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#199 - Mary E. Pearson
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Best-selling romantic fantasy author, Mary E. Pearson joins us this week to chat about her latest novel, her approach to keeping momentum whilst writing and the ups and downs of her publishing journey through the years.
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Transcript
The Power of Writing in Storytelling
00:00:00
Speaker
Ooh, a spicy question. I love it. Because the writing is sort of everything, really. You can fix plot holes, but if the writing... Yeah. So some readers love that, and some readers are like, but I wanted more of this. So it's kind of a gamble.
Meet Mary E. Pearson and Her Latest Novel
00:00:14
Speaker
Hello, and welcome back to the Right and Wrong podcast. With me today is New York Times bestselling romantic fantasy author, Mary E. Pearson. Hello, welcome.
00:00:25
Speaker
Hello. Thank you for having me today, Jamie. Thanks so much for coming. um Let's jump right in. Your latest novel is out on the 14th of November in the UK. It will be out as of this airing. It is called The Quoting of Bristol Keats. Tell us a little bit about it.
A Celtic Mythology Reimagining
00:00:44
Speaker
Well, The Quoting of Bristol Keats is a reimagining of Celtic mythology.
00:00:50
Speaker
And it spans two worlds, both the mortal world and the fairy world. ah And it's about Bristol Keats who, after her parents' untimely deaths, has to return home to help raise her younger sister. And ah Bristol is used to a ruthless life. She grew up always on the run because her parents had a big secret.
00:01:18
Speaker
but it was one that they would never share. ah There was something that was very dark and relentless that had chased them their entire lives.
Themes of Love, Forgiveness, and Second Chances
00:01:27
Speaker
And Bristol and her sisters always thought that perhaps her parents were witness protection program dropouts, but her parents just claimed it was the artist's life. you know They were living living the free and easy life.
00:01:42
Speaker
yeah So Bristol, when she returns home, ah she discovers that no one in her small town is who they claim to be and that her father might actually be alive. And she is plunged, and she is like us, you know, just your average mortal person. She is plunged into a world of gods, fae, and monsters. And she has to, in her effort to save him, navigate this new,
00:02:12
Speaker
world of strategy and magic and and survival in a way that she's never had to do before. So everything ends up becoming very much more complicated than it already is when the fae leader that she made a bargain with to help find her father, ah starts things start developing between the two of them and she becomes uncertain where her loyalties lie.
Is 'The Courting of Bristol Keats' a Duology?
00:02:42
Speaker
m and Ultimately, it's a love story, but it's a love story on many levels. it's It's a love story about between a man and a woman who are trying to navigate this these new feelings between each other. It's a story love story between sisters, a love story between brothers. ah One thing about the Celtic missus, there's a lot of love going on. And so that's what I have in ah this story. um And it explores the lines that we cross that can never be forgiven. And ah ultimately, that's what it is. It's about lines, forgiveness, and second chances.
00:03:31
Speaker
Hmm. Okay. So a lot of themes going on. Obviously it's another um fantasy romance, which is very much your kind of brand. Is this going to be a duology? Yes, it is a duology. And that will be the conclusion to the story. And that is the conclusion. Unless I decide I want to write more. No, just to, but sometimes that's how it goes, you know, as you're writing, um, other possibilities pop into your head, but, uh, yes, it's a duology.
Mary E. Pearson's Evolution as a Writer
00:04:02
Speaker
Okay. Okay. Okay. And have you, have you written the second book or are you currently writing the second book? I'm currently writing it right now. And that presumably will be but published next year? Yes, that is the plan. yeah Same time, same time next year. So I am just like really putting the pedal to the metal because I'm a very slow writer. I'm not a fast one. And then just the publication process takes up a lot of time. So it's really, uh,
00:04:32
Speaker
a big balancing process that um you know you always hope that you can you can manage. Yeah, yeah exactly. um Publishing can be an unwieldy machine at times. Absolutely. This is geology. I tried to sort of count up the the novels that you've written, the novels that you've published. This would be a second geology. You've done two trilogies and then several standalones. Right. Are they all set in different magical settings? ah Yes. um My early books that I wrote were contemporary, no magic whatsoever, um except the very humankind. And and then the other books had like the Remnant Chronicles had a very subtle kind of magic. It wasn't, you know,
00:05:30
Speaker
you know, spells or any of that kind of thing. And then, uh, the same with the, the dance of these spin-off from that series. So this is the first book, my first adult book and my first book that really has magic going full speed.
