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146a Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice
54 Plays9 years ago
We have a discussion about Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice and how bad it is.
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Transcript
Introduction and Episode Focus
00:00:00
Speaker
You are listening to the all-new anti-fanboy episode number 146, Side A. Batman vs. Superman, Dawn of Justice, this is the sunset show, the DC Cinematic Universe is dead. I'm Jonathan Suarez. I'm Devin Gopek. And I'm Steve O'Teary. Tonight we are going to explore what could have been. We're gonna explore the... What should have been.
00:00:28
Speaker
the fuselage of the crashed. The autopsy of DC Cinematic Universe. Crack that thing open. Crack it open. Give it a Y incision on the chest. It's dead, man. They can't come back from this. They will. They made the money. No. No, I'm not saying like...
Episode Structure and Tone
00:00:50
Speaker
They're gonna go broke. I'm saying like this is doomed. Like it's not gonna be good. No, it's from now on does the The fan base it's overall. I feel all right. So we need it. We need it. We need to talk so We're splitting this up. We have a side a and a side B
00:01:06
Speaker
Side A is the sad side. This is the depressing DC... Side A is about the murderers. Side B is about the people that don't murder people. It's about the heroes. About one person that may have murdered a lot of people.
00:01:21
Speaker
But with military precision. It's just handled so much better.
Disappointment in Batman v Superman
00:01:26
Speaker
We're talking about hands falling off. So this isn't like a Batman v Superman review. It's like a discussion. It's a discussion. That being said. Because you know what? We're going deep. So if you haven't seen it, or if you care about spoilers, sorry. The whole marketing campaign for this movie was Batman v Superman. Donald Jost is hashtag who will win. There was no winner. Hashtag Batman.
00:01:50
Speaker
There was no winner. The winner was... Zack Snyder, I guess. The winner was the opening weekend, because that's the only upside that I can see right now. So if you want a review, see our review on anti-fanboy.com. With two reviews. We have a written spoiler-free review, and we have a anti-fanboy drive-by.
00:02:15
Speaker
Fresh out of the movie theater. Fresh out. I'll give you our movie thoughts. I'm working on a spoiler. Okay. A spoiler review. Just something that I can post. Is it just gifts of you taking shits to a toilet? Gifts of, or gifts of slideshows of the really bad superhero movies that have higher scores. We need to have, is that what it is? This is better than, this has a better rating. 25 horrible superhero movies that are scientifically proven.
00:02:44
Speaker
to be better than Batman. That's automatically superior. But before we start, uh, or, you know, let's go into the, the Patreon.
Personal Stories and Patreon Humor
00:02:54
Speaker
I just had to travel across the country. You're back. Yeah. And, uh, I tried to see what was out there and now I have no money for anti fan boy. So a dollar a month. Get me back out there. Oh, wait, wait, that's where the money went.
00:03:11
Speaker
Get me back out. So John stole all the money, took a trip, took a two-week trip. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too. Me too.
00:03:35
Speaker
You know what's crazy? Remember when I drove to Atlanta? And it was about the same length.
00:03:42
Speaker
But with the drive through the lane, I thought I was gonna die multiple times. I was scared, I was falling asleep. You just blast the techno music. It was bad. So you made it through. This trip, I had to drive from San Francisco to Seattle, and man, what a fun drive. Yeah? Because you're driving around mountains and stuff, and everything's really pretty. Oh, it feels like a car commercial like that. It feels just like a car. No, you know what I listened to? I wanted to tell you this. I listened to the Forza Horizon 2 soundtrack. Yeah, all right. That's been driving. Just because they felt like I was living Forza Horizon.
00:04:11
Speaker
So, you know, it was pretty neat. Some good songs on that soundtrack. You should have listened to that PS3 Ludge Racing game. Thanks. No thanks. They no longer work for Sony, so they're dead. Is Shane doing something tonight? No. He's dead. Frank Duran is doing something. Oh, Frank Duran. Real Books Don't Have Batman, baby. All right. Officially, anti-fanboy.com exclusive. Roll it. Hi, I'm Gail Simone, and you're listening to Real Books Don't Have Batman.
00:04:41
Speaker
People need dramatic examples to shake them out of apathy, and I can't do that as pushway. As a man, I'm flesh and blood, I can be ignored, I can be destroyed, but as a symbol. As a symbol, I can be incorruptible. I can be everlasting. What symbol? Something.
Comic Segment: 'Real Books Don't Have Batman'
00:05:07
Speaker
Hello, and welcome to Real Books Don't Have Batman, because they don't. I'm your host, Shane. Last time we left Batman, he got his memories merged back, and he's a little different. He was so pressed for time when he got his brain back that he wanted to be told the situation while he was driving. But he had time to shave his face? What a stickler! Batman blows the top off the bat signal, then grand slams the shit out of it and hits Mr. Bloom's hench monster. It was crazy!
00:05:34
Speaker
The other awesome thing about this issue is that Batman isn't afraid to dish out some sweet one-liners. Badasses always give out the best one-liners, and Batman is the baddest of the ass. John Mr. Bloom comments on Batman's new suit. The bat symbol on his chest has a gold outline now, kinda like Jim Gordon's version. Batman says, I'm partial to the boots, while kicking him in his giant face. Even though Batman handcuffed Jim Gordon to a helicopter to make him go to the hospital to take care of his puncture spleen, he still manages to protect the city like a boss. Whoa, Jim Gordon, whoa!
00:06:05
Speaker
Meanwhile, Batman gets into a super huge Evangelion mech suit and fights John Mr. Bloom. Eventually, Mr. Bloom gets caught in some kind of crazy black hole and Batman was like, LATER! It was all crazy and they saved the day. I can't wait to see more badass one-liners from Batman in the future. Yay-o! What did you think of Batman? Tweet me on Twitter at yupfrank, all one word on Twitter.
00:06:30
Speaker
Yeah, yo! For breaking news, we're gonna head over to Frank Duran and tell us about some websites where we can find Real Bucks Don't Have Batman podcast. What's a website? I don't know. The kids will pay a nickel and dime to see them, though. Well, it says here I have a card that Geeky Universe rhymes with geek, comic podcast network, comicsrelated.com, and GAUstudios.com will all have Real Bucks Don't Have Abby. I tell you, these podcasts are more fun than a Nickelodeon on the weekend, eh, Frank?
00:06:57
Speaker
I love a Nickelodeon on the weekend. I just love the pictures. I love pictures. Did you see the one with the train in it? Scared the shit out of me, Frank. Wow, he has not changed one bit. Nope. Nope. Same person. Good to have you, Frank. Deshaun. Why don't you bring it up a little bit? Yeah, why don't you get your weight off, man? Why don't you sit? Shane, get your weight off. Good riddance. Good riddance, Shane. Yeah, fire Shane. Bring on Frank. Let's do this.
00:07:23
Speaker
Now that
Fan Reactions and Criticism
00:07:24
Speaker
we got the fun stuff. The dust has settled. The mud dirt. We need to settle more dust. Speaking of dust, somebody pointed out a pretty funny thing to me today. It was my girlfriend's brother, and he mentioned the fact that when Batman's running through the dirt, somehow he's just not dirty when he runs out of it. I'm just saying, man, it was a good point.
00:07:49
Speaker
But this is not what this podcast is going to be about. We're not going to nitpick. No. That kind of thing. We're going to nitpick some stuff, but we're not going to nitpick that kind of stuff. No, but this is not even nitpicks. They're crucial elements of making movies and stories. We're going to war. Because what I'm seeing on the internet is that people are saying that true comic book fans love this movie.
00:08:13
Speaker
It's so true to the comic books. It's a great movie. It was a great showing. It was worth it for Wonder Woman. It's worth it for the cameos. Fuck the critics. Fuck the critics. The fans are right.
00:08:27
Speaker
That's what I'm hearing. That's what they said. If you want some Marvel baby stuff. Yeah, if you're into Marvel childish things, this might not be for you. And you know what? No. I will fight you. I'm slowly turning into the troll that I've tried to escape from. Is this your final form? I don't know, man. I was literally taping up into this room.
00:08:53
Speaker
I'm dipping it into wet glass like a kickbox. Let's fucking do this. I will fight anybody. I got in a little argument today. This dude that named his son after Clark Kent by naming him the last name of Clark Kent. This is called Kent. Yeah, he was trying to tell me that, you know, well, first he says, oh, this movie is, you know, it's for the fans, for comic book fans. If you're a fan of any of the comics,
00:09:19
Speaker
No, he said if you're a fan of all the comics all of the car all the college you'll love this movie So I respond saying that's not true. Yeah, cuz here's one raise. Yeah, I had to pull out the fucking card Like I hate pulling that card out all that I didn't hate it doing that this time because I don't know I
00:09:39
Speaker
I'm I can't I just can't I can't understand like it's like man I'm gonna throw this fucking shower in it turn me up turn my fucking turn my headphones up I'm gonna throw this out there right now sure wait if you're gonna get loud these people are like Trump voters like this is who they are they're completely brainwashed by the fact that
00:10:02
Speaker
I don't know, they're completely in denial about everything that they just have to, they feel like they have to defend something that is completely hot garbage. And it's like, and I feel, am I the ridiculous one here? Am I the crazy radical? No, these fans are completely insane. Well, Batman did build that wall.
00:10:25
Speaker
That's how I feel like I'm comparing these two camps where it's like so obvious It's so obvious this movie is a bad movie Meanwhile fucking Marvel have little birds landing on their podiums Christ little sweet adorable things are happening Disney Princess
00:10:43
Speaker
I'm sorry to do that, but that's I mean, I'm not me I'm not saying they're the same, but I feel like I'm saying they're the same No, I'm saying that like if I feel like they're blinding themselves by the fact that they had to defend this movie since Man of Steel came out Yeah, I I I had this is very worse. I had lurked on the DC Cinematic subreddit, right? I can't believe they have a cinematic subreddit and two movies I jumped on like relax a month cuz I was doing um
00:11:12
Speaker
I was kind of doing some research for that single episode I did where I talk about the marketing and how it's not good marketing whatsoever. So I was on it about a month and it was just like a lot of people going.
DC Cinematic Universe's Challenges
00:11:25
Speaker
It was a lot of people going like, man, hey, I'm a moral fan and I just all missed you. I love it. You know, some stuff like that. Some stuff going like,
00:11:34
Speaker
three years of this bullshit we're gonna prove them wrong we're gonna shed this garbage like we are ready like there was like legitimate hype and then and then uh so there were people that didn't like man of steel but thought this was gonna be good yeah they kept uh they kept spouting it sounds kind of rude but they kept saying like the terrio effect
00:11:56
Speaker
the Cristerio effect's gonna, the script's gonna be so much better. Argo was a good movie. But it was gonna be amazing because Cristerio wrote it.
