that idea of just
00:13:29
Speaker
Okay? And you can use it in so many scenarios in life. You know, even when someone's really disappointed you or let you down or be at something big or something quite small, you do, okay, I don't need to understand this actually. I'm just going to accept it. And you're so good at that just as you, as you're speaking now, and I know you do lots of speaking engagements as well, but also in your book.
00:13:50
Speaker
you know, you're talking about your cancer journey, but also relating your journey to what other people might be going through relative to them. So yeah, it can be like relationship breakdowns, a friendship, marriage, whatever, or like a sickness of another kind, a loss of a job, anxiety, depression. So you do so well.
00:14:09
Speaker
like taking the advice that you learn over such a hard journey and being like, you can use this too. Well, yeah, because I think so many of these scenarios, it's a similar process, right? Yeah. If it's a relationship breakdown or, you know, you've lost your job, like you said, or you're just really struggling with depression and anxiety, like that acceptance piece is really helpful no matter what's going on. Like grief, you lost someone that you adore, like,
00:14:36
Speaker
You know, so much energy can be wasted. Oh, what if, what if, what if, what if? It's not going to change the reality. So I think, yeah, the acceptance and the, okay, we'll just breaking it down like that. That can apply to any situation. It's such good advice. And then you have a really good quote and kind of idea around worrying.
00:14:56
Speaker
Yes. That I love. Tell us about it. Yeah. Look, a friend sent this to me at some point during treatment and it just said, worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but it gets you nowhere. And it's just so true. It's back to that energy conservation thing, you know?
00:15:15
Speaker
And we had a beautiful family friend, and he actually passed away from lymphoma about 10 years ago, but he used to, he was just so positive and sunny till the end. And he said, look, my theory is if you worry and then you find out there wasn't a reason to worry, then you've just wasted all this energy. And if you worry and then you find out there was a reason, you know, like actually that was a valid worry, but you've then done double the worrying.
00:15:44
Speaker
So I love that. All you can do is just, okay, I'm just going to take it bit by bit, you know? And I had to apply this actually two weeks ago, take my own medicine. It's when you're, when you've written about it and you talk about it, you're like, Oh, now I've got to do it myself. Um, but I actually like a lump came up on my breast.
00:16:03
Speaker
And so I literally had to go back to the place where I was first scanned and I thought, oh my goodness, how is this happening? Yeah, currently six months pregnant at the time. And, um, and my GP, you know, cause I said, Oh, I'm sure it'll be fine though. And she sort of went.
00:16:19
Speaker
You know, oh gosh, but I had to just apply this. Okay. Well, like, what is the point of me crying and being distraught for the next week until I get the results back? Nothing. I'm just going to take all the joy out of this week. And so I did, I just kept going, okay, I'm just going to wait. We'll wait until the results are there and then we'll think about it, you know? And luckily it was fine.
00:16:41
Speaker
That's amazing. And it's just, you know, a change that's happening on my breast from, yeah. And yeah, my listeners can't see you right now, but you've got a beautiful baby bump baby. I do, I do. It's just, oh my God, it's so exciting. You've got such a beautiful journey ahead of you. Yeah. A beautiful and interesting and overwhelming. Yeah, of course. Yeah. And so,
00:17:07
Speaker
Yeah, God, that worrying thing, just back to the worrying, it reminds me of that quote that's, worrying doesn't take away tomorrow's troubles, it takes away today's peace. And I like how you said that you just have to keep like even, you know, a couple of weeks ago when you found that lump.
00:17:22
Speaker
you had to keep reminding yourself of it because sometimes it can be easier said than done. Well, totally. And it's not like I'm now the expert in all of these things, right? Because I've been through it and done it. Like I actually find I pick up the book from time to time, read it and go, Oh yeah, gosh, totally forgot about that. Oh, rest. Oh yeah. You know, I'm not actually doing that. So
00:17:41
Speaker
In a selfish way, I feel like I kind of wrote the book as a guide to just keep myself on track, you know, but it's constant repetition. And so I think that's also the thing of being kind to yourself. If you do fall off the wagon or you do forget some of these things, it's just constant reinforcement and doing it and, you know, always trying to get better. It's okay. Like we've got to stop being so hard on ourselves because I think we all know that kind of experiment and they do it with
00:18:07
Speaker
flowers or trees or water or whatever. It's like when you talk kindly, it literally grows. And when you don't, it can die. Like it's awful. So we have to like protect our energy. And you'd never speak to, you know, a best friend like that. No. Like imagine. So I think for most of us, if we spoke to the way we speak to ourself, if we spoke to a friend like that, you would have no friends. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Exactly. Isn't that sad? Yeah.
