Transcript
Plant People: I'm not sure I'll ever get used to hearing my own voice come on there.
Jessica : It sounds so professional.
Plant People: I'm like, is that what i sound like?
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: and That's my ah customer service voice.
Jessica : Yes.
Plant People: Well, before we get into our you know question of the day, and I promise, as usual, it is snack focus. We do have a guest on today. Kayla, give us just a real quick little who are you, where are you from?
Kayla: Yeah, I'm Kayla Preston. i work with Grow Appalachia out of Berea, Kentucky.
Plant People: Awesome. Perfect. And we are excited to talk all things high tunnels and Eastern Kentucky and Grow App and all that good stuff today.
Jessica : Great.
Plant People: But first, Kayla, I need to know. we're We're approaching summer. of We're approaching craziness where we're kind of all running around like crazy. And, you know, we're lucky if we're eating any frozen pizza or ramen noodles, at least in my house. What is your go-to snack of choice for for the hot summer months?
Kayla: fruit, ah cold fruit, keeping it in a cooler, working outside as we all know, very hot and can be long days.
Plant People: Fruit.
Kayla: And so, yeah, cold apple or some cold grapes, berries. Yeah, fruit.
Plant People: Love it. Love it. Love it.
Jessica : Mm-hmm.
Plant People: The amount of watermelon I consume in a sitting when it's hot outside is like, like, it's like, just roll me out the door at that point. I'm just sloshing around. so Jessica, what's your go-to like walking out the door snack?
Jessica : I, I'm trying to think because in my mind, I'm in full mom mode, right?
Kayla: I'm trying to think because in my mind I'm food mom mode in life right now.
Jessica : In my life right now.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: So just living in a free house late, I was like, okay, I got an applesauce for all three kids, baby, to eat food now.
Jessica : So like just leaving the house the other day, was like, okay, I got enough applesauce for all three kids because the baby can eat food now. Right. So was like got applesauce packs, got crackers, pack cheese and crackers, your nabs, right?
Kayla: So it's like got applesauce packed, got crackers packed, cheese crackers, your nabs, right?
Jessica : Have those packs ready to go.
Kayla: Have those packed ready to go. But also totally just lots of fruit.
Jessica : but also probably just lots of fruit and getting ready for the, the, you know,
Kayla: And you want for the food?
Jessica : watermelons and all of those because there's nothing more refreshing like ah it's been in like the refrigerator and it's like ice ice cold that's some good stuff right
Plant People: a
Plant People: I just stand in the light of the fridge, just shoving water into my mouth. I'm just like, gross.
Kayla: all I could think about when you started this question, by the way.
Plant People: my um my Those of you who have been listening for a while know I have what I call my walking snacks, which is, you know, just what I eat.
Jessica : that's all I could think about when you started this question by the way
Plant People: It's my walking snacks. my walking snacks. I have various walking snacks. um My ah current walking snack of choice is a little ah Clementine a Cutie because I can just easily grab it and walk and and peel it and um what my household fondly refers to as boat crackers, which are not, have nothing to do with the cracker itself, but they are the crackers that I ah will always find on the boat during any point in time.
Plant People: And they're just like the cheese and peanut butter crackers.
Jessica : The Mabs, right?
Plant People: That's all they are.
Kayla: That's the mask.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : That's what we call in our house.
Plant People: Yeah. We,
Kayla: That's what we call it.
Plant People: We just call them the boat crackers and we all know what that means in the Sheffield house. so But yeah, I've been stealing the boat crackers that haven't yet made it out to the boat and they keep they keep having to be refurbished before they get into the boat because I've been taking them as my walking snacks.
Plant People: You know, it's that's fine. that's It's going to be great. I'm not ever in trouble for eating all the boat snacks before though they get to the boat. But we're not here to talk about boats and snacks, although some of you may be here for the snack ideas.
Plant People: um I always get good ideas from our guests about what snacks I should be eating. But we're actually going to talk a little bit about ah Grow Appalachia and some of the early days and what all the things you guys have been up to.
Plant People: Because I think I have, I know I have recently learned a little bit and I'm excited to know a little bit more. It's like I jumped into Grow App into a project and i'm like, wait, y'all do so much stuff.
Plant People: So Kayla, tell us.
Jessica : Right, i have I've always been impressed too, because I, you know, I've had one idea about what you all did, but then have slowly discovered that how many things you guys are tied to.
Plant People: I know.
Jessica : So I'm excited to hear today too.
Plant People: Yes.
Kayla: Yeah, it it is quite complex and it can also be very complicated to explain. So hopefully I can explain to you all to my best abilities with, you know, concise and thorough.
Jessica : Hey, that's...
Plant People: We got 40 minutes to hash it out. You're all good.
Jessica : That's just like extension.
Kayla: Yeah.
Jessica : That's exactly definition of explaining extension.
Plant People: Yeah. Right. Telling somebody you're an extension agent, they like look at you just like dead eyed. And you're
Kayla: Right. And you could say, oh, grow Appalachia.
Jessica : Thanks.
Kayla: Hmm. Well, probably growing something in Appalachia, right? And so we thought we thought it was a great name then, but you know, um no, it still is is ah is an awesome name.
Plant People: yeah. and you're like
Kayla: And ah yeah, I'm thrilled to be a part of our organization and share a little bit with you all of of what you all want to hear.
Plant People: Yeah, well, tell us tell us about kind of a little bit of the origin story of Grow Up.
