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Photography, Nature, and Bird Joy with Angela Ledyard
0 Playsin 14 hours
In this episode of the Bird Joy Podcast, Dexter Patterson and Jason Hall sit down with photographer Angela Ledyard for a robust conversation about creativity, presence, and belonging in nature.
Angela shares how photography became a lifelong relationship rooted in curiosity and care, beginning with watching her grandparents document everyday life in Cleveland. She reflects on learning the craft across film, studio work, photojournalism, wildlife photography, and her perspective as an FAA-certified drone pilot. Throughout the episode, Angela speaks candidly about showing up as a Black woman in outdoor spaces, finding calm and awareness through wildlife photography, and how birds, nature, and image-making continue to shape her sense of joy and healing.
This episode is about claiming space, trusting your eye, and honoring photography as both a creative practice and a way of being present in the world.
Topics include:
- Early creative roots and learning to see differently
- Building confidence through technical skill
- Navigating nature spaces as a Black woman
- Patience, presence, and wildlife photography
- Birds that inspire joy and curiosity
- Nature, healing, and creative renewal
- Seeing the world from above through drone photography
Listen in for a thoughtful, grounding conversation that reminds us that joy, creativity, and care belong to all of us.
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Transcript
Season 4 Launch of Bird Joy Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to season four of the Bird Joy podcast. Your hosts Dexter Patterson and Jason Hall are back with more birds, more bird joy, and plenty of laughs along the way.
00:00:11
Speaker
Each episode brings new stories, fun conversations, and a whole flock of good vibes. We're happy you're here. We really miss the homies and we hope you enjoy this season.
00:00:23
Speaker
You ready?
Angela Ledyard's Photography Journey
00:00:24
Speaker
Let's go We are kicking off season four for our first guest of the season with an amazing person. Angela Ledyard is a photographer whose love for photography runs really deep, folks. She describes photography as her romance, a lifelong relationship rooted in curiosity, creativity and attention. Born and raised in Cleveland, Ohio, Angela's journey began by watching her grandparents document everyday life through their cameras. That early spark grew into a career that has taken her through film photography, studio work, freelance photojournalism and into nature, wildlife, and even aerial photography as an FAA certified drone pilot. Angela's work spans portraits, landscapes, food, architecture, and wildlife. And as a black woman navigating outdoor and nature spaces where representation has not always been present. She brings an essential perspective on belonging, safety, joy and presence in the natural world.
00:01:32
Speaker
Angela, welcome. Welcome to the Bird Joy podcast. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Let's go. He drops the mic on that intro right there.
00:01:45
Speaker
Hey, you know, Jason and I, we take pride in these introductions. I know. It's like a thing for us. Yeah. Wow. Man, you got tears in my eyes with that one.
00:01:58
Speaker
We are so happy to have you. Like it's, it's, I can second Dexter. We were talking a little bit before, but been following
Entertainment and Connection Through Bird Joy
00:02:05
Speaker
your work. We were just chatting earlier. We were like, man, we got to go on one of them trips with Angela, get down there in the rainforest a little bit, you know, with you and Mike, you know, and some of the other folks. So yeah, it's really cool.
00:02:16
Speaker
Thank Thank you. thank you i am so i am beyond elated to be here. You guys, I have to tell you, on this last road trip that I did, man, y'all entertained me. Do you hear I was as soon as I stopped driving, I'm like, I got to let them know that they were the entertainment on these miles. So, yes. Oh, man. Thank you for taking us on that journey with you. So talk to us a little bit. What did photography give you as a kid that other interests did not?
00:02:51
Speaker
Satisfaction, joy, passion, love of nature, love of the outdoors, an escape. Photography, as you had mentioned, is just, I fell in love with it. um The early days when I was doing, you know, people, portraits and all of that. I mean, that was cool. Yeah, yay.
00:03:10
Speaker
But being outdoors, it's just a connection. i love all, yeah I've always loved being outdoors, but having that ability to capture that moment and relive it and coming later on in life and showing people, you know, like, and they're like, where is that at? They're like, down the street and around on the corner. You need to get outside.
00:03:37
Speaker
can You what's wrong with you? Why you ain't, why you ain't see it? No, Some of the responses, you like people just don't get out.
00:03:49
Speaker
Yeah, um yeah is so that's what photography has been
Photography as Identity and Exploration
00:03:54
Speaker
and continues to be for me. is is just a love, man, a true love.
00:04:00
Speaker
That's incredible. Yeah, and I think i think a lot of us feel the feel the same way. I just posted some pictures yesterday of a Northern Harrier. I saw your post. like yeah yeahally I you know, i blow the dust off the old camera and try to get out there and get something done. But i was I was actually waiting to meet some friends to try to find these Sand Hill cranes near us. And I was there a little early and that harrier was hunting the field. And I was like, let me get my silly butt out here and try to get a couple of shots in this morning sunlight.
00:04:30
Speaker
And turned out okay. And like, you know, my son always asked me when I'm out taking pictures of birds with the bird feeder in the backyard, you know, sitting here like a sad person waiting for an evening gross beak to show up. Yeah. You know, and I always wonder, like, what he's going to remember about me doing that. Right. And what what do you remember about watching your grandparents take photos? Like, what what are some of your pivotal moments there?
