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S5E10: Full Circle Moments, with Judge Victoria Pratt RLAW'98 and 2L Bianca Hernandez
31 Plays8 months ago
Judge Victoria Pratt RLAW'98 and 2L Bianca Hernandez join us to share their story of how they met in Judge Pratt's courtroom and their chance meeting at Rutgers Law.
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The Power of Attorney is produced by Rutgers Law School. With two locations minutes from Philadelphia and New York City, Rutgers Law offers the prestige and reputation of a large, nationally known university combined with a personal, small campus experience. Learn more by visiting law.rutgers.edu.
Executive Producer: Shanida Carter
Series Producer & Editor: Nate Nakao
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/rutgerslaw/messageRecommended
Transcript
Introduction to the Podcast
00:00:09
Speaker
You're listening to the Anthem Award-winning podcast from Rutgers Law School, The Power of Attorney. I'm your host and dean of the law school, Joanna Bond.
00:00:25
Speaker
Today, I have the great privilege of speaking with two wonderful individuals, one former Chief Judge in Newark and Executive Director of Odyssey Impact, Judge Victoria Pratt. And along with Judge Pratt, I have Bianca Hernandez, a 2L at Rutgers Law School. So I'm absolutely thrilled to have both of you on the podcast today. Thanks so much for joining us. Thank you for having us.
00:00:52
Speaker
Thank you for inviting us. Of course. It's my pleasure. So you all have a fantastic story and I'm eager to get into the story a little bit, but I'm going to begin with Judge Pratt.
Judge Pratt's Origin and Motivation
00:01:07
Speaker
Could you tell us a little bit about your origin story? You know, it's such a funny
00:01:13
Speaker
question to ask because as I begin to map out my origin story, I realize that it is almost an up to a triangle in the city of Newark that starts doesn't begin at my mother's beauty salon, but it starts at what was known as West Street, which is what Prudential now sits on. It goes
00:01:37
Speaker
back down the street to 15 Washington, which is what I affectionately call PS15 when I went to Rutgers Law School in Newark. And then it darts back out to 31 Green Street and actually even Broad Street before there and how decisions and observations and experiences in those places
00:02:03
Speaker
have led me to where I am right now. And I don't know if there are many people who can say that that kind of maybe it's not a triangle, but that those three points have allowed them to not just impact policies and practices nationally, but internationally.
00:02:23
Speaker
And so what's important to know about me is that I'm the daughter of an African-American garbage man who was born in Harlem and spent his summers in the segregated South. I am also the daughter of a Dominican beautician who came to this country for a better life for her unborn children. My parents were insistent that they taught and that their children treat everyone they met with dignity and respect, no matter how they looked, spoke, or behaved.
00:02:51
Speaker
and how important those lessons would be when I subsequently became the chief judge in Newark Municipal Court. One of the things I think that is also important to know is that as a young child, I decided that I was going to change the world when I grew up. And there was no one who could dissuade me that I could not do this thing, change the world. That's easy. Happens all the time.
00:03:18
Speaker
I started making decisions about how I was going to do that. And I remember I was terrified of applying to law school. I didn't think I was smart enough to be a lawyer. Who am I to do that? And one summer I decided that when I was going back to college Rutgers, New Brunswick, so I'm a Rutgers Jersey girl, I decided that I was going to become a literacy volunteer.
00:03:44
Speaker
for I think it's Literacy Volunteers of America that's right there on they used to be on university. And the trainings happened at the law school building. And as I walked into the law school building at the time those in the old building, all of the class pictures were on the walls.
00:04:01
Speaker
And you walk in, and it usually holds white males. Then there would be a couple of women, and then you would see some people of color, depending on where you were walking. And something about that experience, just being able to walk into the building and talk. And we took our sessions, our training sessions, we're at the library. And I was like, you know what?
00:04:25
Speaker
I think I can do this. And the mantra that has really guided my life and my decision making has been the what ifs.
