Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
S6E7: Getting to know the SBA Presidents
93 Plays6 days ago
This year's SBA presidents, Emma Roth '25 and Daniel Altomare '25, join Dean Bond to talk about their law school experiences and to ask the dean some questions about her perspective on Rutgers Law School.
The Power of Attorney is produced by Rutgers Law School. With two locations minutes from Philadelphia and New York City, Rutgers Law offers the prestige and reputation of a large, nationally known university combined with a personal, small campus experience. Learn more by visiting law.rutgers.edu.
Executive Producer: Shanida Carter
Series Producer & Editor: Nate Nakao
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:08
Speaker
You're listening to the Anthem Award-winning podcast from Rutgers Law School, The Power of Attorney. I'm your host and Dean of the Law School, Joanna Bond.
00:00:24
Speaker
I am joined today by our SBA presidents. That's the Student Bar Association presidents in both Camden and Newark. Their names are Emma Roth and Dan Altimore.
00:00:36
Speaker
Thank you so much, Emma and Dan, for joining us today. Thank you for having us.
Dan's Journey to Law
00:00:42
Speaker
and So I want to talk a little bit about your story.
00:00:48
Speaker
Can you both take a few minutes and tell me what what your origin story is? Absolutely. do you want to start, Dan? ah Sure, sure. I can start. i think I'm older, so I can go first. um So I'm actually originally from San Diego, um and I grew up there and lived there for my first 18 years of life. Then I went to the University of Arizona um and lived there in Tucson for five years um because I'm a scholar.
00:01:16
Speaker
And then i I got an offer at the end of my time there to work with to work for GEICO, and I got cold feet. And my last six months of school, I got a teaching certificate instead and bought a plane ticket and moved to China, where I lived um for five years.
00:01:37
Speaker
um And then a little bit time after that, I applied to law school, and here I am happily at Rutgers Law. That's fantastic. Okay, so I have to ask, are you fluent in Mandarin? Yes, I speak Chinese. It's gotten worse these past three years as I've only found time for law. but yeah That's great.
Emma's Path to Advocacy
00:01:56
Speaker
That's fantastic. Okay, Emma. Mine is a lot less interesting than that. Oh, I doubt it. I grew up in South Jersey, in Cherry Hill. And I left Cherry Hill when I graduated high school and went to Maryland at Towson University, where I studied business administration with a concentration in legal studies.
00:02:17
Speaker
And I loved Towson. I had an amazing experience. um And I knew when I was in college and even in high school that I wanted to pursue law school. So it was kind of a straight jump for me.
00:02:30
Speaker
i was worried that if I took a break, I would never go back. So I decided just go straight through. And um it's great. I love being back in Jersey. And I'm really excited to be finishing up law school.
00:02:45
Speaker
That is fantastic. So let me just ask, Emma, when you think back to your high school self, what was it about the law back then that that interested you? I've always had a very strong pull towards advocacy.
00:03:00
Speaker
I always found myself being the one to you know speak up about an injustice or speak my mind about um any policy issues going on at my high school and just trying to be a voice um and let my voice be heard. And I think that that was very appealing in terms of law school um because it's full of very like-minded individuals.
00:03:27
Speaker
Right, right. Well, that's great. Thank you. ah Okay. Do you have ah any questions for me?
Dean Bond's Advocacy Roots
00:03:37
Speaker
Yeah, what what brought you to law school Dean Bond, if that's all right?
00:03:41
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Happy to answer that. um i i grew up sort of rooting for the underdog. And so, you know, I was i was always ah advocating for, like Emma, advocating for for others and others.
00:03:59
Speaker
Really, it was in college when I took a class on civil rights law that I realized how useful the law can be in terms of of shaping society and and um creating legal norms. And So I realized that the law was a really powerful tool to create a just society. And and so that's really what drove me to law school. um And I was very interested in women's rights and civil rights. And I looked around for law schools that had... um
00:04:31
Speaker
people who were teaching feminist legal theory and and and that's really one of the things that that drove me to law school. And i I had an interest all through law school in doing women's rights work. um and And eventually that shifted from domestic women's rights work to international women's rights work.
00:04:51
Speaker
But that's what I found most motivating was was the idea that that law could be a really helpful vehicle for social change.
00:05:01
Speaker
I have a follow up to that, if that's I do. And Bond, it's ah about your favorite classes. would Did you have any international law classes when you were law school or you have a completely different favorite class? Well, I didn't actually take international human rights law in law school, but um I took a lot of ah classes that that anything I could find really in in gender and law. And um my my one of my favorite classes was a jurisprudence class, actually, that was...
00:05:35
Speaker
taught by a professor named John Powell, who ah was really my first introduction to critical race theory. And ah and he was such an inspiration that um i I pretty much signed up for every class he was teaching.
00:05:51
Speaker
and And it was really a phenomenal experience.
00:05:56
Speaker
I have a question.
Advice for First-Year Students
00:05:58
Speaker
Oh, OK, go ahead. i Go ahead. um I have a question for Dean Vaughn and Dan. um Looking back, what would you tell your first year self about surviving law school?