00:04:51
Speaker
My grandmother's smile. She would smile so, she had this beautiful smile and when girlfriend would have on her red lipstick, cause grandma, I mean, we would just go like simple places when I was growing up cause they love to like go down to, we'd go over to Lake Erie and my grandparents used to take me down to like the Westside Market, but we would go over to Lake Erie and granddad, who's he using the 126? I'm about to date myself, the 126 cartridge.
00:05:21
Speaker
film and she would pose you know and that is like she just loved it she had so many pictures of her grandma at one point she was using one of her favorite cameras was a polaroid and you know you take that polaroid you gotta wait 10 seconds and people used to kind of flick it like okay Because these days don't know. They don't know. They don't um i don't know. But that's what I remember. I just loved it and I wanted her to model for me. You know, I wanted to see if I can get that. I mean, of course, I couldn't get the same look granddaddy would get. Sure. But nevertheless, just over time and when I would take pictures, it was like soon as the camera was up, she had a she had a pose. She was ready.
00:06:06
Speaker
Even till the last moments of her life. i took I wanted to take a photo and as much pain that she was going through. Oh, my God, I'm about to start tearing up.
00:06:18
Speaker
She just gave me that smile. So, yeah.
00:06:24
Speaker
I can it. I can feel it. I remember even when I was a little kid, we used to have those little disposable cameras that you had to go click click click click click oh yeah then take a picture they would always black give that to dexter even when i was a little kid i was always fascinated with just being able to capture moments and time um and and that really kind of got me early on and just the the power to capture life, these decisive moments throughout life and just these little quick snapshots where you can look at a picture and it defines what what happened. It's just really cool of just seeing the stories that that photos can tell. When did photography for you, Angela, start to feel like this is like who I am, like literally part of your identity? When did that that kind of revelation happen for you? when I would spend more time out with my camera than with anybody else. was no, I do not want to meet you guys at happy hour. No. I need to get up in the morning. There is the sunrise.
00:07:28
Speaker
And I had a girlfriend. She would invite me. She's like, we got to get together and go have dinner. And she would say, but I know you need to look at the weather. Just determine when is going to be a good time for that. And I was like, yes And also remember the weather may change and I might have to cancel on you because nature doesn't wait. That's right. So, yeah, I mean, I never get tired of it.
00:07:52
Speaker
I, if you were to ask me to go to a movie and sit down and watch a movie for a couple hours, it's painful. It is painful. But if I am invited to go hike 3,000 feet elevation gain to a point where I can capture nature, be it a sunrise or whatever's changing or whatever wild animal may or may not show up. And it's I'm getting up at 2.30 in the morning to do this hike. ah
00:08:24
Speaker
I am there, right? Yeah. But I cannot do not sit up here. And I'm like, that's. It reminds me of that. It's that series of memes going around. Like i didn't see at the club last night. And then the response is like, well, I didn't see you out filling your bird feeders this morning.
00:08:39
Speaker
You know, didn't see you on the trail looking for that red breasted nuthatch this morning. What's going on with you? but Seriously. you know I didn't see you at the peak of the mountain. What's up? What's up? Right. You know, it's just, it's amazing. It's not amazing. I don't know. I feel that it's sad that so many people are so disconnected, you know, with what is around them. Before I had left Cleveland, because i'm I left Cleveland about almost 10 years ago.
00:09:07
Speaker
And Before leaving, you know i was out on trails. I was out exploring. I didn't care. But then there were those moments where you know you try and have a relationship with people and they're like, how long are you going to be there? What's taking you so long? You were really out looking at ducks and stuff at the water.
00:09:27
Speaker
Oh, we've all felt it. We've all felt it I'm wondering, like, was that was that a moment where, like, you know, before you left Cleveland, did were you pretty sure at that point? Did you know, like, hey, i I kind of see the world a little bit differently than my peers. You know, I see it through the lens of this camera, you know, whether it's nature otherwise. Like, were you were you pretty solid in that? I was when I was in college. I had attended Kent State for a bit.
00:09:51
Speaker
e And this was right after high school. and people around the college would call me photographer, photographer. And you know i had i was using color and i would develop my own black and white and I would just be walking around the campus, you know just taking photos and, you know, being out because there is a group that we ended up starting a chapter here called Black Girls Do Bike. And it was, you know, to get women out on the bikes. You're not alone. You're OK. You have people with you. You don't have to be this world renowned cyclist. And we would be out. And of course, you know, you see things in nature.
00:10:28
Speaker
You take notice to like the light, the trails, all of that. So it wasn't just cycling, but it was all of that around. And that group started to grow. And even for me, there was a point where as a close friend of mine, we went to high school and college together. And we ended up going snowshoeing here in, was at Cuyahoga Valley National Park.
00:10:51
Speaker
And then we went snow biking, same day. And then after that, she was like, what you getting ready get into? said, I'm getting ready go hike to this frozen waterfall. She was like,
00:11:02
Speaker
By yourself? I'm like, absolutely. you know, because when you're in Cleveland, people really don't want to be outside. it's cold. that old out there i don't even know what that's like. that's You don't want to know. She was like, can I go with you? i was like, sure.
00:11:22
Speaker
And we're hiking and she's like, this is like some Narnia right here. and you can But she knew me enough, like she knows Angela is going to be out discovering something. And we're a hiking,
Discovering Nature's Beauty in Cleveland
00:11:38
Speaker
you can hear the water underneath the snow.
00:11:41
Speaker
And we get to this waterfall that's frozen. Sure enough, there was two people that were kind of like ice climbing, but it was like, in know what is this so cool?
