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Episode 53 - New Mutants #18-21, Annual #1 - Demon Bear Saga
0 Playsin 5 hours
Bill Sienkiewicz arrives on the New Mutants to deliver us the absolutely fantastic Demon Bear Saga and the super fun arrival of Warlock and Doug to the book! It's so much fun, we had to bring along a guest to enjoy it with us.
So Matt and Pat welcome Stephen Hesson from the Batting Around podcast to dive into it with us. We talk about X-Men: Evolution, Baseball, Marvel Movies, and then rave about Sienkiewicz's art for two hours.
TOPICS DISCUSSED:
BILL SIENKIEWICZ! A panel-breaking bear. Raving about the art so much. Cannonball with a shotgun. Trust us, this man is white. Who is this nurse with the chest hair? "I ain't worried about the Hulk, Bobby." Claremont's fetishization of Indigenous cultures. MEANWHILE, ACROSS THE GALAXY. Lilandra still dawdling. WOLFMAN! SHOOT IT! More raving about the art. Sam the religious himbo. Another Rahne Sinclair head injury. A really uncomfortable race-swap. Lonestar -> Moonstar? "TO: Dr. Strange RE: Demon Bear." Healer the Healer. "Drip Face" Whoops, by the way, Magneto's dead. Some Baseball friends. "ya dumb cluck!" WARLOCK! DOUG! A GREEN CAT ALIEN! LILA CHENEY! A Vrakanin, duh! Stealing a planet? A red-headed pervert Iggy Pop.
Timestamps
0:00 - Hellos
21:30 - Pat's Email Corner
26:30 - Do anything X-Men related?
34:10 - New Mutants #18 - DEATH-HUNT
49:20 - New Mutants #19 - SIEGE
1:09:30 - New Mutants #20 - Badlands
1:29:20 - New Mutants #21 - Slumber Party!
1:53:05 - New Mutants Annual #1 - The Cosmic Cannonball Caper
2:09:30 - Final thoughts
2:10:35 - Pat's Steals n' Deals
2:14:45 - Goodbyes
Check out the Batting Around Podcast: https://linktr.ee/battinaround
Join our Patreon! Free, or pay-what-you-want: patreon.com/mutantmenace
Write into Pat's Email Corner: mutantmenacepod@gmail.com
Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/fPv7hRgTeV
Instagram: @mutantmenacepod
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Transcript
Introduction and Podcast Overview
00:00:03
Speaker
I'm Trish Tobey with W.A.R.C. reporting to you live from Westchester, New York, where there appears to be some sort of mutant menace on the loose.
00:00:38
Speaker
Hey, everybody, I'm Matt Allcamp. And I'm Pat Reber. And I'm Stephen Hessen. And say it with us. I guess Pete again. no one's sending us their names.
00:00:50
Speaker
Welcome to Mutant Menace. Nailed it. All right. Another successful intro. Wait a second. Stephen.
00:01:01
Speaker
Hi. Hi. you or sorry, excuse me, sorry. Yo. Welcome, Steven. Really thrilled to have you, borrowing you from the Batting Around podcast. Hello, yes, um...
00:01:15
Speaker
weird crossover but when you when you need someone to talk about bears i'm your guy you two may be the the crossover between x-men and baseball steven hessen tell us about the batting around podcast Well, we're the gayest baseball podcast on the internet.
00:01:38
Speaker
I keep making that claim definitively because no one has challenged me. No. and no And if anybody does their shit out of luck because we're all very gay and very baseball together.
00:01:54
Speaker
What do you do? for Combination. What do you do if somebody challenges you? If somebody's like, no, we're a gayer. Does it become like a gay off or a baseball off or just a fist fight? I guess it depends on the situation. If it becomes a fist fight or a baseball off, I think we kind of win by default because it means that they're not as gay as us. But no, it's Batting Around. It's a baseball-ish podcast.
00:02:21
Speaker
It's me and my two friends, Jane and Lauren, who we all had the lovely idea to just, we decided, you know, you know what the world needs? The world needs another baseball a podcast. And you know when it needs it? ah The middle of the year 2020. Ever heard of it? Absolutely. So we're start we're coming up on our six year anniversary this year. Congrats. And yeah, we just, if you want analytics, if you want in smart insight onto what to do with your fantasy team, ah if you want ah detailed stat breakdowns of games, go somewhere else. that's
Baseball and X-Men: A Cultural Intersection
00:03:01
Speaker
We ah are three terminally online gay people who
00:03:09
Speaker
love to talk and love baseball and love going on tangents. So an episode of batting around is generally just us shooting the shit with each other in a vaguely baseball-y context.
00:03:23
Speaker
ah And that's about it. And people seem to like it. Enough people listen that I get randomly reached out to on Blue Sky being asked to join an X-Men podcast.
00:03:35
Speaker
That's right. I highly recommend the Batting Around podcast if you are the least bit into sports. It was very hard to find podcasts that are like socially or culturally cool. So if you're looking for some insight into you guys do a lot of vibe based sports analysis. It is, i think, a perfect podcast for it.
00:04:01
Speaker
I had a real fun time listening to a couple intros to episodes where you guys are just bullshitting around about like your so life and yourselves. And then the baseball talk starts. And then I kind of. You have a really, really low threshold for baseball talk because we lately have been barely discussing it well Although the World Baseball Classic just end. And we did have a lot of stuff to discuss there. But generally speaking, we're very bad at talking about baseball, almost to the point where we were like... We've edited our intro.
00:04:41
Speaker
It used to be welcome to batting around. It's batting around. It's a baseball podcast. And now it is welcome to batting around. It's batting around. It's a baseball ish podcast.
00:04:52
Speaker
For example, yeah, we have a Patreon and we do two bonus episodes every month. ah This year we've decided to do a fun thing where this is completely not baseball related at all. We're watching all of the Wachowski movies.
00:05:08
Speaker
all year so every month we're talking about a wachowski movie and this month we're talking about the matrix now what is that you know you might just need to subscribe to find out oh okay we come from from the world of baseball and we live in but yeah we do not limit ourselves to it in any way you know guys what's surprising to me is that it's we've talked a lot about the x-men it's 20 it's 20 it's 2026 right yeah and there's so room to tell me if i've gotten this incorrect somehow but baseball is still the thing where one guy throws a ball like deadly hard like as hard as he can deadly hard at another guy so hard that if he does it too much his arm will fall off
00:05:56
Speaker
And if it hits
X-Men's Cultural Evolution
00:05:57
Speaker
the guy, the guy could die, right? Like the guy could be serious. If it hits him in the right spot. Yeah, yeah. But usually it's rare on their ass. And then that guy has to swing a heavy stick at the ball before it hits him. And then everyone gets so excited they start running around. And that is still how they do it?
00:06:17
Speaker
Yes. Okay. Matt, I thought you didn't watch sports. It is the nerdiest sport. So that might be a gateway to it. I am famously, I grew up hating all sports. I was a gay nerd. So I was like, what the fuck is sports for me? It's not my Right. And then the Phillies won the world series. And then I was like, Hmm, of my mental illness.
00:06:40
Speaker
it There is a lot of folklore about baseball, which I appreciate. yes. I appreciate that it is. It's also the most astrology-coded sport because it's just got a lot of magic numbers and like rituals and superstitions. and there's yeah lot There's a lot woo-woo witchy magic in it if if you if that's the route that you want to take. Listen, i can take it any special interest of yours and get it back to baseball. It's great sport, even when it is the worst sport.
00:07:12
Speaker
Well, um let's reverse it and talk about our nerdy thing here. Steven, what's your connection to the X-Men? Oh, boy.
00:07:22
Speaker
So inviting me on an a podcast that breaks down X-Men comics is very interesting because I know these characters quite well.
00:07:33
Speaker
Most of them. Oh, yeah. These are the first X-Men comics I've read. Okay. um I much like sports actually growing up when i got to comics culture. Yeah.
00:07:51
Speaker
I was like, what's going on here? And ultimately decided that it was simply not for me because it just felt so overwhelming.
00:08:01
Speaker
Like, where do I start? Yeah. And how do I like get in it? And for some reason, the the whole the the serialized going on forever culture of comics didn't it wasn't really a thing for me.
00:08:18
Speaker
But the stories are fucking great. And I like of all the comics properties. I read a little bit about that. But like of all the comics properties, X-Men were my like number one with a bullet because i'm i'm I'm a gay nerd. And of course like I loved the movies.
00:08:41
Speaker
I missed the original the cartoon. Somehow that okay that I missed that. Interesting. But X-Men Evolution.
00:08:52
Speaker
Okay. That was a fucking direct hit. That was what I was watching Saturday mornings. That was my favorite Saturday morning cartoon. And that's like the main source of like my, my origin story with the X-Men. I rewatched it during lockdown. Like I went, I went through the whole thing and I was like, damn, this shit holds up.
00:09:17
Speaker
X-Men Evolution was my I think we've talked about this before, but it was like my college stoner cartoon. I would sit back, smoke a joint and watch X-Men Evolution. I mean, yeah.
00:09:29
Speaker
It was sounds like a great time. Perfect show for it. I mean, X-Men Evolution, not not only is it the one, it's interesting that we have you on for a New Mutants episode because X-Men Evolution has a ton of New Mutants characters in it. yeah I think it's also, it's interesting you talk about the cross section between your baseball fandom and gay culture.
00:09:54
Speaker
which is just your podcast. You would be surprised at how, how it is not just. Oh, okay. Yeah. yeah That's a different thing. But um I think X-Men evolution is, so it was around the time of X-Men evolution. It was like the early two thousands where the metaphor of the X-Men started shifting from civil rights to the, the LGBTQ rights. Yeah.
00:10:23
Speaker
um The moment where Bobby blows on Wolverine's glass of Coke to to cool it, to ice it, is directly embedded into the spinal fluid of every gay nerd my age. Yeah.
00:10:41
Speaker
um And I think X-Men Evolution was the first place where that really felt true, right? Because it was a bunch of young kids. It really leaned into this is right around puberty is when this happens feeling of X-Men. There were no gay characters on X-Men Evolution, if I remember correctly, but the metaphor was...
00:11:02
Speaker
Yes. Yes. Yeah. Like, like I, I obviously I wasn't approaching X-Men as a property thinking that evolution was anything other than some sort of like weird alternate.
00:11:15
Speaker
Right. Storytelling. Distillation. Part of it. But I liked the distillation. And I think the way that I'm the the way that I am with comics, like I deeply respect the,
00:11:28
Speaker
the legacy and storytelling that we can get from comics runs but taken as a whole like i had a blast reading these these were so fun i'm probably gonna read more just like casually offhand yeah um but when you zoom out it gets fucking ridiculous it's a it's complicated it is absurd And it's just like, I don't like that, you know, characters aren't allowed to die or retire.
00:11:59
Speaker
And
Chris Claremont's Influence on X-Men
00:12:01
Speaker
X-Men Evolution was great because it's like, yeah, no, we're taking we're taking X-Men comic lore, distilling it yeah into a coherent story and maybe switching things up a bit.
00:12:14
Speaker
Like maybe. Iceman's a new mutant now for some reason. Or Jean Grey is a student. and and and storm is not like we're we're doing different things um was it was like short term enough for those changes to stick around too they don't have to worry about it's also profoundly oughts um yeah a goth ro like if i got the rogue if i were remotely
00:12:47
Speaker
heterosexual uh goth scarlet witch would have done crazy shit to me sure yeah man yeah yeah yeah as an heterosexual i definitely confirm this um Yeah, I mean, it's interesting. So what you said about like Marvel's slavish devotion to ah status quo is kind of what turns you off. It's interesting because this is what Chris Claremont was um so focused on during this period of time. He was like, He wanted, like at the time that these issues are happening, Cyclops had retired.
00:13:27
Speaker
Jean Grey is dead. And chris Claremont intended that to be forever, right? Wouldn't that be cool if that were the case? As much as I love both of those characters, it's just like,
00:13:40
Speaker
Let them rest. that's That was exactly, that's like almost a quote, right? Like he deserves enough his rest. They deserve their rest. And it's it's only, I think, we're only about a year out from yeah Jim Shooter, the editor-in-chief at Marvel, starting to undo some of these changes. And Chris Claremont almost quits Marvel entirely. Thankfully, he doesn't. He sticks around to, like, 91. But X-Men was supposed to be sort of the antidote to that. And at this time... Because you have the concept where, like, you don't need an origin. Like, you don't need gamma rays or super serum. It's just, like like, that's just how you are. Yeah.
00:14:21
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. So if you lose a character because they go retire, you get another one. Yeah, you don't need to go through some big... its Yeah, you're absolutely right, Steven. Um...
00:14:33
Speaker
And at this point in time, there's no reason for any of the readers to have thought, i was none of us, I don't think we're alive yet, but any any of the nineteen eighty s kids um who are reading these books, there's no reason for them to have thought that it would all be undone.
00:14:48
Speaker
At this point, they thought this was the comic that changed and grew. That said, let's give a little bit of background. Where are we when this arc starts?
