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🚈 2.4 Million Rides Toward a Climate-Neutral Future - Cornelia Nussbaumer from Wiener Linien about Sustainability with a Mission
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Cornelia Nussbaumer is Head of Sustainability and Innovation at Wiener Linien, Vienna’s public transport operator. She’s driving the company’s transformation toward climate-friendly mobility, diversity, and future-ready urban solutions.
About the FutureStrategies podcast and your host:
I’m Florian Schleicher, a marketing strategist. I help brands gain clarity, spark momentum, and turn strategy into something that actually moves people. In 2022, I started my marketing studio FUTURESTRATEGIES. to do exactly that. I currently work with corporate clients from 11 countries.
If you want more, check out my FutureStrategies newsletter – weekly inspiration on marketing, strategy and sustainability.
And if something’s blocking your brand from doing its best work, let’s talk.
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Transcript
Introduction and Sustainability Focus
00:00:00
Speaker
What makes us proud is that we offer mobility for 2.4 million passengers a day. Welcome to the Future Strategies Podcast. My name is Florian Schleicher. I'm a marketing strategist focused on sustainability and I'm your host here. You can listen to my interviews with international experts and together we will explore where marketing strategies and sustainability intersect with great examples, insightful stories and a look behind the scenes of some amazing brands.
00:00:30
Speaker
If you're curious how to apply all of that for your own business, I do this for my clients from all around the world, but more on that at the end of this episode. Now, let's jump into today's interview.
Wiener Linien's Role in Climate Goals
00:00:44
Speaker
Cornelia Nussbaum is Head of Sustainability and Innovation at Wiener Linien, Vienna's public transport operator. She is driving the company's transformation toward climate-friendly mobility, diversity, and future-ready solutions.
00:01:00
Speaker
I'm really happy to have this conversation with you today, Cornelia. Thanks for inviting me. So I'm super curious. You are the first head of sustainability at Wiener Linien.
00:01:13
Speaker
What does it mean for you to shape the climate agenda of such a visible urban brand? Well, yeah, I think sustainability must be seen ecological, social and economic.
00:01:26
Speaker
But at the moment, a strong focus is on decommunization. And for me, it's all about achieving the climate goals of the city of Vienna and the contribution of InnoLinion to this gold And I really strongly believe that sustainability is within the DNA of Wiener Linien.
00:01:47
Speaker
And we contribute to the high quality of life with our effective and affordable transport system. you You mentioned, and I just want to circle back to that, that you also contribute to the climate goals of the city of Vienna.
00:02:02
Speaker
Can you just, for our listeners who are maybe international and don't know what the climate goals of the city of Vienna are, just briefly elaborate what the goals there are? There is one major goal in the smart climate city strategy of Vienna.
00:02:18
Speaker
And this goal is to make Vienna climate neutral until 2040, which is quite challenging goal. I can imagine. And Wiener Linien, the company you work for, you have already achieved many of the quick wins.
00:02:31
Speaker
on that path to climate neutrality. Are there any particular milestones that you are personally also very proud of? And could you maybe go a little bit into what made them possible?
00:02:44
Speaker
Yeah, for quick wins, I think it is really that, for example, you can use our network 24-7. That's the quick win for our customers. And the model split of Vienna shows really a high rate for public transport, which other cities don't have in this amount.
00:03:03
Speaker
And I really say e-mobility started a long time ago, on and we have now more than 40 years of metro in Vienna. 80% of all vehicles are electric so far.
00:03:17
Speaker
I think that's very good news for the climate. And in general, there are no quick winds with heavy infrastructure. It takes a long-term planning to expand our network and offer our customers everyday mobility with a high-quality environment.
00:03:33
Speaker
As you mentioned, so quick wins are also coming with an investment. But what I see when I work with companies and they start the journey of sustainability, and then those quick wins, they are done.
00:03:46
Speaker
and then the path usually gets tougher. So I would be curious, what are sort of like the biggest remaining challenges on this way to really become a driving force for fighting climate change?
00:04:00
Speaker
What are those current challenges that you face?
Challenges in Sustainable Mobility
00:04:03
Speaker
Well, Vienna is a growing city and we have to ensure that public transport grows with the city.