00:11:52
Speaker
So it was very few people that actually really very, very few people that would hang around me. Those that knew me, wouldn't hang around me because they would be like, she gonna try and get me outside.
00:12:07
Speaker
I
00:12:11
Speaker
felt that sometimes. went to my core. but's where People be waiting for me to ask them. Like, it's coming. When's it coming? You're going to ask me to go. I sent Jason a text this morning. It's negative one degrees today. And I'm looking out, well, it's still sunny, you know? Exactly. Man, don't mess with me.
00:12:35
Speaker
I know. And i I get on Facebook and I see one of his one of his homies with the BIPOC Burger Club Wisconsin. Rita's out there going for a walk. And I'm like, how is she outside? And I wrote a note. I was like, Rita, y y'all got it. because i said It's called dressing in layers, man. and Listen, there's layers and then there's no.
00:12:57
Speaker
like There's layers. i Just because the wind came not air too coming off the water like that. Although yesterday I saw the pelagic boat tour out ah out of Cleveland with the Black Swamp Bird Observatory, I think. And it was just like thousands of gulls. And I was like, oh, I see. i understand.
00:13:16
Speaker
I understand. It's just, you just have to get out there into the elements. Nature is going to always do nature things, right? I know. I know. And I, you know, I, listen, I love the cold. Like winter is my favorite birding season. y'all when it but When it goes below freezing. Y'all lake effect folks got a different gear. All right. That's all I'm saying. Y'all got a different gear than everybody else on the East coast. We, you know, I'm complaining about my little six inches of snow over here today, but y'all got, y'all got a different level and I, I respect it. That's all I'm saying.
00:13:45
Speaker
yeah Angela, you you work with so many formats, right? You learn your studio lighting early, all of your technical capabilities. How has a lot of that shaped your confidence just going out into these different spaces to photograph just about anything, including nature and birds?
00:14:01
Speaker
Because you have to first know your camera, understand light, and you have to be flexible enough to deal with whatever Mother Nature is going to give you. I'm not out there, of course, on the trail with studio lights. So if I see a beautiful bird,
00:14:18
Speaker
and it's in shadow, i'm like, ah. Nature, wildlife, birds, what so have you, those are my models. How can i take what I'm seeing and have the viewer be just in love with what I'm seeing as I am? So when you're dealing with you know being out there, you gotta be flexible. Would it be nice where you're like, Okay, I need this Puerto Rican woodpecker. Don't move. You're looking good. You're looking good, babe.
00:14:52
Speaker
Please don't move. Just turn your head a little bit so that that sunlight just hits that little pot right there in the eye. No, wildlife or nature has taught me. You better get it now.
00:15:05
Speaker
Yes. And when you're getting it now, you have to be quick enough. And that's what I'm saying. You have to know your gear. So you're like, okay, let me try this setting different. Don't look at your camera to see what you're adjusting. Know your camera enough that you can adjust it without having to look at the dials. Yeah. That makes sense? Yep.
00:15:27
Speaker
Yeah. it's like it's like It's like riding a bike. like You don't look down at your brakes when you hit the brakes. You just know which one to hit and how hard to hit it. It's the same thing with the camera. I really love that analogy that you just made. That's good.
00:15:39
Speaker
I love it. I know you probably get these questions all the time. and And I know Jason probably does as well. Or people say, well, what camera should I buy? and and I'm just like, yeah you know, like buying your first professional camera. That's a pretty big moment. um and I mean, think you mentioned getting a Canon T90. What was that moment for you where you're like, oh like i I just spent a lot of money on this camera. What did that feel like? dude I was in college.
00:16:04
Speaker
i was in college That moment was, want to overwhelming. It was really exciting because I was like, I finally got this mug. I finally got it. Oh, you can't tell me nothing. you hear me? Nothing. I was doing more i was doing more people and weddings at that time than I was with nature because I had a zoom lens, but it was like, I got this tea. 90,
00:16:32
Speaker
I had a person, i was on um I was on a ferry coming from Alaska, from Alaska heading to Washington. And i had my camera out on the table because I just wanted, that just in case things happened.
00:16:47
Speaker
And there was this gentleman that was kind of sitting at the table um across from me and he said, that's a nice camera you have there. And I was like, thank you. laughter I know I had no sense. I love this so much. And he said, you know, he's interested in buying a camera. He wants to, you know, do some wildlife photography. And what camera do I suggest? And I said to him, I said, what kind of mobile phone do you have? And he kind of looked like, why are you asking me about a mobile phone? I'm asking you about this type of camera. And so he said he has an iPhone.
00:17:24
Speaker
So i said, do you mind if I take a look at your iPhone for a second? he was like, no, go ahead. So I ended up showing him features on his iPhone that he had no idea he had, whether it's the Zoom feature, whether it's macro, all these different things. And I said, before I would suggest getting one of these, best camera you can use is one you have now.
00:17:47
Speaker
So learn the camera features you have on your phone, you know, where that way you can learn composition, lighting. And he just sat there and he was like, my wife would love you right now. Just save thousands of dollars. Yeah, right? you know? ah And he ended up telling to his wife about our conversation because I saw them later. like, yeah, she's the one who was talking about, he's like, this right here, right here.
