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Spider-Man (2002)
374 Plays2 years ago
At long last, we're finishing up Sam Raimi's Spider-Man trilogy! Filmmaker August Aguilar is here to help as we discuss how groundbreaking this movie was in 2002, how it helped pave the way for the MCU, and what parts do (and don't) hold up twenty years later.
Visit Strange Films Studios to find out more about August's movies, comics, and podcasts
Help support the show by buying or renting this movie on Amazon
Want to tell us what you think? Have any questions or comments for Perry about superheroes in media or comics? Leave a voice message to play on the show. You can also apply to be a guest on the show.
Patrons get to listen to episodes before everyone else and they also get access to my exclusive companion podcast, the Superhero Cinephiles Book Club. If you want to join in, please consider supporting us through Patreon!
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Transcript
Uncle Ben's Advice on Responsibility
00:00:22
Speaker
Thanks for the ride, Uncle Ben. Oh, wait a minute, Peter. We need to talk. Oh, we can talk later. Well, we can talk now, if you let me. Well, what do we have to talk about? Why now? Because we haven't talked at all for so long. Your Aunt May and I don't even know who you are anymore. You shirk your chores. You have all those weird experiments in your room. You start fights at school. I didn't start that fight. I told you that. Well, you're sure as hell finished.
00:00:49
Speaker
What was I supposed to do, run away? No, no, you're not supposed to run away, but Pete, look, you're changing. I know I went to exactly the same thing at your age. No, not exactly. Peter, these are the years when a man changes into the man he's going to become the rest of his life. Just be careful who you change into.
00:01:14
Speaker
This guy, Flash Thompson, he probably deserved what happened. But just because you can beat him up doesn't give you the right to. Remember, with great power comes great responsibility.
00:01:31
Speaker
Are you afraid that I'm gonna turn into some kind of criminal? Quit worrying about me, okay? Something's different. I'll figure it out. Stop lecturing me, please. I don't mean to lecture and I don't mean to preach. And I know I'm not your father. Then stop pretending to be. Right. I'll pick you up here at 10.
Introduction to August Aguilar and Superhero Cinephiles
00:02:22
Speaker
Welcome to the Superhero Cinephiles Podcast. I'm your host, Perry Constantine, and welcoming a new guest today, and that is August Aguilar. August, how you doing today?
00:02:30
Speaker
Man, I'm doing great. Thanks, Perry. I appreciate you having me on. I'm excited. Well, thanks for accepting the invite. I'm excited, too. Thanks to you, we are finally closing the book on the Raimi films, and we've gone in reverse order, actually. We started with Spider-Man 3. Then a few months later, we did Spider-Man 2. And now, finally, we're doing the first Sam Raimi Spider-Man from 2002.
00:02:53
Speaker
Which is so weird to me because I thought for sure when I was looking at your list, I was like, oh, man, I don't know what to pick. I saw everything was already taken. And I was like, oh, Manuel, Spider-Man, the Raimi trilogy, especially, is kind of really close to home for me. So I was like, when I got down in that list, I saw the first one wasn't there. I was just so surprised because that one, I felt like, would be up for grabs right off the bat, you know? I know.
00:03:20
Speaker
It's funny because, well, I mean, the first part of this show, like the first 60 episodes, I was doing it with my late co-host and we were going back and forth. We would, you know, one of us pick a movie one week, the other one picking up the movie the next week. And he always liked to go for...
00:03:36
Speaker
sometimes he liked to do the big budget stuff, the ones that are more well known, but sometimes he wanted to go for the more obscure stuff that people haven't really seen. So a lot of, so especially early on, we didn't get to a lot of the big ones. And then now since I've been having the guest for him, I think a lot of people were probably like you, they probably just assumed, Oh, yeah, he's probably already done like Spider-Man and the Dark Knight and all that. But, but yeah, those are, those are actually two movies, we still haven't done the Dark Knight actually, either. That's one that's still a big one.
August Aguilar's Filmmaking Journey with Strange Films
00:04:04
Speaker
That's another... I mean, that would have been another one. I'm like, yeah, dude, Dark Knight, I could talk about that all day. Yeah. Me and my friends, my co-hosts on my podcast, we talk about the Sam Raimi trilogy all the time. And it's just funny because after we just got done talking about that and then me and you...
00:04:23
Speaker
you know, touch base and I saw your list and it wasn't there. And I'm like, Oh, this is so perfect. And I just rewatch Spider-Man one and two just like about like three, two or three weeks ago, but it was just, you know, it's just one of those things where it was like everything kind of at the same time, half clicked, you know, I was like, wow, that's pretty neat. Always nice when that happens. Before we jump too much into the movie, why don't you tell people a little bit about yourself?
00:04:45
Speaker
Yeah, so I'm a filmmaker. I run a production company called Strange Films. So we do a lot of independent horror films mostly. We kind of do like the Marvel storytelling approach where it's like everything's existing in a shared universe. So there's a lot of different characters you will see pop up every once in a while or there's like sequels to
00:05:09
Speaker
some of these films and just things like that. Even if you're watching a standalone approach, it's very friendly as far as anybody watching it. Anyone can just pick up anywhere and watch. Strange Films expands not only from the movie side of things, but we adapt our movies in the comic books since I'm such a comic book nerd. I love
00:05:30
Speaker
I grew up reading comics and everything as well. So we do comic books, we make music and art, and we do podcasts and everything as well. So it's a multi-media experience. I try to pitch it as a multi-media production company. But yeah, that's what we do. I'm the director and creator of everything, so pretty much my hands are on every single project, and I'm just trying to get our stuff out there, you know?
00:05:55
Speaker
awesome. So with these horror films, what's the kind of like style? Like, is it like supernatural horror? Is it like, you know, more real world style horror? What kind of field you go for with them? It's a, it's a bit of a mixed bag. I mean, so I can say firmly that
00:06:11
Speaker
The style and aesthetic of all the films, everything you watch is really 70s and 80s horror, like John Carpenter, just in that vein of filmmaking and direction. But as far as the themes of what's going on in every movie, it's a little bit of mixed back. So we've got movies that involve serial killers. We've got things that are creature features. We have demons. We've got aliens in one of them.
00:06:40
Speaker
We've got just like your run of the mill crazy person, just like anything that is, I think we call strange or bizarre is kind of where I fall into the category of our work. It doesn't have to be something that's so specific, but it's definitely influenced very much so by the 70s and 80s. So I have one film that's
00:07:03
Speaker
like super influenced by Texas Chainsaw Massacre, the original. And my newest film I just made is very much influenced by John Carpenter's Halloween. So it's just, you know, those kind of aesthetics you'll see consistently throughout all of our work, but it's, it's a lot of different kinds of characters and themes going on throughout it. Awesome. Where can people watch these too?
00:07:25
Speaker
Yeah, so all of our films are available to watch anytime for free on our website, strangefilmsstudios.com, or you can go to YouTube and just look up strange films, strange film studios, and you'll find all of our films on there. Like I said, they're free to watch. They're anywhere from, well, we mostly are short, so anywhere from five to like 26 minutes long.
00:07:48
Speaker
But the newest one I just put out is called He Comes to Kill and it's 50 minutes long since our first micro feature film that's out. It's actually doing really well on YouTube right now. So just look up He Comes to Kill and you'll find that. Awesome, very cool. We have to talk off, Mike, because I do some comic book stuff too and writing. So we'll have to touch base after Mike and that. Sure, of course. So now jumping to the superhero side of things, what kind of got you interested in
00:08:15
Speaker
maybe spider-man specifically or superheroes in general man it just began when i was like like such a young age you don't really even know what's going going on you know you just get handed things and you know you just that interest immediately sparks you you know and i remember specifically one christmas my uncle got me
00:08:35
Speaker
Two VHS copies of the original animated X-Men series, you know? And they had like two or three episodes on each VHS or whatever. Yeah. And so it was like one of those. He also got me a stack of comic books.
00:08:51
Speaker
And it was anything from, I mean, a lot of Marvel, a lot of DC, Justice League, Superman, Man of Steel, Spider-Man, everything. I mean, anything you think of the hits, but there's a lot of indie stuff in there, too, which at the time, I mean, I didn't know anything about, you know, but like it was just really interesting to see all these different covers and all these different like characters. And and I remember being really interested in these these stories, especially because superheroes were like,
00:09:18
Speaker
these these guys and gals who just were fighting crime or these villains. I love villains, too, at their early age, too, just like venom and things like that. And I just thought it was really interesting because it's all in this big, massive world that expands to other worlds. And there's they cross paths every once in a while and, you know, whatever. So it was just like year after year, I was getting handed down these things, different comic collections from my my uncle, my grandfather.
00:09:44
Speaker
my dad, and then obviously when I'm getting old enough to watch movies and stuff, I'm watching these old school, I think, I can't remember what some of the earliest stuff, I mean like Fantastic Four, the early Fantastic Four and Ghost Rider. Oh, the Roger Corman. Yeah, just like stuff like that. You're just watching things and you're like, oh, that's interesting. But also I grew up on those Fox cartoon shows like All the X-Men and Spider-Man and I watched the Batman animated series. So I'm watching all these cartoons in general,
00:10:13
Speaker
with all the comics and everything paired hand in hand. You know, I collected Pokemon, which I think all that stuff just really like, you know, Pokemon's not superheroes, but kind of hand in hand, it's just all that pop culture just really distilled that love for pop culture and comic books specifically. So growing up, I just was immediately a fan boy. I remember when the first Iron Man came out, you know, and
00:10:41
Speaker
That end tag where Nick Fury comes out is like let's do the Avengers Protocol. I lost my You know, I did I was like I went bananas dude and at that time what that's 2008. I think yeah, yeah, so I think I was like a sophomore junior in high school and I still was at that time I knew you know what that meant, you know, and I was like this is I can't believe they're doing this. Yeah, and now we're at this point where it's like, okay, we're I
00:11:11
Speaker
There's actually a little maybe too much going on, but I get excited about all that stuff still. That little kid in me screams superheroes and comic books, movies and everything else in between. Yeah, it's very exciting.