00:18:31
Speaker
When I'm getting in a little rut of just speaking to myself unkindly and being hard on myself, I will always do an inner child meditation. Oh, beautiful. And just, you know, go back to that little girl in me and look at me when I'm like 10 years old and then immediately I cannot say anything mean to her. I'm like, what am I doing? It's the same person. Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah. Oh, yeah. So you've just been given the news and you've
00:18:59
Speaker
you know, got this beautiful advice from your doctor to kind of, you know, just a step at a time.
00:19:06
Speaker
Then what? Then what? Yeah. Well, it was, I mean, initially I remember just writing out a list of my most favorite people on the planet who I wanted to let know before, you know, they just heard on the grapevine because it's, and so as the person going through it, you're sort of thinking, how do I, how do I gently give this information, you know, to the people that love me, starting with my sisters who were both, one was overseas, one was far away. And, um,
00:19:32
Speaker
Yeah. So that, I wouldn't recommend it, but it's certainly a good way to crystallize who matters and what matters very quickly. And so, yeah. And then, and then I think, you know, mum and I, from that first night, we just sort of thought, okay, well, here we are.
00:19:48
Speaker
You know, I'm accepting that this is happening. I'm not going to try and understand it. I've accepted it now if we've got to do it anyway, let's just See how lightly we can kind of go through this, you know, I think yeah, it's in any of these scenarios It's easy to be swallowed into the void a bit and so trying to strike that balance when you're going through a crisis of any sort not not
00:20:13
Speaker
suppressing how you feel. Cause that was a big learning for me early on. I think I've always been naturally a positive, optimistic person. And I just thought initially I could just fight this with, you know, be captain positivity and just, you know, get an A plus in cancer. And I was just going to smash this. And that was, that was going fine for me until, you know, three weeks into chemo and my hair started falling out. And that's just, it's just really difficult and
Life After Cancer: Building a New Path
00:20:39
Speaker
tough. And I think trying to pretend it's not is just not helpful.
00:20:42
Speaker
do more harm than good. It's like steps into that toxic positivity realm. Completely. And so I was definitely doing a bit of the toxic positivity and I went and saw this psychologist at the hospital and she just said like, I just want you to know, you don't have to like any of this. You can just hate this whole journey if you want. And I thought, Oh my gosh, that feels heavy and terrible applies. So I was like, this woman doesn't know what she's talking about. Left in tears. Like I was out of there. And, um, but you know, I realized later what that,
00:21:10
Speaker
conversation allowed for was just released a pressure valve. It's like, it's okay. You can just, you know. You're allowed to be angry or upset or cry. You're allowed to just sit on the couch and cry all day if you want, but set a time limit on it. Okay. At the end of the day, I'm getting off though. Or, you know, um, yeah. So just giving yourself those, those guidelines so that you can
00:21:32
Speaker
Yeah. Flow through it because otherwise it's either going to be, you know, you're forcing this kind of positivity or you're like being dragged into the void. You've sort of just got to find that balancing point in the middle. Yeah. And you found that journaling.
00:21:49
Speaker
really helped you kind of find that balance. Is that right? It did. So once again, that beautiful friend from Amsterdam, she sent me, she is amazing. Shout out to the friend in Amsterdam. Yeah. And well, I really have heard a thankful writing the book in the first place because she sent me a book called The Artist's Way. If you haven't done it, can't recommend it more highly. It's about reconnecting with your creative self, but I would just call it reconnecting with yourself.
00:22:12
Speaker
And it's 12 weeks and I had 12 weeks of chemo, so there was some nice synergy in that. But as part of it, you do the morning pages every morning, which is like first thing when you get up, just journaling, brain dump, three pages out. And the idea is that it's really, well, I found it really therapeutic. I didn't realize till after the journaling during traumatic or difficult times is actually an incredibly powerful tool. I just sort of stumbled across it by accident because, well, I think my friend knew, but it helps you process.
