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China Tourism Tuesday Episode 15
17 Plays3 months ago
In this episode, we talk to Mingjie Wang, Chief Correspondent at China Daily based in London and an award-winning documentary presenter and producer. As a key panel presenter at ATM 2025, Mingjie shares his reflections on the Middle East, China and the Gulf, and how Chinese tourism to this region is set to play out over the next several years.
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Transcript
Introduction to China Tourism Tuesday and Guests
00:00:01
Speaker
Hello and welcome to China Tourism Tuesday, a discussion of marketing international destinations in the China outbound tourism market. My name is Charles Albertain and I'm coming to you today from Cape Town in South Africa.
00:00:16
Speaker
Good day, everybody. My name is Michael Jones and I am speaking to you from Amsterdam. Today we have a wonderful guest in Mingjia Wang. He is a the London Bureau correspondent for the China Daily.
00:00:32
Speaker
And so he is a ah tried and tested Chinese journalist, been working on the beat for quite a few years. And um recently he was attending the Arabian Travel Mart in Dubai, where he hosted a panel.
00:00:49
Speaker
um So thank you, Menjeev, for joining us today as a guest.
Mingjia Wang's Experience and Panel Topics
00:00:54
Speaker
And yes, if you could please just give our listeners a description ah of yourself and then we can have a nice chat.
00:01:04
Speaker
Hi everyone. Hi, thank you Michael, thank you Charles. So my name is Ming-Jae. I'm a chief correspondent at China Daily in London and I've been covering the Chinese outbound travel market for the last decade, mainly writing about the Chinese travels and coming to Europe.
00:01:22
Speaker
And as I had a chance to hosted the or moderated a session at the WTM last year in London, and then it turned out relatively real well, and I was invited to um hold ah moderate another session at the ATM last week in Dubai. And it's about Asia-Pacific travel market insight, and particularly i'm talking about the Chinese travel.
00:01:46
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, great.
Post-COVID Recovery and Market Insights
00:01:49
Speaker
Well, um let me kick off by asking you, firstly, in how what was any in terms of topics for the panels that you hosted at ATM and then previously at WTM London, ah was it a similar topic or or a little bit different? or how How would you describe them?
00:02:11
Speaker
Yeah, so for the WTM in London, it was about the Chinese airborne traveler, the power of Chinese travelers. So mainly focused on Chinese traveler only. And then at 8 a.m., because there was a summit dedicated to um the MICE Chinese travelers, and then so the organizer decided to have a session on Asia-Pacific travel market with with someone from the Euromonitor made a presentation about the trends or the preference changes about the Asia market travelers.
00:02:44
Speaker
ah Even though ah me and some of the panelists would say it it's quite difficult to to categorize, you know, and as something as Asia-Pacific travelers, because there's so many countries in Asia-Pacific, and then the traveler habits and patterns are different. And even within countries like China, and you have a different kind of preferences, um in different kind of you know cities, tier one, tier two. so So it was kind of, you know, um the the print presentation from the Euromonitor was kind of general.
00:03:15
Speaker
And then we we had a chance to um talk some specifically, you know, about some general trends of Asia-Pacific market. But at the same time, we talk about in the particular context of how ah how to reconnect with the Chinese outbound travelers, you know, after pandemic.
00:03:34
Speaker
So that that was our session about. And then so for the session, divided the session into four sectors. but So the first one was about um the Asia-Pacific a broader travel landscape.
00:03:46
Speaker
And then the second one is, you know, the huge influence of the digital influence um to... um allure the Chinese or allure the Asia-Pacific travelers for the destinations. And third one is about, um you know, the the the Chinese outbound travelers specific because as we know, um before COVID in 2019, Chinese outbound traveler was the biggest in international travel.
00:04:14
Speaker
um I think china and there were more than 155 155 million trips made by the Chinese la that year, a spending 255 billion US dollars.
00:04:25
Speaker
So um as we can see, that that's huge and that's definitely the the you know the most influential forces in the global tourism. And then the COVID happened and then and that number you know got flattened.
00:04:38
Speaker
And I think um as China reopened um at the end of 2022, I think there was some trend um for the Chinese traveling um for the first two years um after the pandemic, it was more mainly like within Asia and that's intra-regional travel because it's easier and they need to gain their confidence to be able to travel back.
Chinese Travel Trends to Middle East and Europe
00:05:01
Speaker
And also some countries, they offer visa travel and these that that has made the travel bit you know more convenient and easy for them for the Chinese to go there.