00:18:16
Speaker
She was probably like, thank you. and I always tell people, I tell them, I said, the camera is just a tool, you know, yeah and eventually like you may get the most out of a tool and realize that you need a new tool. And,
00:18:31
Speaker
It doesn't matter at a certain price point. They're pretty much the same. And all so I told him, I said, if it's if it's for birds, get some with a good zone. yeah If you're worried about birds, I say you're going need some zoom. So if you're first starting out, get a point and shoot camera with a really nice zoom. These cameras are really nice these days and go from there and then take your time. Don't jump out there. Jason will tell you he did it when he was a new bird. You jumped out there? Yeah. I mean straight up i just, I listened and I didn't know what I was doing. I had to, I had to backtrack and learn how to use it first. And then, and then when I wanted to even jump higher and like go get a five, 600 millimeter lens, I learned my lesson. So I didn't go spend $12,000 on that one. I spent a thousand dollars on a used 500 millimeter
00:19:23
Speaker
And that, John, is heavy. I got to go to Planet Fitness and do my curls. so That is the workout. It's heavy. but But I took that bad boy to India this year. I'm taking it again next year. It works just fine. And I'm learning so many things that maybe one day if I have the privilege of then dropping a whole bunch of money on something different, I can do that. But, but you know, it's a good it's a it's a great lesson. Right. And yeah.
00:19:47
Speaker
I'm wondering, like you got your T90, you learned all the rules, you knew what you were going to do. When did you start
Confidence and Freedom in Photography
00:19:53
Speaker
breaking the rules? When did you start breaking your lighting rules and breaking this? and Oh my gosh, rules can always be broken. Your experiences ah being a little bit of a rebel with some of that, you know? Rules can always be broken.
00:20:05
Speaker
You know, you have the rules to kind of rules are like a baseline. for people just getting started. And the more that you are out and the more that you do, the more you'll be like, I don't care about the rule of thirds right now. This is what attracts my eye.
00:20:22
Speaker
That's right. Right. I don't care about if the lighting is, if the subject is backlit and it's more in shadow, but the light, the sunlight or whichever the light is, is highlighting the feathers or the fur that's attracting my eye.
00:20:37
Speaker
So that's when At least for me. When you can break the rules because you've learned the basis. you You've learned like we were talking about a bicycle. You've learned, okay, I can pedal this way. The brakes are up here or the brakes are down here in a pedal. you know You've learned that.
00:20:52
Speaker
So if you want to sit up here and you're on that bike and you're going down a steep hill, you know enough on how to stop because you're not going to stop too abruptly or you'll flip over the handlebars.
00:21:05
Speaker
So that's the thing with, for me, breaking the rules because I know The more that I've done it, what effect that I want to have in my camera or on the photo that I'm taking. That's the thing, you know, and a lot of people, they get so fixated on, okay, did you follow the rule of thirds? Okay, did you have this grid? How is your composition with this?
00:21:27
Speaker
People have to, again, this is just my opinion, photography is amazing. a medium it's an art form for you we are the artists using the camera to create the art that we want to create and once you have determined what you like do you i love it trust your eye folks trust your eye there's a a famous photographer that i really love his work henry cartier brisson And he always used to say, it's a good photo when you say yes.
00:22:00
Speaker
So when you snap something, you see something in your head, you like, yes, that's the moment, right? like So trust yourself, trust your eye. I love that so much. You were talking a little bit about layers earlier and how you'll go out in winter, even if it's cold, chasing a frozen waterfall. But showing up as a black woman in nature also has layers, right? Right. When did you first become, you know, aware that being a black woman and in these nature spaces came with some extra layers?
00:22:31
Speaker
Here's the thing with me. i didn't care. I was not a person i was. I've never been out looking for someone to approve my presence.
00:22:42
Speaker
You hear what I'm saying? You know, if i'm when I get up in the morning, I'm like, I'm getting ready go out here and I'm going to sit. I am going to wait to see what this snowy owl is going to do or if it's going to be there.
00:22:55
Speaker
I don't care if it's a hundred other people there and I'm the only one that is the black woman that's there. I don't care. Being on the trail. I don't look at people and expect for them to smile like as if that's them giving me approval of my presence. I don't care.
00:23:12
Speaker
I'm out in nature. you know Being a woman, period, there comes the safety issue. That's the thing that I pay attention to. I'm not out here looking for someone to approve my racial presence. But I always being a woman, you got to make sure that you are observant of your surrounding.
00:23:34
Speaker
Because like I said, it's safety. Yeah, I've been on the road and had where I'm like, looking in the rearview mirror, I'm like, and that car has been behind me for a minute. ah Yeah, that's right.
00:23:56
Speaker
when i've been out and if i see a group of men don't care what their races are but if i'm like um And I got this big old camera on my chest. you know I have my tripod. My tripod weighs about, ain't lie, about six pounds.
00:24:13
Speaker
And when I'm carrying it, depending upon where I'm at, I will carry it like it's a baseball bat. Right. you know So for me, those layers, it's more about safety than it is being acceptance of my presence being a black woman. love That's empowering, too.
00:24:31
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. and And it's it's it's I think a lot of us can relate. as being black or brown folks, right? But it takes it to an extra layer as as a black woman, right? I i know there's there's different things there that probably Dexter and I will never know or never truly, truly understand, right?
Visibility and Experiences in Nature as a Black Woman
00:24:48
Speaker
And you are so joyful, I will say, right? like you and and And I know I've i've seen some of your social media and seen you get out there and be doing stuff. Have you ever felt like in those moments, like you felt visible in ways that did affect your comfort or safety, like either positively or negatively? I guess this can be a positive and a negative.