Kayla: yeah so garapalachia started about 15 years ago our founder david cook ah was a actual or ah extension agent in west virginia and um just saw a need for a different type of organization to continue to help farmers um with either something as small as a backyard scale all the way into commodity and so that's kind of how garapalachia started We are an outreach program of Brea College and we've been a program of the college for many, many years now, almost since day one.
Kayla: um You know, even when he was early thinking on, um you know, back in 2005, I guess, or however many years ago that was. But I'm sure he was I'm sure it was his little thought baby, his brain baby for a very long time before it actually happened.
Plant People: 15 years ago.
Kayla: Yeah. But yeah, I mean, that's that's the rough gist of how Grow Appalachia started. And then our main our main focus when we first got started was our gardening, our gardening program. And so um that's how we've became such a wide um organization is because we are actually
Jessica : so
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: Our program is in many different communities and in Eastern Kentucky, West Virginia, all of Appalachia, Virginia, Tennessee, Ohio.
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. isn
Kayla: We've had garden and grant partners in many different states. But mainly what that is, is's just ah it's a garden program for the community. And so we find or somebody...
Kayla: in that community that's already working with a nonprofit or a church or affiliated in some way like that or food bank, something like that. um They're able to apply for our funding and then then they are the ones that are teaching their community members how to grow the food, how to plant it, how to harvest it.
Kayla: And then obviously with all of that, when you're hanging out in the classroom, you get to talk to your neighbors that you may have never known that they're growing food too and then you know that turns into both of you all setting up at the farmers market and then you're selling to the stores and so on and so so forth and so that's really kind of how we started and then over you know the past decade we've dove into high tunnels we've dove into social enterprise we've dove into technical assistance for farmers directly one-on-one beginning farmer programming so we also focus a lot on new and beginning farmers and making sure that they have what they need in order to become a bigger farmer with hopes to grow food.
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Mm.
Jessica : Thank you.
Kayla: And so, like, that was actually our main mission from day one was just helping people grow food as much as they can in order for them to start selling it or sharing it with their community and continuing to build the economy
Jessica : Very cool.
Plant People: Oh. Mm-hmm.
Jessica : Yeah. A lot, um kind of the different things you said as you were going through them, other things popped up main thing, like I always think of you all associated with is, well, originally was just high tunnels, right?
Kayla: Well, originally, it was just high tennis.
Jessica : So I know that'll be a big thing that we can discuss as high tunnels.
Kayla: So that would be big thing that we can discuss.
Jessica : But then as like the years went by, um as I do, we do, my husband and I do produce.
Kayla: But when was like, years of five, I do. I do. I mean, suddenly, we're in Dared County.
Jessica : We suddenly, we're in Garrett County. All of a sudden, they're like, oh, you have the option of being a grow Appalachia, you know, ah farmer as well.
Kayla: All of a sudden, they're like, oh, you have the option of being pro-ecalachian farmer well.
Jessica : And like, so then there's that whole other now marketing side of it where, you know, vendors being able to
Plant People: Appalachian Proud, is that what it
Jessica : Advertiser products.
Kayla: Advertiser products.
Jessica : Yeah. Just like Kentucky proud, but you know, ah and I don't know if that is associated with you all, you know, the, the Appalachia proud is not, Okay.
Kayla: Yeah, just like.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: Not necessarily, no. um You know, we we would link up a farmer that would be interested in some sort of label or certification.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Jessica : Okay.
Kayla: We we have those resources and the understanding of okay, you need to contact X for Kentucky Proud. You need to contact this person for Appalachian Proud and so on. And so we don't necessarily have a certificate by any means.
Kayla: But yes, we do have a lot of growers that are that our members in our gardening programs. um But that's it.
Plant People: Yeah, I think that's through KDA the same as Kentucky Proud is.
Jessica : Okay. Okay.
Plant People: So it's sort of like extension is to Kentucky Proud is grow Appalachia is to Appalachian Proud. Like send them send them in there, get them those that marketing ticket. But yeah, the the the word Appalachia is, you know, is being, i feel like used more frequently.
Plant People: It's like people are claiming it a lot more and and just seeing like the magic that is, you know, the Appalachia region and And that's that's been good to see when it's done in a you know positive light.
Plant People: Sure.
Kayla: Absolutely.
Plant People: Well, so, you know, Jessica brought up kind of the high tunnel landscape, and I know you all were a big proponent of that, um of, you know, building them. and And just, like, I feel like we got to, like, point out, and I'm sure you'll bring this up at some point, of just, like, the...
Plant People: the specialty that is Eastern Kentucky farms and how different they are. Like, you know, climate wise, one, you know, one holler to the next is different. You know, we experienced that a little bit in Central Kentucky where, you know, we we've got some of these rolling hills and probably Western Kentucky a little bit less, you know, maybe you get windier or something like that, but the temperature swing difference that can happen as well as just like the soil texture is different.
Kayla: Thank you.
Plant People: You're on a lot more slopes and what you can grow. um You know, when we have Ray on here, Ray is from Eastern Kentucky and in in the hills, as he says, and reminds us that his grandmother never had electric or or running water.
Plant People: So he likes he always we say that he's actually from the 1800s and he's probably like a vampire. But, you know, anyways.
Jessica : He's Peter Pan. He never yeah he never grows up
Plant People: Yeah, yeah. So, yep, exactly. He never grows But, um you know, he he farmed with mules and did a lot of that kind of specialty stuff that Eastern Kentucky is just so different.
Plant People: And so an organization like yours is so important just because you all are seeing it. You know, you know how to help these farmers with their specific needs.