Influences from Animated Series on August's Career
00:11:29
Speaker
I've got a son now, so I'm really excited to share all that with him as he's growing up.
00:11:34
Speaker
Yeah, I've got two kids, too. I've got a son and daughter. They're both under two right now, so they're not quite in that space. But I'm trying to start grooming them early. Like, I've got them like a little group stuffed animal and stuff like that. Yeah. They got like Batman outfits. And so I've already got my daughter hooked. She's hooked on the Peacemaker intro song.
00:11:55
Speaker
Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah. Because I was watching, I was binging that series when we covered it. And every time that intro came on, you don't want to skip that intro. And she just loved that song. So like, it's now she still listens to it all the time. Yeah, it's funny, my kid, he's my son, he's, he's almost to be to my three months. And, and he, you know, it's funny when he, he registers when he hears something over and over again, like a theme song of an intro or something like that, because he'll be doing playing with a book or toys or whatever.
00:12:25
Speaker
Once he hears that theme song, he turns his head. It's funny because I know exactly what that means. You're watching that on repeat. She's probably like, whoa, hey. I'm a little bit older than you, but still about roughly the same generation. I think most people of our generation, they came in through that X-Men animated series or Spider-Man or Batman, the animated series.
00:12:50
Speaker
And then that kind of was like our gateway into comics and all that. And obviously it's influenced you because like you said, your films all have this like kind of connected universe feel to them too. Yeah, I mean, and the thing is, when I started making these films, so I started making them back in 2016. And it was just one of these things where it originally started off as like, I wanted to do a one shot like horror film because I was kind of getting back into filmmaking.
00:13:18
Speaker
But when we got such a good response and reception of things and we were thinking of wider long-term goals of what we wanted to do,
00:13:28
Speaker
It was just one of those things where we're like, wouldn't it be cool if we brought that character back into this story? And what if that character was tied into this and stuff like that? And it just really ended up becoming kind of like a comic book. Tales from the Crypt is a good example. You see that comic book anthology kind of style going on.
00:13:52
Speaker
But it's just one of those things where we're thinking, yeah, it'd be neat to bring back some of these characters for a future story, or it'd be cool to tie this Easter egg into this other story just to show that it takes place in the same world and stuff like that.
00:14:12
Speaker
It wasn't really at first, it wasn't intentional, but now it's kind of like, okay, we have all the, it's a sandbox of characters and settings and locations and scenarios. And it's like, if we have the right opportunity, we can pull from all these guys and things that we've done and just make it connect even more in the lore of strange films. And I think really that excitement when you first start
00:14:38
Speaker
kind of diving into that was, again, deeply rooted for my love of, like, world building comic books and superheroes. And you're just thinking like, oh, this is a neat opportunity. I could do this. Like, because at the time, also 2016, that's really the prime of like Marvel going on, too. Right. You're thinking, I mean, Captain America Civil War, I think, was just coming out like all these things are leading up to Avengers Infinity War and Endgame. And you're just thinking like, wow, what a neat thing that I remember going seeing Iron Man
00:15:08
Speaker
in the Nick Fury tagline with the Avengers and now we're about to get the Avengers like full-on blown like Infinity War crazy everything I mean we're seeing Black Panther on screen I never see I thought that would happen in my lifetime so it's just like Kevin Feige did such an amazing thing bringing this whole
00:15:27
Speaker
10 year plan together. So for me, I'm like, it'd be cool if I did something like that, just in my own way, you know, you know, so that's kind of just how it all sprawled out. And it's not like every decision is based off. We've got to connect. But, you know, it's cool to have those resources to do so. Right. It's nice when you can when you can pull into like, we need a character for this, but we've got these characters over here. Why don't we look and see what we got already? Yeah. Yeah. I do some of that with my own books as well. And it's fun to
00:15:56
Speaker
be able to have that kind of cross series promotion in a way and being able to bring in characters from different things. And you get some surprising favorites from the fans too, because I had done two series of my novels, my not shared urban fantasy universe. And when I was thinking about the third one, I decided, I'll ask the readers what they think. And when I pulled them, and I had a character in mind that I thought they were gonna choose.
00:16:24
Speaker
And, but I threw this other character in there. I'm like, well, let's just put this character in there too. He's popped up a bunch. Let's see what they think. And I just did it to kind of fill out the list. And the character I threw in to just kind of fill out the list was the one that overwhelmingly people wanted to read about. Oh, wow. Cool.
00:16:39
Speaker
So yeah, you never know what's gonna strike people. And that's part of the fun of it too. So then that kind of made me think like, okay, well, what can I do with this character now? So it's fun. It's a cool way to challenge yourself in that way too. For sure. It really is. And I never try to force it because I think when you try to force yourself in that corner, it can be a little sloppy or just obvious. But yeah, it is interesting when you're like, oh, that works right there.
00:17:06
Speaker
So in this new movie that we just did there we actually because I love superheroes so much we have our own
00:17:13
Speaker
superhero I like to quote Taitians air quotes in this is his name is the Royal Knight in our in our strange films universe and he's like he's like a blend between Batman and moon knight like he's kind of crazy like schizophrenic a little bit but he's like he's very DIY and just you know he wants to beat up bad guys and stuff like that but he has a couple short films on his own and he
00:17:37
Speaker
and he's done a couple like disappearances every once in a while, but in this new movie, it's just a background scene where people are partying in a house party and you can see the Royal Knight just like, you know, playing beer pong in the background and stuff like that. And I'm just thinking in my mind, whoever has followed along strange films and has maybe watched the Royal Knight, they're like, that's the Royal Knight right there. And that's just like a nice, for me, it's a nice little Easter egg, you know, to just throw in there. It doesn't have to be so obvious but it's like, hey, you know,
00:18:06
Speaker
And we're doing stuff like that every once in a while. Yeah. Another thing I like to ask people when they come on the show is what have you been interested in lately? Not for work or for podcasts or for films or anything like that, but what are you consuming right now just for fun that's gotten your interest? Comics, movies, video games, whatever it might be.
Balancing Filmmaking and Personal Life
00:18:28
Speaker
That's a good question. Well, I'm so busy, man.
00:18:33
Speaker
You know, I work full time. I've got my son that keeps me busy. And then for the longest time for the last like four or five months, I've just been working on this movie that I've been.
00:18:44
Speaker
just doing, you know, as far as shooting and editing and doing all the marketing and stuff like that, too. And the holidays are coming up. So I really haven't had too much time right now. I'm actually just I'm replaying Pokemon Sword and Shield. So I'm like, I'm kind of getting ready for the Scarlet and Violet Pokemon games because I am a huge Pokemon nerd. So I'm getting back into video games right now. Like I haven't like
00:19:06
Speaker
I haven't played video games in quite a while. I get my switch and it's kind of, I like the switch because it's a pick up and go, you know, over, you know, you know, young kids, you just sometimes you don't even have five minutes yourself. So yeah, it's nice. I can just kind of turn on the switch and I can play for 15 minutes or if I can, and then I can turn it off real quick and put it back on or whatever it is.
00:19:27
Speaker
I don't know. Other than that, man, I've just been trying to... Actually, it's funny because you were talking about you wrote novels, which I didn't realize, but I've been wanting to try my hand at writing a novelization of the strange films thing. We've adapted films to comics, but I've been wanting to do a film to a novel.
00:19:50
Speaker
And that's been something I've been wanting to pick up and just start going at it. Because I remember being a kid, I always wanted to write a book. And I was a writer more than anything as a kid. So that's probably been on my mind more than anything in the last few weeks. But I just really haven't gotten started on it yet. But we'll see. Sorry to not give you the most exciting answer there. Honestly, I've just been really busy.
00:20:19
Speaker
having the toddler I'm just not used to it's just it's just it's a lot of time you know and I know that I get an extra 15 minutes is sit down to myself I just let me sit down yeah I definitely hear you on that like I like video gaming too but it and I've got the like I've got the PS VR stuff and I've got all these VR games that I've barely been able to play because soon after we got it
00:20:42
Speaker
Is when my daughter started moving around so like and now and she gets so interested in the cables So like anytime I try and put it on she wants to touch play around with the cables and stuff like that cables Yeah, he dude. He's playing with the chargers like all the cables you can't I mean it's like if it's a loose cable whatever like he's like he's doing this thing where he just like likes to look at the end of the cable and just like Turn it around left and right like and he'll do that for like 20 minutes. I mean, it's crazy
00:21:10
Speaker
Yeah, it is. Anything I pull out, anything, he just has to try to see what's going on. Sometimes it's like, all right. I don't even know what I can do without him. Then once he's in bed, it's like, okay, I got an hour left where I got to go to bed.
00:21:30
Speaker
rest for a second, turn my person off, and catch up on messages or whatever. Watch this show. I've been putting it off for three weeks. It's just one of those things. Normally, I do try to invest myself into some extracurricular activity or something I'm interested in. A couple of years ago, before my son was born, on all my extra free time, I was trying to learn bass guitar. That was just one of those things.