00:05:12
Speaker
And then as as we were discussing, you know we're coming to the almost the third year of ah of of the reopening. And and now now we see more travels and going to Middle East than as well as going to Europe.
00:05:24
Speaker
And then thanks to the great connectivities, you know, the airlines and and and also with the european ah Middle East countries have visa-free policies as well. And then all those factors have led to, you know, and great numbers of Chinese um going to um those destinations. So I'd like to point out two destinations which will happen to be on my panel. So I had four panelists.
00:05:52
Speaker
One is from the Saudi, one is from Dubai Tourism Board, um um and the one is from Trip.com. And now we also have a travel um um turgo trend analyst.
00:06:03
Speaker
So i' talking about Dubai, And they had about more than 820,000 Chinese travelers to Dubai.
00:06:15
Speaker
And it was about 31% of increase compared with the year before. um And then and as the as Shahab Xiaoyan, the regional director for Asia Pacific at the Dubai Department of Economy and Tourism, he pointed out the three factors leading to um leading to the a growing number of Chinese visiting there. the One is the diversification, and the one is the bespoke contact, and also the other one is connectivity.
00:06:43
Speaker
and And on top of that, Dubai has been introducing visa on arrival to the Chinese visitors from 2016. um twenty sixteen So that has been very attractive for for Chinese wanting to go there.
00:06:57
Speaker
And then also another destination is Saudi. um so Should I continue? oh Yes, please. So another destination is Saudi. So Saudi is relatively a new destination or new entrance to the market. So they opened up to um to the world in 2019 officially.
00:07:16
Speaker
And then we had a COVID hit. And then as as was talking to Al-Hassan, the president of Asia Pacific market at the Saudi Tourism Authority, and he was saying, um so they they start relatively late, but they put a lot of effort. And then the COVID hit. and then kill the momentum a bit. But then and they have been putting a lot of effort on. He himself has made ah multiple trips to China, having different road shows.
00:07:43
Speaker
And and the Saudi has definitely and gained attractions among the Chinese visitors. I think they have a more than 200,000 visitors visiting Saudi. thousand visitors and and visiting saudi um and they They will have more road trips, road shows in China, but and they have a goal of attracting 5 million Chinese by the end of 2030. So it's ah it's a big goal, but at the same time, they're making a lot of um investment and trying to, you know, getting the Chinese out there.
00:08:16
Speaker
Mingjie, if you don't mind me just jumping in, I kind of want to put forward a theory or and an impression that I got from ATM. And then you can maybe tell me where I got it right or wrong.
00:08:27
Speaker
As you said, you know, Saudi, the Gulf countries, they're super sort of aggressive and assertive on on growing market share from China. and AIPAC in general. But I get the feeling that when I spoke to many European destinations, they were somewhat ambivalent about the China market, sort of waiting and seeing, um slowly sort of putting out feelers and ah dipping their dipping their toes in the water again.
00:08:52
Speaker
What is your impression of the European markets? How do European destinations see China? And how would Chinese travelers behave in terms of going to Europe again post pandemic?
Shifts in Chinese Travel Preferences Post-COVID
00:09:04
Speaker
I think that's a very good question. um I think and The momentum is definitely not at the same as a war before the pandemic, before the Chinese travelled to Europe.
00:09:15
Speaker
But we do have numbers you're showing, you know, like the the Spain, the tourism Spain, and then they have attracted, you know, increasing number of the Chinese going there. I think that the fact being, um um you know, they have...
00:09:29
Speaker
the food, the sunshine, and also they are there like a um and previously, i think, you know, pre-COVID, people were talking about Europe. They want to go to Switzerland, they want to go France, they want to go to the UK. And then I think Spain is a it's ah it's ah a popular destination for the europe for the for for the Brits, let's say.
00:09:47
Speaker
But now it's also getting attractions to to the Chinese. And also, for example, the ah United Kingdom, Britain, they've also, you know, um trying to allure the Chinese and and and then they use, you know, the the film setting and the familiar films, for example, the Paddingtons or Bridgertons or Downton Abbey. And they're trying to use those and concepts to to attract Chinese.
00:10:09
Speaker
And then going back to your questions, I think momentum is not strong, um but but to There's reason for it because you know and the destinations, they didn't see the numbers.
00:10:21
Speaker
But don't forget, because of COVID, um a lot of destinations, really they killed their Chinese teams, right? And then the people, their infrastructures ah if structures there to to attract Chinese were gone because there was no Chinese visiting.
