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I Had To Die - Twice
53 Plays6 months ago
This week on Spoiler Alert: It's Different Now, we’re getting theological with the cult classic, Constantine. I'm joined by my friend V to talk about the movie’s biggest themes—life, death, and the supernatural afterlife. We’ll break down Keanu Reeves’s cynical-but-charming demon hunter and get into some serious, and seriously funny, conversations about fate, free will, and the cosmic forces at play. Ultimately, we find that even in a world of angels and demons, the real struggle is simply finding balance.
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Transcript
Introduction and Disclaimer
00:00:06
Speaker
This show is not suitable for all audiences. Listener discretion is advised.
Podcast Concept and Host Introduction
00:00:17
Speaker
Buenos dias mi gente! Welcome to Spoiler Alert, it's Different Now, the podcast where we lovingly ruin our childhoods by rewatching movies that definitely should have come with a warning later. I'm your host, Joel Rojas, and each episode, a friend drops by to laugh, cringe, and spiral with me through the cinematic relics of our youth.
00:00:35
Speaker
because nostalgia is fun. Until you really pay attention.
00:00:41
Speaker
Rated R for reflection.
Introduction of V and Movie Selection
00:00:52
Speaker
Welcome back to another episode of Spoiler Alert is Different Now. Joining us here today all the way from California is my best friend of 15 years. We are here to discuss one of her childhood favorites.
00:01:06
Speaker
A lot of you may know her by many different names and she's worn many different hats and has served many different roles in many different people's lives. But for me, i call her V. Thank you Last night, we had the chance to watch one of V's childhood favorites.
00:01:21
Speaker
And so I wanted her to take the first chance on this podcast today to talk about why she picked this movie and why it was so impactful for her as a child. And we'll jump into a little bit more of what that meant for me as a new viewer yesterday and and the impact as an adult.
V's Personal Connection to 'Constantine'
00:01:36
Speaker
V? right, so the movie that we decided to watch yesterday was called Constantine. This came out in 2005. Keanu Reeves is the male lead in the movie. Essentially, it's about a guy is keeping the balance between heaven and hell. so And he's also going through a lot of self-loathing, trying to buy his way back into heaven. it's that i don't want to spoil too much, but it's a great watch. It's Keanu, baby.
00:02:06
Speaker
Amen.
00:02:09
Speaker
I love when people say that they don't want to spoil it. Like, it's not spoil it. know, I know, I know. It's just so, don't even know explain it. It's just so good because the, you know, the theme of the movie, obviously, I didn't understand that growing up.
00:02:21
Speaker
I just knew was like piggybacking off of The Matrix and shit like that. That was just one of my favorite. At the time, he was one of my favorite actors. You know what I mean? So, when my dad rented the movie, we saw the trailers and shit, obviously. But then when he rented the movie, i was like, okay, cool, I'm down. It's Keanu. I don't care. Right. You know?
00:02:39
Speaker
Not in a weird boy crush kind of way. Don't fucking know. I think everybody had a boy crush Keanu. You know what I'm saying? But Keanu, not for nothing, I like the way he acts. I know he's kind of, whatever, bland to a lot of people, but I like his movies. said john become young But um I was 14 when I first, I believe this was, this came out in 2005. I want to say late 2005, we finally watched it. And I was 14. So freshman going into high school.
00:03:09
Speaker
And this movie, it stuck with me because I grew up in a I guess, traumatic childhood, if people want to call it that. But alcoholism, you know, DV, all that stuff was happening in the house. So it was just, I will get into it, obviously, in this podcast. But a lot of the messages and things like that in the movie were hitting a little bit close
Initial Impressions and Religious Themes
00:03:31
Speaker
to home. I wasn't really essentially like watching it to watch a movie. It was just, I'm sorry, excuse me. I did watch it just to watch a movie. Right.
00:03:39
Speaker
what I got out of it at the end of it was a little bit more than just a fucking movie about, you know, angels and demons. You know what I mean? Do you remember your have first impressions watching it?
00:03:52
Speaker
I thought at the time, surface level stuff like, oh, this is cool. This is like, I was eating this up because like my dad, when he stopped like hitting us and he got to that point of not wanting, cause we're grown now. Jonathan's fucking a giant now. You can't put hands on these kids no more.
00:04:08
Speaker
he would punish us by making us read the Bible. And so he would just be like, okay, sit at the table, start reading Proverbs or, you know, see or start reading Psalms. Like, so like the long books of the Bible, like we would read. So in a sense, it was just like, okay, it was me more like battling my own religious beliefs because of that.
00:04:31
Speaker
You know what I mean? Like, I didn't care for,
00:04:35
Speaker
don't to didn't care for God or there anything like that, but it's hard to want to say, oh yeah, praise God, praise that, when you're getting punished with that. You know what I'm saying? There is no, you can't appreciate shit like that.
00:04:46
Speaker
You know what I mean? It just puts a bad taste in your mouth. So, I love Constantine because the way it was made, it wasn't a, it wasn't pushing you one side or the other. It was just giving you everything up front. You know what I'm saying? Like, but didn't it wasn't heavy on the believe in God, believe in God. You know what i mean? Or like, devil, will devil, devil. It was just, it was very neutral.
00:05:05
Speaker
And it kind of, the way guided the movie, it was like, make your own decision. You know what I mean? Like, but between John and Gabriel, having those conversations, it's tit for tat. You know what I mean?
00:05:17
Speaker
As you mentioned, right, religion was kind of used as a punishment. So, How did you make sense of heaven and hell or the binary that's created in in this movie? And even in religion, you know, something as ah strict as Catholicism, which is very, you know, black and white in terms of the storyline and what the expectations are that is carried by the religion. Like, what what was that impact in your life at that time?
00:05:43
Speaker
How did you make sense of that? i don't... That's a deep one. Sorry, if I swirly with you. No, no, it's okay. No, no, I did because I couldn't make sense of it. You know what I'm saying? I feel like, oh God, I feel like crying.
00:05:57
Speaker
I think for me, it was just like,
00:06:00
Speaker
you know, if God, all these books them in the Bible were like, oh, God's this, God's this, you know, you can be freed by believing in God and all this, you know, God loves you and things like that. But like I said, it was a traumatic childhood. So it's like, it's kind of like Constantine, like, oh, why is all this shit happening if God is supposed to intervene? You know what
Exploration of Religious Beliefs and Personal Impact
00:06:18
Speaker
i mean? Or if we're supposed to believe in him so much, like, why is all these things happening? So the lines were very blurred for me. And I was like, I couldn't understand one way or another.
00:06:26
Speaker
You know what I mean? I think that's why I love the movie so much because this is like, It's not telling me. You know, kids don't like being told shit. You know what I mean? So, like, my dad was telling me one thing, you know? And then on the other... It's like backhanded compliments.
00:06:39
Speaker
Don't tell me God's great and God's good then you got me at the kitchen table four hours reading these damn books and Psalms and Proverbs. I'm not having it. You know what I mean? So... and It was just, it was hard. That's not palatable to me. Like, it was hard to understand that.
00:06:52
Speaker
It's like the, you know, everybody uses the gaslighting now. You know, it's the term of the, you know, of these last five years or whatever. That's what it have felt like. To put a term, I guess, to what I was feeling back then. It was like being gaslighted almost.
00:07:05
Speaker
So it's like, you can't believe that.
00:07:09
Speaker
And then my brother, a little bit of a tangent, but my brother outed me as well, like in this process. And it was like...
00:07:17
Speaker
Now my life is really hell for real. And, you know, praying ain't helping this shit. Because, you know, as a child, you want something tangible to come save you. And there ain't nothing tangible but about religion, period.
00:07:28
Speaker
You know what I mean? so Yeah. It's strictly based on faith. Yeah. It's like how you have faith in a household like that. It's hard. You know? Yeah. Defeat. it I think...
00:07:44
Speaker
For me, right around the age of 13 as well is when I started to ask those questions. Not so much of why is what's going on at home happening, but more generalized in terms of what was happening in the world, right?
00:07:57
Speaker
I think at 13, 14, I'm... It's 2000, 2001-ish. So my mother used to have me go to church with my aunt, and we would go every Sunday to this big Catholic church, you know, in Providence, Rhode Island, and...
00:08:12
Speaker
it was It was all I knew, so I never questioned it. Then I started going to Sunday school to be able to do my first communion. And i remember sitting in class and reading the book and thinking to myself, but if God is...
00:08:28
Speaker
capable of all of this, then why are their kids suffering? Right? Why are there kids that are hungry? Why are there kids that are being beat? Why are there people that are sick? Why are wars and all these things happening? And the answer is free will. That's always the answer is, well, humans have free will. And unfortunately, some people are just handed certain destinies that lead them to illness or whatever. And it's just like, I couldn't buy it either. Right? I i just couldn't understand how that was a good God.
00:08:55
Speaker
Right. No, yeah. You know, so it's, I have a weird relationship with religion now too and I don't think it's necessarily based in you know, ah a personal tie to religion where I feel like it has flipped on its head.
00:09:09
Speaker
I just find it hard to believe there's inconsistency. Yeah, no, I feel it. Right? That's best way to put it. This movie dealt with a lot of, you know, dark, you know,
00:09:22
Speaker
topics, right? we We talk about suicide in there. There's damnation, which is being sent to hell and the afterlife. This is heavy stuff for teenagers to consume in 2005. I'm sure it's even heavier now in 2025.
