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199 / Re-Enfranchised 001 - Beetlejuice Beetlejuice (20024)
59 Plays2 months ago
“The ‘Juice is loose.”
And now for something completely different…
We promised in the early days that we’d make sure to cover any sequels to any film we’ve ever covered… and that means that Brett, Stephen, and Tucker all made their respective ways to the theater this weekend to catch the latest Tim Burton offering in order to make good on that promise! Join them all as they discuss the highs, the lows, and all points in between in this spoiler-heavy conversation about this long-awaited sequel!
While we’re all waiting at the station to board the Soul Train, be sure to give us a follow on these social platforms:
- @Disenfranchpod on Bluesky, Facebook, Instagram, Letterboxd, and YouTube.
- Email us your thoughts or requests to [email protected]
- Rate and review us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!
- Find Stephen at @ChewyWalrus on Bluesky, Instagram, and Letterboxd.
- Check out Stephen’s first novel - Check In, Check Out - on Amazon, now available in paperback or ebook: https://amzn.to/44idk8y
- Find Brett at @sus_warlock on Letterboxd.
- Find Tucker at @icenine09 on YouTube and Instagram and @tuck_mugs on Instagram.
- Join our Patreon for exclusive bonus content, including bi-weekly episodes of What Are We Watching? at https://patreon.com/Disenfranchpod
- Watch our big screen debut in Circle City Supernatural from our buddy J.P. Leck! You can either buy it on BluRay through his website, buy/rent it through Amazon Prime, or watch it free with ads on Tubi!
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Transcript
Themes of Moving Forward
00:00:20
Speaker
I'll say good for you Spring was never waiting for us, dear listeners. It ran one step ahead, and we followed in the dance. We, the disenfranchised podcast, followed in the dance.
Failed Franchises and Sequel Promises
00:00:33
Speaker
That's right, that podcast, all about those franchises of one, those films that fancy themselves full-fledged franchises before falling flat on their face after the first film.
00:00:42
Speaker
Except when we get it the fuck wrong. I was about to say hold on, Steven. Wait a minute. What are you talking about? That's bad. That is normally what we do here. ah Except a couple of a couple four years ago, Brett, you and I talked about a little movie from the 80s called the Beetlejuice.
00:01:02
Speaker
And Tim Burton, in his infinite fucking wisdom, decided to cash in with a sequel. And so we promised all the way back in 2020, that cursed year that is still cursing us to this day with sequels to Beetlejuice, that we would cover any sequel to any movie that we'd ever cover that ever comes
Errors and Introductions
00:01:22
Speaker
out. And this is the first time we have ever had to make good on that promise. Ladies and gentlemen and others, welcome to re-enfranchise the podcast where we get it the fuck wrong. Where we admit, like the grownups that we are, that we got it wrong. Speak for yourself, Steven. Hey, fuck you. Grownups. LOL. You married the fuck into this. Oh, you're right. I did.
00:01:49
Speaker
And so yeah, that's us, we got it wrong. um So I'm i am your host, Steven Foxworthy. ah Joining me is always the man who knows how to leave a cake out in the rain. It's Tucker. Hey Tucker, how's it going? Hi Steven, how are you doing? I am okay.
00:02:06
Speaker
I'm okay. Yup. That's me. Uh, and also joining us today back for his third episode in a row. Don't call it a comeback. We're not anymore at this point. I mean, at this point, he's just back, right? Right? Yeah. and think Right. yeah right brett Um, ah let's, let's be honest. I don't, I don't think that he can take it because it took him so long to bake it and he'll never have that recipe again. It's the great Brett, w right? Brett, how we doing, man?
00:02:33
Speaker
the This really is just a brand new world. You introduced Tucker before me. It's a completely new show. I mean, it's weird. I don't know how to feel now. I'm sorry. Everything's turned on its head.
00:02:48
Speaker
ages before beauty right That's true. You're right. You're the pretty one. Is is a topsy turvy world we live in. And this is how topsy and
Beetlejuice Sequel: Spoilers and Reviews
00:02:58
Speaker
turvy it is. We're covering a new release sequel. We're covering a movie that came out in theaters last weekend as of the air date of this podcast. This weekend, as of the recording, we don't even have box office information yet because we all saw it in previews. Right. We're were the Wednesday, Thursday crowd.
00:03:16
Speaker
I went Friday, but yeah. Well, except for Steven. But yeah, that's that's where we are right now. ah So that having been said, I'm just going to get this out of the way right quick. um We're going to spoil the shit out of two thousand and twenty four is Beetlejuice Beetlejuice, the sequel to Tim Burton's 1988 classic Beetlejuice.
00:03:39
Speaker
um And so if you want to avoid the spoiler talk that is definitely going to be coming in the next few minutes, ah get it pause this, go watch for the Beetlejuice Beetlejuice, and come back to this when you're done. If you don't care about spoilers, then do whatever the fuck you want. I'm not your mom.
00:03:56
Speaker
no There were there were a few genuinely surprising things in this film. So like I think you should probably go see it. I mean, preserve your experience if you care about that. Yeah. Yeah. That's where some people know. If you're a fan of the original, you should totally go. yeah that's Absolutely. what i saying Yeah. It's worth seeing. Did I like it? No. Am I glad I saw it? Yes. There to there it is. Yeah. That's kind of where we are.
00:04:21
Speaker
well I'm still processed. like I don't know know how I feel about it. like I don't know if I like it. yeah There are things I liked, there are things I didn't. And I feel like the didn't kind of outweighs the dead just a little bit. So much. So it depends how I'm feeling when I think about it. And that's fine. But always the bad and sometimes the bad always good. and um I should have gave this two and a half stars because it's like right down the fricking middle. And that's where I landed spoilers for the end of this episode. I do think that it it ends up being at a three. It's spoilers for my rating later, but I landed on a three. like
00:04:59
Speaker
There's more good than bad. I think really if I were to make a decision gun to my head It'd be be more good than bad, but it's real close. It's real close. Okay, so you're at that like 2.75 territory 2.8 2.8. Yeah, we'll just round that up to three. There you go. Yeah, might as well at that point Um, so we went and saw this this weekend. Uh, you guys saw it Thursday. I saw it Friday. Um, what, uh, just initial impressions of Beatle juice, Beatle juice. Well, who are you asking? Whoever wants to talk first. Tucker, you already started. So go. Yeah. I always want to talk. I know. That's why you're on a podcast. So my favorite part of this movie was the opening credits.
00:05:44
Speaker
Mine, too, probably because it was nostalgia vibes. Yeah. um Like and yeah I'm not you know, I'm not and like kind of the opposite of Brett where I'm just not an nostalgic guy at all. Like I fall victim to it, but I i you have to drag me into it kicking and screaming basically. And the beginning of this movie, though, i I kind of I kind of started to tear up just a little bit. Me too. Just a little bit because that David Geffen logo came up and then the titles were The same and I saw all those names and I was like, I know all those people. Yeah. And I really enjoyed the opening credits. um The rest of the movie. ah I guess whatever, like there's so many parts during it where I'm like, I just don't fucking care. Mm hmm. Like who gives a shit about any of this? Like it's one of those movies that I could have walked out at any time and not given a fuck if anybody had ever told me how it resolved.
00:06:41
Speaker
I don't care. I don't fucking care. But what I did like, what I did like, which is what I should have not liked because it was the biggest like callback, like recycled thing in the film was the musical sequence. But I did like it because it was like they took the musical sequence from Beetlejuice and mixed it with the end of Manhunter.
00:07:05
Speaker
and wowzers like like the instrumental to MacArthur park is playing and all the ghost cops are coming up to the thing you know right I'm like shit manhunter here we go but but butpapa let's go let's go I really dug that um the fact that it wasn't just like You know, they expanded upon it is what I'm saying. They took this the the simple idea of like a poltergeist controlling people and making them dance and sing to a song, which I thought was way less convincing this time, though, for some reason. I don't know what it was about it. Maybe it's way it was shot, but I it didn't I didn't believe it like I did in the first one that they were like singing and stuff.
00:07:46
Speaker
Uh, but I did appreciate the, the, the cops approaching and everything during the instrumental parts of MacArthur park, though I couldn't stop thinking that I'd hear a dinosaur roar at some point because in the weird owl version, that's where all the dinosaurs roar is during the instrumental part. do do do do do do do do do do dood dodoo dood do do do do dooo do dooo ra Yeah, all that stuff. Yeah. But other than that, I really didn't like it.
00:08:11
Speaker
I thought, I thought everybody, um, I, I think what this film suffered from was a really really, really, really, really, really, really ridiculously bad script because everything about everything else about this movie is, is fine. Like Tim Burton is he, the direction is great. I think the cinematography is good. The colors are, I think they do their best to kind of match the aesthetic of the first though. I think that was kind of lightning in a bottle. Um,
00:08:42
Speaker
but I think ah Catherine O'Hara was fantastic. I thought Winona Ryder was good. All the returning cast was good. um I like how they handled um Jeffrey Jones not being there.
00:08:55
Speaker
We're the only time you saw his face. He was animated. Well, and then how did this get a PG-13? This was gory as fuck. Really? This is an R. It's an R. I'm going to say it. I don't know. Maybe the MPAA was like, oh, it's Beetlejuice 2, PG-13, whatever. If they hadn't bleeped that second fuck.
00:09:13
Speaker
that it would have been kind of took me out of it because like you they had seened if they had made a joke out of it but being beeped, like somehow made some sort of fourth wall joke about it, it would have been funny. But I know they just did it so they didn't get an R. Exactly. And they even covered his face like what is the unrated cut just going to have be able to see his mouth saying it and him actually saying it. Yep. And honestly, they could have cut that out because the fuck they did drop was fantastic. Exactly. Fantastic.
00:09:40
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you could have you could have easily made that a hell or shit like you could have easily made that anything else but you decided to bleep it that I don't like it. It's a choice. It's just not a good one.
00:09:53
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. I agree. i I have things to say to all of that, but I want to like make sure we we we come to a lot of that stuff organically. um I also wanted to say that I thought that Michael Keaton was good, but they didn't give him anything to do. And because I think they were afraid of
Character Performances and Critiques
00:10:11
Speaker
hurting him.
00:10:12
Speaker
because he's so old because he ah he is old Beetlejuice in this. He barely moves at all. Like he is in the first one. He is a kinetic ball of energy. He's a fucking Looney toon. Yeah. In the first one. And this one, he's just kind of walking around. I mean, he's Beetlejuice, but he's like if he's sleeping with Prince Valium tonight in this movie.
00:10:34
Speaker
Beetlejuice is and it's it sucks because I just saw the wired auto complete interview with Michael Keaton and the man is 73 years old and he's very animated in that that video. Yeah, he could have been jumping around all over the place. Probably not as much as the original, but they don't like they really, really like tranquilized him like somebody behind Michael Keaton, the whole shoot, like the way the crazy and they film in such a way that you're like,
00:11:02
Speaker
We're trying to get as much as we can out of close-ups and like dollies in. like There's very few like full-body stunt work things done. like You get the upper half of him a lot, or you'll get like a shot of his feet. But very rarely are you seeing him, his full body, doing something outrageous in this movie.
00:11:21
Speaker
I think the thing then was 72 making this film. Let's be very clear I think the thing that the only thing that holds us back almost as much as the script is um Some of the decisions that Tim Burton makes um I like the the the stop-motion animation showing ah Charles Deets' death and everything. That was cool. And and then when Beetlejuice is telling the story of his of his first wife, which is a really grand story for something that doesn't end up being shit in the plot until the end,
00:11:59
Speaker
um And how do you waste homegirl from The Matrix Reloaded? Like, damn, how do you waste her? But they did. They gave her a really great introduction. And then after that, you're like, oh, this girl who gives a fuck. Mm hmm. Oh, she's sucking Danny DeVito's soul out. OK, cool. Well, we got to see Danny DeVito didn't know he was in this, surprisingly.