Plant People: needs or or backyard gardeners or whatever that is you you understand kind of their limitations but also what makes them so special uh and you know the wooded things that they can things that they can grow in the forest and all these different um aspects of that sorry i'm not trying to talk i'm just so excited about
Jessica : Thank
Plant People: um My work with girl Appalachia more recently has just made me even more excited about all the cool things out there. So I'm just like, Oh, it's all these cool things. Anyways, so Eastern Kentucky. So high tunnels really grew and you all were a big, you know, part of that sort of mission. So can you take us back to some of those kind of early days and sort of what was the, the landscape around season extension in Eastern Kentucky? Was it existing? What what was going on?
Kayla: Yeah, so David actually started, as I said, he was an extension agent and he, you know, as he was going to these different folks farms, he would see some people using some cold frames or maybe some people were using row cover, but really it was, it was not a lot, not, but not a lot of folks doing it.
Kayla: And so he actually, he's a big researcher. So he was actually already reading, um who knows what, where it come from, but reading about
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Jessica : you
Kayla: farmers in China and how they how they were using high tunnels. So how they were using season extension tools to widen out and expand their growing season, obviously to keep food on the table, to continue to sell it and make more money for the family and for the enterprise, the farm.
Kayla: um And so during those researches, he, around that time, he was starting grow up Alachia. And so there's this story that most folks know when we talk about our high tunnel enterprise, which is we used to bend our pipe on the back of the truck.
Kayla: We would bring the bender to the farm, to whoever's farm or whoever we we're working with.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And we would just have all the raw materials just literally thrown in the back of the truck. like you could imagine. And ah we would just slap that bender back into the the hitch.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: just the Johnny's bender, you know, from Johnny's Selected Seeds, which we were still using the day that we closed off the high tunnel manufacturing, which we can get into later.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: But yeah, we were kind of just bootstrapping it.
Jessica : okay
Kayla: We were Figuring it out as we went. Now, David and Mark did set sit down and they come up with a design. They looked at different styles of tunnels. Back then, it was mostly Quonsets.
Kayla: The Gothics really weren't a thing around here.
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And I don't think that they, and I wasn't around back then, but I don't think that they were. available for for purchase, for delivery.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: it just It just wasn't really that big of a thing until I think people started to realize all of the pros to gothic structures, yeah higher head clearance, sheds of snow better, et cetera, et cetera.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And so, yeah, they weren't having to measure anything. They were literally just bending one stick of pipe and that's what we're going with type of thing. And so, but yeah, it was, it was obviously a learning curve um for them, but they were there with the farmer or with the organization.
Kayla: They're all learning it as they went. And that's kind of how it started. So we first we first got our couple tunnels out at Greenhouse 17, which then moved into Pine Mountain Settlement School and then Laurel County African-American Heritage Center.
Plant People: I
Kayla: Those were our first three larger organizations that really adapted this high tunnel. season extension tool. I really want to focus on saying it's a season extension tool because I think a lot of, and we might get into this later, but a lot of folks that we work with, I don't think they fully understand what a high tunnel is or the purpose behind a high tunnel.
Plant People: i love it.
Kayla: And so obviously that turns into not understanding how to use the structure, et cetera, cetera. But yeah, does that, does that answer the question?
Plant People: Yeah. Well, and ah do you like have, ah you know, like a thought about where that timeline of the sort of these and NRCS equip tunnels like came in and like, what was your relationship with that program?
Kayla: Yeah, so we started working with the USDA. um It was around 2016 is when we established our social enterprise program. And the USDA had started, NRCS had started funding, financial assistance funding high tunnels.
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: I think it was at a much smaller rate, not not as much money and funding going into the conservation side of that. But then once the farm bill hit in 2018 is when we really saw that big vamp.
Plant People: isn
Kayla: We saw um wider outreach. We saw, like I used the word adapted earlier. We just started to notice that farmers were adapting, um one utilizing the USDA's funding, but also realizing like, hey,
Kayla: This farmer over here has got this tunnel and they've got tomatoes at the market two months before I do. Like, how did they do that?
Plant People: it
Kayla: You know, or still have greens or salad throughout the winter.
Plant People: and said
Kayla: How are they doing that?
Plant People: listen said
Kayla: You know, and it's not because it's a heated greenhouse. It's because they were using a high tunnel they and they were taught or they knew how to use it properly. and so once that farm bill hit we i think how it went again um i was very new at that point i was um yeah i was only part-time was only a part-time at that point um building structures solely um and so we started working out a partnership with the usda i think they kind of heard that we were building structures We heard that they were they had some new funds.
Plant People: Yeah, sure. Give us your perspective.
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Funding structures.
Kayla: And so it was kind of like match made in heaven.
Plant People: Hey! Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: um let's Let's do this.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: And so we really started focusing on high tunnel, army our manufacturing, really getting getting our kit down to the T, understanding, okay, we need X amount of tech screws for this, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
Kayla: mean, we really just started our own high tunnel business. I mean, really, that's kind of how it went.
Plant People: yeah
Kayla: And luckily with our – with With the other how do i the other face, our other side, you know, the the USDA knew that we were an educator. ah They knew that we understood what farmers need in this region. They knew that we understood farming in this region. And so, um yeah, we just started building kits and ah helping out their side to to get these farmers taken care of, et cetera.
Kayla: and just started rolling with the with the program and have have over 180 tunnels out there in the world.
Plant People: Wow.