Impact of Rutgers Law School
00:04:34
Speaker
I am more afraid of living with what ifs than I am any fear that could try to attach itself to my dreams. Any fear
00:04:44
Speaker
is always outsized by the idea of living with the what if I had just applied. What if I had just shown up? What if I had just spoken up? What if I had just worked on this idea? So all of that, I end up going back, studying for the LSAT. I eventually get into Rutgers and it is exactly where I need to be for the training that I need to go out and change the world.
00:05:12
Speaker
That's fantastic. Can I ask you to say a little bit more about why you chose Rutgers and why you say that looking back now? Well, again, Rutgers was the building that was like, you need to come here. Being in this space, it was the place that I had seen growing up, catching the bus. And it's sometimes you don't see things in life until you need to see them. It was just this building that I didn't think
00:05:39
Speaker
was for me. And then I started to understand the history of Rutgers, how during the riots, people came there and insisted that people like me were admitted. And these weren't folks who were trying to go to the law school, had no intention of benefiting directly. And once I got there, I was like, everything that is in me,
00:06:01
Speaker
gets to be a part of my practice. And Rutgers taught me that, that I could unleash my upbringing, my experiences with injustice, being the first born English speaking child in a family. And even if you're not in that family, you're required to translate and understand paperwork that you're like, how would I know how to translate this work? Well, you better figure it out. All of that.
00:06:29
Speaker
made sense. And so wanting to use the law to make the world more equitable for folks who were like me and Rutgers was like, this is how we do it. This is how we unleash you on the world. So whether it was the clinics, like I was a part of the inaugural class of the community law clinics and why it's so important
00:06:52
Speaker
That's what's so special, I think about, one of the many things that's special about Rutgers, but that the clinics actually put students into spaces working with people so that it's not just theory, so that it's not just policy, but that they understand this is how you take the law and apply it. And not just in social justice, my intern, I took an entertainment law class at Rutgers, and then I took, I went to intern at a radio, a record company,
00:07:22
Speaker
And it was fascinating that I had just learned something in class that I then saw in a contract and I said, Oh, they had done this. This would have looked differently. That's amazing. That's exactly how it's supposed to work. That's exactly it. That's exactly it. Well, can you tell me a little bit about your experience in the MSP program? Oh, I am of the hashtag. No, there would be no me without MSP.
00:07:47
Speaker
That's wonderful. That is a hashtag, and I am a proud member of the sorority fraternity that exists. It was truly a life-changing experience because it provided support, it provided camaraderie, and not to the exclusion of my white colleagues.
00:08:10
Speaker
in school, like that's what was so special about it. It wasn't to the exclusion of them. It was about supporting me so that I could get to this place to then go into the practice with everything that I needed. And I think that was best illustrated. I was recently honored a couple of years ago by the Alumni Association and classmates of mine had actually taken out
00:08:40
Speaker
they took out an ad congratulating me. And what was beautiful about it was that some of the classmates, I fought with them all the time in law schools. Some of them were Federalists. You know, I was like, really? You're proud.
00:08:54
Speaker
That's wonderful. Yes. And on social media, really feeling connected to any success that I've had. So the MSP program was really important because without it, a student like myself who grew up in a family with parents with eighth grade educations,
00:09:11
Speaker
would not have had an opportunity to go into the world and to do the things that I do and help other judges and help prosecutors and help officers really create change in a justice system so that it's more equitable. So that is why a part of me is pained by these decisions, the decision by the Supreme Court, because it will mute out people who are meant to go into the world and do things
00:09:39
Speaker
and that we have all these standards that keep them out of schools. Right. Your story is remarkable and so inspiring. So thank you so much for sharing that. I want to shift gears a little bit and ask you to just mention briefly how you think that all of this training through the law school and through the MSP program helped to prepare you for your role as chief judge in Newark's municipal court.
00:10:09
Speaker
Well, I was unafraid. I was unafraid to address the things that I saw. So it wasn't just looking at the law. I was seeing people holistically.