00:12:19
Speaker
um ah but yeah the whole part where he was doing that in Spanish and it sounded like it was in a record and everything that was cool but it didn't it was a weird choice that just didn't fit the way all the weird choices in the original fit it felt like Tim Burton was trying really hard to be old Tim Burton And like I commend them for that. I respect everybody in this movie for doing what they did and I respect them for trying something different. They didn't just they didn't just shoot this script through the fan service machine. You know, they really tried to make something that while staying true to the original and hitting a few of those beats was essentially its own thing. And I respect that. But I still didn't like the movie. That's my two cents or 75 cents. I was going to say we're I think we're up to about 350 at this point. my That's my 15 dollars worth right there.
00:13:08
Speaker
Twenty for inflation. Inflation's a son of a bitch. Yeah, it really is. Brett, what are your initial Betelgeuse, Betelgeuse thoughts? Two boy. Well, so it looks like it's going to fall on me to be the positive voice. You don't have to be. You just say whatever you feel, man. But look, man, I feel like I have to be because I. That's something new then. hi Well, sure, it is not saying it's not. I feel like he's saying it is actually. Is he?
00:13:37
Speaker
but like Well, because like, if, if, if I am pretty much 50 50 on good and bad, uh, you two are on the bad. So I gotta, I gotta pick up the slack and tell people what's good about this movie. i suppose That's true. That's true. Um, i thought otherwise they're not going to want to go see it. Um, recommended, even though we didn't like it, I recommend it.
00:13:59
Speaker
No, no, that's what we call a mixed message. Really weird recommendation, but your project is going to like this, but you should definitely see it. but I mean, he said he didn't like it, but he's glad he saw it. And and your mileage may vary. Not everything we like is something you're gonna like, like take it with a grain of salt. I read critics that I don't agree with all the time. For me, it's like I wish that I hadn't paid $20 to go see it at the theater when I probably would have enjoyed it more if I had just sat at home and watched it on streaming in three months.
00:14:30
Speaker
And that's kind of where I fell. like i if If I didn't have to watch it for this, I would have waited till I hit streaming and I would have been probably fine with that experience and probably would have said, glad I didn't pay $20 to see this in theaters. ah But here we are.
00:14:44
Speaker
Yeah, I'm sorry. bre sorry brett Anyway, no, it's fine. ah where Whereas I, I mean, I was happy to see it opening weekend. Look, it's one of my, it's up there and one of my favorite movies of all time. So had I not gone to see it opening weekend, you know, what kind of a fan would I be? So that's, that's why I had to do it. Not, you know, let's not talk about frozen empire and how long I waited to see it, but that's neither here nor there.
00:15:13
Speaker
Um, look, you brought that up. I wasn't, I didn't know. So I wasn't going to say anything. I thought I'd mentioned that at some point oh yeah already. Maybe I did. Maybe I've slept since then. So have I, um, but anyway, I have not, we know.
00:15:28
Speaker
Like you've been very busy. That makes sense. All right. So the movie. I agree with a decent amount of what Tucker said. I think the movie is very disjointed. The writing is pretty bad. A lot of stuff doesn't make any sense. It doesn't go anywhere.
00:15:50
Speaker
um
00:15:52
Speaker
it you know because like the original is like the one very straightforward storyline and this one has like five different storylines going on all at the same time and None of them really matter. And the first one moves at such a breakneck pace, too. And this one just seems to slog along the entire time. Sorry to interrupt, Brett, but you made me think of that yeah like the original. It's like Back to the Future, where like every second counts. Nothing is wasted in the original. Like it all is just barrels through like a fucking freight train. Yeah. but I mean, I i don't I don't know if I ever thought it dragged at all.
00:16:30
Speaker
It was just more like, it's like, there was just too much going on. ah yeah And I mean, I didn't laugh as much as I expected to, do but I did laugh. There were some there were some pretty funny parts. me too I mean, the biggest thing that I'm going to have a problem with is like the the original,
00:16:57
Speaker
gives you just enough logic to understand how the afterlife in this universe works. This one gives you too much, and now I have too many questions. just It doesn't make any sense. um now Now I'm asking questions that you probably don't have answers to, Tim Burton, and you shouldn't have done that. Well, and they don't they don't even try to explain it. It's like the it's like this see the kid that killed his parents.
00:17:25
Speaker
Um, like he's just like, well, I take you with me and then like, uh, something happens and like you're dead and I'm not. We don't know what i'm I'm getting my passport stamped. I guess that's part of it. I suppose who know these words in this order, we walk through this door and I'm alive and you're not. Yeah. Yeah.
00:17:46
Speaker
that i mean but no This is one of the situations where like I say none of it makes sense, but the one example you guys bring up is explained. like What are you talking about? like It's in the handbook. He explains how it works. They explain what happens. Like that handbook is used for a lot of hand waving in this movie, though. It's a lot thicker in this movie, too. I don't know if it's gotten twice as thick. Right. It's a huge old MacGuffin. Well, and you know, it's been what, 35 years. So, you know, they've they've sure they have expanded additions, updated additions, you know, like travel guides. You get the updated additions and there's forwards and afterwards.
00:18:24
Speaker
There's a whole chapter on how to deal with Beetlejuice, too. so Nice. Well, that's probably a new one. Yeah, sure that's what I'm saying. The Maitlands probably added that one when they loophole their way out of their house. Exactly. Wait, there's a whole section about Beetlejuice? Where does it say that in the movie? No, I'm just, I'm missing. Oh, OK. I thought you were legitimately saying there was. No, and no. Did I miss something? Nope. Just be bopping and scatting all over the place. You said it's a matter of fact. You said it's a matter of faculty. I was like, what did I miss something?
00:18:52
Speaker
yeah um But yeah, it's like, one of my biggest ones going, what was the soul train before the 70s? Like, um and what was it? Like, did it just not have a theme? that That's my guess. Yeah, maybe that's what it was. Like, it was just ah really boring. And then when soul train came along, the afterlife was like, Hey, we have an actual soul train.
00:19:18
Speaker
It was just a regular degular ghost train. And then it becomes a soul train later. Once once once they have the real world theming, someone from that show dies and is like, guys, I've got to tell you about this thing we have up on Earth now. And they're like, you know what? Fuck it. It's that from now on plus um a conductor. Isn't he the host of soul train is supposed to be is supposed to be. Yeah, I think so. So it may have been what happened.
00:19:45
Speaker
There you go. I was when he died, everyone got really excited. He's here. He can lead this train now. Let's make it official. Also, ah Tim Burton had to ah find a place to put all the people of color in this movie because otherwise there wouldn't have been any. It's like the first one. So I mean, it is a Tim Burton movie. Let's let's be real. Yep.
00:20:13
Speaker
he loves He loves his people pale, Tim Burton. He really does. That's that's not a that's not a remark on his his political beliefs at all, just is his general aesthetic. His aesthetic preferences, yes. Yes. Everybody real, real pale in them Tim Burton movies. Real, real pale. Pale or blue? Yes. Blue. And there's no in between. That's another question. Why are some dead people blue?
00:20:44
Speaker
Why are some not? And like in the original, it sort of implied that if you kill yourself, you're a servant of the afterlife, but that doesn't seem to be the actual case. Well, there is a there's a headline on the newspaper about a civil servant strike. So my guess is like the hot dog on a stick. Ladies, just a scab. Hmm. OK. Look at that. Because we're telling because if she knew now what she knew, then she wouldn't have had her little accident.
Narrative Twists and Cultural References
00:21:12
Speaker
And I like seeing that joke in the original pays off really well with the Oh, what happens when people commit suicide in the afterlife, they become civil servants, and then all the injuries of everyone working in civil service make total sense like the guy that throws himself in front of the car. um The you know, the lady who slit her own throat and smokes coming out of her neck, like it all makes sense at that point. But But we don't, that doesn't correlate over here. But ah again, there's that one little headline on the paper that Beetlejuice is reading in one scene. And they linger on it just long enough that I'm like, that's something. What does that say? Civil servant strike. Okay, so when I saw a Hot Dog and a Stick Lady later, and I couldn't see what her deal was, I was like, Oh, she's probably just a scab.
00:21:54
Speaker
know yeah Like some pro union or union-esque messaging in Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, not something I expected. So yeah. That's catch, Steven. I didn't notice that. and i do i now Now I like this movie 1, I'm sorry, 0.3% more.
00:22:11
Speaker
That's what happens when you see it on the biggest possible screen. There you go. That's what it is. And I mean, I was actively trying to read the headlines of all the newspapers that they they show. Like i I must have just missed that one. So because I'm like, there's there's stuff here. Yeah. And so I must have missed that. But that's one of those when it comes out on Mac so you can ride that pause button. Yeah. um Because, yeah, I mean, like Willem Dafoe's character, like, I mean,
00:22:41
Speaker
Bye. what it like if you if you're a star who regularly plays. No, man, I really like this character. I thought one of my favorite parts of the movie is everything Willem Dafoe is doing. Running gag of him constantly being handed a cup of coffee. Yes, I do. Like, look, I like Willem Dafoe, but he's not in this movie. He's in some other movie. And I'm how I like that. It's in this movie. That's the point. I like that. actor He's an actor from a major action franchise who always plays a like a like Hard-boiled detectives. Like, of course he's in a different movie. Yeah. No, I i have no complaints about what Willem Dafoe is doing in this movie. None whatsoever. No, no. It's perfect. Ten out of ten. Yes, please. Cut print. Yeah. dude yeah here Yeah. Yeah. do Yeah. see What else?
00:23:36
Speaker
I mean, the reveal of the ghost kid saw that coming a mile away. See, I did not. And so I was I love the Beetlejuice. I am i'm with you, Tucker. I totally bought it. Like I i was right there until he showed up. i like Met the other the teenager. No, the the kid. Oh, bench oh that kid said the kid that killed his parents. Yeah, I didn't see it coming. And honestly, it kind of made that make more sense because like I'm expecting, you know, Ortega's character to maybe get hurt or or die during that experience. And especially when she hits that tree, I'm like, oh, shit. Yeah, she's dead. And I'm like, oh, no, she just met a boy.
00:24:19
Speaker
Now we're doing this. Now we're fucking doing this. Fantastic. Until she comes into the house and they don't show her parents faces intentionally. And I'm like, oh, yeah, okay they're all dead. See, and that's I didn't pick up on that. I'm like that. I thought they might be like they might be cast with like some like some of the same actors that are in other parts of the film. And I thought that was going to be a funny reveal later. That's that's where my head was at at that scene. um So no, when when that reveal happened, I was like, oh,
00:24:49
Speaker
Well, OK, then. But now the reveal that he killed them and like he's actually bad was that I didn't see coming. So I mean, that's bad at least. So I guess that was a bit of a twist. It feels weird that Lydia wouldn't know him, though, if it happened 23 years ago and she grew up in that town. It feels weird that she wouldn't know that story or wouldn't know about or wouldn't have known that kid.
00:25:15
Speaker
I mean, so 23 years ago would be 2001. She was in high school. Well, yeah she would have been in her late 20s. She probably wouldn't have been.