00:12:08
Speaker
And then I kept going on it because I knew if there was going to be a first review, because I was curious. Yeah, of course. And it was always like buzz is good and people are going buzz is mixed. And I'm like, well, what is it? So the first three reviews come up and they immediately get track. Like they're negative reviews and the fan base trash is on. The following day I see the movie with Steve and Waldo.
00:12:32
Speaker
And I go, oh, and I go online, and I go, this was a trash movie. By the way, John, it was just the people that went last year. So it was only like 20 people.
00:12:43
Speaker
Yeah, it wasn't like a jam-packed theater. Did you have problems? No, not at all. Did you fix things? No, I didn't. I even had to do that. Nice. Yeah. So when I went on, it was like, I just got back from the movie. It was great. I just got back from the movie. It was terrible. And I posted some stuff.
00:13:05
Speaker
I got like 200 upvotes on like one comment. The most upvotes I've ever gotten. I'm not a big Reddit guy, but I was like, it was just going higher. People were like, yeah, I'm going to agree with you. Because I was explaining how bleak the movie is.
00:13:23
Speaker
And some guy said he said you're blowing it out of proportion And I said I really don't think so and I gave another really well-thought-out and detail in my opinion like and But like the sub just had a fucking meltdown dude because they just got worse because it was like 8% 11% like 14% and only and then it kind of got higher. It was what you get the 60 guys Really that really had some a few people like this
00:13:52
Speaker
We'll get there, and I'm like alright, and I'm not saying this was everybody, but that's the thing like I wouldn't have been surprised if the Rotten Tomatoes score was higher than it was. Well if you look at it the Rotten Tomatoes score 29% from critics 70% from fans, and you know those are just those fans that are like I think that's like takes away from the that takes away from
00:14:16
Speaker
Like, some people say that that should be the thing that you look at. Wow, that's just the metacritic garbage. To your point though, John, when you said, like, you feel like you're the crazy one, that's what I look at and I go, no, I'm not crazy. Like, there's very easy, like, there's much proof that people do not like this movie. Yeah, and then we're not, and we're not saying,
00:14:37
Speaker
We're not saying, like, we never say that Rotten Tomatoes is an end-all be-all. I mean, we have said it in the past, it's trolling. It's a funny thing when you look at things. But at the same time, it's a good barometer. At the same time, yeah. Because you know what? Like, some of the really good movies have really high scores. Like, movies that would never win an Academy Award. Movies like Ghostbusters.
00:14:58
Speaker
would never win best picture, right? But it's like a 96% on Rotten Tomatoes. Because it's a good movie. And the way it does it, it doesn't do it like Metacrate where they average out scores, they just say which ones are, it's binary. And I think that's a good way of, you know, I mean, honestly, I'm not trying to give a little sucky sucky to Rotten Tomatoes, but that's a pretty good way to gauge
00:15:44
Speaker
OK, and I end up loving it. You know, it's happened a few other times and it was fun seeing this on Monday, though, because that was before like all the critics came out. I think there was anything about the movie. Yeah, there was an embargo. Yeah. And actually, somebody gave me some crap about it because I posted my review and I told them I was like, here's the deal. I did not go to a review screening. Yeah. I did not sign anything. I was not notified of anything. I was under no.
00:15:48
Speaker
if a movie is subjectively good or not.
00:16:13
Speaker
No, really like I was under no impetus to not read hostess thing and whether or not was a spoiler free or not No, you say I deserve this because I wasted my time going to that goddamn IMAX presently that was a fan screening They say that they're like, this is a fan and hey, you know, thanks like it was you know, it's objectively a cool thing to do, you know, but You know, I was like, there's no there's I have no
00:16:39
Speaker
They wanted the fans to get out there to say- I owe nobody anything about breaking embargo. But that was just a little aside because I was like, listen, I didn't go to a refused screening. I wasn't notified not to say anything. I'm not-
00:16:55
Speaker
I'm not a fucking Rotten Tomatoes reviewer. I didn't get an email from the Warner Brothers saying, like, well, you know, you're on our list, here you go. I had to fucking work for that. We sat in line for five hours to make sure we got the best seats tonight. Yeah, we were number one. Number one. Nice. What'd you guys pick? Sounded right. Nice. Of course. Right in the middle. And I sat next to, no. I'm X, but not 3D. And I sat next to this kid who kept sitting on my drink.
00:17:23
Speaker
like his he got up and his shirt like like the edge of his shirt like hit my straw
00:17:31
Speaker
And I was like, I guess I'm not drinking that anymore. Because when he went to sit down, it lifted his shirt up. And I was like, I'm done. Yeah. And you could see his weird scarred body underneath his back knee. His back knee. And well, that guy was very excited about the movie. A lot of people that went to that screen were outside. He was noticeably hyperventilating. The reaction after the film, though. You know what's that? That should have been me.
00:17:55
Speaker
John, I think I took that bullet. Well, no, you paid for it. I would've still took that bullet. I wasted a gift card on it, but it was still a gift card. You could have seen something good with that gift card money. No, no, you had to see it. I spent money on Fantastic Four. But for the audience we saw it with, which is like the diehard Superman fans that were like, some of them were dressed like Superman.
00:18:18
Speaker
Their response after the movie? Underwhelming. Like, you know they were trying to, like, still, like, okay in their head. There were a few, like, nerd, applauding, like, like, woo! Like, flat shows off, and, like, Aquaman and all. Yeah! Yeah! But not to the response you'd think. And then when it ended, it got, like, a smattering of applause.
00:18:41
Speaker
Thanks, AMC, for letting us come. When I saw it for a second time on Saturday, there were these two fans that were just crestfallen. They were slouching their seats. They didn't look happy. I'm not saying that was with everybody. Some people were like, that was amazing. Sure.
00:19:01
Speaker
Go vote. Go vote for Trump. Go vote for Trump. No, but there were a few- Fill that wall. There were a few people like noticeably upset walking out of there. And because like at that point I was looking for him, you know? Because I was like, where are they? Yeah, where are they? Where are these guys? Where are these guys? Upside to my Saturday viewing though, I saw a little kid like shoot his arms up out of excitement when the Spider-Man showed up in the sport trailer.
Dissatisfaction with Batman's Portrayal
00:19:23
Speaker
I was like,
00:19:24
Speaker
That's a good movie. That's going to be a good movie. You're going to have good role models there. Don't kill people for fun. OK. Let's get back. We should get into the meat of the film. We've been talking about the reaction, the response. We need to talk about what the response is from. Yeah. I can't point to anything that I mean, I guess I can. Like, you know, Henry Cavell wasn't terrible. He was he was he was he.
00:19:53
Speaker
He did a great, not a great, but he did an adequate job with the cards he was dealt with. In the 10 minutes he's in that film? Yeah. I said this, I said, I'm not gonna crucify a guy for playing a Superman. For playing a Christ-like figure. For trying to be a Superman that nobody has any interest in him being. Nobody has an interest in him being that Superman. They just want him to be the most miserable Superman. It's weird though, because it's like,
00:20:20
Speaker
That mopey, miserable Superman is kind of what muddles up the movie, though. Yeah. Because it's like... He's not like... Batman, everyone, is expecting to be dark brooding. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dark brooding. Dark brooding. We were talking about that earlier. This is a two and a half hour contest of who's more sad. Yeah. Who can brood the whole thing. There are scenes where they threaten each other, where it's like, I'm gonna break into a million bones. I mean, shit, like, even... What's Superman?
00:20:49
Speaker
Like, they turned Superman into Spider-Man, whereas he's so worried, he's so worried about, he's so worried about what the general public thinks of him. Like, it felt like he was saving those people just to prove that he's not a bad guy. But even then, Spider-Man still saved people in spite, in blatant spite of people hating them. Yeah, of course. And that's what I'm saying. But that's it. Spider-Man is like, the Spider-Man, the most down on his
00:21:18
Speaker
like in the dumps no but i get what john's saying where john's saying like he's not saving those people because he wants to save them because he needs to repair his image after a bunch of situations and that's that's like that's like the the vibe that i got from and like no superman he just saves people because he shows it's right it's right to do he's the one time that they did
00:21:40
Speaker
Oh, here's your spaceship. The one time where I did get a glimpse of that was when he saw it on the news and just completely left and he left Lex's party to go save them maybe. Which is fine. And then he stood around for like 20 minutes and let them like suck his dick.
00:21:57
Speaker
What was that about? He's sitting there looking miserable. I'll say this. He looks miserable all the time. There's still the safest ways to fly a party. I was at a party. Oh, man. And first of all, Clark Kent should know who Bruce Wayne is. Dudes lived on the planet for like 30 plus years. Bruce Wayne's a celebrity. He's a reporter. Across the fucking bay. Yeah, yeah. Across the bay. Yeah, it's like right there. Oh, who's that guy? Why does Lex know who Clark Kent is? I don't know.
00:22:26
Speaker
Because he knows he knew he was Superman. Yes. I'm assuming. Maybe? I don't know. That's another thing. Secret Identities are a complete joke in this movie. Yeah, they are. Everybody knows who everybody is. Clark Kent, this is a little nitpicky, but Clark Kent makes no attempt. No attempt to hide that he is Superman. He stands up straight, dresses nice, just wears the glasses, and is Superman wearing glasses?
00:22:55
Speaker
Dude, was Brandon Routh really that bad? The body posture's not really different. Really? When he's eating the burrito and he makes that face. Yeah. No. That's good to see. No. And that's what I'm saying. Yo, just saying. That movie is like 77% on Rotten Mators. How did you feel when he kills the terrorist guy in the
00:23:21
Speaker
In the beginning of the movie the movie the scene you think is a throwaway scene where he puts that guy through seven walls I was like, oh he's dead. Yeah guys. Oh No lessons learned none none and that's none and that's the thing they tried to backpack the Off of the fan controversy from from Man of Steel. Oh, yeah, they had to think throw that whole thing in there. Uh-huh
00:23:45
Speaker
Which is not, which is a sound idea in theory. The first scene he's in. He kills a guy. Yeah.
00:23:55
Speaker
Oh, but but anti-fanboy. No, like he screams after he breaks Zod's neck. He's so upset, so upset. He's such remorse. Batman's gonna, in Batman v. Siren, Batman's gonna show him what's right. You know, he's gonna show him how to do this the right way, because he's gonna be an old Batman. He's gonna, he knows how to do the superhero thing already. He's gonna be his mentor. They're gonna be best friends. Yeah, they're gonna fight, but yeah, they'll be friends. Oh my God. Yeah, he just flat out murders the guy. Yeah.
00:24:23
Speaker
He wasn't even... Honestly, that guy wasn't even...
