Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Work Life Balance
101 Plays1 year ago
We all struggle with work-life balance, whether you’re in school, in the corporate world, or working for yourself. We live in a world that encourages a relentless pursuit of increased productivity over fulfillment and this idea that we need to get somewhere (faster) so we can be okay. Join us as we discuss the intricacies of work life balance and how we’ve navigated it so far.
Art Pick of the Episode
Ahir: Blood Meridian - A book “that dwells on the worst evils, written in prose with the beauty of an angel,” which explores one question: how can goodness matter in a world where it can be annihilated at any moment by overwhelming violence
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/394535.Blood_Meridian_or_the_Evening_Redness_in_the_West
Devam: New Normal - Finally some good representation! A playful Indians-in-the-Bay-Area sitcom written and directed by my college bud Vivek Menon that the whole family can enjoy. Share it with your friends and parents!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dGhu7ORS-0&pp=ygUYbmV3IG5vcm1hbCBpbmRpYW4gZmFtaWx5
Books Referenced
Quarterlife - https://www.amazon.com/Quarterlife-Search-Self-Early-Adulthood/dp/0525511660
Credits
"Vibing Over Venus" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
"Midnight Tale" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Podcast Focus
00:00:00
Speaker
Hey everyone, welcome back to Pineapple Blunt Rotation. Since we've been really bad at giving proper intro, we're going to do that this time and we're going to do it every time to explain what we're doing, right?
00:00:15
Speaker
We are a mental health focused podcast where the goal is to share experiences and start discussions. We want to reiterate that we're not experts. The point is to just share what we've learned through our journeys and like talk to each other, get tips from each other and share that and ask and engage with the audience. Damn, that intro was already like a hundred times better than the last one.
00:00:41
Speaker
I also want to mention that we have an Instagram page, and that's where we're going to be posting a lot of content, a lot of questions that we ask the audience and get responses from. And that's where we'll have our main engagement with everyone. So please, please go follow our Instagram page. It's pineapple dot rotation.
Settling into Routines and Personal Improvement
00:01:04
Speaker
Okay, so here, what's been going on since the last time we talked? What has been going on?
00:01:16
Speaker
honestly not that much of note which is which is honestly like pretty notable for the last few months like i feel like after like this whole period of like like i mentioned last episode just like my girlfriend moving in uh with me and like us getting like settled together like we're
00:01:36
Speaker
finally like starting to like I guess like dig down and like get our routines back in order and like sort of like just go back to normal life instead of like just a state of like constant like chaos of like oh what's going on here like trying to like figure out like how to live together stuff like that so um not not much has happened I think mainly just like
00:01:55
Speaker
Dialing down on those like I've been trying to work on improving my sleep like these last few weeks So I have been trying to get a bed before for which is such a low bar for most people but such a high buyer bar for me so Definite progress. Yeah, just slowly whittling away at it. So how's that been though? How's that like? Living with your girlfriend. This is the first time you're you've moved it together. That's a big step
00:02:22
Speaker
Oh, definitely, yeah. It's been going well.
Moving in with a Partner: Challenges and Compromises
00:02:25
Speaker
I think at the beginning, there were definitely some arguments and challenges that we had to work through, just because, obviously, in the past, I would stay over at her place all the time, just for essentially mainly staying at her place for weeks when we were living in college. But first of all, it's been
00:02:44
Speaker
like two years since we graduated. Right. And then also I think that in the past, like when we were visiting each other and like even when we were like staying together, like there was very much still a sense that like each of our apartments was our own space. So it was like like obviously if we had problems with what the other person was doing, it was just like, oh, like they're going to be gone like in a couple of days. Like it's not like a big deal or whatever. And so I feel like there's been this period of like trying to negotiate that and just being like, OK, like what where do our like living habits like
00:03:14
Speaker
Like coincide, where do they not? Like what kind of compromises does each of us have to make? So like, there were definitely like, so a lot of like discussions and arguments at first, but like, yeah, I think it sort of like comes with the course and yeah, yeah. So it's been going a lot better now, but yeah, definitely like that hunt to get over in the first place. But I mean, I've been enjoying
New Beginnings in New York City
00:03:35
Speaker
it a lot. Yeah, it's just like so nice for me to like just come home every day and like always have her there. So I mean, no regrets from my end.
00:03:43
Speaker
That's amazing, man. I'm happy for you guys. But yeah, no, it is definitely challenging, right? Yeah, yeah. Transitioning to roommates and making sure each of you have the space to express yourself and grow. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, no, for those of you who don't, you didn't understand that bit. Me, I hear, and I were living together in Seattle. And I moved out. And Asha, or his girlfriend, moved in. And so she replaced me. Yeah.
00:04:17
Speaker
I mean, that kind of leads me to my update. I ended up moving to New York last month and it's been a lot of fun so far. I was really looking forward to this move for a while because I just kind of wanted to blow up my life and meet a bunch of new people and kind of get lost in the city and kind of just let go of everything.
00:04:44
Speaker
start fresh and I think it's a perfect place to do it. I'm getting settled in. I'm visiting the local spots for the first time every weekend, but it's been a lot of fun. I never thought I would move to New York, but
00:05:02
Speaker
Now I feel like there are very few cities like New York. It's not really comparable to Seattle or San Francisco. It's just like a different kind of place. Like it's not even a fair comparison. There's just so much going on in every corner. It's so lively. It's so accessible. Like, yeah, it's just a different world. Yeah. I feel like it's not comparable to any city, just its own thing. What are your, what are the best spots you've been to so far?
00:05:31
Speaker
Dude, there's this there's this place called Rowdy Rooster in East Village, like very close to where I live. And it's it's an Indian fried chicken sandwich. And it's so good. Oh, my God. I've had like I've literally had it like eight times in the last month. It's really good. And I have to write that down for the next time I'm on the East Coast. That sounds beautiful. What was it called?
00:06:02
Speaker
rowdy rooster rowdy rooster but no man there's there's a lot of there's a lot of good food i live in east village so like the heart of east village and so like there's so many restaurants around here uh like all the main bars uh clubs are all here and then lower east side so it's a fun neighborhood no i feel like uh yeah like it's probably i i guess like that's just the whole city where i was thinking like i feel like when
00:06:31
Speaker
like like for example when we were living like near Cap Hill it's like you can just get lost like exploring like just that one area when there's that many like good spots like it's sometimes hard to like motivate yourself to go outside but i i feel like in new york that's probably true of literally every place in the city so totally yeah yeah i know yeah east village is probably
00:06:53
Speaker
I want to say the size of capital health. Gotcha. And it's just one part of Manhattan. Yeah, Jesus. Yeah, just one part of Manhattan, not even counting anything else. Oh my God. Yeah. City that never ends. Yeah. Any stand out, like, I guess, like experiences, like things you've done so far? Places you visited? Halloween was a lot of fun.
00:07:20
Speaker
had a couple friends visit and like just the city was so alive. Yeah. And
00:07:27
Speaker
through like a housewarming. It was a great it was a great time. The rooftop bars here are amazing. The views are great. The drinks are expensive. So they're more expensive than Vegas. Like, I mean, not everywhere. Some places, only some places. But yeah, yeah, I did. I did go to this restaurant slash bar called Double Chicken, please. And basically they have they have drinks that taste like food.
00:07:56
Speaker
Yeah, like do they do they actually taste like I can't even imagine what that would yeah So some of their flavors are like cold pizza Japanese noodles Key lime pie French toast maple syrup What else does it just does it just taste like they like liquefied that food Jesus
00:08:24
Speaker
Yeah, it doesn't even taste like a drink. Like it just tastes like the food itself. So it's definitely cool. Yeah. I don't, there's no, like, I don't know if I would go again necessarily. Cause I don't, there's no real point to it, but as a novelty, it's cool. You know, it's like, oh wow, this is cool. Yeah. Like, damn, I didn't realize you could do that anyways. They do have a really good fried chicken sandwich.
00:08:53
Speaker
Got you. I'd say right. You're still better, but that's say otherwise that double chicken please is better, but yeah, there's a wrong. Well, you can come and try them for yourself. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, objective third party. Got you. Got you.
Struggles with Work-Life Balance Among Young Professionals
00:09:21
Speaker
So today we're going to talk about work life balance. And this is something that I personally have dealt with over the last couple of years, struggled with. And it's, I feel like a lot of people our age
00:09:39
Speaker
you know, in their early 20s, like right after college, as they enter the workforce are beginning to struggle with this concept, right? It's like this constant push of pull of work and life. And it's interesting because especially in higher pressure communities, like in high schools and colleges, I feel like it's kind of
00:10:09
Speaker
We kind of do all this work, right? And push ourselves so hard to get to this point where we're at right now, right? To graduate and get that, get that internship, get that job, get that, you know, degree grades, whatever. Right. And now we're here. We're in the workforce. We're here. And now it's like, okay.