00:25:27
Speaker
She would have left. you a nu Yeah, she would not been living there. And also ah they make it kind of ambiguous how much time any of them spent there after the Beetlejuice thing, because they're always talking about how it was Charles's house and how um Lydia had been off doing the show and Delia's in New York doing art stuff. So it's really unclear how much time any of them outside of Charles spent at that house in the following years or in them in the in between years.
00:25:56
Speaker
done but Especially after they, you know, got the Maitland's their loophole. Yeah. Right. what Which I mean, I understand from a real world perspective. Yeah. It like it doesn't make any sense, because like if you get Gina Davis and I like bald one back, then you're going to have to see G.I. D age them because it doesn't make any sense for ghost. age Well, that was the interview that they when they asked Gina Davis why she wasn't in this movie, she said, well, because ghosts don't age. She's like, not that I have, but yeah not the not that I have, but ghosts don't age. Only demons, trickster demons, apparently. Right.
00:26:31
Speaker
Didn't think we'd notice the makeup. Come on, guys. I know how old Michael Keaton is. Particularly michael keaton particularly in like a higher, a higher, quality a higher film grade quality or a higher like picture quality. Like, yeah, we can we can we we can see them. We can see the makeup. We can see the wrinkles, dude. I mean, he looks fantastic for a 73 year old. Doesn't look a day over 55. Right. Just turned 73 like yeah a couple of days ago as of this recording, like last week as of this airing. But yeah.
00:26:59
Speaker
Yeah, and also it does, even though it in the movie, I don't know what it was. Like I knew that already and I knew that's why they weren't in the movie. I don't know why it feels so cheap in the movie, though, like it is literally just like a quick one. So we just a little more more like when they're in the attic, we need a box of like maybe of their stuff that they have to find something in other than the fucking model. Right. Yeah.
00:27:26
Speaker
I mean, the model the model is theirs. But at this point, after you've seen the original, it's not just the thing that that a the Alec Baldwin built, it's.
00:27:37
Speaker
It's a character in the story, right? But we need to just just a little something like maybe a letter or maybe some photos while they're looking for something just and not things where they're like nice. Yeah, not stuff where it's like look movie going on. It's like this, which is like something over here where if you're looking for it, you're like, oh, there's a there's a photo of Gina Davis. and oh Oh, shit. There's Juno or something. You know, just a few. I mean, I don't know why we need to bring Juno, your case worker.
00:28:02
Speaker
in on it, but it'd be nice to see a photo of her. She probably died a long time ago. I was going to say her last movie was Tim Burton's Mars Attack. So she's been gone for a while. Yeah. Because she was in the nursing home. Yeah. She's the grandma listening to the music, like bobbing her head back and forth. Yeah. like AKA one of the best fucking parts of that movie. Yes, dude. Oh, I do love that movie. I love, one I love Mars. That's maybe like my second or third favorite Tim Burton movie overall. I think it's one of the last great Tim Burton movies, not the last good one, and one of the last great ones. Not one of his best either, but one of my favorites. I will say objectively, probably not a great film, but one that I unabashedly love in spite of
Nostalgia and Absences
00:28:40
Speaker
myself.
00:28:40
Speaker
Because it's so Tim Burton-y. It's very burttony it's very Burton-y, but it's also like I love the cast of that thing. And it's so fucking goofy and plays on all of those old like 50s sci fi tropes that you just know Burton fucking loves. And it's it's so much fun. ah Yeah, Jack Burton or Jack Nicholson in the multiple roles, Jack Burton, your old pal Jack Burton. No, Jack Nicholson in the multiple roles. God, that movie is great.
00:29:08
Speaker
And Tom Jones, you can't go wrong with Tom Jones. You really fucking can't. That movie launched a ah youthful obsession with Tom Jones and young Steven. Ditto, except I'm not Steven. Right. I was not young Steven. That's funny. You look so much like me, it's uncanny. Surprisingly, we were both young Steven, but at some point we split. Some mitosis up in this shit. Yes, we are the same child. We are different adults.
00:29:38
Speaker
Branch timelines and shit. Yes. I'm sorry, bro. We keep interrupting you. No, its it's quite. It is our nature. Mars Attacks is fine. um Yeah, no, I know. I'm i'm just kidding, dude. I don't care. I would probably not even in my top five Tim Burton movies. No, and it looks it shouldn't be in anyone's top five Tim Burton, but it is in mine. So I'm just going to say that. I mean, it shouldn't be, but it absolutely is because I love that movie. I get it.
00:30:07
Speaker
You know, I watched like when I talk about Tim Burton movies real quick. I watched Sleepy Hollow because now is the time to the season. The time is now. And I'd been wanting to watch it again. And yeah, God damn, I love that movie. You do. You really do love that movie is if you look, if I didn't have the nostalgia piece for Beetlejuice, Sleepy Hollow might be my favorite Tim Burton. Yo, should I watch that again? Because I really didn't like it when I saw it when it came out. Should I reassess it? Depends on why you didn't like it.
00:30:36
Speaker
I don't know, when did it come out? What year did it come out? 1999, if I'm not mistaken. Oh, because I was chasing girls around. yeah I didn't have time for that Tim Burton shit. I discovered that was the summer I turned pretty. So I discovered that I could get ladies pretty easily. So I was more focused on that, really. Tucker Tucker got mad horny in that period. That was Tucker's mad horny period. And he's like, you should love Sleepy Hollow for nothing else than the absolutely insanely stacked cast that movie is. It's it's pretty. I think that was literally in it.
00:31:10
Speaker
OK, Johnny Depp, Christina Ricci, Miranda Richardson, Michael Gambon, Casper Van Deen, Jeffrey Jones, ah Richard Griffiths, Ian McDermott, Michael Goff, Christopher Walken. Christopher Lee is in it. There he is. Alan Armstrong. ah So, yeah, there you go. Like that's and I mean, now we're below the we're well well below the title at this point, and I'm still picking people that I love.
00:31:39
Speaker
um Yeah, now we're getting into people I don't know as well. um But yeah, no, unbelievable cast. yes jeffrey Martin Landau. Martin Landau, yeah. What's going on with Jeffrey Jones? Amadeus is Jeffrey Jones.
00:31:51
Speaker
Uh, registered sex offender, Jeffrey Jones, registered pedophile Jeffrey Jones. Yes. The reason that he's, you know, getting in half in this movie. Right. The reason that you, you, you literally don't see his face unless it's the CG animated stop motion thing. Well, there's a photo, but the, the only, the only thing that really brought him back deadwood brought him back for the movie, which I understand you can't do a deadwood movie without that character. You can't. You just need to kill him off in the first five minutes and don't have him around when there's kids on the set.
00:32:22
Speaker
I know this is one of the worst ones. This is again where I'm making this about me instead of the victims of the crime like I normally do. But um like man, I'm so mad at Jeffrey Jones because he because he's bad for doing the things he did. But also because because he did that now he can't be in movies anymore. You know what?
00:32:44
Speaker
I fucking love watching that guy in movies. Every movie that he's in that that I have seen, he's one of the best parts. Always. Ever Ferris Bueller's Day off? Best part of that movie.
00:32:56
Speaker
Best part of that movie. I mean, I'm inclined to agree with you, but Mr. Rooney, come on. You got to separate the art from the artist in this situation. And that's what I'm saying. It's like, fuck that guy. But also, holy shit, I love him in every movie. Yeah. And he's a movie he's a pretty big part of a lot of iconic 80s movies. So like he's and he is a Tim Burton regular collaborator, too. So if you're a Tim Burton fan. You got a record with Jeffrey Jones. You got it. He's and he's Chris. Well, you know, in Ed Wood. Yeah.
00:33:23
Speaker
Tim Burton's best movie, in my opinion. I agree. Hard agree. It and don't get better. But I do appreciate that I feel like this is, Beetlejuice Beetlejuice is also kind of like,
00:33:39
Speaker
Tim Burton going, man, I thought I like this guy. You know, I thought I knew you. I thought I knew you. But like, ah do so you're going to be a piece of shit. I'm going to get you bitten in half by a shark. Your character is going to be in this movie, but you ain't, motherfucker. And i I thought that was really good because he could maybe feel that way. And it was brutal. But at the same time, I feel like ah the character from the first one is preserved and respected in the second film.
00:34:06
Speaker
Like they may be like fuck Jeffrey Jones, but they're not like fuck Charles Deets. Right. Like they keep that. And I I did get a little misty eyed when the animation came up and I was like, Jeffrey Jones, why? Why have you forsaken us? And i it looks like a young Jeffrey Jones looks like it looks. Oh, it looks great.
00:34:27
Speaker
And it's in that Burton kind of weird animation style, like all the stop motion stuff. It, it looked a little too clean for me like it looked a bit like it was all done on computers instead of with actual clay which I mean, sure, it's probably cheaper and less time consuming, but like Tim Burton. And also pretty much literally everything else is practical in this movie. Right. There's, there's, there's a lot of stuff that's not, but there is a decent amount that is like, I loved, loved Willem Dafoe's makeup in this movie. And that is a hundred percent practical. There's a lot, a whole lot more in this movie that is practical that we have seen in a film of, of this budget and of this stature in decades.
00:35:11
Speaker
Yeah. I would say. Yeah. and i And again, we are, all of us on the disenfranchised podcast, hard practical
Practical Effects and Plot Critiques
00:35:19
Speaker
effects stands. like We love them. We will always stand for them in every situation. And there are some really good ones in this movie. like There's a lot of great makeup effects. um i you know I called out, Monica Baluchi's are really good.
00:35:33
Speaker
Um, Monica Baluchi, AKA the character that goes nowhere. Like, look, Tim, we know you like showing off your side pieces in movies, like, or your, your, your girlfriends and wives in movies. Like we know you love that. Uh, but you know, normally usually you've given them a reason to be there as opposed to whatever the fuck Monica Baluchi is doing in this movie. Yeah. If only like, it makes sense if you follow that storyline, like you set up that storyline.
00:36:03
Speaker
That's cool. And then you free forget about her for most of the movie. This movie has four villains. If you count Beetlejuice, this movie has four villains. And it doesn't have enough running time to devote the necessary time to any of them.
00:36:25
Speaker
And so what we end up, this this script feels like something that has been in development for 30 years. And there's enough pieces in there that they weren't willing to part with. And so this feels like a Frankenstein of like four different movies.
00:36:43
Speaker
that we hodgepodge and kind of stitched together or stapled together um to make something that felt vaguely coherent. And I'm leaning very heavily on vaguely there. Like this feels like a movie that has been written and rewritten and gone back over with a fine tooth comb over and over and over again until what's left is coherent enough for a Hollywood blockbuster, but not coherent enough for an actual story.
00:37:13
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, because like and it's it's not that. All four of those villains need more time because like the killer teen that I mean, that's a pretty self contained storyline. It doesn't have a whole lot of meat on the bone. It's I will say my favorite storyline of all the other ones. It could have easily been the B plot to the main A plot. Correct. That's it. You don't need the other two, but like.
00:37:43
Speaker
They wanted to add the other two for some reason. So yes, I did get shunted off to varying degrees. And. Yeah, I don't I don't really know where I was going with that, but I mean, it's kind of. Yeah. Yeah, it did that's my biggest complaint is that it's all over the place. Yeah, it it it's not. There is no coherence coherence to this movie whatsoever like it's and that's sorry.
00:38:11
Speaker
No, I just know i mean, that's that's my biggest complaint. is that there's And and it's it's a it's a modern Hollywood problem. It's not just a legacy sequel problem. It's a modern Hollywood problem. It's that we don't have enough of a story to fill a certain runtime, so we have to jam-pack it with as much as possible. Or we have all these big actors. We have to give them all enough to do within the confines of the film.