00:10:19
Speaker
And so I had been trained. I had already been doing it. I had been working at the housing authority when I was a law student, looking at those three strikes and getting kicked out of getting people getting kicked out of housing. So what I understood was that when grandma gets kicked out of housing, that can impact four generations of families because they live with grandma in public housing. So now I'm a judge and this person's about to plead guilty to something or get sent to jail.
00:10:48
Speaker
And I'm understanding how this impacts generationally this one family. And so I didn't separate those things as a judge. I had an understanding and had to get to this information and also had to be impacted by
00:11:06
Speaker
What else could we do? And whether or not what we always did was the right thing to do. Because just because you have jail as an option doesn't mean that you always have to use it. And sometimes
00:11:19
Speaker
know, it's easier to just send somebody to jail as opposed to dealing with all the stuff that you really need to. It's not easier for them, but it gives you cover as a person who has some authority in that courtroom if you don't want to have to deal with what happens if I let this person out, but what happens if I give them services and we get this family some help? So those were the things, those were questions that had been kind of put in
00:11:44
Speaker
And I can't say my DNA, but I had been trained to ask them. And when I got on the bench, I didn't stop asking those questions just because now I'm a judge. And I think that's one of the problems we have. We have this good training, you become a judge, and you just do this thing this one way. And that's a waste of an opportunity. So it's seeing and it's understanding community. It's understanding people and the broader range of issues that appear in a courtroom.
00:12:10
Speaker
It's wonderful that you can bring that life experience to bear on the cases that you were deciding. That's incredible. Now I want to shift gears and talk a little bit to Bianca.
Bianca Hernandez's Journey and Inspiration
00:12:22
Speaker
Bianca, can you tell us about your origin story?
00:12:26
Speaker
Yes, so I just, every time I hear Judge Pratt, more and more parallels between her life and my life, they always tend to shine through. I am also from a background of mixed parents. My mother is
00:12:42
Speaker
Puerto Rican, born and raised in Washington Heights. So she's a New Yorkian, we like to call them. And my father is born and raised in El Salvador, and he grew up during the war time. And so most of his life, all of his life, I should say here, in his country was full of strife and war and probably the most gruesome stories you will ever hear.
00:13:09
Speaker
And my father has no education, no formal education. He never learned how to read or write in English or in Spanish until he was a grown adult. And my mother graduated high school and had some college courses, but unfortunately was never able to fulfill a degree. And growing up, they instilled education as being
00:13:34
Speaker
my way out, my way of making something of myself, of becoming a success. And so I always knew education was really important. And when I was growing up, people always used to tell me like, oh, you're smart. You're so smart. But I just never believed it. I was always one of those people that I knew I wanted to be a lawyer at a young age. I didn't know why. I just saw them as being really strong-willed, intelligent,
00:14:01
Speaker
People and that's kind of what I wanted to emulate in my life and in my career, but I never thought that was possible. And.
00:14:11
Speaker
I just, it was always one of those things like, oh, you never see women like me. You never see Latinas playing lawyers on TV. And that's all I ever knew of lawyers. And so I definitely was filled and clouded with a lot of doubts. And one of those pivotal moments in my life was meeting Judge Pratt and speaking to Judge Pratt. And she really, she really
00:14:38
Speaker
It was a pivotal moment from adolescence to adulthood, but also in my personal life and also in my career. And so every time I talk to Judge Pratt, we have more in common and there's more to talk about and there's more to learn about each other. And for me, it's always such a wonderful experience.
00:14:56
Speaker
Here I am. I grew up somewhat in Washington Heights, mainly in New Jersey, and I went to Montclair State. I went to public school my whole life. I'm a public institution, kind of girly. I went to public schools. I went to Montclair State, and now I'm here at Rutgers Law.
00:15:12
Speaker
I feel like when I first met Judge Pratt, one of the things that she was talking about was full circle moments. And all of these things in my life had led me to that meeting point of meeting her again. And it was all of these full circle moments and they were just, it accumulates and it really fosters confidence because you know that I'm meant to be here and I'm meant to be in this place in my life.