00:04:10
Speaker
So to be honest, of course, we have significant CO2 emissions during the construction phase. That's something not so easy to tackle. You are currently constructing a new metro line in Vienna. Yes. And as well, if you speak about the new metro line, this is of course not cheap to build and it's always difficult to finance our extensive network and maintain the network.
00:04:35
Speaker
So we try to get subsidies whenever possible. It is as well not always easy ah to ensure sustainable travel for their own employees. If you imagine you are the first bus driver to take the bus at four o'clock in the morning, who will bring you there when not your private car? So not everything is solved now, but we have a new project where we plan shuttle services for our employees as well.
00:05:03
Speaker
But then again, the question is who drives those shuttles, isn't it? Yeah, in future, maybe autonomous vehicles, that would be perfect, but we are not yet there.
00:05:13
Speaker
have Have you ever personally driven with an autonomous vehicle? Not yet. But would you be open to doing it? For sure. Because I was in the summer this year, I was in San Francisco and and Los Angeles, and there are so many autonomous vehicles driving around, like many robo-taxis.
00:05:32
Speaker
And then I also drove with one of these robo taxis and it was really a a completely new experience. I felt so safe also in them. It was very driving very slowly and smoothly and not accelerating at any point.
00:05:46
Speaker
And it was just a very, very smooth ride. And then I asked my followers on Instagram also, so who would be open to driving in a robo car? And I think like 80% were yes, of course, immediately, but 20% were like, no, never.
00:06:02
Speaker
and So I think there is also still some psychological overcoming to be done for that. Yeah, that's not only one of the open questions for this technology. So I'm very much looking forward to this. yeah So I was thinking about this and public transportation in Vienna is isn't just infrastructure, but it's also kind of part of the identity. As you mentioned, like we can all ride the transportation here in Vienna, basically 24-7. And I would be curious, how do you see your company's Wiener Linien role in
00:06:36
Speaker
making Vienna one of the most climate-friendly capitals in Europe. but We are, of course, being Vienna already very high, but still there is room to grow. and And how do you see your role there?
00:06:48
Speaker
yeah We are very visible in the city, as we spoke before. our buildings and our infrastructure and on signs and so on. We are very visible and you can really seamlessly transfer from trams to buses to the metro to bicycle, whatever you need.
00:07:05
Speaker
And we are so-called love brand. and We are very proud of that. And for me, it's also important to look on these small things as well, yeah to keep the surrounding of our stations clean.
00:07:19
Speaker
to use green tracks whenever possible for our drum network, to have tree-friendly construction and try to save as many trees as possible. ah think that's that's all a part that is really important.
00:07:35
Speaker
when we operate Vienna. And you just mentioned that Wiener Linien is already a love brand. Many people are quite fond of it. Similar as people also like Berlin public transportation system.
00:07:47
Speaker
Why do you think people like Wiener Linien so much? Yeah, I think we use always a good sense of Wiennese humor in our advertising. And I think as well as Berlin, I love it.
00:08:01
Speaker
I think that's a very important factor. To also use self-humor when maybe there are some delays. Yes. And just for our international listeners also, for me, one of the feelings of coming home to Vienna is always you go to a metro station or a tram station or a bus station and you are annoyed when you have a waiting time that is longer than five minutes.
00:08:24
Speaker
And everywhere else, like... seven, eight, 10 minutes is fine. But here in Vienna, we are so used to like immediate transportation connection everywhere.
00:08:35
Speaker
So I feel like that's also probably a big part of why people love it so much is that it's very reliable on most lines and that the intervals are very short. Yeah, that's something you get really used to, but you notice it when you travel in other cities and when you have to wait 30 minutes or more for a bus, you say, maybe I miss Vienna now.
Investment and Urgency in Climate Action
00:08:56
Speaker
Yeah. Before, when we were talking, you were also mentioning the new metro line that is probably one of the biggest infrastructure project in Austria. I would be curious where it ranks there.
00:09:08
Speaker
How do you balance such long-term investments with the urgency of climate action where we basically need to something now? Yeah, in general, it's it's always important to raise awareness for sustainable mobility.
00:09:24
Speaker
And we do this construction sites to enable future mobility. And as well, our infrastructure is very durable. So our metro network is now 40 years old and we use our vehicles as long as we can, which is sustainable, of course.
00:09:40
Speaker
And for the short-term investments, we have 3,000 sharing bikes now. sharing bikes now That's something that's a bit quicker than building a new metro line, of course.