00:38:36
Speaker
so that they feel like their time's not being wasted. They feel like they're having a good experience. And so we're just chucking everything we can into the script, regardless of whether it makes sense. And in this case, as I had to say, a lot of it doesn't.
00:38:52
Speaker
And it's difficult not to compare it to the original in the way that you remember. Do you remember last week when I was saying why ah it's OK, the Beatles uses and in the movie until like 45 minutes in in the original is because that's those characters. That story is interesting enough.
00:39:12
Speaker
Right to where not only does it carry us to that point, but we still give a shit about it after Beetlejuice arrives, which is very difficult to pull off. But instead, this one just has this story, this story, that story and that story. And a couple of them are related to Beetlejuice and none of them are really that good. And I i don't give a shit about any of them.
00:39:34
Speaker
about half About halfway through this movie, I'm looking at my watch going, Beetlejuice has been in a lot of this motherfucker. I was promised he was not going to be in much of this movie. And like they I think they overuse Beetlejuice. As much as I like what Keaton's doing in this movie, and as much as he's able to dial it back to 88 the way that he did in the original,
00:39:53
Speaker
Like, there's there's too much, like, you need to pepper that in. Like, that needs to be a spice you sparingly. No, I think that's what they do, though, is they, the reason it feels like he's in this more, which he isn't, it's about the same amount of time, is that they do pepper him in instead of bringing him in and him moving the story forward until the end of the movie, like he does in the first one. And this one, within the first 10 minutes, you get, like, a 30-second scene with Beetlejuice. And the next five minutes, you get another 30-second scene of what Beetlejuice is doing. and and then over the next three three to five minutes, you can see him again. It's not that he's in it more, he's just in more of it. Does that make sense? Like he's he's a little bit here, a little bit here, a little bit here, instead of like when he comes in, you get one little, like when he's reading the paper, that's the only time you really get to to hear him or anything before he makes this big entrance.
00:40:42
Speaker
You know, and but in this one immediately, he's just there and he's every couple minutes we check back in with him. And it's not that those scenes are long. It's just that they happen all the fucking time. And so there's no it's it's not a reward anymore. You're just right. It's just part of everything else that's happening. It doesn't feel special. No, it certainly doesn't.
00:41:05
Speaker
Which is part of the what what we're saying a lot is that it's all over the place. like So you have to you have to constantly be cutting back to Beetlejuice. When Beetlejuice isn't on screen, the audience needs to be asking, where's Beetlejuice? Where's Beetlejuice? That's really how it seems like they've approached it.
00:41:24
Speaker
and And honestly, in in this like climate, in the climate that we're currently in, that's probably what people if, if if people showed up to a Beetlejuice sequel, and Beetlejuice does not show up within the first 10 minutes, people would legitimately be asking, Where's Beetlejuice? Because I guarantee you, most people did not go back and rewatch the original movie before watching this one.
00:41:46
Speaker
They probably do not remember the fact that Beetlejuice doesn't show up till halfway through that movie in in any realistic and significant way. It's my favorite part about the original Beetlejuice is that he doesn't show up till then. And then after that, he is the driving force of the film. But in this he's dont it it feels like they they give him a lot more screen time, but a lot less to do.
00:42:13
Speaker
Which is really frustrating is because half the movie, half of his his screen time, he's just hanging out in that like ungodly call center, which reminds me a lot of some call centers I've worked in. Not the one I'm currently working in, mind you, but others that I've worked in. I've worked a few bobs, you guys. Justice for Bob. Justice for Bob.
00:42:37
Speaker
I think another another movie where we have a villainous character surrounded by an army of of of identical minions all named very simple male names out in twenty twenty four because this is also the one we got despicable me for. And those are all named like Bob and Alan. There was something that was going to mention like I don't. It's the minion problem like Ghostbusters is doing it and not Beetlejuice is doing it like you don't need to have a bunch of Dumb, goofy minions. How are you going to sell merchandise, Brett? Yeah, that's that's I think that's one of the things that really drags this down is that they do have to make this film for the ah no offense to any anyone lowest IQ in the room. You know, ah because the first movie, it trusts you.
00:43:32
Speaker
There's no there's no long explanations. There's no long conversations. Like I said, it just breezes through the plot. We never really set on anything. It just keeps going. Whereas in this movie, the movie just kept stopping so people could talk about shit that doesn't fucking matter. No.
00:43:50
Speaker
And but they have to do that because since this is a legacy sequel and since people, most people who enjoy this, enjoy it from their childhood and don't remember why they like it or they liked it for different reasons when they were a child, you have to cater to all those people because Beetlejuice is universal. Yeah. And actually, it's a Warner Brothers film, I believe. Shut the fuck up, Steven. But you know what I mean? It's it's it's everybody. Show me somebody that doesn't like Beetlejuice.
00:44:19
Speaker
And I can't I how could you not at least respect it for what it does. um But. All those people- Not everything is for everyone, but yeah. Well, I think the original is. Everybody loves Beetlejuice and it trusts its audience. And also it's made in such a way that you don't have to be into movies. You don't have to understand how movies work or be familiar with how story writing is or direction or anything. It's just a good movie. No matter how smart or dumb or how you know into or ignorant you are about film or storytelling or anything. It's just good.
00:44:54
Speaker
And they just go knew they could- They're just going fucking bananas with those air quotes there. They knew. They have called me a bogey with them, basically. You really are. It's kind of just to give our audience a a point of reference there. Tucker is ah just hands flying all over the screen with those air quotes.
00:45:09
Speaker
But they they knew that that was lightning in a bottle. That's not not something that you can do on purpose.
Character Evolution and Performance Highlights
00:45:15
Speaker
You make a film that's that universally loved. That's lightning in a fucking bottle. And so much of that original film was accidental. It's shit that they it based on their own limitations or shit that they stumbled into. Like Tim Burton's first choice to fucking play Beetlejuice with Sammy Davis Jr. I want to see that version. Like that. I know neither do I. That's insane. Like we come for your daughter.
00:45:42
Speaker
That's wild, babe. um Like that, that that's kind of absolutely nuts. And like you don't get Keaton, you don't get his comedic sensibility. Like this movie i made any any change made to that original film leads to a completely different film. That's not the movie we love. But then when you try to replicate it,
00:46:04
Speaker
And without understanding what it is that people like, and I think having so much time removed from it, you get a chance to listen to all the voice. Well, this is what people love. This is no, this is what people know. This, no, this, this, this. And now you're trying, you, like you said, catering to such a broad group.
00:46:22
Speaker
And you know you want to make sure that the adults that loved it when they were kids have something to latch onto, but the kids today are going to love it and they're going to have something to latch onto. So you cast Jenna Ortega, who is, I will say, the best part of this movie in my opinion. She does her job in this movie. She earned her paycheck is what I'll say.
00:46:42
Speaker
I, her scenes, her storyline is the most interesting to me. Like that's when I was really locked into this movie is when she's on screen and doing her thing. Like I really enjoyed that. Like Winona Ryder, fine. Great. I love Winona Ryder, but like, I'm just, I think she, she did really great at not just coming in and being Winona Ryder, but coming back in and, and being a believable.
00:47:08
Speaker
35 year older Lydia Deets. I believe that. I believe that's who she was. Like I said, that's no anything that I don't like about this movie is no discredit to anybody that was involved in making it. I think everybody did their best and everybody did a great job. it just wasn't The pieces did not fit together.
00:47:26
Speaker
right discredit maybe to the screenwriters but other than that yeah but constantly get shit poor screen well and you know that they are probably good and probably could have made a good version of this movie but with a movie like this you know the studio is like you have to do this you can't do that that has to go you're gonna add something you need the metal spider robotic spider there right and I mean, it's Alfred Guff, Miles Miller, and Seth Graham Green. Like, these are established Hollywood screenwriters. When I saw Seth Graham Smith's name, I was like, Oh, no. Yep. Yep. I was like, Oh, no. No, I suddenly don't feel so great. And I mean, he's the one good Mr. Stark.
00:48:07
Speaker
he's the one who's been working on this movie for like the last ten years like he's been the predominant voice and i think miller and golf came in later to kind of punch up what he'd already put down but again like we talked in our original episode way back in 2020 bread about beetle juice goes hawaiian And what that script was and what that kind of entailed in the direction that was going. But they've basically been riffing on those premises ever since. And this is kind of what we're left with. And again, this, like I said before, this movie feels like it's been written for 30 years. It just feels like it's 30 years in the making. There's a lot of cooks in the kitchen. Maybe I would say maybe too many cooks in the kitchen cooks for sure.
00:48:51
Speaker
And it just feels like we there are so many things that someone high up really liked and wasn't willing to get rid of. And so we have to have that beat. We have to have that moment. It's like on our Planet of the Apes episode when we talked about the guy who like completely scrapped the project because his baseball idea wasn't in the final project.
00:49:10
Speaker
Like, that's that the kind of thing that we're talking about here. It's like, well, you know, this movie doesn't get made if we don't have, you know, 10 of the trunk and head guys. that That one joke in the first movie, that one visual thing that people thought was really funny, we're gonna do that like 10 times in this movie. And it's like, we're gonna have them running all over a town. That's gonna be hilarious. I mean, you wanna hear some really bad though? Do I? I actually kinda really liked it. I thought it was pretty funny.
00:49:38
Speaker
Look, it it was I was of two minds about it because it was very amusing. I love I love the. the ah no head costumes because the torsos are always so large and the shoulders are in anything where you have a practical effect of like a headless body walking around. Yeah, it's always like that. and I love the way that looks. It's so off putting and creepy, but also silly. And so seeing all those bobs running around, you know, all the bobs are just headless costumes. Right. little Heads on top. And I just i aesthetically, I was like, yes, I this is fantastic. But so it's really stupid.
00:50:13
Speaker
They can't put their arms above like the apparatus. on their grave because They have to flail their arms are around. it's Exactly. I love it as a concept. I love it as a concept, but I mean, like yeah as a part of this movie. In moderation, though, like and that's just it, like in moderation, like do we need 10 of those guys? No, probably not. We can just bring back the original guy. That would be fine. But no, we've got to have 10 of them and they're identical. Why are they identical?
00:50:42
Speaker
Shrug minions. That's why. And they're all yellow like minions. Well, OK, first of all, hold on. There's only like five of them. And second of all, like who knows? I mean, like you want to get into some like some like head cannon. Like they probably all were dressed differently, but Beetlejuice hired them all for his, you know, bio exorcist call center. Well, and how come he was able to reverse his shrunken head in this, but he doesn't reverse theirs?
00:51:11
Speaker
Because where is that? Where's that solid and half lady that was shrinking all their heads anyway? Does she work for him as well, like getting him new recruits by shrinking their heads and sending them to the call center? I don't see. I don't think they're going to work for him. the The witch doctor was the one that shrunk his head. Oh, I thought it was a solid and half lady. Yeah, you're right.
00:51:31
Speaker
No. Oh, because. Yeah. Yeah. Because he switches the thing with them. The numbers. Yeah. Yeah. Sitting next to the legs of the. song Yeah. lady There you go. yeah And like copying a feel and getting kicked. But yeah. and And the witch doctors on the other side. Right. like Yeah. Like, you know, look, sprinkles of the stuff. on it Yeah. How did he undo that?
00:51:52
Speaker
Look, that's on the loophole. I don't I don't need an answer to that question. and I really don't. I don't think it's because he's Beetlejuice. He's fucking Beetlejuice. Right. he He stuck his thumb in his mouth and he blew and his head popped back. Like that's I don't care. He's a cartoon. We'll say that cartoon physics work. Like I don't I don't need that answer. I don't need the answer to that question. um But life doesn't make any sense in these movies. And that's right. But again, I agree with you, Brett. They apply too many rules to it in this one.