00:10:36
Speaker
And to have to reinstall all of that, that takes time. Right. But also, um i think there's an important thing to to be aware because i think previously we talked about pure numbers.
00:10:50
Speaker
But nowadays, after the pandemic, and as so and I was talking to Gary, you know, Gary Baum and the Checking front and checking Asia, the founder of Checking Asia, a travel trend analyst, and and that the that the the travel trends from Chinese outbound travelers to to abroad is quite different now.
00:11:08
Speaker
And then previously we have big tours, you know, and people are just like trying to ah cover multiple places. And then after COVID, and there's more and more trends of like independent travelers. Yeah. And then they want like cultural immersion experiences and they want authenticity.
00:11:23
Speaker
So they might, the number might be smaller compared with pure bit previous or not coming to the point that um before COVID, but then people might, um, spend a bit more more time and and and more one focusing on on experiences. So this is something, you know, the destination that they actually want.
00:11:43
Speaker
They would rather have, you know, people, and the independent travelers, because they they were engaging more and they were spending more and they were more interested in local cultures. Yeah. so those that So those are one of the big trends um after after COVID.
00:11:58
Speaker
ah Absolutely. That's the sense that I get as well, is that it's smaller volume, but you know spend is is is on the up. Keeping that thought in mind, Mingjie, I was wondering if you could maybe look at specifically the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. you know like they They are really pushing quite hard on the China market.
00:12:17
Speaker
But I was wondering from your position, if you could perhaps give us sort of and maybe an audit or your opinion on you know where Saudi Arabia has done well in the China market thus far. Okay.
00:12:28
Speaker
and where they could perhaps improve in terms of getting a better product market fit for China. Yeah, yeah, sure. I think ah this market has a great potential. And obviously, um you know, where you when you go to WTM, when you go to ATM, you always see the huge billboards of Saudi, right?
00:12:46
Speaker
And they're they're everywhere. I think their marketing the budget is just huge. And then they're really trying to put a lot of efforts out there. and And I had a chance to um to visit Saudi for a conference last year and I note i had a first taste of Saudi myself. I think um the kingdom itself is really progressing in many ways, especially in tourism. They want to welcome tourism and they want um people to visit there.
00:13:10
Speaker
So in terms of the Chinese market, and they I would say they've done as as a relatively late kind ah new like late entrance to the market and they they've done pretty good and they they've they've covered all the basis infrastructures. And so they have, you know, the Chinese, as they said, they have a ah Mandarin training, Mandarin language training for the tour guides.
00:13:33
Speaker
to make sure you know people visit there, they have a smooth communication and also personalized experience for Chinese visitors. And they also integrated like popular Chinese apps like Didi and also Alipay into their local services.
00:13:46
Speaker
And then because you know Chinese, they have the habits and when they travel, if they're anything familiar with the the apps they use in China, and then that will definitely encourage them to spend more. right And then they also been to and different um like i think they had campaigns in Shanghai, also in Beijing, and then you know gathered a lot of attention and and that leading to the bookings as well.
00:14:11
Speaker
And they also having a lot of influence and campaigns. and to to to get there. um They also have the different um ah digital social media, Douyin, TikTok, WeChat, Weibo, all sorts. And that's what I was told at as well. And then on top of that, they also, I think, made how to say, the the package um ah travels in collaboration with tourism a abroad ah aboards from neighboring countries like Jordan, like Egypt and Turkey and Oman so people visiting those countries and they can also um go to go to Saudi so I think the basis is is is good and they've also partnered with you know um as far as Trip.com and MaFengWor all those big travel companies in China so that's what they've done
00:14:58
Speaker
yeah So that's very good. But from what I see and could potentially improve is like all the destinations nowadays, when whether it's new or relatively seasoned or experienced destinations and we in China, they all partner with big um ah players in China, like Trip.com or MaFengWu Alipay, all of them have that.
00:15:25
Speaker
but what why or Sometimes I question or sometimes I was talking to other people. i say So if everybody has that, so it's good to have it because you need those kind of, you know, Xiaohongsu as well, red but ah Red Notes or Little Red Book.
00:15:37
Speaker
You need that that kind of partnership with this. But ah if all the destinations have this, so how to differentiate your dead destination different from the other ones, right? So I think what they need to do the next step is really i' trying to think how Saudi is different from from other countries. For example, Dubai is as as a place like must be because you have so many, the biggest, the first, the largest, right? So when you're living life, you you want to go once, right? And also they have a huge, great ah connectivity.
