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The Leadership Challenge No One Talks About: Midlife & Menopause with Tanya Rutherford
16 Plays3 months ago
No one tells you what happens when the demands of leadership collide with the realities of midlife. For many women, menopause, identity shifts, and the pressure to keep proving themselves can trigger a second voice of doubt, overwhelm, and burnout. Today, we’re pulling back the curtain on the leadership challenge no one talks about—and discovering how to reclaim power in the midst of change.
At The Second Voice, we explore the inner conversations leaders rarely say out loud.
If this episode resonated, it is likely because the second voice is active in your leadership too.
Hosted by Luisa Hogan, leadership resilience strategist and founder of Vermelho Consulting.
Luisa works with founders, executives, and senior leaders who carry real responsibility and want to lead with steadiness, clarity, and self-trust under pressure.
Her work focuses on nervous system regulation, leadership identity, and the inner dialogue that shapes how leaders show up when things are hard.
Work With Luisa
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Learn more at: vermelho.com.au
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Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
No one really tells you what happens when the demand of leadership clashes with midlife in women. For many women, perimenopause and menopause causes a huge shift in identity and that triggers a huge change in their self-talk and in their self-doubt and an effort to continue to prove themselves and to continue to perform at the same level they were at when they were 20.
00:00:29
Speaker
And that can often trigger ah burnout and overload. And today I wanted to pull back the curtain on what midlife menopause and perimenopause looks like for women in leadership and discover how we can reclaim our power as women when we're going through that enormous change in our bodies and in our lives.
00:00:50
Speaker
Welcome back to the Second Voice Podcast, where we uncover the conversations that leaders don't say out loud. I'm your host, Louisa Hogan, and today we're diving into a really important topic, and it's around midlife and menopause and how this reshapes leadership with women. And we're going to talk about what it costs,
00:01:12
Speaker
what it reveals about us and how women can rise stronger on the other side. And I'm super excited about the guest I have on the podcast today. Her name is Tanya Rutherford and she's incredibly inspiring um in the space and does some amazing work in the space. And she's going to have incredible stories for you coming up in this podcast. So Tanya is the founder of Queen Bee Rising and Learn, Grow, Become. a social enterprise dedicated to supporting women in midlife and helping students students navigate change. Her work was born from lived experience where she grappled with anxiety and identity loss and the pressure of trying to keep proving herself in her leadership even though success felt hollow to her.
00:02:00
Speaker
After years of giving her power away, including in a very toxic relationship with a coach, she discovered the deeper cost of leadership in self-doubt and in burnout.
00:02:12
Speaker
And from there, her journey is now about reclaiming voice and purpose and it's shaped rising the rising feminine network which now empowers women to rise beyond fear and imposter syndrome and the private cost of ambition.
00:02:29
Speaker
Tanya speaks very openly about the inner voices that leaders rarely admit to having and the toll of chasing enough and the freedom that comes from rewriting that story. Welcome, Tanya. I am so excited to have you here as part of this podcast. It's going to be a wonderful conversation.
00:02:50
Speaker
Thank you, Louisa, and thank you for such nice introduction. i feel so excited to be here and have the opportunity to talk about these things because I don't think we talk about them anywhere near enough.
00:03:02
Speaker
We absolutely do not, which is why when you and I got in touch with each other, i was very excited because I'm going through my own perimenopause journey and sometimes it's a conversation wrapped around shame. So before we delve into that, tell me a little bit more about your journey. Tell me about what got you here.
00:03:21
Speaker
what's What's your personal story navigating midlife and leadership and entrepreneurship through all of that? Tell me more about you. Okay, so you've got six hours.
00:03:34
Speaker
We can edit some of it out, no problem. um I will just try and cherry pick some pieces. um So for me, my midlife journey, my menopause journey really started when I was pregnant with my second child.
00:03:53
Speaker
I had just gone through a redundancy one I think it was my third or fourth. I have not, I've had so many over the years. um So I had a real challenge with my identity.
00:04:07
Speaker
um We only had one car at the time and i we live sort of regionally. So i was very isolated and how it started for me or how it started showing up was through severe anxiety.
00:04:22
Speaker
So I would, um go to the front gate and I'd see my husband and my little toddler go off to child care and I would watch them obsessively as they went over the hill convinced that I probably would never see them again you know something would happen they'd have a car accident and it was quite obsessive and this happened day after day um anything that I would hear um about any child anywhere, no matter how totally unlikely, you know, something that was happening in the third world country.