00:09:38
Speaker
Do you remember that standing out to you in in terms of these being heavy topics yeah for the movie? Or did that was that later? You know, the there's lot of trigger warnings in the movie, you know, but i last night after, like, at the end scene, when John's trying to fucking off himself and stuff, I thought about the fact that this, movies now have trigger warnings, to you know, for anything sexual that happens, any suicide, anything that happens, and this movie just didn't have it, but it's, like, all over the movie. You know what I mean?
00:10:07
Speaker
oh I did think about Damnation only because My dad and the whole, you know, the
Family Dynamics and Personal Reflections on Faith
00:10:16
Speaker
Bible stuff. We read the Bible all the time. So, like, of course I knew that, you know, the suicide thing. I knew that.
00:10:21
Speaker
But I think it was, like, worse because my mom was, like, telling me I'm an abomination, this, that, and the third because I'm gay. You know what I mean? So I think that, like, at the time, thumb young like it was just, well, fuck.
00:10:35
Speaker
Because it kind of, it's not the same, but it's the same. A little, you know what I mean? i'm not committing suicide, but essentially it's, like, that's a little bit extreme to say that I am, but it's like, the all you know at that time because of your age, you know, you're you not developed all the way.
00:10:48
Speaker
It's like, damn. I'm sinning. Yeah. Like, real bad. And I don't have a family for real no more. Like, these people hate me type shit. You know what I mean? So, that for sure was little bit louder than everything else that was happening and all the other themes in the movie. oh But yeah, that shit was, I would lose sleep over that thinking about that because like I said, it was like, it was kind of in succession when it was happening. it was like,
00:11:13
Speaker
The gay thing, well, we watched the Constantine and then it was the gay thing and I was just like, damn, like that was ringing in my mind all the time. Like, I'm going to hell. There no way I'm winning this battle. You know what I mean? It didn't have to be the extreme of suicide. It was just like,
00:11:26
Speaker
you gay, period. Leviticus. Everybody throw Leviticus in the face, know what I mean? You already violated, you already did. Right, yeah. I think I've been jokingly saying that I have a seat to hell ever since I outed myself, you know, like in my teenage years. Like, I've been on this trip, like, I've been there. I got the ticket.
00:11:41
Speaker
I'm a life-term membership passenger whenever my times come. But at the same time, it makes you wonder, right, like, in what context did we hold hell? Right. Like, what what does that mean? And I've taken religion classes and I've taken, you know, different spirituality classes and sociology sociology classes that touch on the afterlife. Yeah.
00:12:03
Speaker
And, you know, if you look at Dante's Rings of Inferno. Yes. That really informs our imagery of what L is. Is that kind of, you know, torture and fire and inferno and, you know, rings of different layers of hell? Is that kind of what you pictured growing up? Or what did hell mean for you?
00:12:21
Speaker
and Yeah, because my dad, aside from all the dumb shit, we, he loved watching movies, right? So, and his thing was like, he loved watching anything horror, angel and demon, exorcism, things like that. So i already,
00:12:36
Speaker
already had a baseline for this stuff before watching Constantine because we would watch things like this. You know what I mean? And then, damn, when did Da Vinci Code come out? Damn. I don't remember when Da Vinci Code came out, but I know like at that time, Tambien, watching that shit, I was just mind blown.
00:12:51
Speaker
You know what I mean? um I'm looking it up in case you're wondering because we got time. We don't got to rush. Da Vinci Code came out 2006. Yeah, so like even after that, right? And watching things like that, I i already knew.
00:13:03
Speaker
And then there was shows growing up. We used to go to church at one point, but shit cut hairy in Florida with kids being kidnapped. And it i say all that, but like I'm prefacing the fact that why we didn't go to church because church at the time was weird.
00:13:17
Speaker
and it fit and And it was separate. My dad had separation anxiety with the kids. So, you know, when people come and take kids and put them in another room talking about we're Bible studying and you don't have eyes on them.
00:13:33
Speaker
That stuff would would make him go and insane. So he couldn't even sit there and listen to the word because he's thinking about what's going with my kids. Who's touching my kids? You know what i mean? Like the anxiety and paranoia of that stuff. So we stopped going to church. Like, which I never liked the beginning with would fall asleep. Me and my brothers fall asleep all the time.
00:13:49
Speaker
But it was on like, I guess him, he felt like it was on him, uh, to teach us. But, you know, parents teaching of the Bible is extreme, no matter how we look at it. You know what I mean? Because they want to scare you. It's like scaring you.
00:14:03
Speaker
Don't do the this because this is going happen. I'm always going to be right, you know? You know, and using the Bible is kind of like a ah weapon. Yeah, it's a weapon. It's their sword. Like, God's going to get you. you know I mean? You better pray before you go to sleep.
00:14:15
Speaker
You know what i mean? So I already knew about all that stuff since young. Like, this didn't really move the needle one way or another in the sense of beliefs about angels or beliefs about demons because that was already ingrained in a sense.
00:14:30
Speaker
You know what I mean? And I didn't mention this earlier, but we were we were a Christian household. we don't My grandmother was Catholic. And I think that's just like a, you know, Hispanic thing, colonizers, whatever.
00:14:41
Speaker
yeah but But we were Christians growing up.
00:14:47
Speaker
So in watching John's character, right, he's based on a comic. Are you familiar with that comic? I know. Okay, so me neither. we We don't have to i talk about it at all. But in and already having a basis for what,
00:15:02
Speaker
religion kind of is at this younger age. And, you know, at least knowing that there's a heaven and a hell and that there's certain things that exist such as sin and that you may be a sinner and that there's atrocities in the world that can be and should be stopped by a higher being that we just are not seeing being resolved. yeah So this is ah weird time to be um in life watching this movie. right Because for me, I feel like the first time I watched this movie was last night. Uh-huh.
00:15:32
Speaker
But for having your basic understanding at that time and watching John Constantine's character develop. Yeah. How does he give context for you for what it is to, you know, be able to redeem yourself?
00:15:46
Speaker
Right. Because think that was the climax of the movie where he has a chance to offer his soul. Yeah. For Angela's. Yeah. The detective that is also a part of the storyline. She.
00:15:58
Speaker
She is a catalyst right so this for the sequence of events that happens in this movie. be So in John moving in and out of what he knows for himself, which is I'm going to hell. He's well aware that that is his path. And so everything that he does is informed by this destiny. Yeah.
00:16:16
Speaker
What context did his journey provide for you in terms of understanding those concepts such as redemption and the afterlife at that time in your life? You know, at the time, I was thinking about, like, what my dad would have to do because of all the, like, fucked up shit that was going on and, like, that happened.
00:16:34
Speaker
It was just like, damn, I wonder what he would have to do to, like, get to that point, like, where he can go to heaven. You know what I mean? But then I...
Debate on Hell, Redemption, and Moral Questions
00:16:43
Speaker
Because at the time, like, I wasn't... I'm outgoing now. we's seeing people The people in our lives that know me are like that, but I wasn't like that growing up.
00:16:50
Speaker
You know what I mean? So I wasn't doing... I wasn't doing dumb shit in the sense of like, damn, how do I redeem myself from this? God, I've sinned today. I've done you what I'm saying? I wasn't like sexually active. I wasn't out here doing drugs. I wasn't doing, i wasn't sneaking out. Like I wasn't doing shit in the sense of like sinning.
00:17:07
Speaker
You know what I mean? So I would, a lot of, at that time when I was watching, I was comparing it to what was going on in my life. You know what I mean? And like, and in the sense of two evils or my father was,
00:17:22
Speaker
was a little bit more, he was more the 51 and 49 between him and my mother. You know what I mean? So for me, it was just like, damn, what do you have to do to get up there? don't want to see burning in hell.
00:17:35
Speaker
I don't want to have to think about like my dad passing and I know he's in hell. Cause like, but he was, me and him were like best friends. You know what and he Very much talking with syndrome, but it was just like, that's what I was thinking about at that time. Like, damn, dude,
00:17:49
Speaker
what are the things that you have to do? Why are you still doing this dumb shit? You know? And it's like, when I would go to school, I'm like, I need to act right. I need to get good grades. I need to, because I don't want to, um it sounds weird. It sounds crazy, but it's like, i don't want to go to hell.
00:18:01
Speaker
Right. You know i mean I don't want to have to repent for shit that I was doing in school or acting up in school. You know what I mean?
00:18:08
Speaker
i know I think there's there's something to be said that there's ah such thing as redemption. Yeah. Right? That you believe that if you could do good, that you would redeem yourself from a hell that you can't really contextualize. Because i've I've asked, like, what what is that? And I don't think we've gotten the answer. I don't know. Is it no i know i think hell was it a hot place? Or is it just you like reliving your...
00:18:34
Speaker
abuses and your atrocities. Right? Like, I kind of, to me, i think at this age, it would be that. it would be me having to relive over and over all the hurt and pain that I've caused in my lifetime.
00:18:47
Speaker
That if that, right, like, but then at the same time, it's like, but if the only sin was being gay, then... What have I done? Truly. What have I done? And then also, that might not be so bad. Right. No, for real. That's what I'm saying. It's like, you know, it's...