00:22:40
Speaker
you know and make sense of what's going on and it also over time just gives you clarity about you know so I had a lot of like thinking and dreaming time during that time yeah what I want to do next with my time on earth what's you know because there's a lot to work through and particularly for me it got the most difficult when chemo finished in a way emotionally okay because when you're in it you've got like set
00:23:03
Speaker
you know you've got a set laundry list of what you're doing and appointments and a schedule you're busy actually just getting through the doing of the cancer and then it finishes and you feel awful and you're totally depleted and you don't have any strength but you don't know how long it's going to take and no one can really tell you how long it's going to be to feel better yeah how long is too long to take off or should I get straight back into work and for me that's when I really struggled the most
00:23:29
Speaker
But realizing that everyone feels like that, actually, I reached out to some other women that have been through and they're like, oh yeah, of course, like that's totally normal. And realizing that was normal, then I felt fine. I guess there is this like societal expectation or pressure that, you know, whether it's cancer or another crisis that anyone's going through,
00:23:53
Speaker
to get back on track. Yeah, like get your life back to normal, but is it really ever going to be the same again? Yeah. And I wasted a lot of energy initially trying to just force myself back into that. Yeah. What I had been doing before and I'm still this, you know, fun, positive bubbly, like party girl. And I can, and I just kept exhausting myself. Right.
00:24:14
Speaker
Something that I loved, I was watching Michelle Obama's documentary that went with her book. Was it called Becoming? Oh yeah, yep. And there was this gorgeous moment, she was sitting with a group of young girls and one said to her, so you've just had eight years in the White House and now you're leaving and you're going back out into the world, how do you get your life back on track? And she said, what track?
00:24:37
Speaker
There is no track. It's just all new now. It's a new path and it's different. And it takes time to figure out what that track is and what that looks like.
Nature's Lessons on Resilience and Adaptability
00:24:47
Speaker
And that resonated with me so much because I was trying to get back on the track, not realizing that actually it was a, it was a new track now. And that was okay. That felt really scary to begin with, but to allow yourself that time and be gentle with yourself and know, okay, it's okay.
00:25:02
Speaker
it's going to take time to figure out what this next chapter looks like. How refreshing. That is really refreshing, what Michelle Obama said. And I guess it goes back to that thing of acceptance as well, because you're now accepting that things have changed and that's okay. And I guess it can happen with, you know, negative things, but also positive things like,
00:25:23
Speaker
you know, at the moment you're pregnant and you're going to have a baby and life is going to change. Yes. And it's okay that it's going to be different. So even in a positive aspect, but we've got, and going in with like different expectations, you know, girlfriend said to me the other day, she's like my best bit of advice. She's got four children under like seven or something. And she said, it's just not to strive for anything during this time. Like just live in it. Just get through the days, you know, don't try and,
00:25:52
Speaker
excel and smash everything and you know which A type personalities you kick into and I thought that was great it's like yeah it'll just be what it is and just having that acceptance of it and another thing someone said to me the other day is you know if you haven't slept all night and you wake up and you're exhausted rather than fretting about oh the day's gonna be a write-off because I haven't slept and it's just going okay this is just what today is so that's just that acceptance piece yeah again this has come up so naturally here but being bendy
00:26:20
Speaker
Be More Tree is a section in your book. So tell us about Being More Tree because I laughed when I read Be More Tree and I was like, I'm so excited to see how this is. And I loved it and I've written it down. Oh, gorgeous. Yeah. Tell us about that. Well, I loved this. This was a beautiful mentor of mine and he was talking about the most difficult times in his life. He's like, I take inspiration, you look up at the trees, you know, which I,
00:26:46
Speaker
it has been one of the biggest takeaways from this whole experience for me is just like we go searching for magic in life it is all around us and it's called nature you know and you actually if you stop and look and take it in you can be completely absorbed by it and it you know we know the science of it is clear even just looking at greenery even if it's actually on a screen even if it's not real
00:27:08
Speaker
you know, it calms the nervous system. It is just, it is good for us. You know, it's, it's what we were always meant to sort of be immersed in, but look up at the trees and in a, in a windy, you know, in a storm, what do they do? They're swaying and they're moving. They're not just rigidly standing there going, Oh, stop blowing at me and stop, you know? And so here's,
00:27:29
Speaker
The concept I took away from it was to be a bit bendy when times are challenging, when it feels like there's a gale blowing. It's just that you've just got to sway with it. You just got to go with it. Otherwise you'll snap, you know, in half. Yeah. And I love when you said too that it reminds us that we don't bloom all year.