00:24:26
Speaker
Like, he wasn't even doing anything wrong, really. I'll kill her. Like, he didn't know what was going on after they found, okay, so here, let me break this out here, that scene. So, I kind of thought that was- We're talking about the scene in Africa, right? Yeah, the scene where she's in that terrorist camp. Yeah. And, you know, it slows lane. So, yeah, she does that. Yeah, that's fine. No problems. I think Kandaq is the area that she was in when Super Ram bought.
00:24:53
Speaker
Caught the bullet in the comics. Okay But you know, I love this movie But anyway, so so yeah, so Jimmy Olsen's there was fucking $7,000 film camera
Superman's Morality and Jimmy Olsen's Death
00:25:06
Speaker
You know, he's the report. It's cool. I was like, that's pretty cool because you know what? Zack Snyder is a fan of like, I hate him for it because he gets to use the toys that I would like to use. Yeah, he's probably pretty good at photography too because you know, he's the director. Sure. But they rip open his, his film, expose the film. They find a little CIA thing. It's not that little. That's a huge fucking chip that's blinking. I told this to Devin right as I saw.
00:25:32
Speaker
first thing I thought was like okay so that's Jimmy Olsen maybe like that's a cool twist on like you know Superman's pals watch like maybe that's how Superman knows where they are if that's Jimmy Olsen that little tracking device is just Superman uses that to you know if Jimmy and Lois are in trouble why not you know it's so optimistic it's kind of cool right you know this is Superman it's Superman Jimmy also has watch
00:25:56
Speaker
Fucking get over it modern modern day. He's got a tracker a Superman tracker in his camera, but no it's the fucking CIA It's a CIA They they get all those people killed Jimmy Olsen gets blasted in the how did I say it on Facebook? He ate a bullet. Hope the brains. Yeah. Yeah, that's what I said
00:26:18
Speaker
So like, all right. So, so, so Superman is constantly listening to his heartbeat, right? Why make him in the comics? Why make him? Why? Why make him? Like, why make him Jimmy Olsen? Because don't. Why? Fuck you. That's why. Because you. I'm Zach. Why couldn't you be Jack?
00:26:37
Speaker
Why couldn't he be Jack? A random dude that has nothing, no bearing on any place in motion at all. Jack me with the CIA? Jack, get out of the building. Who's Jack? Nobody. He dies. Fine. Why does it have Jimmy Olsen? I didn't even know that was Jimmy Olsen until I read later. Why? I thought, no, I had that assumption and then he dies and I was like, oh, that's probably not Jimmy Olsen. They call him James, right? I saw him. No, they don't even name him.
00:26:59
Speaker
Yeah, they don't say I saw him in the credits and I was like said Jimmy Olsen No, this is Jimmy Olsen and I thought Jimmy also was the black guy in us the Supergirl show. Oh wait, baby Okay, wait, let me read you wait real quick. I want to read you cuz Zack Snyder talked about this in an interview Christ crazed hermit Zack Snyder Yeah, let's see he says
00:27:21
Speaker
We just did it as this little aside because we had been tracking where we thought the movies were going to go and we don't have room for Jimmy Olsen in our big pantheon of characters, but we can't have fun with him, right? I said, I want to do this misdirect and you'd be great. You'd be great Jimmy Olsen, the director says. And he's like, yeah, that's cool. Oh, this is when he's talking about Jesse Eisenberg was going to be originally was going to be.
00:27:44
Speaker
Jimmy Olsen. And then we're going to kill Jimmy Olsen. That's like a little, huh, like a psycho type deal. And he says, he admits that he was in talks with Bryan Cranston about being Lex. So a bullet dodged by Mr. Cranston. Mr. Cranston had his taste. Yeah. And he says, well, he's telling him about how he should be Jimmy Olsen. He wouldn't have been a fucking awesome Lex though. Yeah. Well, he's telling him about how he should have been Jimmy Olsen. He's like, oh, and then I guess, you know, he's like, ooh, you could actually pick a Lex.
00:28:12
Speaker
Oh, he's not that expensive right now. He's already unfortunate. We're already almost at a billion dollars. Let's just make it a billion dollars. Make Jesse Eisenberg, Lex. I think that movie costs 250 million to make. Something like that, yeah. That's not even kind of... But the thing was, he doesn't even name him in the movie. It's in the credits, so he's not even like...
00:28:37
Speaker
ballsy.
00:28:55
Speaker
the military corporation, like the PMC. They put the blame on Superman. There are witnesses there. How is this a surviving witness from that area? Why is she not testifying against him or against them when they were saying that Superman killed all those people? Maybe she did, but everybody just trusted the... Well, maybe because she's biased, I guess.
00:29:18
Speaker
I don't know, but this is us making excuses, right? She's biased, but come on, it's easy to realize when you find a bunch of dead bodies that are like Kato in the OJ trial. Did he get to testify? Yeah, I think he did. So everybody thinks that Superman shot all these people. With special Lex Luthor bullets. Yeah, or at the very least, his appearance caused everybody to shoot everybody. He doesn't show up until after the shooting. I know, but still, it's a problem because later on,
00:29:49
Speaker
So they have a whole fucking they're having Senate hearings over this incident Yeah Senate hearings and then they're like well we got to bring Superman into the Senate to talk about this shit And it blows up as we talked about earlier and no one fucking blamed Superman That's like Lex Luthor's plan words like he's gonna show up. It's gonna blow up You're gonna be like that out of control alien because you know
00:30:10
Speaker
Obviously people hate him because they're outside picketing him in front of the thing even though they build a fucking statue there are there are arson investigators that can Tell if yeah, if I do say they keep saying the news report. They they're they believe the explosion came from the wheelchair
00:30:26
Speaker
But then they're still mad at Superman because he didn't do anything about it. This is the smartest man on earth. This is Lex Luthor. It doesn't make sense. Why would Lex Luthor do that? It doesn't have any hindrance in his plan. Yeah, no. Like, aha! It doesn't make sense. I blew up the Senate. We'll get into Lex. Sorry, no. I'm sorry. But what we're talking about right now is Superman's motives, right? So back to Africa.
00:30:49
Speaker
If it was Africa, no, it was that was okay. So so Sue rent blatantly kills the dude He smiles and then kills the guy Smashes it like lowism to go ahead and he just puts the guy through seven walls and I didn't kill those people. I'm like, oh you killed somebody and then they bang Danny in a bad. Oh, yeah weird that seems weird because Lois is looking at the bullet and
00:31:17
Speaker
And then Clark comes home. And she hides it. And she hides it. And I thought that was the tracker. And I was like, yo, is she selling them out? And they don't really explain why she would ever do anything. They don't explain. I mean, if we're going to shake a little bit. And they just have an argument. And it's miserable. It's a miserable conversation. There's no motive for Lois to do anything that she does in the movie whatsoever at all. Besides just being like, a little reporter? Like, OK.
00:31:43
Speaker
I'm shocked Zack Snyder didn't fucking shoot her. Why would he? Why would she not share that information with with Superman? Yeah. If she at least be like, hey, look what I found. I found this. Can you use your fucking microscopic vision? Yeah. Like you said, there are these zero number for each other.
00:31:58
Speaker
You fucking Superman's your boyfriend. He's about to bang you in a tub that he's standing in. With his jeans on, so you don't get super sperm shot off your back. Oh, man, yeah. But anyway, so, ah. So I think that's at the point where the film jumps to Batman for most of it. It becomes Batman's film for a lot. It becomes the Batman movie. And Jeremy Irons, I thought, was pretty decent. Alfred? This is my problem, though. He's all right. My problem with this.
00:32:28
Speaker
is the fact that he is literally the same age as Bruce Wayne, you can tell. He's fucking running around, hacking computers, not doing anything that Alfred does, actually.
00:32:40
Speaker
He's not getting him tea. He's not. He didn't tend to that house for shit. Yeah. Yeah, the house looks like shit. They turn off. Bruce Wayne gives him coffee. Yeah, Bruce Wayne gives him coffee. No, they turn Alfred into a Barbara Gordon Oracle slash Lucius Fox role. Even though Barbara Gordon was supposed to be. Yeah, she was supposed to be in the movie, so I don't understand. She dodged a bullet. Yeah. Oh, she'll be in the ultimate cut. She was thrown out of the way. The Barbara Gordon cut. Yeah.
00:33:07
Speaker
So yeah, so my problem with, I mean Jeremy Irons, yeah sure, that's fine. Oh fuck. But he's not, he's not Alfred.
Critique of Alfred's Depiction
00:33:15
Speaker
That was my problem. I just thought, and I'm like, dude, you know that Ultimate Cut's gonna have the fucking killing joke in it too. Because Zack Snyder can't resist to fucking make the penultimate comic. He's like, there's too many people in wheelchairs. Dude, I bet you he made that shit. He's probably on film somewhere. No, but like Jeremy Irons, I didn't mind. I just go, like, he's just kind of like, people go, he's great. And I go, well,
00:33:38
Speaker
He's competent, but nobody listens to him. He says some stuff, and Bruce Wayne doesn't listen to him ever. He yells at him in the argue a few times, but he's never like, you know what, Alfred? You were right. He's just like, fuck you, Alfred. And then Alfred pilots a drone, and then thankfully doesn't murder anybody. In what they could have done to Alfred?
00:34:00
Speaker
Like, they could have had Alfred also killing people in a batsuit. They'd be like, aha! I have 37 kills, master. This is weird. Like that one in the comics. Yeah, there's a weird line where it's kind of implied that Alfred has the keys to the batsuit. Because that's why he got mad at the suit, because Alfred didn't let him bring it to Lex's party. This one literally says, he literally says, I'm going to need the suit tonight. And he's like, no. He's like, no, you can't use that. You don't have to use that suit.
00:34:26
Speaker
Yeah, and then he gets and then he gets and then he starts fucking grimacing at the suit like Like so I guess Alfred has the keys to the suit. I will do it tonight No, no, no you had it last night. You got to do your homework enough people last night. It wasn't murder. I just brain just because I Need even kill it. Are we talking about Batman right now? Are we talking about bad? Yeah, let's
00:34:50
Speaker
I mean, we'll probably go back to Superman at some point, but he was really like not over the place. He really was not like, uh, this isn't his board. Yeah. That may gets the most character development. He gets the most screen time. Would you call it development? No, I'm sorry. Retardation. He gets the most downgrade. Yeah. It's the most degradation screen time. The beginning of the film. And he has the most to do.
00:35:12
Speaker
Origin. Yeah, he has the most to do. Yeah, where he magically flies. Yeah, where he flies? We were just fucking nudging each other we were like, oh my god, we're in store That was like the first thing they showed to was like he goes through the thing whatever that was like I didn't want to see it nobody has to see it at this point like this the Batman origin and
00:35:35
Speaker
I mean, you're going to do it. No, you have to for Charles Foster Wayne's Rosebud moment later on in the movie. Well, yeah. Well, he tries to fight that mugger. That's why he gets shot. Because if you're a superhero father, like the father of a superhero, you have to be a fucking idiot.