00:19:05
Speaker
It's interesting. But the concept of redemption is needed, right? Like, I think that's part of the faith that you we have to believe in good. I say it all the time. Like, if i if I'm going to be an active member and an active um participant in my life, I have to believe that people have a desire to be good. Yeah.
00:19:24
Speaker
And do good things. That's hard. It's very hard. It's hard to believe that. Especially when people have patterns and behaviors that have proven otherwise. Yeah. Yeah.
00:19:37
Speaker
I was just thinking like free will. When you have that, the it it blurs the lines about, you know, people being good because there are generally good people. But, you know, people get good. People get tired of being good.
00:19:48
Speaker
He says that our all humans are capable of terrible things. And I believe that. Oh, absolutely. All it takes is is that 13th reason for real. I honestly believe that humans are inherently good, but are extremely capable of heinous things. Yeah.
00:20:07
Speaker
if provoked, right? If the right button is yeah right, you've given the 13th reason. At what point
00:20:14
Speaker
ah what point is it justified? Right? Like, I think that free will aspect yeah gives the justification for us.
00:20:24
Speaker
Yeah. Like, because we believe in redemption. yeah it so weird how we how we operate, right? It's like, we want to operate in the black and white. Well, if you kill somebody, that's a crime. You should go to jail.
00:20:35
Speaker
Oh, and by the way, you should also go to hell because you took a life. But, what if you took of the life of somebody that was actively trying to do harm to you? Does that Does that blur the lines? Because that's what happens in the movie, right? like Isabel is presumed to have killed herself because she didn't want to carry out the wishes of the demon that had taken over. So she she had preferred to kill herself than to unleash the heinous acts of this demon that had pretty much taken over her host body.
00:21:06
Speaker
So should she be redeemed and is it justified right that she suicided? She just saved everybody their mamas. and right This is how she can, thanks. One way ticket to hell. Crazy work.
00:21:17
Speaker
That's so crazy. That's so crazy. i don't yeah I don't like movies like this. yeah Yesterday I was watching this and i was like, okay, I'm going to watch this because this is this is good for conversation. I love being stimulated in different ways at this age. I want to be put onto different movies that I'm not um used to and I was like, this is not a movie I would have watched as a teenager because this stuff has always kind of like
Life After Death and Reincarnation Beliefs
00:21:41
Speaker
freaks me out. Yeah.
00:21:42
Speaker
Right? I think that...
00:21:46
Speaker
i don't think we just die right and decompose and that's it. I do feel like science has given us enough information to know that energy is only transferred. Like, it can't be destroyed. It's just transferred over somewhere else.
00:22:02
Speaker
So, if we're going to blow that out, then... I believe that my energy may go into a tree or it may go into a dog or a butterfly or maybe the next president of Uganda. Who knows?
00:22:13
Speaker
Right. But.
00:22:16
Speaker
Fucking Uganda is crazy, you know, but I hear you. um You know what I'm saying? Like could end up anywhere because my energy is out there, my spirit, my soul, whatever we put that into. I feel like we we give ourselves that.
00:22:29
Speaker
Yeah. And. I think at this age, I'm more open to understanding that as a thing. see Right. But as a kid, yeah this scared me. Concept is gone. Yeah. I just, i to me, it was scary to yeah to think that there's angels and demons walking the earth right now. Right. And that I could be walking by the serial killers.
00:22:49
Speaker
Right. And the heinous ones on a daily occurrence. I'm trying to tell you. That's just scary. Yeah. Yeah. No, it is. I've always said I've I always tell people I've said this all my life.
00:23:01
Speaker
don't give fuck. Y'all gonna think I'm crazy and shit. I've lived a thousand lives already. Thousands a lot. But I have such vivid memories of my past lives. What are some of the memories? so is that It's about to sound crazy, y'all, but... I want to hear it. Well, I was for sure a whore a couple times.
00:23:17
Speaker
ah be I can't... Look, you know, I'm not shamed of my past lives. No, you're bugging. No, but that's the type of shit I be still when I... Man, look.
00:23:27
Speaker
Okay. I can have conversation about this shit for real, but I've lived a thousand lives, bro. I'm trying tell you. And I've been different ethnicities. there I've been a white woman. I've been Asian. I've been everything under the sun, bro. I'm telling you. I have such... When I have dreams, it's not even of like...
00:23:42
Speaker
Like, when I have dreams in relation to what I'm talking about right now, like, it's not even dreams of movie characters or, like, movies that I've watched or it's not triggered by anything. It's literally just, like, almost a deja vu, but it's, like, thinking back on, oh, I remember when I was doing this during this time frame.
00:23:58
Speaker
You know what I mean? So, it's just, it's crazy. cause My family's like that, like, lot of gypsies and shit in my dad's side of the house. So, it's not a, for me, it's not a feeling that's too far gone, like,
00:24:11
Speaker
People don't believe in shit like this, but I do. I don't care. So hold on. So if you've lived a thousand lives. I won't say thousand. That's crazy because I don't have a thousand memories of different lives. But I get what you're saying. Let's say you have nine lives. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:24:23
Speaker
Because cats can do it. Right. V can too. Yeah.
00:24:29
Speaker
Then where does hell come into play?
00:24:32
Speaker
I think, I think hell for me, right, with this whole life situation is not going further in in a life, right? So like, you know, concubines and whores and all that were at the lowest level of the totem pole. Got it.
00:24:48
Speaker
In these, in, not now, but like civilization, right? Like medieval societies. Yeah. Yeah. Right? So, I think back on like, okay, I have certain memories of these things and I was like, but I'm going a little bit further every time.
00:25:01
Speaker
You know what I mean? Like, This life that I'm living now, it was shit at the beginning. But when I've learned to exercise my free will, like I was in the military, I did X, Y, and Z in the military.
00:25:12
Speaker
ah I'm a civilian now. I'm doing better things as a civilian. Like I am going a little bit higher in the sense of societal norms, I guess. and You're responding.
00:25:24
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. You know what saying? So I think hell for me would be like, living like how I was as a child or these previous lives in the lower end of the totem pole. But I'm ascending in the sense of like, okay, I'm getting further.
00:25:37
Speaker
ah feel like every time. You're getting closer. I mean, I'm... Yeah, like I'm in a better place, so I'm in a better environment. Am I a whore? Sure, sure. What is this? What is this like? Am I a king's whore?
00:25:50
Speaker
yeah um and but Okay, at the Bronx. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, you were sending it to somebody's wife. You see what I'm saying? right Things like that. You know what I mean? if we you apples to oranges whatever the fuck like if we're thinking about like that like that's for me hell would be like staying at the but lower end of the spectrum on this like not ascending through life because yeah like energy is being transferred right but I'd rather be a fucking dog than an ant right I'm a doctor.
00:26:16
Speaker
And slicing in guarantee. You got to be underground the rest of your life. And even then, them boys will get you if they want to. You know what I mean? Yeah, there's a lot of them. They won't even miss them. That's what I'm saying. The people will kill themselves if you want you don't want to go grab that pebble, baby. You know what I mean?
00:26:30
Speaker
yeah You know what I'm saying? You fucking remember going on the way to go get this pebble, somebody step on you, you done. Yeah, you're expendable. Right. Versus a dog is a little bit more... Yes. You see what I'm saying? I'm trying to ascend. Hell for me would be I'm at the ninth level and I'm constantly down here with Dante in it. No, that makes sense. I like that. Yeah.
00:26:49
Speaker
That makes more sense. See, yeah if somebody explained that to me as a teenager, then I would accept that. Yeah. That's more realistic than me going to an inferno. or being pulled apart over and over again. Like that's one of the
00:27:10
Speaker
There's specific scenes that stand out and specific characters.
Character Analysis: Gabriel and Chaz
00:27:13
Speaker
What's your take on Gabriel, the archangel? Gabriel confuses me. And he comes, I still to this day, because I don't understand Gabriel's purpose.
00:27:21
Speaker
And, and I'm not talking the movie. I'm saying in a sense of religion. Okay. Because,
00:27:28
Speaker
There's a lot of things with Gabriel. gay ah Angels, period, don't have gender, right? So right this is the first time seeing this type of person on the screen. Because growing up, we didn't see days.
00:27:40
Speaker
we'll call You know I'm saying? Days and thems. Or androgynous. Androgynous. We didn't see androgynous characters such as Gabriel. Right. You know what I mean?
00:27:51
Speaker
So I like Gabriel because it's kind of like, he's the devil's advocate in a sense. Exactly. You know what I'm saying? You're saying you're playing for God, but you're also saying you're playing for the devil just because you're just trying to see something.
00:28:03
Speaker
You know what I'm saying? Like, oh, I just want to see how to, she fucking went, but because I know she's a female playing the character, but you fucking went Constantine just because you know you can, just to see if he's going to take the path that you guided him to.
00:28:15
Speaker
You know what mean? He's the fork in the road. you know I'm saying? And he's like, oh, this is enticing, but this is also enticing. This side is also... You're going to have fun on this side too. You know what I mean? You should try it.
00:28:26
Speaker
Right. it Like... Yeah, so Gabriel confuses me a little bit. But... He's not my favorite character for sure. Yeah, I didn't really like Gabriel too much. yeah I also found Gabriel confusing...
00:28:37
Speaker
I love that actress. like I love when she plays roles like that. Yes. Because she's the only one I feel like that can play those type of roles. But the character, yeah, I just didn't fuck with him because when I did watch it initially, I was like, damn, I thought Gabriel was trying to help him when he was at the church. You know what i mean? That's what i thought too. Yeah. And so...