00:14:59
Speaker
Yeah, there is a lot that's happened in the 17 issues and one graphic novel of the New Mutants so far. um Most recently, they lost Karma. It's important to note that she is presumed dead by the New Mutants, but also who presumed alive by Xavier privately. And he's like, I won't tell them. yeah Right. He thinks it was too evil. It's something that they wouldn't be able to handle. So he's he's just letting them think she's dead.
00:15:27
Speaker
ah They went to the Amazon. Bobby's dad tried to kill them, but they escaped and found Nova Roma, an ancient Roman culture still surviving into the 20th century. Escaped that with Magma, who's Amara, a woman who can turn herself into pure lava and can also summon volcanoes whenever she needs to. know stuff, yeah.
00:15:51
Speaker
Ileana Rasputin. is now a demon sorceress she spent half her life in limbo she is i guess she joined the team sort of between panels because she's officially a member now but she's got like a costume and stuff now when last time we saw her she was just wearing kitty's old costume i think right although it could be still be kitty's old costume and she just is like i'm not giving this back We know her name is Magic because they like say it. like Her miniseries is called Magic. They say it at the back of one of these comics, but nobody has named her Magic in the books yet.
00:16:27
Speaker
ah Yeah, yeah. There was a surprising lack of codename use throughout. Yes. I was just going to say we're very much on a first name basis with all the new mutants these days. There's um there's a thing that, again, I think of Claremontism where...
00:16:44
Speaker
In the X-Men, the adults are always reminding each other to call themselves by their code names. likell They'll get into a battle and it'll be like, Scott, and it'll be like, call me Cyclops, we're in the field.
00:16:55
Speaker
But these are kids, so they never do. Yeah, yeah. But it's not like it's not in the writer's mind there. They are... Yeah, thinking this mistake I think this is intentional. characters.
00:17:06
Speaker
Doug Ramsey, it turns out, kitty's Kitty Pryde's friend is a mutant. He can understand any language. He doesn't actually know that yet, but Xavier and the all of the new mutants do know this about him.
00:17:20
Speaker
That's the one I want. I want that one. That is a good power. And I think we're going to get into ah really characters creative uses of that power here too i'm excited for the yeah yeah that was really yeah it demands creativity from the writers i think like over time they've made it to like oh doug understands all languages including the language of fighting so he's the best fighter right stupid shit but like
00:17:52
Speaker
the smarter thing to do is like what they do in the two issues he's in, in this episode. It's like, just be a little creative to think of how a person who can understand any language nearly instantly can be useful.
00:18:10
Speaker
Uh, and then they all just got back from the Massachusetts Academy. They met
Comic Book Storytelling Techniques
00:18:14
Speaker
the Hellions, which are like their, their evil counterpart in Emma Frost's school. Um,
00:18:22
Speaker
They kind of reached a bit of a stalemate. i guess they they won the fight, but lost the battle, if that makes sense. thanks they were there and they got to They got stuck there because the X-Men were in secret wars at the time.
00:18:34
Speaker
And there's there's just this the slightest reference to this, but Wolfsbane and Sunspot are like, ah they're going through something right now because of some, there was a they they had a they an interaction with Cloak and Dagger.
00:18:49
Speaker
in a Marvel team-up issue, and both of them are like... We'll get there. All right! Both of them are just a little, ah I don't know, something savage or whatever.
00:19:01
Speaker
What did you guys... Okay. And now it it seems like the piano player's setting up, but what did you guys think, just, like, high-level thoughts of this? Fun. I love... ah See, that that's the other thing with with, like, comics writ large, is, like, I kind of love when we're a bit lower stakes or... Yes. yeah We're not like saving the galaxy or something. Although there is that. There is that. he also But in the smallest way possible. but i I love, hey, we got to rescue our friend from a giant evil bear. That's cool. That's fun. Yeah. I'm a big horror guy. So like, I love how creepy it is at the start.
00:19:44
Speaker
um I did... I did while in a fugue state. I was like sick. Like I had a huge, God, we're talking way too much about COVID.
00:19:57
Speaker
I'm talking about COVID. Yeah, this will be our third mention. Yeah, it's really bad. But no, i i I don't even think it was COVID. I think I was just recovering from a vaccine, like one of the vaccines. But like remember being delirious in bed, half conscious, watching COVID.
00:20:16
Speaker
the new mutants movie. Oh my God. Oh yeah. What? it And I remember going, i remember spending, I oscillating wildly between this isn't as bad as everybody's saying. And then all something would happen and I'd go,
00:20:31
Speaker
oh yeah right okay 100 it's like there's so many good moments in that that terrible if it was all bad it would have been better but there is enough promise in there to just make me mad to break your heart yeah yeah yeah that's another one of those movies where they just told everybody yeah you're gonna be in the universe now like the uh i'm calling for a complete and total shutdown on comic book movies until we can figure out what the hell is going on oh yeah that's right pat like yeah everybody in that movie is like i'm a marvel star now baby then the rug gets pulled out for butter i'm like no not not really buddy most of them were like plucked from like big shit like game of thrones and stranger things yes and yeah anya taylor joy oh my god money into that movie remember when oh fuck remember all the eternals i feel so bad when i think of the eternals the what's
00:21:34
Speaker
All right. No, the piano player knows when we're about to go down a dangerous rabbit hole. It's protecting us. It is time for Pat's email corner. Let me get to a couple of emails we have here in regards to episode 51. Weapon Jason, who is an MVP of that episode. He gave us all the background of all the characters.
00:21:59
Speaker
That's true. Yeah, yeah. Going into that that series. He says Secret Wars is a guilty pleasure, mostly because it has some moments mixed in that feel really cool. But overall, I recognize it's pretty much comic gruel with all the hallmarks of a Scooter Booter tale from his early Legion of Superhero days.
00:22:16
Speaker
ah He points out that as Secret Wars is ending over at DC, they are just starting Crisis of Infinite Earths and essentially take the same concept and just do it better.
00:22:27
Speaker
Yeah. And then he had some umbrage with my disrespect for the wrecking crew. and Team of supervillains that get their power from an enchanted crowbar. So yeah, he's everyone's entitled. I one interesting question he asks and Steven, I'm going to pose this to you. You won't even read what he says about the wrecking crew.
00:22:53
Speaker
If told about a mysterious building in Central Park, would you drop all of the important threads of your life to go investigate? I'm going to say no, because it would require me to travel to New York City, which I'm not willing to do. It's a bit of a hassle.
00:23:07
Speaker
Yeah. What if it's Central Philly? Maybe. Yeah. I would say if like an obelisk. like Like an obelisk just like off to the side of Rittenhouse Square, I'd probably check it out. Yeah, yeah.
00:23:20
Speaker
If it's in walking distance, I'm checking it out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If I have to if i have to take a bus there, then there's... I i absolutely... And Pat, like this is something that it feels like a guy would say.
00:23:32
Speaker
and wouldn't be true, but Pat, you've got to confirm this. I absolutely would be there. And I would be the first touching Neopolisq and transported to a secret battle world. You would cross the police tape just because I'd be like, hold on. Let me touch it. Thank you, weapon. Jason, we're going move on to sweet Douglas, our other emailer today who says, ah hey, Pat and Maddie, ignoring formatting rules. I was disappointed at first when I saw Marvel Unlimited did not, in fact, have any Micronauts content, let alone the X-Men crossover. They will not print that anywhere ever, ever again.
00:24:10
Speaker
Of course, it turned out I dodged a bullet and then walked into the next bullet of having to read secret oars. By about halfway, I started skimming through pages, speed reading speed reading to end the suffering faster. Even reaching the end felt like a Pyrrhic victory.
00:24:25
Speaker
Do you want to know a secret? So did I. What? I have read every word of secret wars at some point in my life.
00:24:36
Speaker
Like my first read through of all the X-Men, my private read through. my That sounds so salacious. My private read through, but no, this time i was like, I cannot read all of these words. There's so many words.
00:24:50
Speaker
Matt, I read them all so closely just to make sure we got every detail that was. i I'm so glad one of us did. If you remember, we were also worried about Sweet Douglas potentially being in hell. He says he didn't mention last time, but his neck of the woods is a little island off the east coast of Canada called Prince Edward Island. Oh, Jesus.
00:25:09
Speaker
Says it's all small towns and lots of beaches. So we didn't have much access to fancy big city candies.
00:25:17
Speaker
I guess we were talking about candy. ah Sincerely, Sweet Douglas. I've always wanted to visit Prince Edward Island. My
Personal Anecdotes and Speculations on Mutant Powers
00:25:25
Speaker
fiance's parents live there and it is apparently profoundly boring, but very I like a very pretty, profoundly boring place though.
00:25:34
Speaker
Not if they don't have good candy though. they have a problem with um healthcare care on the island because the ratio of old people to doctors is... Oh, no. Very ah skewed in one direction. Wild. Okay, yeah.
00:25:51
Speaker
And that's it. I'm going to save any pilk discussion for next episode. We've somehow become a podcast about the mixing of Pepsi and milk, but...
00:26:02
Speaker
I thought it, sorry, did you not get the email? It's in my rider. Contingent upon my appearance on this show, there needs to be zero discussion of Pilk. Yeah, exactly. I'm sorry'm sorry. I'm right so sorry. I'm so, i
00:26:31
Speaker
All right. Before we start jumping into these issues, i just gotta ask. What's up, dude? Steven, have you done anything X-Men related this week? ah Yeah, actually. I am a homosexual, so that is... if yeah
New Spider-Man Projects and Personal Connections
00:26:49
Speaker
Just always doing something X-Men related. I just... Yeah.
00:26:54
Speaker
I'm never not doing something X-Men related. Yeah. I'm doing something X-Men related right now. And no, that is not recording X-Men podcast. It is count talking. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:27:07
Speaker
Let me ask Matt. Yeah. Have you done anything X-Men related this week since you're asking around? You know, use you know, i think i I think I discovered ah so i thought I discovered a superpower and then I realized I hadn't in the strangest way. So,
00:27:26
Speaker
have a big, big coffee mug, a big coffee travel mug, right? And it's got ah it's got a metal straw in it that has like ah a rubber mouthpiece thing.
00:27:37
Speaker
Gotcha. and i lost the metal the rubber mouthpiece for like a week or two. So you're just drinking an unprotected metal straw?
00:27:50
Speaker
Yeah, I was just drinking straight from the metal, which is not good for coffee. And then I dropped a little thing through my, into my sink in like the garbage disposal area. So I pulled the rubber stopper out and I was like, what's that white thing? And I pull it out and it's the rubber mouthpiece.
00:28:16
Speaker
Whoa. In garbage disposal? In my garbage disposal. completely intact and it's been down there i've emptied my sink of m dishes several times and used my garbage disposal many times in these weeks and it has been bouncing around this garbage disposal taking zero damage And so am I'm like, and do I have some very... And because this has to happen with mutants sometimes, right? They have this completely obscure mutant power that they never discover. Like, I have the ability to protect rubber from damage when it's within 10 feet of me, right? You create this safety feel within proximity to yourself and you'll for all rubber objects specifically. Exactly.
In-Depth Analysis of New Mutants #18-20
00:29:08
Speaker
So just...
00:29:08
Speaker
wrap your team in rubber keep them close to you oh hey so I was like wow how did this rubber mouthpiece this thing must be indestructible or I must have a superpower so then i take it out i wash it real well I put it on my my straw and I'm drinking coffee and I noticed like a little bit of dried coffee is on the like the rim of it so I take my fingernail and I go to scrape the little bit of dried coffee off And it rips apart the fucking rubber mouthpiece off.
00:29:42
Speaker
Mutant power ruined.
00:29:53
Speaker
Maybe your garbage disposal has a mutant power. It's because, no, no, no. See, see, here, you you create... Your power is that you create this protective yeah zone yeah within, let's say, three feet of your body. yeah But your body is strong enough to pierce that.
00:30:12
Speaker
Oh, you're the only one that can. I'm the only one. You're the only one that could have done that. i willll have to try I'll have to try it. I'll have to. I'll go buy a gun and I'll shoot the rubber mountains.
00:30:26
Speaker
Patrick, have you done anything? Have you done anything X-Men related this week? I wouldn't say X-Men related, but it is about a longtime friend of the podcast, Spider-Man.
00:30:38
Speaker
time A new Spider-Man trailer dropped, and we're not going to about it. We're not that kind of podcast, but... I'm a 40-year-old man, and despite having an X-Men podcast, I consider myself an adult. The twinkle that I get in my eye when I hear that there's a new Spider-Man thing coming out is still the same that I had when I was a small child and found out there was a new Spider-Man cartoon. I was just...
00:31:10
Speaker
i I was returned to my ah nerdy little eight-year-old comic-loving self. How did you feel about it? Are you excited about it?
00:31:21
Speaker
they're They're going for a pretty strange story, it seems like. They're going to do man spiders. They have the weirdest instincts. The Tom Holland Spider-Man. Yeah, they really do.
00:31:35
Speaker
They're going for. There are very few iconic Spider-Man stories over in 60 year history. And they're choosing the ones where they just they had to think of something. There wasn't. They've already written everything about Spider-Man.
00:31:51
Speaker
So like going into the weird web of time yeah it just What if you just did your own thing? Yeah, what if you made in your own Spider-Man? Because it seems like this one has Boomerang, Scorpion, Man Spider.