00:04:57
Speaker
And I could imagine that happening to my children. And it was quite obsessive um and very overwhelming. And it just kind of built up and built up. And it's the kind of thing, you know, people say, oh, you know, you need to talk about things. You can't when you're in the midst of it. It is so your brain is just so full of it and it wasn't until ah kind of got ah to a point where I was having lunch with a friend at work after I got a job and and I had my child and everything else it was a few years down the track and I just kind of like started talking and it was like the floodgates just opened and it was like blah blah and I cried and I got it all out and it
00:05:42
Speaker
it then created this space where I could see that there was a problem, that there was this thing there. And so that was when I could go and get help. And I think it's a kind of, the reason I wanted to share that was because we often think, oh, you know, you're anxious or you're depressed or you've got some thing, some mental situation or emotional situation.
00:06:07
Speaker
um you just need to talk to someone you need to go and, you know, get it addressed. And you can't when you're in the middle of it. There's a certain point where it just stops being accessible for you. It's like the wood for the trees, you know, you just can't can't go there.
00:06:23
Speaker
um So once I got that out and I went and saw my doctor, And I was very fortunate because he ah didn't put me on an SSRI, um an inhibitor, um but he gave me a serotonin booster and that was enough to help me manage it. It was always there.
00:06:47
Speaker
it was always a pressure. um Nowhere along the journey did anyone mention anything about hormones. This was...
00:07:00
Speaker
uh probably 12 years ago 11 a half 12 years ago and it wasn't perimenopause didn't exist like it wasn't a word we used um and it was only i think about when I was 44
00:07:21
Speaker
That was six years ago. a friend said to me, i think you might be in perimenopause. And I'm like, what is that? Never heard of it. Don't know what you're talking about.
00:07:31
Speaker
And I started kind of looking into it a little bit, but not really. It was kind of like, okay, this perimenopause thing, whatever, probably. I'm not old enough. I don't look like the golden girls because that's what old women look like when I was growing up.
00:07:45
Speaker
Yeah. um And so you just keep going on. And it wasn't until I actually went to my doctor three years ago um with hot flushes and he said, oh, well, that does sound like menopause, but you're too young. That doesn't happen until you're 51, like anything happens at an exact point in time.
00:08:07
Speaker
And that was when I really went, no hang on, this isn't right. This doesn't sound like what we should be telling people. and And so I started doing a lot more research into the menopause thing, what was going on what was it all about.
00:08:22
Speaker
um I actually created some infographics on like what perimenopause was. I sent it to our local GPs. Anyone who had an email address got one of my infographics.
00:08:34
Speaker
um because we weren't having the right conversations. Like we there was just this huge gap of knowledge around what was actually going on.
00:08:46
Speaker
And I think one of the blessings of our age group as Gen Xs is that we're kind of like, screw this. we it This sucks.
00:09:00
Speaker
Let's do something. We've been ignored for so long because we weren't like cool anymore. So we need to do something about it. um And the other thing I noticed was I could see how my experiences were related perimenopause.
00:09:18
Speaker
I could see that that anxiety was hormonal and I also recognize that my cousin who i lost to suicide when she was 44 was probably due to perimenopause symptoms not being recognized, acknowledged and spoken about.
00:09:43
Speaker
Now in her case, she struggled with bipolar and her specialist told her when she went in saying, look, I can't think properly, it's not working, was like, well, this is as good as it's going to get because there wasn't any acknowledgement that al how our brain works how medications work in relation to our body and brain, all that changes when our hormones change because our hormone receptors are in every part of our body, particularly our brains.
00:10:19
Speaker
And when we're going through that menopause experience, why we have all these weird symptoms and everything else is our whole body is trying to readapt to no longer getting the supply hormones the hormones that it used to get, particularly estrogen and progesterone.
00:10:40
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, what I can only relate to my own experience because I've never and had anxiety in my life. And suddenly over the last year I got crippling anxiety in in exactly in the way that you described over things that would never have worried me. and it was intense and, um,
00:11:01
Speaker
you know, I'm lucky. I'm lucky in that I had friends who have are also going through perimenopause or have gone through perimenopause and had told me about their anxiety. So I knew mine was hormone related. And I'm also incredibly lucky in that I have, I found a doctor who understood exactly what that was and didn't tell me that I had just anxiety and that I had to go into SSRIs and do all of that sort of thing. Um,
00:11:31
Speaker
But it's still today because I know somebody who went to her doctor and was told, well, you're not menopausal, so I can't give you hormone treatments yet until you're fully menopausal, which, as you know, is not accurate advice at all. no and you know and i And I just recall for myself personally, you know, going through that anxiety, just what what a huge mental shift that was for me for work, driving to appointments for work for my consulting practice. I was...