00:28:54
Speaker
When that shit, because she did give it to him straight, you know, when they had that little piece of dialogue, like you're going to hell because you smoke X amount of packs a day of cigarettes. And so I was like, yeah, that makes sense. Like somebody who doesn't want to take accountability, that's what needs to be said.
00:29:09
Speaker
And it's like, maybe that'll ah motivate you to do better. Right. You know what i mean? But then as you killed the man. Right. And then homegirl sitting here acting a fool at the pool. So no like so that shit for me, like Gabriel confused the hell out of me both times.
00:29:26
Speaker
Another character that stood out that I was also confused by was Chaz. Chaz pissed me off. And the only reason they pissed me off... Did you complete your thought? sorry.
00:29:37
Speaker
No, yeah okay. So Chaz was played by Shia LaBeouf. Yes. And I think the reason why it threw me off is because now I'm watching it at this big age. Yeah. And he's a big age and he's not a kid anymore. And he's had this whole career and, you know...
00:29:50
Speaker
history that has happened for him. And so I just, I was just thrown off. i was like, what is he doing here? Right. You know, so I understand that he was, you know, the the sidekick, the Robin to the Batman.
00:30:02
Speaker
And he served his purpose in terms of, you know, being his driver and and his ace. But I just thought it was, it was a ill, he was just a weird place character. Yes.
00:30:13
Speaker
I didn't understand his purpose. Yeah, that shit pissed me off because
00:30:18
Speaker
Once he gone he's gone, like he's gone. There's no, oh, what happened to Chaz? You know what I mean? like Could we have done without him? Yeah, sure. Because John was carrying the movie. However, you're going give him sidekick, be a sidekick. Or do like Papa Midnight, where you had him in for a certain season and he was zoned.
00:30:35
Speaker
but You didn't have to have him the entire way. Yeah. I think they carried him too long. It was that. Yeah. like He didn't have development as a character. like He just went, did what he needed to do, then died.
Portrayal of Lucifer and Power Dynamics
00:30:55
Speaker
Lucifer was probably the most memorable. the Outside of John, obviously. yeah Lucifer is one of the most memorable parts of the movie and and he has a calm, yeah calculated, but also petty, right, personality and presentation in this movie.
00:31:14
Speaker
he's I think they did him... He was very well developed. yeah And he was very well casted. Yeah. I think all the characters were. I mean, yes. With the exceptions of the ones that we just mentioned. But I think at the end of the day, they did a great job of presenting how Lucifer would present himself in a modern yeah world.
00:31:36
Speaker
I think the little horned red creature with the pitchfork is very... um
00:31:45
Speaker
It's very, oh my God, what's the word? It's childlike, right? It's cartoonish. There's a word I know. I'm just trying to think. I can't think of it. Romanticized.
00:31:56
Speaker
Yes, right? We've created a lot of imagery for what we think the devil looks like. Kids grow up, you know, they grow up dressing as a devil for Halloween. yeah This was a completely different take yeah visually. What was your interpretation of of this character choice?
00:32:10
Speaker
i I loved Lucifer because, like you said, we had this romanticized version of him in our minds and he's such a bad man. not ah But the way he steps in, this you know, his suit that he was wearing and his demeanor, it was just like, this is what I would expect the devil to sound like or to act like.
00:32:30
Speaker
You know, and then God's a more a little bit more whorelier than thou. But they talk about him throughout the movie. And then we finally see him in the entrance that he makes, it's like, this is what we're waiting for. You're not just to come up here for nothing.
00:32:43
Speaker
Right. You're not about to just waste your time for nothing. And so... Yeah, I really did. I appreciated how they brought him into that one. They finally him into the light. And it was just like, that's how you step in for real. Like, that was that was real good.
00:32:56
Speaker
I did appreciate that because, like, if ah you know, when we think about the devil in your ear and things like that, it's not somebody screaming. It's not somebody. It's yourself in a sense. so We have our our own devils, you know, and I don't when I make decisions like bad decisions,
00:33:13
Speaker
I make bad financial decisions. but that fucking thing No, but um when I think about decisions that i'm making, the devil on my shoulder, and it's myself, you know, I always laugh at the decisions that I'm about to make, knowing the consequences that's coming.
00:33:27
Speaker
So I think, like, the banter between him and John is very spot on, because that's exactly what I ah picture and go through with myself, like, When I'm about to make a fucked up decision. Because I know what it is.
00:33:39
Speaker
And you know, I'm going laugh about it later. Is this going to suck? Is it going to hurt? Am I going through like my own internal emotional hell after this? Sure. But am I going to do it? Absolutely. Absolutely I am. You know what i mean? it's It's a personal gain thing. Just like it was with Lucifer.
00:33:53
Speaker
yeah Personal gain. I need John. hey Y'all pull me out my damn cat. Like my cave. I'm here. Come on, John. You know what I mean? Like, let's see. But I did like him a lot.
00:34:05
Speaker
I thought it was also reflective of the the evil that we would associate to the real world. yeah right A lot of the evil that we experience in our real lives comes from men in suits with swath personalities that and hold power in a way yeah that most others don't.
00:34:25
Speaker
And that movie made me think of like the dynamics of power and how important having it is. to be able to use it for good and or bad. Right? Like they, they just so quickly made things happen, right? Down to even yeah God with the light opening up at the end and trying to take John as he was crossing over and,
00:34:44
Speaker
you know, the pettiness of Lucifer to to pretty much be like, nah, bro. Yeah. I'd rather kill you I'd rather bring you, excuse I'd rather re revive you than to let you die and go to heaven. um I'm going to bring you right back to life and I'm going to rid you of your cancer so that you can continue to live a life that proves that you deserve to be with me. Yeah.
00:35:03
Speaker
You don't get off that easy. And I just thought that that's really reflective of how we experience power in our lives. It's usually dressed up really nice.
00:35:15
Speaker
well-spoken. Yeah. And I also think I want to hit on two more characters, but one being God, because even to the end, we don't see this man. We know everybody has his romanticized version of this white man in the frame, you know?
00:35:29
Speaker
But even then, as the at the time where he needs to be there, yeah he don't even show up. He's just like, here's John. Right, he just parts the clouds. Right. Like, come on. Park the Red Sea.
00:35:40
Speaker
Bring John on board. You know what mean? That's what I'm saying. Like, even when thinking about, like, childhood and shit, even at the lowest level of any child in the low-income area going through the most extreme, there will never be anything tangible to save that child in the sense of religion.
00:35:58
Speaker
This man was on his way out and God did not make, you know I'm saying? He didn't even make face. He didn't show up for nothing. But that at the time I was like, damn, even in the movie, like he's not going pop up because it's hard.
00:36:13
Speaker
I think as a director, thumb being like it's hard for you to conceptualize what God is going look like because you're going to catch critique from everybody named others if you put somebody to be God. But then you have you can do it in a comedy.
00:36:25
Speaker
What was the one with Jim Carrey and Morgan Freeman where played God? Almighty? Yeah, Bruce Almighty. Yes. And it was a joke. So it's okay to have a black man and a white man playing God and doing all these things.
00:36:36
Speaker
But when it's something serious, like a Constantine, you can't do that. Because now you're tipped on the line. And somebody's going to come get you for however you portray what God is supposed to be to save Constantine. But you made the devil a white man.
00:36:48
Speaker
ah Right. You know what I mean? So it's just... Yeah. That shit really... They were calling on themselves. Yeah. You know what mean? So... Yeah. That was crazy.
00:36:58
Speaker
And then another... The last one is would be Hennessy.
00:37:04
Speaker
And I don't say Hennessy because...
Addiction, Instant Gratification, and Society
00:37:06
Speaker
When I first watched the movie, the scene of him being in a liquor store really fucked me up for real. I did a little note. When he's drinking the bottles that we can't see. And the alcohol's not coming out. Yeah.
00:37:18
Speaker
I had to write this down because I truly felt a type of way about that growing up. And this was like.
00:37:26
Speaker
Okay, so this is what I wrote. I'm just reading it off this paper here. um As a kid, Hennessy's liquor store scene hit me hard. My dad was an alcoholic and I saw the same hopeless cycle that no matter how much you drink, it's never enough.
00:37:37
Speaker
And so watching Hennessy desperately chugging the bottle after bottle and thinking there was nothing coming out of it felt like a metaphor for addiction's bottomless pit. You know, because it it's like,
00:37:50
Speaker
Why isn't this coming out? Why isn't this coming out? But baby, you're still far in that addiction. You so you seek in the instant gratification. And he's not getting that. He's trying to get these voices out of his head. I'm going to drink. drink. I'm drink.
00:38:02
Speaker
And he's drinking and he's drinking. at it by him But for him, he's not feeling that. He's not seeing that. And he's like he drowns himself. You know what i mean? I was like... I thought that was such an interesting scene. yeah I didn't understand it either until the scene actually played out. But now that you're adding more context...
00:38:18
Speaker
Yeah. Made me think my dad, bro. Made me think of my dad because anybody with addiction, not just my father, I know keep him up, but like that was a lot of what was going on. It's just, ah that's how addiction is.
00:38:30
Speaker
You know, you're drinking one can a day, maybe one after work. It's not, it doesn't seem like anything. And then you're drinking a six pack before Wednesday. You're drinking a 12 pack before Friday. You're hitting the whole case.