00:32:08
Speaker
We got the hand. The hand, crime master? Did I say crime master and tarantula in that trailer? So I don't think that's the hand. I think... Well, but... I think that's like the the order of interdimensional spiders and their army that's coming at him. I think they're going for like the, you know, the the idea of totems and there's like these...
00:32:37
Speaker
spiders totems in every universe and there's also vampire that goes from universe to universe eating spider totems i don't know i don't know any this i it seems like that's what they're scraping up against it could get into madam web territory Dear God. Do you think this is supposed to cross over with like into the spider verse? They were supposed to do that. Honestly, I would not be surprised because they need, they need to be proximate to anything good they possibly can. Yeah. Yeah. They need to start gathering resources. I, yeah, no, I used to go, i used to go to like midnight showings of those. Yeah. yeah Right. And now they are firmly uh,
00:33:23
Speaker
airplane movie sort right like right i but that's not a blanket no but yeah i watch them all i just take my time to get to them i i don't i don't watch them all but anymore but uh i have to it's a compulsion i was on a long flight last year and i finally watched the thunderbolts Good movie. Good. is That one was fun. Yeah, that was fine. Yeah. It's not going to, they're not bouncing back. They're just going to keep. Oh, you you don't have you don't have high hopes about Doomsday?
00:33:57
Speaker
not at all All right, you guys. do you Do you guys want to read some New Mutants with me? or ah Yes, please. I would to get into this. All right.
00:34:08
Speaker
Should I kick us off, Matt, with New Mutants number 18, Death Hunt? Not a great start. Death Hunt. Okay. All right. Yeah. I want to hear about Death Hunt.
00:34:22
Speaker
There's a hyphen between death and a hunt for some reason. Chris Claremont, writer, Bill Sienkiewicz, artist, Glynis Ween, colorist, Tom Orzakowski, letterer, and Senti editor, and Jim Doopey, editor-in-chief. Matt, Stephen, Bill Sienkiewicz is here. Bill Sienkiewicz is here!
00:34:41
Speaker
Ah, yes. I know him. At this point, he was like a 25 year old. He was like a new gun at Marvel. he apparently he'd started off as kind of like a so a Neil Adams clone. He was just like a big Neil Adams guy. Yeah, just did good comics.
00:35:00
Speaker
Until his run on Moon Knight, where he started experimenting more and more and getting getting weirder and weirder. He started like doing collage and this like sketchy, ink-heavy art style. i love this. Yeah, it's unreal. It's beautiful. i spent these like a bunch of these issues just sort of like really being impressed with the... don't know line work is the right...
00:35:28
Speaker
word for it but just sort of the way like yeah i'm flipping through um there's a page where like there's a snowscape and then someone's eyes are at the bottom and then theyre like the giant bear is the sky yeah and yes we're doing really fun abstract things and like to to tell the story that we're telling that sort of break the this is in this panel and this is in this panel and this is in this panel like yeah we're getting artsy with it in a way that probably is more common than i think but like you know i again i don't read these very often
00:36:09
Speaker
I think it is now. I think at the time, this was this was all pretty brand new. And yeah, this is his kind of career-defining run. he would He would go on to keep doing really brilliant artwork, but sort of weirder stories, like stray toasters. But yeah, I think this is this is sort of the apex of Sienkiewicz.
00:36:31
Speaker
Yeah, this is his peak for sure. He also... um something we'll have to talk about is the covers because he is doing wild mixed media work for the coverage to each of these issues as well. Like pieces of paper glued on top of pieces of paper glued on top of a piece of plastic, uh, really striking stuff. We'll do our best to do it justice, but okay. Release date, April 1984 cover August, 1984. issue opens with series of cuts. Um,
00:37:00
Speaker
the issue opens with a series of jump cuts Danny Moonstar wakes from a sleepless night gripped by a fear of the demon bear who killed her parents. It's immediately, immediately from so page one.
00:37:13
Speaker
You're like, there's something fucking different happening here, right? It's so yeah cool. This image rocks. It is Danny underneath a blanket. That blanket morphs into the demon bear and also towards the bottom morphs into a crossword puzzle.
00:37:31
Speaker
The last issue we saw, I think, who was it? John Buscema's depiction of the demon bear. Sal's, yeah, yeah. Sal Buscema's depiction of demon, it was just like a bear who is kind of human shaped. Looks like Winnie the Pooh made of clouds.
00:37:48
Speaker
if This is a photorealistic, ferocious bear that is, you know, like built out of the folds of her blanket.
00:38:00
Speaker
really impressed. the thing that draws your eye is Danny's face. And it's like a centimeter big. Yeah. Yeah. But like her, her eye is in shadow. Yeah.
00:38:14
Speaker
That's good. Really. So good. Next, the mansion explodes and begins to crumble. A young girl with shoulder-length red hair protects herself with a telekinetic force field. x Xavier tells her to hide in the danger room as he tries to reach the commander of the army surrounding him.
00:38:32
Speaker
He raises himself from his wheelchair, only for a gunshot to pierce the window of the mansion, knocking him back down, dead. I forgot that this happened. And also, wait, what is this? I know. This is, this is fucking, this is a X-Men plot that they just sort of weave into this new mutant story for, I don't know why.
00:39:01
Speaker
but yeah, yeah. Did i it's a, they don't pick this up again. in what we read no no no they will pick this back up in the main x-men line this is just kind of what why chris claremont does the character will explain that this happens in her like yeah in her future yeah okay but we won't see her again in a new mutants comic maybe ever at least for another like five six issues yeah yeah also the death of xavier is visceral here like we're seeing the uh the blood and the the like cannon fire shooting out from the back of them it is yes something else uh outside an intact mansion A young, tired-looking girl with cropped red hair nervously waits and remembers the previous scene, trying to pluck up her courage to approach.
00:39:58
Speaker
Cannonball, Magma, and Sunspot practice in the danger room against some robots while Danny, Magic, and Ileana watch from the booth. Basically, everyone notes that Sam seems to have a crush on Amara, but that Amara does not return his affections.
00:40:12
Speaker
Sam finally begins to improve his abilities and change direction while blasting. Aww. ah This is, um, is he what is, what is his vulnerability status while blasting? I could never remember.
00:40:29
Speaker
out Turns out, and and he doesn't mention this very often. i think this is only what the eighth time. He's invulnerable while blasting. Whoa. Okay. Mm hmm.
00:40:42
Speaker
This is we hadn't heard it in a while. i was going to be at this first mention. I was thinking like, Matt, should we even still keep the count up? Yeah, we should. We should. The doorbell rings and Ileana runs to answer it.
00:40:55
Speaker
It's the red haired girl asking to see Professor x Xavier. Ileana explains that he's in Massachusetts and she can take a message. But when the girl asks her name, she runs off in a panic.
00:41:06
Speaker
In her future, Ileana died with the professor years from now. And she was the same age then that she is now. How could this be possible? We won't find out in fucking New Mutants. We'll find out in the X-Men.
00:41:21
Speaker
This was also fun because i think I only know this character from Marvel Snap. but ah Another jump cut to distant space where a weird robot creature drags itself along the ground of a dead planet.
00:41:40
Speaker
He tries to use the planet to restore his energy when a white hot ball of flame begins to descend from the sky. In its center is another robot creature, his father, telling his son Warlock that he will make his death quick and painless.
00:41:56
Speaker
Warlock jets off into the void as the planet explodes behind him. more chris claremont shit just like i'm setting up something that i'm gonna pay off in like four issues real good stuff danny moonstar stalks a snowy landscape bow in hand waiting for her enemy to attack when it does she fires a single arrow into the neck of a bear twice her size and it goes down another bear swipes at her from behind and she dodges knocks another arrow and hits it square in the neck as well Ileana shuts off the danger room and the two chat about how hard Dani is pushing herself. As they flip off the lights in the darkness, red eyes and fangs appear with a low growl.
00:42:40
Speaker
Later, Dani sits at the window thinking about the bear who killed her parents. She feels responsible and while she knows the others would understand, she can't bring them into it. It was her fault that her parents died and now she must face it alone.
00:42:55
Speaker
She applies some Cheyenne war paint and grabs her bow, trudging off alone into the snowy tree line. this is that This is that panel where it's it's it's her eyes. And the bear is the entire like skyline here. but And it's also breaking the comic frame.
00:43:15
Speaker
Right. Or the panel frame itself. Yes. Yeah. It's overwhelming. Like the sense of scale here is is insane. it's so good and then when we turn splash page next yes it's her standing in like the bear standing before her and it takes up the basically the entire page yeah yeah a wordless page right it's kind of like a an amorphous blob almost because the way the the way that they are doing the shadow like basically except the for the face and for you know where the highlight is coming from the light source and yeah in the top right everything is in black except for the claws which is really cool and then we've got this like this snow the the snow flurry painted on top of it
00:44:09
Speaker
um imagine getting this, imagine being in the 19, like 1984 or whatever, and getting this issue and turning this page and seeing just this, The entire page is the bear.
00:44:22
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I keep having to remind myself this is 1980.
00:44:29
Speaker
There are a few moments that really like the, the dialogue. Yeah. Feels very dated. yeah absolutely. The comic, like the, the dialogue is very funny because it's just like, it's not how people talk.
00:44:44
Speaker
Mm hmm. Which it feels very, very comic book-y, I guess, because they keep having to, like, state things for... Unnatural. let's Let's reintroduce things that everybody who follows these and already know has heard a million times. Yeah. Just in case you're picking up for the first time.
00:45:04
Speaker
Yeah. Which I
Concluding Thoughts on New Mutants Arc
00:45:05
Speaker
appreciated in in the first issue. And then as I kept reading, I was like... All the characters explaining how the other's powers work to each other.
00:45:18
Speaker
or just where they are at any given moment. Like, hey, glad we're all running down this this snowy embankment, but we should all note that Amara is still inside because she ah didn't wake up in time. It's like a Netflix television show. Yeah. They're all describing what they're doing.
00:45:38
Speaker
Danny instantly pulls the bear's greatest fear from its mind, shocked to see that it's Danny herself. her face Her first arrow strikes its neck, but only enrages the bear further.
00:45:49
Speaker
It lifts her from the ground and she shoves a second arrow through the roof of its mouth, allowing her a moment to run, knock another arrow and fire it into the bear's open mouth. the image of it holding its face with the arrow sticking out of its snout yes like that one yellow eye and like the claws like yeah coming over its face is another really incredible image they're so good He's got this thing where there's photorealism mixed with like this really cartoony style. Absolutely. Where the bear has these almost cartoony reactions, like wide eyes and like like like surprise lines. like radiating off its face but at the same time there's these photorealistic pictures of a bear it it really it's got a a horror feel to it yeah yeah yeah it's very deliberately not so like adhering to rules of like scale or continuity yes for to have that impact you're you're feeling this with each character yeah
00:46:57
Speaker
The bear falls, and Danny approaches it, full of pride and triumph, its eyes open. Rain Sinclair springs up in bed, screaming Danny's name.
00:47:08
Speaker
Shifting to wolf form, she summons the others, and the new mutants arrive at the tree where the demon bear fell, only to find Danny Moonstar alone and sprawled in a pool of blood. say okay really impactful moment yes yeah yeah take sam the kentucky boy he is grabs a shotgun you're what are you gonna do with that
00:47:33
Speaker
that would be wild if he added that to his repertoire though right oh my god he's blasting we yeah And he's shooting a shotgun while he's coming. He's racing he's racing the pellets to the target. Imagine, oh, God, you are like some big supervillain or whatever. You get smacked in the stomach by cannonball, and then behind him come this volley of ah shotgun pellets that he's fired as he's shooting towards you. um ah Holy shit. Yeah, that ending is...
00:48:10
Speaker
This whole thing was wild. This is like, you can immediately feel that this is going to be different. Just Sienkiewicz is clearly forcing chris Claremont's hand a little bit to like...
00:48:24
Speaker
daring him to be a little stranger end the other thing that he does incredibly well is just even with all the abstractness he understands how to convey emotion even without too much detail it's very ah this is the only comparison i could think to make but it's very king of the hill-esque where like there's minimal actual lines there but you can tell exactly how they feel i I think it's from Bill Simkevich inking his own work, right? Like, I think it's – he's drawing incredibly, like, these incredibly complex images and then choosing only to ink the lines that need inked.
00:49:07
Speaker
um So you see a face and it's – almost photorealistic but it's implied by how few lines he uses yeah yeah yeah this is different than everything else happening in comics at this time and speaking of that moving on to new mutants number 19 siege i just want to start with the cover before we talk about in the upper left hand corner where normally they have just like the floating faces of the character yeah the little character box
00:49:38
Speaker
They have Danny Moonstar in a hospital bed with an IV drip next to her. That's such a fun, creative decision. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:49:50
Speaker
Also, the cover itself is. it's sort of like ah another take on that panel we discussed before, but instead of Danny standing before it with her at bow and arrow knocked, it's everybody else fighting the thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:50:07
Speaker
I think this oil paint too. Am I'm not, I am. It looks like watercolor to me, but I would know the least of anyone here. So I'll take you guys where I, I, I could be wrong, but it looks like watercolor to me, but it also looks like there's, there's different, he spatters ink and, um, yeah.