00:11:59
Speaker
in are sweating from and and anxiety i've never had that before so um you know listening to this i'm hoping that women will hear that maybe going through this will help you know get some understanding that this may be a change that you're going through and to to talk to your doctors armed with that knowledge so can how do you help women how do you help women with that are are you providing resources what what do you do So I do have a lot of resources um and, you know, talking about these things on podcasts is a big thing.
00:12:32
Speaker
ah And also on my own podcast, you know, sharing stories, bringing experts in. ah We have a lot of free menopause resources and and things just explaining what's going on. So what is estrogen?
00:12:46
Speaker
What is progesterone? What is testosterone? What are the... you know, the roles that they play for us. So we can actually get a handle on why it's such a big deal. And even for women who don't go through symptoms, that the change is still happening.
00:13:02
Speaker
And so they still need to be aware of the longer term health impacts of doing something as opposed to doing nothing. So that we have that there.
00:13:14
Speaker
What I've also run a summit earlier this year, which was all about menopause and all the different facets like relationships and sex and, you know, leadership and, you know, managing your team and how other people act and react and how you can support them.
00:13:32
Speaker
And then now what I'm focusing on is more around that, okay, once we're aware of what's going on and the beauty of going through menopause is we no longer have that hormonally driven drive to fit in all the time because, you know, we're created, we need to fit in need so that our children are protected and, you know, so we're kept in the community and everything's okay once we no longer have that we can kind of go well you know what I actually want to do things my way now and I don't actually want to fit in this box and this box and this box and I don't want to feel like I'm burnt out and overwhelmed all the time because I'm carrying everyone else's expectations plus my own societal programming
00:14:20
Speaker
I actually want to feel free. I want to feel like I'm alive, I'm vibrant, I'm a whole person, and i want to shed off all the trauma that I have created and carried throughout my life. And so that's kind of where I'm at now is like helping women to sort of let go of a lot of the stuff that's holding them back to realise that they actually have so much to offer so much more than they've probably ever considered in their life. And that it is their time to actually shine and to rise.
00:14:57
Speaker
Amazing. I love that message. I love that because it's true. You do get to a point where you're like, well, I don't care if you like me or not. you know I'm just, I'm just here, you know, and I actually, until you just said it, I didn't realize it was hormonal. I didn't realize that was a hormonal shift. I just thought we get to a point where we, we just have attained enough wisdom to, to let that go. um and that's an interesting, like, you know, this, I'm i'm here to talk about inner, inner voices and inner self-talk, you know, the self-talk that we have, I find that such an amazing shift, you know, because so much of the self-talk that we have in our early careers or, you know, early on is so much about that.
00:15:38
Speaker
Do they like me? Am I fitting in? Am I doing that? And I didn't realize it was so hormonal. Right. So Yeah, it's how can we help women listen to that voice more and not see it as like a you know a negative? How can we help them see that shift, do you think?
00:15:55
Speaker
Oh, such a good question. um I think part of it is around like having the conversations, but having the conversations where you're just one step ahead or a couple of steps ahead, what we often do is you know, we have someone who has achieved great things and we talk about them or they, know, talk and share all the amazing things and we're like, wow, that's so good, but I can't relate to how I could possibly do that because it's too far away.
00:16:30
Speaker
I mean, it's a bit like, you know, talking about from an organisational level, right? Okay. You're the mail boy and, oh, wow, I want to be the CEO, but how do I get there? You know, we need to kind of look at, well, you know, what are the progression steps? What are the the smaller things we can do? What are the smaller experiences that are ah still uplifting? Yeah.
00:16:54
Speaker
aye One of the things I've found in my journey, particularly over the last year, I've been doing a lot of work in terms of nervous system support and safety, um trauma, like recognizing and releasing.
00:17:11
Speaker
And sometimes it's just those smaller steps of, okay, well, how do we actually help women feel more grounded and safe within themselves?
00:17:21
Speaker
And that's like the first step. And once we can do that, then we can kind of say, well, now what are the things that bring you joy? What are the things that, that you know, make you laugh, that you love to do that maybe you haven't done or maybe you're just curious about it and you kind of go, wow, you know, it always looks kind of cool when people skydive. I want to do something crazy weird like that.