00:38:42
Speaker
You know what I mean? And if we remove You're not tasting anything. You're just drinking. It's just like how Henderson was going through. He's just drinking, drinking, but he don't taste it. He don't feel it because he's so far gone. He needs to already hit that wall and he not there yet. And so he drowns himself.
00:38:57
Speaker
You know what i mean? It's just crazy. it was just a wild scene at the time. why And I was just like, damn, that's so relatable at the time because I felt like watching my dad do this to himself. Like, you don't get enough.
00:39:12
Speaker
You don't get, like, they be watching my friends and shit, and I'm like, y'all don't have enough. Y'all not, y'all don't get, y'all not, This ain't enough for y'all. Y'all hung over and shit. Like, it pisses me off. But that's growth for you because you were also a fish once upon a time in two. I don't want to sound judgy. No, no. I was right there with you. I'm just saying. I used to be a raging alcoholic. Yeah.
00:39:31
Speaker
But again, it's very relatable because I used to be like that. Right. I just wanted to drink to hit the wall. I wasn't even trying to drink to catch a buzz. I was trying to black out. You know what i mean? So that scene, even though Hennessey himself, the character,
00:39:45
Speaker
You know, he looked grungy, dirty, beat down. he was helping, you know, ah Constantine with the ether, like, trying to find out what was going on with the demons and shit. Right. His character was, like, out of the way a little bit, kind of in the dark, helping what he needed to. But that one particular scene was so powerful to me. Like, was like, damn, bro.
00:40:03
Speaker
That shit hit me hard growing up, for real. But, yeah, i was that was that was a good way to ah kill him. Because it's very, that's what that's what happens with people. Like, that addiction will get you every time.
00:40:16
Speaker
It'll get you every time.
00:40:20
Speaker
I love that you mentioned the. How you related it to the instant gratification. Yeah. Because I hadn't. Again, that scene hadn't clicked until you just introduced it. And it makes me think of the instant gratification that society seeks now.
00:40:36
Speaker
And that if this is Hennessy's fate. Yeah. In seeking that instant gratification, what does that mean for our society that is also constantly seeking instant gratification? Shit, we see it with social media. That's a new drug nowadays.
00:40:51
Speaker
It's killing us, right? I'm telling you, it's horrible. People just want... You know what? And i'm I'm guilty of this. I won't even read a damn recipe book no more. I'm going get on TikTok for 30 seconds be like, okay, i need to go buy all these vegetables and boil this shit and get it on.
00:41:04
Speaker
Because I didn't want to sit there and read. You know, that's me instantly gratifying like, okay, I need to save time. I don't have time to read and and figure this out. I don't pick up. How do I make rice? How do make this?
00:41:15
Speaker
I think though, in essence, that's the that's the the utilization, right? yeah That's how we're supposed to use TikTok. It's kind of supposed to be, I look at TikTok as an extension of It's the new Google. Yeah.
00:41:29
Speaker
Which to me, the Google was the new Britannica encyclopedia yeah or the new Ask Jeeves. You know, there was there's layers to this. So I feel like TikTok is just a faster way to acquire information.
00:41:41
Speaker
So, yes, that's that makes sense that we would ascend and yeah evolve to a point where we have a faster way of getting a recipe. Yeah. That makes sense. I think where.
00:41:57
Speaker
there's not going to be a point where you're not going to satisfied by not like by finding a recipe. Yeah. you're You're going to find the recipe. You're going to make the dish. yeah You're going move on. Yeah.
00:42:09
Speaker
That's not going to kill you. Right. Where it might kill you is if you're consuming something, something like Instagram and you have BBL models that are influencing the way that you also feel and want to look about yourself.
00:42:22
Speaker
And now you're, putting yourself in a position to gain that instant gratification of feeling what you think that person feels in the picture. And maybe you end up with a disease or and infection or it still doesn't satisfy. Right. Let's say it's not even as gruesome as you getting sick and dying. Right. it Now you have the ass. Now you have the titties. Now you have the pretty face. You have the fillers. You have the extensions. You have all the things, but you're still dead inside.
00:42:49
Speaker
Right. And so I think there's this parallel that I just drew to that where it's like, wow, like we're really out here seeking The instant gratification or the the dopamine hit. Yeah. That's really what it is. Right. The dopamine hit.
00:43:02
Speaker
And like every addiction that will eventually. numb itself out and you it would just be insatiable. So, yeah.
00:43:11
Speaker
Wow. Yeah. Great point. Thank
00:43:24
Speaker
Some of the scenes, I think, in 2005 were probably groundbreaking in terms of the way that they use CGI to portray, you know, hell or even heaven at the end or some of the the demons.
Movie Symbolism and Cultural Reflections
00:43:36
Speaker
was like, man, this was probably really cool back then. But 20 years later, I'm a little unimpressed. No, I mean, I think we're coming out the of doing shit. And this is what we're know what? I did appreciate that the demons didn't have faces for real.
00:43:50
Speaker
Yeah. I did like that because it we don't know what these people look like for real. We don't. We have this, like you said, romanticized version of what the devil is or what demons are supposed to look like. But even in the Bible itself, like it doesn't explain what an angel is for real.
00:44:03
Speaker
The angel doesn't have gender. The angel comes to people in the forms that the person is going to accept them, which is a human form. You know what I mean? So I did appreciate that because demons don't have faces.
00:44:15
Speaker
There's a quote in the movie. Heaven and hell are right there behind every wall and every window, which is the truth. The granny in the backside probably, she probably the devil. We don't even know it devil has so many faces.
00:44:26
Speaker
The demons have so many faces. These worker bees have so many faces. And we have to face decisions like that every day. Am I going to get mad with this person and and put hands on them or am going to just move on and and get over You know what i mean? So...
00:44:40
Speaker
Like I said, I appreciate that there wasn't a face because there's also something to be said about these demons and these workers not having a full face for real. You know what I mean? Because you can put that, you can grab that and copy and paste that anywhere.
00:44:52
Speaker
It's the truth behind the matter.
00:44:55
Speaker
There was imagery where he walks into the club to see Midnight, the Midnight Lounge. yeah and it's clearly demons, box demons in there. Yes. Half breeds is what yeah they were referred to.
00:45:09
Speaker
thought was interesting. ah predictable, but interesting that they still chose to highlight ah the nightlife. Yes. I understand bad things happen in these environments. Preachs come out at night, baby.
00:45:24
Speaker
Right. But it was just like reinforced. Yes. And you know the older I get, I understand now that there's some truth to that. That darkness hides in the darkness. right It will find...
00:45:40
Speaker
Misery loves company. Yes.
00:45:44
Speaker
And I can see, you know, in my wisdom now and experiencing different evolutions of life and being out in the nightlife and seeing tragic things happen as a result of being out in the nightlife to others.
00:45:54
Speaker
thank Thankfully, not for me. But it brings into context that you this there's probably some truth to that. There's there's probably some comfort for evil people. to gravitate to these spaces where people are more comfortable sinning, so to say, or, or doing the things that they normally wouldn't do out in the light.
00:46:15
Speaker
Right. Metaphorically and literally.
00:46:19
Speaker
Also in that scene, Papa Midnight's Club, ah there was another couple that was androgynous as well. don't know if you caught that, but it was just like, I did this twice now, you know, or people were,
00:46:34
Speaker
they weren't inherently male or inherently female. I also thought that stood out as well in the sense of like... The way that they played with sexuality. Yeah, the fluidity between all that and what's going on in the club and things like that.
00:46:48
Speaker
Yes.
00:46:51
Speaker
2005, I'm trying to think of where we are where we were in the LGBTQ movement. Because that would inform the way that they used sexuality in this film. Well, we know that Don't Ask, Don't Tell was still a thing.
00:47:06
Speaker
So we couldn't be outright gay in military. Right. That was very much still a thing. the And then marriage. No, when did marriage pass? Was it on 9? In 2005, Massachusetts became the first state to allow same-sex marriage.
00:47:19
Speaker
So there was definitely advocation for this... to advance, we just weren't there yet. So the understanding of sexuality and gender as we know it now, 20 years later, has been completely exactly advanced and and misinterpreted and then reintroduced in so many ways.
00:47:38
Speaker
But yeah, I would say I would agree with you. I would say it was it was daring. It was bold for them to use sexuality subtly. Right. But also Angel was an important or excuse me, Gabriel was a very important character.
00:47:52
Speaker
the to showcase androgyny and the non-binary gender that exists, right? So... But right.
00:48:03
Speaker
Don't Have Stone Child was definitely a thing. We were living a secret.
00:48:10
Speaker
The film's message seems to be that John's salvation comes not from grand acts, right? But from a single self look selfless voice, which is him exchanging his life For Angela's soul to be able to ascend to heaven because they are devout Catholics and he wanted at least one of the twins to be able to make it to their rightful rifle place.
00:48:33
Speaker
What does this say to you or the viewer, the audience, about heroism and these grandiose acts that the everyday human made make or take.
00:48:52
Speaker
Right. right I think what is when people aren't really heroes? Is it like an anti-hero? The hero that's not really the hero? I feel like that's more what John is because, again, we have a romanticized version of what a hero is. The good guy versus the bad guy.
00:49:08
Speaker
You know, Batman versus all these other crazy people in in the in the city acting a fool. But what I think I think the anti-hero is more relatable to real people.