00:27:47
Speaker
all year round. Yeah. And it's so nice because we don't and that's okay. Yeah. Like that quote, uh, the moon reminds us that you are still whole no matter what phase you're in. It's like we are still whole. We are still ourselves. We're still doing well. We're still moving forward if you're resting or if you're having a bad day or if you, you know, yeah. So yeah, it's such a nice, I loved that. Yeah. Oh, thank you. Yeah. No, it's something that I've just, uh, I love like visual metaphors like that. Cause it's something when you are feeling a bit frazzled, you can just
00:28:17
Speaker
you know, tune back into. But I think it's just the best thing on any day when you're feeling a bit frazzled anyway, it's like just find a way to get into nature, even if that is just like literally watching some ants crawling along the ground, like whatever's near you, you know, you don't need to be in a rainforest, go down to the beach or put your feet in the water, just something to sort of ground you and
00:28:38
Speaker
Just remind yourself for a minute, you know, even like at night I find, you know, going outside and looking up at the stars.
Therapeutic Tools: Journaling and Emotional Management
00:28:45
Speaker
Stars? I still don't believe that stars are real. When I'm looking up, I'm like, how are you real? You're a pretty little twinkling thing in the sky. Like, this is incredible. I know. It just puts it all back into a kind of perspective. Yeah. Yeah. And then circling back a little bit to the journaling. Yes.
00:29:04
Speaker
I remember this part from your book where you said that speaking aloud your kind of worries or concerns or anger, as well as journaling it out, kind of like took the severity of that emotion away a little bit. And I agree with that. So yeah, do you still kind of practice that?
00:29:23
Speaker
I do. I don't journal as much as I would like, but I am trying to actually my word for this year because I always just picked just a word for the year. And this year it's just right because I find that sometimes I have to write to think, you know, it just calms me. It's like quite meditative. Yeah. But I think there's something also about when you put pen to paper, I don't know why, but you cannot lie. Like it's really hard. You can sort of tell yourself all manner of things in your mind. Yeah. Oh, it's fine. I know. Yeah.
00:29:51
Speaker
when it comes to writing it down. I find this particularly true of relationships. I was in a pretty rocky relationship at the time. And when the pen hits the paper, the truth just kind of comes out. And so it's, you know, over time, the idea, because the idea as well with the morning pages is I think in the book, it guides you to sort of just write for 10 weeks and don't go back and read them, but then go back and start to. And this is your journal.
00:30:17
Speaker
Sorry, this was in the artist way, the original book. Oh, this is in the artist way. Oh, got you. Because you also, though, you have a journal version of your book. I do now. Which you've just given to me and I'm so excited for that. It is. It's so powerful to journal it out. It is. And I think sometimes though, people find journaling a bit.
00:30:36
Speaker
intimidating or they don't know where to start like people said I love the idea of it but like the idea of opening up a blank book and so that's why I created the journal it's like this is the journal I would have loved to have had at the beginning yes that was actually just guided you through and it guides you through the steps that are actually in the book but you know giving you space to be angry and just have a rage page you can just
00:30:54
Speaker
get it all out, you know, a brain dump page, like what are all the things coming up, you know, gratitude sections, but then just spaces for you just to write, but with something to prompt you along. Yeah, that's so, so good. Because yeah, I do get a lot of my community as well saying to me, like, I don't know where to start. And also a lot of them saying,
00:31:13
Speaker
Oh, I don't want to write anything negative because then I don't want it to like, you know, manifest. And I'm like, you got to let those frustrations out. You've got to let it all go. It's like a weight lifted off your shoulders. Well, I loved what Julia Cameron, who wrote The Artist's Way, she said there are journalings like spiritual windshield wipers. And she's like, you can whinge and moan and
00:31:37
Speaker
whatever. Yeah. It doesn't, these are just thoughts that are passing through. It doesn't mean that this is with inside you. In fact, it's just about actually getting that dark cloud of thoughts out of your head and putting them on the page because yeah, like we were saying, once they're out there and you've written them down, sometimes you look at it on the page and you're like,
00:31:55
Speaker
Oh, why was I so worried about that? Yes. Well, it makes them almost feel a bit trivial. You're like, Oh, okay. Oh, is that it? Yes. Okay. That's fine. We can manage that. Which is like so powerful because so often we'll grab a little thought and then we'll assume the worst and we'll make it bigger and bigger and bigger in our head. All of a sudden we're so anxious. We've made up this whole story in our mind that is completely false. But then yeah, when you write it down, you're like, what?