00:17:42
Speaker
yeah You would never find me doing that. but I have. It's amazing. but I'll let you keep that one. um But, you know, just just smaller things like that and recognising when we are actually getting there and recognising when we are showing up differently.
00:18:04
Speaker
ah you know, it could be a matter of just saying to someone, oh, my gosh, you just look so, you know, glowing today or, you know, there's a real sparkle in you.
00:18:16
Speaker
just noticing those small things and I guess also not taking each other for granted yeah I mean I always say you're only as strong as the people that you have around you because those people are going to uplift you encourage you help you see things differently so ah ah so agree with that but at the same time you know um I love self-talk and the science behind self-talk and affirmations and so forth and I often wonder if you know if people are so incredibly harsh within themselves um how can they possibly be kind to the people around them because they're so harsh to the person that they're with 24 7
00:19:03
Speaker
you know, I find that that's an important thing too. You know, if we can start working on our own inner voices on how we speak to ourselves in a more kind manner and forgive ourselves for the things that we're going through, then we can surely do that with others much more easily.
00:19:19
Speaker
and i think also the other thing to keep in mind is that, you know affirmations and and self-talk only work when we can get in resonance with that so I can stand there and say you know you're you know oh Tanya you're so amazing and you're worthy and you're this and you're that but if I'm not feeling that emotionally if I'm not actually you know I guess in my subconscious believing that it it's not as straightforward so we need to kind of
00:19:55
Speaker
you know, build up to it sometimes, be aware of what are the things that maybe trigger us that we could be saying as an affirmation but it actually is not helping us. And I think that self-awareness stuff is really where that comes in, is making sure that those affirmations that we create
00:20:20
Speaker
is making sure that those affirmations that we create that self-talk that we stylize for ourselves is actually suited to us and it's not something that's general that, you know, everyone sort of says, oh, you know, i just say how great you are or just remind yourself how worthy you are. Well, if my core limiting belief is I am not worthy, that's going to trigger stuff inside me and it's not going to help me.
00:20:49
Speaker
So, the ah The other side of that is really ah being trauma aware who because there are things that we can say that won't help us if we're carrying trauma in ourselves. and I'm not talking necessarily big T trauma but just the small stuff that's built up over time and our you know our systems of our culture are constantly creating things for us.
00:21:19
Speaker
in that sphere. So we need to be sure that we are actually supporting ourselves on a holistic scale. Yeah, 100% agree with that. but You know, it's it's one piece of the whole puzzle, you know.
00:21:35
Speaker
and So you've created the the Rising Feminine Framework. Can you tell us more about what that is and and what ah what does it look like for women actually to rise beyond um fear and imposter syndrome, particularly in midlife? So when we're we're facing some of these hormonal struggles, like what what does that look like and what's the what's the the framework, um what is that about? Okay, so the framework is really important guess it's it's almost like a roadmap of the experience that I've gone through and how i well, the the structure and the support that I found along the way that actually helped me to make significant shifts.
00:22:19
Speaker
I mean, at the start of this year, I was in a really, really low place, like shame. um And, you know, we talk about shame as being being your biggest suicide threat.
00:22:31
Speaker
ah trigger that's the word must be metaphor can't think of the brain fog the brain fog which you we we forgive ourselves here but yeah so coming from that you know going and the first stage of the the framework is root which is really grounding into yourself so connecting And like physically, so connecting in with the ground, like feeling like we're connected, coming into our bodies, um
00:23:04
Speaker
in a way that feels safe not everyone feels safe being in their bodies depending on what's happened for them um but just like I when I first started you know that conscious process of like bringing my awareness into my body it was really hard because I'd lived in my mind for so long which sort of sits out separately out in front and it was a real pull to try and bring myself into my body and you know, that's where a lot of your mindfulness practices can be really good if you bring in that physical sensation stuff as well.
00:23:42
Speaker
So coming into nervous system support, understanding what I needed to do to actually feel like I was safe and supported. And then the next step is remember, which is not so much remembering what we've been through, but more about remembering that we have a true nature that is actually beautiful, whether we whether we can see that at the time or not. And so part of that process is releasing the things that are holding us back, the beliefs, um the traumas, the frustrations, all the structures and the things that are just keeping us stuck,
00:24:27
Speaker
And then starting to realign ourselves with, you know, what our values are, what are al um what is our core direction, you know, I guess our sole direction, but we may not know what that is yet.