00:50:26
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:50:29
Speaker
yeah Chris Claremont is our writer. Bill Sienkiewicz is our artist. Glynis Ween, colorist. Tom Orszakowski is the letter. in nicenti's the editor And J.M. Scooper, editor-in-chief. Release date, May 22, 1984. Cover date, September 1984.
00:50:46
Speaker
We open on a team of paramedics rushing into Mid-County Medical Center with Danny Moonstar on a stretcher. The scene is frantic and draped in red as the doctors marvel at her injuries and fight to keep her alive.
00:51:02
Speaker
The new mutants sit anxiously in the waiting room as a blizzard falls over Westchester County. A nurse recommends so scrounging up some blankets and pillows. It's going to be a long night for Danny, but she's clearly a fighter.
00:51:15
Speaker
Officer Tom Corsi of the Westchester Police waltzes in and starts questioning them about what happened and then scoffs when they tell him Danny was mauled by a bear. This guy.
00:51:26
Speaker
Look, it'll become apparent why I'm saying this later. This is a white man. right I was wondering when we were going to talk about this. I guess we should save it? I think we should save it, but we should say this is a white man with a pin in that with short hair and blue eyes. so that's We'll just put a put a pin in. Seems like a weird thing to put a pin in, I understand, but trust me.
00:51:54
Speaker
I think we've earned your trust by now as a podcast than we that when we mention somebody's race explicitly, it's for a reason.
00:52:02
Speaker
It's not oh this nameless nurse guy with the chest hair. Yeah. on with an Orderly. Where's it? Where's let's let's follow him for a bit. Yeah. Why does he not have his own own mini series?
00:52:17
Speaker
Roberto calls Tom Corsi an idiot. Officer Tom Corsi. Hell yeah. Hey, yeah baby. yeah Tells him to go make himself useful.
00:52:30
Speaker
I love, i I love Roberto so much. He's so good. ah The officer says he'll stick around until he gets some better answers and until the storm lets up.
00:52:44
Speaker
In a more private area, the gang talks through their options. Bobby wants to track down and fight this bear, but Sam has a theory. The bear's coming to them. It's always been after Dany. She's clearly been trying to tell them this whole time, but they always dismissed it as a hokey religion and ancient weapons.
00:53:05
Speaker
But now they know magic is real, and it sure seems like Dany's being hunted by a demon bear. There's a really fun moment here where Sam says, Bobby, so they're trying to talk in private. so So Sam says, Bobby, secure that door. He turns into Sunspot and holds it and says, nothing is getting through here on my life. Sam says, i ain't worried about the Hulk, Bobby, only the nurse. It's just so good.
00:53:37
Speaker
ah These, so these two, these two were my gateway into this team. just the buddies Sam and Bobby just always razzing on each other and just like being buds so Rain shifts into wearful werewolf form to establish her psychic link with Danny hoping to glean some information about the bear but as she does everyone's shocked to see her form instead of her modest wolf girl form she's a hulking seething beast feeling a wild power course through her
00:54:11
Speaker
I think this is something we'll get into in a later episode. i don't know if this is supposed to be influenced by the demon bear, but I think this is a cloak and dagger thing. Oh, mo dagger I think this is a cloak. I didn't read that. I don't know what you're talking about. yeah eyes swing on There's, there's been some implications in the past few issues. There was a Marvel team up with cloak and dagger.
00:54:38
Speaker
We'll get there that affected Sunspot and Wolfsbane. Okay. And there's these implications in some of these recent issues where they just like kind of look out on the city of New York towards the church where Cloak and Dagger live, and they're like, man, that was really fucked up. And then they have some sort of like weird feeling.
00:54:59
Speaker
i think this is that, but I don't – it's never made explicit well in this book. I can say that this the panel of Rain's eyes in wolf form looking out ah like through oh my good the psychic link over the psychic link over the doctors operating on Dany is one of my favorite panels it's so beautiful in this whole thing.
00:55:27
Speaker
It's gorgeous yeah weird and very fun. I love the way that the half-wolf form is drawn. It's very fun. Yeah. Yeah. It's cool as hell. It invokes, like, the Lon Chaney werewolf.
00:55:43
Speaker
That's true! Man. Yeah, yeah. pipe But... dis it it It very clearly is invoking that without copying it. Yeah. yeah and i think Very much its own is rain form.
00:55:57
Speaker
And this is sort of what I think informs the Wolfsbane look from here on forward. like the It's like like she has like the Wolverine ears, yeah yeah but made of hair with like a hair plateau connecting them. um But yeah, no, it is it is like just so just enough off of human looking.
00:56:18
Speaker
to be freaky so she's able to link with danny like we said but danny's too foggy to communicate clearly she's desperate to warn rain about the bear so much so that she starts to wake herself on the operating table ruth the doctor one of my greatest fears waking up on the operating table i'll be in surgery and wake up yeah bugs me that i never had it bugs me that any time it bugs me that anesthesia puts me completely out and then i just wake up later and like i was dead for that time what want i don't want to experience it i just don't want to be like it feels like i was dead about it i have about its surgery what were they saying about me
00:57:08
Speaker
The doctors panic and rain disconnects from, uh, to stop her from dying on the table right there. Question. Yeah. What's, what's going on? What's going on here with the psychic link? Okay.
00:57:21
Speaker
Um, I, I initially read it as they're really close friends. and then And then I read it as, oh are we doing it are we doing a racism?
00:57:37
Speaker
We are doing a racism. the latter. She is so in tune with nature that her friend she has an innate psychic link with her friend when she turns into a wolf. Only when she's a wolf.
00:57:50
Speaker
Great. Yeah, yeah. Great. Love that. I mean, I... i the To its credit, the movie just turns them into lesbians and like has them hook up instead. And that's that's perfect.
00:58:04
Speaker
It's better. Excellent. and A great way to fix that problem. Yeah. yeah But in this, I mean, we are listeners of note. We've talked about this. Claremont.
00:58:16
Speaker
He doesn't know he hates Native Americans. He thinks he's very respectful of them. Well, I he ah so i wouldn't. There's a difference between. Yeah, you're right.
00:58:29
Speaker
um yeah I want to know, like. What do like what what do indigenous people think about Danny Moonstar and the Demon Bear saga?
00:58:42
Speaker
Do they, like, i want to hear from, yeah like, what's their deal? Have they made a fuss about it? That's a good point. You're right. There's a difference between hate and fetishization. I think Chris Clannamont often fetishizes Native Americans. Not to say fetishization is okay.
00:58:57
Speaker
it but Right. But just to make the distinction that, like, it is a different bad thing from. Yeah. And yeah yeah he does this any time Indigenous Americans come up and he.
00:59:10
Speaker
it's It's rough. It's rough. We're dealing with it over in X-Men with Forge right now. um yeah To be honest, anytime I've ever read about Indigenous American representation in comic books, it's that the the amount is so slim that it's kind of like...
00:59:31
Speaker
We have seven. if we start If we start fucking hating on three of them, then we have four. But I would love yeah i would love to have indigenous perspectives on it.
00:59:45
Speaker
So Rain does end up getting the info information that Dany wanted her to have. the bear is coming, and it's terrified of Dany because she has the power to destroy it. Ooh.
00:59:59
Speaker
across the galaxy so wild to cut to this unbelievable and it's not even all right turn a page and then now we're in space it's like no the space stuff starts on the same page mid page yeah yeah just a big old shot of chod Yeah, big green swamp monster looking guy. So across the galaxy, the star jammers are kicking it and out in space when Binary sets off a red alert.
01:00:31
Speaker
An entity roughly the size of a human but possessing the power levels of a space station is hurtling towards the Earth too fast for them to catch up to. It streaks by them in a blinding flash of light.
01:00:43
Speaker
who know you Can I point out that Lalandra is still with them she's just farting around space with the star jammers instead of fighting the war that is her birthright she was like i have to leave to fight this civil war and then she spent like two years just hanging out with the x-men going to weddings going to go to birthday parties playing baseball playing baseball and now she's in outer space just hanging out with the star jammers
01:01:18
Speaker
All right, back at the hospital, stranded by the storm, hours into surgery and still hours more to go, folks start to lose their minds. Rain creeps around as a werewolf, scaring Officer Corsi. Wolfman! Wolfman! Shoot it!
01:01:36
Speaker
i love i love this characterization of a cop seeing something confusing and immediately pulling out his gun. Yeah, yeah. That can't be real. I should shoot it. Threatening little children. This also reminds me, specifically specifically the Corsi and... Sharon Friedlander.
01:01:58
Speaker
Friedlander thing. This issue was my favorite of of what we've read. Okay. specifically because it is giving John Carpenter I feel like this is John Carpenter movie.
01:02:13
Speaker
You're trapped in this hospital with a thread outside. This is a bit Assault on Precinct 13. This is a little bit of Halloween 2. to This is a little bit of The Thing. This feels very carpentry, and that man is very important to me. So I love this shit.
01:02:34
Speaker
This is... and it's It's like we've got a we've got a girl turning into a wolf. We've got telepathic discussion. yeah And we've got a giant demon bear.
01:02:46
Speaker
But otherwise it feels pretty grounded. And storm. A crippling storm. Their like mission is to like go turn on a generator. And like it's it's not we're flying through and there's weird spectral whatever. We'll get to that. But, like, I – this hits the fucking sweet spot for what I for what i want to see generally.
01:03:13
Speaker
And, I mean, this is – like, they even he takes the time. Like, Tom Corsi is going through all this shit, but this is – he's just – This is what but put him in the hospital with that nurse that he has a crush on, Sharon Friedlander, who, look, again, is also a white woman.
01:03:30
Speaker
we need to I yeah promise there's a reason we need to be clear about this. um And he's like, oh, I get to hang out with Sharon. like Even though all this other crazy shit's going on, I get to hang out with Sharon. And he just goes and flirts with her for a little bit. like That's such a human moment.
01:03:49
Speaker
And I can see is that same thing like that John Carpenter might do where it's like even in these extreme circumstances, humans just have to take the time to be human sometimes.
01:04:01
Speaker
even Now that you mentioned it, even the lighting is like really reminiscent of a Carpenter film, the way just the like the perspective of light on the art here is set.
01:04:13
Speaker
Just hiding everything in the darkness behind you. It's yeah so cool. Officer Corsi, again, finds Rain in the closet. She gaslights him ah when he almost shoots her in in human form. to cool off, he starts hitting on Nurse Freedland, only to be interrupted by a haunting growl as the panel turns red blood red screams and a gunshot ring out through the hospital and it's the new why are they sleeping in their costumes yeah so that their secret identities don't get exposed ah like the they would either be in their costumes or sleeping
01:04:56
Speaker
Why are they? Screams and a gunshot ring out through the hospital as the new mutants converge on the spot where Corsi and Friedlander just stood. They only find a pool of blood.
01:05:08
Speaker
Rain can smell it. The bear's in the hospital. Bear in the hospital. This is what the fucking movie should have been, right? like this i Why wasn't the movie this? I know, right?
01:05:20
Speaker
The fact that they turned it into a superhero, like clearly it was shot like this. Clearly, when they wrote a screenplay and they shot the movie, they expected this. and yeah and And then when they got to editing, they were like, nah, it needs to be more like Spidey Man.
01:05:35
Speaker
give Give me the fucking script. I'll fix it. We'll do another one. We'll redo it. we'll We'll actually well cast someone correctly for Rubiro. Yeah, yeah. Don't worry about it. yeah Ileana focuses her energy on casting wards around the operating room, and just in time as the panel is consumed by darkness, save the claws and salivating jaws of the demon bear.
01:06:01
Speaker
The bear again is the panel here. It's fucking so good. Yeah, yeah. It lashes out immediately, tossing Bobby aside and slashing Illyana across the arm.
01:06:13
Speaker
But where she expected damage from the claws, she finds a fragment of armor protecting her instead. Not wasting the opportunity, she summons her soul sword and plunges it into the bear. It screams and fades away.
01:06:27
Speaker
But before they can regroup, the lights go out. So do the phones. Emergency generators provide enough power to allow the surgery to continue, assuming it can continue.
01:06:39
Speaker
Ileana cries out in pain as the ward she casts upon... the OR r come under attack. She focuses her power on strengthening the wards, pouring more and more of her spiritual essence into the protection spell. Like the demon bear is trying to get in there. He's like clawing at the door. He wants to get to Danny.
01:06:58
Speaker
It's physically hurting her every time he attacks the the protective field. The new mutants mount their best attack, but something shifts in the air as the bear's form starts consuming everything around it. It's casting a spell.
01:07:14
Speaker
Suddenly, the team find themselves standing outdoors in a vast American desert at the foot of the towering demon bear. It holds both the cop and the nurse as its prisoners, and only Ileana's warts protect Danny and the team of surgeons from seeing the same fate to be concluded. Ooh.
01:07:36
Speaker
Ooh. I love the sun in this panel. Also the bear's face. It's a good panel, except the weird floating people. Or sphere that's happening.