00:25:07
Speaker
I was at Mount Rainier 20, it was while ago. And was chasing a Stellar's J. This was like my nemesis bird, right? well That's a good one too. oh I was so upset when this happened. so My homie, my girlfriend, that we went to high school together and caught she was with me. and She knew that I was chasing this bird. so we had gone the trail.
00:25:34
Speaker
The Stullers J was there. ah had my big zoom lens on, held the camera up. We're the only two Black women. and Soon as I locked in on the bird, this lady screams out, there's a mighty big camera you have.
00:25:50
Speaker
What are you taking picture
00:25:55
Speaker
of? I'm angry right now just listening to this story. You. I was just locked focus in. And I was at a level where I was kind of low because bird was kind of up and I was like kind of eye level. Oh, you had it lined up. And i was like, okay, I do get a lot of attention because it's not common to see a black woman out with, ah especially with a big lens. Mm-hmm.
00:26:22
Speaker
When I have that big lens on me, I get so much freaking attention. When I just have like one of like but the maybe the 24 to 105 on, everybody's saying nothing.
00:26:33
Speaker
Nothing. Yeah. So I took this one of two ways. Either the lady was really like, oh my God, excited. i she heart She doesn't see a black woman out here taking, you know, having a lens and taking photos. she deliberately made me miss that part.
00:26:51
Speaker
ah So that part of of me tries and look at the positive. She was excited to see me. And, you know, we're not here, you know. Oh, I was so upset. But I learned from that.
00:27:04
Speaker
Where, because like I do, I'll get attention. And if I'm out taking, when I'm out, not if, when I am out, someone will strike up a conversation and I will tell them because I had to put up a barrier to say, just one moment.
00:27:20
Speaker
Because I'm locked in. i'm yeah i don't want to give you my attention right now because you see I'm locked in. Mm-hmm. I've had a woman who was walking her dog. And again, I'm locked in. i saw a bird. This woman decides that it's a good time to let her dog off the leash. I love dogs.
00:27:36
Speaker
I love dogs. Dog owners, yeah some of them niggas some issues. So I'm like, if her dog comes over and she plays this, oh, I'm sorry.
00:27:46
Speaker
and she did. and I'm like, yeah, you saw me though. yeah And it would have been nice if you would have kept your dog on the leash because your dog is actually supposed to be on the leash. you know So you have these moments where you're I kind of try and like, for some of them, I try to look at a positive. You don't see me.
00:28:03
Speaker
i You don't see a lot of us out there, especially black women. um And then you have some where I feel that they're kind of being deliberate, like letting the dog off the leash at that time. Come on now, you saw me.
00:28:16
Speaker
Yeah. Sometimes it feels like that. Right. You talked about being locked in. i like I kind of want to learn a little more about this process of getting locked in. Wildlife photography really does require patience and awareness. How do you settle into that space um to get locked in?
00:28:34
Speaker
I watch, I observe, and i just disconnect with what's around me. I've already did my scanning. Okay. And let's say like there was a mama bear in her cups. Did my scanning.
00:28:48
Speaker
Was there potential for bears to come behind me? Absolutely. Absolutely. um But mama bear is there and being locked in and you're, I'm i'm observing their behavior and,
00:29:05
Speaker
then I'm holding the lens and just watching that moment that will resonate with me. That's being locked in. I was now an extremely locked in moment I was in Costa Rica and gosh, what was that bird that we were, we had got word of, I can't remember which bird it was. Did I even post that photo? I didn't even post a photo.
00:29:28
Speaker
Anyway, so I was with Alberto and he's ah my friend and guide in Costa Rica. And we had just finished doing this trail. Gets word, there's a bird in the forest, not on a trail or anything. he was And we were about to eat, mind you. We take off.
00:29:45
Speaker
He goes right into the woods. For a minute, I'm like, hold up, there's no trail. um He just jumped right into the forest. There's no trail. We're in Costa Rica. You know how you had that movie Friday and Deebo and you're like, you know, but you know like get it to together. yeah yeah yeah I go right in. I'm like, put your big girl panties on right now, get in the woods. Yeah, I go right in. And we're like literally doing hand signals, you know, like, usually
00:30:17
Speaker
And he stooped low. There's no studio lights. We're in the forest. And I happened to look down. don't know why I look down. I just, like I said, it's that scanning that I do. You're in Costa Rica. There's snakes, right? Sure. We're standing on a mound with a million freaking ants.
00:30:35
Speaker
Oh. Let me tell you. So I'm like, okay. So the ants start crawling on my boots. So? yoga, practice, I'm standing on one leg, trying to shake the ants off of the right leg and trying to hold the six pound lens to try and get pictures of the birds.
00:30:56
Speaker
okay When I say locked in, I'm like, I'll deal with the ants later. Oh. So it's these moments where it's like, wow, I am i'm i'm i'm looking at a mama bear and like the the baby, that the cub, like was crying like a human child, right? Mama caught salmon.
00:31:19
Speaker
I'm standing in a Costa Rican forest and I am literally having a thousand freaking ants realize like, oh, you're you're on our complex, right? you just destroyed our home, so you're about to catch it. That's right. We were in the process of building this new wing. That is, that is, oh I've, I've, I've been there, done that. I put my hand into a, um when I was in India, we were trying to find ah this bird and we were walking down this trail and I was the first one. and I just went to be polite and move a branch out of the way for everybody else walking by. And I put my hand right into a fire ant nest that had formed ah around the backside of a leaf and I didn't see it.