00:24:41
Speaker
And the third one is reclaim, which is really important. And this was a big part you touched on in my introduction about the toxic experience I had with the business coach was that until I went through that, I hadn't realized that I had been leaking my power everywhere.
00:24:59
Speaker
I'd got to a point where I'd burnt out. And then as I was kind of dragging myself out of that experience, I was looking for someone to save me. I was looking for who can tell me what to do because I'm so stuck and I'm so lost. And that's how that you know those situations come about, whether that is in relationships, whether that is in business, you know whatever it is, we if we don't hold our own power and and how we do that is through having really clear boundaries that align with our values and our personal integrity,
00:25:38
Speaker
And if we give in on those, we give out our power and we then feel powerless and helpless and that starts a negative spiral in terms of our emotions and our energy and and until we get to a point where we either break or we realise and then we can start making a shift.
00:25:59
Speaker
The fourth stage is... um Reignite. There's so many R's. I've got to keep remembering which one think I'll be in. know that feeling.
00:26:13
Speaker
um So reignite is really discovering your passion and your joy and going, actually, you know what? There is something beyond just going through the processes. There's more than just a to-do list.
00:26:27
Speaker
There is a to-feel list and a to-experience list. And, you know, how do I actually... get out of that that feeling of, um well, often of not feeling. You know, we kind of close down and we just go through the motions and actually feel like, wow, I'm on this planet and I'm alive. I have one life to live.
00:26:49
Speaker
What do I want to do with it? You know, how do I want to feel? And once we get that, we are able to then start embodying that. We can start taking the steps to actually be that,
00:27:03
Speaker
joyful, that passionate, that exciting, whatever it is, woman, as we rise. And that's the rise part of the framework is really getting into that. How do we live it? So we kind of identify it. And often that's where things stop.
00:27:20
Speaker
I kind of i want to do this. Oh, that's good. Off you go. We want to make sure that you're actually living that and experiencing that. And then the the final stage is radiate, which is basically, okay, well, how do you know we get to that point? And then what is the impact that we want to make? Because most of us,
00:27:40
Speaker
actually are here with compassionate human beings who want to make a difference in the world whether that is our you know our small world like our local world or whether that's globally or whatever it might be you know there's something that we want to do and part of how we do that is by living and expressing our genuine true nature self and amazing saying yeah so that that's kind of the process and The thing I know is like there are different times, it sounds very linear, but there are different times when we're shifting up and down, like, you know, something can come out of left field and suddenly we're kind of, i need to ground and get back to myself again and everything else just falls out. A bit like Maslow's hierarchy of needs, you know, we've kind of got to have our foundations in place. ah
00:28:28
Speaker
But once we've been there and we've experienced it, we start operating at a much higher vibration. And if that's where we focus, that's what we attract. And so then you get, you know, you're manifesting your dreams and your aspirations and things like that in that sort of higher energy space as well.
00:28:47
Speaker
Amazing. I've written it down. I've got cards here that I write notes on, but I love that. The to feel list, because I'm, I'm a big lover of a to-do list. I love, I love my lists.
00:28:58
Speaker
um But, you know, saying that to feel this and to experience this, I absolutely love the concept of that. And, um but also without adding the pressure of, it's another thing to do because that can be very overwhelming too, you know. i want to explore, you mentioned in there about your, you know, your your toxic coach and needing to, you know, reclaim your power.
00:29:20
Speaker
i want to explore what what was the inner self-talk at the time when you you were talking about you were leaking your power? What was your self-talk at the time? i i want listeners to, to be aware of the kind of self-talk that you may have been having, that they may be having, that might be impacting them, leaking their power over air? What was going through your mind at at that stage of your life?
00:29:42
Speaker
Well, it and had actually been going on for quite ah quite a while and it sort of ebbed and flowed a bit. But the the core part of it was really, ah just don't know, like I've done all the things, and this is a big one, particularly for women in business, where How you're taught to do business is a very masculine way.
00:30:03
Speaker
And so we feel disconnected from our feminine side. We don't, we're not grounded. We kind of, we're lost, we're stuck. We do all the things and we don't necessarily get the same results.
00:30:15
Speaker
And, you know, every coach I've ever had would say, you're so good at doing the things, you know, we we give you the task, you do the things. But I wasn't seeing anything happen from it.
00:30:27
Speaker
And so I was like, okay, I i need something different. um i don't i didn't believe I had it in me. It was like I've done everything that I can.