00:21:56
Speaker
I'm no musician, but I love music so much. I was gifted a bass guitar. It was just one of those things where it's like, I want to learn something with this. Every morning and every night, I would take 30 minutes to an hour and I would just practice
00:22:12
Speaker
you know, bass guitar on YouTube, you know, YouTube tutorials and, you know, looking at bass tabs and stuff like that.
Exploring August's Podcasts
00:22:18
Speaker
And I miss doing stuff like that. But, you know, you got to prioritize, I guess, things that you want to do and work and extra cook or stuff like the podcast things, you know, working on my podcast. That's that's one big thing I do every week. But I have to like, I have to put aside two hours and make sure I have someone who can watch my son for those two hours. I can, you know, get the podcast done, upload it and all that good stuff. So it's just,
00:22:41
Speaker
It's a little tough when you got a kid, and I know you know that. Yeah. I don't think you mentioned your podcast. What's your podcast all about? Oh, yeah. Yes, there's actually two podcasts. The one is the Strange Films podcast, and that's really mainly where
00:22:56
Speaker
We do updates on everything going on, strange films, the films and any other projects we're working on. I bring in guests as far as people I've worked with before, as far as actors or other filmmakers or anything like that. I also bring in guests who make independent comic books or other filmmakers or anything.
00:23:17
Speaker
And yeah, it's just it's just one of those things we do commentaries on the films We've already shot and we watch him and stuff like that. So it's actually a newer newer podcast I've done interviews on YouTube and stuff for years now, but I finally like Finally was able to bring it all on Spotify and Apple. So I'm just kind of
00:23:35
Speaker
re uploading old stuff, I'm adding new stuff too. So there's a strange podcast on Spotify and Apple and other platforms. But the other podcast I like to do, which I guess would be my extracurricular activity is called it would be nice. And I do that with my other one of my best friends is named john Queener. He's another filmmaker friend of mine. And we just we we riff on life a little bit for the first half of it. So we take a subject that's like just bothering us in life like can't get a new job or
00:24:05
Speaker
too many. Why are people taking craps in the public bathrooms? There's five people taking craps next to each other. There's got to be a better way to do this in public restrooms. Just random things we put a fun spin on and laugh about. We usually talk movies at the last half of it or we talk our updates of what's going on. It spirals into random social commentary about anything and everything.
00:24:31
Speaker
That one's the main podcast that me and him, we work on every week. And that's, like I said, it would be nice. It's on Apple, Spotify, all the streaming platforms. And so it's a very much of a social commentary, comedy podcast. And then if you're looking specifically for strange films, we do have that outlet as well. Very cool.
Impact of Sam Raimi's Spider-Man 2002
00:24:51
Speaker
And we'll include I'll we'll give you a chance to talk about the links and all that at the end won't be in the show notes But but now let's talk Let's talk spider-man because this movie this movie came out my senior year in high school It was like a few months before graduation and I remember because you know, this was back before You know, this is back before like, you know buying stuff online became really common so I had like about
00:25:19
Speaker
And this, this showed me that, you know, there was something big happening with superhero movies because my circle of friends, there was like 20 of us. Everyone wanted to see this movie. And so like, and I wanted to buy tickets in advance to see it because I know that the theaters we went to around there that they, they sell out if you wait in the day of. So I would.
00:25:38
Speaker
You had to drive in person to theater to pick up the tickets, because I didn't have a bank account. I didn't have a debit card or anything like that. So I couldn't shop online. So I'd be driving up to the theater to pick up the tickets. And for a straight week leading up to this movie, almost every single day, there was another person who was coming up to me with money. He's like, hey, can you get our ticket, too? Can you get our ticket, too? And then we went there on the day of, and we had two or three cars. And everybody piled into the brim, driving everything.
00:26:08
Speaker
went over to the damn theater and then getting everyone inside and there was a it was a big event like I was like X-Men came out a few years before and that was pretty successful but nothing really kind of compared to what it was like when people went crazy over over this movie when it came out. Oh yeah man there's so many things I can
00:26:31
Speaker
kind of piggyback off of what you just said, because, you know, first of all, the nostalgic is kicking in where you're saying, you know, you have to go up to buy the tickets, you know, not online, everything like that. And I miss that man, because now you got to buy, you pretty much had to buy tickets online. And the other thing is about movie theaters and screenings that you had to buy, you just select your seats, you know, that kind of for and
00:26:52
Speaker
It's like I get it, but it's just like that raw nostalgic moment where it's like I miss just going up to the booth, getting a ticket, and then walking into the dark theater and trying to find your seat that you want to get. Sometimes it sucks, don't get me wrong, but Spider-Man came out-
00:27:11
Speaker
Yeah, so, you know, that was just like such a prime example of like, going to the movies and the excitement behind that and everything. But I was a little younger. So I can't remember, let's see, 2002, I was born in 92. So I guess 10, 11 years old, I was, I was kind of right there. And
00:27:31
Speaker
I remember going to the theater. I saw X-Men. I remember seeing X-Men in theaters before that. And I remember the excitement I had leading up to it and then watching it in theaters and being like, wow, like I cannot call X-Men like a live action X-Men in theater. So seeing Spider-Man, it did kind of take that feeling and elevate it to such a whole new level because seeing him like just, I think,
00:27:57
Speaker
I think the whole dynamics of X-Men, where you could kind of ground it pretty well, where it's like, yeah, I got mutant powers and everything like that. And there's some CGI there. But Spider-Man was such like a, he's web slinging. It's just like the costume, the aesthetic of New York and everything like that consistently flowing through that. And the Green Goblin was crazy. That excited me even more. And I remember specifically, it's a very odd memory, but I remember driving home from the theater
00:28:22
Speaker
And I'm looking out the side window of my mom and dad's car, and it's nighttime. And I just kept thinking, I was like, what if I saw the green goblin flying in the sky right there? I was scared of the goblin because he scared me when I was that young. But it's just funny because I remember that it was such a pivotal moment for me seeing Spider-Man, a live action Spider-Man, and how awesome it was. And then you just see like,
00:28:52
Speaker
I think everything went into full momentum right after that. Absolutely. As far as that standard. Yeah. Well, that comparison to X-Men, that's something I want to talk about too, the whole, the grounding of it, because there was a lot of discussion back then in the fan communities about like, well, how are they going to do the costume, right? Because the idea back then was you can't just take the costume from the comics and put it on screen. It doesn't look right, right?
00:29:20
Speaker
you know, memories of like Batman 66 and all that and it worked for Christopher Reeve, but it didn't seem to work for anybody else, right? There was something about Christopher Reeve in that Superman suit that it just worked in a way that anyone else who wears the Superman suit doesn't work the same way, not that classic spandex suit. So there's all this questions about like, what are they going to do? Alex Ross did his own kind of like fun design of it where it was
00:29:44
Speaker
you know, usually had a little bit of red, but everything else was mostly black. So a lot of people are like, what are they gonna do? Are they gonna do something like that? And then when Raimi released the first photos of the costume, and it's basically from the comics, except the webbing is, is raised is like, raised up on the costume, and we're just like,
00:30:02
Speaker
What? They're doing they're doing it from the comics. What is this? And, you know, I remember everybody going. It blew everybody's mind at the time. Right. It's funny to think of now and now seeing, you know, comics, accurate costumes is no big deal. But back then, that was a huge thing. Like nobody expected them to actually use the costume as it looked in the comics.
00:30:24
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, for me being that young at the time, it was, um, I wasn't quite aware of that. I knew watching X-Men that it wasn't like, Oh, this isn't like comic, what I'm used to seeing on the animated series or comic books. You know, like that's not overrated. Like, where's this yellow suit? You know, like I knew that, but like, I knew right away seeing Spider-Man and I was like, wow, this is Spider-Man to a T. Like this felt like Spider-Man and, uh, seeing that,
00:30:51
Speaker
You know, it was cool. I think obviously the Green Goblin was the one that didn't really have his comic accurate, you know, get up. But it's interesting because you saw, I'm sure you've seen the test footage of him doing the Green Goblin set and it was the comic accurate kind of look. I don't know if that would even really work, though, in the final outcome of the movie. You know, it's interesting to try to put it together, but I'm like, maybe it would look too cheesy or something, but it would definitely look looks cool in the test footage.
00:31:20
Speaker
of what they did. Yeah, the goblin look, the look of the goblin is one of the things that it still sticks with me all these years later that I still don't like what they did with the goblin. It just it looks a little bit too goofy. You know, he's got that big head with the fixed mouth and you could even see Willem Dafoe's face through the mesh on the mouth. So it that's that I feel like I'm at Disneyland every time I look at him. Yeah. Yeah.
00:31:43
Speaker
And the rest of the body suit, it's like something out of like a Power Rangers costume or something like that. So the goblin costume looks pretty goofy to me. And honestly, every time, especially after seeing No Way Home, which I'm sure you've probably seen, you've got Willem Dafoe in that and his mask gets damaged early on. And then after that, he's just using his own face. And I'm just like, you know, Willem Dafoe's, you know, got such a creepy face to begin with when he starts doing those contortions, just slap some green paint on him. And I think you'd be fine.