00:32:20
Speaker
Yeah. And the only caveat I would give it with journaling is that if you find you are just running the same thing over and over and over day after day, that can actually become unhelpful and a bit unhealthy. Yeah. So, you know, I mean, let yourself go for a week or two or something, but if you find it's the same theme over and over and over, well, then that might be a good indication to you that maybe I need a bit of professional help here to talk this thing through with someone because I am in a rut with this. And actually like I had a girlfriend
00:32:49
Speaker
same thing and she was quite anxious in temperament but she just said like I'm just I'm writing pages and pages and pages and pages on this one thing and I was like okay well maybe I would stop now yeah actually and go and have a chat with someone about it which she did and that and that was yeah so I would say get it all out write it all down but just notice the themes if you were just really obsessing on the one thing like okay maybe journalings now
00:33:15
Speaker
not helpful. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I agree with that. Yeah. I agree. And you had, I'm going to read this out because you had a little quote that you said in your book that you put on your mirror, I believe. Oh yes. On your board. And it was after you being told that you were free of cancer, but I know your journey became, you know, quite overwhelming and hard after that. And you said you were going to get through this and you were going to come back brighter and shinier and stronger and wiser and more gorgeous than ever before.
00:33:45
Speaker
So was this during the cancer or was this after? So this was after. Yeah. And this is where I'd moved back to Sydney. Actually, all my housemates had moved out. So I was living with new people. I didn't know all my neighbors because I lived at three houses in a row where all friends had all moved out just in that year. And it just felt like everyone had moved on with their lives. And I was sort of way behind where I'd started. I was exhausted. I was trying to start work a few days a week. I was just so tired and felt quite hopeless, I think.
00:34:13
Speaker
And which is just also exhaustion, right? You sort of, and not, not knowing as well how long it's going to take. Cause no one can tell you, Oh, don't worry. In six weeks, you'll be feeling great. It's a bit, you know, like, and, and that sort of then began to manifest as chronic fatigue, which lasted for about four years actually. And so that in many ways was.
00:34:33
Speaker
emotionally far more challenging than the cancer because there's no end date on it at least in cancer you've got a treatment plan you know when it's going to finish right whereas this was like well you might have this for the rest of your life oh goodness that is demoralizing uh and so i did i wrote that little mantra out i had it beside my bed and i just read it every night and read it every morning and i didn't i don't
00:34:55
Speaker
I think I really believed it at the time but I had to just pretend that I believed it and yeah slowly but surely you know I started to feel better I mean I've tried so so many things that's a whole other podcast episode over the years recovering from chronic fatigue but the last yeah the last year and a half I've been feeling
00:35:14
Speaker
back to my usual self and that that's like you know that would be yeah it was five years since diagnosis and I was feeling pretty rotten for a few years leading up to that so it can it can happen and and and that's just one other thing I'll say on the acceptance piece because where I think sometimes the only warning on acceptance is with the chronic fatigue side of things like I had accepted that this is how
00:35:37
Speaker
I was feeling and how I could always feel. But you've got to be careful in a way to not shut down the pathway to getting back to healthy, right? Because if you're then, okay, accept that I'll always feel like this. Well, there's no, there's no pathway now. Then you're not going to be open to possibilities.
00:35:55
Speaker
It's that thing where you've actually just got to hold, once again, my gorgeous GP friend, Nikki. She just said you can hold on to two truths at once. That you might have this forever and you might make a full recovery. You know, because if you're too wedded to either camp,
00:36:11
Speaker
you continually demoralized when you don't get better, or you're, oh gosh, sitting in that, I'm never gonna get better, I'm always gonna feel this awful. So yeah, once again the balance. That is such good advice, like that is so good. I just feel like that is gonna help so many people.
00:36:27
Speaker
And you also, I think it may have been your friend who wrote this section in the book, but it was around you don't have to be healthy to be happy as well and that kind of mindset. Yeah. So my best friend, the GP, this is her older sister who'd been dealing with really horrendous chronic fatigue since she was about 21. So for well over 10, 15 years now.