00:09:52
Speaker
And we try to save CO2 emissions during our construction phases as well, as far as possible. For example, when we transport construction waste, there are also ways to save emissions. And yeah, as I said, you can't avoid the construction sites there's your network has to grow for a growing city.
00:10:12
Speaker
Yeah. And probably that's like, you have to factor it in. I remember in our pre-conversation, you also mentioned that of course now CO2 emissions are higher because you have the construction,
00:10:24
Speaker
but then they will get lower on a total level because then people can use the new but metro line. So definitely is a good investment. And as I always also tell my clients, like any form of change requires an investment.
00:10:38
Speaker
like Now, so many companies are investing into AI because they feel like there is a potential there for growth. And I think it's the same for sustainability that we need to invest into future growth.
00:10:51
Speaker
into future livability a place and constructing a new metro that will improve the mobility and the livability of the city definitely.
00:11:01
Speaker
That's true. It would not work without investment. Yeah. Is it hard internally to constantly remind people that sustainability is something that needs to factor in?
00:11:14
Speaker
Because I can imagine that's also part of your role then to constantly remind people, hey, we also need to think about sustainability. Is that something that is already deeply ingrained in every employee's mind on every level?
00:11:26
Speaker
Or do you feel like there is still a discussion that comes up again and again? I think sustainability is in constant discussion and you always have to balance it with safety issues. You have to balance it with budget constraints.
00:11:42
Speaker
So i think it's in every company I know it's a constant discussion. And of course, we we know the goals of the city of Vienna and we've work towards that.
00:11:54
Speaker
It's important to have a clear vision, to have clear goals. And as well, our arguments are that every euro you invest in public transport comes back in a multiple benefit for the macroeconomic level.
00:12:10
Speaker
So it's really important. And what makes us proud is that we offer mobility for 2.4 million passengers a day. And I think we are quite successful with that because currently Vienna has more annual pass holders than registered cars. Wow.
00:12:30
Speaker
So what you say is because you have a goal and a vision, it's easier, not easy, to get people on board then. Yeah, I think if the the management clearly communicates and as well the management of Wiener Stadtwerke, which we are part of,
00:12:46
Speaker
That motivates us to go further and to keep our passengers at the core of all of our efforts. And we really do this for the city, for the climate and for our future.
00:12:58
Speaker
That should be a tagline, that last thing that you said. I love that. If we now take a a very futuristic point of view and we look 10 years into the future,
00:13:10
Speaker
What would you like the citizens, the population of Vienna to feel and to say about your companies, about Wiener Linien's role in climate protection?
Future Vision for Urban Mobility
00:13:22
Speaker
Yeah, know I would love to hear from everybody in Vienna that no one needs a private-owned car. That they can really rely on our services and our network. And what would be cool as well, if people search for green jobs or chocolate sin, as we call it.
00:13:40
Speaker
but A lot of young, talented people still want to work at Wiener Linien. like my team. And in the end, it's it's really important that Vienna has still this high quality of life.
00:13:55
Speaker
So it would be really great if they say Vienna is still ah one of the cities in the world with the highest quality of life and then how Wiener Linien contributes to that. I'm curious if we are able to win that title back. I think Copenhagen has it currently.
00:14:09
Speaker
And one of my best friends, he he lives and works in Copenhagen. And you can't imagine the number of times that he has reminded me since we lost that title that I should again now move to the most livable city, which is currently Copenhagen.
00:14:23
Speaker
That's funny because I lived in Copenhagen during my students' time. And yeah what I can really say is that Copenhagen is much better in ways of biking than Vienna is. And we are catching up.
00:14:37
Speaker
But I think the the share of bikers in Copenhagen bike riding is far higher than in Vienna. And for public transport, it it was okay. But for me, it was just, it's much more expensive than we are used to in Vienna.
00:14:52
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. Cornelia, do you have any questions for me? Yeah, I would be interested. What is your personal strategy for a climate neutral future? so That's a good one.
00:15:05
Speaker
So this is also a question that I get often when I teach at universities about sustainability and and marketing and communications. They are very curious, okay, so what are you doing actually?
00:15:16
Speaker
And I think the the important thing is that each of us has to figure out individually Where is it that you can have the biggest impact? So I try to, of course, buy my clothes sustainable. I try to eat a lot of organic food whenever I buy something.