00:49:20
Speaker
in real life. And that's why I think they portrayed them. yeah You know, everybody has their opinion about the comics and all that shit. but for me, I think that's why it was portrayed the way it was because there aren't inherently just good and bad people. Like you said, we have this gray area. So, you know, opinions can change.
00:49:38
Speaker
People can change as new information is being, you know, ah presented to people. Right. So if, if I was living a path of hell, right? And then one day woke was like, damn, I've been doing this fucked up all along. I can choose to change.
00:49:52
Speaker
And I can change. And then I'll do better. It's just like John. You know, he... His parents were being fucked up parents. You know, with the shock therapy and all that. And he figured his only way out was to just off himself.
00:50:05
Speaker
That don't make him inherently bad. You know what I mean? That's why he spent the whole movie trying to make these great decisions. Like, to be like, I need to buy my way back in the hell. I'm trying to secure my retirement. I feel like people go through that, though. It doesn't even have to be at the child stage.
00:50:18
Speaker
Like, their life is just so fucked and they finally catch a break and they're like, okay, I'm doing well. or Like, I need to do better things. i need to do better. i need to do better for my family. I'm trying to break this cycle. That's not... Somebody that's inherently good would look at that person and be like, but you're still bad.
00:50:32
Speaker
No, baby, I was making decisions to survive. Yeah. And now that I've survived and I have kids, I don't have to make bad decisions anymore. That's past me. You know what I mean? So... part the hero's journey. Yeah, exactly. Like, this yeah.
00:50:47
Speaker
I feel like he's very more more relatable than other movies. would It would just be like, this is a very good guy. He's a hero. This is a very bad guy. He's a villain. You know? Yeah.
00:51:02
Speaker
You know when he tells... Chaz, and then Chaz repeats it back to him. Everything in the book is not as it seems, right? Because it it doesn't say what book. It's just very broad. It's just, we're assuming he's talking about all the books that he's read about demonism, Satanism, you know, exorcisms and things like that. But the way I took that was like, the Bible ain't what it seems.
Religious Texts and Perception of Reality
00:51:24
Speaker
Right. Everything in Bible ain't what it seems, you know? At the deeper end of this, it's been rewritten and regurgitated so many times to fit the times, to fit a child reading a Bible, an adult reading a Bible, different religions, you know?
00:51:39
Speaker
But I think it's very fitting even now, so far gone, that that one quote is very, very, um, relatable like everything in that damn book is not what it seems because even now people are like you're not supposed to eat pork you're not supposed to leviticus was talking about man laying with man or lit man laying with children and shit like that why are y'all taking homosexuality and making it a vague thing when there's lesbianism you know there's lgbtq community there's so many labels to that that homosexuality is is not just ah a vague term you can throw to encapsulate all these people mm-hmm
00:52:12
Speaker
You know what I mean? that's why I like that quote lot. was like, the book is not what it seems. It's not what it seems like in the book. We not being damned. We not getting killed by being stoned to death. Right.
00:52:23
Speaker
You know, I'm sure this that's happened in maybe some other countries around the way, but that's not the reality of the situation right now. It's just not. And there's also, I mean, if you're looking at the literal, I think it's something ah to the effect of man should not lay with men how they do with a woman. Yeah.
00:52:38
Speaker
But, then there's that's the loophole. Right. right it's Well, then that's fine. I'll just fuck a man just for pleasure then. Right. Like, that's fine. I don't... I lay with my woman to reproduce.
00:52:49
Speaker
So I'm just going to have a concubine or a eunuch and this is what I'm doing. Right. And that's okay. Right.
00:52:59
Speaker
It's really interesting. You're right. the I learned at a very early age and I think, you know, you get tattoos when you're young. Sometimes to because it sounds cool and it looks cool.
00:53:10
Speaker
But across my chest, I have an Italian false or realte. Oh, boy. And it's false reality. Yeah. That's the idea is that not everything in life is as it seems. Exactly. And I think it was a reminder for me that when I look in the mirror to have discernment.
00:53:24
Speaker
Right. Like to just be a little bit more present, be a little bit more aware, you know, ask little ask a few more questions. Right. Have discernment. be Be in tune with what's happening so that you can make better informed choices. Yeah.
00:53:41
Speaker
You know, because not everything is as as it seems. And if you just accept things at face value, that might end up painful, right? Exactly. Or expensive, depending on where we're what life we're talking about, you know? But in most cases, as an adult, the the older I've gotten, the more expensive my mistakes have become.
00:54:00
Speaker
Exactly. Exactly. I think for me at at an early age, I understood that I needed to be better at just making good choices and being aware to
00:54:11
Speaker
the possibility, right? yeah of Of things not being but they're what they're presenting. Right.
00:54:29
Speaker
There's a few things that stuck out. One specifically with the twin girls. Okay. ah Angela and Isabel. Yeah. So Isabel, again, is the sister that jumps off the roof of the psychiatric hospital after she's been admitted because she's been possessed by Mammon, which is the son of Lucifer.
Mental Health Themes and Children
00:54:47
Speaker
Instead of carrying out his wishes or intents to take over the world, she kills herself and... and is it or excuse me Angela, the remaining sister, is able to track down Constantine.
00:55:00
Speaker
who and they have this dialogue where she's explaining that at a young age, at around 10 years old, they started having visions and seeing things. And when Isabel started expressing these visions, she was put on antipsychosis yeah medication.
00:55:17
Speaker
And so Angela kept her visions that she also developed to herself. And I just thought it was...
00:55:26
Speaker
It was ahead of its time in terms of how it presented that normalization. Because right now it's really normal for us to medicate our kids. yeah And I felt like the way that it was presented was kind of like, this is a taboo topic.
00:55:40
Speaker
And I was also very scared to be put on medications and be looked at as crazy. And I just thought that it highlighted kind of like the crack into mental health, especially in youth. For me, that's the way I looked at it. was like, wow, tell me.
00:55:55
Speaker
Yeah, because even with John, they, you know, shock therapy ain't a thing no more, but and there was a scene of him getting shot because of the things that he was seeing, you know? And, you know, it's funny, like, in the Hispanic community, we can take, like, during this time and even earlier, when you have los locos that sit in the family, they just keep it at grandma's house or something. Like, no jala con el.
00:56:18
Speaker
You know what I mean? littlehi local Like, leave him mal alone. He's not Medicaid. He's just going about doing his thing and things like that. But we have come so far from just leaving somebody alone, which I get it. That's not the case for everybody. We should not just be leaving these people alone.
00:56:30
Speaker
But compared to that and, you know, even kids right now who are maybe a little bit sore in development or maybe maybe they just not trying to be bothered because every child isn't an energetic, outgoing child. They just want to sit and play.
00:56:44
Speaker
the automatic thing that people jump to is, okay, kids got autism. Oh, these kids need to get pills. They need to do this. They got ADHD. But it's like, bro, even as an adult going through college, our asses cannot sit in a fucking class for 45 minutes without wanting to get up, without wanting to chew shit, without wanting to express things, text our friends.
00:57:03
Speaker
We don't have that, that, uh, damn, what's it called? Uh, we just don't have the, the, the span. What is it? Bandwidth? We don't have the bandwidth to sit there and do that, especially it's something that we're not interested in and we're forced to take class because it's a core course for the degree.
00:57:18
Speaker
You know what i mean? I feel that. It's like I turned at an angle. I was like, you want to put food away. And I was like, girl, you better leave that food out because what we doing before we had stoves and fridges and shit? People was eating food that was left out, you know, may it may not have been a week. Now, I'm not saying that, but like, you know what I'm saying?
00:57:36
Speaker
Like overnight, you know what I'm saying? People weren't dying. But now people, there's this crazy ass, oh, food's going to go bad. It's going to have germs. You're gonna kill yourself if you don't put it the fridge right away. Baby, no, it's not.
00:57:47
Speaker
But we so scared of all these things that this is the first thing we think about is to medicate that kid right now. Medicate these kids with mental health issues. And I get it. That's not fair. That's not the baseline for everybody because some people do have schizophrenia that do need to be medicated or, or, you know, a severe ah bipolar that do need to be medicated.
00:58:06
Speaker
But to do that to a child where you don't necessarily understand that child or believe that child because you don't have that belief. That's crazy. Yeah. I think that as well. I feel like there's a certain age. I've,
00:58:19
Speaker
there that has i've Again, and this is not for the real deal diagnosis that required medication. I'm talking about some of the behavioral or mental um conditions yes that kids may or may not be carrying yeah at a young age where their brain is constantly regenerating and developing itself.
00:58:44
Speaker
I think... now in 2025, we have more wherewithal to understand, like, that ain't the answer. Right. And most kids will kind of buff out, so to say, right? Like, if you give them time, they will develop. If you give them time, or if you give them certain...
00:59:00
Speaker
therapies that are not based on medicine, yeah more holistic approaches that in some cases and in a lot of cases, kids will benefit and adjust accordingly, whatever that expectation is that you're holding to them. Right.
00:59:13
Speaker
Right. But I think we've also come to understand that there's so many levels and nuances to how kids develop. Yeah. Whether that's environment, whether that's parents, whether that's socioeconomic structures. And I think that we have to give just more grace in general. right Absolutely.