How Does Celtic Heritage Influence Pearson's Writing?
00:05:49
Speaker
Okay. So all the other ones were young adult. Yes. Yes, they were.
00:05:55
Speaker
Okay, what made you want to move up in the sort of um age bracket? Well, basically what happened is when I finished the Dance of Thieves duology,
00:06:10
Speaker
I just felt, and that was after five books being in the same world, I really felt, even though I love this world, I felt like I had to challenge myself to do some other things, so I just wouldn't fall into the same old um writing processes.
00:06:28
Speaker
ah and so i Wrote this book without a contract. ah And that was the other thing. It was the first book I had written in years that wasn't under contract. And I just wanted to see where it would go and ah let myself you know just put it all on the page, everything on the page and see where it would take me.
00:06:54
Speaker
And it was it was a fabulous experience. It it was also written ah in large part during the pandemic, yeah which was, you know, yeah we were so constricted during the pandemic in so many ways, it was great to have something that was not constricting whatsoever. Yeah. Yeah. And as I wrote and I just put things on the page, I didn't have filters and, you know, the characters and skewed older and their experiences were older. So you know when when all was said and done, it was an adult book. Oh, okay. So it was not a conscious decision. It was more of a just, his this is the story I want to write and this is how it turned out.
00:07:39
Speaker
Right. And you know I think to a certain extent, it it probably was a conscious decision because I did not want to have to um worry about my audience. I just wanted to write what I wanted to write.
Balancing Romance and Fantasy
00:07:54
Speaker
And you know that was um yeah that was sort of a a conscious decision.
00:08:01
Speaker
Okay, so it's interesting, the print obviously, Remnant Chronicles and Dance of Thieves, like you said, five novels all in the same fantasy kind of universe. When you were coming up with like a new setting when you're doing that world building again, where do you where do you start with a new spike? Does the world come first? Do the characters come first? Does the plot come first? Well, ironically, I had written the beginnings of this story back in 2016, a long time ago. And it was, ah it's very interesting the way stories evolve. um You know, I'm sometimes trying to find the character, trying to find the setting, trying to find all the elements that go together. And it comes in little
00:08:53
Speaker
bits and pieces and gifts that are put into my hand. And in 2016, I was writing about a, I wrote a a short about a short bit of the story about ah a girl who receives a mysterious letter and an offer of art. And she goes to a house that isn't a house. And I think some of that goes back to my childhood when I was watching a story and someone stumbles on, it was a ah TV show, and a character stumbles on this house and it looks like a normal house, but it's not. and And it was that unsettling feeling. Maybe just because I was a child, a house was something that you recognize and was ordinary.
00:09:39
Speaker
And when you become so unmoored by finding out that it's not that, that was a feeling I wanted to create in this story. And so the thing behind this mysterious house that ah in effect Bristol stumbles into, it led to a different world. And also, you know, I think part of it is I knew very little about um Celtic mythology other than, you know, the big basics. And that would be, you know, that is my heritage. And i'm I'm thinking why was that never taught in school? And so I'm reading all of these mythologies and they are just absolutely fascinating.
00:10:20
Speaker
And, uh, and it just, all the pieces just kind of started coming together. Okay. So was this the first time you've done like a big kind of research element to your, to your novels? I always do. I always do so much research. I always say I'm, I, when I wrote the Remnant Chronicles, I actually, um, I, I,
00:10:46
Speaker
set it in a time when there was no technology. My previous novels had been um the adoration of Jenna Fox trilogy. I did so much research on that ah with because I'm not like a computer whiz. And so I had to you know do especially when you're doing research in a near future novel, it was set only 50 years in the future. And so I had to find out all the things that are on the you know the cutting edge edge, but were not quite there yet. And so when I started the Remnant Chronicles, I said, I'm going to write something that requires no research. and But then it it did, because I was creating this world that had risen from the ashes of another one.