00:32:13
Speaker
For sure and I think you know probably What I'm sure happened in some degree is that I think at the time when they're doing the spider-man first that Sam Raimi's first spider-man It was almost kind of like okay, is this gonna work? Yeah, like is this Sam Raimi? Can you make a spider-man film? Is this gonna work? Are we gonna like
00:32:35
Speaker
Is this going to be a successful blockbuster hit? Because that's all, you know, Hollywood is like that in general. But superhero movies also at the time, especially, were pretty much like a gamble. I mean, even up until the late 2000s, it was a gamble until really the Marvel, you know, besides the Raimi trilogy, I'd say when Marvel and Kevin Feige stepped in officially,
00:33:00
Speaker
everything was kind of like, you know, whatever. But anyway, so it was it was a gamble to kind of go for it anyways. But it was like, I think he just or I'm sorry, I lost my thought there. But
00:33:18
Speaker
Oh crap, what was I even saying? I'll pick up on something you were saying. It's okay. It happens to me all the time. I know what it's like. But yeah, it was, you're right about the superhero movies at the time because you know,
00:33:31
Speaker
You had the Batman movies, which had gone from the kind of like the dark Gothic fantasy of Tim Burton to just kind of being like, you know, ending up at Batman and Robin. We had Spawn, which was an attempt to be darker, but didn't work, especially in retrospect. We covered that movie recently.
00:33:50
Speaker
And then you had like the really bad ones like you know you have like steel and stuff like that which is just like, you know, super low budget and just like nobody taking it seriously. X-Men took it seriously but like we said, they made it very grounded so I think
00:34:05
Speaker
Spider-Man was the first movie, honestly, probably since Superman, that really kind of took it seriously, was made by people who really kind of loved this character and loved this world, and who wanted to be true to the source material, right? They weren't embarrassed. Sam Raimi was not embarrassed about the fact that he was making a superhero movie.
00:34:25
Speaker
Whereas you look at like, sorry, I just want to finish this one thing. Like you look at Tim Burton, he was never really a superhero fan. He's like, you know, I just want to use this to explore the themes. You know, Brian Singer, not a superhero fan. He's just kind of like, yeah, this is just a paycheck for me, but I like, but I think it's kind of interesting, but I want to make it more serious. And Sam Raimi comes in and he's like, no.
00:34:50
Speaker
I'm a fanboy and I want to show you why I'm a fanboy." And he put that love of it up on the screen. Yes. I just remember what I was trying to say was you see that love of it through Sam Raimi and he delivers his own style of Sam Raimi films in his direction. You got Tony Maguire who is just lovable from start to finish.
00:35:21
Speaker
However you want to compare a Peter Parker to the other Peter Parker's that's live-action and who he is in the comics is is one thing but you everyone agrees that I think almost that Tony Maguire is just perfect for this trilogy, but I think when you watch Spider-Man 1 and you watch Spider-Man 2
00:35:41
Speaker
I'll quote my my good friend John Queen around this like it almost looks like Spider-Man 1 is kind of like a TV movie Spider-Man 2 because they like like I said, they were kind of like is this gonna work? You know make sure like we will give it we'll give it our all make sure it works But it did and that since it worked so well and flawlessly when you watch Spider-Man 2 everything just looks like a
00:36:06
Speaker
crisper like like brighter colors cleaner like like more special effects and everything into it like I mean I think it just you can see the the the success from Spider-Man 1 or 2 and how I think perfectly honestly like I
00:36:21
Speaker
Spider-Man 2 has always went down as one of the best superhero movies of all time. And I think it's just because Spider-Man 1 laid out that risk, that foundation of can we make Spider-Man? And you can. And it works so well. I mean, I still watch it. It's a comfort movie for me watching that movie. It really is. That whole trilogy is. But yeah, it laid the foundation down to kind of show that
00:36:51
Speaker
they can take these risks and they can go comic accurate to extent and they can also do their own thing and their own direction as well. And yeah, it's pretty awesome still to look back on.
00:37:06
Speaker
One of the things, yeah, just want to touch on Spider-Man 2, because we had covered that on the show.
The Timeless Quality of Spider-Man 2
00:37:11
Speaker
And when we covered on the show, it's one of those rare movies that one of those rare superhero movies that still holds up all these years later, because, you know, some of them you look back on, you're like, OK, you know, still pretty good, but it's still very much of its time. Spider-Man 2 has got a very timeless feel to it. Like it still holds up really well. And it I mean, you could release that movie today and I think it would still
00:37:35
Speaker
people wouldn't be like, hey, this feels like it's 20 years old, right? It still holds up really well. This one to a lesser extent, I think this one doesn't quite hold up as well. But in Spider-Man 2, there's something magical about that. But going back to this one, what were some things that kind of jumped out at you when you were rewatching it?
00:37:57
Speaker
Well, you know, it's kind of like what you said where Spider-Man 2 is really like everything about it is a timeless feel to it. Spider-Man 1, I would say that a lot of it does feel timeless to me, but I think some of the get-ups are a little like, yeah, you know, like the Green Goblin is one of the things where it's like, it's an obvious thing. You're like, ah, man, they could have done better on that.
00:38:20
Speaker
whatnot. But I don't know. I mean, I think really the nostalgic feel that gets when I rewatch Spider-Man now, it's just it's just a little quirky moments that Peter Parker and Tobey Maguire, you know, portrays.
00:38:37
Speaker
as as Peter Parker, you know, and just like him discovering himself as Spider-Man. It's just a really authentic feel to it, I think. And it's it's a little heartwarming to see, you know, like I just love when he's on the rooftop and he's like, go Web, you know, and just trying to get his web the webs to come out. And, you know, it's it's funny to see a lot of the stuff that happened in this old Spider-Man movie.
00:39:05
Speaker
that maybe, you know, comic accurate people would be like, I could have been like this or whatnot. But, you know, we all didn't know 20 years later, no way home would come out and.
00:39:19
Speaker
you know, it ties everything back into it. And then they're even addressing the web, you know, his organic web shooters and stuff like that. I think that's just, you know, it's just interesting to see from a launching point of this first movie, they just stayed true to what they wanted to do. And it worked so well. But
00:39:42
Speaker
Yeah, I'd say the wrestling match is always a fun thing to watch from it. You know, Peter Parker, just like I said, just his first kind of coming. I really love that that hallways fight scene with him and flash. He's like, I don't want to fight you, Flash. And it's so funny because I was laughing.
00:39:59
Speaker
I was laughing so hard last time I rewatched it and he's like, I don't want to fight you Flash. And Flash is like, yeah, I don't want to fight me neither. And I just think of that meme because there's so many memes now with like just some other random circumstance and it's just a picture of Flash saying that same context. There's so many memes now out of that first movie with William Defoe going, yeah, I'm somewhat of a scientist myself. I laughed when he said that lied. And then they said that no way home. I was like, come on, this is great.
00:40:27
Speaker
You had mentioned the organic web shooters, and I remember at the time, leading up to this movie, there was tons of, you know, like, I mean, Spider-Man fandom is some of the most merciless fans you'll ever find if you see
Organic Web Shooters Controversy
00:40:42
Speaker
them on Twitter. I mean, it's, and this was before Twitter, and people were, I remember on the old message boards and stuff, people were getting, you know,
00:40:49
Speaker
People were sharpening the knives up when they heard about the organic web shooters. Me personally, I thought it actually made a lot of sense. Now I've kind of come around on it, but at the time I remember thinking, organic web shooters makes a lot of sense. And even as a kid, when I read those old Spider-Man stories, I'm like, why do they give him mechanical web shooters? Why not just have it come out of him? So I remember thinking that as a kid, too. And so when I saw this movie, I'm like, no, that makes sense. That sounds fine.
00:41:20
Speaker
When we got into the amazing Spiderman movies and they brought back mechanical web shooters and then especially in the in the MCU when they really focus on the fact that it's it's about you know
00:41:32
Speaker
Peter's ingenuity and all that and I'm like, okay. Yeah, I I get the I get him now but at the time I thought the organic web shooters made a lot of sense and What about you? What did you think of them? I never had a problem with them, you know, I really didn't I I thought it was interesting I mean again, I was a little younger so I I guess maybe at the time it wasn't kind of like in that debate where mm-hmm
00:41:54
Speaker
Why aren't they using mechanical web shooters? So even when I was just a few years older and I realized, oh, Spider-Man, he's supposed to have mechanical web shooters, I still never had a problem with the organic. I thought it was cool. I just thought it was an interesting point of view, I guess, as far as that world.
00:42:11
Speaker
goes and then even as I got older and I was really more into comic books and and I respect the the lore of the characters and everything comic accuracy and everything like that I still never had a problem with Sam Raimi's decision to do the organic web shoes I don't even know if he ever came out and said why they went the organic route
00:42:31
Speaker
But I still think it's just a unique point of view for Spider-Man, and I don't think it's so out of character. I mean, the fact that he gets bitten by this spider, this radioactive spider, or, you know, the spider that gives him powers and...
00:42:46
Speaker
you know, that he's now embedded with all these Spire abilities. And I mean, the web, I just felt like it was natural. I thought that, you know, at the beginning, I was like, yeah, I thought that's how it was actually supposed to be. But so yeah, I mean, now, yeah, like you said, with Tom Holland and Andrew Garfield, when they did their mechanical web shooters, I thought,
00:43:07
Speaker
Oh, I see. It is to show his super scientific side of Peter Parker to always have these web tutors on hand. And that's just one of his crutches, I guess, to keep up his ability as Spider-Man. But I never had a problem with it. And I just, again, it goes right back to that no way home thing where it comes full circle where you're like,
00:43:30
Speaker
They're all debating on it. That was a really fun moment for me and I'm sure you and everyone else who never had a problem with that organic shooter. Yeah, I did love that when he's like, how do I do breathing? I just do it. It doesn't come out of anywhere else.
00:43:55
Speaker
Now I want to talk a little bit about Tobey Maguire. And I think you were right. Like when you were saying that he's, he's really kind of perfect for this trilogy.