00:10:31
Speaker
We're here. And what are we, are we still doing that? Like, are we still, are we still trying to get somewhere? Like what's, what's, what's the, what's, there's no clear path, right? And so it's not like, Oh, I just need to do this and then I'll, that'll happen. And then I'm good. Right. Cause that's kind of the, the mindset, which, which.
00:10:53
Speaker
with which we push ourselves until now. And now suddenly it's like your life could go in so many different directions and there's no clear path. There's no answers. There's no like, there's no guidance really. And so it's, it's so easy to, you know, get stuck with work-life balance and struggle with it.
00:11:20
Speaker
Because there's no rule book. Yeah. What do you think, I hear? Yeah, I mean, I agree with most of what you said. I think it is slightly different for me, because I think for me, I feel like I have a strong, I've always had a strong sense of, I guess, what I'm passionate about in terms of I'm really into philosophy and I'm really into art. And I've always known that those are the things I kind of want to pursue outside of my job once I started working.
00:11:49
Speaker
But I think for me, it's like work-life balance is less about like, I think for me like the biggest way it shows is less in like, I guess like now like taking a look at my life and like not knowing what to do as much as it is like not taking care of myself and
00:12:12
Speaker
like not giving myself the time to pursue those passions that I know that I have and those hobbies that I know that I want to pursue. Like, and I think like the biggest thing for me is that, yeah, like, yeah, it's more about losing that sense of passion because I'm neglecting myself. Yeah. So I guess a good way to start this discussion is probably to talk about
00:12:38
Speaker
Hey, how has, what has work-life balance meant historically? Like how has it been historically, right? Throughout high school and college and then first couple of years into the workforce. So what, what has your experience been so far? It's definitely been rough. Yeah, it's definitely been rough. And I don't even know necessarily if that's because like, like, oh, like my, my job right now is like that much
00:13:08
Speaker
worse compared to like yeah like I don't know if it's that like my job is that much worse compared to like how things were like when I was working for like school or anything like for I feel like for me it's very much that like like growing up like like going through high school and then going through college like there's a very set structure and like going to college it's like yeah there's like that set structure of like okay there's like certain goals I need to achieve like I need to get these grades but like
00:13:38
Speaker
Even like it's kind of this weird thing where we had very set like goals but at the same time outside of that it's like if we wanted to like one day in college like we could just like Sleep sleep in the whole day like fuck around and then like just like get our work done like when
00:13:53
Speaker
like as long as it was before like whenever we needed like our deadlines were versus like I think it's definitely been a shift for me like moving into like sort of starting my own life and like having to integrate like having that sort of those sorts of like routines and habits about like okay I need to work for this many hours per day I need to like like schedule and structure my own time and then even outside of
00:14:16
Speaker
work it's definitely like I feel like even that's like less clear in terms of like hobbies and passions because in college like obviously you're living around your friends like everyone like there's always something to do or like you can join in like just like going to their place and like hanging out like it's definitely been a shift like moving over to this like lifestyle where it's more like okay I need to put in that initiative to like put like take that time for myself versus like yeah how things were before
00:14:46
Speaker
Yeah, it's a struggle. I feel like none of us have figured out the answer. Yeah. Especially this early on in their careers where I feel like we're only just realizing that this is a problem in the first place. Yeah. For me, I feel like I have struggled with work-life balance over the last couple, since I started the job almost three years from now.
00:15:13
Speaker
I have struggled with it. It's been, obviously there are better times and worse times, but I think it took, it ended up like over the last, not recently, but over the last couple of years, it took a big toll on me. It was impacting.
00:15:36
Speaker
It has impacted my life in a lot of negative ways. I felt stuck for a long time. I felt like if you've ever been in an environment where you're told like, you know, work is life. Like, what do you mean work-life balance? Or like, you know, like, oh yeah, work-life balance. But then that'll be the official messaging. But then, you know, the culture, you can't really change that with messaging.
00:16:03
Speaker
Yeah. And it's like it's things that you have to kind of navigate. And as a person who has just entered the workforce, it's difficult to navigate things like that, especially when throughout college, things have been very clear and it's just like, oh, yeah, I just need to work this much.
00:16:22
Speaker
You pretty much do what you're told, right? Like for the most part. And so when you enter the workforce, you kind of have to start making those decisions for yourself, regardless of what anyone or any authority is saying out there.
00:16:41
Speaker
Yeah, I think it definitely it took it took a big toll on me. I think it was always something right? It was always like, Oh, I just need to, I just need to get this project out. I just need to get this promo. It's always it's always the next promo. Always the next promo. There's always another promo. And then I won't care after that. You always tell yourself these things, right? But
00:17:10
Speaker
Yeah, it, it was, it was a lot. It affected me. It affected like my connection to myself. I was just so drained and numb working that it affected my, the relationships around me, my relationship, myself, um, you know, not getting time to pursue hobbies to just sit and relax and let my brain wander. Right. I think.
00:17:39
Speaker
That's something that I missed and that's something that I'm finally getting better at now. Yeah. But I think, I think that's the main thing. Like if you're working so much, it's like you stop, you stop feeding your soul, right? Like, does that make your heart full? Make your soul full? Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's interesting. It took, it took, it took a while to even realize that, Oh, this is toxic. This, this is giving me anxiety. This is like giving me a lot of stress.
00:18:10
Speaker
And that I don't need to be in that situation. It's a lot of it is to do with your own mindset, right? Regardless of like, what is, how are you looking at it? Right. And so it's always, I mean, I feel like especially growing up in competitive environment, it's always been like, Oh, I need to perform. I need to be.
00:18:36
Speaker
better than the others, like I need to stand out, you know, show that I'm capable and, you know, always fishing for the, you know, the compliments and the, of course, certain philosophy of sacrificing today for tomorrow. Yeah. Right.
00:19:00
Speaker
And that again, it goes back to the, the promo, the, you know, if I work, um, I mean, how many times have you seen this idea, right? All these people entering the workforce and then just going like, yeah, my plan is to just work really hard for like five, 10, 15 years. Right. Quick decade long detour. Yeah. And just like completely dissociate with yourself for 10 years.
00:19:30
Speaker
And then life will happen after that, right? Yeah. And that just ends up putting you in this place where you're so lost and you just kind of stray further and further from yourself. Yeah, you just end up putting off your life until it's already over. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Damn, that's fucking that's horrible to hear. Like, I can't even imagine that, like,
00:19:57
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like there's so much in what you said just to all the dynamics of work-life balance, the mindset, the external pressures. I guess I'm just curious, do you feel like when you were sacrificing your life for work and when you were in that place,
00:20:16
Speaker
Like, do you feel like that was more driven by that, like external pressure from like your manager and stuff to like, Oh, you need to perform better. Oh, you should be working more. Or do you feel like it was more of that, like internal mindset that you talk about where it's like, you felt like, okay, I need that next promo. Like I need that next accomplishment. I think it's, I think it's internal, right? I think it's, I mean, external, like.
00:20:40
Speaker
You can't control the world. People are going to say, everyone has their own interests. Your manager has his own interests, business interests, and your manager's manager will have the same ones. Corporate world is a hierarchy of what's the word I'm looking for.
00:21:05
Speaker
It's a hierarchy of domination. Yeah. Exploitation. And exploitation. How it is. Right. And definitely some environments are better at handling it. But that's kind of built into the nature of it. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And so.
00:21:31
Speaker
I think it was more to do internally. It was this, I had this idea of like, Hey, I just want to get to this place. Yeah. I want to get to this place where I don't have to worry about money. I don't have to worry about something else. And especially I think it was combined with the fact that my job, like, even though like I was growing and it was like, you know, all of these things, but it wasn't, there was something missing for me. I felt like I was.
00:22:01
Speaker
sacrificing something for myself, right? Yeah. Some connection towards what I want to do with my life. Yeah. Severing like a connection towards meaning. Yeah, like fundamental level. And it was extra like, Oh, I want to get to this faster. Yeah, yeah. That I can go do those things, right? Yeah. So that kind of that, that kind of mindset.
00:22:31
Speaker
got you. Yeah. But no, I mean, the symptoms of it, man, like, let me tell you, like, it was I was I was waking, I was going to sleep thinking about work.