00:52:20
Speaker
And i I'm just stuck going, this movie doesn't make sense. Like you've got, again, four villains. You've got Bride of Beetlejuice, you've got killer Killer Teenager, you've got Bad bad Boyfriend, and you've got Beetlejuice. And they're all dispatched so quickly and without any kind of thought.
00:52:40
Speaker
given to them. Like, oh, ah bad boyfriend, well, Beetlejuice pulls a lever and he falls into hell. Done. um The ah bride of Beetlejuice and bad boyfriend, they get eaten by a sandworm. Done. Beetlejuice, he inflates for some reason and explodes and says he should have gotten married in Vegas. Done. Like, it's just like, which i did which I didn't like that because like at the end of the first movie, like,
00:53:04
Speaker
he's fighting them to say his name right and in this one they just say his name three times and he doesn't even like yep he just doesn't bad enough he doesn't try to fight them on it he just lets them do it well he's tired he's seventy two he's tired well yeah that's want to say he's he's a little different in this one in the original I think Beetlejuice is truly, truly evil and just wants what he wants. Right. He wants to further his agenda in the original one. Exactly. In this one, he's almost like an anti-hero, which made me kind of sad when they killed him off because like everybody wants his help and he's like, okay. And he's not like trying to trick them or anything. He's just like, well, if we get married, you just sign this. He's kind of trying to trick them. Or at least Lydia is trying to trick, but yeah.
00:53:47
Speaker
And like when when the when Jin Ortega is like, well, that's we read the book and that doesn't work in the contract goes up in flames. He's like fair, you know, like he's not he's all about no. ah And the original he would have tried harder. Exactly. he's so All right. I guess I guess I'll blow up. He's apparently the 35 years in between the first movie in this one have made him very soft. Really mellowed him out. Yeah. Right. Which is about.
00:54:14
Speaker
like Well, the call center kills your soul. So I think that's it. Yes. Yes. He really grafted him down as a person. I think his love of Lydia softened him up a little bit. I mean, he always has that picture of Lydia on his desk. That's true. Yeah, I. OK, my my favorite. I have to come back to my favorite and least favorite scene in this movie.
00:54:37
Speaker
It's the same fucking scene is the musical number at the end because it is so theatrical and so fun and so goofy. And I love MacArthur Park, the song, both of both the Richard Harris and the the Donna Summer versions that we hear in the Weird Al version word out version. about Jurassic Park. And the Weird Al Parody, sure. But I love MacArthur Park. I love that song. But it is everything I hate about this movie. Like, it's everything I love and everything I hate about this movie distilled into one scene. Because it's the fanservice looking back to the original. Why is this musical number in the movie? Because we had one in the original where a ghost was making everyone lip-sync and dance. That's why it's in this movie. um But then by the same token, it's also like,
00:55:25
Speaker
It's like Willem Dafoe's character getting to do some fun shit. It's Jenna Ortega and Catherine O'Hara, like lip-syncing like crazy. Burn Gorman fucking and nailing it as the priest. like Oh yeah, he was the best out of all of them with the lip-syncing. Like he really, he that's the only one that I believed. He could have been in the first one in that scene. A hundred percent. but He could have been there for sure.
00:55:46
Speaker
Like he's my number three favorite ah performance in this movie after Jenna Ortega and Willem Dafoe. Like because every time he's on screen, he's doing something, he's saying something ridiculous while just being as stoic and self serious as possible. And I think it's,
00:56:02
Speaker
awesome. And he's so good at it. And he's fantastic and everything that I've seen him in because he has such a unique look. And he knows exactly what to do with it. He's he knows what his he knows what his face looks like. And he knows how to move it so that you believe everything that he's saying and doing. Yeah, he is a master and like he has to look in the mirror probably hours a day where he's like, All right, there it is. Nope, nope.
00:56:26
Speaker
Right there, there you go. that is there That is a man who has such great, and again, the lip sync scene confirms it. He has such an incredible control of his face. that like it's it's it's impossible to like look at this guy and not have a blast. He's absolutely nailing the lip syncing in a way that none of the other actors really are. therere There are some that are better than others, um but he's far and away the best. and he's having You can tell everyone in that scene is having a really fun time doing what they're doing and like goofing around but then by the same token. like
00:57:03
Speaker
It's all just fan service. Like this is just here because it was in the first one. There's no, like in the first, and I was telling this to my partner last night as we were on our way home, like in the first movie, the lip sync scene has a narrative purpose. The Maitlands are trying to scare away the Deetsis and their guests. Like they're trying to scare them all away by possessing them and making them lip sync Adam's favorite music, Calypso. Up to this point, we've pretty much just had a disco soundtrack because apparently that's what they listened to in in the afterlife is disco.
00:57:32
Speaker
Well, and every time we're in the killer kids room, it's always some sad, weepy 90s band. Right. Because it's cool to be into the 90s now. Right. Everything's 30 years removed. Yeah. Right. died I know. Conveniently, conveniently when he died. Right. that's what we're This is the point Tucker is making. yeah Yes. I fucking guess.
00:57:58
Speaker
If you say so, geez. I mean, he could have died in any any era, like they made it any era. But because it's 2024, he died in the fucking 90s as a teenager in the 90s, man. Yeah, man. Where everything was so much better.
Cultural Cycles and Fanservice
00:58:13
Speaker
Well, what what other decade could he have died in? Then it wouldn't have been obvious he's been dead. Like you say he died in the 80s. That's pretty obvious. Like early 2000s are not that much different from the 90s in terms of like early 2000. He died in 2012 because fashion runs in cycles of 30 years, Brett. So because it was 30 years ago, those fashions are back in. Yes, dude. Yes, dude. I had no problem with that. It didn't even I didn't even give it a second fucking thought. Oh, no, I don't have a title. No, I don't have a problem with it. No, it's just it's just so predictable. You know what I'm saying? Just a little predictable from a story writing standpoint. Again, I didn't think so. I don't really.
00:58:52
Speaker
That's fair. Brett, I respect what you say and it's valid as fuck. You just seem to not like 90s music. That's what this sounds like. I love 90s music, are you kidding? Who doesn't love 90s? It's a music I grew up on. What are you talking about? Do you see Odellay by Beck right there? It's right there, Brett. It's right there. Why are you out here talking shit about it? Do you see Diggable Planets right there? Those are both early 90s. Look at that. Prominently featured on my vinyl rack. What's the problem?
00:59:18
Speaker
There isn't one. What? Why is there a problem? Why does it have to be a problem? Because it's lazy writing, Brett. It's not about what decade it is. It's not about any of that. It's just that it's lazy writing. It's exactly what you would expect because they have to make it for everybody. And that's what everybody wants is 90 shit. That's what it's it just feels lazy. That's all in the site. That's what I'm missing. I don't.
00:59:43
Speaker
that And that's great. but I love that for you. I really do. I love that you can enjoy stuff that is lazy and I'm not being sarcastic. I'm not because like I wish that I were less nitpicky. No, I'm serious. This sounds like I'm saying a terrible thing, but I wish I were less nitpicky because I as much as I can watch a bad movie and find a lot of good stuff about it that I like mediocre movies, I cannot I cannot do it.
01:00:12
Speaker
You've got either got to be good or bad in the middle. I'm not so much into that, you know. So something like this, when there's some lazy writing involved, I can't look past it, even though it doesn't really impact the story at all. You know, it doesn't fucking matter. It's a huge nitpick and it sucks being somebody who can't enjoy something like that. So that's why I'm saying that I love that for you, Brett, and I'm not insulting you at all. I'm not saying.
01:00:41
Speaker
anything bad about you, I'm just saying that I wish that I could view it through that lens so that I could get some more enjoyment out of stuff that I probably should be enjoying more. He's not intentionally insulting you anyway. No, I'm in a candid way. I'm insulting you. Here's the thing. i'm I'm not saying I enjoyed it or didn't enjoy it. I'm just I'm out here going, what are you talking about? Like, I don't I don't know. Why would that be lazy writing? I don't get that.
01:01:06
Speaker
I don't get where like because it's so obvious. It's so obvious. That's what I don't understand. You're saying like, that's so obvious. I don't agree. Why is that so obvious? Well, Stephen explained it. It's it's ah fashion and culture runs in a 30 year cycle. um This was something I noticed in the 90s when everybody was doing 60s stuff, including myself. ah Fucking told almost made a comeback and all that shit. Yeah, like I go jeans are bell bottoms for the 90s.
01:01:35
Speaker
Uh, can I tell you, uh, that my buddy Marv who was 21 years old, my friend Marv, I'm always talking about this boy wears jinkos to work. No, absolutely not be directly to jail. I'll make sure he knows you said that.
01:01:51
Speaker
But no, this dude loves fucking nine inch nails and wears jinkos and shit. It's it's always a cycle, man. And I'm fine. It's not a bad thing. That's a cycle. That's fucking rad. I love this stuff gets to come back and gets a new audience and everything. But to just kind of rely on something, a trope that lazy in a movie like this kind of yeah it takes me out of it. It makes me not like it as much.
01:02:16
Speaker
even though it doesn't fucking matter. I'm admitting that I'm the weird one, Brett. I'm admitting that. He said I don't want to be that way. Well, yeah, no, i and I get that. It's just it's it's the logic I can't rip wrap my head around. like And that's fair. I don't get it. I don't understand where you're coming from. I can't even understand where you're coming from. Like, I don't I don't get it. It's fine. So like.
01:02:40
Speaker
I mean, here's the thing, Brett, you're right. He's wrong. That's true. That's what I'm saying. That's that's it. I'm cursed. And I can't tell if you're being sarcastic. No, he's not. Only in tone. You look not at meaning. I'm talking about you, Steven. I can't tell if you're being sarcastic. No, I'm actually really not. I get that a lot, though. People can't tell when I'm being like genuine or sarcastic because everything I say sounds just a little bit sarcastic. A little bit, yeah. A little bit.
01:03:08
Speaker
um But no, I. um But yeah, so like we've written this like theme of disco soundtrack with the exception of the the killer boy themes or scenes. um And so like that coming with the and also the exception of the funeral where we've got the weird choral rendition of Dale. Did we need that? It's out like a sore fucking thumb. um Why would Charles like that? That wasn't his thing. That was.
01:03:34
Speaker
add fucking exactly man i He did have a really fun time after that after that happened They were all hooting and hollering and having a blast I got the impression that like after that happened Especially the scene after it in the original movie that he liked that song so much because of what happened He became the world's the second biggest Harry Belafonte fan in the world. Well, the the the biggest side a maldwin the yeah living they live in Harry ball or a Harry Belafonte fan. Yeah. Yes. Or maybe it was just that song. Like I could see him telling Delia, like play that song at my funeral. Like I could could see his character say that's the thrill of his life is what you're saying. Like that was the the most fun he had. I could I could see that.
01:04:16
Speaker
And it' how do you reach that experience in a positive way? I mean, there were negative things that were wilder than that that happened to him during that experience. But that specific thing, that was fun. Everybody had a good time. I mean, how do you meet that you get the impression that Adam and and Barbara made that happen for them a lot, like because at the end of the movie, you get um ah but ah Lydia dancing to work your ah work your body line. Jump in the line. Jump in the line. That's what it's fucking called. Yes. um I was like, I know I'm going to get the name of the song completely wrong. um But yeah, you get her dancing to that. so And that was like her reward for doing well in school. So you get the impression they're doing that a lot. You know, the more we're talking about stuff ah in this movie, the more I'm realizing there is a lot of unspoken stuff going on.