01:07:50
Speaker
Because the bear is the night. Yes. The moon is in the bear. The landscape visible. The landscape is happening across the panel. Yes.
01:08:04
Speaker
And it's daytime. It's bright day. like The sky is white. So it it looks like a hot desert day. But yeah where the bear comes into contact with the...
01:08:17
Speaker
With the horizon, it is night and you can see the moon and yeah the like clouds that are lit by the moon providing a light backdrop for like the silhouette of the rocks. It's really fucking cool. It's really great.
01:08:35
Speaker
One of the best panels I've seen. Yeah, yeah. there's In this entire read through. So many depictions here where you wouldn't even know you're looking at a bear if they didn't add the claws and the the crazy eyes and snout.
01:08:50
Speaker
Yeah, right, right, right. It's just built into everything. who Fun moment before we move on. Dani, when she gets psychically contacted under under anesthesia, having a great time.
01:09:06
Speaker
She's like, hey, Rainy, thanks for reaching out. Just imagine it. you Imagine being able to just like psychically contact somebody who's under anesthesia or just on any drug and just like hear their thoughts for a minute.
01:09:22
Speaker
Well, now you're going to make me paranoid next time I smoke. All right. So next up, we've got... ah Badlands Chris Claremont writer Bill Sinkiewicz the artist ah Tom Orzakowski the letterer Glynis what what is with these people this is what things were like back in the eighty s We're just so used to it. I didn't even realize these were weird names. The color is Nesenti, the editor. And that guy is the editor who is much taller and coincidentally chief.
01:10:08
Speaker
Gross. Yeah, he makes it. hate it. That is that is. Yeah, that is how Bill Sienkiewicz writes it here. Much taller and coincidentally chief. And I i don't even know if I get the joke fully.
01:10:23
Speaker
Because he's the editor in chief and he's calling out the chief bit because racist. Yes. I mean, is this yes. Yes. They're like something about the height of a person and being a chief.
01:10:36
Speaker
I don't fucking know. I think he's comparing himself to the demon bear.
01:10:44
Speaker
Oh, I hadn't caught or or is the transformation that happens to the cop. yeah Yeah, that's fair. I thought it was just like a shot at his immodesty.
01:10:57
Speaker
At Jim Stupin's immodesty. But i I honestly, I don't know. I can't speak about it either way because I know it's a joke. but I don't know what the joke is.
01:11:07
Speaker
Yeah. Well, luckily we do know some things. Oh, like this was released on June 26th, 1984. Yeah. yeah um and the cover date is October 1984 on a vast plane, uncorrupted by colonialism, a spiritual realm in which the demon bear resides. The new mutants face the massive beast. Yeah.
01:11:30
Speaker
Above the giant bear are the floating bodies of Officer Tom Corsi and Nurse Sharon Friedlander, and between them, a red globe which shows a window into the operating room where Danny Moonstar lays.
01:11:44
Speaker
The bear sinks its claws into the souls of Tom and Sharon, instantly transforming them into demon representatives of Cheyenne who instantly attack the new mutants. Yeah. Gotta say the demons are cool.
01:11:58
Speaker
The demons look cool. ah You're right. You're right. We're not quite at the moment yet. They do look cool. they The visual language of Warlock is applied to these demons. Yeah. Yeah.
01:12:12
Speaker
Very spindly sort of sort of shifting form as they go. Right. They look creepy as fuck. Cannonball blasts directly into the bear while Ileana becomes distracted, attempting to bind the demons. This gives the bear a momentary advantage, allowing him to tear through her protections around the operating room.
01:12:34
Speaker
For a split second, one of the surgeons sees the violence occurring on the demon bear realm beyond. But then the room returns to normal and he refocuses on Danny's broken body.
01:12:46
Speaker
That's cool. Yeah, it is. That's cool as hell. I love the panel where it's like ripping open the wall to expose the realm and like the doctors are in the foreground in colored in such a way that like.
01:13:04
Speaker
Yeah. In it, like, normally, this would just be an artsy panel where they're happening in a separate moment as this other thing. But traed him the one doctor is not breaking the fourth little wall, but like acknowledging what's happening in a way that's really interesting.
01:13:23
Speaker
Yeah, having a physical representation, right, of what, of Sienkiewicz's art style, like this is it impacting the world around, is a very interesting, ah yeah, it's really interesting panel. Yeah, yeah, what an approach.
01:13:40
Speaker
Ileana cannot use spells on the demons or her protections will drop. And Sunspot tells Amara that they can't use violence on the demons because Tom and Sharon are innocent in all this. To make matters worse, as the moments tick past, the bear's shadow grows, corrupting the planes around them.
01:13:58
Speaker
Ugh. Sunspot is pulled into one of these patches and Wolfsbane instantly dives for him as Magma tries to disarm one of the demons. Ugh. The demon bear once again presses his advantage, plunging his claws into the soul of Amara as she begins transforming as well.
01:14:16
Speaker
Risking her protections on Dany, Ilyana summons the soul sword and slices the bear's paw clean off, then plunges her sword directly into the body of Amara.
01:14:29
Speaker
There's some really cool shit here. Like, okay, there is, we haven't mentioned it, but in the upper left-hand corner of several of these pages is like a little map.
01:14:40
Speaker
And it's like laid out like a grid with- It's cool. ah Yeah, yeah. Letters on one side and numbers on the other, x-axis and y-axis. different parts of this grid- are becoming like covered in ink stains which yeah it says below represent the areas of the planes that are that have been corrupted shadow yeah corrupted by the demon bear shadow fucking so good and it looks like ink blotches yeah from a psychiatrist's office or something yes yeah yeah yeah
01:15:15
Speaker
Sam panics and blasts into Ileana, accusing her of killing Amara. Rain was right all along. Ileana was an evil witch who finally showed her true colors.
01:15:26
Speaker
Sam, the two I love. I love this fucking himbo. So. just these two religious nuts like we knew it you were a demon yeah iliana marvels marvels at the silver armor suddenly covering her body to protect her from sam's attack while amara chastises the boy for misunderstanding the situation iliana was purging amara's soul from the bear's corruption The confusion and anger seems to empower the bear as his shadow grows, covering nearly the entire landscape.
01:16:02
Speaker
Rain finally escapes the shadow with Roberto into a small patch of light the new mutants are gathered in. Another fucking incredible page. like the that as matt yeah That I actually thought about.
01:16:15
Speaker
like like It is in the same dimensions. like I thought about like that would be a good background image for like a social account. Oh, yeah. The problem is I already have the perfect one ah for Blue Sky, which is when the 95 highway collapsed. Yeah, yeah They had to warn everybody in the surrounding area not to go to Northeast Philly. So there were just a bunch of highway signs that said avoid Northeast Philly. Yeah.
01:16:50
Speaker
Which, for context, is where I'm from. That happened at my exit. Very fun. Oh, no way. ah Yeah, if that weren't the case, this image here of the landscape covered in darkness with...
01:17:07
Speaker
three small like pinpricks of light shining through the clouds is stunning and it's simple yeah there's not a lot of actual stuff going on but just like the way that they arrange the colors here is gorgeous Yeah, I also think there's something cool here about, like, writing-wise, about the way that the New Mutants just start kind of arguing. Yeah. And they don't they don't explicitly say it, but it's at that moment that the darkness suddenly spreads over, like, twice the landscape that it had been covered over before. And it feels like, oh, this is the Demon Bear's sort of influence
01:17:54
Speaker
um on them and their negative emotions sort of empowering the demon bear right yeah yeah yeah iliana remembers what rain learned last time she mind linked with danny that danny was the only one with power to kill the demon bear rain must mind link with her again even though it almost killed danny last time rain reluctantly agrees and begins the mind link as the mutants stave off the next wave of assaults The bear strikes the sphere, knocking Ileana to the ground.
01:18:28
Speaker
She's almost killed by the a demon when magma erupts a small volcano in its path, diverting it toward a big sunspot double punch. Cannonball blasts a second demon as it comes in on Bobby, but the first one is up again.
01:18:44
Speaker
Invulnerable while blasting count number to nine. Oh, yep. Another but vulnerable while blasting. I'm glad that we have that clarification. Otherwise, you'd be worried. You'd be like, what's going to happen to this boy while he's blasting?
01:18:59
Speaker
i also, i think it's so shady that at least three times... throughout these these issues that we read yeah someone makes a comment that ah Sunspot is not invulnerable not invulnerable they're very clear about this don't forget yeah Rain comes back with an answer but the demon immediately clubs her in the head on a jep boy yeah another Rain Sinclair head injury always getting a hit in the head
01:19:34
Speaker
God, she's like, it's like, she's like Rupert Giles or something. um She could take it. Ileana dives between the two and thrust the soul sword into the demon's heart, transforming it back to human.
01:19:49
Speaker
But instead of Tom Corsi, a war painted native american falls to the ground oh my gosh the sword is the key rain explains and teamwork i guess well listen that's gotta just be that's just gotta be a fluke like right sinkhavage forgot what he was drawing be top course again later yeah well yeah they haven't killed the bear yet i'm sure this is still some magic he'll correct it he'll correct it with it yeah iliana orders magma to light the demon bear on fire to distract it while cannonball blasts her up to its head she plunges her soul sword between its eyes and tears its fucking face in two the bear howls its shadow retreating from the land and out of the bright white gash in its body a woman and a man emerge the new mutants are spat back out into the hospital
01:20:41
Speaker
as are Tom Corsi and Sharon Friedlander, who once two white people are now Native American people. Jesus Christ.
01:20:52
Speaker
And that is how they'll remain, explain the other Native American man and woman who emerged from the demon bear's body. um I genuinely had to like stop and like flip back because I'm like, wait,
01:21:09
Speaker
yeah where the hell did these two i thought they just started bringing in other people to make them to do this but yeah clear all that up at the end well well we will will we will have to go really in depth on this how how inappropriate this is apparently these two are william and peg lone star wait yeah yep what yeah they're william lone star and peg lone star parents of danny moon star i don't fucking know man well they were the demon bear so no time for that now the doctor has appeared out of the or and danny will live but she'll be paralyzed forever
01:21:56
Speaker
Wait, no worries, says Professor x Xavier in the kids' heads. I've got this. What? He just appears and he's like, hey, it's fine.
01:22:07
Speaker
Don't worry about I've been following along. i real ah great great Great. Great to know you've been following along and doing it. Soon, Storm brings the Morlock healer to the hospital to fix Danny's paralysis. When she wakes, he's back and tells her she'll make a full recovery. And when she asks about the bear, her parents step out of the shadows.
01:22:31
Speaker
The bear was actually them. They were enslaved and corrupted, and they were going to do the same to Danny, but... Black Eagle Eagle had woven spells to keep them away. When Danny left the mountains, it freed the bear to hunt her down.
01:22:46
Speaker
Anyway, it's gone now and no one knows what in the hell it was to begin with. Xavier is going to refer to all this stuff to to Dr. Strange. He's just like, ah I'll send an email to Dr. Strange. Just re-demon bear, re-two white people turned into indigenous American, which doesn't make sense. You don't just turn into No, no, no. It's just a fundamental misunderstanding of what race is
01:23:21
Speaker
But also there might be some interesting story here to tell. Like, have you seen Altered Carbon? No, no, I know. i know what you're talking about. I never watched it. It's a show about it's like a sci fi show. It's probably based on a book or whatever. I don't know I watched the first season. It was really good.
01:23:39
Speaker
Season one star Joel Kinnaman. Okay. Yeah. Is he sweet? Yeah. Swedish. The Swedish guy playing a character called Takeshi Kovach.
01:23:54
Speaker
Okay. Who is Japanese. Okay. But the whole point of the show is that like you can transfer your consciousness into different bodies. And they play around with that very interestingly.
01:24:08
Speaker
Like, Takeshi Kovach is played in season one by Joel Kinnaman and in season two by Anthony Mackie. Yes. So there's a lot of fun exploration of like, what does it mean to be?
01:24:22
Speaker
you versus the body that you inhabit and it plays with race relations in these in this show sure and there are absolutely stories to explore here um but i don't trust white people in the mid 80s yeah chris claremont doesn't have the best track record with the And there's a difference between i am jumping in between bodies and then suddenly living in the experience of another person versus, oh, my skin and hair changed color.
01:25:00
Speaker
Yeah, I am now a Native American. No, you're fucking not. You just know. You just know you popped out of this spirit realm looking a little different. And everyone said, ah that's a Native American. But no, it's not. It's the same guy.
01:25:16
Speaker
i know it's not their fault, but white people shouldn't do this. What turn change their race. No! Cancelled. They are cancelled. Yeah, let's cancel Tom. let's get and Tom was a cop.
01:25:35
Speaker
Oh yeah, he was pre-cancelled. He was already cancelled. Chris Claremont has a really bad track record with this. um ah He, you know, his his grasp grasp on all race relations is like a progressive guy in the 1980s. So like tenuous, but good hearted. Well meaning.
01:25:56
Speaker
And I think I think there's something similar going on with his relationship to indigenous Americans, but it's so much worse um because like you like the the the word you use before he fetishizes them. Yes.