00:30:39
Speaker
I'm, you know, I'm empty now. There's nothing left. I don't have any, you know, the fact that I have got so much experience and skills and I've helped people with everything else, it was like the sense of being able to help myself and to provide my own coaching, um it was like I'd lost all my expertise, I'd lost all my skills,
00:31:03
Speaker
You know, if you'd come to me and said, okay, Tanya, what can you offer? I'd be like, I don't really have anything to offer. Like it was I was so empty. And, you know, that's part of that burnout. That's part of that overwhelm, part of the nervous system being shut down. um You know, it just there just was this need for someone. I needed someone outside of myself to help me.
00:31:27
Speaker
I didn't trust myself. I didn't believe that I could do it. without someone else guiding me, telling me what to do. I wanted someone to tell me what to do. It's like going back to being a kid. Okay, mum, just tell me what I need to do.
00:31:41
Speaker
um And, you know, part of that probably does relate back to our social conditioning when we're kids, you know, do what you're told, be a good girl, you know, everything will work out. Well, if no one's telling you what to do anymore, you start going, i don't know what to do so maybe I need to find someone who can tell me what to do. um You know, so it was very difficult. And the other side of it was,
00:32:10
Speaker
I didn't feel like I had anyone in my close network that I could talk to about it. I didn't have anyone else who, you know, had a business that, you know, on their own that that kind of was the same type. I didn't feel like I related to someone in that space.
00:32:30
Speaker
And so it made me very vulnerable. And so when I had someone say, yes, you know, this is what I can do. i can do all this and I do it in a way that's heart led. And, you know, it's very, you know, all the things that I wanted to to do I wanted to have a, you know, a heart led, you know, feminine, soulful kind of experience.
00:32:52
Speaker
That wasn't what I got. What I got was what I'd previously had. very masculine, very at times demeaning, kind of putting down, you're just no good, you just give up all the time and all those sorts of things. And so that just keeps bringing you down. It keeps you in that stuck space.
00:33:12
Speaker
And i actually, it was only from going, I found this amazing woman who's an energy healer. I just happened to go to a networking thing and she was there and we just talked and I'm like, I need you because this is what I need healing. I need something to shift this huge weight that was I was carrying. It was like...
00:33:35
Speaker
ah Well, I mean, she described me when I first came to her as being like this kind of broken, hunched up person, really closed in energy space, kind of sitting on the couch, you know, all hunched over in a very, you know, defensive, closed off, um very weak body language style. Yeah.
00:33:55
Speaker
And, you know, each time we met, like i'd lighten up a bit. It would lighten, it would lighten. And, you know, when I met it the last time I saw her, which was a couple of months ago, you know, I was a different person just from having that that healing and that someone who was listening that I could just talk to and I didn't feel judged and I didn't feel that I had to be anything other than where I was at.
00:34:22
Speaker
um And then that took me to a point where I could then reach out to someone else that I'd met and say, hey, I know you have a similar business. Can we chat?
00:34:34
Speaker
And, you know, so then you start building it up and you start getting stronger. And, you know, I was doing my nervous system stuff that I felt grounded. And then I had someone say to me, was talking about this business coach situation and they said, can you get out of it? And I'm like, I've been trying to get out of it for like months.
00:34:56
Speaker
Um, and, but it was just different this time. i think I was in it. i was a stronger place. I had someone that I trusted with my back and so ironically I went to chat GPT and said look this is the situation and I just wrote this long letter as if I was writing to to to her and just wrote it all out and how you know all the problem and the toxicity and everything else
00:35:28
Speaker
And ChatGPT came back and said, okay, so i can and so i can see that, you know, it's been really challenging. This isn't the right kind of letter to send, but let's frame it in a way that's going to work.
00:35:42
Speaker
And so we did. i sent it. I got out of it that day and suddenly I had... you know, clients starting to come in and it was it was just huge, that huge weight. It was, oh, my God, it was like a whale was sitting on me. It was so big. Blue whale too, not a little titsy, big whale.
00:36:04
Speaker
um But it was only after I, again, after I got out of the darkness that I could start seeing that this was what the problem was.
00:36:15
Speaker
one that I had been giving away my power and that's why I felt powerless. And when you feel powerless, what do you do? You can't do anything. um If you feel helpless, what do you do?
00:36:28
Speaker
Well, you help someone else. And so it's starting to find out, well, how do i you know, step, how do you step out of those situations? And it's really hard when you can't see that you're in it. So that's where I think we really need to have,
00:36:44
Speaker
you know, each other's backs and we need to be looking out for each other. um i had, you know, mum talked to my mum and she'd go, oh, yeah, you know, you're in a really bad spot. It's like, well, it wasn't going to get any better without help. And I think sometimes we're kind of scared of saying things, of saying, you know, like, are you okay?