00:15:41
Speaker
so I can have the career that I want to have because I am capable. I am capable. I'm smart. I don't need to see Latinas play lawyers on TV. I can be a lawyer in real life. Right. That's excellent. Well, Bianca, your story is truly inspirational too. And we're so fortunate to have you here at Rutgers Law School. Can you tell us a little bit more about how you met Judge Pratt?
00:16:07
Speaker
Yes. So it was, I was actually an undergrad and I ended up in municipal court in judge press courtroom. Um, and I went with my mother and that was the first time I'd ever been in court and I was so nervous and my mom was nervous and we both were, you know, we were scared because we've never been, had to deal with anything in the legal system. And now I'm standing in front of a judge and I'm a young woman and I don't know what I'm doing and I'm trying my best to look professional or sound professional.
00:16:35
Speaker
And I am in Dutch Pratt's courtroom and she's asking me about myself and she asked me, well, young lady, what do you want to do with your life? What do you want to be when you grow up? And I say, well, actually, I want to be a lawyer. And that was one of those points in my life where I wanted it, but I didn't know how to achieve it and I didn't know if I was capable of it.
00:16:55
Speaker
And after a little bit of a stern talking to, Judge Pratt tells me, well, if you want to be a lawyer, you need to get yourself together. You need to get yourself together because you can do it. You can do it. You can become a lawyer. You just need to fix the things in your life that are happening now, and then you can become a lawyer, and there won't be any stopping you. And Judge Pratt, and I thanked her.
00:17:24
Speaker
She asked me, who was I here with today? And I said, oh well, I'm here with my mother.
00:17:29
Speaker
And she turns to my mom and says, Miss, thank you for coming in with your child. And thank you for being here today. We don't see a lot of parents support their children. And so when we do, we have to thank them because without your support, these things that she wants to obtain will be extremely difficult. And so my mom was just so honored that she had been recognized. And my mom is the biggest support in my life.
00:17:57
Speaker
for her to get that recognition was, it was very special to both of us. That's so moving to hear you tell that story. And, and it's wonderful to hear that that you each have had an impact in each other's lives. If I could, I'm so sorry. You know, it's like such an emotion. I didn't. I'm laughing because we are
00:18:25
Speaker
experiencing a moment again. And oftentimes you, this is why you have to do what you're called to do, no matter what, no matter how difficult it looks, no matter what's happening, stay focused on the gold. Because I remember her very clearly.
00:18:46
Speaker
And I remember asking her and looking at her sternly, I want you to be afraid, you know? And I said to her, you know, what are you going to do with your life? And when she said, I want to be a lawyer, I remember people in the audience laughed and they laughed because they're like, ah, but she's in court. And, you know, it's always the naysayers who push you the furthest.
00:19:10
Speaker
but not even fully understanding that this is the person who changes the trajectory of her entire family's life. Like, that's what I know. And that's who she was. And seeing people as salvageable, you know, she came to me for something silly, you know, but why it's so important. And then so to fully understand and to fully have someone
00:19:37
Speaker
express how they experienced you. When I was just focused on, she gets to do what she needs to do in life, you know, and I have an obligation to her because God sent her to my court. Like she ends up here with me. I have an obligation to her. And sometimes in my book, you'll see there's points where I start talking to God and I'm like, why would you send this person here? What can I possibly do for them?
00:20:05
Speaker
And it's that. So for me, it just reminds me of even the days that it's difficult to shift institutions, but institutions are people, right? So it's not a building that I'm trying to shift. I'm not trying to shift a criminal justice. I'm not trying to shift the building, the edifice. I'm trying to shift people who work in spaces. And every time someone gets a second chance,
00:20:33
Speaker
what they, how that reverberates in the world and what they end up doing. So I didn't want it lost. And then, you know, she's like, awesome. And you're sitting there and you're like, wow, I'm sorry. I had to meet all this awesomeness this way, but that, you know, you really never know the impact that you have, but you still have to do the work that you're called to do.