00:11:33
Speaker
and I had to research how things decompose and tons of research again. And I honestly, I think just any book research is the fun part. you know ah It gives you so many ideas and I love, you know whether I'm reading about um clothing or architecture, ah all of those things just get the juices going.
00:11:58
Speaker
Okay, so it sounds like no matter what your setting or your time period, you're always going to find something to research. I will.
00:12:07
Speaker
That's, I mean, that's, you know, it's a great way of finding inspiration because like you say, and I've spoken to historical authors who obviously, you know, a large part of that process is research where they can get lost in the research and sort of go down these, these kind of very um folk hyper focused sort of roads, which, which are ultimately not going to contribute to the story, but it's exciting and it's fun. and that The more yes you immerse yourself in the research, the more it feels like you're, I guess there's a confidence element to it too, where you're like more comfortable writing the story. Absolutely. There's things that I researched that never end up in the books, but um I feel like that really grounds me. It gives me a really good backstory that I really understand the character. And that is really what it all comes back to is
00:12:56
Speaker
getting in the character's head, everything to me revolves around the character. you know The world building is what helps me understand how this character came to be. And so when I really understand my character well and and the world that he or she lives in, um they will become more fleshed out and ah believable.
What is Pearson's Writing Process?
00:13:21
Speaker
him the the So you put very much the character first. Would I be right in saying then, you know your your books are are marketed as um romantic fantasy? Yes. Would you say that the romance is is more important than the fantasy? No, no. um Because the fantasy is the thing that makes my my character tick and okay motivates them. and So they're kind of intertwined. I read years ago from, and i sorry, I can't remember who it is, but they said character's plot plot is character. and And I would agree the same thing with setting. They're they're an intertwined and you can't really separate one from the other. If you don't have a setting, you don't have a character.
00:14:15
Speaker
If you don't have a plot, you don't have anything that pushes the character forward. So they're they're all um intrinsically combined together. Yeah, no, that makes sense. That makes a lot of sense. um I'm just aware that, yeah, there are some some people who will like, some authors will write something and they'll say like, you know, the romance was was the main thing for me and like the sort of setting was dressing and like, it's it just a different approach. True. Every author approaches it differently and that's what makes books so interesting.
00:14:48
Speaker
Yes, exactly. And that's what you know what people call the voice of the author is that uniqueness, is that way of looking at something that that no one else does it that way or or explains it that way. it's kind of The answer to the question, I guess, in short, is they kind of come together, the world and the characters, they are the inception point for your stories. Yes. I would say I i do tend to have um romance in in my books. I think there's usually a love story. And i I think that's something that is such an important part of our lives is finding someone who gets us. and so But then you know there's there's the other life and all the complications. So I just find exploring that. um
00:15:40
Speaker
very interesting, but the the characters actually have to live in a real world. And it can't just be all about them, you know, looking into each other's eyes and falling in love and all of that stuff. There's a real world out there. And that's, you know, what all of us deal with. It is actually like real life.
00:15:57
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's it. It's about making it, because it's in the end, it's about being relatable. It's about the reader picking it up and finding something that they can sort of, even if it's set on a different planet with a different, like with aliens and things, it's about them being like, oh, but that's a very human reaction. And that's something something I would have done all over. Exactly. And I think also fantasy, I think it is like,
00:16:25
Speaker
Poetry in many ways, it has a way of giving us a glimpse of our world through a different lens. i you know Sometimes we can't see our world for what it is, and I think fantasy gives us you know a new way to see it.
00:16:43
Speaker
Yeah, I'd agree with that and you can you can sort of go into more controversial or like darker topics in fantasy because it's sort of one step from removed from reality. Right. Yeah, which can be really interesting and and obviously over the vast course of publishing there have been many authors that have done so.
00:17:03
Speaker
Well, right. I have people in my books that get killed all the time. you know That doesn't really happen in my everyday life, but I can imagine it. so Yeah, exactly. If you were reading a contemporary ah story, there would probably be less death involved. Yes.
00:17:23
Speaker
um Getting back on to to you and I'd love to ask a bit about your kind of process and how how you how you approach the writing and are you the sort of writer that plans everything out or are you the type that simply take an idea and run with it?