01:26:10
Speaker
And granted, like the quote unquote, the noble savage trope, this has been discussed in sociological circles and anthropological circles and historian circles at this time. It was knowledge available to him, but it hadn't kind of permeated the broader culture yet. So there's a good chance he's never even heard of the concept, but you'd think you'd do some fucking research if you're writing about cultures you don't understand.
01:26:38
Speaker
Yeah. Or like, I don't know. It's like, I, I seek this shit out because I'm interested in hearing from people's, like, I want to hear stories from, from cultures that aren't my own and I want to learn about other people in the world. But like,
01:26:59
Speaker
I don't like, I want, I want to hear from them. i want yeah their authentic stories. I don't want like, you're not going to write a book. about this yeah Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like I can't, I can't write this.
01:27:11
Speaker
That's not my place. Like, yeah dude, let's get, let's get an indigenous writer on a demon bear saga adaptation. Yes.
01:27:22
Speaker
God. They might just be like, no, thanks. They might literally just be like, no, thanks. Nope. Let me ask, what do we think of the ending?
01:27:33
Speaker
It's a bit sudden. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's like, I'm going refer all this to Doctor Strange because I didn't want, because me, Chris Claremont, didn't want to write any explanations for anything that just happened. I've i've written myself into a quarter. Mm-hmm.
01:27:51
Speaker
and I'm going to ask the Doctor Strange writers, and you know, ah Steve Gerber or whoever to write me out. It's an incredible story. I was just, I thought the ending would be a little it clearer, I guess. sir But she's got her parents back.
01:28:08
Speaker
Yeah. Right? they're They're living people now. That wasn't like a... Yeah, they are they are alive and we love that. Yes. Yeah. But yeah, it's really hard to tell like what kind of like what was any of that? She even asked. She says, what was it? What's behind this and why? And they're just like, I don't know.
01:28:27
Speaker
Don't worry. Rough end to an otherwise incredibly good story. Also, Healer's back. And that's his name. His name is Healer. His name
New Mutants' New Adventures and Character Dynamics
01:28:38
Speaker
is Healer? He dresses like D&D cleric.
01:28:43
Speaker
he's got a pope hat he's got like big he's got like a one of those big collars that come around and come around the sides of his head and he's got a like a ah big but bushy white beard and he speaks in these and those great thou art leader of the morlocks windrider like leaning into the bit Who the fuck are you? aren't you just Aren't you just a random New York guy who lives and the underneath New York City? Like, why do you talk like this?
01:29:16
Speaker
Only in New York. Yeah, I guess so. Okay, let's get into New Mutants number 21, Slumber Party.
01:29:27
Speaker
ah i love this. I love this issue. All right. Chris Claremont's the writer, Bill Sienkiewicz is the artist, Tom Orsakowski and L. Louis Buchalis are the letters, Glynnis Ween is the colorist, and Nusenti's the editor, and...
01:29:42
Speaker
Jump shorter. Editor-in-chief. Release date, July 24th, 1984. Cover date, November 1984. The Xavier Mansion. Just after dusk.
01:29:53
Speaker
A pack of silhouetted figures traipse across the lawn in the dark. Arrive at the front door and knock. They're invited in by a figure that opens the door and leads them down the hall, up the stairs, and into a slumber party. oh One of them calls the other one a drip face. I think i think these are all Marvel staffers.
01:30:16
Speaker
Oh, really that's fun. Yeah, I think I think all of them are like based off of Marvel staffers and they're like friends and yeah deal and stuff. They do have really like specific renderings. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And the first the person that answers the door says, Hi, guys, I'm Wheezy. I think that's Louise. ah Louise Jones.
01:30:34
Speaker
Yeah, sure. Imagine you're at a slumber party. Popcorn, there's balloons, there's music. You're a teenager.
01:30:45
Speaker
What are you doing for fun? Well, reading People Magazine. What the? Like that, that just makes me feel so like that makes this feel so old. This is the era of teen magazines too. yet They're reading People. yeah what i Just off panel, somebody's got a Reader's Digest.
01:31:11
Speaker
Yeah.
01:31:15
Speaker
Ileana Amara and a bunch of teenage girls are dancing, reading magazines and having pillow fights. Danny from a wheelchair makes sure things aren't getting too out of hand while Rain worries this might all be a sin.
01:31:27
Speaker
What I did not realize. I did not realize about this character because, again, my exposure to her. is X-Men Evolution, yeah ah which introduces the new mutants, but they're not really characters. They're just sort of like in the background. And yeah I always was just like, oh, those, I want to know more about them. yeah what's going on over there i did not know this whole super catholic part yes rain's whole thing and i don't love it yeah just be traumatized for sure yeah she was raised by a preacher it's sort of like an abusive you're a sinner everything you do is a sin and then when very like carrie's mom
01:32:13
Speaker
yeah right yeah yeah and then when he finds out that she's a mutant he's like this is yours this is your sin this is the devil punishing you for your sin and then tries to kill her metaphor very when we meet her he's trying to kill her and we don't learn much about him until much later but yeah I think that's what's so compelling about her character is the... She's still so devoted to her faith, even though it tried to kill her. Like, it's it spat her out.
01:32:51
Speaker
And his teachings. She's always referencing what he said, even though when we meet her, she's being chased by a mob led by him trying to kill her. Wild.
01:33:02
Speaker
So, far above the mansion, on an asteroid in orbit around the planet... We're finally gonna get some payoff for this. Magneto gets a sudden alert that a celestial object is flying toward him too fast for him to do anything. He tries to deflect the missile with an energy bolt, but it's no use. His asteroid, asteroid M, is destroyed.
01:33:27
Speaker
What are we doing? at where this is the version of seo You just what put a popular character into your comic book for one panel. Why?
01:33:40
Speaker
well we know he is alive We know Asteroid M isn't going anywhere. That's the thing. It's like, hey, look, this thing happened. Just kidding. No, it didn't.
01:33:55
Speaker
Well, all right. What if this was Magneto's death? what after What if after all this, this was just... a Yeah, what if Magneto died as a footnote? Yeah, what if he was He was never in a comic book again.
01:34:12
Speaker
introducing a character that not like that is very weird and we don't really know anything about i'm going to by the way will piece more compelling magneto's dead i'm going to oh man all right this does have anything far-reaching consequences i'll say like this Okay, obviously Magneto's not dead. Obviously we know matt Asteroid M becomes a big part of the comic. It stays a big part of the comic books for decades.
01:34:44
Speaker
But this does happen. it does yeah it does explode. Asteroid M does fall out of the sky. Magneto does get knocked, you know, does almost die. And we will see, like weirdly, we will see the fallout of this.
01:35:00
Speaker
just interesting Is it going to be in New Mutants or is that in can't remember. i can it's that Is this this era where like the Rachel Summers thing where stuff will just bounce back and forth between the two titles as if Chris Claremont forgets which one he's writing?
01:35:18
Speaker
um All right. We get a close-up on the object as it continues to plummet to Earth, a pitch-black, almost humanoid figure figure adorned with bright blue circuitry patterns that amounts to muscular muscle structure and a barely discernible face. His name is Warlock, and he's desperate for a source of power to feed on.
01:35:37
Speaker
I have not seen something like this in comics before. This is... nuts just what warlock looks like yeah just yeah craziness i love it but it's weird he is just half it's half scribbled too it's just sinkovich yes scribbling on the page and that's a character yeah and it's and he's perfect i love him i love him so much i'll die for him the slumber party continues down on earth as rain gets a makeover
01:36:13
Speaker
amara makes some new friends and the boys get jealous and try to sneak in classic when they're rejected sam and bobby go for a swim ah well sam goes for a swim nude and bobby just sits on there he's like he says he's too cold too cold for me we gotta talk about it He's going to stay. got to talk about it. rest of this issue. You brought me, you brought me onto this podcast. You're getting, you're getting me. ah And Bobby, is it?
01:36:46
Speaker
Yeah. They find so many, so many ways to put Sam Guthrie in a state of undress. Yeah.
01:36:59
Speaker
To comment on his posterior. To humiliate him publicly by dressing him in things that he wouldn't normally dress as.
01:37:11
Speaker
There's a lot going on here. And I would like to say, i love it. i think It's almost like Sienkiewicz is making up for how much they did this to the female characters in the first like 15 issues or whatever. Yeah, sure. could it Is it actually that? Because it it is definitely intentional. i and i He really admires Sam Guthrie's form for sure. It's it's yeah maybe his favorite character to draw.
01:37:44
Speaker
And he's frequently drawing him nude. Also, the baseball of it all. Oh, yeah. There's a baseball scene. There's a whole baseball scene. Don't skip over that. yeah yeah They're coming back from a fucking Yankees game, which even better, the Yankees lose. Yankees lose. Embarrassingly. we love it.
01:38:09
Speaker
And then Bobby's, Bobby's haunting him saying could always root for the Mets, which, I mean, there's no winning there. It's like, would you rather be shot or stabbed? but They used to, they when the Mets first opened as a franchise, there used to be so many jokes in X-Men about how terrible the Mets were. And they were having like historically bad seasons. It was rich. Oh God, yeah, so wait.
01:38:36
Speaker
So Spider-Man predates the New York Mets. What did he do? yeah heonically fan he He probably mildly enjoyed the Yankees.
01:38:50
Speaker
Maybe he's a Brooklyn Dodgers guy. Oh, well, I mean, we know we know Steve Rogers is a Brooklyn Dodgers guy. Yeah, he sure is. We know that in the movie Captain America, he wakes up and...
01:39:05
Speaker
They're playing a Dodgers-Phillies game for him on the And that's what clues him into the fact that he is not in his... own time he remembered that because he was specifically yeah they also there's so this is a double issue which means they need to fill some space so they have this like they have this baseball interaction where sam just picks up a boulder and hits it with like a tree limb or uh sorry roberto does that sam gets really mad at him for it because he doesn't know where that you dumb aqua land You call them a dumb cluck. You dumb cluck.
01:39:46
Speaker
And flies off to pulverize it. Good friendship. love good friends having, i love having, getting the time to just hang out with these people.
01:39:58
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's nothing going on yet. They're just like, these are two friends hanging out. They're coming back from a game. they're goofing around with their superpowers this is the good shit yeah this is the fucking good shit right here give me more yeah this is what all x-men should be um the the god the image of bobby smacking the fucking boulder also why does he just find a boulder do you guys just find boulders on the ground a lot why is he wearing a speedo now
01:40:35
Speaker
He didn't swim, but he's in a Speedo all of a sudden. That's a good point. He wasn't while Sam was so swimming. He at some point took his clothes off. make his friend feel less alone. Yeah, it they knew exactly what to do. They gave me some baseball.
01:40:55
Speaker
They gave me a really lovely little makeover scene. I love Rain's new look. Yeah, it is great. And then they give me... Is he naked the rest of the issue? He goes back to his room and chooses not to put clothes on. Which...
01:41:15
Speaker
In fairness, hey man if I looked like that, you got it you're you're going everywhere in a towel. While Sam's going for a swim, a meteor crashes down onto the property.
Warlock's Arrival and Backstory
01:41:31
Speaker
They investigate, but it's just like a rock. Seems weird, but they'll let the professor figure it out when he's back. For now, they'll just carry it inside and stow it in the foyer.
01:41:44
Speaker
You guys have fought aliens. What are you doing? Whatever. Look, it all works out for the best. Not necessary stupidity. Yeah.
01:41:56
Speaker
The Rock wakes up. Once again, we see this black figure covered in like baby blue scribbles and circuitry. Who wants to take like their best...
01:42:10
Speaker
i think We said it was like a Sienkiewicz just like scribble. It's like he's scribbling circuitry, right? Yeah. it's like it's like a so It's like an unpolished sketch of a figure.
01:42:26
Speaker
Yes. yeah But instead of like inking it and erasing the sketch lines, you leave the sketch lines and then add some more stuff. Like you turn every sketch line into like a piece of...
01:42:41
Speaker
Yeah. Circuitry like ah like it was on a motherboard. Yeah. Yeah. It always looked loud to me. That was. Yes. and well because he' always like It always looks like he's screaming. Sure. Yeah. Yeah.
01:42:54
Speaker
It's something only Bilsenkevich could have drawn. Nobody could have come up with this character besides Bilsenkevich. Right. Like nobody draws this way. and has this kind of imagination. They gave him this character. They said, hey we have an idea for shape-shifting metamorph.
01:43:13
Speaker
Can we, Bill Sienkiewicz, ask you to create this character? Oh, that's amazing. Okay. Yeah, yeah. All right, I keep losing my fucking place. This issue's too good. it's getting me It's getting me all excited. So Warlock's form contorts from panel to panel as he thinks in panicked sentence fragments. He's dying. He looks around for a source of energy spying an outlet in the corner. It extends a tendril from his body directly into it.
01:43:43
Speaker
He turns red and surges with energy. The power of the whole property. He electrocutes himself. Bad idea. The girls at the slumber party don't notice as they're up in the attic with the lights already off, putting on a seance.
01:44:00
Speaker
This is its rain is, of course, in the corner worrying that they're sinning. But Danny is conjuring demons, like just images of them. And all the girls are going, ooh. Yeah.