00:20:55
Speaker
Right, right. Thank you so much for that insight, Judge Pratt. And it starts, I think, with seeing the humanity in every single person who comes before you in court. So such a wonderful, wonderful story. And Bianca, if I may, can you tell us a little bit about why you chose Rutgers and why you chose to join the MSP program? Yeah, so I chose Rutgers for a few reasons.
00:21:21
Speaker
One of them being I have always lived in New Jersey my whole life, and Rutgers being one of two institutions, law schools here in New Jersey. Not only, I did look outside in other places, but I definitely wanted to stay close to home. I knew going into law school that I was gonna need that support of my family, and so I wanted to stay somewhere where I could
00:21:46
Speaker
have that support and have those people to tap into when I needed that extra push on those days that were extra tough. And so that was one reason, but also the MSP program. Where I grew up, there was not a lot of people of color. There was maybe two people of Hispanic backgrounds, maybe three Black people and maybe one or two Asian people.
00:22:13
Speaker
Growing up, I knew what it felt like to be excluded from a lot of things. And when I went to undergrad, my undergrad institution was very, very diverse. And that was the first time that I had professors of color, that I had seen deans of color, that I had seen all of these professionals of color. And so in choosing Rutgers, I knew that I had to choose a place that was a diverse community because I knew what it felt like to not be in a diverse community. And for me, I did not want to go back.
00:22:40
Speaker
Another thing was in undergrad, I'm a first generation everything. So that's what I like to say. First generation everything. And in undergrad, I didn't know that there were programs like the EOF. So I didn't tap into them because if you don't know, how can you apply for them?
00:22:57
Speaker
And so having that knowledge into law school, I knew I needed a program that was like EOF that supported first generation, low income, people of minority backgrounds. And so I found that in MSP. And when I looked into MSP and the history and the wonderful professionals that have been able to come out of MSP, it was, for me, it was a no-brainer.
00:23:23
Speaker
And I'm very grateful for MSP and that's how I reconnected with Judge Pratt during my 1L year. MSP was promoting a book talk. And I look at the email and I see the flyer and I see Judge Pratt's face and I see her name and I'm like, oh my gosh, that's Judge Pratt, that's my judge. And I see the date and it's on my mom's birthday. And I say, okay, come on, mom, let's go. We have to go to this talk. So I bring my mom to the book talk and
00:23:52
Speaker
And Judge Pratt is talking about full circle moments. She's reading an excerpt from her book and she's talking about all of these full circle moments in her life. And so I kindly go up to her after the talk and me and my mom are listening to her and we're both crying.
00:24:06
Speaker
I go up to the talk and I'm like, hi, Judge Pratt. You may not remember me, but my name is Bianca and this is our story and this is how I first met you. And it's an honor to reconnect with you and it's an honor to be here at your law school and a part of your minority program. Because obviously when I first met her, I didn't know what law school she went to. I didn't know that she was in the MSP. And so for me, that was a full circle moment.
00:24:34
Speaker
That was fully full circle. And I know that the one else this year had the honor of listening to Judge Pratt during their orientation. And so I had gone to the orientation as a 2L just to hear Judge Pratt speak. She knows every time she comes to the law school, I'll be the first one in the audience there waiting for her to talk. You and I both. Yes, absolutely.
00:24:56
Speaker
And so during the 1L orientation she's talking about, you know, last year a student came up to her and introduced herself and told her this story of her time on the bench and how this student was going to change the world and how my words to her were so transitional and so
00:25:20
Speaker
So they were transitional and inspiring to her, but in reality, her words every time she speaks are inspiring and transitional for me. And so that was another one of those full circle moments of like, I met, I reconnected her with her last year and now again at MSP event, and here she is talking about me to all of these students. And it really was one of those moments where it's like, just again, tears. But it was a beautiful, it was very beautiful emotional moment for me.