00:36:49
Speaker
And so she was one of the first people I turned to. Because I knew, of everyone I knew, whilst it wasn't cancer, I knew in terms of a health crisis, she'd had to develop some hardcore resilience and some mindsets and ways of managing.
00:37:04
Speaker
And so she actually put together a few beautiful ideas in a little book and sent them to me. And then so when I was writing the book, I asked her to contribute that as a chapter, which was really lovely. And yeah, that was a real, you know, one of those ideas that hits you and just really connects at that time. You don't have to be healthy to be happy because
00:37:25
Speaker
the reality when you're in chronic fatigue or you're in cancer treatment, well, you don't have control over that component of your body right now. But actually that idea that you can divorce the mental and the physical was really kind of revolutionary to me.
00:37:42
Speaker
they don't have to sit at the same level. I can still contribute, I can still have beautiful conversations, I can still be a great sister, I can, you know, I can still leave people feeling better when they've been in
Mindset Shifts and Embracing Positivity
00:37:54
Speaker
my company, even though physically I'm not feeling great.
00:38:01
Speaker
Yeah. Wow. Yeah. It's so powerful. It doesn't dictate it. Yeah. Yeah. And it really, I guess, it also, I think for people who aren't going through a health crisis at the moment too, it does just also put things into perspective, which is really nice because I know personally, sometimes I find myself in such a negative rut.
00:38:20
Speaker
for no good reason. Like, come on, Cleo. This is silly. You know, journal it out. And then I'm like, oh yeah, really silly. So yeah, it really does. And it is that thing about...
00:38:33
Speaker
you know, focusing on the state that we are in. So often like we just get carried away and suddenly we're in this foul mood and, and actually thinking about, you know, what are the, I heard this thing recently, this amazing man called Simon Reynolds. He was like the advertising guy of like the 90s, 80s and 90s. And his, his incredible sold his like advertising agency for like half a billion dollars. And Ozzy guy has just moved back to Australia from LA some years ago.
00:38:59
Speaker
But he was, he studies like the mindsets of elite athletes and elite performers. And so he's a lot of really interesting information. But one of his things was actually how often do we focus on putting ourselves in an optimal state? Right.
00:39:14
Speaker
And what are, and his advice was think about the three conditions that are the three words that for you put you in your best self, in your best state. And so, you know, for me, for example, it's, it's when I am optimistic.
00:39:30
Speaker
It's when I'm well-slept and when I can get up and journal and have that little bit of time and space in the morning, that puts me in my best state. But, you know, I think often we don't think, well, yeah, what for me puts me in my best state in the day? And he said, actually, elite performers, they're checking on that on an hourly basis. Wow. Okay. Am I in my best state right now? What could I do to change that? What, you know, that repetition, checking in and adjusting as needs fit rather than just like, oh, I'm in a funk.
00:40:00
Speaker
And because it can be comfortable to stay in that funk. Like it can be so comfortable to have a winch, have a gossip, have a, you know, whatever, woe is me on the couch for a day or a week or a month. Yes. And it's like, yeah, it is easier to stay there, but it also doesn't feel very nice at all. No.
00:40:16
Speaker
And it's ultimately not taking you forward. And it's a choice and you can choose to, you know, sometimes you just do need to be in that state and you can allow yourself to do that. But recognizing that, yeah, it's probably once again, you know, timeframe. Yeah. And so you are now.
00:40:36
Speaker
living on the Gold Coast. I am. You are speaking at all sorts of different events and seminars and workplaces. You are pregnant as we've mentioned. Yes. Like where are you now? Where's your head at? How are you feeling? Yeah well you know it's funny about I think you know when I think back to two three years ago just feeling exhausted, depleted,
00:40:57
Speaker
quite hopeless to be honest, you know, which sounds grim, but, you know, I always tried to maintain forward momentum and positivity, but you just, I couldn't see a, you know, I'd just gone through an awful breakup and you just think, well, will this ever feel better? You know, will this get easier?
00:41:16
Speaker
And also on that thing, you know, of just feeling like, you know, especially I think, you know, for women, you've come out after a breakup particularly and you just think, oh gosh, will I ever find someone? And then focusing on what, you know, was really important to me, what was purposeful. And for me that's, it's always been about the environment and climate, but you know, the cancer experience really brought me back to it. How can I use my time purposefully to make impact?