00:59:29
Speaker
So I do agree with you. Yeah. instant... the the instinct you know, resolution of medication can't be the answer. Right. But it often is. And we saw that with the opioid, you know, pandemic or epidemic that happened in this nation. so I think parents just freak out, somebody, because they don't, they see maybe their brother or sister, how they was raised.
00:59:48
Speaker
Yeah. And they think, okay, this is the right answer that mom did. You know, this was the right thing to do. And it's like, baby, you're free to make a decision on how you want to raise that child. You can't just jump to that conclusion because this is what mom was doing with brother.
01:00:00
Speaker
Right. That's crazy. Yeah. There's too much information out there now on raising kids and exactly different ways to raise kids and there's counseling for those that need guidance on how to raise kids.
01:00:12
Speaker
But I think our kids could hurt a little less if we're more intentional about what it is that they need.
Timeless Themes and Future Reception
01:00:18
Speaker
yeah
01:00:23
Speaker
If this movie were to come out in 2025, given what we just mentioned in terms of religion and mental health, And even a celebrity, right? In terms of Shia LaBeouf as a character and Keanu Reeves as a character.
01:00:38
Speaker
How do we think it would be received if it was reintroduced today as is? As if. I think it is. I think it holds, it holds, holds the line as is because I watch this all the time. can tell you, I've watched this movie probably a hundred times and every time it still hits, it still hits for me because the message is still the message.
01:01:00
Speaker
No matter how we chop this up, no matter how many people we move character wise to match ah the current actors of today, the message is still the message. And if, as long as the message is not touched, you know, dialogue stays the same in certain aspects.
01:01:16
Speaker
this is people will receive as well i think kids will receive as well now like i'm saying like i think 14 is a good age because you're right at that age where you like you peeping game you sing shit you know what i mean like 12 you're still a little bit naive unless you way off the rick the scale you know what i mean so i think you can't take this and you know they do now with movies where they put them back on the theater for the one night i think it would still be a full theater Truly.
01:01:41
Speaker
But I love this movie so much like because it's so relatable. There's nothing in this movie where it's like preaching. Like I told you, like we don't we not there isn't a scene where we're at a church and theres ah you know the pulpit is there and everything's going on.
01:01:54
Speaker
It's not that. But is it is relatable. The things that he's saying, the dialogue that he has with Gabriel, the dialogue that he has with Angela the when they're eating. You know, God isnt is a kid with an ant farm lady.
01:02:05
Speaker
A lot of people believe that. her You know what I'm saying? there Like even with Gabriel, and he was like you said, when he was giving him that 100% truth, ah be accountable for your actions as well while you still want to blame God for all the shitty shit that happened in life because you also accelerated that. yeah You know what i mean? So I do think it will be received it it would be received well by today's society because people are still looking for answers. No matter how far in technology we get, we still seek those answers.
01:02:31
Speaker
about the afterlife. It's like the brain. People want answers about the brain. We want to know about dementia. We want to know about autism. We want to know about ADHD. We want to know about all the feelings. But we can't because we can't just study the brain like we can the regular organs below the neck, the regular bones below the neck.
01:02:46
Speaker
You know i mean? So this truly, I think this, if you copy and paste it and slap it back on the screen, people will still come watch it because it's relatable because there's, there's a middle ground. People are sitting in limbo. A lot of people sit in limbo about religion. Some people believe in universe.
01:03:01
Speaker
They want to believe in the, you know, affirmations. They want to believe in whatever I put out is going to be received, you know, but this stuff isn't linear. Life isn't linear. The human experience isn't linear. And we're, you know, it's like a circle. My dad used to tell life's like a circle.
01:03:14
Speaker
We're not supposed to be happy all the time, right? So we're going to go up the circle, up the 180, and we're going to be happy. And then eventually we're going to have to come back down and live in hell a little bit. We just are. Because... That's balance. That's balance.
01:03:27
Speaker
Otherwise, we'd be on drugs trying to constantly get dopamine hits. And we can't live life like that. That's not the human experience. We have to... People die. That's for certain. We're born. we We fucking live life when we die.
01:03:37
Speaker
Period. You know what I'm saying? So, again, this is
Existentialism and Balancing Life's Dualities
01:03:41
Speaker
just... Everybody's in limbo. And this is a very relatable... thing about, you know, the universe, the religion, where where do we fit in that?
01:03:48
Speaker
When Zeitgeist came out, that movie, I think it came out in like 2007, and it broke down all the religions and how they're all very similar across the border shit like that, that's true. The whole world blew up.
01:03:59
Speaker
Because it was on YouTube, like three-hour movie about, you know, God, religion, and how all these religions are the same and all that, but there's people that think that that just won't say it because they're afraid of the backlash. I have conversations like that with people, you know, whenever I do have conversations about religion, it's just like,
01:04:15
Speaker
Yeah, God's cool and shit, but I'm not putting all my eggs in that basket. You know what I'm saying? I used to be very into existentialism in high school. And I even said I had a class to take that in college and I was at Western Michigan. But I believe it was Henry David Thoreau that said, I'd rather live my life believing that there is a God and dying to find out there isn't one than to live my life not believing that there is a God and dying to find out that there is one.
01:04:41
Speaker
I live my life like that very much so. I'm always, thank you, Jesus. Thank you, God, I woke up. Thank you, God, I'm eating. Thank you, this. Thank you, that. Because I don't know. the end of the week, nobody knows. hu But I'd rather...
01:04:52
Speaker
you know, give my thanks here and there, have my little things collected up. Because if I do have to meet somebody at the end of this, at least I would have known that I did my due diligence in the sense of some type of belief. I don't got to be in church.
01:05:04
Speaker
I don't got to be acting the ass out here and doing all this other Bible-something things. But as long as for me, my my comfort isn't, I gave my thanks to God. I'm okay. I'm also doing my affirmations because I do believe whatever energy you put out, that's what you're going to reciprocate in the universe.
01:05:18
Speaker
You know what mean? So... knew that was long-winded, but... No, i'm I'm big on that as well. I feel like, like I said, at 13, 14, I kind of got away from Catholicism. I did my first communion, kept going to church and just things didn't make sense.
01:05:32
Speaker
And it wasn't even so much that I was on like the Scientology. write It wasn't even that. It was really, i couldn't, they couldn't give me answers. And I felt like at that point in my life, and even now you you have to make things make sense.
01:05:47
Speaker
What makes sense to me is There is something bigger, whether you call it Buddha, Allah, a tree, Jesus Christ, whatever it is that you believe in. I think that there is consistency and it makes sense that we gravitate as humans to wanting to have a belief in redemption, whichever way redemption comes, whichever storyline you want to believe. I think that's important for the bad times, yeah like you mentioned.
01:06:18
Speaker
I think it's also important to harp in onto the fact that there are going to be bad times because I think we, because we live in this instant gratification lifestyle in 2025, the landing of understanding that you have to be able to take the bad with the good yeah is missing the mark for a lot of people these days.
01:06:38
Speaker
And when the bad comes, they self-destruct. And I never want to take away from anybody's like grief and pain and struggles. But I feel like there's something to be said in how quick we are to... Hold on, I always have a hard time with this word.
01:06:53
Speaker
Catastrophize life circumstances that in some cases were predictable or manageable. or self anddo Or self-inflicted, yeah right? So it's kind of like we have to really get back to understanding whether it's you harping onto some type of spirituality or belief is not the point, but it's understanding that life is so circular or cyclical, excuse me.
01:07:20
Speaker
Life is cyclical. And just like a pendulum, which I also you know learned in my later years, if you take one of these you know little balance scales where you have the ball, the pendulum swings, right?
01:07:33
Speaker
If it comes all the way to the right, at some point it's going to release to the left. And it's going to continue to snap back and forth, left to right, left to right, until it finds its center. yeah And then it will stabilize. If you're getting good, there's going to be bad. And I think the high that everybody is chasing of always having good, of always having a story to post, of always having a picture right to share is is going to really be a downfall to our society and damages our children, right? And I think that if we can revert back to understanding that there's ah balance
01:08:06
Speaker
If we can find that again, that we'll be better off. Right. I kind of just had this conversation with where Ellie on the Sister Act podcast. Yeah. And it was talking about how we can get back to community and how we can kind of fix some of the woes of society. And it's it's not necessarily getting back to church or getting back to religion, but it's being able to anchor ourselves in the understanding that there is a balance that's required to get through life.
01:08:27
Speaker
And there's while there's free will, you also have to have...
Diverse Representation and Cultural Changes
01:08:31
Speaker
perseverance right to carry that free will and the consequences of those choices that you're making.
01:08:49
Speaker
What I did think about was the representation of different ah people. Okay. Because we did see Papa Midnight. There was an extra in his room who was also African-American. And then the doctor that was telling him about his lung cancer and was African-American. But otherwise, this is very much inherently pale people.
01:09:10
Speaker
Yep. The Caucasians. But shout out to them for having big, important roles. Because a doctor, even if her team was short in the sense of like the interaction, it is important to have somebody that looks like her her skin tone being a doctor that still holds weight even if it's something subtle in the movie because this is 2005 you know what i mean so that by itself holds weight or even having somebody like papa midnight who is like you know he's the guy you know on the neutral center third that also holds weight for some people because a lot of churches are filled with nothing but white people and even if this guy you know uh
01:09:51
Speaker
the place that he holds spiritually, because he was praying over both of them, that's still important to see that there's people like him, his color, his, you know, it skin tone, that do this. Yes. You know what i mean? Because we only see it in our own community, right? So we only see it, like, in Puerto Rico or in, like, Haiti, when you know what I'm saying? Like, with Haitians and all that, and and that type of, ah like, with the voodoo and, you know, La Santeria and all that. yeah We only see that on our side.