Kayla: We actually just came out with a with a high tunnel map that will soon have it on our website.
Plant People: That's amazing.
Jessica : That's amazing. Yeah.
Kayla: And so we don't actually have every single tunnel that we've ever built throughout the region. um
Jessica : It's very cool.
Kayla: down to the county. And so it'll be neat to see where we're heavily focused or why.
Plant People: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: um and it's mostly because of the USDA funds. I mean, really, you can really tell that we're focused on the eastern side of the state because of RCPP-SEEC. Big thanks to USDA for helping us go throughout that process and and carry out that program.
Kayla: And so ever since then, we've just kind of been alongside them and going forward.
Plant People: Well, I'm sure they felt, I know if it were me, I would feel very lucky that I could have reached out to an organization like you because, you know, I think a lot of growers outside of Eastern Kentucky who got high tunnels sort of didn't know what they were doing. they They were like, oh, here's free money. I'm going to make a bunch of money on this and then had no idea what to grow or, you know, the the challenges of a high tunnel and how different you know yeah you might have grown tomatoes for 20 years but growing tomatoes in a high tunnel very different experience you know and so um i think i've i've heard that they a lot of them until they you know maybe if they didn't have someone in extension close to them that knew a lot about high tunnels and of course none of us really did at the beginning um they're you know feeling empty like they didn't have help.
Jessica : Exactly. Yeah.
Plant People: And so to have an organization like you in that area, I'm sure was like a breath of fresh air for them. They're like, Oh, thank God they're taking care of that.
Jessica : Well, yes. And just the help with like you're talking about, you probably guys became a very well oiled machine with building, right?
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : Like that's huge because there's so many people who want high tunnels and then they can find where the purchase one, but then it comes down to, okay, am I going to try to put this together myself? Am I going to try to hire a company?
Jessica : Am I going to try to, you know, who, you know, is this somebody who can legit do it and they're going to get it done in a timely, you know,
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : Within a good timeframe?
Kayla: Right.
Plant People: Right. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jessica : Or is this going to be a project that we're working on for several years to months, you know, to to get get it all together?
Kayla: Absolutely.
Plant People: right
Kayla: it's
Jessica : And so that, just even that is so valuable for people who are interested in putting one up.
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: of
Kayla: Yeah. When I'm doing consulting with all farmers, that's number one question is, okay, do you actually have the time and the capacity to build this yourself?
Jessica : Yeah.
Kayla: Do you have the tools? Do you have the help? And do you um really a back to the time thing? It's all about time.
Jessica : Uh-huh.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: And then the know-how, like you said, the well-oiled machine, you know,
Jessica : hu
Kayla: Steph, my assistant, my co-brunt, she's hard at it, and she and I have been doing it for years.
Plant People: Mm hmm.
Kayla: And and yeah, it's a well-oiled machine now. We know exactly what part of the process goes next, and we know what tool we need, five steps beyond that step, and we know where to lay all the materials out.
Kayla: And so, yeah, it's it's been, um i mean, I've been doing this for 10 years. And so, yeah, it's a, I, It's part of my heart. It truly is. um And i know it so well, and I'm really excited to continue to do it because we are going to continue to do consult consulting and even hands on repairs.
Kayla: And it yeah, we might get into that a little later, but our social enterprise is going to continue to help folks out with high tunnel maintenance and repairs. So.
Plant People: amazing yeah it is an ongoing like yes you get it built but there's we'll we'll bring that up later i have my own personal questions um ah
Jessica : That's awesome.
Kayla: okay
Jessica : just you know The learning curves too, like as as you've already mentioned, like so many people, i know Alexis probably knows some too from when she's a county agent. So many people got high tunnels and then like you said, they don't know what to do with them, right? Or just like even the simplest things of like, we talk a lot about People were like, I'm going get a high tunnel and put something in there.
Jessica : and i'm like, well, you got to be around like all these cool days. It might be cool, but the sun is out all day. And if you're not there to open and close sides and all, you know, just it is very like things after the fact, you're like, oh, duh.
Plant People: It's 95 degrees in there.
Kayla: Yeah.
Jessica : Right.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : Like it's going to get so hot, you know, but if you, they don't have that experience.
Plant People: It's a toddler. You have a toddler now. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: Yep.
Jessica : It's so having somebody like that to help with just even the simplest things. Yeah.
Kayla: Yeah, you know, and it comes with experience and and and exposure, really, um because if you don't, if you've never been around one or you don't know anybody that has one, you don't know that the tunnel should not be the five fields over nowhere near your home when, oh, my gosh, it's,
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Jessica : Right. ah
Plant People: Yeah. Baby, you're going to be trucking out in the snow to clean that thing off.
Kayla: Exactly.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And that's what I like to tell everybody is, you know, if I'm if I'm teaching a class or if I'm just talking to somebody like you all, it's all about maintenance and taking care of it. um I think people think it's a lot more passive.
Kayla: i mean, it is passively heated and passively solarized, although it's not a passive enterprise at all on the farm.
Plant People: It's passive solar.
Jessica : Yeah.
Plant People: No.
Jessica : Mm-mm.
Kayla: If not, it is a big responsibility.
Plant People: this
Kayla: Alexis, you have one yourself, right? So, you know.