Portrayals of Peter Parker: Tobey vs. Tom
00:44:02
Speaker
Um, looking back, you know, even at the time I kind of felt this way about him, but like, I always felt like Tobey Maguire is perfect as Peter Parker. Like he has that, especially when you get into Spider-Man two, when he's, um, when he's nerding out with, with Doc Ock in the, in the lab and everything, or in this one, when he's talking about the spiders and he's all like excited and wild eyed.
00:44:24
Speaker
and Harry's like, Peter, only you would think, why would you think I think that interesting? He's like, who wouldn't think that's interesting, right? You really kind of buy the fact that he is this big science geek. Andrew Garfield, like he tried, but I don't feel like Andrew Garfield really kind of nailed the science geek side of things as much, even though I do love Andrew Garfield's performance overall. But when it came to the Spider-Man side of things, I felt like
00:44:50
Speaker
and partly this is probably the script but Tobey Maguire is just not a wise cracker right that's just kind of like not in his in his personality and it's really really kind of hard for him to do it the few times when he does try to make jokes in these movies they they just seem to fall flat for me oh yeah yeah no you're totally right um
00:45:12
Speaker
Yeah, he's got a you're right. I think he's a great Peter Parker. I mean, he's just got that awkward charm that he carries, you know, he's a nerd, he looks the part he's, you know, you feel you feel for him on all the emotional levels, and anything in his life, you know, and I think there's a lot about
00:45:34
Speaker
tow McGuire that just that scream Spider-Man because of that foundation he laid out in that trilogy. But when you look at it as far as an overall
00:45:43
Speaker
um franchise with all these live action spider-man now and even going forward in the future you're like okay spider-man can be a little he needs to be a little bit more on the cuff you know when he's with you know these uh uh because he is very like you know with his villains he's just you know he he likes to talk smack with him he's real quick about it and even um i can't think of a specific example with uh part one but i know with part two with he's fighting doc ock he's you know he says something you know just something
00:46:13
Speaker
like you said just flat you know it's just like i just remember watch just rewatching and i was like oh he tried talking smack there but it's not like it's not like a quick gimmick it's just it's kind of just a flat like uh you know whatever and that's fine for that for what it happened for what it was in the the trilogy of sam ramy because i think again even though from part one to part two and three it jumps as far as quality and maybe um
00:46:38
Speaker
being as colorful as it was. It's still very grounded for what Spider-Man was in this whole trilogy. And I think Tom McGuire holds that pretty closely to his portrayal of Peter Parker and his portrayal of Spider-Man. You can almost compare it to like Christian Bale on the Dark Knight. I mean, it's very grounded in that world. And I don't think in that world, a
00:47:02
Speaker
very, very animated, colorful, off the cuff, Spider-Man would exactly work. I just think it's just... Tom McGuire did what he did and it worked out perfectly how it was. But yeah, I just think more of the emotional side of Peter Parker and Spider-Man and the
00:47:20
Speaker
the awkwardness, he definitely the scientist nerd, I definitely he thinks he nails it. I mean, Andrew Garfield, I'd say he was a great spider man. Absolutely. Yeah. Peter Parker, I think he had a great look to him. But like you said, he maybe just didn't really there's something about his emotional and scientific side. I was like, yeah, but he was a great spider man. And obviously, we all love
00:47:41
Speaker
Andrew Garfield, especially seeing him come back in their way home. Tom Harlan, he's a good mix. I think he's a good balance in both of them. I think there probably could be better. I think there could be things that could be improved either way, but he's definitely a good balance of the two.
00:47:56
Speaker
But, you know, Tom McGuire, I just think as we look at it from being such an early and mid 2000s kind of style and being as grounded as it is and as awkward and charming as it is, I think he just nails it in that sense. But he's definitely not like that, that Spider-Man we're used to in like the comics or the the the animated series or anything like that. And Tom Holland does a great job with the
00:48:22
Speaker
the, you know, off the cuff, you know, kind of talk smack with the villains and stuff like that. And Andrew Garfield was leaning towards that, too, as far as Spider-Man goes. Yeah, you hit on exactly what I and, you know, listeners are probably tired of hearing me say this because I say it every time these three actors come up. But yeah, I think, you know, Tobey Maguire was a great Peter Parker, not so great as Spider-Man. Andrew Garfield was the opposite. He was greatest Spider-Man. His Peter Parker, I mean, you know, and it's not saying their their other interpretations were bad. It's just like not what I think of.
00:48:51
Speaker
And his Peter Parker felt kind of like he was a loner or an outcast by choice, right? It didn't feel like oh, yeah It didn't feel like he was he was put upon or he was bullied or anything like that It just kind of felt like yeah, he's you know, he's Peter Parker. He just kind of does his own thing That's more like what it felt like and and but and but Tom Holland he and one of the things I like about Holland when he does the off the cuffs and the witty stuff is spider-man is
00:49:17
Speaker
It's like, he's got like a nervous energy to it. So he really nails home the idea that this is him as Spider-Man making jokes to cover up the fact that he's fricking terrified. Whereas Garfield Spider-Man just felt naturally witty. So it didn't feel like he was covering up for anything.
00:49:35
Speaker
I agree with you on that for sure I agree with you on that for sure. Yeah and then again back to McGuire it's just like whatever he was saying in the moment of those fight scenes it's just kind of like it felt just very written you know yeah like it was just kind of like well that was part of the script and he said it and he didn't it wasn't like that nervous energy or that
00:49:56
Speaker
that true Spider-Man, you know, form of, uh, talking smack, you know, it was just, he just said his dialogue and he's carrying on the scene. And it's not a bad, they're not bad scenes. It's just, it's just interesting how he talks compared to the other Spider-Man, you know? And, um, but yeah, I mean, but you do feel for Tobey Maguire throughout the movie. I mean, you know, he's getting picked on in school, you know, the bus leaves them in the beginning, you know, and stuff like that. Like the Mary Jane, that's a whole, I think the whole Mary Jane arc.
00:50:26
Speaker
Part one two and three is so much more emotional than anything that has been portrayed in the other movies and and just like I think I think you just feel for Tobin you relate to Toby a little bit more maybe just as like a regular guy and being kind of this nerdy kid and stuff like that but yeah when you're when you're looking as as far as the Spider-Man goes it could have been a little better but it's definitely a
00:50:53
Speaker
Yeah, it's interesting to see now from the whole, you know, point of view with all of them. I think it's funny you mentioned the MJ thing because that's actually one of the weakest things for me in these movies. Yeah. It's like these these movies don't do either Kirsten Dunst or MJ as a character any favors. I mean, of the three, I think this is the one where she gets the best treatment in the script. But even still, it's not a great treatment like her
00:51:20
Speaker
Compared to the other ones, I thought of all of them, I think Andrew Garfield and Emma Stone had hands down the best chemistry. Peter and Gwen, I was fully invested in that. Then when she dies at the end of Amazing Spider-Man 2, spoilers for a movie that's over 10 years old now.
00:51:43
Speaker
But, you know, I like I felt for that even and as many we talked about that like as many problems as that movie has like the Peter and Gwen stuff of it was just always on point and that
00:51:55
Speaker
And even so, when they brought it back in No Way Home, and he saves MJ at the end of that movie, and almost the exact same way where he wasn't able to save Gwen, and he almost breaks down after he does it. I felt that even now when I watch that movie a few times, I still feel that. For sure.
00:52:15
Speaker
I had with McGuire and Dunst, they never had that same kind of chemistry that Garfield and Stone had or that or Holland and Zendaya have I never really kind of felt it. And just like some of the I think part of this is just Ramey style. He's
00:52:34
Speaker
Raimi's a cheese ball. I mean, let's be honest, he is. He's a total cheese ball. And that works when you're doing stuff like, you know, The Evil Dead or when you're doing Doctor Strange. I feel like his cheese ball humor and style of writing really works for that.
Sam Raimi's Style and Character Analysis
00:52:50
Speaker
When he's doing it and he's trying to write and he's trying to portray these scenes of like Peter and MJ having these hearts to heart, it does not work for me at all. Like the scene when they're at Aunt May's bedside and he's saying, he's like, when you look into her eyes and all this kind of stuff, I'm just like, just stop, just please stop, please stop. This is going on way too long. I can totally see that on your end.
00:53:14
Speaker
I feel like I guess I am a little bit of the opposite though. I honestly thought Andrew Garfield and Emma Stone were a little cheesy watching them together. Maybe just a little too on the nose. But I will say, obviously, part two of Amazing Spider-Man 2, when Gwen Stacy dies, that is a traumatic emotional
00:53:34
Speaker
moment. And then again, what you just say with no way home when it comes back full circle, and he says MJ and he breaks it. I mean, in the theater, I was like, Oh, I'm like, I felt I feel those things. And even when Hollen and Zendaya, I just for I don't know for McGuire and Kirsten Dunst, I just there's a there is something that maybe
00:53:59
Speaker
It is kind of on the nose, slight rom-com style, like cheesy. But again, I think I'm just so invested with Tom McGuire and so emotionally attached as far as like his, what I'm seeing him go through as Peter Parker and him discovering himself as Spider-Man and his massive crush on MJ. It's kind of just one of these things where I'm like, it's really forgiving for me. I'm like, oh man, this like,
00:54:27
Speaker
This is what he wants. This is what he needs. But he's also like, he's conflicted. He doesn't know what to do. You know, at the ending of it, it is cheesy when he's at the, you know, the funeral. And he's like, and she's like, I love you in the in the kiss. And he's like, I can't be with you. Like, you know, and it's just like this back and forth pool, the whole trilogy. But I love it so much. I just think it's a I love watching
00:54:56
Speaker
Toe McGuire go through it. I don't know why I just I just do but I just for whatever reason Not to knock Andrew Garfield because I think he's a brilliant actor I think the script was he was just given the script and everything and but he's a great spire man, but I just think his Peter Parker in those first two movies and a lot of those dynamics of being the nerd being
00:55:21
Speaker
in love with Gwen Stacy and everything. I just thought they were maybe a little too on the nose for me. Just a little too obvious or cheesy in my end. But that's the cool thing about Spider-Man and seeing these three trilogies that we've got now is just to see who loves who. Everyone loves all these Spider-Man and different portrayals of
00:55:43
Speaker
Peter Parker's and everything and everyone's got their own opinions on them and whatnot. But it's just so great to know that the one we're talking about today was Sam Raimi's original Spider-Man just set the ground floor for it all. And I think just no one was prepared for it.