00:31:58
Speaker
And I'm holding it there. And I'm like, man, ah my hand stings. What did I touch something weird? And i look and there's just probably a hundred ants on my hand is all biting me at the same time. And I, so when you said that, I just, I felt it in my whole body. I was like, oh, cause they are mad too. They are heated. And umm I'm wondering, like you, I was waiting for you to tell me that you like got out of there. Oh, absolutely not. no So how do you how do you stay so calm? Is that yoga? like like what's the what's like Where did you learn how to just recognize the situation, stay alert, stay connected, but stay calm while you're trying to get the shot?
00:32:33
Speaker
Because for me, I'm in that moment, right? I am i will never get this moment again. Maybe. Who knows? I don't know. But at that time, it's like, girl, you are here.
00:32:46
Speaker
Watch this because you don't know if you'll get this again. The ants, the kids, another thing. You're not going to die from the ants. They didn't consume you. I was smart enough, of course, to have on the boots where the socks came over the leggings. Alberto, however, he had on pants. So the ants went up his pants. look I think a lot of people, especially a lot of women, a lot more black women that I encountered.
00:33:09
Speaker
I'll say that are scared of nature, but you have to learn. Did I know what type of ants those were? Absolutely not. Did I know that we were, they were probably pissed off? Sure. But I knew what I had on. Okay. I, they could not get to my skin unless if they made it up to my neck, then okay. I would have been, that'd been a different story.
00:33:30
Speaker
But when I'm locked in, I am like, there for that moment? Have I been in situations where snakes? Yes. Yes. And it's like, you can't, you can't react because you might really endanger yourself. You just have to remain calm. That is advice that I think we all apply in places other than nature as well. Right. It's it's really interesting to hear you say it that way. You know, it's it's funny how these experiences filter over different aspects of our lives. That's awesome. exactly They do. Locked in. so
00:34:07
Speaker
you you talked about going to find this bird in Costa Rica in the forest. Is there a favorite bird that you have for ah photographed? That's like if you. How many kids you got, Dexter? Hey, I always tell people picking the favorite birds like picking a favorite kid. Exactly. Right.
00:34:26
Speaker
yeah right I cannot. I had to try, folks. I had to try. Don't say didn't try. I am amazed by so much. I can still look. There's goals outside right now. And it's like, how they're just gliding with the wind. I just, I don't have a favorite. Did I have Nemesis? Yeah, the Stuller's J was a Nemesis. um At one point, the Belty King Fisher was a Nemesis.
00:34:55
Speaker
Hmm. But here in Northeast Ohio, you got blue jays and cardinals, common birds. But every time I see them, it's like the first time. So, yeah, you tried. I'm sorry.
00:35:09
Speaker
Let me just follow up then, though. Like, what's the what's the last bird you photographed that, like, really moved you? Oh, well, the one of the oh that really moved me, I would say this was actually funny, hilarious, because I can't believe I did it. I was on, where was I leaving? Phoenix. I think I was either leaving Phoenix.
00:35:28
Speaker
Anyway, i was on the road. Driving la la la, listening to y'all podcast. Matter of fact, I believe, yep, it was. I was listening to y'all podcast and i just happened to take notice of this fat looking bird of prey. You know how like when you're out in rural areas on the highway and they have like those fences to kind of mark properly? So I see this bird and initially I was like, that cannot be barred owl. That can't be, it can't.
00:35:55
Speaker
he On the highway, mind you. So I decide on the highway, I'm going to pull over into the shoulder. and On the highway. And it's not like you can stop abruptly because you're doing 70 miles per hour, little bit more, whatever. time right So I'm probably about a half a mile down the road from where this bird of prey is. and i'm like, it can't be. It really cannot be an owl.
00:36:17
Speaker
It has to be a hawk. I don't know. Could it be? I decide I'm going to grab my camera and I'm going to walk my tail along the shoulder on the highway so I can go see where this bird is.
00:36:28
Speaker
It was a red-shouldered hawk, but that was okay. Chunky one, though. It was chunky. It was eating good off the highway. Yeah, sure. And after I took a few photos, I'm walking back and I'm like, did you literally just stop along the highway?
00:36:44
Speaker
Where you got trucks passing you, blowing your hair all over the place. And I was like, I sure the heck did. Yep. Proud of it. So that is what that is one that I would say that kind of moved me. It literally moved me. You know, I've had experiences where I've watched a hummingbird in this nest bringing food to what be the chicks? That's the hummingbird chicks. Is that what we call them? yeah um I've had moments where i was at Urban Woods Initiative in Seattle. We had just did, we had a we were finishing a meetup.
00:37:18
Speaker
And after the meetup, we're all talking, yada, yada, yada. Eagle flies over here. What? There's an eagle. Crows chasing the eagle. What? We're all like, oh my gosh. An osprey. Did we miss a minute the memo? What is happening here? An eagle, crows, and an oscar. So we're watching. Eagle takes, dives down, and we're like, what is it getting? We're all like screaming, what is it getting? Eagle comes up, has a rabbit in his talons. We're like, oh my god. Oh, no. It's a rabbit! We're screaming, right? nice
00:37:51
Speaker
I had just finished taking photos of a bird in the shade. Did not think, Angela, you don't have the right settings. I'm taking pictures of this eagle with this rabbit. And I look at the pictures later because we're all like, oh, we're screaming and stuff. And the poor rabbit in the in the photo, it had to look like y'all were cheering me on. Y'all were cheering the eagle on. Really? Really?