Plant People: I have two and a propagation house. That's basically a mini, mini high tunnel, but i i have all of my, I say all loosely, but I have all the automation I could afford. Let me, and I didn't put up a tunnel unless I could have automated sides and fans. So like i did, you know, if it meant I had to wait a year so that I could save money for it, I did that because I knew that I, I could not be out there with our weather. i mean, in the winter time,
Plant People: you know if the sun comes in and out enough that it'll be 20 degrees and in an an hour it'll be 85 degrees and like that's not an exaggeration I mean I know you know but for those of those of you listening who may may not have that experience you know an hour can fry a crop um and so yeah yeah
Jessica : And that is why I do not have one here at home or at work for for a demo of demo just because of that.
Plant People: yeah yeah
Kayla: Yeah.
Jessica : um Because it is it is impressive how quickly they can heat up.
Kayla: Yeah.
Kayla: What's it? And it's just an additional skillset on top of like knowing how to grow the food in there. You have to think about irrigation. Obviously it's not raining in there. So you have to think about that.
Plant People: Humidity.
Jessica : I think the fertility.
Kayla: You've got to understand. and then soil health is a huge factor into high tunnels.
Jessica : Yeah.
Kayla: Um, really before the high tunnels built, you want to be thinking about your soil health and thinking about what's been grown there or what's been built there before and all of that. Um,
Plant People: don't get Jessica and I started on soil health. We'll never get out of here.
Kayla: yeah right
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: You know, resources, is there a spigot nearby? are you going to do if it's not raining? You know, you're going to have to water in there. And then electricity, Alexis, you said automation, that automatically means electric.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And so there's all these site considerations and resource considerations that need to happen even before they're thinking about the size of the structure.
Plant People: Yep.
Kayla: You know, it's even prior to that.
Plant People: Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Well, so, you know, you have been building them, but i I know, I know also from experience, but there are more places that keep popping up that are building them. That was like one of my things too, is like, I'm not putting this baby up myself because I don't trust myself. um And like, to your point, don't have the time. So there's been a lot of other, I say a lot.
Plant People: not nearly enough probably based on the weight list that these groups have, but there are more places that are putting up these type of structures. And so, you know, since you all have kind of been in the game since the get go of this high tunnel boom. And for reference, I think we've mentioned on here before, Kentucky is number two, ah you know, as of 2026 or late Kentucky is number two in the nation.
Plant People: for the amount of things in protected agriculture, for the amount of acres things, acres in protected agriculture, which we're second only to California and not by much in comparison, we're way above a lot of other places, which is very unexpected because we're not nearly the biggest producers for veg and various things, but we have a lot of protected ag. And a big part of that has been these high tunnels and this equip and all of the work that you all did in a Grow App. um So anyways, how have you, you know, I know you said you've not been here since the very beginning, but you've been involved a lot long enough. You put up enough high tunnels to know kind of how this um environment around high tunnels has changed and the availability and just sort of what that looks like today versus what you experienced before.
Kayla: Yeah, so... e Hmm. How do I answer that best? Well, it's, there was a gap that needed to be filled 15 years ago.
Kayla: There, were there was no vendor, no manufacturer and no installer building structures that would fit the needs of our farmers back tiny backyards ravines.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: Like you said, holler to holler is going to change.
Plant People: isn
Kayla: Um, and so that's why we actually designed the small, our smaller structures.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: Um,
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: And we weren't competing. We've never really considered ourselves competors competitors against the larger vendors. You know, your 30 by 96s, your 30 by 96 connected to a 30.
Kayla: Like, yeah, we've never considered that.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: Really what we've considered in ourselves is is as educators mostly, but kind of just really also like to get our hands dirty.
Plant People: Sure.
Kayla: And so that's, you know, we just said, why not?
Plant People: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And and and the farmers needed it too. and And that's What started the social enterprise because there was a demand. Well, after a few years, more than a few, okay, five or six, seven, these are our other Kentucky vendors, as you mentioned, that are a qualified vendor under USDA are now building the size structures that we were building back then.
Plant People: Which are, what are your all's like preferred size structures?
Kayla: phil
Kayla: 15, yeah, 15 foot and by anything in a four foot increment. So 15 by eight, we have ah the tiniest structure right here in in Berea.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Jessica : OK.
Kayla: um It's just a little shade house for the Berea Urban Farm to sell their propagated plants under, but we can go as long as 106 feet long.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: um And so that's our standard size. But then over time, the but the other vendors were selling the same structures and
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: They have a full group that comes and installs.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: They're really good at providing the materials. you know that they Whatever's on that invoice, they're going to be bringing to you. like They're really good when it comes to that. They do a great install.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And then they head out within the day and they get the job done.
Plant People: yeah
Kayla: um On the Grappalachia side of things, we don't have a large group of people that build the structures. It's just me and my assistant. And so it's just two people. And so it takes us a little bit longer.
Kayla: We're a nonprofit. So it's it's just the dynamic.
Plant People: You're also educating, working with the farmer, hopefully, to put that up.
Kayla: where We're educating. And so it it exactly.
Plant People: And it's an experience more than just an item you pay for.
Kayla: And so.
Kayla: And that's, I think, honestly, that's why a lot of people have chosen to go with our structures over the years is because they're not just getting a rectangular structure put on their farm and that's it.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: No ties, no relationships, none of that. When you buy a tunnel from Grow Appalachia, you were buying ah a friendship. You were buying a a partnership. You were, you know what I mean? Like you get our expertise.
Plant People: People that checked on you and
Kayla: Yeah, I mean, you know, you are actually just like become kind of part of the big Grow App community is like,
Jessica : Mm-hmm.
Plant People: a part of the community. Yeah.