00:35:53
Speaker
Well, to be fair, at least he didn't do what they did in Amazing Spider-Man, where it was like, cool guy mugger, and he's like, hey guys, you want some free pretzels? That guy is so cool! You stole those pretzels from the store! I'll give you actors and shoot myself with it! I'll show you! No, I'm just trying to give you pretzels! Bang! Bang! Although, our ideas warped to the surface. Yeah, we're bad movies to make better decisions. I wish that scene was one-to-one.
00:36:23
Speaker
But like, so people, this is what people are walking away, a lot of people are saying this, and they say, Ben Affleck's the best on-screen Batman of all time. And my statement to that is Ben Affleck should be disqualified from any conversations about best Batman. Not because he's not good, he's not Batman. He's not terrible, he's not a- It's Batman, he's a likable guy. No, but he's not, this character is not,
00:36:50
Speaker
Batman yeah, this character is a dude who? This is like during our this is the urine our bat, and they have the art that is they have the argument them and kills and all the moves like No, there's a lot of by proxy stuff, and yeah, you're right It can get a little dicey right, but like we go from Christian Bale my one rule Joker's the whole dark night is about Joker pushing them to that point yeah
00:37:15
Speaker
And we just get this guy who's just like like blatantly killing Blame like like shoot your car I'll shoot you your car will be on fire and then I'll drive through it and then I'll back off and then I'll drive through it again
00:37:33
Speaker
landing on vehicles firing heat-seeking missiles at people on turrets yeah he takes a car swings it around another scream confirms there's people in there and I'm like alright listen yeah I get it right but like I
00:37:54
Speaker
The moral high ground that Batman is supposed to have is gone. But that would be kids. He doesn't try to save Razzell Gould from the subway train wreck. He blows up the monastery. We mention these things. This is the difference between Superman leaving Zod
00:38:15
Speaker
somewhere to meet his own fate and snapping his fucking neck in front of a fucking scared family. There's a difference! Yeah, and it's just, it's
Batman’s Violent Methods
00:38:26
Speaker
just... He had like, Zack Snyder was describing Batman's killings as manslaughter. He was like, it's more like manslaughter than murder. It's really more like, proximal murder. No, Batman like, goes out of his way to prevent that. Batman, Batman, this is capital murder in the first degree because he's actually firing missiles that can take human life.
00:38:43
Speaker
If you were to tell me in a court of law, if I shot somebody's flamethrower tank, would I be like, well, your honor. Technically. Yeah. It's not first degree. It's maybe, you know, I just don't. It's so, so, yeah. So obviously it's Batman's movie. He's killing people. Why, why, why the branding? What is that? What is that brand? It's hardcore.
00:39:06
Speaker
No, but still like that. And honestly, I'm not a comic fan because I didn't like this movie. But has he ever done that before? I don't think so. I don't think so. He's become Dracula. He's beat people up with with fucking nail baseball bats as they're in our Batman. Branding. The branding is that brand. The bat brand. So when they go to jail, they get murdered.
00:39:32
Speaker
They said it's a death sentence. So he would get the chair. No, no, no, no, no. It's so prisoners will beat him and stab him to death. Oh, OK. Yeah. Oh, it was like when Matt Murdock carved the bullseye in the bullseye. Yeah. It happened once because he was crazy. Right.
00:39:49
Speaker
As long as I had it coming man. Yeah coming, but still ain't kill so old Batman's going around brain I want to know how many brands Joker has Another point just brands of penis drawing full battle. We're already fucking deal like fucking with the timeline. There's no reason Yeah, why show me a lot? Yeah
00:40:11
Speaker
Why's your girl on that? They would have killed that dude. He would have killed that dude. I see minutes in maybe the first time he got caught He was like fuck that that dude's a nut. I mean, obviously he obviously murdered her. Yeah, he murdered a robin, right? I am now he just spray-painted on a robin suit that man killed him. Yeah, why do you? Like when the suit to remind him to remind him why he needs to brand people But like be watching that movie. I'm like, oh brainy. It's pretty hardcore like
00:40:41
Speaker
I think in my head, I'm trying to like, maybe he doesn't know. Maybe he doesn't. I don't know, right? Maybe he just punched them real hard. In my head, I was like, all right, maybe this is just a thing where like Batman is so down, like he's been doing this for years and nothing seems to be changing. But at least he's got outright killing. Right. Like maybe later in the film,
00:40:59
Speaker
He'll take a page from Superman. That's what happened. So when we saw those things in the trailer, the first thing I thought was the fact that maybe it's the son's Batman that are running around. That's what I thought. That's the first thing that came to mind.
00:41:18
Speaker
This is fucking DKR Batman. We're gonna try and bring him off DKR. Yeah, maybe the sons of Batman are around. I don't know. We'll get to this more, but I just want to say, like, I'm watching him. I'm like, okay, the branding. And then the nightmare scene, where he shoots everybody, and I'm like, dude, that was the nightmare scene. So it's like, okay. Okay, he's still kind of in the clear. Wait, which nightmare scene are we talking about? When he's shooting people, when he saw him. And then, but I'm like, it's a dream. Okay, whatever. And then he gets to the mapmobile and I was like,
00:41:45
Speaker
Okay, well he threw the car. Okay. I've seen some of that stuff in like Dark Knight. And then he fires a rocket. The turret guy gets lit up. His car's... The bullet did it. Not Batman.
00:42:02
Speaker
He did it, he killed it by accident, guys, so it's not really killing. Yeah, and then he like, he fucking, he drives, he drives the car onto the fucking flatbed, or onto like the truck, and like, there's three guys in there, by the end of it, there's two guys, so one of them's gone, and then, you know, in the bat plane,
00:42:21
Speaker
you know that's seven guys right there like yeah there's no they don't scatter they don't scary there and then he fights he beats up all the guys and I was like what at this point I'm just like you should just be stabbing them all in the face like there's a reason he shouldn't be there's a scene where that's him and then he stabbed that guy and like I know it's his shoulder but the angle they do it he's like
00:42:48
Speaker
Yeah, and then he does the thing where he pranks in and the guy's gonna burn Martha Kent. He's gonna burn Superman's mom and he kills him. And some people were like...
00:43:01
Speaker
Bro. The one of the most frustrating arguments is like, who did he kill? I didn't see him kill anybody. And I'm just like, what is wrong with you? I've seen those comments. I'm like, whoa. Yeah, Trump, man. So that movie, I was just like, they fucked up that man. Like to me, I'm like.
00:43:19
Speaker
Well, they fucked Superman up, I guess, of course they would have to fuck Batman. Of course they would fuck Batman up. Yeah, and I get it, but like, this isn't an excuse. Like, a bunch of, by proxy, like, actual, like, kind of, by proxy kills, and a bunch of, like, different times. These aren't- These aren't decade kills. Doesn't give you, like, the fucking cart block to just, like, just mow people down, like he does in that movie. And, you know, and maybe this is a lot of us just putting our own psyche into, like, how Batman should have reacted to Superman, but it's just like,
00:43:49
Speaker
What position do you have besides that, like, you're a xenophobic asshole? Like, like, he has no position. And that's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. Well, so are you, dude.
00:43:59
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, he has no he has no right like there's the Bruce Wayne that's worried for mankind and then there's this Bruce Wayne that goes around branding people and Those two people like I guess I don't know Like he has no like you said there's he has no right at all to be angry for Superman No, because aside from that he's just racist or you know, exactly or whatever you want to be when he's not braids
00:44:27
Speaker
But that's it. That's what I'm saying is like they took what was supposed to be Lex's Standpoint on Superman and throw it on to Batman for no reason exactly. Yeah that the opening of that movie could have been Lex Luthor. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, this could have been
00:44:44
Speaker
I don't know, man. This could have been like... Wonder Woman, Diana Prince could have been Senator Finch. She could have been the government-like role that links the Batman and Superman and the superheroes together. Because she does that kind of stuff anyway. She's Wonder Woman. In this movie, she plays Wonder Woman as Catwoman for most of it. She's Agent Diana Prince. I know that, but...
00:45:09
Speaker
But it doesn't make sense. Like Waldo said, if you do not know that one woman- Explain, explain. So this guy, Freakers, Waldo has this innate ability to like actually have, he can go into a movie blind. He will not watch the trailers. He's like, I don't, I saw the first trailer and that's it.
00:45:27
Speaker
Major he doesn't know about spider man like he doesn't know about spider. Yeah I probably spoiled it for him, but like he does he didn't see that trailer You know like that's how shut down like he was like I didn't know Aquaman was in the movie until I saw a toy And we're like oh Yeah, so like for the majority of the movie. He thought that Diana Prince Wonder Woman
00:45:51
Speaker
was Selena Kyle Catwoman. Yeah. And the knee jerk is like, you fucking idiot. But think about it. Brunette kind of connected to Bruce, catches Bruce. The way they introduce her. She steals something from him. The way they introduce her in that movie is the way they introduced her in The Dark Knight Rises and in Batman Returns. Yeah.
00:46:14
Speaker
Yeah, she steals something from it and then and up until like the very end like like until the email scene, which you know That's not an email they are I am in each other This is in your email you are the yeah Oh shit, it's Wonder Woman and I was like, well when you think of when you bring it down like that Like of course if you think of being a woman
00:46:41
Speaker
Yeah, she's a slender, sexy, stealer person thief. Wonder Woman. Yeah. Or Catwoman. Is it? I don't know. I'm confused with you all the time now that I've seen her. We don't know. We don't know. But... Where were we? But that's the thing, like, again, like... No, we were just talking about how, like...
00:47:00
Speaker
like Batman like the characterization is off it's just not there and I you know who is the bitter angry one and yeah yeah but so is Christian Bale yeah and he didn't kill anyone no he actually should have killed
00:47:16
Speaker
a bunch of people. He actually had, he, man, they did so well in the Dark Knight where he put the faith in the humanity and fucking blues load all over Joker's face. Like, like that's the kind of, these are the kind of characteristics that we're supposed to see in these heroes, right? I don't care if it's dark or too, if it's gritty or if it's like, you know, if it's brooding or whatnot.
00:47:38
Speaker
Like, that's fine. If you wanna make that movie, sure. And like I said, I was okay with whatever decisions they made with Man of Steel, you know, in Man of Steel up until the big moment. And what they did with this movie is they just, instead of trying to fix whatever issues people had, which is what they looked like they were trying to do. Oh, overly so. To the point where there are sins where it's like, don't worry, there's no one in that area. Where there's people protesting,
00:48:07
Speaker
Yeah. Oh no! Super influence base! Shoot the nuke! Shoot the nuke! Like, you know what I mean? Like, they're trying, it's like they were trying and then Zack Snyder just went out of control and was like, yo, let's just fucking...