00:41:42
Speaker
And that led me into work that through which I met my, my now partner. Oh my God. I love this stuff. We met, it's very cute. We met on world environment day at a climate fundraiser. And I just met him. I remember just walking into him and just thinking, where have you been my whole life? Like that was just like immediately, immediately. My heart just kind of
00:42:05
Speaker
And when we went on our first date, like a year later, because we worked, we then ended up working together for a year. And he said the same on our first date. He's like, when I first met you, my heart just skipped a beat. I was like, I felt exactly the same. And so it's funny that, yeah, I think sometimes.
00:42:23
Speaker
that there's this, I've just got to tell you this one like Chinese proverb because it's, I have lived by this, this last few years and it's of a Chinese like farmer and his son, right? And they've got this horse and it's their greatest possession, their only asset. One day the horse runs away and everyone says to them, Oh my gosh, that's such bad luck. Like that's your everything. And the dad says, Oh, good luck, bad luck. Who knows?
00:42:50
Speaker
and the next day the horse comes back and it brings with it another 20 wild Rumbies from uphill you know and so then the paddock is full of all these horses and everyone says oh my gosh you're so lucky yeah that's unbelievable you're so good luck bad luck who knows and the next day the sun gets on one of the horses
00:43:06
Speaker
and one of them gets scared from the other horses and he falls off and he breaks his leg everyone says oh my gosh that's such bad luck yes oh good luck bad luck who knows and the next day um like a war has broken out and generals come through the village and they take all the able-bodied men take them off to fight in the war
00:43:24
Speaker
But just this idea that actually we don't know where things are unfolding often and going. And like, so going through, you know, this horrendous breakup that I was like, this is the worst thing. And actually it was the greatest gift of all time because it led me to finding the most beautiful like man I've ever met.
00:43:43
Speaker
my pass around the style community are going to go off on this story like it is literally like i i wake up every day so grateful that oh thank goodness i went through that yes but at the time you can't see it necessarily and you never can and like always looking back everything makes sense and it's so nice to feel that
00:44:00
Speaker
like supported because you're like oh the universe or whoever you believe there was a plan yeah there was a plan and i was supported and it all worked out how it needed to and what's that code as well it kind of relates to your story um you never know what worse luck your bad luck saved you from yeah is that right does that sound right you never know what yeah what worse luck your bad luck saved you from so say if we are in a situation and we
00:44:26
Speaker
force it or whatever. And then it might end to worse luck. But if the bad luck happens and it ends and it's really sad, but then you meet your partner or you get the money or whatever it is. Exactly. And it actually reminds me of a Dalai Lama quote where he says, sometimes not getting what you want is an incredible stroke of good luck. Yes. Yeah. I've just released a podcast on like signs and coincidences and someone asked me like what happens when
00:44:52
Speaker
I don't get my sign that I'm asking for." And I said, like, well, I think that that's a sign in itself. But it doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad thing that you're not getting that sign. It could mean that there are just so many more, like you're thinking too small. There are so many more opportunities for you to open up, let your guard do it. And knowing that abundance and like the universe is actually just full of limitless possibilities. It really is. And so I suppose to tie up that point about the good luck, bad luck, who knows,
00:45:18
Speaker
is just, it's when you're in a really difficult time. And if anyone listening right now, it just feels like they're really in the thick of it right now, whatever's going on. It's like, you've just got to keep scanning for the good, expecting that good things will happen, you know, and just keep programming your mind to be looking for that. Because if you are only looking for the bad, guess what? You find it and you find it everywhere. Yeah. But if you keep looking for the good and scanning for the good, like,
00:45:45
Speaker
It's like, you know, when you go to, they say, um, you might be looking for a car and you want a red car and suddenly you see red cars everywhere where you never saw them before. It's the exact same thing. If you're scanning for the good, you see it and you do find it. Yeah. It's like the, it's the law of attraction working. And what I love about the law of attraction is it says so much science that backs looking for good and finding good and looking for bad and finding bad. There's so much science that backs it.
Finding Love and Purpose: An Optimistic Outlook
00:46:09
Speaker
Yeah. And all those days where we are losing hope and we're thinking, Oh, I can't,
00:46:13
Speaker
you know, think positive and create my positive reality because you're feeling crap. Well, science actually says you can. Well, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. You look at placebo effects. You looked at, um, and, and just one other thing I'd love to just share with your listeners is because this changed my life last year. I did this three day course. It was called the lightning process and it was all about neural, um, pathways basically. And it was to help with my chronic fatigue. And I kid you not in three days,
00:46:40
Speaker
the chronic fatigue just up and left my body. It was insane. And it was all of that. It was scanning for the good. And so literally in terms of your symptoms and how you're feeling, I wasn't allowed to come in and be like, Oh, my neck's hurting. I've got brain fogged. It was like, okay, what's gone really well in the last 24 hours and just getting programming you just to be thinking about what went well.