Kayla: you know that who we are and you know what expertise we have on the staff. And so it kind of just, it worked out. But now that other vendors, we can actually just let that part of the enterprise go, have them continue to build a solid structure for a good price, And let us come in and actually educate around that structure, teaching them about the water catchment, about the drip irrigation, about soil health, about what to grow and what not to grow.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: um We hook them up with folks like CCD and give them the high tunnel planting calendar.
Plant People: What up?
Kayla: you know, i mean, we we are that I call ourselves that middleman um that makes sure like, yes, we're building the structure. But we don't have to just build a structure. We can actually sit there with you and talk to you and give you all the other organizations and entities that are available and how you can go get some funding for this particular project or where you can find the best fertilizer, cetera, et cetera.
Kayla: So that's kind of how we... closed out the manufacturing.
Jessica : I was say, that's how it all connects.
Kayla: That's how it all connects. And and it's it's a beautiful transition. And yes, I have been very sad about it um because it's like my baby. I mean, I've been doing it for so long.
Jessica : Well, yeah, that's a huge, huge part of your life.
Kayla: But we do see the need out there now, and that's that's what it is. We're never going to settle with what's just normal or what's what's there. We're always going to be looking for what is needed, and we're going to continue to provide and support that, and that's it.
Kayla: where we We will never allow for us to just sit there and let things be as they always have been. are going to continue to listen and change as that happens, and as that as that need goes, that's where we're going to be.
Jessica : Mm-hmm.
Plant People: Well, yeah, and as farming changes, you know, you all are changing with it and your boots on the ground in that way. And sometimes small, a little bit of a smaller organization that's able to be out there and they can adapt a lot faster than the big blue machine can sometimes, well although we do our best.
Kayla: And you all do a great job as well. Absolutely.
Plant People: yeah
Kayla: I've can't not say.
Plant People: and Not fishing for compliments there. Mostly I'm saying we could do better.
Kayla: No, no, I mean, I can't can't tell you how many times we've really been thankful to have you all as ah partners and just the support system over the years. So.
Plant People: Well, we're all we're all in it to you know help the farmer. So however that gets done for sure.
Jessica : Yep, that's the ultimate goal there.
Kayla: yeah
Plant People: um So yeah, well tell us about you, you know you mentioned you guys are kind of closing out the the um you know actual building part of it and focusing more on education.
Plant People: So what's that look like? what are What's the future? What's the dream?
Kayla: ah Well, um gosh, the dream, we would be here for days if I actually sat down and talked about our big dreams.
Jessica : sat down and talked about our victory.
Kayla: But um no, really, what what we're what we're focusing on now is, well, Garoppalachia as a whole or the social enterprise?
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: Hey girl, whatever you want to give us, we're here to listen.
Jessica : Whatever you would like to share. Yes.
Plant People: ah
Kayla: okay well um so the the social enterprise itself i already mentioned that we do technical assistance around high tunnels so we will help you we will consult with you about what's wrong with your tunnel um what could be changed how much this would cost to get the automated roll-up curtains i mean we really are there around the construction side of things, or around we're there for you around soil health. um the growth The social enterprise still has our online garden supplies catalog and ah and or just our garden supplies in general. So, you know, we're still...
Kayla: distributing over 22,000 tons of fertilizer every year. um We've got a whole slew of nice high quality materials, ground covers, row covers, insect nettings, et cetera, that people can just order from us.
Plant People: Wow.
Jessica : Wow. yeah
Kayla: and And that was another way that we saw what was needed and just fell, just followed through with it.
Plant People: o
Kayla: We're like, okay, well, let's just start carrying materials because people can't afford the shipping. I mean, let's be real.
Plant People: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Kayla: It's very expensive to ship ground cover and things like that.
Plant People: And, you know, taking a whole day to go drive, you know, two, three hours to the closest produce place is, you know, not a luxury every person has.
Kayla: And so,
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: Plus, like, you got to have a truck, you got to have all this stuff.
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: Yeah, sorry to interrupt, but...
Kayla: Yeah. And so we we kind of just started doing that here. And so we'll continue to provide those materials. And i always like to tell folks, if you see something that you need that's not on our catalog, holler at us.
Kayla: We'll look we'll look into it. we'll We'll probably put it in there.
Jessica : ah This is amazing. I just pulled it up. And again, ah something else I did not know that you all had or do, but this is awesome.
Kayla: Yeah.
Kayla: Yeah.
Jessica : All the different options you have.
Kayla: And then and then of course you get our expertise alongside of that. So we can tell you the difference in exclude net and protect net and why you need one and one takes out a fits and the other, and the all the, all these things.
Plant People: Mm.
Plant People: Mm.
Kayla: um So the social enterprise, that's kind of our, that's going to be the bread and butter for the SE. We won't really be manufactured. or We will. Let me, clarify we are not manufacturing high tunnels and we are not installing high tunnel kits anymore but what we will do is help you figure out what high tunnel you need or if you need the big end wall or just your standard man door end wall and what ventilation fans are and why are they different from circulation fans like we will really get into all of that stuff with you um
Plant People: Yeah. That's huge. Like that, as someone who like was trained in this, still buying my first high tunnel was a nightmare.
Plant People: Like I was so worried I was going to make the wrong decision. And I was the person people came to, to ask those questions. So like, yeah.
Kayla: Yeah. So there's a huge need. And so we've recently gotten um another partnership, the RCPP Sure with USDA. And so what that is around is us giving free, free technical assistance to any farmer that applies for that USDA RCPP p i have financial assistance program, which is, ah which is more than high tunnel. And so I wanted to clarify that too, is we are no longer just, well,
Kayla: Kayla and Steph are no longer doing technical assistance around high tunnels. We are not Mr. High Tunnel. We are anything from any conservation practice you can think of that's associated with the USDA.