Recognizing Burnout and Its Impact
00:22:44
Speaker
I was waking up thinking about work, you know, like what I should do, like, yeah, I can change this. It's like this obsession, right? Yeah, yeah. And it was just
00:22:57
Speaker
And that's how burnout happens, right? Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was, it was just very consuming. Yeah. To the point where like, I would just, I remember like there were times like I would be driving back from work and I would just be so like, I would be numb in the car to the point where I wouldn't even realize I was driving. I would just drive home.
00:23:24
Speaker
And somehow I would like end up at home, like not even thinking about it.
00:23:34
Speaker
I would just, I remember like there were so many days I would come back and I would just sit in the car. Yeah. For like, because I was like, I would just be so trained and like, I just, I just, I need some time to just sit in the car, in the garage and just like. Breathe. It was that bad. Like it was just, it was so consuming.
00:24:04
Speaker
Jesus. Yeah. And so if I know, I know for a fact that a lot of people are dealing with this origin and it is fucking sad. Yeah. It is like truly, truly like I don't wish that on anyone. Yeah. Yeah. And it's not about number of hours necessarily.
00:24:24
Speaker
I know people that are seemingly working more than 60, 70 hours, but they're also fine. Maybe at this point in their life, that's what they need the most. That's what's giving them the passion. Yeah. It's not true for everyone. Yeah, definitely. And that, and that also doesn't have to necessarily do with the number of hours you can burn out working 50 hours a week. Yeah. You know, like, yeah. Yeah. I got you. Yeah.
00:24:53
Speaker
It's also, yeah, I can imagine if the work is really difficult, it doesn't matter if you only even worked six or seven hours that day, you're still going to come back home exhausted. You're not going to have the bandwidth to do anything else. Yeah. Yeah. No, exactly.
00:25:16
Speaker
Yeah. So what was the point, I guess, once you were in that, what was your fracture point? When did you realize, OK, I can't do this anymore? Was it a slow realization? Or was there one event where you suddenly had a clarity? No, it was slow. It was slow. It was a feeling that was slowly
00:25:46
Speaker
marinating inside me. And it slowly kept building and building and building. And that was actually the first time I started therapy for that, specifically for that, how to deal with burnout, like work-life balance, that kind of stuff. How to be more in touch with myself. Yeah, that's when I started learning some techniques. I started practicing daily check-ins.
00:26:16
Speaker
Like, oh, every day after work or at any, any, not after work or at 3 p.m. or whatever. Yeah. Check in with yourself. Right. Hey, what am I feeling? Yeah. Am I feeling stressed? Where am I feeling stressed? Why am I feeling stressed?
00:26:34
Speaker
what I'm going to do about it and what I'm going to do for myself later that day. Just literally three simple questions. But I was so surprised that I wasn't asking myself those questions at all. And when I did start doing that, by the way,
00:26:56
Speaker
I'm terrible at continuing, like I'm terrible at holding myself to do these things. But when I did start doing that, I did it very religiously for like a month or two. It helped a lot. It helped a lot. It didn't fix everything, but it helped me at least find that voice inside me for the first time.
00:27:26
Speaker
Right. That's you. Yeah. That like, okay, listen, listen to your mind, listen to your body. Right. Like, so that, that, that was the first time that, and then, and then kind of everything else built on top of that. Yeah. Yeah. I got you.
00:27:49
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like when you're in that kind of environment, like it's so hard. Like part of the reason it's so hard to get out of it is like just, yeah, like you don't even have the time to like even really acknowledge or like come to terms with like how you're feeling and like, yeah, it can be difficult to like. Like.
00:28:10
Speaker
Yeah, it's difficult to find time. And I also think it's so easy to almost lie to yourself and be like, oh, I'm fine. To almost think, oh, I know how I'm feeling. Yeah, you don't necessarily need to take that step back, even though once you do, even if it's only for a couple of minutes, yeah, you suddenly realize, oh, there's been so much stuff. I wasn't letting myself
00:28:39
Speaker
be aware of or like I didn't have the bandwidth to like, yeah, like have awareness of. Yeah. Totally. The way I think about it is kind of like
00:28:48
Speaker
being and operating in first person. Yeah. Like in a shooting game, like, yeah, it's like you have a first person view and then you have a third person. Yeah, I don't know. Second person, one point five person view where it's slightly outside your normal field of vision and suddenly you can see more clearly where you're actually at. Yeah. It's so much easier to orient yourself. Yeah.
00:29:17
Speaker
I should have known, dude. I suck at first person shooter games. Life is an FPS, bro. Yeah.
00:29:31
Speaker
Honestly though, that's such a perfect metaphor because I think it very much is taking that step back to be aware of yourself. You get so caught up just in what you're doing, that immediate perspective or task that you're working on that you don't take that step back to be like, where the fuck am I? What is my life right now? Yeah.
00:29:56
Speaker
How has it been for you? What have the downturns been like in times where you like say weeks where you have terrible work-life balance, right? You're working constantly throughout the weeks. What things have you done?
00:30:17
Speaker
I mean like just like my fucking mental health just like plummets. Like I'm like, I find myself like really stressed out by everything like irritable. Like I definitely like, I think a big thing is like just like all of like my passion and like the enjoyment I get out of like, like everyday activities just like gets sucked out of me. Like there's lots of times like, like I don't like,
00:30:43
Speaker
Like, yeah, when my work-life balance is bad, like, it's like, I'll give myself time, like, to, like, I'll try to give myself time to, like, take a break and, like, focus on my life. And it's just, like, I won't even really know where to start or what to do just because, like, I feel so drained that it's like, I don't really want to do anything. Like, nothing really gives me that, like, joy anymore. Like, I think, like, that's one of the big things for me. And I think that's very related to, again, like,
00:31:16
Speaker
that's a big part of when my mental health gets worse. I just lose that enjoyment. And then I stop really taking care of myself as much. I stop eating well, sleeping well, things like that. And it's sort of like this loop where it's like maybe I have a rough week because of personal things or because of something at work. And then it's because of that, I take care of myself less. And then because of that, it becomes harder to keep up with work. And I start like,
00:31:37
Speaker
like my mental health, like because I think, yeah, like
00:31:45
Speaker
yeah, like just dealing with work in like a more unhealthy way and like that causes me to take care of myself even less and so yeah, yeah, it's like this like self-perpetuating cycle almost until like I finally like force myself to like take a step back and I'm just like okay like I can't live like this or like my therapist like I'll
00:32:05
Speaker
Uh, like a lot of times, like when I go to therapy, like I feel like the big thing is just that, like, like you were saying, like that just gives some time to like take a step back and just be like, okay, like you don't. Like you don't need to be working this hard on this or like, uh, like, like, like getting this project out by the end of the week, like isn't as important as you actually think. Like you have a lot more time to take care of yourself and yeah.
00:32:32
Speaker
Yeah, I'd say that's pretty much the cycle for me. Might work by balance, go that away. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah, it's like every day other tasks overwhelm you, right? Yeah.
00:32:52
Speaker
And then everything else also kind of feels just like a task, you know, yeah, cooking, cleaning, yeah. Talking to people. Yeah. You know, calling home, like, yeah, calling, you know, whoever it is you need to call. Yeah. If you're in a relationship that like, it's just everything just so like, just because you don't know
00:33:20
Speaker
You're not in touch with yourself at all. Everything else is so, so burdening. Oh, definitely. Yeah. Everything, every single thing, just feeding yourself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. When that like, yeah. Cause like, when that enjoyment goes away, it's like, they aren't like things you enjoy anymore, right? They stopped becoming a part of your life and they just become like, okay, like I have to eat every day. So it's like, I'm taking off that box. It's like, just like, yeah.
00:33:50
Speaker
Yeah. And I think one thing I've noticed over the last couple of years is this, like you were saying, there's a cycle, but I'd say like, I'd say there's also a cycle for like staying numb, right?
Social Media's Effect on Personal Connections and Creativity
00:34:07
Speaker
Because you're so tired and you're so burned out from everything. It's like,
00:34:14
Speaker
Have you ever noticed like a lot of older people, like parents working for jobs and stuff, who just after work, all they do is like stare at the TV? Yeah, yeah, that's definitely. That's a thing, right? Like, I feel like there's a whole generation of people that are just glued to the TV. Yeah. And there's a reason for that, right? Like, it's not out of nowhere. It's because
00:34:46
Speaker
you're so burnt out and sucked out of everything, right, from your job. And not just job, it's like everything for this society has set up for us, you know? I mean, the job is one thing, but the reason you do this job is because you have to fucking pay for healthcare and you have to pay for, you know, this $3 million house in the Bay Area and you have to pay for your kid's college tuition, right?