00:16:08
Speaker
But in the Saudi, I think when it comes to think about it so what is Saudi good? And then I would think Saudi it's it's it's has got a lot lot of vouch culture there. And then when we when we first learned about Saudi, we we we were talking about the 1001 night stories. So how can they um tap those kind of you know uniqueness of the Saudi?
00:16:28
Speaker
um and tourism resources and to to make it alive to attract the Chinese. I think that's the next step they do and potentially maybe partner not only just the big players, travel players, um ah partners in in China, but also use the creative agencies.
00:16:44
Speaker
and how can we engage? And now everybody is doing KOL campaigns, but how do we do it differently? Because they they have the budget, they know the basics of partner with all of these players and then having those campaigns. But then I would i would say ask the next question, it's like, how do we differentiate? it and why And how do we invite the KOLs and then different from the KOLs going to Qatar, going to Dubai?
00:17:12
Speaker
right So this is something they they they have to do. i think they have the commitment, they have the effort, um but ah they need to now, once the grub work is done, they need to think out of the box.
00:17:24
Speaker
No, no, for sure. um One thing I want to ask you as well is, you know, many of our Chinese listeners might be be questioning, you know, they were they're interested in in in Saudi Arabia, but they don't quite know how to get a start or to begin.
Saudi Arabia's Strategy to Attract Chinese Tourists
00:17:38
Speaker
um Seeing as you you have a bit of a very good grip on sort of what Saudi Arabia is doing right now, what are some sort of key events that are being planned out for the next year or so, or key opportunities that you see for China's side?
00:17:50
Speaker
to go over and to experience Saudi and to create those stories from a Chinese perspective. I think Saudi has, as I was on the panel, I was shocked at how many um events there are going to be. So, for example, Saudi, they will have a 2034 World Cup and they will have 23rd World Expo.
00:18:09
Speaker
They will have a 2029, the um the Asia Winter Games and a 2027 Asia Cup. So you can see there's a great event in their calendars and they got loads of things going on.
00:18:22
Speaker
And then then, you know, it will definitely attract... attracts the Chinese visitors and, and or you know, visitors in general, Asia Pacific or or other destinations that want to visit.
00:18:33
Speaker
But also they have, um you know, as I was talking to them and then they mentioned about the footballer, the Cristiano Ronaldo is there and then they want to try to use that as a hook and then then trying to have the campaigns in China and then they're really getting people out there.
00:18:51
Speaker
I think another thing they could potentially work on is connectivity. I think, you know, unlike Emirates, and they have so many airlines and so many like ah flights from different cities and and and to go there and different countries to go there, I think if Saudi ever want to attract 5 million tourists by 2030, 5 million Chinese visitors by 2030 to Saudi, really they really, the key thing, they need to expand the connectivity.
00:19:20
Speaker
They need not just Shanghai, Beijing, you know, they need it from Chengdu, from Chongqing, from Guangzhou, from all those kind of destinations in China to have the connectivity. Because if you do not have the flight, if you have to transfer somewhere and then, you know, the the the urge, the motivation of people want to go visit there is definitely lower than if you have a direct flight.
00:19:41
Speaker
And secondly, you also they also need to have the visa free. That's for sure will help a lot. Because if you have to spend some money or even the the it's easy to get for the e-visa, um but i still, you know, it's in some sort of effort. But if you do not have that kind of barrier, and that will also help to for the Chinese and wanting to to get there.
00:20:03
Speaker
And I think like from the people I talked to, all my my friends, when I talk told them um I've been to Saudi or I've been to Dubai, I think Middle East is definitely on the right, on the rise, and people want to go there.
00:20:14
Speaker
And people are, you know, people travel to Europe, people heard about Europe, and then this is open. But the Middle East is still kind of myth. and And then this myth, you know, you have they have the desert, like in Saudi, they have the Alula, they have the Red Sea, they have a lot of, you know, resources.
00:20:31
Speaker
and and ah And people want to unveil, you know, that myth. um So... I think the potential is great. Again, it's how they connect with the Chinese visitors and they were saying they they're using you know you know social media, theyre did digital influence, and then they they they're doing all of that.
00:20:49
Speaker
But I think they need to really... i think my next step, for example, I always think it's useful, for example, you when you're doing KOL campaigns, I think it's not about the numbers.