Kayla: So fencing, water catchment off of just any roof, not just high tunnel specific.
Plant People: Laud.
Kayla: We can talk to you about cover cropping. I mean, really, we can go through all of those conservation practices and help you. We can help you even like apply. We can help you go through the application.
Kayla: We can It's just great. And so that's good. That's our new bread and butter.
Jessica : That's what myself several us
Kayla: That's what that's what myself and ah several of folks on staff are going be focusing on these next few years. We've got it for three years. And so we'll keep pushing forward with that. But to technical assistance, I mean, that's that's really what we thrive in.
Kayla: That's that's what we do well. um And that's what we're going to continue to do is is continue to share what we have learned ah by being in this industry for so long or just ourselves personally, you know, all of us are very passionate about growing food and, you know, providing food for themselves or for the community. And so it, it's, it's just a, it's kind of like a passion, but also, um,
Kayla: We know that it's a need. it's And it's so clear.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: um And luckily, there are a lot of other technical assistance organizations in Kentucky. Oak, I mean, they do awesome work.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: You know, um there's so many that I'm going to miss if I try to just explain all these folks.
Jessica : Mm-hmm.
Kayla: But we all know Kentucky has got such a robust organization.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: program. I mean, the industry here in Kentucky for the amount of organizations that we have, and I know you all know this stuff, but it is, it's insane compared to our surrounding states.
Plant People: It is. Mm-hmm. it is
Kayla: I mean, like, this is the best place to grow food because we have the most like technical assistance available.
Plant People: Support.
Kayla: It's, it's wild.
Plant People: Yeah. You don't really realize it until you, i've I've said this before, but like I never realize it It's easy to like knock on you know, something you have.
Plant People: Well, we don't have this and they don't let us do this and blah blah, blah, blah, blah. And then you step out into another state or talk to somebody else who maybe does a similar job to you and they go, you have what?
Jessica : right yeah
Plant People: And we I'm like, oh yeah, actually we have a lot.
Jessica : Yeah. Or you talk to growers who've moved from other states and they start asking you questions about different like rules and regulations of things they can and can't have.
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: We're pretty great. Mm-hmm. From another state.
Jessica : And now you're just like, what do you mean you have to report that?
Plant People: don't have that.
Jessica : Or like, what do you mean? Like you can grow whatever you want. Like obviously, right?
Plant People: Yeah. Any legal plant.
Jessica : Like legal, legally.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Jessica : um But yeah, it is. You don't know how good you have it. Right. Until so you go elsewhere or
Plant People: Yeah. Well, okay. I i have i have more more technical questions. So, you know, we've I said that we've got a lot of high tunnels. We've got a lot of protected ag.
Plant People: You yourself have put up, what did you say, 180?
Kayla: I myself have only done 150. Sorry, had to
Plant People: Oh, well, only
Jessica : Just only. Only.
Kayla: yeah so i to make a joke there.
Plant People: but um so
Kayla: Yeah, we have 188 in the field, in many fields.
Plant People: And you have put up 150 of them.
Kayla: i have
Plant People: no big deal. No big deal.
Kayla: My body feels it, but I've, I've loved the work.
Plant People: It's pretty.
Kayla: It's been so rewarding and so challenging at the same time. And that's, I think that's just what makes me happy and makes me just fulfilled.
Plant People: Keeps you coming back every day, huh?
Kayla: It's, it's, it's very fulfilling work and, you know, working with folks like you all.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: And then really the farmers, I mean, our farmers are awesome around here. They are so innovative, so creative, so smart, and they do good work. I mean,
Kayla: So nice. let's Let's talk about how nice our farmers are too. But yeah. um
Plant People: Well, so i was goingnna I was going to ask then, you know, we have this sort of ah group, large group, at least 150 of growers who are kind of, you know, they've had their tunnels for a while now and maybe they're looking at stage two or something that they need to be doing, you know, five years down the road or something. So what would be your, what are your tips to those, you know, semi-experienced high tunnel growers that you would say, hey, start paying attention to this at this time?
Kayla: and Soil health, please test your soil every year, maybe two times a year.
Plant People: And what like specifically are they going to, should they be looking for?
Jessica : I was like, salts, that's it.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: salts, sodium.
Plant People: Salinity. Yep. Yep.
Kayla: um i mean...
Plant People: Cause you don't get the rainfall.
Kayla: Yeah. um The rain doesn't come in. It doesn't wash away the salts. The plants obviously are producing um and then that's what they are leaving in there.
Plant People: Mm-hmm.
Kayla: And so you've got to figure a way to flush that out. um So yeah, that's that's top. And typically what I tell folks is, you know, that plastic has about a six to seven year warranty, depending on how tight it was pulled or it whether ah trees, limbs falling on it.
Plant People: How many holes you've poked in it? Yeah.
Kayla: Yeah, all yeah, like all of that stuff.
Jessica : Mm-hmm.
Kayla: um But yeah, typically what I tell folks is just once your plastics looking really rough, you're you've lost growth, like it's obvious that your plants aren't growing as fast because the soil is an issue.
Jessica : um
Kayla: And also,
Plant People: You start to see salt build up on the top of the soil.
Kayla: Yeah, the salt buildup, the white crusty stuff. um But yeah, your plastic but starts to become refractive and so it doesn't reflective and so it doesn't go through.