01:05:05
Speaker
Like it just isn't the like story that's in the background in the subtext, if you will. There's so much subtext in his movie. Like, really? There's something I noticed that I thought about, like, General Ortega's character can't see ghosts, right? Until she thinks.
01:05:21
Speaker
Well, no. See, I think when she she bumps her head, she hits her head on the tree and then she she can see ghosts. Oh, she's dead. Oh, damn. She just met a boy moment. Yeah. Yeah. But she clearly hits her head. People who can see the paranormal thing are brain damaged. Yes. Interesting. And I think the reason that I thought that she was probably going to die with that is the Maitland's just crash off a bridge. How hard is it to get out of a car that's in like three feet of water?
01:05:51
Speaker
Incredibly hard. Like, I guess so. Legit. It's incredibly hard to get out of a sinking car in a little stream like that, though, because of the pressure. Like if a car is even like three fourths submerged, which it looks like it is because it goes in head first. Well, they would not have been able to get the doors open. Neither of them were wearing seat belts, by the way. I've confirmed this. Just saying they could have ah rolled down the windows, probably. You can't even do that because of the pressure.
01:06:19
Speaker
oh pressure pushing down on you on the Maryland's car on me because that's why like you have to act super fast if your car gets submerged in water you have to act immediately which most people don't because like my car is thinking I'm gonna die it's shock yeah they it becomes a state of shock by the time you think what you need to be doing it's too late the pressure from the water is like you can't open a door you can't roll down a window and like you're screwed yeah dude
01:06:51
Speaker
dude Yeah, well, I so I stand erected corrected. I stand corrected. Look, what you do in your own personal time is your business and we don't need to hear about it. You guys don't know. You only see me from the waist up. I could have a boner the entire time we're recording. That's what I'm afraid of. That's what I'm afraid of. Check, guys. Let's see. Let's see those hands, Brett.
01:07:13
Speaker
all right okay cool it took bread a while to get those hands cleaned up i guess you'll never know and i don't want to know that's the point i'm making that's why we're from the waist we couldn't handle the truth yeah i think we really couldn't anyway what are we talking about right subtext i'm in my underpants but i mean like you know you're wearing pants barely I never did.
Funeral Songs and Marketing Critiques
01:07:39
Speaker
Hell yeah. We need to put it over here. It's your house, damn it. Come on. Anyway, the headline, the headline we were talking about earlier about the it's a strike, the civil servant strike, like there's a lot of background storytelling going on that and the stuff we were talking about was like Charles really liking the, you know, Deo song. Like it's stuff that you sort of have to head cannon, but it like it makes so much sense that you're like, I bet you he intended that.
01:08:06
Speaker
Because I initially I'm like, why the fuck is this song playing at his funeral? And then I thought about it for 20 seconds. And I was like, oh, no, he had a blast with that. He had a lot of fun with that. Like they all did. That was the point of that scene is that they were trying to get scared away and then they weren't like that was that was the whole point. So, no, he probably walked away with that from that experience with an appreciation for that song.
01:08:28
Speaker
So it made sense at that point, but I still didn't like it because again, it felt very call back. Like, why is this song here? Because it was in the original because this is the scene we all remember. Exactly. Look, is it explained? Yes. Could it be? Could it be explained? Yes.
01:08:44
Speaker
But it does still felt weird. I still hate it. like it's still something i just because Again, it's those fanservicey elements that I feel like I'm being pandered to. I feel like I'm being coddled to. I feel like I'm being talked down to as an audience member. like Yeah, this is the shit you liked in the first one. Yeah, you like this shit. Don't you eat it. Fucking eat it.
01:09:01
Speaker
and i'm just like down you right i don't know thank you it does that's where i'm like do you have some unresolved trauma maybe maybe i fucking do brad maybe that's why we are this way brad maybe because when i see that stuff i'm like that like well okay so it i'm of two minds of it in this movie it does feel very like corporate like the you know the company was like yeah we need to give them this fancy stuff whereas like In other movies, it is' it it doesn't feel that way. It feels more lighthearted and like, look, there's the stuff you like. Isn't that cool? But see, I don't i don't want to just be shown the stuff I like if it doesn't make sense in the story.
01:09:45
Speaker
Like, you i'm I'm okay with callbacks and I'm okay with references. Like, that shit is fine. Make it make sense within the logic of the film, and don't just throw it at me because it you can. And that's that's the stuff that irks me. That's the stuff that tends to bug me as someone going to see a movie is, you know, oh, we we put Deo in it. Remember the remember the Deo? you You like the Deo, don't you like the Deo? Like, yeah, I like that song. but the fuck, like you arrange it differently, you make a bunch of kids sing it. Like, and that's supposed to, you can tell that's supposed to be a laugh moment. And I'm just like, eh. Like if I may work for me, if I may gatekeep for a moment in the, uh, in the time before streaming music, how many people who were fans of that song knew that it was called the banana boat song? Sure.
01:10:37
Speaker
Very few is my guess. if you look The people the people our age that that that that discovered and liked that song was probably through either one of two things either reruns of The Muppet Show or Beetlejuice. It was both at the same time for me like they both kind of it was parallel.
01:10:55
Speaker
I mean, for me, it was a Muppet show, but like, I know for you guys, it was probably Beetlejuice for Tucker, apparently, it was both, because he's a, you know, a galaxy-brained individual. I contain multitudes. You contain something. I almost tell you. Multitudes or something. My full of shit is what he's saying. I mean, I didn't say it, but you said it, and I can't say it's a grade. It's a grade. It's a grade. It's a grade. But like, that's, that, I mean, that's, that's the whole, like, and and so, like I mean, but I'm like,
01:11:26
Speaker
So you get like this music that's probably like 30 years out of date for the original film. And you we're doing the same, except it's more than 30. It's more like 50 years out of date. Yeah. For this movie. MacArthur's Park came out. Yeah. And I remember saying last week during our Beetlejuice Redux episode, like how much I would have loved to have the Calypso soundtrack for this movie as well. And then as soon as I heard MacArthur Park, I'm like, oh no, is it going to be disco?
01:11:51
Speaker
And then it fucking was disco. And I was like, it was yeah damn it. Like fucking damn it. And I, again, the MacArthur park wedding scene, loved and hated in equal measure. Like it it dispatches. And worst scene of the movies. It is a hundred percent. Like i I love, I love it and I hate it. And I, I hate that I love it. Like that's kind of. I love that I hate it. Exactly.
01:12:18
Speaker
Another thing in this movie that I hate in Love and Equal Measure, like I love it so much and I hate that I love it as much as I do because it works for me so well. Baby Beetlejuice. He shows up twice in this movie and I fucking love him and I want him. I want him like i want a life-sized baby Beetlejuice that I can just put on my shelf and look at and love and admire for Edward. No, but the suction cups on your car, like the Garfield.
01:12:42
Speaker
There you go. That's I'm sure it exists. I'm sure it exists that that character only exists for merchandising. So yeah, in about nine months to a year, Hot Topic is just going to be baby Beetlejuice. Yeah, dude, that there's a chance, Steven, you get your little one for your window. You're telling me there's a chance. ah yeah Yeah, but that's that's it. Like and it again, it's one of those things where you're like, we're going to put this in this movie. It doesn't really serve a narrative purpose. It's a joke. It's a gimmick.
01:13:11
Speaker
But you're gonna love it. And but it also it serves no narrative purpose. Like it's a joke. It's a gimmick. Why is it here? It's here to make you laugh. But we're gonna recall it later, just so you can be like, ha remember baby Beetlejuice bitch. And then it started crawling on the ceiling. I'm like, Oh, are we gonna fucking do a train spotting joke in 2024? Is that where this is going? And then he eats the light bulb. And I was like, Okay, I'm good. We're fine.
01:13:34
Speaker
Like, I don't need a train spotting joke in 2024. No, thank you. I love that weird callback to have made. I just love how blatantly dumb all the baby Beetlejuice stuff is. It's not unapologetically stupid. Like, as he crawls away, it's like, and I just thought that was hilarious. And like, normally fart jokes are a miss because they got to be pretty good fart jokes for me to like them because farts are inherently hilarious.
01:14:00
Speaker
but But I mean, it's shit it's shit without the mess. It's lazy. It's lazy writing, though. It's shorthand. You know, to noise equals funny. Like, come on, we can we can punch this up a little.
01:14:11
Speaker
And I don't know the farting as he crawled away was lazy but still hilarious just because the way that it was shot and the way it was moving and just how goofy the whole scene was in general. Again on paper it's everything I should be hating but I can't help but kind of love it. Like and that's the thing that infuriates me about this movie is the stuff I love the most is also the stuff I hate the most. Which is why I come down right in the middle on this movie because I love it and as much as I hate it and hate it as much as I love it.
01:14:39
Speaker
It's so weird because this movie is firing on most cylinders. Yeah. But not all of them. And that's a problem. No, no. Because the ones that are not firing are very important. So important. Very, very important. vital hole I would say the oxygen. It's the life support systems that are failing in this. That's everything else. Great. Engines are running great, though. Perfect. Fantastic. Yeah. Trucking right along. Yeah, dude. If there had only been two less storylines, this movie might have been like a 10 out of 10. Right? I think so, yeah.
01:15:11
Speaker
Like i think I think if it were a little leaner and a little cleaner, it could have been really smart. And if you'd have focused instead of trying to like shoehorn Monica Belucci into this thing, I quit. i I hate to keep picking on her because I i love her and everything else.
01:15:28
Speaker
But like, I love her, especially in Twin Peaks had another Monica Baluchi dream. Like, what she makes more sense in Twin Peaks than she does here. And she makes no sense in Twin Peaks. None. Like, and but that's where I'm at. I'm just like, if if we'd have maybe written that character out, and maybe put her somewhere else where Tim Burton can be like, look at this hot girl I'm dating, because he loves to do that.
01:15:49
Speaker
um then we we could have probably cleaned this up, like paid attention to the things that weren't working and weren't making a lot of sense and streamlined those a little bit and made something that works a little more as an overall story instead of trying to create something that's going to sell it hot topic. Boys, it's as simple as this. They made the wrong script. They picked the wrong one.
01:16:14
Speaker
Everybody's doing great in this movie. Tim Burton is is doing great better than I've seen him do in years, decades, maybe all the all the acting is on point. They get their characters. Everybody knows what movie they're in. Everything's great about this movie. But the one thing that matters is the script and they picked the wrong one. That's it. This was not the one to do. No, this is not the one to waste all of that talent on. Is one thing.
01:16:41
Speaker
Well, I was going to say in terms of Monica Belugis character. that Oh, sorry, Brett. but There's some more subtext. And that is the fact that the finger that Beetlejuice has in the first movie is hers. Oh, yeah. I think I I considered that during the film, but I hadn't thought about it since then because I did maybe because he takes it off to give it to. Yeah. Yeah. She went nothing to me. Nothing. Yes.
01:17:08
Speaker
Yes, that is the last finger that she recovers. That's like the last part that she staples under herself. And it even looks different. Like it looks dirtier and groutier than the rest of her. and Right. Because Belarus was carrying it around for her. I like that. Yeah. So more subtext in the background. of just Yeah. Like, you know, maybe then again, we could we could maybe like, again, if we're streamlining and paring out things that don't make sense, then, you know, maybe we can you know, draw a straighter line to that, maybe. Well, yeah, maybe some of the subtext becomes actual text and the movie becomes better because of it. Right. Instead of like, you know, someone like hearing this podcast and making a tick tock in 12 months going, Did you know that the finger that she has is the finger that Beetlejuice has or the first movie?