00:35:13
Speaker
And you have to leave, you have to send money back home, like all of these things. Right. And so that's the reason you do it. Yeah. But then you're not in touch with yourself at all. Yeah. You don't know.
00:35:26
Speaker
You lose purpose for your very own being of existence, right? Not in relation to other people. Like, yeah, I have to live for these other people. But like, why do you have to live for yourself? You kind of do stuff, right? And so then you can't create.
00:35:44
Speaker
Yeah. In your free time. You can't create anything. You can't create any art. You can't work on anything cool. You just consume. And so you become consumers of TV. And for that generation it's TV. Or if you just find yourself watching Netflix all the time.
00:36:04
Speaker
Yeah, something like that, right? And for us, I feel like it's manifested itself and staying glued to our phones and TikTok and social media, like any kind of social media is just passive entertainment.
00:36:21
Speaker
It's not entertainment. It's just like, it's a way to keep our minds engaged without actually creating, being creative. Yeah. White noise. Yeah. It's just white noise. And it's just, it's not even relaxing. Yeah. Anyone who says watching TikToks is relaxing, it's not. You're full of shit. Like it's, it's literally like you, you will never feel more well rested.
00:36:49
Speaker
after watching TikToks for an hour. You know what I mean? Most of the time. Yeah. I think I already drained, which is... If it's just pure entertainment, I understand, but it is 95% never that. Oh, yeah. Right. It's not used in that way. Yeah.
00:37:12
Speaker
Yeah, you know, when I found out it was a problem, it was when is when I realized I was ignoring people, people that I like, there would be there would be messages on my phone from people, right? Yeah, who I love people who like, you know, I have these connections with and I would ignore them. And instead, spend time on
00:37:40
Speaker
reels or TikTok, you know? And that's when I realized that this is... And I started questioning why that is. Like, why is it that I do that? And I realized that that was the reason. I just didn't have the energy to engage with them. And that's when I realized I'd had a problem.
00:38:02
Speaker
Because the reels, they give you so much in return, right? They give you so much, they give you a much higher dopamine kick for putting in nothing. So then it's like, then obviously your brain is going to prefer that. It's going to create that. Cause we don't even know how to, we don't even know how to react to these kinds of stimulus. Um, yeah.
00:38:31
Speaker
So yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The whole science of social media is really, really interesting. Yeah. Our brains are not built to handle this shit. And it's like, it's very much built to exploit us. Yeah. She's dystopian. Yeah. Yeah. Not even like, yeah, there's like the social media, like our brains not being able to handle it. There's the algorithms. Like there's so many ways it's like fucked up and exploitative.
00:38:59
Speaker
Yeah. If you're listening to this, like I want you to ask yourself, when was the last time you actually felt well rested? And if you have an answer to that question, I'm already jealous of you. And you were doing something right. And please, please share your experience. But as far as I can tell, like most people are struggling with this. Yeah. The second you said, well, you rested, I started yelling. Yeah.
00:39:29
Speaker
Yeah, no, definitely. Yeah, it's a problem. It's sort of like, almost like, I don't know, like, it almost seems like, like, I wonder, like, like, I feel like it's like, like, I definitely agree with what you're saying about like, social media and like, the way that we sort of get like lulled into like, passivity, instead of like, actually thinking about like, okay, like, why am I doing this? Like, why don't, like,
00:39:56
Speaker
Like why don't I have the energy to do other things I want to do with my life? But I almost see it as like, do you like, I kind of see it as like a symptom of like the problem, you know? Cause I feel like when I do have that energy, like when I am like taking care of myself, like it's almost like the, the motivation to like do that, like is a lot lower too, right? Like it's like, I feel like more motivated to like go out and like spend time with my friends and like just exploring stuff. So I wonder like, like,
00:40:24
Speaker
I guess like from your perspective, like, do you feel like, like, do you see it as more of like a symptom or like, do you feel like that's like contributed to the problem for you before? Like, I mean, like it's, I guess for me, like it's definitely contributed in the sense where it's like, like just took up my attention, like white noise. And like, so I didn't like take that step back and I wasn't like being mindful about like what I was doing. But yeah, just curious. Yeah. No, I think I don't think it's just a symptom.
00:40:55
Speaker
I think it contributes to the problem because it takes something out of you, right? Like when you get those, like, when you get those, like, it's different when you're like looking for entertainment, right? But when you're scrolling in your past time, when like, you know, when you're already down and tired, right? It's making your brain more tired. There is some thing that is lost,
00:41:24
Speaker
There's something that is lost by doing that. It's the ability to create or apply something that you know already. Yeah. Let's say you spent all this time learning, right? You have certain ideas, some ideas of philosophy. Yeah. Instead of learning more, there's a certain sense of like,
00:41:54
Speaker
Just sitting with what you do have, right? And allowing your brain to wander with it. Yeah. And create. It's taking away from that constant never ending bombardment of information is taking away from that ability to create. Because the most creative mind is a bored mind, right? Like that's what that's what research tells us.
00:42:24
Speaker
Like, you know, yeah, like in the, like not actively doing something or like not actively engaged. Yeah. Like allowing your brain to engage itself instead of being engaged by an external stimulus. Yeah. Like I don't feel like, I guess like social media has anything like inherently negative, you know, it's like, yeah, sure. It's like not something that's like.
00:42:49
Speaker
I think a good way to think about it is, like, in the past, like, there have always been, like, back in fucking Socrates' day, like, philosophers would talk about, like, oh, kids these days are just, like, playing games with their wooden toys instead of reading books. Like, they're not, like, they should be actively studying and trying to understand these things, but instead they're just, like, wasting these time with these frivolous activities.
00:43:16
Speaker
like I don't really see like any big difference between like like that and like social media in a certain sense like I think that like we've always found ways to like I guess like waste time and like we've always like like like felt like they're all like there have always been these concerns about like oh like is this causing like the kids to get stupider or is this like um like yeah like the just like that
00:43:41
Speaker
Like, if those things weren't there, like, oh, maybe people would be better off, and they would be spending their time doing more, engaging more actively with things which are more valuable to them. But I don't really see a big difference between social media and distractions in the past that people have worried about. I think social media, like I was saying, is definitely more negative in the sense where it's more exploitative of our brains' pleasure centers.
00:44:10
Speaker
They're obviously like better or worse distractions, but I don't see anything like inherently negative or like that much more negative than like distractions in the past, you know? I'm not saying that social media is inherently evil. It's always the relationship with. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And so I'm saying that a lot of people have that relationship with social media. I know for a fact that I would have been, I would be better off if I didn't scroll
00:44:41
Speaker
a lot on these things. And I think I'm redefining my relationship with these things. And it has helped me a lot. Because I do find myself having the energy to do something simple, like respond to people. Which is so dumb if you think about why the hell am I not responding to people, but I'm going and scrolling on these apps. But yeah, so now I'm able to do that more.
00:45:09
Speaker
I mean, I think that's perfectly fair. Like I think a lot of people have like an unhealthy relationship with social media. I guess like, yeah, like the point I was more of trying to get at is like, yeah, I don't think there's anything like, like, like, again, like there's nothing like inherently negative, right? It's like just the relationship that you have, like being mindful about that relationship. Yeah. No, I think it's about understanding your relationship you have with these things. Yeah. Because once you do that,
00:45:40
Speaker
You will know whether it is a problem or not. In my case, I examined the relationship I had with social media and I found that it was a problem. And so I've been working on redefining. Yeah. And I encourage everyone to do the same thing because I think a lot of people would benefit from the analysis.
Exploring Personal Meaning and Avoiding Societal Pressure
00:46:07
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. No arguments there.
00:46:11
Speaker
Yeah I guess like it's almost for me like I feel like like I guess like now like thinking about it like I have a better like sense of like why I was bringing this up more which is that like I feel like for me sometimes like that idea of like oh like I'm just like
00:46:25
Speaker
mindlessly browsing on my phone, I should be doing more active things. I think that can almost turn into toxic mindset again, where I start thinking about, oh, I need to be using all of my time productively. I shouldn't be doing anything passive. I shouldn't be resting there. So I guess that's more of a me thing.
00:46:47
Speaker
You're definitely right. That's not the message at all. It's not like, oh, go out there and be more productive. Just allow your brain the time to be. And things will naturally come. And for a long time, maybe even they won't come.