Kayla: And so you're going to have to replace that anyway. And so I just tell folks to take that off and leave it off for a full season.
Plant People: it
Kayla: I know it's hard to do because that's a lot of money. But think about how much money you might be losing, but you know, little, little by year by year by year if you don't maintain that soil or the plastic.
Plant People: this is
Plant People: Right.
Jessica : But most people by that point, they have the high tunnel bug and they've already put up a second one.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : So we can tell them to, or as one of my other growers who's on high tunnel number three.
Kayla: ah
Plant People: I have to take my plastic off.
Kayla: Bugs.
Plant People: Like, and I, my goal is to get, yeah, I have,
Kayla: So, yeah. So, Alexis, what she's saying is you're taking yourself to also relieve of pest pressures is what you're saying.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: Yeah.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: Yeah. A healthy.
Plant People: That's um I'm looking forward to that because the, the, the pest, they, they do be building up and you think, right.
Kayla: Yep.
Plant People: The doors are open. The, the sides are open. Like why would, I mean, there's obvious, I see bugs in there, but it's not the same. There's like that pest pressure is just so different when there it's just open completely to elements.
Plant People: I am so scared about taking this plastic off.
Jessica : And the different things you see.
Plant People: I don't know why it's stressing me out in a way, but I'm going to do it by the end of the week.
Kayla: Well, it is really easy.
Plant People: Yeah.
Kayla: just Just make sure that the winds are not above 15 miles an hour when you're pulling it off. um But yeah, all you really need, yeah, I mean, that's what a lot of our folks do.
Plant People: I'm going to pull it off and use it to solarize something.
Kayla: All you need is a pair of needle nose pliers and a ladder and you've got it.
Plant People: Okay. All right.
Kayla: That's really it
Plant People: She's giving me strength.
Kayla: And like, and like, you know, a nice new album that you want to listen to or a podcast.
Plant People: She's giving me.
Kayla: It's, it's so easy. I'd be happy to talk to you more about it after this, if you want.
Plant People: Okay. Okay. I know that like, you know, i've I've dealt with a lot of wiggle wire in my life and also I own a box cutter. So either way it'll get done. It's just like the the the action of going, ah wait, I'm taking this off and it's not going to be be used.
Plant People: It's very stressful, um but it's fine.
Kayla: Yeah, I can understand that.
Plant People: Everything's going fine. We'll report back to those of you listening and give you strength if you have to do that to yourself.
Kayla: this
Plant People: here soon and all of you who have a high tunnel will do it at one point so i'll tell you maybe give you some tips or you should you better because you better not be parking your tractor in there you better be growing cool stuff or else um i listen i live on threats uh So, well, Kayla, this was awesome.
Jessica : Or you should.
Plant People: And I think that we're going to definitely have you back for to tell us all the cool stuff that you're doing with this new grant.
Kayla: Cool.
Plant People: We will make sure that we put Kayla's information, Grow Apps information, all of that in our show notes. And you all can go check that out. And if you need some help, if you're in Eastern Kentucky, definitely give them a shout.
Plant People: You know, can always, of course, call extension. If you're not in Eastern Kentucky and you're super jealous, I mean, I feel that. I mean, I love, I love my county agent. Jessica, but she she doesn't offer the things that grow up can.
Plant People: But anyways, if you need some help and you're not in Eastern Kentucky, please feel free to reach out to your county extension agent.
Jessica : Oh,
Plant People: And if you they need help, they will reach out to us here on campus, to CCD, our vegetable specialists, any of those awesome folks that we have um to make sure you're getting the help that you need.
Plant People: And who knows? I'll probably be calling Kayla going, I'm sorry. ah Walk me through this one more time. So ah we...
Kayla: Happy to do it for you and happy to do it for anybody else on the call, listening to the podcast.
Jessica : oh I know.
Plant People: Awesome.
Jessica : I already got like two people in mind that I'm going to be like, hey, let me tell you what I learned today. You need to get in contact with Grow Appalachia.
Kayla: And we also just have a we also have a lot of good articles that we have pulled from our partners or other research institutions on our website, greppalachia.bria.edu, in our resource library.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : Growers.
Plant People: Love it.
Kayla: And so there's lots of education there. If you don't feel like calling me, there's also a lot of other stuff there.
Plant People: Sometimes I just don't want to call.
Kayla: We also have instructional YouTube videos on how to install high tunnels. Wee, that's fun.
Plant People: Genius.
Kayla: um And yeah, um just call. Give me a call. Give us a call. Follow us. All of that jazz. Absolutely.
Plant People: Awesome. wellll Well, we'll, we'll make sure to share that. we, we do have an Instagram. If you all don't, you all, as in you listeners don't follow at Hort Culture Podcast, and we will make sure to tag Berea, well, Grow App in, you know, the stuff that we post so that you all can find them and follow along with all the cool stuff that they're doing. And maybe you can jump in and be a part of that community. Cause that's really what Grow App is, it sounds like, is is kind of just a community of of folks who are wanting to grow stuff. And I think that's so awesome. But anyways, Kayla, we appreciate so much you being on. If you all have questions, if you all just want to tell Kayla how amazing she is, please leave a comment and give her five stars and be like, have Kayla on all the time because she's the best. um You know, feel free to leave that comment. We're not we're not saying you have to, but like if you don't, I mean, Kayla might be sad. I'm just saying.
Plant People: We appreciate you guys listening and we hope that you will join us next time. Have great one.