01:17:52
Speaker
i can't i'm going to share that tiktok with you as soon as i find it this i know all your eggs you are endings explained of beetlejuice beetlejuice i think of beetlejuice explained like do we need the ending of beetlejuice explained like no really do we really have you ever watched one of those videos i hate them just them talking about the whole movie yeah like it's not just the ending telling you what they spend. It's a 15 minute runtime video. They spend 15 minutes setting up the entire movie in the last like three. They're like, oh, yeah. And so the ending is this. See, it pays off. Don't forget to like and subscribe. Listen to our sponsors. Here's the end. I'm just like, and but that's they've made it. There's a cottage industry on YouTube around that shit.
01:18:32
Speaker
there so so Well, that's a big thing I want to talk about, but go ahead. I'll do that after you're done. I was just going to say ah from in the context of what we're saying, it's kind of a symbiotic relationship with the film companies that make all these huge pop culture blockbusters because they they put the stuff in there to feed those videos and the videos feed back into the movies so people can understand what's happening in them.
01:18:57
Speaker
for casual fans they can watch the videos then watch the movie and have a better time it's a it's a circle it's a circle of life but him and that I mean, that's true. Because, yeah, I mean, OK. What what like, you know, random run of the mill Beetlejuice fan is going to know some of the stuff that I saw. I i forgot Beetlejuice even had a finger in the first movie until you guys mentioned it and I was like, oh, OK. I almost asked what finger then Tucker did the pulled the ring off and I was like, oh, that thing. OK. Yeah, dude. You had just recently watched this movie, too. I know.
01:19:34
Speaker
Yeah, but Brett, to be fair, we've probably seen it thousands of times, whereas Steven has seen it like three times, two times, three times. Yeah. bru times seattle Fair enough. Thousands of times. There are. I forget about the Jesus of it all. There are full days. How dare you forget the Jesus of the child, sir. ah Blah, blah, blah, Jesus magic. Yeah, dude, you say that like it's a bad thing.
01:19:59
Speaker
Well, like I'm also quoting the opening number of the musical. It's like my favorite line in the opening number. So the one main the main thing I want to talk about before we wrap up is the marketing of this movie because God, it ruined a lot of it. um I feel like there were jokes in this movie that would have probably made me laugh pretty hard had I not seen them a million times in the trailer.
01:20:26
Speaker
yeah The big one being, I'm going to make you so happy. Like that would have made me laugh out loud had I not seen it a million times in the trailer. Yeah. Um, cause it feels like the juice is loose would have been more impactful. I feel like it would have. Yeah. I don't think that's a great line just to begin with, but like it would have at least been better had I not already heard it 15 times. You're correct. Yeah. It would have hit harder. I think it's the delivery of that line that, that makes it um a fun one, but like I say, you hear it so many times before that it loses all its impact in the film. Or if they used a different um a different cut, like a different delivery of that line in the movie than they did in the marketing, that would have been great too. Like I love when they do shit like that, like what's in the trailer is not what's in the movie. Like I find that really fun when that does happen. Agreed.
01:21:21
Speaker
Yeah, I miss I miss trailers um that are shot just as trailers and they're not part of the movie. Mm hmm. Like Texas Chainsaw Massacre three, where it's just the chainsaw coming out of the the water and like Leatherface grabs it and then it's like fucking the saw is family.
01:21:39
Speaker
It's like all Arthurian and shit. Like and it has nothing to do with the movie. It's just going to get you hyped. Right. like This is the kind of shit you need to expect from this movie. It's what you're going to love it. What a trailer is supposed to do. It's not supposed to reveal trailer half the movie to you. what yeah the The most notorious right now is whether it was the new James McAvoy movie.
01:22:00
Speaker
Oh, speak no evil speak no evil. Yes, right. We saw that trailer. Well, we saw that trailer in front of Alien Romulus, but that's because I was going to say I've seen it in front of every movie I've seen over the past year in front of every movie that's been out in the past year. It wasn't in front of this one mercifully, but it's been in front of all the others. um But but yeah, that trailer does show you the entire movie. I don't have to go see it. I know what happens.
01:22:25
Speaker
like They do basically everything except spell it out for you and they kind of tip to right up to the line of doing that. But with the whole kid with the open mouth doing the scissors motion like come on. Well, it's like it's like connect the dots, but there's like little dotted lines in between the dots like Billy from Family Circus has been walking through your.
01:22:43
Speaker
ah Connect the dots, you know what I mean? Right. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. So, yeah, I wish I wish trailers were didn't show you the whole movie anymore. I agree. Do I get why they do that now? Yes. Do I still think it's stupid? Also, yes. Also, yes. Double agree. Yeah. But they definitely overdid the marketing on this movie. like Again, this they have to go hard on the marketing for this one because this is their big this is their big tentpole heading out of the summer and into award season. Like they're probably at least hoping to get pick up some like maybe makeup or effects awards for this movie. um Which they should. which Or at least nomination, like makeup 100%. If this movie does not get a makeup or a costuming or maybe even an art direction nomination, I'll be surprised. i I think that Danny Elfman deserves a little bit of credit for the score because he did a really good job of
01:23:39
Speaker
basically it's like when you listen to the record and you hear the song you like and then 15 20 years later you see that band live and they play that song they've been playing it for 20 fucking years so it has changed in little tiny ways just enough where you notice it and appreciate it everything that's different about it and that's the Beetlejuice score like it is he took the same thing and then just played it a million times and basically perfected it. And that as as a musician myself, I understand that because like I look back at older songs that I did and I would do them completely different now, but you would know it was the same song. Right.
01:24:19
Speaker
And that's how the Beetlejuice score felt. And I thought that was really impressive how well he kept it the same while very obviously taking it in so many different directions and adding so many just peppering little things here and there, ah changing it just enough to where it's it's really fresh. Yeah, you can tell it's this is a guy who's been working on film scores for 20 years, coming back to something he really likes and being like, all right, let's flex a little bit. Let's let's try some new shit. Yeah, exactly.
01:24:48
Speaker
That's what got me tear up at the beginning was those titles came up and the music was kind of the same. And I was like, oh, if this movie is the same as this music, we are going to have a good fucking time. But unfortunately, it was not. It tried to be tried. Listen, garden I respect it was not. I respect the fuck out of this movie, you guys. But man, I really did not like it that much. Yeah.
01:25:13
Speaker
ah yeah My last thought is, ah did Moira Rose break Catherine O'Hara? That's my last thought. is we've We've talked on the podcast before about roles that actors play that kind of like change the way that they perform every other role they have after that, like um like Captain Jack Sparrow and Johnny Depp. Every role he's played since Jack Sparrow has just been a little like degrees of Jack Sparrow.
01:25:41
Speaker
pretty much since then. um And I feel like this is and they're similar characters like both Delia and Moira are artists. But like, there's a lot more Moira to this performance than the Delia I remember from 88. And maybe that's a choice for her but like, I'm not familiar who's this other character from what? Schitt's Creek.
01:26:03
Speaker
the Yeah. Oh, wow. Oh, I just thought about Waco and now I'm spiraling. What was I talking about? Oh, Catherine Harrah. Yeah. So I haven't seen Schitt's Creek, but oh, oh, oh, oh, that's what I would slap me up, dude. Episode three fucked me up anyway.
01:26:35
Speaker
um Like Catherine O'Hara, based on her performance in the original, without any context from Schitt's Creek, I thought it was very spot on for me. And that may be because I lack context from the other, or maybe it's because I've seen Beetlejuice thousands of more times than Steven has. But I would say both opinions are valid as fuck. Well, I also got to wonder is, is it the other way around is like that's such a loyal rose is such an iconic performance. Is that just sort of what you've been printed on her now? Could be maybe. Yeah. So it could be the other way. Who knows? I don't know. You tell me. Yeah, dude, in the comments.
01:27:18
Speaker
in the comments on our Patreon, patreon dot.com slash disenfranch pod, the official conversation of the disenfranchised podcast. yeah do um Gentlemen, any anything else to say before we wrap this up and talk a little bit about ah the the early response to this movie? I feel very, very satisfied that I feel like I got to say everything I really wanted to say about this movie. I feel good. I feel good about this. I really do.
Wrap-Up and Speculations
01:27:44
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I feel the same, I think.
01:27:47
Speaker
I can't really think of anything else I would want to say. I would say I'm good. OK. Well, as I was as I was watching this movie and as I was driving home because I live 45 minutes away from the nearest movie theater, as I was driving home, I was thinking about, OK, don't forget to mention this. Don't forget to talk about this. I definitely want to say something about that. And that list is all checked. Yeah. Don't know why I feel like I needed to elaborate, but I thought it was a good metaphor.
01:28:15
Speaker
Fahrenheit even a metaphor. It wasn't you're fine. It was a a fable. No, let me save you from yourself and just move on. Oh, thank you. I'm going to edit that out. Bye. Click five minutes later.
01:28:28
Speaker
ah So Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I just have to say this real quick. I love you, Steven. We are really good friends. But can i I just want anybody who listened to last week's episode on Beetlejuice put in the comments if you noticed that 90% of that was stitched together by my own hands because we had such a bad lag last week, my fault. We had such a bad lag last week that we were talking over each other when we didn't know that we were talking over each other. We were interrupting each other and everything was everywhere. Not only did I have to cut certain things out, I had to move parts of the conversation around so that they were spaced correctly like a real conversation. This took me four hours.
01:29:11
Speaker
It's the most I've ever worked on editing any episode. So please, I need to know comments, ah criticisms, anything you've got because it is kind of my, it's my masterwork. It's my gift of maximum effort to to everyone in the audience and to Steven and Brett because I think all of those people deserve it. That's gonna be the one he's remembered for folks. I hope so because you know what I need to do is I need to just post it without any edits.
01:29:39
Speaker
and then you motherfuckers would appreciate it you know i'm saying very maybe but oh god Very maybe. I'm sorry, Beetlejuice what now, Steven? Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice opened ah Thursday, September 5th, which as of this recording is two days ago, as of this episode airing a week ago. As of right now, only the Friday box office numbers are in. It has earned so far in its opening day, $41.5 million. saying? Very maybe.
01:30:11
Speaker
Nice. um In second place so far is Deadpool and Wolverine in its ah was 43rd. Oh, this. Yeah, this is just the daily chart because I can't fucking get the weekend chart yet because I don't have one in its 43rd day and release has earned over six hundred million dollars, almost six hundred and ten million dollars domestic um in third place. Reagan, the ah Dennis Quaid, Ronald Reagan biopic, um which has been open for about a week now. It's down in third place. ah In fourth place, it ends with us. A movie that dares to ask the question, what if it guys what if it ends with us? um That's that that Blake Lively movie, who's really hot for being Ryan Reynolds' his wife right now.
01:30:55
Speaker
Oh, yeah. And that that movie is getting by just on the controversy, I feel like. Yeah, pretty much like a whole feud between people and stuff. And that's all people are talking about it. And that's why anybody saw that movie. I feel like look as ah Hollywood doesn't care as long as there's butts in seats. Yeah, dude, I like butts and I like seats. So I'm into it. And then in fifth place, Brett's favorite movie that he saw in the past week, Alien Romulus. Hey. Fenny Alvarez, though. Yeah.
01:31:24
Speaker
Yeah, i love betty overre the man who gave us the evil dead remake see our previous episode on the evil dead remake reboot whatever and don't don't breathe don't breathe I know just that you're breathing um and We also have ah The Forge in sixth place, Twister is in seventh, and then coming in later, we've got Trap, Despicable Me 4, the aforementioned Despicable Me 4, and Afraid, that weird AI movie with James Cho.