00:56:00
Speaker
No, absolutely not and that's why kind of where I lost my train of thought earlier was like, you know Hollywood and and Sony took a chance on this spider-man movie because they didn't know I don't I really don't think they knew exactly how it was gonna go down It did so well, but they kept it at a grounded level I think yes kept to that grounded level and that's I think that's why it works so well because it's not a
00:56:24
Speaker
so in your face and so in a fantasy where it could have been a little too much in the first round of things. I think Kirsten Dunst too, I think when they're writing MJ's character in a lot of these movies,
00:56:44
Speaker
they're kind of writing her as not the best person. She's dating Flash at the beginning when he's obviously a total asshole. And we never see any reason why what she sees in him for him to actually be endearing to her. When she's with Harry, she's constantly making these eyes at Peter when she's talking with him in the hospital. And she's like, well, what are you talking about, Peter? And all this kind of stuff.
00:57:14
Speaker
You've got you're dating his roommate. What are you doing? Oh, yeah And then not the best part one because she even when she's with Harry she kissed a spider-man Yeah, she's obsessing over spider-man. I think she get I think the worst is in
00:57:30
Speaker
Well, part two is pretty bad when she's obviously in love with Peter and then she still agrees to marry this other guy, who's like the nicest guy on the planet. And then she dumps him at the altar. Like I felt that ending, it just, I loved it at the time when I saw it in the theater, but looking back on it now, I'm just like, oh God, this ending is so painful. Yeah, it's pretty gut wrenching. She's not, I mean, as far as the MJ character in the trilogy, she's not a good person. No, she's not. He's just like, she's bouncing back and forth between Spider-Man,
00:57:59
Speaker
Peter Parker, Harry, I mean, like you said, in part two, she's with Jonah Jameson son, and she's like, even trying to recreate the Spider Man kiss and make sure that he's not Spider Man, you know, like, she's like, she's just like, her mind's always on another guy. I think yeah, part three with Peter.
00:58:15
Speaker
but she gets back with Harry a little bit like she they're cooking like food together and you know they like kiss and it's just like well it's just always like she's always like interested in something else is keeping her attention and how happy she is but yeah I mean outside of that though uh just I think it I think it's really more of a for me the perspective with Toby and Peter Parker and it's like
00:58:42
Speaker
He always wanted MJ. You knew he wants MJ. He's having a hard time trying to figure out how to...
00:58:49
Speaker
be with MJ and then when he's even can get MJ, he's trying to balance Spider-Man. I just think all those like really, those approaches to his character was great for me. What about James Franco? So I know, you know, first disclaimer, the guy's obviously a scumbag now we've come to learn, but- We've discovered. Yeah, but that aside, I mean, like looking back on these three movies, I think,
00:59:17
Speaker
In all three movies, even in Spider-Man 3, which has tons of problems with it, but I always felt like his performance in Spider-Man 3 was still one of the strongest parts of that movie. It's a consistent performance throughout all these. He really sells it as Harry in these three movies. What about you? What do you think?
00:59:37
Speaker
Yeah, no, I completely agree. I think, you know, despite who the guy is that we've come to learn, I've always been a huge fan of James Franco and on all of his movies. So seeing him that early on with this Harry Osborn character, it was, I think it was always been a treat for me. But seeing him, like you said, being very, very consistent,
01:00:01
Speaker
through all three parts. And his character arc goes pretty dramatic in those three three arcs, too. And I think that just makes such a difference because you've got this best friend who turns villain, but ultimately they're friends at the end, you know, kind of deal in or, you know, he's going to help Peter save the day at the end of it at the end of it all. And
01:00:27
Speaker
I really always liked Harry Osborn or James Franco as Harry Osborn. I just thought it was a really good dynamic, especially at the time he bounces off well with Tony McGuire. And yeah, I just think it's great to see
01:00:43
Speaker
I really like him in part one, um, because he kind of plays like the innocent Harry Osborn, you know, not really, he's oblivious to a lot of things. There's a little bit, you start to see the lot, the jealousy kind of come out with it's really because of MJ throughout the whole thing. But the part two, I think is my favorite where he just, he, he knows he wants Spider-Man dead, you know, and he, he knows
01:01:06
Speaker
Toby Peter Parker is working. He takes photos of him. So there's that heated dynamic between them base cocky also because he's running Oscorp now and you know, it's just one of those it's a really great portrayal to see like Harry go from like the student to the CEO of Oscorp and this vendetta against spider-man and then ultimately discover his his father's
01:01:32
Speaker
goblin throne and takes on the mantle. I do think part three, it gets a little cheesy with him going through the amnesia and stuff like that, but part three is- And the magic butler at the end. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But as far as James Franco
01:01:51
Speaker
portraying the character throughout the whole Moot trilogy, I never had a problem with and I still like watching. I mean, even with all the problems in Three, I thought his dark turn and after he gets his memory back, I thought he
01:02:07
Speaker
as as terrible as that plot line is with the amnesia like you know franco does such a great job you could eat like that that pie scene and i love that pie scene oh dude yeah yeah because i watched three like i don't know a year ago or something and
01:02:24
Speaker
and i forgot about the pie scene and i just was like oh man how devilish of him you know um although one note about spider-man 3 uh before we get back to spider-man um you know when we covered that anthony does yado who came on to to cover that uh
01:02:40
Speaker
movie with me. He had watched what's called the editor's cut of that movie and it rearranges some stuff and it has like a different way for Harry to kind of come into the realization at the end. So I haven't seen the editor's cut, but from what he was saying, it sounds like a much better movie. So really? Yeah. So maybe give that a try. Apparently that's on Amazon. So that's apparently a much better version of it.
01:03:03
Speaker
Oh, I'll have to look into that. I never heard of that. Yeah, I was surprised too. At first, I thought he was talking about some sort of a fan edit or something, but no, it's a legitimate cut. It's available on Amazon and stuff like that. Oh, okay. Yeah, I'll have to check into that. Yeah, my buddy John, he...
01:03:21
Speaker
He defends Spider-Man 3 to the day he dies. He loves Spider-Man 3. I swear to God. He loves it so much. I don't hate it. I just think it could have been a lot better. I know there's a lot of problems with it and whatnot. It is what it is. He defends that movie all the time. I'm going to ask if he's aware of that editor's cut or not. I didn't know about that.
01:03:44
Speaker
So I want to talk about Willem Dafoe and Norman. Yes. I love Dafoe's performance. I think if you're going to get somewhat you want someone to play Norman Osborn, Green Goblin them.
01:03:55
Speaker
It's hard to think of anybody who could do a better job than Willem Dafoe. I mean, he's, you know, he comes off as like, when he's Norman, you know, before the transformation, he comes off as very kind of charming with other people. You could see how this guy's this, you know, successful businessman, but you also see the relationship he has with Harry and how hard he is on Harry and just like, and just that,
01:04:20
Speaker
that very quick scene in that intro when he when he's with Harry in the car then he introduces himself to Peter you see those two sides of him boom right away he establishes that and when he you know cost him a side when he's in the goblin persona and one of my favorite scenes is when he's talking himself in the mirror and he's switching back and forth it's almost like a physical transformation he does yes and I was just gonna make that note because um so William Defoe obviously is an amazing actor but that
01:04:51
Speaker
on and off switch that he just does throughout the movie. I mean, it's scary. There's a lot of parts of William DeFoe's performance in that whole movie where I remember being a kid, I was scared. I was just creeped out by the fact that it's a really dark performance and the way he just gets that low growling kind of voice.
01:05:17
Speaker
He just turns it on and yeah, he just does a really great job. I think it is hard to think if there will be another Green Goblin in that vein. I don't think there will be anytime soon because he came back in No Way Home, which I'm glad they brought him back for that, you know, appearance. But he is, I just think from the start, like you said, he just kind of has that
01:05:45
Speaker
Persona of the charming father like but he's hard on Harry, but he loves he likes Peter He's very interested in Peter, but then he you can tell like he's working on this thing with Oz Corp It does it goes wrong. So he takes his own hands and it's just like oh man, it goes balls to the wall from there and I think one of my favorite performance or one of my favorite scenes I guess in the movie is the Thanksgiving dinner because I love when
01:06:11
Speaker
He realizes Peter is Spider-Man. Yeah. And with the blood. And then he flips the switch like goblins taking over. He knows like something's wrong. And he starts yelling at Harry in the hallway so loud that Mary Jane is hearing it.
01:06:30
Speaker
from the the living room and she's like and you know it's just it's so ruthless he goes from like trying and even when like um aunt may is like she slaps his hands like he's like you know lix's finger you know from cutting the turk like just those little moments when when goblin has really kind of taken over himself uh for the most part but it's right after that scene i think he goes back to that mirror and he's like
01:06:56
Speaker
I can't, you know, it's a goblins just like talking them down, man. And I just think it's a really great performance. And it's his laugh is his charm. His Oh, God, the laugh. Yeah, everything in it. I think he just did such a great job. He is like a dark and kind of scary part of that movie. But he's definitely I mean, you can't you can't replace that, you know.