00:38:14
Speaker
Really? ah ah Nature beat nature. beat Nature, and nature nature man Sometimes it's brutal, but it's always beautiful. Right. It is. You talked a little earlier about the Stellars J that that woman hated you on. Oh, my God. See, you know what? Why are you saying like that, Daxter? What is the positive side? She out there somewhere she needs to know about it. She could have been jealous because my camera lens was bigger than hers. Yeah. She needs to do better. Is there a bird like the Stellars, Jay, that you're still hoping to photograph? There are a bunch of birds I'm hoping to photograph. when I was in, where was I?
00:38:56
Speaker
It's been a year. She be out here. Angela be out here, folks. If y'all don't know, she traveling all over the place. It's so, like, this crazy. I'm in Alaska, Washington, Cleveland, Phoenix, Costa Rica. She just dropped in, like, the soft flexes, right? Not y'all talking about the soft flexes. Ant Hill in Costa Rica. Yeah. Look, people, get out, live life. That's this whole thing. Get out, live life.
00:39:22
Speaker
But it all depends on where I'm, where out let's let's start here. In Northeast Ohio, what do I want to see? I know, screech out. Eastern screech out. That's a good one. That's the bird I've been trying to see. And you got different morphs. Yeah, I like it. like it. Yeah, I've hit the trail, one of the trails here a couple of times where someone had noted that they had saw this Eastern Screechow.
00:39:48
Speaker
e Nope. That screech. I was like, I see your camera. No. Sure. Sure. Did you have the, did you have the roosting hole that it was in or are you still looking for it? i' so There was so many freaking different holes. can, you know, this stuff it's tough. It's tough. Try to find the right one that's pointed towards the sun in the afternoon. So it's going to get up there and get warm. But when you, you know, you got it, you'll find it. I'll just sit here and wait patiently and wait wait for it to show up on Instagram.
00:40:14
Speaker
But, you know, it's' it's funny that that whole part of being out there and kind of chasing a bird or wishing for a bird or walking by a space and be like, you know what would be nice in this scene? Would be perfect. And Eastern Screech, I was sitting in that hole, you know, but they're never there. We need them to be. But you still, after those kind of experiences, find yourself feeling good.
00:40:33
Speaker
great. At least I do. Right. And so how does that work for you? Do you, does your cup fill up being out in nature, regardless of the photography? Does it do something for you emotionally? Like how does that roll
Nature as a Source of Peace and Creativity
00:40:45
Speaker
in your life? It detaches. I'm back in Northeast Ohio. My mom passed away in May. sorry to hands Thank you. My parents would have been married 61 years. um So being back here where my dad is one of now six,
00:41:03
Speaker
since his brother passed away. Well, my uncle passed away last year. So being here and seeing my aging relatives and trying to help navigate things with them and for them has been, it has been challenging. um And being able to get outside, if I see that you should screech out, cool. If I don't, it's okay. Because when I'm outside, i detach. I'm not thinking about anything else. I'll see a mushroom on a tree and I'm like, wow, that's pretty.
00:41:34
Speaker
Or am I might, it doesn't matter. Or like now when you see like the frost particles on a dead leaf, Nature is detachment for me. it's It's allowing for me to take things that are stressors at the moment and let it go. It sounds like your photography would Yeah, that was like, yeah. Yeah, exactly. I'm hanging out with you after a long week of work. Yeah, um that was amazing. I know. And I'm i'm just thinking about, you know, you you mentioned and once again, sorry for your loss with losing your mother. And it sounds like that your photography helps get you through things like that. Right. It helps you get through difficult situations. Photography has been that for me for so many years. um
00:42:28
Speaker
Nature. That's why, you know, like yeah in the introduction, when it was like, I'm in love with nature. That's my passion, right? Photography, cameras, that's my boo thing. um Because we have to, um especially in today's world, you got to find a way out. You have to be able to. I used to manage people and I would work countless hours. Come to town when I was not in office, I out on the trail chasing. And that, I was like, man, this feels good. Whether I'm hiking up and I'm sweating and I'm like, Angela, why did you think this was a good idea? I don't know, but this is so it's okay.
00:43:07
Speaker
But that's we need that. yeah You need to allow yourselves to reconnect because we've been so programmed with this industrialized nation, right? You know, being in the office, sitting in a chair, get home by sitting in your car, right? And then you're home and you're sitting down and you're eating. Where where are you reconnecting?
00:43:30
Speaker
Sure. Yeah. it' that's is that Listen, you you have to explain it to us too, right? i I think we both have talked about this before, about how that helps in the most difficult of times. And it's something that I hope our listeners are really tuned into, right? To make sure that they know that, you know, we talk about access to nature for black and brown folks and different aspects of how we do that with different guests. And you're the kids. Yeah. Right. Right. And very rarely do we talk about how that is a tool for the rest of your life to process joy, sadness, grief, anger. And it's such a gift too, right? When you have it and you see somebody else struggling, that's probably why all of ah all of our friends don't want to hang around because we'd be like, let's go for a hike. Let's go outside. You know, we try to make you happy um or or give you some some piece. And I'm wondering if ah just to kind of switch gears here a little bit, like the bird photography is one thing, right? This is calm, intimate, traipsing through the woods, standing on anthills, right? And then there's this, this, this, how are going to put standing on anthills in the same sentence um as you did it on one leg. So whatever birds you were taking pictures of, please tag me in it when you post it so I can share that. Now you have this perspective from the drone and this new creativity of seeing that, you know, quote unquote, bird's eye view. How how did that unlock some of your creativity? Because that's a totally different perspective. Oh my gosh. I've been droning since 2017. Wow. And when I first put that drone in the air, I was like, I'm in trouble.