01:31:56
Speaker
Yo, trapped is trapped is kind of just hanging on. It's just making just enough money every week to stay in the theaters and like crap is fun. I might still go see it. I liked to trap traps like my second favorite movie of the year so far after Challengers. Nice. We'll have to go see it then because, you know, I did go to see it. We know. I did make that journey, but ah I did not get the destination. Yeah, it was not there.
01:32:26
Speaker
Didn't quite get there. No. Right now, these were trapped in my car. Right. A joke that that Brett helped me out with their workshop that at the darkest time in my life. Brett comes in with the humor and I appreciated it for sure. So what I'm here for. Yeah.
01:32:44
Speaker
Uh, the, uh, the current Tomatometer score is a 77%. Uh, the critics consensus, Michael Keaton's devious poltergeist still has plenty of juice left in this mad cap return to form for Tim Burton, marrying charming practical effects and ghoulish gags to provide a fun, fun time. And yes, they did put fun twice. Uh, yeah. I want to say it three times or you'll have fun.
01:33:10
Speaker
ah Fun will show up, right? yeah Hello, I'm fun. That makes me fun. No! The meta score is a 62 based on generally favorable reviews from 58 critics. ah So we seem to be in the minority on this one, at least Tucker and I do. Brett, again, you're right, we're wrong. And Tucker want to take a stab at the letterbox score for this one.
01:33:36
Speaker
It's going to be in between 3.3 and 3.7. It is a 3.5, literally right in between. Fuck yeah, dude. I'm back, baby, I'm back. Huzzah! That's on top of things. And so while you're talking, Tucker, what is your score out of five stars?
01:33:54
Speaker
This is going to be a two point five. And I think I would like to revisit it because my expectations are different before I see it than they are after. And I do think that I'm going to enjoy it a little. I'm still going to have the same problems with it when I watched it again. But I think I'm going to be able to relax and enjoy it a little more. The good stuff. You know what I mean? Because the first time I watched something, I feel like I have the the critical glasses on.
01:34:22
Speaker
Yeah. But then once I kind of figure out how I feel about the movie, I can just kind of sit back and maybe turn my brain off a little bit more and have a good time. Right. So I don't know that I'm going to purchase this film. I probably won't buy this movie. But i'll over the next 10 years, I might watch it two or three times on streaming is what I'm saying. There you go. Brett, I know you've said it already. Has our discussion changed your opinion at all?
01:34:48
Speaker
tempted to give it a 3.5, but I'll stick with a 3. Okay. And I'm also sticking with a 2.5. So there we are. That is ah for a average score of 2.6 repeating. um That is kind of where we lie on Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice. What did you think of Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice? Let us know either in the comments over at patreon dot.com slash disenfranch pod, the official conversation of the disenfranchised podcast. You do not have to pay us one cent yeah to to be a part of that tier. ah To be a part of that conversation, just head on over and let us know. You can also shoot us an email at disenfranchpod at gmail dot.com and let us know what you thought of Beetlejuice Beetlejuice. We may read those comments on our next episode. um ah Yeah, you can also find us on some social media platforms at disenfranchpod. Good luck.
01:35:39
Speaker
ah And what else do I normally say at this point? Oh, yeah, if you pay us five dollars over at patreon dot.com. Let's just in French pod You get access to like days worth of of content ah podcasts that we've recorded other fun stuff over there and you can also head over while you're online to ah or not wherever you get your podcasts, Apple Podcasts or Spotify in particular, leave us a nice juicy five star rating and review, a beetle juicy five star rating and review ah to help us find other listeners like yourselves. I am Steven Foxworthy. I've been your host on this journey. um You can find me at some social media platforms at Chewy Walrus, buy my book, check in, check out on Amazon. And Brad, where can we find you on socials these days?
01:36:23
Speaker
Pretty much nowhere. Right on. Kind of on Letterboxd, some kind of on Instagram. Souths underscore Warlock on those places if you want to come find me. I don't fucking care. He doesn't. He really doesn't fucking care. He's not just blowing smoke up your asses. He does not care. Social media sucks. It does, objectively, which is why we're barely on it anymore because Well, I mean, tick tock counts, I guess, but. I'm not making content. I was going to say you're really not making you're not making shit on tick tock. We just spend hours scrolling on tick tock. That's that's what we do. Very much. And Tucker, where can we find you on the socials these days? ah Not on tick tock. That's for sure. But you can find me on. no
01:37:01
Speaker
instagram Instagrams and YouTube's at ice 909. That's I C E N I N E. The number zero and the number nine. Also, tuck mugs is still going strong. Tuck underscore mags. We just had one a couple of weeks ago. We had an original post. I posted my my most recent Lincoln Square mug that I that Stephen was with me when I got.
01:37:27
Speaker
true the design is different like it's it's ah instead of being a tall thin boy it's a short stout boy um but i feel like it's the it holds the same amount of liquid i might test that out put water in one and and you know move them back and forth between the two to see if ah anyway I still have ah Jimmy's post that I'm sitting on that I just need to find time to punch it up real quick but that should be coming sometime this week or next week things have slowed down quite a bit for me but the weekends are still um a lot so hopefully not only can I get
01:38:00
Speaker
some more tuck mugs out there. I can finally get those. What are we watching out there? And we can record some more because I miss recording. What are we watching? I love recording the main feed, but I love just like bullshitting with you guys about random shit that we've watched. You really do. I really like that. And my list is long. I think we're going to have to do just ah like we're we'll all three be there, but it'll just be my list.
01:38:26
Speaker
and And then like if if you guys each need an episode two, we'll do that the following weeks. I have a feeling the next one is going to just be me and Brett like doing ours together. And then there's just an entire episode of just Tucker going, and then I watch this, you guys, you guys. And then I watch this. And everybody's just seeing this. Brett and I will just be like, uh-huh.
01:38:45
Speaker
Oh, cool. No, I haven't seen that. Oh, man. That's wow. Wow. Impressive. Boy, you're so rad. Tucker, you just did a spot on Stanley Spadowski impression. Thank you. The head movement you did with. the Yeah, you did that naturally. I did. It was great. Thank you. Thank you. I'm glad you appreciated that big influence on my life. Stanley Spadowski, one of the biggest.
01:39:13
Speaker
Alright, and that, friends, is our first ever episode, the end of our first ever episode of re-enfranchised. If any other movies that we've ever covered get um get made into ah get get sequels or become the actual franchises that they were hoping for, we'll do more of these. If if there's a sequel to Beetlejuice Beetlejuice, which I guess will depend on how the rest of opening weekend goes, um we'll we'll cover it because we are honor bound now at this point. So it'll be another re-enfranchised. I don't know how much this means.
01:39:45
Speaker
Probably nothing. Who knows? Probably not. But Tim Burton is on record in an interview is saying, look, this one took, was it 36 years to make? ah So, you know, in 36 more years, I'm going to be too old. So I wouldn't count on another one. Yeah.
01:40:04
Speaker
yeah I don't think there's gonna be another one either not with at least not with the original cast or anything which was something I considered while I was watching this as much as I loved ah the return of Beetlejuice I was hoping that I knew they wouldn't do this but how cool would it be if they just completely recast Beetlejuice and whoever they recast as him just nailed it. And what if and Beetlejuice could be anything. I mean, like, as far as we know, um before this film came out, he doesn't always look like that, you know, like maybe he can shape shift or like turn into different people, different ethnicities, different genders and sexes and stuff. Like how cool would that have been? Of course, in this film, we learned that he has like an origin story and that's what he looks like. He looked like in real life.
01:40:54
Speaker
Right. Minus the mold, obviously. But italy it was a black plague. Who knew? Yeah. Yeah. It it just it would have been cool to to see some reliable narrator. Find some some other comedic actors that have the same energy as Michael Keaton did during the original and maybe just ah have two or three of them just have a go at it.
01:41:18
Speaker
And just make Beetlejuice be able to shape shift and even have Michael Keaton in it to where like at the beginning he's like, you know, I'm going to shed this form, you know, and he turns into something else. And it's like the same character, but just like slightly different because okay I just think that I'm Lord God. Yes. Yes. Like, like the doctor who gives a shit. Yes.
01:41:39
Speaker
Kind of like that to where like every time he comes back, like sometimes it's a woman, sometimes it's a person of color. Most of the times it's just a different white guy. But, you know, to to have that would be, I'd watch a Beetlejuice show where like every episode he is a different comedic actor putting their own spin on it. Get like a Dietrich Bader up in there or something. And Keaton's only in the first episode for five minutes. Yeah, yeah. Where he decides to, you know, switch things up a bit.
01:42:08
Speaker
And then immediately turns into, I don't know, Jeffrey Combs. Okay. I very different energy, but OK. Well, when we were I was I've got Jeffrey Combs on the brain because when we were talking about the guy who plays the priest in this, um the only person that I know of that has that much control over a facial performance is Jeffrey Combs. You know who I could see doing a Beetlejuice riff? ah Charlie Day.
01:42:40
Speaker
Oh, yeah, I could see there's a couple of lady comedians. I could I could see a Natasha Leon. Oh, yeah. Oh, that'd be amazing. Yeah. and Watch the fuck out of that. For sure. Like you get some inspired casting choices. Some people that you know are just going to knock it out of the fucking park and just do like a six episode mini series. And I would just watch the shit out of that.
01:43:01
Speaker
I really, really will. And I'm just like, i'm i'm in my head, I'm playing like iconic Doctor Who regenerations, but with Beetlejuice instead. and Yes! David Tennant as Beetlejuice. I don't want to go. i'mm I'm kind of partial to the Christopher Eccleston Beetlejuice myself, but that's me. That's true. Beetlejuice 11 is my Beetlejuice. Right. yeah The 11th Beetlejuice is my Beetlejuice. Yes.
01:43:28
Speaker
Uh, you know who else I think would be a very different kind of thing, but I think he could also pull it off because he's got the manic energy of Beetlejuice is a Nick Cage. Oh yeah. I would love to see a Nick Cage Beetlejuice. He would really bring something to it, I think. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Particularly like a late stage long legs, Nick Cage, a hundred percent.
01:43:47
Speaker
I feel like Nick Cage is giving his all in every performance, but I also feel like that he's always holding back a bit because he knows that if he went any further, it wouldn't fit the tone of the film. And so something like Beetlejuice, where you just let that motherfucker loose. Mm hmm. Yes, dude. Yes. That's some juice I would like to see let loose. Absolutely. Loosen the juice. and You would want to see Beetlejuice in this.
01:44:15
Speaker
weird television show idea. Yeah. Who, who, who, were who are some actors or actresses that you would like to see play the juice to as we, as we franchise this thing out for the, for in, I mean, Alex Brightman is the obvious choice. You don't have to say that one. He's already played the role. We know he's good. He would probably be in the first episode just to like quiet people down. And then we can riff on some really fun casting choices after that.
01:44:39
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. All right. That is our episode on Beetlejuice. Beetlejuice from two thousand and twenty four joined us next week for our two hundredth episode. We've been doing this for four whole years, and this is going to be our two hundredth ever episode. So we've got, I dare I say, a fun movie planned, at least fun to talk about.
01:45:01
Speaker
I'm sure, if not fun for us to watch, will be fun to talk about. So join us next week for that. In the meantime, I'm your host, Stephen Foxworthy, for my co-hosts, Brett Wright and Tucker. Until next time, MacArthur Park is melting in the dark. All that sweet green icing flowing down. Someone shut the fence off in the rain.