01:44:14
Speaker
This is like how Houdini used to do seances. But Lockheed jumps into action when he senses a foreign presence in the man mansion. Warlock is in the kitchen, meanwhile, turning houseplants and the food in the fridge into techno-organic matter like himself so he can absorb its energy to feed off of it. He thinks the fridge is a guy. He's like, oh you're an interest interesting... won't answer my call. Who hasn't been there?
01:44:39
Speaker
Who hasn't at one point thought the fridge was a gal? He's like, oh, this is is smart of you to keep your food in yourself. um Lockheed confronts him and a warlock surprised considers eating the little dragon. Lockheed lets out a scream and a burst of flame, which sends all of the new mutants running towards the noise.
01:45:01
Speaker
Ileana finds them first and assuming he's a demon, summons her soul sword and cuts into warlock. It has no effect, though, as she learns this creature is not one of magical origin.
01:45:12
Speaker
Warlock strikes back, but once again, a mystical armor forms around Ileana and protects her from harm. Recovering quickly, she summons a demon of her own in from limbo, only for a panicked warlock to reach out and morph the demon into a techno-organic creature, just like he did to the houseplant.
01:45:32
Speaker
Ugh. iic this is creepy yeah so what he does is he ah he can turn other creatures into things like himself and then basically eat their life yeah huh so okay was in a good guy way but yeah Ileana even finds the circuitry starting to climb up her hand as she grabs Lockheed and escapes through a teleportation disc in retreat.
01:46:05
Speaker
Rain leads Amara, Sam, and Bobby around as they try to figure out what's going on without alerting the rest of the slumber party to their identities. They come across Warlock, who begins to understand that he's under attack because these creatures are the inhabitants here, and he's being seen as an intruder.
01:46:21
Speaker
But before he can explain, he's blasted with a lava burst by Amara, rocketed outside by Sam, and has pieces of his ever-shifting form turn torn off by Roberto.
01:46:35
Speaker
Invulnerable while blasting count number 10. Nice. We're there. we're so We're back, baby. Double digits. Warlock retreats wounded.
01:46:45
Speaker
Dany, still back in the mansion, overseeing the slumber party, begins to get worried. She pulls herself out of her chair and staggers out into the hall where she's immediately confronted by Warlock.
01:46:56
Speaker
In a last-ditch effort, she hopes this robot can feel fear and summons a terrifying image of Warlock's father, Magus. weird name i like that he has a beard he's got a beard made of circuits yeah warlock runs off and danny realizes something if it has fears this is a sentient being and his behavior indicates fear and confusion not malice rain rain confirms that he also smells scared and the new mutants decide to try a new approach thanks for This use of Danny's power is one of my favorite, yes like very creative, like, oh, hey, this is a very specific way that we have advanced the plot using this very specific power.
01:47:44
Speaker
I like it. Yeah, if you have such a human power, using it in this humane way, is like is that's a really interesting, you're right, you're right. um This creature is probably alien and clearly can't communicate with them, but who do they know that can communicate with anyone That's right, Doug freaking Ramsey. Hey.
01:48:06
Speaker
Sam rockets off to presumably the Massachusetts Academy. They just left him there, right? I guess so. He acts like he just goes next door. But yeah, but Doug should be all the way.
01:48:18
Speaker
so confusing to me because I've never heard of this person. Who the fuck is Doug Ramsey? He doesn't even have a code name. What's his code name?
01:48:30
Speaker
Well, Doug Ramsey. He doesn't have one yet. He's just their neighbor friend. Off-paneling explains the new mutant's whole deal to Doug, including the fact that he's a mutant and can understand and communicate in any language. What a fucked up thing to do to the poor kid.
01:48:46
Speaker
Incredible thing to do off camera. Yeah. Yeah, he just pops into the frame going, oh, by the way, okay, I guess you're all Random other guy. Yeah.
01:48:59
Speaker
And they're just like, he he comes on panel and he's just like, um this is weird. I guess I'm a mutant and you're all mutants and I can understand any language and I'm supposed to talk to an alien.
01:49:12
Speaker
Also, wait, how did he not realize that he knew every language or could I and understand any language? You ever run into a talented person that doesn't understand that not everybody's as talented as them?
01:49:28
Speaker
I guess. Because he would kind of, there were a few situations where they were trying to make it clear to us that he could speak other languages very easily. And he had no idea. He was just like, how come you guys can't speak Spanish?
01:49:43
Speaker
Yeah. And i yeah, I mean, also, I think there's something to be said about like, this is pre-internet. So like, how often is he just randomly encountering people?
01:49:54
Speaker
That's things in other languages too. um The occasional person in his, you know, that he, like the occasional, I don't know, like, also in Westchester, upstate New York. I don't know. I don't know what the, but Warlock, meanwhile, has found the danger room and is trying to feed off of the bountiful energy it provides.
01:50:13
Speaker
Doug gets to work using the danger room's advanced holographics to establish some visual language with Warlock. And Warlock takes the controls from there, explaining his whole deal through moving pictures.
01:50:25
Speaker
Warlock explains his world has evolved into a synthesis of man and machine. this They reproduce asexually and every child must face off against his older self, his, quote, father in a battle to the death.
01:50:38
Speaker
Weird. warlock chose not to fight and has' been fleeing from planet to planet looking for sanctuary from his father or allies in the battle against him doug starts using patterns of light and sound to further establish a language link but warlock is dying no one can be sure if he's telling the truth but raine can't stand to see him suffer and chooses to trust him she grabs his outragered hand and does not start to turn into technogans herself Instead, Warlock transforms his hand into a plug and Rain plugs it into the socket in the wall.
01:51:12
Speaker
He springs to life and he can speak English. Kinda. Kinda. Kinda. Xavier returns to the school to find an absolute mess from the slumber party that no one bothered to clean up. Then he finds a hole in the wall and battle damage that no one also bothered to clean up.
01:51:30
Speaker
The new mutants introduce him to Warlock and request that he and Doug both be admitted to the team. x Xavier agrees. The beginning. The beginning. Did you cry, Pat?
01:51:42
Speaker
No, not this time. Okay. You know... This is like the fifth time and they've that Claremont has pulled beginning. The beginning. Wow.
01:51:53
Speaker
I love this. issue issue What did you guys think? It's so fun. It's so fun. Yeah, yeah. It has room to breathe. and Exactly. I've only had Warlock for three issues, but if anything were to happen to him, i would kill everybody in this room. No.
01:52:13
Speaker
ah I yeah I mean I'm in the same camp not as gripping like not as spine tingling but I needed a break from that here yes um this is like just the right level of silly and satisfying I think yes and warlocks here now I'm so happy the warlocks here what a sweetie you guys want to do a fun one you got one more to go through holy shit do a silly one And this is the most exhausting of them.
01:52:46
Speaker
yeah Yeah. This one. This might go quicker because we're not going to have interludes where we wax poetic about. Yes. yeah Although we do have a return of ah Bob McCloud here, the original.
01:53:01
Speaker
New Mutants artist. This is going to be new Mutants annual number one, the Cosmic Cannonball Caper. Oof. OK. The Cosmic Cannonball Caper.
01:53:15
Speaker
Yeah, Chris Claremont and Bob McCloud, writer, co-creators, and artist, respectively. McLeod and Palmer, inkers. McCloud, letterer. Sharon, colorist. And the Senti editor. And Jim Dump, editor-in-chief.
01:53:29
Speaker
Release date, October 2nd, 1984. Cover date, November 1984. In the Danger Room, Sam Guthrie is blasting into that big strength press to gauge the power of his blast. When Xavier orders Danny to summon his worst fear, just that big industrial press they have in the day. Yeah, they used it to to gauge Colossus's strength.
01:53:52
Speaker
Now they're doing it to Sam. i x Xavier orders Danny to summon his worst fear uprood from his mind. He gets distracted and falls, failing a Xavier's test and feeling miserable about himself.
01:54:06
Speaker
Interesting. We've seen his worst fear before, and it was a collapsing coal mine. But now his worst fear is the brood. Yeah. Because that shit's scary, even if you just heard about it. Scary, scary as hell.
01:54:20
Speaker
Another thing that I don't really know anything about. But in doing my research and homework for this, ah the whole brood stuff It's scary. It's just kind of kind of wild. Yeah. Technically, they were formed by the brood, right? Yeah. yeah ah And technically,
01:54:46
Speaker
ah ah what death are we on with Xavier? ah i Two. Yeah, he's had two. This is third Xavier. Okay. Okay.
01:55:00
Speaker
ah We cut to a big green cat monster tearing a poster of Lila Shady and the fence behind it with his big claws. What an insane interlude. This...
01:55:13
Speaker
This makes this comic feel decades older than it actually. Right. We've been reading all this This looks like it's from the fifty s Yeah, we've been reading all this this this really interesting personal interpersonal and like deep storytelling stuff, and then suddenly a big cat alien monster's just like stomping around the city. Tearing down posters. I hate this poster.
01:55:45
Speaker
I hate rock music. Back at the mansion, Danny Moonstar undergoes physical therapy with Stevie Hunter. Recovery is slow and she's frustrated and feels miserable about herself. Well, luckily, Roberto bursts in with eight tickets to Lila Shaney's final concert.
01:56:05
Speaker
Cut to the Starlight Ballroom in Manhattan where the new mutants, including du Doug Ramsey and a disguised warlock, have access, have exclusive access to watch Lila Shady's band during soundcheck. Warlock's just like some guy.
01:56:21
Speaker
he looks like West. allan west Or something. he looks He looks like he's their father. Yes. It's like, why is this why is this old guy just hanging out with all these kids? They they have an exclusive access to watch Lila Shaney's band during soundcheck. The gang stare enamored at the music and the band until a loose sound rig snaps and the amps begin to topple over.
01:56:49
Speaker
Sunspot and Warlock power up and race into action, racing to hold the speakers up, and they succeed, except for the topmost speaker. Cannonball blasts into Lila, knocking her out of the way just in time with a, sorry about this, ma'am. Very Sam. Oh, I do need to, I need, I do need to circle back. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. um Sam and Rainn.
01:57:13
Speaker
Are there any others? No, I think it's just them. the The written accents are very funny. really Yeah, yeah, yeah. They do it really well with Rogue in the main X-Men comics, too. Oh, well, yeah. that That would track.
01:57:29
Speaker
It's ridiculous. It's very ridiculous. It's so silly. Let me... Can I take a moment here to i address the way that Chris Claremont just says they arrive at the concert.
01:57:45
Speaker
Sure, sure. Yeah. He says, and so on the appointed day at the appointed time, the faithful converge on the Starlight Ballroom in Lower Manhattan to hear the last installment of Lila's triumphant world tour, which is packed houses from London to Tokyo and back again. This is a guy who's never been to a rock concert. Yeah.
01:58:08
Speaker
I also love that, like, they're commenting on how the crowd is dressed. Oh, yeah. And it's just like, that dude has a mohawk. yeah Yeah. One of them's wearing a scraped shirt. Yeah, it's This is the 2026 talking, looking back at this. but Yeah, yeah. There's a man. bit more tolerance for.
01:58:32
Speaker
There's a man in front of them in a business suit with glasses and just like neck length brown hair. And they're like, oh everyone here looks so crazy.
01:58:45
Speaker
uh lila thankful to sam for saving her life gives him a big kiss on the mouth and invites the whole gang back to her place after the gig for a big party how old is she big uh the 1975 energy here how old is how old is lila shaney unclear okay all right sam is 16.
01:59:09
Speaker
Great. Everyone is 16. Yeah. ah yeah Yeah. Although I guess they are all teenagers. Yeah. That's the the whole gimmick. You you kind of have to distance that from some of this as you read through. It was a different time. Exactly.
01:59:27
Speaker
i Everyone is stoked to go to Lila's party, except Warlock, who notices that the snapped chain was no accident. Someone was trying to murder Lila. Following Reigns, Wolf knows all of the gang except Doug and Danny climb up to the rafters of the theater looking for the culprit.
01:59:45
Speaker
As the concert starts, they find the green cat monster. He's vrakkonen. du And he keeps the absolute... A vrakkonen. You were like, he's I didn't know this was a vrakkonen and I was like, you dummy.
02:00:01
Speaker
Can't I just keep calling him green cat monster? He kicks the absolute shit out of the new mutants one after another. But just as he's taking the aim at Lila with his ray gun or whatever, Sam slams into him, catching Lila's attention. She plays a particularly loud guitar riff from the stage that causes the cat guy to shriek in pain and warlock as well.
02:00:26
Speaker
Catman's armor explodes and he falls from the rafters in a ball of flame, almost bringing Sam down with him. As Lila and her band continue to play, they start to glow brighter and brighter, Sam dangling overhead, Warlock beginning to discorporate.
02:00:41
Speaker
Suddenly, there's a flash and the entire band disappears, taking Sam with them.
02:00:49
Speaker
In the confusion, the mutants gather around Warlock, who's storing so much energy, he's about to burst and take the planet with him. Did not know this was a liability of his. Yeah.
02:01:01
Speaker
Also, anyway how did he absorb that much energy that was generated on the planet in front of them right before them. my like but oh Yeah, you're right. I absolutely started skimming at this point. Sure. I unfortunately have to admit that. Yeah, no. i Apparently...