00:45:09
Speaker
I am going to be, I will never be at home. um My gosh. It's it's like, oh,
00:45:21
Speaker
To have that that drone or that bird's eye view and capture scenes where you're just like, wow, I would have never known that was there or I would never have seen it from this perspective. It it was just like a whole nother, like I'm thoroughly in love. One thing I don't do with the drone, I don't use that to chase wildlife. Sure. And you have people who will kind of disrespect rules. And I think that's why it's important for people to do their research, get certified or or, you know, do the recreational certification. Being able to just have that view and get that perspective. And then you have to also reprogram your brain because you're not on the ground taking photos.
00:46:05
Speaker
That make me dizzy. I'm just going to pass out on the sidewalk. Okay. People are oh, I did not know there was a river right there. Yeah.
00:46:20
Speaker
It could have been an American Dipper back there all this time and I wouldn't have known. Yeah, it's just, it's, oh, yes. You just have to reprogram and determine what it is about, again, going back to this being another medium of choice to create your art.
00:46:38
Speaker
Right. Because you can't think drone-wise the same way you think when you're on the ground using your camera. I love it I love it alright Angela we're coming to the end of our time together got little lightning round I'm sure I'm going to click here for you I do man yes you need that you need that I need it these were cracking me up these were cracking me up on the car go ahead think I'm ready think so
00:47:14
Speaker
Sunrise or sunset shooting? ah Sunrise. All right. Telephoto or wide angle lens? ah Telephoto. Got her. Got her. All right.
00:47:26
Speaker
Plan? You're not mean. This is mean.
00:47:32
Speaker
Plan, shoot, or wandering? Wandering. Okay. Last one. One word. One word only. quit. One word for how photography makes you feel.
00:47:45
Speaker
Passionate. Love it. That was one of my favorite lightning rounds. That was hard. Telephoto.
00:47:56
Speaker
It's eyes up outside san a favorite bird, right? Yeah. Who came up with these questions? We're going to have a talk later. yeah Angela, you you briefly talked about this earlier about, you know, a lot of black women say, oh, I don't go outside or black people in general. We don't do it We don't do cold. We don't go outside. We don't hike. We don't bike. We don't do none of that.
Encouraging Connection with Nature
00:48:18
Speaker
What would you say? to a black woman out there um who's thinking about nature but hesitant to enter an outdoor space.
00:48:28
Speaker
It's funny that you asked this question. um I have said, and I've even done a ah Facebook post on this, be your ancestors' wildest dream. Our ancestors were not sitting up in the house watching TV.
00:48:42
Speaker
They were out growing. They had a garden. They were out exploring land. They were out even during slavery. Going out trying to to escape from plantations, using the moonlight, all of that. That's all nature.
00:48:57
Speaker
Be your ancestors' wildest dream. Make a difference. Get your behind outside. I love that. love that so much. Man, it's so good. This was such a great interview. And I know you're home taking care of family right now. And I text Dexter all the time when he's out on the road doing stuff now on his book tour and everything. And I just, you know. Yes, Dexter, hands up on the book tour, man. Right? Thank you. We just be trying to like check in on him and see how he's doing and make sure he's finding rest and joy, even though things are very exciting. Right. And so what does joy look like for you right now? Because I know you're out here taking care of other people. So what are you doing to fill your cup up on a daily or weekly basis? First of all, my dad is paying more attention to the hawk that flies around in this area.
00:49:43
Speaker
Hey, got him. Dad used to say when we would be traveling and stuff, going down south, you see that hawk? You see that hawk? Now I'm like, dad, that was a red-tailed hawk or a red-shoulder hawk. He's paying more attention. We have some bird feeders that I had put up.
00:50:02
Speaker
So that's what I'm doing to fill my cup up. That's beautiful. Yeah. So just... that. Getting him a little bit more connected than sharing that bird joy, bro. That's like is it To the person right next to you that you've known your entire life and you still have space to share more bird joy. That's really beautiful. And he's 82, 83. He up there, man.
00:50:25
Speaker
Hey, he out there looking at the Hawk though. So that's the win. He was like, think it comes around 1130 in the morning. He here getting data too. He getting data. that man notebook, a t-bird account. You know, you better, you know, you're out here contributing. So Angela, thank you.
00:50:47
Speaker
Thank you for your honesty, your presence, your vision. This has been just absolutely incredible for Dexter and I today. We regularly have guests where we say that our cup gets filled up just when your presence is overflowing. is absolutely one of those experiences. So thank you very much. Yeah. yeah Thank you guys.
00:51:05
Speaker
You reminded us today and all of our listeners that like, you don't owe anybody nothing that, you know, reclaiming space and nature is for you, right? It's for you. And you don't owe an explanation for it. It's an act of creativity. It's an act of courage, but but also like this act of care. This has been fantastic. Thank you for giving us ah your time and sharing your fantastic stories with all of our listeners today. Thank you. Thank you guys for inviting me. All of our listeners out there. Thanks again for joining us once again. Remember, Bird is for everyone.
00:51:49
Speaker
Right there. Love it. Peace, y'all. See y'all later.