01:07:21
Speaker
My one problem with the Goblin in the movie, it has nothing to do with Defoe's performance. It just has to do with the writing because I don't feel like after he kills the board of Oscorp, I don't feel like they ever really give him a reason to keep putting on the Goblin suit. I mean, I understand the motivation for Doc Ock and the second one. And even in the third one, I understand why, at least Sandman in the first part of the movie, I understand. Venom, I totally understand. Harry, I totally understand.
01:07:49
Speaker
And even in the Holland movies too, in the Garfield movies, for the most part, they give a good reason for why the villain is doing what he's doing. In this movie though, I feel like he's just being the goblin after he kills the board, just because he likes being evil is what it kind of feels like.
01:08:08
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I guess that's true. I mean, you know, because the whole reason why he puts that goblin suit on, or I mean, the glider and everything in the serum is because, you know, the serum thing that he was trying to test, they would disapprove. So he was like, I'll just do it myself. And then it goes wrong.
01:08:27
Speaker
And then next thing you know, you hear the glider is gone and he kills the boar and everything. And I think, yeah, like you said, I think he just likes the anarchy. I think he likes the chaos. I think the goblin persona just kind of took over at that point because I think it's really about that speech him and Peter are on the roof top talking about. And he's just pretty much saying like,
01:08:50
Speaker
you know, imagine what he's like, he's telling Spider-Man like, you can be the hero, you can be everything you want for them, but they still won't care about you. He's like, so imagine what we can do together, because we both are these like unstoppable forces, you know. And I think it's just, I think he's got that power and it just doesn't, it's just gone to his head, you know, there's, and I like that about a villain though, I think some villains have to have that kind of just pure chaos momentum.
01:09:19
Speaker
There is a great, you know, when you find a villain that's got a great backstory who they were probably they were trying to be good people, but turned villain, that's a great perspective. But I think maybe for this one, since it wasn't so explained, I think it just kind of went straight into it. It worked out. Good deal. Yeah, it's it's cool to have a villain who's just pure chaos. And I think
01:09:43
Speaker
I just feel like I feel like they should have done something more to build up like the power hungry aspect of his character. I think then it would have made a whole lot more sense. I just feel like they weren't really invested too much in why Norman's doing what he's doing. And that was a lesson they obviously learned because even in No Way Home too with Norman, especially like his motivation makes so much more sense in that movie.
01:10:10
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. The only thing that bothers me in No Way Home is that him and Tom McGuire actually don't talk. Yeah, yeah, that's a good point. And I found myself missing that too, because there's also, and it's one of those things it's touched on very briefly in this movie, the fact that Peter is the son that Norman always wanted.
01:10:30
Speaker
We get a few hints of that here and there, like when he first meets Peter and then later on when after they move in together and he's offering Peter a chance to, and Peter says, I want to make my own way. And Norman's very respectful of the fact that Peter's doing it on his own, doesn't want any help. And there's this kind of subtle indication that he resents Harry a little bit because Harry's always relying on his father. Yeah, yeah.
01:10:54
Speaker
And at the end when um when they're they have that confrontation scene in the final battle when he says i've been like a father to you be a son to me like i feel like that is the motivation there but you have to bring in the fact that he knows that peter is spider-man earlier and
01:11:10
Speaker
And I feel like if I was doing a rewrite of this script, I would probably have the spiders be engineered by Oscorp and have Norman figure it out a lot earlier than he does. And that kind of being the momentum, the fact that Peter has this strength that he always wanted in the sun that Harry doesn't have. But it's one of those aspects that it's not really played up as strong as I think it could have been. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.
01:11:36
Speaker
Um, I think one last thing I really wanted to touch on here and that is the, uh, I think hands down, I think the, my favorite performances throughout all these movies is, and the one actor that I don't think you could ever replace. And that's J.K. Simmons as, uh, Jake. Of course, consistent throughout everything. Um, well, yeah, I mean, obviously he's got the look down. He's got the voice down. He's got the attitude down. Um,
01:12:08
Speaker
from the start with part one, it's just established that he's, you know, J Jonah Jameson. And it's just, oh, it's just such a treat to see him, you know, on screen and yelling and at Spider-Man and all that stuff. And then, and then I love, I think when part one, my favorite part with him would be where he's like,
01:12:30
Speaker
Uh, I think he, I think he's, for a second, he's like maybe doubting or he's, he's thinking maybe he got Spider-Man wrong. And then like, and then there's something that happens and, uh, oh, Goblin comes. Yeah. Goblin crashes into the office and, and he's like taunting, uh, Jameson. He's like, where's Spider-Man? And then Spider-Man comes and he's like, I knew you two were together. And he's like, you know,
01:12:54
Speaker
Like, it's for a second, right before all that happens, he's kind of like, you know, maybe Spider-Man's a good guy or something. And then when he sees Spider-Man confront Goblin, he's like, I knew you two were in together. He's like, ah, he's like, shut it. James Webb's his mouth and whatnot. But dude, it's just perfect portrayal, you know, and it's such a it's such a treat that we got to see him back in the newer movies. You know, one thing I missed about it, though, is he they got to get they got to bring the flat top back.
01:13:21
Speaker
Dude, they have to. That is the one thing that's a little bit of a bummer about. He's just got, he doesn't have that look anymore. I mean, exact look anymore. But, but yeah, no, he's a, you can't ask for a better Jay Jones and Jameson. I mean, he's perfect. Yeah. The, one of the things that still cracks me up is when, when Peter's like, he's like, you can't say that stuff about him. That's Slender's like, no, it's not. He's like, Slender's spoken in print. It's libel.
01:13:47
Speaker
But also, one of the things I like too about it is they give him that moment where it shows that he's got another side to him. Like you said, in that scene when Goblin comes after him, and he says, who's the photographer who takes pictures of Spider-Man, right? Jonah comes in, he defends Peter, right? He says, I don't know, his stuff comes in through the mail. It's a very small beat, but it shows that even despite this tough attitude, he's got this softer side to him.
01:14:15
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah, he definitely, there's little moments of that throughout the whole trilogy. I can't remember which movie it is. I think it's part three though, but I mean, he's wanting to take a photo and he takes a little girl's camera. Oh yeah. Sam Raimi's daughter actually in that scene.
01:14:34
Speaker
Oh, is that really? Okay. But yeah, no, he just has little moments that are just not so harsh, but it's heartwarming. And at the same time, it's true to his character and everything. It's really telling that in Amazing Spider-Man 2, because they couldn't get Simmons back, but they didn't want to replace him. So they just had him communicate with Peter through email. Oh, yeah, yeah.
01:14:58
Speaker
Yeah, so it would have been interesting to see how far they would have went with the Amazing Spider-Man series. I know they had such a plan with that whole franchise of Andrew Garfield. I don't know if they would have been able to bring him back or what, but it is nice to know that, I'll never forget watching Far From Home, that end credit scene where J. Jonah Jameson pops back up and I was like, ah! I lost my shit in the theater when I saw that. I know, I did too. I was like, ah, God.
01:15:24
Speaker
so so perfect that he was able to come back from no way home and you know it's obvious he clearly loves this character because he's voiced the character in a bunch of other stuff like the spider-man video game a lot of the animated shows he's come back to do the voice and yeah it's just such a treat and i hope they
01:15:40
Speaker
Like I, in some ways I like what they, I like the kind of like Alex Jones version that they used in the MCU. But at the same time, I do kind of miss the, the J Jonah Jamison who is like, you know, at his heart, he is a, he is a decent
Multiverse and Modernization in Spider-Man
01:15:55
Speaker
guy. And so I would wish you could bring some more of that back. I'm not sure how they can, I mean, you know, now that we're gonna get into multiversal stuff, maybe there can be some, some stuff that happens after the, after secret wars and all that, where they can fiddle with the timeline and stuff.
01:16:10
Speaker
Yeah, well, I took the modern approach to where he you know, he's he's doing his news from a green screen You know, it's not like it's not like the Daily Bugle as we know, right? Traditionally, so it's it's interesting how they kind of very much modernized his character. Yeah
01:16:28
Speaker
So to see if we see him back, hopefully we do, to see what they do with him, that'll be interesting. But I think he'll always be open to it if they want him in it. Like you said, I think he loves the character and he's got the iconic name and role to it. Absolutely, yeah. One thing too I found out when I'm watching this movie is, and this is not a criticism of the movie, it's just more how
01:16:56
Speaker
technology has changed but the the mask on the costume is you know at the time you know we thought well there's no way you can have the eyes move right it it works fine in a comic book because there's you know it's it's art it's interpretation it's but when you're watching it on screen you know you got to have those kind of fixed lenses thing although now that we've seen it in
01:17:19
Speaker
in the MCU movies where they had the mechanical lenses and they can move. I find myself missing that so much in these movies now because it adds so much to his characterization, his performance as Spider-Man when the eyes can move.
01:17:33
Speaker
It is nice. I do like it. I do like the new suits, the mechanical eyes especially.
Spider-Man's Influence on Superhero Films
01:17:41
Speaker
I guess I try, you know, it just goes back to the nostalgia. When you're watching these old movies, you're like, this is what Spider-Man was back in the day. This is how it will start at all. And to kind of just, for me again, it's just like, it kind of goes back to that comfort
01:17:55
Speaker
I remember watching these movies religiously growing up and just feeling like this was what a superhero movie was. There was nothing else to put it by standards because you're watching these movies and you're thinking, this is the best superhero movie to date. Nothing can top this.