00:48:21
Speaker
Fuck it! I want this to look cool! I forgot about that. Where was his hammer that he had? Did he have a hammer? Batman, didn't he have a big hammer? Or was that the spear from the trailer? This is spear, I'm pretty sure. It doesn't seem to work. Are you talking about the Trinity shot where it's Wonder Woman with the sword and shield, Superman, and him with his shotgun? Yeah. The patented bat shotgun? Yeah. They're so Batman detective in this movie.
00:48:47
Speaker
No, I was like Batman kind of stealth spy. Look, where do I need to go? Yeah. Yeah. He Batman could easily have just been working for like TMZ or something like a man at that point didn't care to look. He stole anybody's anybody's like past. I didn't know that round. He didn't find out who Superman was. He just didn't care. That's the thing. He didn't care to learn. He said that's an alien freak. That was it. That was it. That was it.
00:49:14
Speaker
He needed no nudging. Yeah, that's a problem. Also, he's the worst boss of all time. Bring it back to the beginning of the movie. Jack! He calls Jack. The yo-yo killer is happening. The whole thing's happening, right? Billions are falling.
00:49:33
Speaker
And Bruce was like, you gotta get out of there. Like, they had to wait for Bruce Wayne to call him before the boss says we can leave. What is the hard ass you have to be that you're scared to leave? Like, I'm explaining to me that you gotta get the boss to call. Okay, all right, let's get out of there.
00:49:53
Speaker
He has to fly a chopper and drive to the building. Yeah, he has to drive near the building. Yeah No, he has to check the building out to make sure it's it's an Situation that they should be leaving work for I don't see any snow
00:50:17
Speaker
No, but seriously though, again, going back to this real quick, why does he get Jack, but we get fucking Jimmy Olsen, Superman's best pal, has to get shot in the head with a fucking bullet?
00:50:37
Speaker
Why? I don't understand. Because the first thing I asked them was like, yo, who is Jack? Is that like a real, like, is that a real character? I can't think of it. I think it's just a guy named Jack. I'm sure some old guy who like runs Wayne Financial. I'm Jimmy Olsen, just some random photographer that works for the CIA. Got shot in the face. They were just like problems.
00:50:57
Speaker
Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack,
00:51:12
Speaker
And the beginning of that movie is like 103-minute long scenes with no establishing shot that just throws you in a- Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's no- There's no close-ups. You feel like you're in a fucking- Well, I think- Like fever dream. I think maybe they made a big, like an executive decision. It was like, oh, you know what? We didn't do that. We didn't do any B-roll. So, make Gotham City right next to- Drop right there. Listen, we don't have the funds for helicopter shots.
00:51:40
Speaker
In this movie, we're just gonna have to- We spent it all on the goddamn Twitter marketing. Sorry. You got Nolan. Spent all the cereal. You got Nolan. All he does are establishing shots, which are awesome. Yeah. From the sky, Batman fucking parachuting his plane thing down. His Halo China or whatever. Yeah. The plane getting hung in mid-air. Sure. This guy?
00:52:07
Speaker
Yeah, Batman. Give Batman a shotgun and just make him fight. I'll say this. Bruce Wayne's not bad. I have a lot of hard- No. Like, I can take- I can take bitter, pissy Bruce Wayne. I can take that too. Right? He drinks and fucks chicks. You gotta respect that. I mean, Graham Morrison did bring that back. Okay, yeah, yeah. So that's fine. Although he drinks now. No, no, no. The drinking thing, I don't think-
00:52:28
Speaker
Does he drink? In Dark Knight. In Dark Knight, he pretends to and throws it off the thing. No, no, no. I'm saying this is one of the bigger problems with the movie. He wants to keep taking nods from Dark Knight Returns.
00:52:44
Speaker
But they're like all half measures. It's like, well, this, but it doesn't fit with a lot of other stuff. Yeah. Because like, yeah, he drinks all he does. He's like a hard drinker in Dark Knight Returns. But I'm like, yeah, this isn't Dark Knight Returns, dude. You're not making Dark Knight Returns. He's not returning. You're making Batman be Superman. You're making Batman be Superman. You start to the DC.
00:53:03
Speaker
Yeah, that's all. Yeah, we'll see. He shoots the guy with the machine gun, Dark Knight Returns. I'm like, yes. He says I believe you. Dark Knight Returns. Yeah, he threw too many. He threw so many Dark Knight Returns. It's because he doesn't want to make his own good stories. He wants to
00:53:19
Speaker
find ways to try to adapt everyone else's perfect stories into not perfect facts. Yeah, and that's what's shitty. It made more sense in Watchmen because that was one cohesive story, right? Yeah. So he was able to do that. And Dark Knight Returns is a sort of list now because they're Dark Knight 3, but he's not making Dark Knight Returns. That's the problem. He's cherry picking scenes that work in the context of that book.
00:53:46
Speaker
Yeah, they don't in this and that's a lot. It's like a bad mashup. Yeah. No, dude, dude, like it's a weird comparison, but like a bad comic book movie like 2003's Daredevil just takes big iconic scenes from the book, but it's not the book.
00:54:02
Speaker
So your foot, it doesn't, it's wrong. Like you're looking at it and you're like, this is wrong. Higher, higher round tomatoes score. Better. Some people, the people that were really, people that were, people that were really pissed off about Ben Affleck's casting because Daredevil.
00:54:19
Speaker
The movie doesn't earn anything. The people that didn't give Charlie Cox's Daredevil a chance because of the movie that got fucked up before has a double of the Rotten Tomatoes score. Has a 58% to Batman V Superman's 29%. That is two times 29. That's 58. That's double. It's twice as good.
00:54:45
Speaker
No, but the movie doesn't earn a single bit of what's happening. No. It doesn't earn... My biggest problem... It doesn't earn the battle. No, that's the thing. We're doing it in the second movie. In the context of that second movie, it just happens. So they don't earn the Superman death, they don't earn... They don't earn Lexus intelligence quotient.
00:55:08
Speaker
Yeah, they don't earn any characterization that they have with each other. They don't, they don't earn why he dislikes you. They don't earn why Superman's a kind of a divisive figure. Like they have a bunch of talking to heads, but it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't do enough. Like it doesn't do enough.
00:55:26
Speaker
enough like groundwork for whatever they're trying. They don't. They don't. Doesn't make any sense where you're supposed to get excited for the future. Like like a return of Superman. Yeah. The dark side. Yes. They'll earn it. They don't earn the fucking flash bursting in after that dream sequence.
00:55:44
Speaker
You were right! You were right about Superman! Kill Lois! He flat out says that pretty much. It's the girl! Wait, he said, my favorite line, part of that, he goes,
00:55:58
Speaker
I'm too early, and I'm looking at it, right? And I go, I understand. This is Ezra Miller, and this is Grant Goss. And they're both very young. They're both the Flash, and I get multiverse and all that. But I was like, I don't like that. I don't like this one. He's got a crustache. I don't like it. Stop it.
00:56:18
Speaker
No, but before no, I don't want to pick the cabbias because they were not me picking that cameo That's them trying to establish I know I know he has time travel abilities the flash I didn't know he was Freddie fucking Kruger now showing up in people's dreams. Yeah, man What okay, uh
00:56:46
Speaker
You want to talk about the nightmare scene?
'Nightmare Sequence' Analysis
00:56:50
Speaker
That ties into the nightmare scene. The parademons I think were dope. I liked the way they looked. I was like, alright, that's pretty cool. Batman shooting dudes.
00:57:04
Speaker
I'm looking at it, I'm going, well it's, it's, it's, Darkseid took over the fucking world. I get it, right? Alright, sure. Superman murdering dudes and I'm like, well, okay, there we go. And then, yeah, and then he wakes up, then he has the thing, and he says something along the lines of like, she's the key, it's Lois, you were right about him the whole time.
00:57:36
Speaker
So now I'm thinking like two, maybe one or two movies ahead. I was like, so are they gonna try to fake it out and it's gonna be Darkside? Like it's Batman. You're like, this Darkside is a pretty cool guy. And then like later is like, oh no, that's who it was. It wasn't Superman. Or Superman's gonna come back and just be evil. And like that's the future of the movie, which is more just Zack Snyder going like, fuck you Superman. You're the worst.
00:57:53
Speaker
something like, you know.
00:58:02
Speaker
I just want to break down the whole movie as fast as possible. So real quick, we're running out of time. We gotta jump to the B-side, which is the fun Daredevil podcast. It's not fun, but it's good.
00:58:16
Speaker
We have Batman who wants to kill Superman because he's an alien, right? We have Lex Luthor who discovers Kryptonite. You don't like him, right? I'm gonna get to that. Why didn't Superman clean up that world machine in the Indian Ocean?
00:58:32
Speaker
It was there for like two years. I'll get to the comparison. I'm sorry. Because there is a very mirrored scene in this in this one. So, all right. So they're both trying to kill Superman, right? Lex or Batman finds out that Lex was holding it in the white Portuguese ship. So he tries to steal it from him. Superman stops him. Right. Yeah, inadvertently. But he gets the kryptonite.
00:59:01
Speaker
But the thing is, he gets the Kryptonite and the access to the crashed ship. Two mutually exclusive things. You don't need one for the other. I thought he had access to the crashed ship before that. Maybe. Because he put a jolly rancher in a senator's mouth. He got the crashed ship and Zod's body. And the Kryptonite was on its way and then the senator sold him out and then he peed in a jar and blew her up. Yeah. So Zod and the ship
00:59:30
Speaker
Kryptonite, two mutually exclusive things. They do not intersect with each other. One is not needed for the other. Am I right? Sort of. He takes he gets the kryptonite because he has to get to get his fingertips off so he can get access to the ship. OK, so you forgot the Africa scene because the Africa scene is Lex Luthor framing Superman in order to have Senate hearings so he can convince the Senate so he could get access to the world machine. Yeah. And the Zodbach. Yeah.
00:59:58
Speaker
So how very complicated plan, but why? Yeah, exactly. So he doesn't, he doesn't FedEx, uh, overnight FedEx, the kryptonite to Wayne Manor, right? Right. Batman has to, Batman gets pushed to, to try to steal it again successfully this time. Yeah. Because the fucking, the white house blew up, right?
01:00:17
Speaker
Again, I have a huge problem with the fact that Superman didn't pick up on on the bomb right he's from with his reaction to that Oh, yeah, which was smh more work. He's uh, he tweeted smdh
01:00:30
Speaker
After that happened, he said, fuck it. I'm going on vacation. He flies away. He flies away, sees his dad because he's psycho. He's fucking paranoid, schizophrenic. Dude, when he showed up, I'm like, I'm fucking done. Dad tells a story about killing whales. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. Of course not. He hears your screams when he goes to bed at night. This is your dad telling you a terrible story. Yeah. No wonder why he's a psycho.