00:21:00
Speaker
It's not about and the followers that KOL has. I think it's most importantly, I would advise, or when I was talking to Destination, I think I would rather prefer if Destination invites the KOLs, someone has for example like 10 million, 5 million, compared with someone maybe have 500,000. If 500,000 followers if that five hundred thousand koa followers has very sticky followers and then have a very good conversion rate. Someone, you know, you you have created good content and someone follows you because like your lifestyle, like what do you wear? What do you what do you travel? What do you eat? What do you see?
00:21:33
Speaker
And then you need to have those kind targeted KOLs and then have the huge conversion rate. And that is better than the huge numbers because those followers, they have 10 million. They're just followers like what you see, but then they're not quality followers and there's no point of it.
00:21:50
Speaker
So I think destination really needs to be more and more aware. We need to have the KLA campaigns, but we need to have the targeted ones that you know they want Saudi want to attract, actually independent, high end or upper middle class or middle class.
00:22:04
Speaker
But they did they need to really find the KLA that are hugely influenced by the KLA in that demographics. I see.
00:22:14
Speaker
Just one more question from me, Mingjia, then I want to pass to Michael. ah One big question that I had on my mind when I was speaking to many sort of investment groups and hospitality groups from Saudi is the question of alcohol. um I know that for for Europe, and you probably know this quite well, for Europe, and having a dry cruise, for example, with no alcohol on a cruise is a bit of a deal breaker.
00:22:38
Speaker
But I wonder how you would think about you know the the concept of ah of a dry hospitality experience, a zero alcohol ah hospitality experience, ah specifically for the China market, specifically in Saudi.
00:22:52
Speaker
That's a very interesting question. um i was there and then yeah I've been to two yeah like Dubai this year and the Saudi last year. And then I think for for for someone like me as a Chinese, but living in in in the UK for the last, you know, um more than decades, and I definitely have the very huge influences by the Western cultures. I think the drinking is very big part of, um you know, um Western social social etiquette.
00:23:20
Speaker
socializing etiquette. But I think for the Chinese, um i I think it might not be as much an issue compared with the Western customers or Western visitors.
00:23:31
Speaker
I think the Chinese, we have a lot of middle class like women or or men or family groups and and then think, the they They can't handle not drinking you know to socialize, and I can picture it. i think people will be ah mesmerized by by by the views, you know by the the resources, by the exoticness of the destinations. I think like friends I'm with, they could easily, you know from China, they can easily go without drinking, and then they're not big drinking either.
00:24:03
Speaker
So I think ah it's ah it is something. and then um but ah you know for the Chinese, I think it's definitely not as a big issue compared with the Western travelers. Yeah, 100%. I think I tend to agree with that. um I wanted to ask you just ah one or two other questions. um And the one might be a little bit philosophical. one now And I would love to get your ah your views on that. So you you live in London and you obviously travel around Europe a lot and you ah follow the Western
Challenges and Opportunities in European Tourism
00:24:34
Speaker
media.
00:24:34
Speaker
um the whole ah There's a lot been a lot in the Western media recently ah about over-tourism. um So in places like Barcelona and specific islands in Greece and things like that.
00:24:47
Speaker
ah What is your view? What are your thoughts on on the over tourism debate? That's my first question. and And then I wanted to like see maybe,
00:24:58
Speaker
Do you think there's any possibility that the over-tourism debate in Europe could maybe negatively impact, how do you say, um tourism organizations in in Europe wishing to attract tourists and maybe would put them off a little bit about the China market if they're still thinking about like these mass big group tourists from China?
00:25:21
Speaker
um Any thoughts about that? um Yes, I think over tourism, as you mentioned about some destinations in in in um in ah ah Spain, yeah, it's ah that that definitely caused an issue with the locals because, you know, the accommodation with more people traveling there and then they put up the um the costs and then with the...
00:25:45
Speaker
ah with the locals and increasing their living costs as well. So that's why they introduced the laws and trying to cap kept that. um I think um from living in Europe, I honest understand that because here people are very outspoken and then love to voice their concerns and then especially they their life or their well-being has been impacted.
00:26:05
Speaker
But I think um and in terms of ah the impact towards the Chinese, whether they will put them off um and because of over-tourism. But we have to understand different destinations, they have a different holiday period.
00:26:18
Speaker
And sometimes I think um the over-tourism is because, you know, the European destination, sometimes they all have holidays like in summer, right? And then that's why everybody want to go to Greece, they want to go to the sea, they want to go to Italy, they want to go to Spain. And and and then that's that's really caused the trouble.