01:18:13
Speaker
once the MCU rolls in, you know, everything changed really. But it's it is it would I guess it would it would be cool to see like some of that modern tech now with the maybe some of those grounded materials because I think there's they did something so right back in the day that sometimes I do think the MCU is lacking. You know, I think sometimes MCU lacks some sort of the grounded
01:18:44
Speaker
levels of emotion, story, and everything. And I just think maybe if there was a perfect blend of all that, that would be really nice to see. But yeah, I agree with you. I do like the mechanical eyes and everything. I love seeing the new Spider-Man now. I think when you watch Spider-Man in his modern day suit,
01:19:05
Speaker
fighting and everything. I mean, you feel like, man, this is Spider-Man. This is classic, like, from the comics, Spider-Man. It's great. Yeah. Well, I think, and one of the things, one of the great things that I think this movie did and, you know, Feige worked on these movies, too. So I think it's clear he was taking a lot of notes when he was working with Raimi is you don't get to the MCU without first going through Spider-Man and Spider-Man 2. Like, those movies really kind of set the tone for what the MCU would be.
01:19:34
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, there's definitely like, even you're looking, you could take the first two Spider-Man movies and whatever superhero franchise you're looking at, you could take those two movies and just kind of use it as a template or an example just to kind of see like how to build a character, how to build an overall story and establishing a world and then expand from there, you know.
01:20:00
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, X-Men, I thought, did a really great job. I still love the original. X2 is even better. But Spider-Man, I think, just blew X-Men out of the water, their first Spider-Man. And then Spider-Man 2, I still, it's like a chef's kiss. Yeah. And it's just one of the best movies of all time, as far as superhero movies go. Oh, absolutely, yeah. I mean, I think, oh, sorry, go ahead.
01:20:24
Speaker
I'll just say like what you said, Kevin Feige being a part of even those early roots with those earlier Marvel movies before MCU was even formed. I mean, you could just now knowing that he did that and seeing the MCU, you're like, yeah, he was taking notes all along like he knew he wanted to do in the future. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And and yeah, these these movies and they also they struck the right balance because you had
01:20:50
Speaker
Up until the MCU, you really kind of had like these two different types of directors when it came to superhero movies. You had people who were not at all a fan of the movies, but could still make pretty good products like Tim Burton, like Brian Singer. Then you had on the other end, you had people who were really big fans, but almost to the detriment of what they were trying to do with the movies. Like Mark Steven Johnson, who did Daredevil and Ghost Rider, or Tim Story, who did the Fantastic Four films.
01:21:21
Speaker
their excitement as fans to be doing this almost kind of overrode the needs of a good movie. Ramey struck that balance, right? He had that balance between, okay, I'm a fan, but I still understand that I've got to hold back some of my fan enthusiasm to make a good movie. And that kind of balance is really kind of what Feige seems to be looking for in directors with the MCU. Yeah, it's totally, yeah, you can totally see that.
01:21:50
Speaker
And for the most part of the MCU, it has worked very, very well.
Sam Raimi's Directorial Style in Doctor Strange
01:21:55
Speaker
And I think that's why Sam Raimi was even brought back for Dr. Strange. I mean, he's a well-known director before Spider-Man. He did an amazing job on Spider-Man.
01:22:06
Speaker
He did great movies after Spider-Man and he's just one of those guys that he treats any kind of project with the integrity of the art and the storyline and the lore of everything that's going on too. But I mean, he's going to give it his own style and flair and make sure he's doing a great job for the audiences also. But I mean, Doctor Strange, I thought, I love Doctor Strange Multiverse and Madness.
01:22:33
Speaker
It's such a Sam Raimi flick, but is so fun and colorful and comic book, you know, craziness. I thought it was great. But but yeah, so it's nice to see that. Yeah, he does. He just laid an example out, I think, like you said, because you can watch the Fantastic Four and Ghost Rider and.
01:22:50
Speaker
I mean, Ghostrye was pretty bad now watching it, but Fantastic Four is a little forgiving every once in a while. But I think it's just one of those things, like you said, it's like they were probably too much of a fan because they overlooked a lot of flaws. And we don't know, Hollywood, I know in studios are always cutting corners on things and writing on things or everything's just butchered in the end. So that could have been very much of an effect to it as well.
01:23:21
Speaker
Just to see that we even got, and I'll even give Bryan Singer props with X-Men. Just to see those two franchises do that well and have that balance of some fan treatment and grounded storytelling and make sure it's a franchise. That's all you can really ask for in those early days.
01:23:43
Speaker
Superhero movies. Well, so I think when you mentioned dr. Strange, I mean first off, you know What a what a joy for a rainy because he said like it growing up his two favorite characters were spider-man and dr. Strange And he got to put his stamp on the movies for both of those characters
01:23:58
Speaker
But also, I think I feel like Doctor Strange as a character is just so much more suited to Raimi's style of directing than Spider-Man is. It really allows him to flex those horror muscles he had developed with the Evil Dead stuff and to bring in that slapstick comedy aspect he has with stuff like Evil Dead 2, Army of Darkness, and Drag Me to Hell. He can lean on those really heavy.
01:24:24
Speaker
I feel like Multiverse of Madness was maybe a little bit hampered with all the MCU stuff
Marvel's Multiverse Saga and Character Exploration
01:24:31
Speaker
they had to do with it. I hope he comes back to do a third Doctor Strange movie, and it really gets to be just a pure Doctor Strange movie, because I think he's going to knock that out of the park. For sure. They're so caught up in the Multiverse saga right now. Like you said, pretty much every movie on
01:24:48
Speaker
The MCU's map right now is tied into that somehow, but you can definitely see in the multiverse madness, like direct influences from drag me to hell and evil dead and everything. And it is such a rainy flick. Like I watched it in theaters and I was like, this might need to be rated R. Like touching there, you know, it's getting to that point. But what I love about the original Raimi trilogy also, I can't remember if it's one or two, I think it's two maybe, but he, you know, he's like, what do we name the villain?
01:25:18
Speaker
And he's like, Dr. Strange. He's like, no, that's. Oh, yeah. And it's like that was a. Yeah. Yeah. OK, but I I I watched that. I don't know. It's just years later I watched. I was like, ah.
01:25:29
Speaker
That's just such a it's so cool and then obviously after you watch or after you actually directed dr. Strange multiverse madness It's like that's that's just really cool. Like you said, he always wanted to do spider-man. Dr. Strange. He got to do both and he even Did an easter egg of dr. Strange name in the original. Yeah, I mean sure. It's great. All right, um, I think that's all just be said about Spider-man any final thoughts you wanted to mention about
Nostalgia and Enduring Appeal of Spider-Man
01:25:54
Speaker
it? I
01:25:55
Speaker
That's just a great movie, man. I mean, it's a great comfort movie. I would even argue it could be a Thanksgiving movie just with the Thanksgiving theme around it with the parade and the dinner and everything. But no, it's a great movie. I think there's a lot of obviously some stuff you could argue with or
01:26:12
Speaker
Um, whatever there's maybe it's outdated on certain things and whatnot But um, but when you look at it like as far as starting the roadmap of who spider-man is and and how movies can be uh, it's it's just it's Perfect in a sense, you know, it's it's really just set the way. Um, toe mcguire is uh
01:26:33
Speaker
He will always be my, he will always be a number one Spider-Man for me. I just love, I just love Tom McGuire so much, you know. Yeah, it's a great movie, man. Sam Raimi, you gotta love him. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it, you know, even with the criticisms we brought up here, I think more of this movie works than doesn't. And it's mostly, for the most part, like I'd say like 90, 95% of it still holds up after all this time. Oh, yeah.
01:26:56
Speaker
All right. Thanks for coming on, man. This has been a lot of fun.
Promotions for Strange Film Studios and Superhero Cinephiles
01:27:00
Speaker
Yeah, I appreciate it. Why don't you tell people where they can find your stuff? Yeah, thanks again, man. So you can find me through Strange Film Studios. We've got an Instagram. I like to promote Strange Film Studios on YouTube. You can check us out. And we do have a Facebook page. It's pretty popular on Facebook. But strangefilmsstudios.com is where you'll be able to find
01:27:23
Speaker
all the stuff we do. I mean, all our comic books are on there. All of our films are on there. Our podcast links are on there and emerge or anything like that, too. But yeah, check out our films. I mean, we're I mean, if you like.
01:27:36
Speaker
Like I said, we're pretty much influenced by pop culture, superheroes and 70s, 80s horror and stuff like that. So if you like anything like that, you might like something that we're doing, but it's all for free anytime you can watch it on YouTube and our website. So Strange Film Studios. All right. Thanks a lot. And I checked out the website while we were having some of our little difficulties before, and it looks really cool.
01:27:56
Speaker
Yeah, we'll have the link to that in the show notes that does it for this episode of superhero cinephiles Superhero cinephiles comm is the website super cinema pod on Twitter and Instagram and You know now that Elon Musk is apparently slowly destroying Twitter. I am on hive just under my regular name per Constantine per Constantine, so I haven't figured out how to make two accounts on that yet So I'm just posting superhero cinephiles stuff under my regular name there
01:28:25
Speaker
But yeah, and don't forget patreon.com slash super cinema pod if you subscribe for as little as a dollar a month you get these episodes a week in advance and you also get the companion show once a month where we talk about comic books graphic novels all that fun stuff and Please make sure if you haven't if even if you're a subscriber if you want to help support the show Give us a review on iTunes rate and review it always helps us out. Thanks so much for listening and we'll talk to you next time