01:00:57
Speaker
No wonder he fucking ran into the tornado! He didn't want to hear the fucking screams anymore! Oh, are I going to hear the screams anymore? I have to kill myself. Still, number one bad guy. Number one bad guy. Pa Ken. Fucking Father of the Year. Pa Ken. God, they wasted so much money on kennel dogs. Kill those kids. Kill horses. And Ma Ken's like, fuck these people. Do whatever you want. You don't owe them nothing, Clark.
01:01:24
Speaker
Yeah, so sorry it's foster parents by the way it's Russell Crowe's a different Dude is a bad guy on his own planet stealing baby sculls from fucking Krypton So bad man successfully steals a kryptonite this time could've done it
01:01:39
Speaker
I guess anytime you just needed the White House to blow up. He got extra mad. He got the checks. Extra mad. And then she blew up. Yeah, he got the checks. Yeah, so in between that time, in between that time, Lex sees the legless guy and gives him a fancy wheelchair that blows up and was like, yo, I want you to stand for something. I was like, bro, bro, that's a little too much there. I think that whole legless guy screaming at Superman in court wasn't too much.
01:02:10
Speaker
I'm like, this is weird. I'm watching a Superman movie with Superman in it, and he's just like, what were you doing to me? What is this, the board on the 4th of July? What the fuck is happening? Should we be mad at both Batman and Superman? Sure. Well, not Batman, Bruce Wayne. See, that doesn't make sense.
01:02:33
Speaker
because he's sending the checks back but or is he because Lex admits that he was writing on those checks so who was sending the checks back no but that's the thing he didn't get Lex was intercepting the checks and writing on them and so I can't make a call HR but how much time passes by where he has like 12 checks that the one guy in the company was like oh mr. Wayne I forgot to tell you we've had these checks 18 months 18 months of checks
01:02:58
Speaker
So Lexus had this plan for, he's had this plan for forever, right? He's had this plan for 18 months to push Bruce Wayne over the edge so that he'll see him. He knows who everyone is. Lex Luthor discovers everyone's identity. This is what doesn't make any sense. So like why did he not just give him the kryptonite? Like why did he still make him? Does he need the kryptonite?
01:03:26
Speaker
Doesn't make sense. Why can you just split it in half and just send them half? I think I think he was he didn't want him to know that okay, so yeah, so okay, okay, so that's fine, so
01:03:36
Speaker
Like, long story short, this becomes Lex's grand plan, which still doesn't make sense, even after all that stuff, because he was trying to push Batman to steal Kryptonite from him, but his plan was for Superman to kill Batman the whole time. So he kidnapped Martha right to witch on her head. Not wrong. He's not wrong.
01:03:59
Speaker
She is kind of a witch. She's a horrible person and a horrible mother. She grows that flying demon. But her name is Martha. Bruce Wayne. He makes a spear. He makes a kryptonite spear. He works out a bunch and he makes a spear. And he walls the other parts to make gas. Kryptonite shotgun farts done. Why didn't he just make a kryptonite bullet at that point?
01:04:26
Speaker
No, I don't know. Why would he do that? He was totally down with killing at that point. No, but that's the thing. He was going to impale the fucking dude with the spear. He even kind of branded him, too, with his face. He did. He cut his face. He made him a bat. Hold still. I'm not done yet. Hold still. Well, he couldn't do that because he was too busy attaching rope to him and swinging him around. Oh, yeah. OK, so the fight scene was an underwhelming. We got to get to the fight scene.
01:04:53
Speaker
Yeah,
Titular Fight Critique and Animated Comparison
01:04:54
Speaker
it was very underwhelming. Well this is like the thing, the movie's called Batman v Superman. This is what you're waiting for. And it's, it's there, it's not great. It's not kinetic, it's not fun, it's, it's, they're, you know, they do the big close up and you're like, alright, and it's, and maybe that was the plan because they're like, ooh, it's like too tight, it's fine, but everything was so slow. And I get he's in a big robot suit, but like,
01:05:21
Speaker
But that's the thing, maybe that stuff doesn't work on film. Like it does in an established archival history of comic books. Yeah, it's a lot of punching. It's not like, you know, hey, let's make these comparisons. But like, Captain America and Bucky.
01:05:40
Speaker
Right? There's stuff going on. They had a whole movie of our big friends together before that. Both times. Both times. There's stuff going on. This is just him. He's punching up. There's some cool stuff. Superman going through the smoke and he got away. Even though that whole thing's clunky. Like Superman or Batman just takes a big smoke grenade and you just drop. Not like a ninja. And he has to wait for the smoke to come out before he leaves.
01:06:04
Speaker
They're fighting he drops a sink on his head cuz he's a fucking thug. Yeah, that was a prison fight. Yeah Yeah, the kryptonite wears off Batman goes yo chill dude. Yo relax, bro. I know bro. Yeah, I was just pregnant. Oh, yeah
01:06:24
Speaker
hits him again, Batman just swings him around and it's all slow and dumb. I'm like, this isn't cool. This isn't like fun. It wasn't the zod, but entertaining. You know, it's just like, whoa. I'm like, that's all right. Maybe one of
Mocking the 'Martha' Scene
01:06:41
Speaker
my favorite first introductions of Batman and Superman was in the animated series.
01:06:47
Speaker
when they first meet and fucking Superman just like kind of pushes him out of the way. He's like, yo, fuck you. No, no, Batman. The first thing Batman does is judo throw. Yeah. He's like, what's up? I scared you. You're Batman. You're the best combatant on the fucking Earth. You know, he only weighs like 265 pounds, which is your thigh. Yeah. So it doesn't matter.
01:07:15
Speaker
But he's just like woo and screaming around. And then goes to stab them and... My mom's name is Martha! And goes, what does that mean, dude? So this is where I... It's actually an obligated scene of Batman screaming something incoherently. Yeah. It's in all the other Batman movies of recent. What did you say? What's that talking about? What did you say? Why did you say Martha? And then Lois Lane shows up and she's like,
01:07:41
Speaker
It says Mom. It says Mom Psycho. Oh shit. I think I just threw that spear away. Those mumbles did too. Oh wait, that Eugene threw the spear away. Yeah, so, well not only.
01:07:54
Speaker
Okay, Martha, right? But then we have to relive the entire scene for like a third time. The Rosebud scene. The Rosebud scene. I was like, good it, push the bullet, then I was told, Martha, we get it. And I'm like, all right. Jack Snyder forgot to put young Bruce Wayne in that shot. So it's like he wasn't present for that scene. Bruce Wayne.
Lex Luthor's Plan and Doomsday
01:08:11
Speaker
At this point, we can assume, safely assume, that Batman was the one who shot them. Right. The kids fucking blew them both away. Just fucking eye close-ups and you're like, all right. Oh, not the fucking black eye that shot them. So that's why they're friends.
01:08:23
Speaker
Right? They don't earn the friendship. Oh Martha! MOTHER! Fucking okay! Sure. That's why Bruce so suddenly abandons all of his beliefs in one split second. It's disgusting. Throws a kryptonite spear away. How dare I? What's wrong with you? But there's still no motivation for him to want to kill Superman. There's no motivation for him to not want to kill Superman. Who are you, some mom?
01:08:46
Speaker
Yeah. And then it's like, all right, so let's jump back to the breakdown. So is that a flamethrower guy? So Superman is like, go save Martha! And Batman goes, no, I'll save Martha. Because you might kill someone. Go take care of this movie's version of the world engine while I save your mom. No, listen, we'll switch it off. I'll kill the Joker, huh? Because that's who Lex Luthor is in this movie. He's more Joker than any.
01:09:15
Speaker
Anybody else? And then he's like, no, you saved my mom. So Batman shoots up everything in the bat.
Wonder Woman's Introduction and Trailer Spoilers
01:09:22
Speaker
The bat plane. Kills about 18 people. And then he's like, oh, I get it. I'll just jump in there and murder everyone. So he jumps in there and he stabs people. He stabs people. School fights.
01:09:33
Speaker
It's a cool fight. It's a cool fight. But we saw it on a trailer though. Oh, that's another problem with this movie. You could have just seen all the fucking trailers and been like, yep, seen all the scenes. Yeah, I was disappointed. I saw it, and I was like, I thought they really had more to show. I didn't think they would be so dumb to show the whole thing. That's what they did with Man of Steel. It's the same exact situation.
Superman's Death Scene and Funeral
01:09:51
Speaker
No matter what, they're always the trailer. No matter what, they're always the trailer. I will get to. Yeah, yeah. But still, I was like, fucking, it was just another thing to disappoint me. So Doomsday comes out. Right.
01:10:01
Speaker
Well yeah Batman kills the guy, shoots the flamethrower guy, what attempted humor so far in the movie? Where it's destroyed by murder. But at the same time, it's a scene right out of Dark Knight Returns. He says I believe you in the Dark Knight Returns.
01:10:20
Speaker
If you're a comic fan, you'll love this movie. I love that. I'm a comic fan. I love that, man. So, yeah. So he murders a bunch of people on the third floor. Saves Martha. Saves Martha. She makes a joke about Caves.
Wonder Woman's Role and Missed Opportunities
01:10:31
Speaker
Superman's pissed. Hilarious. Superman is pissed. He goes to the first Crash World machine, I believe. Yeah. And Lex, well, at some point, Lex
01:10:39
Speaker
Doring all this fucking shit. He's like hey, you know what I'm gonna do I'm gonna stay in a gun gunk takes odds body bleed all over his face And then don't and then doomsday is gonna happen. That's what happens when you do that Yeah, would you bleed on a Kryptonian? They turn it? No, we're talking about so It's gonna sound a little crass. But when you bleed on a Kryptonian and there's that happens
01:11:04
Speaker
So as Superman's cock looks just like a big doomsday monster this whole shit cuz you know one night either tearing their own superior sex had to have happened Spiky so
01:11:18
Speaker
The scene with Doomsday where Lex was
Critique of Lex Luthor and Storytelling
01:11:21
Speaker
like, huh? I forget what he said. He said it were God's monsters. And he's really, he's right. So much. Immediately at that point, he's like, why would we have a being that could do so much stuff? I needed to make a being that can do so much stuff. Yeah. And then he makes, he says, if God's all powerful, he's not all good. Man, they didn't even, they didn't have to do Tuesday. That could have been like bizarro or something. That would have made more sense.
01:11:46
Speaker
But Lexus has no plan, right? He goes, huh. Well, after the
Batman and Superman's Alliance Potential
01:11:51
Speaker
whole killing Batman plan pops up, because he wants to prove to the world that Superman's not a Boy Scout, which is, well, I don't know why he even acted like that. He's tarnished. He is fully and wholly tarnished. Anyway, his backup plan is Doomsday. What was the plan there?