00:47:01
Speaker
yes because when you've been sick for a long time as well or you've been really anxious for a long time or you know it can be it feels like it's part of you and it's in you yes it's and it's attached to you yeah and it's part of your identity yeah and you
00:47:16
Speaker
fixate on that. Well, if you're fixating on just, oh my God, my neck's hurting, my neck's hurting, my neck's hurting. You're just firing up all the pathways that are just thinking about that. You're not thinking about, oh, actually for 80% of yesterday, my neck didn't hurt and I felt great. So anyway, if anyone's dealing with like a chronic issue or like, you know, even just stress, worry, overwhelm anxiety, the lightening process, it is amazing. Okay, great. We can put a link to in the show notes as well.
00:47:40
Speaker
And I like, I love that too. And you can bring it down to quite a simple way of doing it too. And I think you chat about this in your book where instead of I have to exercise, I get to exercise or I have to go to work. I get to go to work. Like start changing your vocabulary. Words are just so powerful. I mean, it was another thing they taught me in the lightning process was just changing the language of I'm stressed to I'm doing stress.
00:48:08
Speaker
or I'm anxious because you know I hear and I hear young women saying it all the time. Yeah, I'm highly anxious. I'm very anxious. I'm an anxious person that makes it in you. That's something you can't change, but it's not in you. It's a state that you're feeling right now. So what I love about and it sounds a bit weird at first getting used to it, but I'm doing anxiety is it's like a choice now. I'm opting in. I'm actually choosing to do anxiety.
00:48:33
Speaker
And for me it was really helpful with like, I'm exhausted because that's in me, right? I was like, oh, I'm doing exhaustion. Doing exhaustion just for a little bit. I'm just doing a bit of fatigue. Dabbling into fatigue. I'm doing a bit of brain fog. And it is like, it's just wild how much it just takes it out of you and it suddenly just puts it over here.
00:48:52
Speaker
away from you. And it's like, okay, that's actually a passing thing. It's not in me. And I don't want to opt into that. I'm not your problem anymore. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was life changing. Oh, I know that you're a speaker always like this is your job, but like, yeah, like, of course you are. I just listened to you talk and I just want to stay here. That's a lovely, that's a lovely, you're amazing. You're so inspiring and insightful and educating. I think that is the difference with you.
00:49:21
Speaker
is you educate in this really light and gentle way. That's inspiring, really is. Well, it's so nice for me, I think, to, you know, turn something's been really difficult.
00:49:35
Speaker
into something that's helpful for other people. Like it's just the ultimate, you know, I get the most beautiful messages from people all around the world that are just going through the most difficult things, be it, you know, having lost someone like a lost, you know, a partner, um, dealing with immense grief and just to hear them say, this idea is really helping me today. It's just the greatest feeling. So yeah, it works both ways. It's yeah.
00:49:59
Speaker
So tell my listeners where they can find you and your book and everything. Yeah. So I, I spend way too much time on the gram, on the Instagram. So it's Bryony Benjamin, B R I O N Y Benjamin. Uh, otherwise, yeah. Um, my book is available anywhere you can get books really online.
00:50:18
Speaker
Big W, did I get it? Yeah, Big W, Kmart, Target. I think they've all got it. So, yeah. How good. And I'll put all those links in the show notes as well. Amazing. But thank you so much. It's been such a fun conversation. It's been so fun. I feel like we've, um, we could chat for hours, but I feel like we've known each other for a really long time. So it's really nice. So thank you for your,
00:50:38
Speaker
Yeah, just gorgeous warmth and energy and you're such a beautiful interviewer. Oh my god! I was so nervous for today. I knew that as soon as you walked in, I would be fine because I knew that you're such a lovely, beautiful person, but I don't know. I'm just still, you know, working through limiting beliefs, self-doubt, all of that. It's called being a woman sometimes. And I was just saying, channel your average mediocre white guy, you know? Literally, I need to do that more. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, thank you, Brianie.