00:47:07
Speaker
You will have a lull, like the first time you're off the phone, it's not like you're just going to be magically fucking enlightened, like this post nut clarity and everything's going to be clear, right? It's going to, you're just going to be existing for some time. Then things will naturally come, like slowly you'll have a thought. That's interesting.
00:47:28
Speaker
learn more about that. Definitely. Engage with this. I want to make this dish. I want to go eat. I don't know. Anything. Whatever it is, man. I feel like everyone has some form of meaning inside of it. I think that's what I'm trying to say. Everyone has some artistic
00:47:52
Speaker
value, like some artistic drive inside them. But I think where that social media has been toxic for a lot of people and for me is it's preventing that from coming out.
00:48:13
Speaker
I think that's fair. So whatever it is, dancing, music, if it's engineering, it's engineering. That's great. Philosophy, photography, cooking, podcasting, writing, create. Literally anything. I want to encourage people to do something.
00:48:39
Speaker
And then you have these things about, oh, like, it won't be perfect. Why even try? Yeah. You know, if it's not better than everyone else. Yeah. But that's not the point of art, right? Yeah. You've almost turned art into this competition. Yeah. Which is so dumb. Yeah. Yeah, go ahead. No, I was going to be like, oh, other people draw better than me. Why even draw?
00:49:09
Speaker
I got you. I got you. I want to help break that in some way. Maybe we should start a column or something. Maybe we should start submissions.
00:49:29
Speaker
We'll use our platform to showcase. I would be kind of down because I actually watch a podcast where like every episode like people submit like just fan art of the people in the podcast and like they show that before each episode. No, totally. Let's do it. Send us your best pineapple drawings. No, but I'm not even saying that.
00:49:54
Speaker
Not even related to the podcast. Just any piece of art. Oh, yeah. You know, they created. Yeah. Show it. Just anything. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little clay pot you made, like whatever, like be proud of it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, definitely.
00:50:22
Speaker
I think that's very fair. Like I think like the key is like, just like almost like it's like to take like an active role in like what you're doing and like what you're doing, like in your life. Since we were talking about like taking those steps, like to do, like to do things more actively and to like engage with your life more. Like what, what do you think like the big things that you've, or like the big steps you've taken so far that have been positive? Like what have you seen?
00:50:51
Speaker
like that you really enjoy and that you really like doing now that you've taken that step back. I think in the process of figuring out how to navigate this kind of constant push and pull of work lifetimes, that comes later. I'm still even getting to that part where I'm figuring out what things I actually enjoy doing. I think a lot of it
00:51:21
Speaker
has been understanding, trying to figure out why, how I ended up in this place in the first place. Got you, got you. Because until you do that, I feel like, so here's what happened, right? For me, I was like, okay, I'm going to invest more in my hobbies. Okay, instead of working all the time, right? Yeah.
00:51:47
Speaker
you know, at my job. Yeah. And so I was like, all right, let me do that. So I tried achieving work-life balance by working on my hobbies and myself more, but I'm still operating within the same lens that I've always operated in. Yeah. So everything became a job. Yeah.
00:52:17
Speaker
So if I picked up music production, or if I picked up playing the guitar or going to the gym, whatever, it became an obsession too. It became, I have to do this every day. I have to make this much progress and this much time. I have, this is the future that I see with it. You know, this long-term vision, this plan, it just all came up naturally with it.
00:52:43
Speaker
And so after like a little bit of doing that, I would burn out and it would overwhelm me. And I wouldn't even realize that it's doing that, but I would not want to do those things.
00:52:55
Speaker
Yeah, right. So then like, it was like, okay, like what is going on? Yeah, right. And I think a lot of after a lot of reflections, like, I think I think it's two front, right? One is like, one is like, there's there are practices to, to help figure out what you want to do where you're at now.
00:53:21
Speaker
And there's some ways to do that. And the second part is the roots. So first I'll talk about that root, right? Yeah. And that's for me, that has been like this kind of in high school, I developed this work ethic because I, things were difficult. Like it wasn't like.
00:53:42
Speaker
I wanted to stand out, but I wasn't the class genius, you know what I mean? I wasn't like, oh, just retaining information at light speed, like understanding things the first time. No, it was a lot of hard work, right? And so I developed that work ethic and kind of that obsession. And then I allowed that to consume my life, but now,
00:54:10
Speaker
when I do anything, I do it with that same lens. So everything just becomes, while it helped me in that moment, that skill that it helped me in that moment, you know, get to college, graduate college, like all these things, right? Now at this point in my life, it's taking away from my experience.
00:54:32
Speaker
Like now I'm realizing that that's not all there is to it. This is kind of a segue into this book that I read called Porter Life. Okay. And it's a really great book. I think it came out maybe a couple of years ago. It's kind of describes how people are on a range between
00:55:00
Speaker
stability type and meaning type. And stability types, generally, like the idea is like, oh, you view the world as like kind of a series of obstacles that you have to overcome and things you have to achieve, you know, setting things up for a better tomorrow. Yeah. It's kind of like the way we describe conventional success in our society, right? And like how you're supposed to live your life, what it means to, you know, being a homeowner by 30, like getting married, like, you know, all these things, right?
00:55:30
Speaker
Um, retiring at 60, like everything. Yeah. And then you have, and then on the other end of the spectrum is meeting types where it's like, generally people who fall into the far end of this, um, bucket is like, you know, people who usually don't conform to these norms where, um, for these people, like the world kind of looks grim and pointless and depressing. And, you know, these structures that are there just kind of feel wrong.
00:56:00
Speaker
and daunting and they're kind of branded as non-conformist. It's not that they don't have aptitude or talent, they have a lot of that, but they struggle with like, you know, everyday things, engaging with everyday things like, you know, setting up a 401k, thinking about finance, like thinking about like, whatever the fuck, right? Well, you gotta add me like this, bruh.
00:56:27
Speaker
Let me write those down. Am I describing you? He's literally me. Yeah. But yeah, continue, continue. No, I think, I think there are, while there may be some inherent nature to these things, for me, I'm realizing like, I would, like, if you'd asked me a couple of years ago, I would have probably been like, yeah, I'm a stability type.
Balancing Stability and Meaning for Fulfillment
00:56:58
Speaker
But I don't think that's true. I don't think someone is a stability type or someone is a meeting type necessarily. I think someone has a, like everyone has a certain percentage of this, like, and this will change over time. Right. But I think, I think for me, what I learned was I learned how to be a stability type by developing kind of by like going into hyperdrive and like, and like,
00:57:26
Speaker
figuring out how to be conventional in that, how to be successful in the conventional sense of the world. But what I realized is that was taking away from
00:57:43
Speaker
me feeling fulfilled. It wasn't helping me feel fulfilled. And that's kind of the point of the book where it's like, okay, if you grew up one way, if you look at life through this way, you'll hit a point where you want to find more meaning. You want to let go of these things. There is a certain act of balancing that happens on both sides, right?
00:58:14
Speaker
For people who start out on the meaning path, for them it's more like learning how to engage with the world in a way that doesn't overwhelm them.
00:58:26
Speaker
also helps them be successful in that conventional sense, but keep feeding their soul. And I think that's what it is for both as people. It's similar to having both masculine and feminine energy. Life is a mixture of these things, right? And you need both. Well balanced. Regardless of what gender you are, right? Yeah. Well balanced, exactly. Yeah.
00:58:55
Speaker
And so that's, that's what I realized. And yeah, I was at a point where it's like, Oh yeah, everything needs to be optimal. My fucking credit cards have to be optimal. I need the best vacation. I want to go to the gym. I want to work on myself. Like I want all of these things, but it's like, it was so overwhelming. And like, and I, at the end, I still felt empty, you know, like, it's like,
00:59:20
Speaker
It's like, I was almost doing these ways as a way to doing these things as a way to deflect from the emptiness I was feeling inside. Yeah. Yeah. Um, something is wrong. Um, and so it's interesting. Like I'll tell people now, like, when, when people are like, Oh, what are you, what are you up to? Like, how's life? Like, you know, I tell people I'm learning how to be responsible. I'm learning how to just listen to myself.
00:59:49
Speaker
And I'm learning how to let go of like all these conventional ideas. Yeah. I'm learning how to leave my room messy. Yeah. You know, not cook because I don't want to. Yeah. That was the problem always. Whenever I had some free time, I spent it figuring out how to make my life easier in the future. Yeah. So if I had free time, I would go do my laundry.