00:17:39
Speaker
Um, my process has evolved over the years and I've done both. I have done a complete seed of my pants type of story. And I've done, I'm not very good at outlining, but I've so i've arrived at a place where, you know, I think very often it's just semantics. It's the way we describe it. You know, one author will say that they pants it. Um, but the,
00:18:06
Speaker
they very much outline in their head. And I think that is kind of what I do is I do lots and lots of thinking. I go for walks every day and plan out scenes. And so I i am outlining, but when I try to write it on paper, I cannot do it that way, but I can write down scenes that I see coming. And so usually what I do is I've gotten into this post-it note system where I write down all of my scenes that I know of and
00:18:42
Speaker
As more scenes come to me, I write it down on a post-it note and I put them on a board. And so I can see kind of places that I'm writing towards. Well, as I write towards those things, those scenes, and sometimes other scenes fall by the wayside, they no longer fit. And so they go in the trash and it makes it really easy. I don't have to erase or do anything like that. I can rearrange, I can move this up and move something else back, tweak it a little bit.
Overcoming Writing Challenges
00:19:13
Speaker
So there is definitely a a outlining process that goes on in my head because what happens is these characters are alive in my head and I hear them talk. And it ah that is kind of my driving motivation. And so, you know, I think the post-it note process
00:19:39
Speaker
really works well for organic writers, ones who maybe can't envision every single thing in an outline form, but they can envision things that will happen to their characters, and but they don't want to be you know married to it for sure.
00:19:58
Speaker
Yeah. So I'm picturing this as you kind of have an idea of what you're doing for the next like two or three chapters, but not all the way to the end. And then you can kind of as, as you're writing, you're kind of evolving and changing that and taking things out and adding things in.
00:20:14
Speaker
um Well to an extent actually I do usually always know the end i I know the end game and I know some of the places in between But all that connective tissue is the stuff I have to figure out ah But the end knowing the end game and I have been wrong sometimes the end game changes a little bit and that's okay, but as long as I I think having a a scene in mind and an outcome in mind to write toward is extremely helpful.
00:20:50
Speaker
Yeah, i i I'm not someone who would intricately plan, but I think I always know, I always have an idea of how something is going to end because it seems terrifying to write. so and I have friends who write without knowing what the end is going to be, and that seems insane to me, but they make it work. Yeah. The thing is, I think it's good to know where you're going, but also be flexible. It's like, oh, this might be better.
00:21:17
Speaker
so You know, um even for the cording of Bristol Keats, I had one really far out ending in mind when I first started writing this. And um and that just went by the wayside because this world became bigger than what I had imagined.
00:21:35
Speaker
Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sometimes you have to find the ending by actually writing most of the story. Right, right. Yeah. And I wanted to touch on, yeah, so you mentioned that you were actually a slow writer, but you're publishing at least a novel a year by my count.
00:21:56
Speaker
Is that about right? Yeah, that's about right. eye the Although there is a big gap between the vow of thieves, which came out in 2019 and then this one. So that's like a five-year gap, but that's, you know,
00:22:12
Speaker
Partially because of the pandemic and also um you know setting out on this path that I didn't know where I was going, I was just going to follow it. And that was made it a longer process. And without having a deadline to take more time. yeah so ah But when I was doing the Remnant Chronicles, and my books are big, they're not little. And I think that's one reason I needed that little bit of a break.
00:22:41
Speaker
They're about 500 pages, a crack. and so and Being a slow writer, that means I was writing all the time, all day long. and ah so Yeah. It's, it's hard to write a book a year, but that's what I was doing. I don't know how I did it actually for that, but I'm doing it again. So. Yeah. Do you have, uh, do you, do you like keep yourself on a, on a routine, like a strict kind of regime to, to get the the words down? I do. I, I, I aim to write a thousand words a day, um, more if I can.
00:23:23
Speaker
It just depends, and I try to do that every day. I'm one of those people who, if I'm away from the story for too long, the bubbling juices kind of simmer down. and ah So i I'm one of those people, and it's not for everybody, but I very much think writing every day really kind of keeps everything going.