00:25:49
Speaker
It sounds like it. That is an incredible moment. And Judge Pratt, what was going through your mind when you reconnected with Bianca at the book talk? You know, I don't know how many times you get people so emotional on the podcast. Not enough. It was confirmation. It was really, it's like being, doing a,
00:26:19
Speaker
doing a relay race. And I get to that last leg and I'm exhausted. You know, this work is hard and getting people to do the right thing and watching people suffer and knowing that there's only one of you and that you really are trying to, you know, build up an army or just equip people so that they can go out in their own corners of the world in the marketplace. And I was tired. Literally I was just in a space that I was just like, wow, okay, what else?
00:26:48
Speaker
can I do? And then I speak to her and I was like, okay, I'm so ungrateful because I need to be in a space of gratitude that I get to experience this young person that I got to touch them in some way. And I got, you know, and I got stopped feeling sorry for myself because I was tired and got back to work. Like for it's, it's always that it's about you're tired, you're frustrated.
00:27:16
Speaker
But get back to work. And so she really gave me the fuel in that space. And I was just so grateful. I went from being inward and just being so grateful to being able to be in a space where you get to touch people along their travel. That's it. And so that's what it was like to see her mom
00:27:38
Speaker
And I was watching. I don't know why I just kept noticing her mom was just smiling so hard during my talk. And then I just went over and I'm like, wow, this is this is why you don't always you don't always know what you do. You just stay focused on the mission and keep doing it. So that that was that was a great gift for me. That was truly a great gift and a reminder and a confirmation for me.
00:28:04
Speaker
That's wonderful. And in Bianca's words, really a true full circle moment that's just beautiful to hear about. So Judge Pat, your advocacy and leadership have taken you all over the world now. And I wonder if you could talk a little bit about what you're doing now.
Judge Pratt's Current Endeavors and Vision
00:28:22
Speaker
So I am running an organization called Odyssey Impact. And it's been an organization that's been around for a while.
00:28:30
Speaker
And we're just transitioning into a grant funding model around social justice issues. But what I also do, though, my consulting is that I do judges' trainings. I work with jurisdictions. I work with criminal justice reformers. I work with prosecutors and officers and anything that touches the system and trying to find ways of improving how we deliver justice. And so, you know, it's amazing when I get a call and I'm like, can you come to Scotland? And I'm like, really?
00:28:59
Speaker
And I go to Scotland and we do a junket there and we visit the juvenile facilities and I meet with the judges and I talk about the things that I do and some of the things that they might consider in their system because they're really trying to figure out how to make their system more just. And I come home and maybe seven months later I get an email saying, you know, thanks to the junket, the juvenile judges now have to consider rehabilitation as a part
00:29:26
Speaker
of their decision making when sentencing. Now, obviously it's not just me, but that again, I get to be a part of this process. It's going to Dubai and talking to judges about returning and restoring humanity to our processes and why it's important. And judges saying, yes, I always, I feel this way. I feel like there's something more than just procedurally processing cases that I need to do. It's going to New Mexico four times.
00:29:53
Speaker
to train and to have people respond like, wow, I went back and did, or Colorado when judges are like, oh yeah, my judge does everything you do. And the judge is like, yeah, I saw you at a training in San Francisco and I went back and did everything you talk about. And it's changed how I feel about judging. I now impact people's lives and this is all I want to do. Like I didn't realize that I could exercise more than just what I'd been doing.
00:30:19
Speaker
And so much of that, so still looking for more ways to impact the justice system. Even I go to prisons and I laugh in my book. I talk in the power of dignity. I talk about how my husband's like, yeah, yeah, you should go. And I'm like, absolutely not. I'm not going to the prison. And then I go there because I really want to speak holistically about justice and the impact
00:30:45
Speaker
on talking to people who are in prison on long sentences, what could you have done? When did it change? What would have meant the difference? And getting them excited, I go back and they're like, you know, I called and I told the folks back home about what you talked about here. And I'm like, wow, really? And so really looking at how we can all change. And some of the things I talk a lot about procedural justice, but it's applicable
00:31:14
Speaker
throughout all fields. So it's not just about restoring humanity to the criminal justice system, but wherever you are in the marketplace, if you're an accountant, you need to be thinking about how you treat the people who come to you for help. If you are a teacher, how do you engage the students in a way that they feel that they still have maintained their dignity and respect as they've gone through these processes of being engaged with you? So doing a lot, and that's probably why I'm tired. Yes, that would explain it.