01:00:16
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I would go like, I would go meal prep something for tomorrow, or I'd go book a flight for later that, you know, so that, so that is done advance and I get a good price and like all this shit. Right. And it was just constantly, constantly that instead of actually relaxing or actually like, yeah, honestly, actually relaxing, even giving me the chance to approach something that's more meaningful. Yeah. Right.
01:00:48
Speaker
Yeah, that was, yeah. So that's kind of my kind of roots, I guess, on the issue. The second part, what I was mentioning is the things that are helping me kind of achieve that, helping me trying to get in touch with myself a little bit more. First of all, the daily check-ins, like I mentioned, right? Like, what am I feeling? Where am I feeling it? What am I going to do the rest of the day?
01:01:17
Speaker
I was listening to this podcast and it had this Buddhist teacher, Jack Kornfield on it. And he'd be like, when you're feeling these things, when you're feeling confused, overwhelmed, like anything, just ask yourself, Hey, what would love have me do today? And if you're feeling overwhelmed, maybe the answer is stay in, order food, watch movie, right? Yeah. Take care of yourself. I feel like that's what work-life balance comes down to. It's just listening to yourself. Yeah, definitely.
01:01:47
Speaker
Oh, if I, separating like, oh, how you treat yourself versus like, just imagine you were your best friend. Yeah. Separate person. What would you tell your best friend to do if they listed out everything going on in their head and in their life? Right. And just like asking that question. Yeah. Um, and then the answer becomes more clear. Yeah. Uh, yeah. And yeah.
01:02:18
Speaker
I don't know, man. I feel like if I went back and I told that person, like if I told myself like a year, two years ago, like, Hey, at the, at the end of every single day, you deserve to feel whole and full and not worry about all the things you have to do tomorrow and just let life happen. I would have looked at myself funny.
01:02:42
Speaker
I would have been like, that's the weirdest fucking shit I've ever heard. I got you. If I did that, how am I going to have a multimillionaire and be able to take exotic vacations to fucking St. Lucia and Seychelles and Santorini and not have to work after 35.
01:03:11
Speaker
yeah no i got you yeah i mean like i i yeah no i mean i feel i feel exactly the same way like i definitely like not like i think like what you said about like um like treating yourself like your best friend like giving yourself that compassion like i definitely like feel like for me too like that's something that's very foreign for me and like just like instinctively
01:03:40
Speaker
especially in the past, like now to a certain extent too, like I think like that idea of like treating myself well and like giving myself time, like I would have like just been like, no, like, yeah, like that would have seen like such an alien, like stupid idea to me. Yeah. Yeah. I think one kind of perspective that helped me is that
01:04:11
Speaker
This kind of doing a bunch of stuff every day and being productive and this kind of conventional idea of success is only there because, because that's the society we built. Yeah. Where that is valued over everything else. Yeah. And once you kind of realize that it's like, what the hell am I doing? Yeah. Yeah.
01:04:40
Speaker
Yeah. No, I guess that concept like blows my mind sometimes. Yeah. Just take a step back and be like, what the fuck is this action? Oh, actually. Yeah. Yeah. But I do want to say, like, I feel like it's a privilege that we've been talking about this. Oh, definitely. Yeah. That we even have the luxury to talk about this. Yeah. A lot of people don't because a lot of people don't. Yeah. Like they're just doing this to survive. Yeah.
01:05:10
Speaker
Like if you're burnt out and you have all these things to do, like all these bills to pay and, you know, kids to send to college and medical stuff to worry about, like everything, like that sentence won't make sense to you. Like, Hey, what would love have me do today? You'd probably just scoff at it. Like, what do you mean?
01:05:33
Speaker
love would have me pay the bills today like yeah afford to send my kids to college yeah totally yeah but i think these conversations are still important because that's what's gonna help to move the needle forward right definitely yeah i mean like we're we're definitely privileged to have like the ability to like have this conversation but like
01:05:59
Speaker
It's like that should be a privilege that everyone has, right? Everyone should have the ability to do what's fulfilling to them. Nobody should have to be in that mode where all you're doing is surviving, right? All you're doing is just ticking off things one day to the next hoping that your kids will have a better life, like a life where they don't have to do that, right?
01:06:22
Speaker
Yeah. I mean... What is it? It's Maslov's hierarchy, right? Yeah. That's what that's about. Self-actualization. Yeah, we just have to get to the next level. Yeah. It's so interesting because I think like a lot of like this mindset like that causes us to
01:06:51
Speaker
like sacrifice our work-life balance like comes from those sorts of situations that we're talking about right like for my like parents like like for my dad for example like he grew up like he had to support like like four or five siblings like
01:07:06
Speaker
off of his income you have to support like his parents like like to a certain extent like that was a luxury he didn't have and I think like almost like that just almost like without thinking gets passed on to the next generation right even though like that's not necessary for us anymore or like that's not yet so it's like but at the same time like we still end up inheriting that mindset we still like just end up like assuming like okay like this is what we have to do when in reality it's like
01:07:37
Speaker
Our parents made it for us. We should be enjoying the life that they've given us. And also for them, like you were saying, they don't need to be in that mode anymore either. They can also spend the time. They've made it now. They can see, OK, now what do I actually care about? Yeah. And then I feel like it's our responsibility to keep going forward. Yeah.
01:08:07
Speaker
Especially for future generations. Yeah. So, and just society in general, right? Keep advocating for that. Yeah, definitely.
01:08:24
Speaker
I think it's so like, yeah, go ahead. Oh, no, I was gonna say, I think there's a quote by like, Benjamin Franklin, who said that, like, my parents studied, like, or like, I studied war, so that my children could start can study science and mathematics, and they study science and mathematics, so their children can spend their life like studying art and philosophy.
01:08:48
Speaker
so they can reach a point where they can just pursue to create, to pursue that fulfilling life. And we have to keep moving forward and pushing for that instead of being stuck in the past, stuck in those old mindsets. That's true. I feel like society, we kind of boost sense of that. It's so interesting. I saw this post once about how every
01:09:17
Speaker
every decade since the 1850s there's been a newspaper article that says with the same headline that says oh some version of oh the new generation oh yeah the new generation wants everything easy yeah they don't want to work they don't want to put in the effort like we yeah like they just want everything given to them yeah and it's so telling that
01:09:47
Speaker
You have the same idea of getting passed down. Yeah. Every generation. Yeah. Every generation is like, fucking kids these days have it too easy. When it's like, to a certain extent, like, that's like, like, that's the proof that they made it, right? Like, that's what they wanted initially. Yeah, literally. Like, I hope my kids have it easier than me.
01:10:14
Speaker
yeah it's like but no that's the thing right it's yeah but also like understanding their perspective it's like they're so bitter from all this shit yeah yeah right because it was so fucking terrible for them no definitely yeah but they're like oh like why is it so much easier yeah right at the end of course yeah
01:10:37
Speaker
And it's also like a lack of understanding, right? It's like if you're used to such a harder life, like the things which we might struggle with might seem so trivial. Like, oh, like why are you, why are you spending so much mental energy on that? Like, why are you like, like, like, why are the, like, why are you taking these things so hard when it's just, yeah, like that, like the same way that like, it's like the same way that other people being happier than us doesn't invalidate our happiness. It's like,
01:11:07
Speaker
the fact that other people have it harder than us doesn't invalidate our difficulties, right? And the point is to hopefully, yeah, like we were saying, like get to a point where like the vast majority of people or nobody has to like struggle the way that like our parents and our grandparents had to, right? The good thing is I think we are headed in the right direction. The fact that you and I are sitting here and having this conversation is a sign of progress.
01:11:33
Speaker
100%. Yeah. And I do think companies in corporate world, like we're, they're being more and more cognizant of these things. And even though some of these things are performative, like there's no question about it. We're still in a better place than we were 20 years ago. And that's how like, it'll keep making progress. Yeah. Right. Definitely. Yeah.
01:12:04
Speaker
The fact that like mental health is, mental health like therapy is so much more accessible. Yeah. More normalized. And there's more normalized.
Progress in Workplace Mental Health Support
01:12:16
Speaker
The point is to really understand where you're at and why you are there and what you can do to make it better. That's it. That's all therapy is really, right? Yeah.
01:12:28
Speaker
There's not, it's not more complicated than that. And so just that, having that be more accessible, I think pushing us in that direction. There's so many companies offering free therapy. Yeah. Yeah. For their employees, which is great. Like, yeah. Yeah. No, I definitely think like, yeah, it's a big improvement.