00:23:48
Speaker
so Uh, and even on weekends, it might just be, I might only write 50 words, but, uh, it keeps those, the characters and their world in my head. Yeah. And a lot of writing happens, not at the keyboard, but you know, when you're on locks, when you're out grocery shopping and the, and we all know about showers, there's a million different places where writing can take place.
00:24:13
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think there's, I've i've always subscribed to that idea of ah no matter how much it is, like as long as you're moving and in a positive direction, the direction that you want to be heading every day, like yeah one step is fine if if that's what you're going to take. So yeah, I think that's a great way to to look at
Mary E. Pearson's Deserted Island Book Choice
00:24:31
Speaker
it. Absolutely. I have a a mantra that, you know, there's days when I'm just not in the mood and it's like, okay,
00:24:37
Speaker
Just open up the file, write 10 words, just write 10 words and you're done. yeah And it's amazing how, you know, you write 10 words and then it's 20 and then it's 15. Before you know it, you've written a couple hundred words. So a lot of it is just facing that screen. And yeah if once you get past that, then, you know, the words start to flow.
00:24:59
Speaker
No, I absolutely agree with that. um We're at the point in the episode where we head over to the desert islands. So, Mary, if you were stranded on a desert island with a single book, which book do you hope that it would be? Well, of course, you know, Jamie, that is like the cruelest question to ask. Yes. um Honestly, I would have to say probably a this This might be a cheap but um a collection of poetry, you know just reading poetry because each little poem is a story in itself and poetry just leads to all kinds of story worlds in my head. so you know
00:25:45
Speaker
I don't get the chance just to peruse um ah poetry books so much anymore, but when I do, there just like it's like going home. And so definitely a ah collection of poetry. Yeah, that's ah that's a nice choice. um I've had a few people have ah with a similar sentiment. Do you have a favorite poet?
00:26:06
Speaker
Oh my goodness. Edna St. Vincent Millay, Emily Dickinson, E.E. Cummings. There's just there was just so many.
00:26:18
Speaker
Yeah, so you'd want you'd want a collection which is like of many different authors as opposed to just all by one.
Why is Poetry Valuable?
00:26:24
Speaker
Oh, yes, yes, for sure. Okay, now that's a great choice. And with poetry, I would say it's the sort of thing that you can just keep rereading it and see a different point of view and like find different meaning every time you read it. Oh, yes. um I think that's the the the beauty of it is that sometimes, you know, it can be obscure, trying to understand what they were trying to get across. And Maybe that is the the point of some poetry is to really make you think. And ah and yeah, gets or a a different line will strike me differently another time. And and then sometimes you you know you go and you look into the history of the poem and you find out where the author was in their
00:27:09
Speaker
um life at that time and you discover that you know what kind of motivated them could have been a death in their family or you know some injustice. so ah yeah it it has a new meaning. And even actually, that's not that much different than rereading a story, you see things that you didn't see before. So. Yeah, obviously, most poems are shorter than novels.
Where to Find More About Mary E. Pearson
00:27:36
Speaker
So yes, it feels like a more manageable task because you just quickly reread it again. Right, right.
00:27:43
Speaker
So next up I'd love to talk about agents about publishing deals and the and the rise of romanticy but that will be in the extended episode which is available on the Patreon. There's all kinds of things that can explore love stories so find your love story and and go after that.
00:28:03
Speaker
Yes, that's great advice and very, very well put, I think. Well, thank you so much, Mary, for coming on the podcast and telling us all about your writing and and what you've been up to and and and your latest book, The Courting of Bristol Keats. Well, thank you so much for having me, Jamie. yeah It was really nice talking to you and I wish all of your followers the very best on their publishing journeys.
00:28:27
Speaker
Yes, and for anyone listening, if you want to keep up with what Mary is doing, you can follow her on Instagram at Mary E Pearson on Facebook at author Mary E Pearson, or on the website marypearson.com. The courting of Bristol Keats is out in the UK November 14th, so probably by the time you're hearing this. To support the podcast, like, follow and subscribe. Join the Patreon for ad-free extended episodes and check out my other podcasts, The Chosen Ones and Other Tropes. Thanks again, Mary, and thanks to everyone listening. We will catch you on the next episode.