01:12:12
Speaker
Like, alright, I'll kill Superman. Then what? Well, first thing he tries to do is kill Lex. It's kill Lex, he tries to punch him because he's a fucking monster. So I'm like, alright, that was Lex's brilliant plan. So, Lex and Superman doomsday start fighting. They fight into space.
01:12:28
Speaker
the government nukes them first chance they get they never comes a little nooky baby becomes a skeleton comes a new comic yeah it's cool to see because it's like a man's dead and we I said this on the drive
Characterization of Superman and Batman
01:12:41
Speaker
by I totally like didn't acknowledge that that actually happened yeah
01:12:45
Speaker
Like I forgot that happens. Oh, it's like what's easy to forget. I've seen a zombie Superman this fucking movie But when there's a break here where Batman gets on aim and he sends out his message to wonder what that's right before Okay, there's that secondary is right before the Batman of Superman fight. Oh, that's before you're like ready. You're ready to go Yeah, you're so he says that's a Wonder Woman Wonder Woman takes her that flames
01:13:12
Speaker
After the nuke happens, that's when Wonder Woman says, I need to get off of this. She's reading all the emails, and she's looking at all the character profiles. And she's like, I need to go, because she realized her identity. Yeah, yeah, because she's like, oh, he knows. And then the nuke happens. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then she's like, I need to get off of this plane. And they're like, get back here, Diana Prince. And that's the first time they say her name. Yeah, that's Prince. And you're like, what? And probably Waldo went, oh, OK. That was for Waldo. Let's see.
01:13:39
Speaker
It's one of the people that thought she was a cowboy. Yeah. Good luck here, Selena Kyle. Oh, yeah. I think we're forgetting the scene. I'm sure we are. Lois throws the spear away. Oh, yeah. Lois throws the spear away. So at this point, they fight. Superman gets nuked. He's dead in space. They land on Rikers Island, and somebody goes, oh, it's a bandit. And you're like, OK. Thanks, movie. Yeah. Batman is like, I got a bandit on that island.
01:14:10
Speaker
Sees it. Sees doomsday. Doomsday's not super powered. Yeah, doomsday, yeah. His spikes are growing in. He's shooting eye lasers. Padman goes, better take this guy back to that city where that kryptonite spear is. And it's like, and I'm watching. I go, that seems like a terrible idea. I think everyone thought that. And so he's flying, because he's flying away. He's like, we can't stop it. I need the kryptonite. Got to bring it into the city. You're already halfway to picking up the kryptonite spear. He's like, no, I got to kid him to chase me. Yeah. He shoots doomsday. Doomsday chases him.
01:14:40
Speaker
The bat plane blows up. He's about to die. Oh, shit. Second humor, second funny joke. And then Wonder Woman shows up. Big reveal, got an applause. I already saw it in the trailer. Saw it in the trailer. So I still think. I was like, OK. Oh, she's here, right? Yeah. The music, like, where the hell? Like, it's there. And I'm like, all right. And then I think Superman just, like, the sun hits him and he's fine and he just lands. Yeah.
01:15:09
Speaker
And then, we have the Trinity Shot. Oh, there's some banter. Oh, I thought you were gonna get the spear. I don't know how Superman knew about the spear. I don't know either. I don't know how Lois knew about the spear. There's no reason Lois knew about the spear. Lois threw it in, and then she's like, I need to get the spear out. Yeah, Diana says, why'd you bring him back to the city? And he goes, cool, so it's abandoned. And you're like, well, hop away, there's nobody abandoned.
01:15:36
Speaker
geographically you were safer on that island, but still, sure. They keep making excuses, right, for the last movie, even though they shouldn't because murders have already occurred in the movie already, you know? Like, but okay, fine. They fight
01:15:56
Speaker
There's moments, there's moments where I'm like, whoa, it's the Trinity fighting. And I got a little, I got a little swell, like a swell of something in my gut.
01:16:06
Speaker
All right. But then it kind of just evolves into punching because there's no banter. There's no Batman. Don't go here. Do this. I'm a technician. It's not Wonder Woman going like I fight monsters like this all the time. You know, go for the fucking eight in hindsight. In hindsight, one Wonder Woman should have been able to take him out easily because of the weakness, the magic, and she is cutting him up. Yeah. She would show her hand off. Yeah. So I can't wait for Justice League from the clone from his hand. No, but like I'm watching it and I'm like,
01:16:37
Speaker
There's no shake and bake, right? That was like one of the first things you said. That's one of the first things I said. It was like, no shake and bake. There's no shake and bake at all. Not really. And again, that's one of the cool things, even in the Superman Batman comic book, the first run of it, is they're shaking and baking a lot. Yeah. And that is the movie I wanted to see. I don't want to see them fight each other. I've mentioned this plenty of times before. But if you're going to do it, fine. But they're friends now. They're the same mom. They're half brothers. Whatever.
01:17:05
Speaker
One of them showed up sure why man Completely worthless in the doomsday. He just runs away and he fires his last stink bomb Yeah, which I guess makes sense cuz there's not much he can do cuz yeah, he destroyed his own Yeah, the boss of a suit open the yeah, it's a shame the sex player felt he also needed to tell death of Superman in this well That's my that's my big problem is like
01:17:29
Speaker
Like, are we supposed to be sad? Like, for the people that like the movie, like, are you... Were you upset that Superman died in this movie? Did you cry? Cause I read a lot. I'm a comic book fan. I named my son Kent.
01:17:42
Speaker
after Kenta, the wrestler. But Superman, alright, so, Death of Superman, the way that book works is everyone tries to stop Doomsday, and they all fucking fail. And then Superman fucking has to deal with it, and they go toe to toe, and he dies. And it's Doomsday versus Superman, and they kill each other. Yeah.
01:18:04
Speaker
Pretty sad. You got the job done, but he fucking died, but he died. He also took out everybody else. And Batman, I'm sorry, and Superman killed this guy, right? Which is still a big deal. Every time Superman kills somebody in the comics, it's like the circumstances are like fucking catastrophic, right? It's like even when this had to happen, even when he's
01:18:28
Speaker
The topic of discussion of killing somebody comes up. There's whole fucking stories about that. It's called Kingdom Come. He doesn't kill. This is what happens when he doesn't kill. These are the consequences. When he does kill, he strips himself of his powers. He puts himself in exile. The price is so high, he dies.
01:18:50
Speaker
That's an echo, whatever. In this universe, though, when Superman kills someone, he makes a quip later. Like five minutes later. Wow, you're looking quite sexy today, Superman. I know.
01:19:04
Speaker
He throws a fucking US satellite on the ground and expects them not to care. Oh my god. And they give him a funeral like a soldier. Yeah. Yes. Well, yeah. So he impales doomsday. The funeral scene is literally like 45 minutes, I think. It's a very long scene. And they keep cutting out because they keep cutting to other scenes and they keep cutting to another funeral. And they keep going back. And I was like, all right, let's go. Wait, we got to jump back. So all right.
01:19:34
Speaker
Lois drowns while trying to get the spear she threw into the water again Here's here's Lois banging on the thing Yeah, and that's never explained in this movie where it's like Superman is always listening to for Lois's heartbeat Or was that in Man of Steel? No, it wasn't the heartbeat. He just heard her I guess oh
01:19:56
Speaker
I don't know. I mean, I'll say this like I was expecting during that fight I was like, oh he's gonna have that moment where he goes stops and he has to save Lois Yeah, cuz she's clearly going to drown He does that they're like, oh no, and she throws the spear and he's like, I gotta do this. She's like, no He would have been dead literally in trying to fly for like
01:20:20
Speaker
How long was it? I mean, a good, a good five miles. The rules, the rules of this movie, because we all saw Superman through a kryptonite mountain into space. Like we all saw that. But the rules in this is like the gas fucks him up. Yeah. He's flying it and it's like, OK, I think it's really far away from his face. I guess that's why he also gets you paled, I guess. Sorry. Our explanation. This is so long and convoluted already. But so they kill each other.
01:20:48
Speaker
And then Superman's dead. And I guess it's supposed to be sad. I would thank God. Yeah, no, because at that point I was like, oh my God, the movie's almost over. I was like, thank God this menace is gone on this planet.
01:21:06
Speaker
Uh, Lex Luthor had the right idea. Um, but no, then you get the double funeral sequence, which is like, the way this movie ends is like fucking Return of the King. There are like a hundred fake endings where it's like, you'll get one funeral and then like Batman's like, we gotta form a league Wonder Woman. Yeah. And then it cuts to like,
01:21:26
Speaker
Martha Kent being a bad mother-in-law. Yeah, poor Lois is upset, crying on Clark's bed, and she goes, oh, by the way, he's gonna propose to you. Like, thanks, Ma. Here's the ring. Thanks, Martha. Boom. Yeah, here's the ring he was gonna use. And then it's pretty big. And then it cuts back to fucking Witched. Lex in jail, and Batman shows up, and he's like, I'm gonna brand you. Jerry Cook, I only punch walls now.
01:21:54
Speaker
Of all people who deserves a fucking branded neck. Fucking legs. No. No, no, no. No, there's a use of political- Why didn't he brand it? White collar prison. He took it out. He branded the wall behind him. Yeah, well he's scared of him. Because that was supposed to show the character growth I was telling you about where he doesn't brand people anymore. He just kills them downright. If he doesn't get to do the killing, no one gets to do the killing.
01:22:16
Speaker
Yeah, Lex alludes to a lot of like he had a very he had a very Jack Nicholson Joker moment there And then it cuts back to a scene of them cleaning up Lex Luthor's house and his painting is upside down with the painting upside down
01:22:46
Speaker
Oh, fuck this movie. Oh, and then, no, no, and then Lois, or yeah, Bruce and Diana go, we gotta put a team together. Why? Nobody's, nobody's motivations have changed.
01:23:01
Speaker
Diana just saw that guy. Who's that guy? Oh, he's dead. That's a dead guy. Bruce goes, oh my, my sort of best friend just got killed. But like, I only knew him for like 10 minutes. So it's not really Washington. Bruce Wayne never had that moment. I'm like, oh man, I was going about this all wrong. It's not like Superman is just so good. He's willing to sacrifice himself and like open my eyes. No, he's just like, there's a war coming. Like that's, that's why they're, that's why the team's going. And then the dirt on Superman's offering.
01:23:31
Speaker
Rises much like a young Bruce Wayne Rose His coffin dirt rises and the movie stops the movie stops and we all went what the fuck was and then and then Mr. I hate everybody with powers want to kill all of them goes to Wonder Woman says Yeah, she's like why I'll just have a feeling the war Batman psychic
01:23:58
Speaker
He has all these premonitions of him shooting people with movies and shit. You gotta do it! I love it! This movie is... And that's the 666 suit, right? The Batman 666 suit that he's wearing in the dream. I mean, look like it to me. Uh, yeah, okay. He's got a trench coat, he's got goggles. Pretty much, yeah. That's what I thought.