01:12:53
Speaker
Like it's almost like a sign of like what we were saying of things like improving, right? It's like, once we, once we start moving in a direction where we, our physical needs are taken care of, like now it's like, okay, like, what, like, what do we need? Where do we need to be mentally to actually both be fulfilled? Where do we need to be? Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. Kind of, um, I guess like, I guess there's a question you originally asked, right? Yeah.
01:13:21
Speaker
What has the process been like for getting more in touch with yourself and like figuring out what, what things give me more and stuff like that? You know, I started going to yoga. Yeah. Yoga. Yeah. Yoga has been cool. Um, I've been taking random classes around the city, just like trying to figure out, like I took a Pilates class. Very cool. It was very, very hard. Yeah. I was about to say.
01:13:49
Speaker
I was trembling halfway through. Like it was so hard. That shit is not easy. Um, also yoga is hard. Like if you go, if you're going to a good, proper yoga, proper yoga, I have been like every time I've gone to yoga so far, like so far I've, I've sweated and I've also felt so much more relaxed. Yeah. Yeah.
01:14:17
Speaker
Um, and just like open. And I think it's interesting. I have realized things as I'm doing the yoga, like it's like releasing things that are stored, like, you know, places in my body and, um, Oh, definitely. Yeah. No, I got you.
01:14:38
Speaker
I mean, I think fundamentally that's what it is, right? Like it's that process of like taking care of yourself and like being attuned to your own needs, like the specifics of like what you end up doing or what you're passionate about. Like that'll obviously vary from like what time in your life it is, like who you are, but like the fundamental like process is what's important. Like, yes. And there's a certain sense of you need to explore. You need to go ahead and see what you're doing and leave it for yourself. Right. And then you,
01:15:06
Speaker
And then like over time, you'll know. Yeah. Yeah. No, 100%. Yeah. I feel like assuming in advance, like what those things are is almost like the fundamental problem, right? We like, because I think like, yeah, like when you don't take that step back and like take that time to listen to yourself, like
01:15:28
Speaker
a lot of times you fall into those unhealthy habits just like on impulse and you just assume like, okay, like these are the things I want to do in my life, like you were saying, right? Like, oh, I want to accomplish these things. When in reality, like it's about giving you that space, giving yourself that space to like explore. Yeah.
01:15:46
Speaker
I guess I had a story related to when you were talking about the stability, my personality type, and how the sorts of realizations you came across. I almost feel like as someone who leans more towards the meaning type,
01:16:03
Speaker
it's so fascinating to see like I feel like the issues that I struggled with were so different but like fundamentally like the underlying issues were so similar about like like I was saying like not taking that time to listen to myself not like forgiving myself like I think like throughout like my life like I've very much struggled with like okay like I know like like like even back in like
01:16:30
Speaker
like elementary school and middle school like I knew like I was really passionate about philosophy but it's like I've always struggled with like feeling I guess like it's like when you when you talk about like those norms about like certain things you're supposed to accomplish like I have like very much felt like
01:16:52
Speaker
this sense of like, oh, why should I be doing these things? Like that's not actually what I want to do with my life. This like instinctive, like, I guess like, like attempt to escape from like those things. Like, I guess like the norms that I felt like society was trying to put on me. And I feel like that almost itself became something that I started doing like mindlessly and started becoming like destructive.
01:17:20
Speaker
Yeah, there definitely been projects where I was working on design or a big milestone for my promotion, where because there were certain deadlines I needed to hit, I ended up working on odd hours or ruining my sleep. Or I might decide, oh, I'm not going to go out this weekend. I'm just going to stay in the apartment and just grind it out.
01:17:45
Speaker
just the entire weekend, or I would end up neglecting going to the gym because I was like, oh, I need that extra time to finish up the projects I'm working on. And what would end up happening is that I would start, I would just end up skipping those things more and more to the point where it wasn't even really that I was getting much work done. It was just essentially that
01:18:15
Speaker
Like, yeah, like I like. Just like that, like feeling that like, Oh, I need to like spend longer on this. Like I need to make sure it's perfect. Like I need to make sure like it's done at a certain time. Like I just ended up like consuming my life, like with work to a point where it wasn't even that I was working effectively anymore. It was just that like, I was constantly consumed with like that worry and that stress and like that feeling that like, Oh, I need to be like,
01:18:45
Speaker
working more and I need to be like, like, yeah, being more productive. And so I would end up like neglecting myself and like, yeah, not taking care of myself and like, yeah, just ending up in a really bad place mentally where sometimes I would like have to take like a sick day just because like I felt like I ended up feeling so awful and
01:19:06
Speaker
It's like, I would realize after that, like, Oh, like you took the whole day off. Like nothing actually happened. No one really cared that much. Like it wasn't like there was actually this like world ending deadline that you need to get done. But it's just like I got so like consumed up in that mindset that I would just like mindlessly like throw myself at it. Like even though like it wasn't actually.
01:19:27
Speaker
Like even from the standards of like, Oh, like I have to like work well and I have to work like optimally. Like I wasn't even doing that. I was just like burning myself like down to the, down to ashes. I feel like there's a certain sense of make being made to feel more important than you are. Right. Like it, like, I feel like that's a common theme. And so you feel like you have to work a lot and you're like, Oh, I'm the only one who can do this. I have to do this.
01:19:56
Speaker
Yeah, this project is my baby, you know, I look at all of these feelings, right? And like, burn yourself out along with, you know, the plans of the future and all that shit, right? The other thing there is, because we're so burnt out from the week and so repressed, we have this big release on the weekend, right? Like big release where all we get together, you know, people just go out drinking and
01:20:26
Speaker
And, um, yeah, drinking and getting high and like all of these things, right. Um, and that's where like the work hard play hard comes. But it's so like, that's such a flawed ideology because life happens between the work hard and play hard. Yeah. It's like, it's like.
01:20:53
Speaker
It's like, we built up all this frustration and we have this big release, right? And then we're back to the same frustration again. And we're not any well, more well rested. We're not full. It's like taking vacations. I feel like my, there was a point in time, my mom would be like, Oh, like, what do you mean you're burnt out? Like you're taking all these vacations. And it's like, they don't help.
01:21:18
Speaker
They don't help. They're like a temporary escape and it's back to the same shit. It doesn't actually help you feel any better or any more prepared to go back. Living for the weekends and for the vacations, it kind of gets built into our heads.
01:21:44
Speaker
And a lot of times, like, yeah, like you were saying, like, it's not like, it's not even that it's a big release. It's just afterwards, like you, you still feel as shitty. A lot of times, like if you're drinking stuff, like you end up feeling even shittier, but it's just like, like, yeah, you're not, you're not releasing any of that stress. You're not releasing any of that unhappiness. You're just burning your free time.
01:22:05
Speaker
Yeah. No, I think this is, this is what I was trying to say with the whole social media. It's like, this is what's preventing us, right? Like this is what's preventing us from engaging with ourselves and with the world. It's like, as soon as we have this time now, we're fucking, we're like, all right, I just need to, I just need a big release. Like I'm so tired from work. Let's all get together. Let's party. Let's just get high. Like, I don't know, whatever.
01:22:37
Speaker
Yeah. In other, like, you know, there's new, like, I know like things like investment banking, they have a big cult culture. Yeah. I think it all comes back to the same thing. Yeah. I mean, that's almost like.
01:22:55
Speaker
Like, yeah, like that's just like that. What we're talking about, like just even worse, like it's like that, that has like rotted even more where it's like when you're in that kind of high stress environment, it's like you end up like going for more destructive ways of like releasing that energy, releasing that pent up like unhappiness, right? Like. It's honestly, it's a way of keeping your feelings repressed. Yeah. Yeah. Right. That's all it is. Like you watch.
01:23:25
Speaker
You, you what? I mean, you've all seen Wolf of Wall Street. The reason they're like, oh, you know, the whole rookie numbers. Yeah. What does it do? It's just, it's just. Number goes up. Yeah. That's literally it. All it is is just like, okay. Like it's an unhealthy coping mechanism. This is the shit we talked about last time, right? Yeah. It's like the cope and the, you know. Yeah.
01:23:52
Speaker
jacking up for that as a movie. It's a way of keeping yourself under control. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's not about like this or that distraction. It's just like mindlessly burning your time instead of like taking that like time to actually live your life and live for yourself. So that you don't have to deal with those feelings at all. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. It's like, yeah, you're not you're not actually resolving those feelings. You're distracting yourself.