00:26:35
Speaker
But I think if the destinations... a market themselves well. and And I think the Chinese, again, like I am from China. So whenever I go to China, like, like for example, the May holiday, my hometown, Hangzhou, is a very popular destination in in China. It's beautiful city with West Lake.
00:26:55
Speaker
And then you see that every time the May holidays or a May holidays or October national holidays, the the broken bridge by the West Lake always packed. And I think the Chinese, because we have a 1.4 billion population, and then people get used to that.
00:27:12
Speaker
They get used to, you know, um and the big crowds and things. So I wouldn't i wouldn't necessarily say that would ah have a negative impact two to the Chinese wanting to go into the destinations like like Europe, which which has suffered some overtourism. I think it's more the problem that the Europeans, and they have to sort them within themselves.
00:27:32
Speaker
But when comes to the Chinese, and then I think it could be useful because the holiday seasons are different. So we have the Chinese New Year usually in February and January, which, you know, it's ah it's an off-peak season in in Europe and people don't travel. So I think if they can, you know, um and ah market it well and then they can, you know, having the the the Chinese and coming at this period. And again, then the October holiday, um and it's ah it's just after summer in Europe. It's not the time that people travel, but then Chinese travel.
00:28:05
Speaker
So I think if they're doing well, it's more complemented rather than have a negative impact on it. no And then um lastly, I appreciate that your time is quite limited
Personal Travel Inspirations and Social Media Influence
00:28:17
Speaker
today. So my last question, this is more like a bit of a fun one that we like to ask people.
00:28:22
Speaker
ah You've obviously traveled around quite a bit. What were your three top favorite destinations in terms of having fun? Oh, wow. Top three destinations. and We don't have to specify the countries, right?
00:28:35
Speaker
No, no, it can be anywhere. Okay, anyway, I think what attracts me now ah a lot is South America. um Because i I've lived ah in the UK for a decade, so I just calculated the other day, I've traveled to about nearly 60 countries. so and So mainly in Europe, but now because I like outdoor sports a lot,
00:28:57
Speaker
and then and like trail runnings and stuff. so So i've I've done a lot of trail runnings within Europe and then I think winter destinations. um You know, I like ski as well. So i love um the the the places that has mountains. So that's definitely attracted me. So in the Alps and Italy, Austria, Switzerland, it's great.
00:29:18
Speaker
But also nowadays, i think South America has that kind of allure to me. and um I traveled, you know, before COVID, I was in um Argentina, Chile and and the Uruguay and I went to um Patagonia um and Torres Dupont did a hike and and then the next one I would like to go to um and um Peru, Machu Picchu and places like that I think would be more fascinated about. um and and In terms of the city, i you know I live in London, it's a great city and in Europe they have so many old towns and I think it's so similar but I think I would be definitely
00:29:56
Speaker
a lot more by the destination with beautiful and mesmerizing outdoor landscapes. Wow, fantastic. That sounds really cool. I think we're quite similar minded when it comes to those things. When you talk about the mountains and hiking, trail hiking, I was like, okay, cool. Yes.
00:30:13
Speaker
yeah what i so So this is what I was also asking, i was so i was telling the destinations, you know, for example, in terms of me, and you know, independent travelers and being traveled to so many countries and how yeah Do I get allured for the next new travel inspiration?
00:30:30
Speaker
So I think like sometimes you are in social media, you have Instagram and then you saw a destination with someone rowing a boat in in and the lake with with fabulous mountains and, you know, with the great clean waters and and then places like that. I think they really need to create um ah a scene or ah attraction that, you know, stands out for that places and then people will be really allured and then sometimes it's very simple.
00:30:57
Speaker
I want to go to Bolivia, I want to go to certain countries, not because of the culture things, but because I saw a post about that destination, have a fabulous ah landscape and then I want to go and I want to do more homework.
00:31:08
Speaker
So if the people can, you know, if the destinations can can get that right, you know, get that step and then to to have that attraction, I think that will be they'll be definitely um put them in an advantage position. Oh, that's some fascinating insight. Mengjie, thank you so much for joining us today on China Tourism Tuesday. And it was a real honor to have you and really always a learning process. And I certainly learned a lot.
00:31:33
Speaker
um So, yeah, thank you very much and hope to catch you again sometime. Thank you. Thank you very much for having me. If you have any questions or comments about today's episode, feel free to send us an email at marketing at cconsulting.com.cn or search for us, Create Consulting, on LinkedIn.
00:31:49
Speaker
We look forward to hearing from you.