00:37:06
Speaker
But are you really okay? How about we go out for a coffee and have a chat? you know, and let's let's talk about what's going on for you. May not have the answers, but often it's just having someone that you can you can talk to that can sort of help you see that there is a separation, that you aren't situation, that you can actually step out of it.
00:37:30
Speaker
100%. I'm so sorry you went through that negative experience. It baffles me how a coach can be putting you down in that way, know, you know and And only amplifying the self-talk that you would have, you know, i just find that appalling. But I'm also so incredibly impressed of how you managed to pull yourself up out of that situation. i mean, I imagine your self-talk now is ah you said you're a different person. What does your self-talk tell you now compared to then? Yeah.
00:38:01
Speaker
Oh, well, you know, it's like when, you know, when I'm looking for, I guess, help, I suppose, is something, but but assistance is kind of more like, oh, I'm really interested in what someone has to say, but I'm not relying on them. I'm still the driver.
00:38:22
Speaker
you know, it's, it's my, it's my car. I'm driving. And yeah, I love that you're giving me some direction and, and I'll think about how that works with what I have in mind, where I want to go with what I'm creating. I feel so much more creative because, you know, creativity and anxiety are like opposite ends of the scale. You can't have one without the other. So I can be creative now because I'm not stuck in anxiety and depression and shame and guilt and all that other stuff.
00:38:50
Speaker
um I've noticed in my own journey of of rising is that my relationships at home are so different because the vibration that I'm setting sets off everyone else.
00:39:03
Speaker
And, you know, when we you spoke earlier about that, you know, having the people around you that bring you up, well, we can also bring them up as well. And, know,
00:39:15
Speaker
you know, letting go of the people who are trying to bring us down. um It's sad that that happens, but that's their trauma and their issues and their stories and their fears.
00:39:26
Speaker
We can acknowledge them. We can try and support them, but we can't do that for them. And, you know, i I find that since my, since I've stepped out of that space and,
00:39:42
Speaker
I wake up each day, i feel positive. I'm not lying there dreading that whole day thing. It's like, okay, you know, what am I going to do today? That sounds like fun. I'm optimistic. I find, you know, opportunities come up because you're operating at a different different level, you know. It's like,
00:40:05
Speaker
Yeah, I mentioned to a girlfriend about something I was doing and she's like, ohg you know, can you do that? Come over and we'd love to have you doing this over here. And, you know, so it builds. And whatever wherever we're at is what we attract.
00:40:18
Speaker
So when you're feeling really flat and you're really, um you know, in those sort of those guilt and the shame and the depression and all those low-level experiences emotions and experiences that's what you seem to attract more of it's where your focus is you're bringing that back in having the courage to step up to do something anything helps you to rise out of that and it starts opening you up to better times better experiences um yeah amazing i mean you're speaking my language you know the work that i do in resilience we talk about making sure you have appropriate support and network around you because when you're in the trenches, you feel a lot better when you're in the trenches with somebody as opposed to being alone.
00:41:08
Speaker
um so it's finding those people and I'm very happy to have you as part of my network now because – amazing to know you. But you know, you also talk about, you know, taking that one brave step, just a small step forward, doing something, anything, anything that just moves you in the direction starts to clear the path ahead of you, and just shifts you. um Have you got any other and very practical strategies? Or, you know, is if if you could tell women in midlife now in leadership or in entrepreneurship, who are going through midlife, perimenopause, menopause, who are experiencing these massive shifts within themselves,
00:41:45
Speaker
If you could speak to them and, um you know, and they feel stuck between proving themselves and losing themselves, you know, they're grieving the person they used to be, what would you want them to hear?
00:41:59
Speaker
i guess there's a couple of things. The first thing is you're not going crazy. Just because you feel it you're not feeling like yourself and you don't know what's going on, you're not going crazy. It is just your hormones. It's reverse puberty, if you like, um sometimes with the pimples.
00:42:15
Speaker
um But the big thing is that this is it's really an opening to something greater. Like whatever we've had in life before, you know, what's possible for us now is so much bigger, so much greater, particularly in you know a country like Australia where it is safe for us to be women predominantly. Like obviously, we you know, we have domestic violence issues, we have um all sorts of other, you know sexual violence issues, but nothing like we have in other countries.