01:24:24
Speaker
I mean, I've definitely fallen into that like mindset before where it's like, yeah, like after I have like such a shitty week, it's like, I'm like, okay, like I'm going to go party today. I'm going to like drink, like just let out all my stress. And it's just like, I don't, the next day I don't feel any happier. I don't like some, a lot of times like I'm not even like, like even when I'm drunk, like I can still feel some of that, like just like built up tension. Like it's not like I'm as happy as I would be. Like if I spent that time to like calm down and relax and like,
01:24:53
Speaker
like spend time for myself. Yeah. But I'm glad that we're realizing these things, right? And seeing it for what it is so that we can at least start the process to try to change it.
Achieving Work-Life Balance through Self-Awareness
01:25:10
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. I mean, we're never going to be perfect, right? No one's ever going to be perfect. The point is like to acknowledge what you're doing and to try and like take some like agency there. Yeah.
01:25:23
Speaker
All right, so to summarize, I'm realizing work-life balance comes down to answering these questions about yourself, really. One is, are you in touch with yourself? Are you able to feed different parts of your soul?
01:25:47
Speaker
Are you satisfied with your life? Like, and do you feel whole at the end of the day? And what I feel like is you can, you can kind of listen to anyone spiel about work-life balance, like no matter who it is, you know, Warren Buffett, Jeff Bezos, or any like big hotshot CEO and, you know, whatever the fuck they have to say about these things. But I think what it comes down to is that work-life balance is about you.
01:26:18
Speaker
the life in work life balance is your life, you know, it's like, you're the one living this life and, you know, kind of, there's no like blueprint really, um, that you can follow to achieve the perfect work life balance. I think it's just a process of staying in touch with yourself as much as possible and
01:26:45
Speaker
If you're able to do that and you're able to, you know, work a lot and work a lot in whatever you are working in, and that's great, but it may not be true. So it doesn't really matter what anyone else is saying. I feel like it's just, are you satisfied with your life? Um, yeah. And where you're at right now, that's all.
01:27:10
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. Just being mindful of yourself and whether you actually want to do what you're doing or whether it's actually fulfilling you or not. And it's almost like when we were talking about the connections between work-life balance and anxiety, I almost feel like
01:27:28
Speaker
Like it's similar for anxiety, right? It's not like there's like, Oh, like you believe like these specific things to get over your anxiety or you have to do like X or Y like specific activities, right? It's more about being mindful of yourself and how you're feeling and continuing to like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just staying mindful, I guess. Yeah. I mean, that's all there is. Again, like as we're wrapping this up, um,
01:27:54
Speaker
Thank you guys for listening in. I'd like to plug our Instagram again, pineapplebluntrotation. That's where we post all of our updates to when we're releasing episodes. Any questions we have, that's where we're going to start answering responses to the prompts that we put up.
01:28:20
Speaker
Yeah. And that's, that's the main place you can reach out to us, like give us, give us your thoughts about an episode, give us suggestions, tell us your perspective. Um, so yeah, please go follow us on Instagram.
01:28:36
Speaker
Oh, and please hit the follow button on Spotify or Apple Music or wherever you're listening so you get the updates. And so hopefully our podcast can reach more people. We're always asking questions, engaging, like trying to get your guys' thoughts on these topics too before we record the episode. So we'd love to have you guys engage there.
Literary Discussion: 'Blood Meridian'
01:29:09
Speaker
for the for the art pick of the episode what do you have here i feel like it's kind of off i i don't know how to put it like off brand or off base for what we're talking about on the podcast um considering the subject matter but i've really been uh i've started reading this book blood meridian or i mean i started reading it a while ago but i've really been getting into it and
01:29:35
Speaker
I have a strong feeling that it's going to end up as like probably my favorite book of all time. So shout out to that. But the subject matter is extremely like disturbing and like violent. So be very warned and prepared beforehand if you want to try to read it. Wow. OK. But what kind of what is the premise of it?
01:30:01
Speaker
So it's essentially, it's a Western, so it takes place in like the 1800s. And it's about this like kid who joins a gang of Native American like scalp hunters. So in the 1800s, like while we were like going into the West and like just taking over the land, America would literally just pay people to like kill Native Americans and then come back with their scalps as like proof of like how many people they had killed. And they would pay for like the scalps.
01:30:31
Speaker
So it's like the story is about this kid joining up with a gang of scalp hunters, which is led by this like seven foot tall, this huge seven foot tall hairless mutant who seems to be all knowing and all powerful and kind of wants to essentially just destroy humanity. And it's about like essentially like the relationship between like violence and history and in morality, like
01:31:01
Speaker
how essentially like for America to develop in progress like is it sort of inevitable for like those things to only come about through violence and like in the face of like that sort of violence like essentially like how do you respond morally to a situation
01:31:19
Speaker
against something and a group of people as violent as that. How is it possible to be moral? And is there even any point in trying to be moral in the face of that? So definitely not the best thing for your mental health, depending on what mood you're in. But there are just these scenes and even sentences that are burned into my brain that are just some of the most
01:31:45
Speaker
just, I mean, first of all, like the way he writes the book is the author Cormac McCarthy, he writes in just this insanely like beautiful way. And like that like juxtaposition between the beauty with which he writes about this stuff and just like the violence is just there's so much about it. That's like, like, I just think about like lines like throughout the day, because it's that powerful. Wow, no, that I mean, that sounds very
01:32:13
Speaker
Very interesting. It's like a thought exercise, especially the part you said about like, oh, do we have to go through these periods of terror and inhumane like treatment to eventually be better? You know, like does it have to be this like slow crawl towards progress, slow and painful crawl towards progress? Yeah.
01:32:42
Speaker
Very, it's kind of topical right now, too. Oh, yeah. Very, very topical. A lot of things there that are like, yeah, just like in everyday life, surprisingly topical. Just thinking about that, watching some of the shit going on right now. That's amazing. I might, I might, I might pick that up. Yeah. It's again, like, it's definitely not for the faint of heart. Like it is like.
01:33:05
Speaker
like there's a there's this literary critic Harold Bloom who called it like one of the best books of the century and he had to try three times before he could finish the book because it was just so like overwhelmingly violent that he couldn't continue reading it. Like it's definitely like I've never read anything like that and but yeah I mean I highly recommend like at least trying you know like
Promotion of Cultural Representation in Media
01:33:36
Speaker
yeah totally for my pick um onto something less depressing less a lot very i'm gonna shift gears in a very big way right now it's gonna be a hard right turn um or left turn what do people say is it right turn left turn left turn why is it left turn why can't it be right turn uh that's deep i don't know um
01:34:07
Speaker
going in an orthogonal direction. I want to plug this, this, this one of this actually one of my friends and his dad worked together to create a show. It's like a it's a sitcom. Oh shit. Yeah. One of my buddies from UCLA, Vic Menon, he he and his dad, they worked together and they wrote and directed and
01:34:36
Speaker
you know, produce with the help of like crowdfunding, a sitcom, like an Indian centric sitcom of, you know, this, this brown family in the, in the Bay Area, this group of brown families in the Bay Area. And it's just, you know, I think, I think as, as a community, we've always been underrepresented in media.
01:35:01
Speaker
in Hollywood and not really having the right representation. And so I'm very proud that we're taking the effort to and running these kind of like almost like grassroots campaigns to find things like this. And it's very enjoyable.
01:35:28
Speaker
Highly recommend going and watching. It's called the new normal. I'll plug, I'll plug a link in our description. Yeah. But yeah, it's called the new normal. They've released like, I think four episodes. They're all on YouTube, but no, I showed, I showed my mom, my mom loves it.
01:35:46
Speaker
I've showed some of my friends and yeah, please please go support and and obviously obviously like yeah, you can't you can't compare it to Like sitcoms that are running on Netflix. Yeah, you know big product through big production houses like you can't compare but it is such a great effort and
01:36:07
Speaker
Um, you, you can tell that they've put a lot of work into it. Um, and you know, we, we got to go support and hopefully it gains enough momentum, um, for them to kind of take something like this to the next level. No, definitely get out there and watch it. Yeah. Yeah. What's the YouTube channel? Cause I'm trying to search it up, but there's a different TV show that's coming up. So I want to make sure it's, let me find it.
01:36:44
Speaker
There is another series called the new normal that I found that issue when I was looking for it too. Yeah. Um, the new normal Indian family. How about that? Ah, there it is. It's the channel is called evergreen productions. Okay. I see it. Yeah.
01:37:07
Speaker
yeah so that's if you just search like the new normal it's not duh sorry it's new normal and then just say like indian american comedy series like it'll show up for sure yeah sweet yeah i'll definitely check it out