00:15:32
Speaker
I try to think wherever I can, okay, what's the more sustainable option here? But still, i'm some I sometimes have to drive a car. I'm renting a car then.
00:15:43
Speaker
and don't own one. I eat a lot of meat. I also eat fish. I travel to faraway places by plane. So I'm in no means perfect. But I think what my biggest impact can be is to one, give companies that are actually doing good a voice, which is something that I try to do with this podcast, because then I can amplify my own voice.
00:16:09
Speaker
And two, to help companies in this transition, because from working at Greenpeace or Too good To Go, I know how the sustainable audiences, what they want and what they need and how they feel and think about stuff.
00:16:24
Speaker
So helping companies to make that transition, that's number two. And number three is the teaching part. Being at university, leading courses on green brand management or sustainable communications or whatsoever, and passing on that knowledge. Because my individual impact, like the food I eat or or the way I travel is a small part, but amplifying this message to companies, to universities, and to listeners. Like with this podcast, I think that's honestly the biggest impact that I can have.
00:16:52
Speaker
And another thing that I started right when I started my own company three and a half years ago is every year I donate 1% of my annual revenue to good initiatives. So I'm part of this alliance called 1% for the Planet.
00:17:08
Speaker
And it always is a little bit tough when I see the amount of money that I now have to donate because I set this as a principle for myself because nobody likes to give away money.
00:17:19
Speaker
But I feel like I also as an entrepreneur have a responsibility and I'm fortunate enough that also can afford this. So I would say that is my contribution.
00:17:30
Speaker
That sounds great. Keep going. I'll try my best. Yes. So let's move on to the final three questions. This already been a lot of fun. What is good marketing or good communications for you in three words?
Marketing Strategies and Recommendations
00:17:47
Speaker
I'm not sure if I manage in three words, but first of all, it has to be authentic, needs to be emotional and yeah, with a sense of humor.
00:17:58
Speaker
Also very, very fitting off of your brand's communication. For sure. Second question, what is the future of marketing? Yeah, I see AI as an important driver.
00:18:09
Speaker
And when we look at our trend management, then it's really individualization and automatic campaigns, macro trends that we we keep seeing.
00:18:23
Speaker
ah you What is your favorite use case of AI where you use it yourself? Yeah, when you prepare LinkedIn posts or so, then it's of course very easy to use little help of JGPD.
00:18:38
Speaker
But I think most people don't like to talk about it, how much they use JGPD for their posts. There's an interesting study that actually, like I think almost half of consumers actually have a very good nose on identifying what has been written or created with AI.
00:18:57
Speaker
And the study also then came to the conclusion that 20% those who spot in AI posting, then have less trust in the brand, which is very interesting. And and we see this again and again in in in studies coming up that people trust people the most. And when they realize this is not a person that has written or created something or not the brand that is really doing that, which is also people in the end, that it impacts, that that it can impact the performance. so No, I would always use my own words.
00:19:32
Speaker
in the end and to make it personal. yeah That helps a lot to reach people. yeah Final question. Are you ready? Yes. What is a book that you would like to recommend here?
00:19:45
Speaker
yeah The last really interesting book was 21 Lessons for the 21st Century from Yuval Harari. That's, I think, a recommendation for every innovation, sustainability manager, you name it.
00:19:59
Speaker
I think For everyone. Yeah, it's it's a very good book. I can second that and also recommend it very much. I've read it a couple of years ago and it was really a good one. Cornelia, thank you so much for coming on the show, for speaking with me. i ah know you probably have a very busy schedule. So thank you for taking the time and speaking with me.
00:20:18
Speaker
Thank you for having me. See you soon. See you. And that's it for today. Thank you so much for listening. If you've enjoyed this episode, please forward it to a friend or a colleague.
00:20:30
Speaker
This would mean the world to me as I pour my heart and a lot of energy into producing this podcast with all the brilliant minds that share their perspective here. And if you know the value that a great marketing strategy brings to really connect with your target audience, give me a call or send me a message.
00:20:48
Speaker
I'd love to get to know you and your projects. You can find me on LinkedIn, Instagram, or through my newsletter, where I write in-depth thought pieces that help you build a successful and exciting marketing strategy.
00:21:02
Speaker
Again, thank you so much for listening. I really look forward to sharing more with you in the future.