00:42:54
Speaker
um You know, we have the freedom to speak, to be heard. And now that we're getting more awareness and more conversation around our health and wellbeing, it's amplifying that.
00:43:10
Speaker
yeah I mean, if you think about it, right, the fact that um women weren't required to be included in health studies for drugs and pharmaceuticals until the nineteen ninety s because our hormones made it too complicated. They didn't use female rats in testing because their hormones were too complicating. You know, we've been essentially treated as 70 white males for so many generations and a lot of the pharmaceuticals that we are still provided are still tested like haven't been tested on women it's just assumed you know we're coming from that kind of background to now where it is a requirement that if it is something for women that women are involved you know there is a requirement that
00:44:02
Speaker
You know, we have psychological safety, whether that's a reality or not yet, but at least we're working towards it. We're having those conversations. um You know, there's so much more potential in terms of our our structures and there's more growing.
00:44:18
Speaker
And i think as we come together and we start working on these things and supporting each other and encouraging each other and, like you were saying, you know,
00:44:29
Speaker
not just the self-talk for ourselves that we are possible, but that it each other can do this. And, you know, there isn't, it's not a competition. um It's such a masculine concept that we're competing all the time. We're not. We collaborate and we grow. You know, we're helping each other up and we get so much further when we work together. And I'm seeing that more and more and I'm absolutely loving it.
00:44:59
Speaker
um I rarely speak to women business owners now where it's like like occasionally come up of like, oh, you know, I'm operating in the same space where competitors. Usually it's like, oh, my God, how can I support you And, you know, and we just keep supporting each other because there's there's not a shortage. You know, there's no shortage of people to serve. There's no shortage of anything.
00:45:27
Speaker
it's That's a mindset. I mean, it's like thinking we haven't, you know, there's only so much money that we can earn. There's only so much love we can have. There's only so much um anything. There isn't. The more we work together, the bigger it becomes. And, you know, it's is so exciting what we have available to us and we just need to step into that and to really embrace it.
00:45:54
Speaker
I love that so much. And it's so, so true. You know, there is so much abundance in the world. And when you shift your mindset to that, you actually start receiving that abundance in, you know, twofold because you are sharing and, you know, nothing is a zero sum game in that regard. You know, giving just allows you to receive in return. And I absolutely love that concept. And I've seen a shift even in myself the minute I started thinking in that way. And I love that you have that message message today.
00:46:29
Speaker
so So Tanya, like a conversation, i could I feel like I could talk to you for hours actually on this. feel like I could. And there's so much more I'd love to delve into. you Maybe we'll bring you back as a guest again another time and talk about some other areas. But where where can people contact you if they want to work with you or learn more about the work that you're doing? How can they find you? And I will add the links to this podcast, but Tell us a little bit more about where to find you.
00:46:54
Speaker
um So my handle and my website is queenberising. So it's queen bee, but the queen that you can be yeah as opposed to the buzzing kind, although I do like that. um And, you know, it's reaching out to me um on connect at queenberising.com.au, coming to our website. You know, we do,
00:47:18
Speaker
try and have something different that we're running each, at least each quarter. ah And of course, like I said, we've got the free resources available at all times. And yeah, it's just, I i just love meeting new people. so I'm always excited to get on a call. If you want to have a chat with me, just let me know. um Yeah. Yeah.
00:47:45
Speaker
I highly recommend getting in touch with Tanya because we spoke to each other. And from the very first moment we connected and started talking, Tanya is super easy to talk to and you will have the same experience. I have no doubt. So thank you so much, Tanya. It's been an absolute dream talking to you today. I really appreciate the wisdom and the thoughts and your experiences that you brought to us today. Thank you.
00:48:07
Speaker
Thank you so much, Louisa. It's been an absolute pleasure. Lovely. And thanks to all of you listeners. It's been a pleasure having you. So grateful for you joining us on the podcast. And I really hope that you can see that midlife and menopause don't have to be the silent downfall of your leadership and that it can actually be the moment that rewrites your leadership and inner voice and helps you reclaim the power that you have on the other side. It it isn't the end. It isn't the end of you. it isn't the end of your identity. It's just a new way of being. And I urge you to find the support, talk to people like Tanya, myself, who've are going through it or have been through it and um and understand what it's like. Find your network of women. And that's the second voice that we're really here to listen out for, that voice that says that you it's not the end for you. this is This is just the beginning. And it's the voice that you can learn to trust.
00:49:05
Speaker
So thanks for joining us. We'll see you next time.