01:24:20
Speaker
I love the comics. Good pull. I love the movie. Good catch. But I mean that's what I was thinking, right? Does that make sense? It looks, no, no, I don't think about that. Because he's wearing a fucking trench coat. Yeah. I love that issue. He looked good. That's fucking Damien's trench coat. You stay away from that then after. Trust me. Please. That's Damien. That's Damien? He doesn't care. He doesn't care. Is that Damien? This movie is the bleakest superhero movie I have ever seen. It's more miserable than Watchmen.
01:24:46
Speaker
And watch this whole movie. That whole explanation we just gave. That whole plot. Zack Snyder had to pitch that to someone. And someone went, sounds great. Sounds like Avengers. Let's do it. That sounds exactly like a Marvel movie. We start off with political drama in Africa. We fucking end on the symbol of hope, the perceived symbol of hope, because they certainly didn't show it. But Superman's dead.
01:25:13
Speaker
Fucking your dead dad tells you a depressing story about killing horses like even at like the guy has no legs Said it blows up Superman as miserable man's funeral even was depressing Yeah, like well the part where like they're all sitting there with the candles and it pans over like the Superman symbol and it's like if you're looking for a body Look around you like Jesus Christ like just more less angry. Yeah fucking
01:25:40
Speaker
Yeah, honestly, this is more like a Damien Wayne Batman. Lex Luthor, seriously, he fits in. He fits in a moment where he has to mention about how his dad beat this shit out of him as a kid, you know? So you hate aliens, but you like making them? It doesn't.
01:25:55
Speaker
It doesn't let up in how miserable this movie wants to be. And I'm just talking tone. The tone is grim, depressing, exhausting. There were multiple times where in the free screening I went to, I wanted to take a break.
01:26:13
Speaker
Like, if there was an intermission. And like, look at a sunshine. Yeah. With a sunrise or something. Like, there's no point. Like, the way it's edited is exhausting. Uh, just the tone of the movie is exhausting. Nothing in that movie is enjoyable. And if you like, if you like the movie, it's, I'm sorry, but why? Like, your reasoning is weird. Like, you're, you're just trying to like force like it. I feel, don't,
01:26:44
Speaker
There's interesting conversations to have, right? There are. What is wrong with you? What is Superman's thoughts on how the world perceives him? He does save people. He does what he does. And we're going to have that moment. But no, the Senate blows up. And he looks sad and miserable.
01:27:04
Speaker
What is Batman's actual beef with Superman aside from paranoia, right? Like, where's that conversation? We never get it. The movie's not interested in showing us anything of substance. It just wants to show us sadness and people hitting each other to varying degrees of success. I'm not saying there was nothing cool about this movie.
01:27:28
Speaker
I like, I like some chunks of that doomsday fight because I've just, you know, it's the Trinity fighting doomsday. That's like the problem. The problem with that is it's like, why didn't we get like those moments during the Batman Superman fight? No, yeah, that fight is. Yeah, I didn't like that at all.
01:27:46
Speaker
Wonder Woman. Pretty cool, but like, you gotta take it for what it is, right? No, but she's purposefully held back in that movie. Completely. Because it's just like, you're not going to do anything and then you show up and you're going to fight Doomsday. And like, that's what we got. Because you want to satisfy the fans. Yeah. That's it. And Wonder Woman showing up is cool. But yeah, like, there's always caveats to everything. He takes, he cherry picks scenes that just don't really flow with any of the narrative that he's building.
01:28:12
Speaker
The movie doesn't flow, nothing's earned, it's a bad movie, and it's the worst version of these characters. It's a shitty Batman who just hates everything and is miserable. No one's reasoning is on point? No. So anything you think at for more than like 10 seconds, you go, oh wait, that doesn't make sense. Like, yeah, no.
01:28:35
Speaker
And there's a longer cut and there's a whole other subplot. They just cut out of that movie. And whether or not it makes it better, who knows? Probably not. I highly doubt it. Yeah. Because it's probably another girl in a wheelchair and it's just like, oh my god. It's probably just exhibit like in the Daredevil movie. It's Coolio. Coolio, I'm sorry. He's racist.
01:28:56
Speaker
Nah, he's pimping the Batmobile. There's a scene where he's like, yo. Alfred spouts stuff. Nobody listens. He says some quippy things here and there. Batman murders people. Superman murders people. Sad horse stories. What the? This is your deal. OK, so this is really what I walked away with. I'll end it on this. I went into Man of Steel very excited. I left very disappointed.
01:29:25
Speaker
and I wasn't sure what they were going for. I had ideas. Batman v Superman has fully, 100% confirmed the direction and the tone they're going with these movies. It wasn't just like a one-off and we learned our lesson. They doubled down and I just, I have to say, I was like, this is not for me.
01:29:45
Speaker
I don't like it, and it's not made for me, it's made for a 14 year old kid. No, it's because AIDS is parents right now. No, yeah, a 14 year old kid, that's gonna hurt your mom. It's gonna be a problem. A 14 year old kid that thinks it's okay because Batman shoots people with guns. Yeah. It's fine. There's a moral high ground. There's nothing to look up to here.
01:30:08
Speaker
I'm not gonna say it's not for me. I'm gonna say it's not for people that are true fans of what these heroes mean and what these heroes are supposed to mean.
01:30:24
Speaker
Like Wonder Woman, again, she went into the whole Diana Prince thing in the comics, that's fine. But she's more of a diplomatic, uh, government face, you know? She's more important, uh, as Wonder Woman. She's not a cat woman, uh, not a fucking thief.
01:30:42
Speaker
She's not a fucking thief, all right? And that's cool. Like, and whatever. Like, I'm sure, you know, feminists are going to have problems with the way she's being portrayed. And I have to agree with them this time because that's not Wonder Woman. No, we should have gotten a cool. We should have got a war like the fight scene in a server room or something.
01:31:01
Speaker
Yeah. Like just her being like, what are you doing? And it's like, you know, we could see sort of like some of that stuff and be like, oh, shit, that's an episode of like, she knows that the viewer knows who she is. Right. No, but that's the problem. Yeah. Like, it's a little bit like, I don't know, like I don't know who this movie is made for.
01:31:20
Speaker
who is
01:31:37
Speaker
It's a boring movie. They're not liking that because it's a boring movie. They're like, this is boring. I don't understand what's going on. There's weird stuff that like I have to know comic books to know this, like why is there spray paint on the bottom? And then we have the fucking, we have the Man of Steel truthers that have been defending that movie for the last fucking three years that I guess feel like they have an obligation to like this movie. They unfortunately hung their hook or their coat on the wrong boat. And that's the thing, like I don't understand
01:32:04
Speaker
how, you know, and the same goes for a lot of people in America right now too. It's like, I don't understand how you can view something like this and think it's great. Like, it's not, it's a horrible interpretation of established characters. Right?
01:32:24
Speaker
Which one? There you go. Because you ask for reasons and they don't give them to you. Much like the movie. No, that's the thing. Like, they're just like, it was good. And if you're that casual guy and they made bold choices. These are not bold choices, Franklin. They're not bold choices.
01:32:43
Speaker
Deshaun Vasquez. These are just... Yeah, they're just fucking... They're just... They're bad... They're not even decisions. They're just bad interpretations of the characters that need something. You clean up the dialogue all you want, but the characterization's wrong. It's wrong. If it's not on base, it's all... And it's sad. It's fucking sad because, you know, when I was a kid growing up, fucking even like five years ago when I was still reading comic books, man, I would have loved to see a fucking World's Finest movie.
01:33:13
Speaker
Yeah, actual Batman Superman interaction. Well, let's let's let's jump to because some people will be like, well, you can't complain about this and then be like cool with like Michael Keaton's Batman where he's murdering like 100 people in the beginning of Batman Returns. There is a difference.
01:33:28
Speaker
Michael Keaton's Batman is a very much dark movie. It is gothic. It helped define Batman. It helped define Gotham City. That was really a reaction to Adam West Batman. Right. It was them jumping Batman. It was what Dark Knight Returns was for comic books. Like it just makes...
01:33:52
Speaker
It has to reshape what Batman actually is. Right, but there are reasons to these things. In Batman, 1989, you have a story that is slowly doled out, you understand these characters, everyone has motivations that are proper, and you understand when the film climaxes why things are happening. The Batman vs Joker fight in that film
01:34:17
Speaker
As you put it, has substance, it was earned. Yeah. And that's what happens. Joker dies in that, but you know what? It makes sense. Yeah, it made sense. Yeah. At the same time, Superman killing Zod, I guess that you could say, man, you can't even say that they earned it there, too, because- When Man of Steel? Yeah.
01:34:44
Speaker
No, you can't. You can't say that. You can say that when you left him in the chamber to fall to his death in Superman 2 or whatever. Sure, maybe, because, I mean, he didn't fucking snap his neck in front of a fountain. Like, that's not earning something. No, it was, Zack Snyder thought he earned it. I mean, I think, man, the Steeles look better put together a movie than this. And that's, that's saying, that's, you know? You thought destruction porn is better than, and that's the thing, like,
01:35:14
Speaker
This isn't destruction porn, this is just destruction of priorities. He's not even having too many things to deal with, and he doesn't seem remotely interested.
01:35:22
Speaker
and putting it together except for scenes where you can. Do we even have to do an MFK? No, it's all killed across the board. And if you want those people that go like, oh, the borrowed movies, the commercials, the borrowed movies, I got some bad fucking news for you, buddy. It's all gonna be. There will be a hard stop. I mean, fuck! Billionaire Bruce Wayne is driving a Jeep Renegade. I'm sorry, he's driving a 2016 Jeep Renegade in the year 2013.
01:35:52
Speaker
yeah and there was and that's only a fucking I don't know he fucking he was what it was the thing they said about Bill Gates is that every step he took he's earning like $50,000 that's half a fucking step for Bruce Wayne to try on a fucking Jeep Renegade fucking no buddy Chris who I saw it with he's like
01:36:14
Speaker
Batman would, he's like, Chris Wayne would fucking kill himself if he ever got in a car with those seats. Oh yeah, yeah. Are you kidding me? Because he's like, he's a gearhead. He's like, there's no way a rich guy would ever drive that car. There's no way, yeah. I was like, yeah, I guess so.
01:36:30
Speaker
Yeah, no, it's a bad movie. It's a bad movie if you think that it's for comic book fans you're wrong. Post in the comments why you're wrong. Let's go to war. I want to fight you. I compared you to Trump voters. Maybe they are. Let's do it. Let's fucking go.
01:36:46
Speaker
Like, I just have- we have our replacement for Man of Steel for the next, I don't know, three years. We have it, guys! Your new content, baby! Your new content, baby! Alright, so, jump over to the B-side if you want fun Daredevil talk. By fun, I mean, you know, something we like.