00:31:45
Speaker
It must be so validating to hear how you've had real impact in people's lives through this work. It's such important work. It is, you know, to hear Bianca talk about her mom's reaction to being in court because I always treated the court like my living room. So if you came to court, I got to talk to you. And, you know, if mom came, then we had to have a conversation because the conversation is about
00:32:13
Speaker
we as a team are now going to help this person through this process. And what that means that we are now, you know, and sometimes I remember mom and dad came and mom wouldn't, I would ask the son a question and mom would answer. And the dad kept giving mom these cross eyes. And I had to say at one point, ma'am, stop talking and stop. And I had to ask, I said, why is it every time I ask your son a question, your lips move and your husband gives you dirty looks.
00:32:42
Speaker
And so this is the whole process of what's going on in this family. And we needed to address this so that the dad felt empowered to be a part of the process of helping his son come out of what it was they were, and that mom also stopped making excuses for the son. So the judge really just had to call her out so that she noticed, like, stop, just stop for a second.
00:33:07
Speaker
I laugh when I hear that, you know, her mother had her, her response to me talking to her because I'm like, yeah, I talked to everybody in the courtroom. That's great. What is your ultimate career goal? It's, it's, it feels like, um,
00:33:34
Speaker
finding more platforms to further my message, to ensure more justice.
00:33:41
Speaker
to ensure more people are engaged in the process. Touching young minds, I also taught at Rutgers Law School and seeing those students go into the world really armed well to go in and fight injustice anywhere that they are, whether it's in politics, whether it's in corporate America, whether it's in the nonprofit space. So really just creating bigger platforms for myself to really be able to have an impact.
00:34:08
Speaker
and having other folks go out and change the world. So when I decide to finally retire, which I don't imagine will be anytime soon, but I think in terms of career goals, just getting, sharing the message more broadly and really getting people trained to take
00:34:28
Speaker
on some of these fights. One of the things that's been exciting is seeing police officers, young police officers, rookies as they call them, in New York, stop me and say, oh, I saw your talk. Thank you for those tools because they're using my TED Talk as a training tool in the police academy. And so for me, I'm like, wow, that's, it's not what I envisioned. It's not something that I thought, but it's something that they now have that they're like, this is another thing that I can add to my toolbox.
00:34:57
Speaker
and it's helping them do their jobs more effectively. Right. And it's having an exponential impact because you know that all of those folks that you're helping to train are then going out and helping to train others. And so that's really an incredible thing. Absolutely.
00:35:13
Speaker
And so my last question is really one, seeking for students who may be interested in going to law school, what advice would you give those students about the process and their consideration of law school as a next step? Well, the first thing I would tell them is to stop talking themselves out of it. If you are thinking about it and
00:35:42
Speaker
idea of it excites you, I would ask you, but you're afraid, I would ask you to ask yourself a few questions. What would I do if I didn't have to worry about money or what people might say? And if you would still say practice law, then do that. Because if we don't serve folks who will, we don't serve them who will.
00:36:07
Speaker
You know it the process once you are in the process you find ways to overcome the obstacles that only thinking about now as you talk yourself out of it. You realize realize you're stronger and smarter than you are.
00:36:25
Speaker
That's wonderful. Well, that's important advice to remember if you're a prospective student. Well, this has been such an inspiration to everyone. So thank you, Judge Pratt. Thank you, Bianca, for joining us. I can't wait to listen to your next talk at the law school. So we'll have to have you back soon. And thanks again for joining us. Thank you for having me. Thanks, Bianca.
00:36:53
Speaker
Thank you, Dean Bond. The Power of Attorney is a production of Rutgers Law School. With two locations just minutes from New York City and Philadelphia, Rutgers Law offers the prestige and reputation of a large, nationally known university with a personal, small campus experience. Learn more today by visiting us at law.rutgers.edu.