02:01:25
Speaker
The energy came from Lila herself, activating a stargate and teleporting across the universe. Danny asks if Warlock can use the energy to replicate the stargate. She needs to chase Lila and gets him back.
02:01:37
Speaker
So just as Lila did, Warlock glows super bright until the new mutants suddenly disappear. She's like, well, can you just create a stargate that teleports us across universe?
02:01:49
Speaker
the universe and Warlock's like yeah yes like sure i but instead of ending up wherever Lila and the band and Sam went to the new mutants find themselves floating in the vacuum of space Meanwhile, Sam and the band pop into a majestic palace on an alien world.
02:02:11
Speaker
When Lila shows the massive abandoned city beyond to Sam, she finds that she doesn't need to explain that they're in a Dyson sphere. Sam already knows what that is from all of the Larry Niven he reads. Oh, my God. Loves Larry Niven. In the last episode, he was like, oh, I read a lot of Robert Heinlein. And he's like, oh I read so much Larry Niven.
02:02:35
Speaker
freaking dork this guy gee okay can one of you explain what a dyson sphere is uh it's like a fake world it is you didn't catch this while you were skimming steve it's i was like i've heard this term before and i know i recognize it from somewhere but i fucking forget oh it's all that larry niven you read Yeah. it's ah It's like a sphere in space protecting the environment underneath it so that it's habitable. It's a fake planet.
02:03:07
Speaker
Okay. Simple idea here. But one large enough that a um that the star of that system can fit inside. So it has to be like millions and millions and miles across.
02:03:20
Speaker
Right.
02:03:23
Speaker
Lila nibbles Sam's ear and sends him off to get changed while she has an ominous conversation with another green alien gremlin about what's really going on. She's got a bounty on her head because of some upcoming auction where she plans on stealing and auctioning off the earth.
02:03:43
Speaker
Meanwhile, meanwhile, the new mutants wake up in a spaceship that is Warlock. He's a spaceship now. And he can't get them home, but he can get them to Lila Shaney. So Danny orders him to get moving.
02:03:56
Speaker
Back in the Dyson sphere, Lila is getting down to the business of boning Sam, who is now sporting basically Glenn Danzig costume. And while they're getting down, her drummer is making shady deals with the alien gremlin guys, the Vrakkonen. The Vrakkonen.
02:04:16
Speaker
His drummer looks like a ah redheaded pervert Iggy Pop. Oh, my God, he does. The new mutants make it to the Dyson Sphere and start exploring the city, looking for Lila and Sam when more Vrakkonen attack.
02:04:33
Speaker
Not for Vrakkonen! They fight but get their asses beat and Warlock, Wolfsbane, and Dany get captured. Sunspot, who stole one of the alien's sky sleds, seemingly crashed to the ground and is presumed dead.
02:04:47
Speaker
At least that's what they're told when they're brought to Lyla's palace in shackles and tossed in front of the Vrakkonen's other prisoners, Sam and Lyla. They watch helpless as the drummer who betrayed Lila is evaporated in front of them.
02:05:00
Speaker
And the leader is about to teleport the earth to the Dyson sphere and sell every earthling into slavery. Oh boy. stakes The stakes are high. The stakes are.
02:05:14
Speaker
God damn it. This is like the plot of a fantastic four comic from 1962. Yeah. Yeah, like what this clearly happens after the demon bear saga. Yeah, yeah. yeah What are we doing?
02:05:36
Speaker
Oh, but just before he can throw the switch, the palace itself begins to shake apart. You guessed it. Magma is here along with Ileana who uses her soul sword to trick a cat person into thinking he's been stabbed while Doug tackles them from behind. Doug.
02:05:54
Speaker
Doug did Doug. Yay. This was the stupidest fight scene to try and recap. It was like, oh, she swings her sword, but he knows it, but it doesn't, it doesn't,
02:06:06
Speaker
It just scares him. just So she grabs his gun. him what they They're just killing these guards too. yeah There is no regard for life. yet It's like, it's like, um ah Chris and Bob also want to be done with the comic. And they're like, don't know they fucking shoot him. I don't know. Whatever.
02:06:23
Speaker
They free their teammates who join the fight until finally Sunspot arrives. He's okay and finishes it. Yay. You're not out of trouble yet, though. Oh, the damage Amara did to the palace fucked up the earth stealing device. And now it's going to blow up the earth instead. Yeah.
02:06:43
Speaker
As it begins to activate, the room begins to glow. Lila admits she has no idea how to turn it off. But Doug finds some writing on the wall with instructions. He's got just seconds to decipher it and save the world, which, of course, he does. yay Everything's back to normal, except that now they're stuck on an alien world with a woman who tried to kidnap it. She apologizes, explaining she's a master thief and sealing a planet would have proven she's the best at what she does. But since they saved her life, she'll leave it alone. She's good now.
02:07:13
Speaker
Plus, she's a mutant and can easily teleport them all back home. Problem solved.
02:07:23
Speaker
Her bathing suit is getting smaller by the page here. Especially as we get towards the end, it is just shrinking all around. It does feel like Bob McCloud is like, how much smaller can I get away with?
02:07:37
Speaker
Everybody pops back to Earth only in London, just outside of Lila's townhome. sam so She just says, sorry, yeah you're on your own from here. Good luck getting back. How the fuck are they going to get home? USA. Also, she's a rich fucking pop star. She's a rock star. yeah She can do it. She can get them home.
02:07:59
Speaker
Sam is upset with Lila. How could she possibly sell the entire Earth? Seemed only fair, she says. Earth sold me. But she doesn't explain what that means. Because Chris Claremont doesn't even know what the fuck that means. They just get all romantic with each other and make out some more. Meanwhile, the new mutants call Professor X for a ride home.
02:08:19
Speaker
And Roberto is upset that Lila likes Sam over her. The end. Whoa. Great. this is so What a mess. Had such a good with such a good fucking arc. And then all of a sudden we have to read this. We have to go to the circus. ah ah Yeah, i I didn't like i didn't like that one i Yeah, i hope I hope that I hope this doesn't offend. This really cemented for me the idea that Bill Sienkiewicz's art is almost forcing Chris Claremont to be like a little more weird and a little more solemn about it than.
02:09:04
Speaker
Like when Bob McCloud comes in and they write they fight a rock star in space for the fate of every human on Earth. Overall, though, I got to say this was a blast. This is as refreshing as it was when we first got the new mutants, when they were first introduced. Just like, my God, this is something new and we we really needed it.
02:09:29
Speaker
i I agree. Yeah, I think they the demon bear saga is just something really special. And so is the sleepover issue. And it makes me want to know more.
02:09:40
Speaker
Yeah. About what what are they going? What's what? Where's this going? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I might genuinely, like, keep reading. Yeah, yeah. We'll let you know when it ah gets bad again. Thank you, yeah. so you know exactly when to stop. Well, hold on. I'll tell you guys. It gets bad right away, but then it gets good again, so don't worry.
02:10:06
Speaker
the next Okay. the next The next arc is, like, the cloak and dagger, like, the sort of... Reconciling the cloak and dagger stuff.
02:10:18
Speaker
But still listen, please. No, yeah, it's it's still Bill Sienkiewicz and Chris Claremont, so it's going to be interesting. It's just like that... um It's Chris Claremont kind of shaking off the last little bit of his his previous inclinations before getting into more of this Demon Bear style storytelling. Nice. got nih out by up time machine
02:10:53
Speaker
Oh, boy, Matt, let me ask you something. Sure. do you like video games? Are you freaking kidding me? i love the damn things.
02:11:03
Speaker
Have you ever heard of these guys, the Mario Brothers? Yeah. You're telling me they're two brothers named Mario. Yeah. want swo Well, well we're it depends on what you mean. i This guy, matt you know what, Pat? I'm looking at this ad here, and this guy looks less like a guy named Mario and more like Jumpman from ah the king the the Donkey Kong video game.
02:11:31
Speaker
Oh, Matt, the rookie mistake. oh This is not Jumpman from Donkey Kong. This is Mario and his brother Luigi, who it seems like.
02:11:43
Speaker
So the plot that this is describing now, this is ah Mario Bros for Atari. This is not the n NES game that we know. This is ah one like, what do you call it a platformer where you're just on one screen.
02:12:01
Speaker
They're both platformers, but yeah, this is like a, this is like a dual. Yeah. It's like a picture joust. If you know the game joust, it's just one room where you're jumping between levels. You have to kill crabs and turtles. And it seems like Luigi has gotten stuck in one of the pipes.
02:12:18
Speaker
Well, I don't know why they're saying that. ah But yeah, with ah something's coming up the plumbing. Poor Luigi's in a bind. Killer turtles to get him. Giant crabs are right behind. Fighter flies. Holy cripes.
02:12:32
Speaker
They're all coming out the pipes. Now, Mario for Mario Bros for Atari. Have you guys ever played this game? and No, but I saw some YouTube footage. It looks awful.
02:12:45
Speaker
It's a lot of, okay, so you play it like against each other and you have to, you're kind of like running around. If you've ever played Super Smash Brothers, there's one level that's like based it. Yeah, i've I recognize this image from, it like as like a Smash level. Yeah, you if you go underneath the platforms and you jump upwards, it flips the turtles over and then you got to kick them. And it's like you're kind of competing for score. So yeah you have to get, I think, like three or four ahead of the other player before you win.
02:13:20
Speaker
um and in the middle is the big pow block that knocks everything over. Oh, right. That fucking POW block. um Yeah, I had this game for n NES as a kid. it's It was actually a lot of fun.
02:13:37
Speaker
You had this one? Yes. That's crazy. And I don't know... know there's a whole other one. had that one too. I actually don't know. Was this... Okay, so Mario first appears in Donkey Kong as Jumpman.
02:13:55
Speaker
Right. And then is this before... This is before... Super Mario Brothers, right? Yes, correct. Did they this? Well, yes, because it's Mario Bros. It's not Super Mario Bros. Yeah. This is they your the original. At this point, know that this was the same guy from Donkey Kong?
02:14:16
Speaker
No one on this call is going to be able but to answer that question. I just, I wonder. I would say the luigi here looks a whole lot more like... Jumpman. Jumpman than the Mario does.
02:14:30
Speaker
don't know. No price? No price on it? No, there's no price on this, but you already bought it, Matt. Oh,
02:14:47
Speaker
Pat, I'm sorry that Pat Steals and Deals ended so abruptly, but man, we're tired after that ah annual. Stephen. Hello.
02:14:59
Speaker
Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. This was a lot of fun. yeah it was so much fun to have you. Everyone can find you on your podcast, Batting Around.
02:15:12
Speaker
Batting Around. some In some places we couldn't get the G- ah So hold hold a moment. All of our links are on our link tree bat tin around.
02:15:27
Speaker
We couldn't get the G. Just Google batting around podcast. You'll find us. on yeah Yeah. You find you guys on blue sky too, right? Yeah, we've got a blue sky. That's where we post because, you know, my co-hosts are trans. I'm gay. We're not fucking with Twitter.
02:15:44
Speaker
Yeah. ah Yeah. So batting around at blue sky dot social for the podcast. If you need me, I'm at TGK dot blue sky dot social. Three letter handle.
02:16:01
Speaker
yeah i am a blue sky elder i needed to i needed an invite to get on there um but yeah uh if you want to listen to if if if you were intrigued by us discussing my podcast at the top of this show and you've made it all the way here ah check us out um I have these exact vibes over there, but instead of talking about um hijacking planet Earth in space, i talk about how my favorite baseball team is ruining my life.
02:16:47
Speaker
So if that is of interest to you, you ah yeah, that's that's really all I got. Awesome. Yeah. Can't recommend batting around enough. Please tune in, check out their Patreon.
02:17:01
Speaker
Really cool stuff. And that, that favorite ah baseball team is the Jacksonville jumbo shrimp. Everybody. a big jacksonville jumbo shrimp fad Well, everybody, thank you for being here. Thank you for listening. You can find us on Instagram at mutant menace pod. You can find our Patreon.
02:17:22
Speaker
At, uh, Patreon.com slash mutant menace pod. No, I don't think there's pod. No, sorry. Slash mutant menace. Slash mutant menace. Do you want to say it clean once? You can find our Patreon at patreon.com slash mutant menace. There we post our bonus episodes. We post a little early. We post for any podcast.
02:17:45
Speaker
all All benefits are for any amount of money. You can start as as low as $1.
02:17:53
Speaker
But if you will also want to follow us for $0, you'll get our ah reading lists. So you can keep up with us as we as we go. MutantMenacePod at gmail.com if you want to write into Pat's email corner.
02:18:07
Speaker
Also, just send us your name. well If you'd send us strictly your name, we'll read it at the top of the show. i huge thanks as always to Krils Wilson for the music and to Julia Selle for providing the voice of Trish Tilby so and with that I think we'll end the show the way we end every episode so Stephen do you want to do you want to give our trademark sign off that we give at the end of every episode sure can real cute tush let's see where he went
02:18:43
Speaker
That's right, folks. And as always, the bear's taint is summarily banished.
02:18:51
Speaker
And don't forget, eenie, meenie, chilly beanie.