01:10:17
Speaker
But it's important to put that on screen también. You know what i mean? So that I thought, even though it was small, I thought that was, for it being small, it hit important parts.
01:10:28
Speaker
Agreed. yeah because that's one thing that has been very much a commonality as I'm going through these movies is the representation of certain demographics and the use of yeah the presentation. yeah And I think that this one, to point, 2005, if we're looking at if we're looking at pop culture really taking off with the internet, right? Like i'm thinking about just like what's happening at this time.
01:10:54
Speaker
We were starting to celebrate diversity a little bit more. And they did take the opportunity to present these others, right, at the time in a way that's palatable for the white consumers. Yeah.
01:11:09
Speaker
But also honors yeah the demographics that they represent. So I definitely appreciated that. Yeah. Great catch. See, see, see.
01:11:22
Speaker
We were just talking about if if this movie came out today, that it wouldn't need to have any changes. It would be received. The only thing that I'm thinking about might be received differently is his use of cigarettes, his cigarette use. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:11:37
Speaker
Right? Like, I think that would be one thing I would change. If I had to rewrite the movie, I think I would change that. don't know what I'd replace it with, but I think I would change that just because it wouldn't hold as much...
01:11:50
Speaker
cultural weight. Yeah. no That makes sense. See, see, see. Especially, I don't know, don't remember when the campaign was like really heavy hitting for the tobacco smoking and all that. think around here. me see.
01:12:01
Speaker
That might be, that actually might track. Yeah. Let's see. just remember them damn orange commercials about that damn tobacco. And that damn, they put that shit on every damn container.
01:12:14
Speaker
ah The initiative started March 1999. yeah. ah yeah And even then I was still seeing commercials. So, you know, same, same. They started moving over to drugs and all that stuff. But ah because kids vape nowadays, you know what mean? Adults, they're vaping and access to weed is on every corner, essentially. You know what i mean? So I do.
01:12:33
Speaker
like I could agree with that. You know, I didn't like I didn't like this shit pissed me off. Not why I didn't think about it back then. But even like now when I see it, I'm just like, why she got a wet white shirt on?
01:12:45
Speaker
That pissed me off. You know No, I got upset. And even though it wasn't like prevalent in the movie, ah because like there was this sexual tension, right? There was. There was. So annoying. Yeah, but i what I did appreciate, shout out to the women in the world, she didn't kiss him. like She walked away at the end, which was, yes, we win this one. She said you wish.
01:13:05
Speaker
Right. So I didn't like that wet shirt shit because, man, get that off there. We shoot for the demons and the angels, baby. I didn't wear the wet shirts. I felt like there was no need for any romantic plot line or story. It was just... I agree. There was no need.
01:13:18
Speaker
Unnecessary. Yeah, i just wanted to slap that in there for nothing. But yeah, I agree with that. Y'all could have went straight through movie without having to deal with that. Oh,
01:13:30
Speaker
wait. I have two more things. Okay. Hit it. I never noticed the Quiznos in the back. Oh, yes. I never noticed the Quiznos in the back until he walked out and it panned out and I said,
01:13:42
Speaker
Holy shit, in my mind, like, a fucking Quiznos. Is Quiznos still a thing? No. I'm pretty sure the boys got shut down. It's a cultural relic. That's what I'm saying. Wait, hold on. Quiznos is a sandwich spot for those of you that are unaware.
01:13:56
Speaker
It's kind of like what Subway is about to turn into. A fossil. I guess. A memory. and Right. 2018, Quiznos announced that they had been acquired by California-based High Bluff Capital Partners.
01:14:08
Speaker
Okay. So
Symbolism and Historical Contexts
01:14:10
Speaker
it's not a thing. Quiznos is not a thing. Damn. See. But yeah, that was nice to see. Yeah. like when you catch stuff like that. That one blew me out of the water.
01:14:20
Speaker
And then I didn't, I never did this before, but I was keeping track of all the crosses that came on the screen. And I got 23. Wow.
01:14:31
Speaker
But it's subtle because you don't. Yeah. The pool is the cross. Mm-hmm. You know, when she comes through the window, that's the cross. It's a big-ass cross on that psychiatric ward. Just everywhere. They're everywhere, right? Symbolism, yeah. Yeah, it was pretty wild.
01:14:52
Speaker
I wish they would have developed the story about the spear ah little bit. Uh-huh. That's something I would have changed, too. Because I don't... Why was it in Mexico?
01:15:03
Speaker
ah Do I have to, like, think about...
01:15:07
Speaker
geography back then and figure out why was there. You know what I'm saying? like that That for me was like, why do we place it there and why did it take forever? like I understand Los Angeles, Mexico, that's probably the best place to put it short. However... The missions.
01:15:22
Speaker
oh The missions, right? That's the story of California that the missions traveled. Junipero. Junipero. Junipero. whatever that got yes the tuni pair The fathers had went up and they had set up several missions throughout Southern California. So if we... You're right. If you know that, yeah I guess that makes sense. but Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:15:43
Speaker
I had to really think about that right now as you're describing. would be a Mexico if it's they're based in LA? Yeah. I think it's that. Yeah. If we're tying into Catholicism. Yeah. Because i don't I don't think Catholicism when I think of LA. Mm-mm. Mm-mm.
01:15:58
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. So that was, it was cool, like, looking for that. Because it's, like, right as soon as that first scene hits, you got two big ass ones right there, like, leaning off the broken highway, you know? Yeah.
01:16:10
Speaker
I agree. They should have definitely developed that a little bit more. Yeah. Just little bit more history. Yeah, just the background. Because they could have just opened with, like, the old time. Exactly. And then somebody dropping it or the church burning down something. yeah. Like, they could have given us some historical. Yeah.
01:16:21
Speaker
The transition between hell and reality, that probably would have worked right there. Yeah. You know what I mean? Just to introduce that. um So that, looking just thinking about the things that I missed like I said I watched it so many times i always look at different things but this is my first time catching that and then counting the crosses 23 crosses yeah that's a lot of crosses and they're subtle so it's like half a second half maybe even less than half a second millisecond on the screen you know what mean like if you blink missing that thing yeah I think about how at the time
01:16:54
Speaker
the Catholic Church was definitely in trouble. I think there was a need for people to justify a lot of the laws that they were trying to keep from passing in terms of LGBTQ rights. They were being justified by religion and the Catholic Church looking at birth control and access to birth control and and abortions and things like that was also a big deal in the early 2000s and how communities were protesting, you know, Planned Parenthoods, for example. yeah So I think The impact and the importance of the Catholic Church in 2005 is day and night yeah compared to now.
Reflection and Closing Remarks
01:17:35
Speaker
We have definitely strayed away from a lot of these symbolic
01:17:40
Speaker
yeah relics or, you know, anything tied to religion. Everything's just so sanitized now. Yeah. Except for in the South, right? They're trying to introduce Ten Commandments in the classroom and shit like that. But, you know, like, we've we've made a... We definitely but made a big push in the last two years to have a clear separation of church and state.
01:18:01
Speaker
Yeah. We need to, though. Yeah, but then we get here and you have people that are downing metaphoric bottles of alcohol, right? Right, themselves right.
01:18:15
Speaker
It was a great movie and i'm I'm so happy that you introduced me to it. Yes, I love it. Again, as ah as an adult, it was a lot. It was a lot to take in. I think I would want to watch it again with my wife just to see her take, even with my daughter to see her take and what yeah she picks up.
01:18:29
Speaker
But it's one of those movies that I can see that every time you watch it, you would pick up on a new symbol or a new quote that just stands out. it's It's one of those that you got to sit with. lot of good gems in it.
01:18:43
Speaker
V, it was an absolute pleasure. Thank you. You know we have our own talks all the time about all these great, heavy, impactful, scary, happy, yeah all the things that are happening in the world. We just try to dissect it and try to make sense of it. And it's nice to be able to just finally consolidate all of that thinking into this movie right here, Constantine, and being able to apply it to so many aspects of our personal lives, but also life as it is today. Yeah.
01:19:12
Speaker
So thank you so much for coming through and sharing your thoughts. I loved it. Thank you so much for having me. This is just a disclaimer. Some of y'all want to go watch this. It's a slow burn. If you don't like slow burns, pause it. Go get a little snag and come back.
01:19:25
Speaker
But the message behind is very clear. And it's if you're looking for something, maybe you need some guidance or something, this will be really good to just sit and just take it in for what it's worth. Take it at face value. Take it in for what it's worth.
01:19:36
Speaker
Enjoy it. Thank you for having me. I'm always here. You're always welcome. You are always welcome. And and we will get you back on this part. Again, it's up to you which movie you bring up next. Yeah.
01:19:48
Speaker
for now. Thank you so much. Please join us next time for new guests, old movies, and the uncomfortable truths we uncover along the way. Thank you so much all our listeners out there. Keep supporting. Follow us on Instagram at spoiler underscore alert underscore podcast.
01:20:06
Speaker
With that being said, stay focused, stay motivated, love one another. Have a great fucking day. Yes. And we're out.