00:06:10
Speaker
Hmm. That is such a good question. Yeah, that's a great question. I think I would... I think I would reassure myself that ah the that this was something I could do. I started in my first year with a lot of self-doubt. And by i think by my second year in law school, I had figured out that that this was um this was something that that I really wanted to do. And it was an environment in which I could thrive. ah
00:06:42
Speaker
But, but I think I would, I would tell my first year self not to sweat the small stuff so much and, and have the confidence to know that, that I can really thrive in this arena.
00:06:55
Speaker
How about you, Dan? Yeah, that, that is a tough one. Uh, I think I got really good advice right before I got, I mean, I don't know about you too. I got so much advice about law school like from everyone.
00:07:09
Speaker
um Everyone had an opinion, even though very few of them had actually gone to law school. But I did, um one of the few lawyers I knew before I came to law school did give me good advice. And he said, don't do anything special to prepare for law school. And in fact, um relax and like go to the beach and read a non-law book. And um i definitely think that is good advice and I did do that to an extent but I wish I had leaned into relaxing more um because law school at least for me has been like a marathon um and then in 1L themselves like I had to be like completely frank i had like
00:07:46
Speaker
extreme anxiety in between fall and spring waiting for my grades to come back. um I don't think I was alone there. I, to the point where I had like physical stomach pains at one point.
00:07:57
Speaker
um And it was fine. Like, you know, i don't have straight A's, but I have pretty good grades and it's fine. Like it's, um it's It's, yeah, it's like, it's not that big a deal unless you really bombed all your tests, in in which case you probably had an idea that you bombed your tests. um I think in general, you're going to be all right. And that's what I would tell myself.
00:08:18
Speaker
Yeah, that's good advice. That's good advice. Okay, so let me ask you two, what do you find most exciting
Emma's Legal Interests
00:08:25
Speaker
about the law? what what Are there specific areas in the law that but it really excite you?
00:08:30
Speaker
I really enjoy criminal law. And it's not something that I thought I would enjoy when I was entering law school. I kind of went in thinking that I was going to be interested in more transactional work.
00:08:43
Speaker
But I really did take an interest in criminal law. And I think another area of law that really is exciting to me, but I don't know if I'll ever venture into is medical malpractice.
00:08:54
Speaker
I think that's so fascinating. And I would be interested in taking classes on it because I think that it's so relevant, especially with ah new technology in medicine.
00:09:08
Speaker
So yeah, I find those areas really, really interesting. That's great. Did you enjoy first-year torts? I did. i love torts. I'm actually taking advanced torts right now. you are?
00:09:18
Speaker
Yeah, and it's great. i Advanced torts is a little bit different because it's more conversational, less luxury. And we really dive into all of the complex things issues in the tort system. And it's it's really fascinating.
00:09:35
Speaker
That is interesting. Are you are you talking about medical malpractice in the advanced towards class? We are a bit. um Professor scales, he, he gives us a lot of examples on medical malpractice. And so it really ties everything in together for me.
00:09:51
Speaker
And so I feel like I'm getting a little bit of the medical malpractice um knowledge, but also still really learning about about the nuances of tort. Great. That's great.
Dan's Career Aspirations
00:10:01
Speaker
How about you, Dan?
00:10:04
Speaker
Yeah, ah like Emma, I also thought I wanted to do transactional law and um it was kind of confirmed in my 1L year. Like contracts was the only class I really ended up really like quote getting in my 1L year.
00:10:20
Speaker
um And it was by far my best grade in all of 1L. And torts ended up being my worst in the fall. you know, they're both fine, but like relatively speaking. um But since then, i I'm um person pretty convinced I'm going to be a trial attorney and probably practicing civil litigation. So torts.
00:10:38
Speaker
I'm also an advanced torts taught by my 1L torts professor, um Professor Swan, and she's excellent. um And then I'm also very interested in international law. So I try and take anything I can towards related, international law related and environmental law related.
00:10:55
Speaker
Great. Those are all great areas. Fantastic.
00:11:02
Speaker
And. um Let's see, what has been the most important thing that you learned at Rutgers so far?
00:11:15
Speaker
um I can try and answer that. That's tough. I've learned because I've learned so many things ah at Rutgers. um There are so so like, honestly, like every kind of experience it related to the law can be found at Rutgers.
00:11:30
Speaker
And um I came into law school knowing nothing about the law. I didn't think I would ever study law until right before I decided I would. um So everything has been new, but if I had to pick one thing, ah maybe it would be the cliche thing, but the thinking like a lawyer, because that kind of permeates everything, but um truly...
00:11:53
Speaker
critical analysis and then being able to communicate that in detail, um you know, with my oral advocacy, but even more importantly, what really developed is my writing skills.
00:12:04
Speaker
That has probably got to be what I learned the most in law school. And um obviously I am going to practice law. I hope. um But I think it is kind of transfer of a transferable skill. I realized um I always thought myself a critical thinker. But before coming to law school, before coming to Rutgers, I realized that there's like a whole nother level of critical thinking really detailed analysis that you get taught how to do here.
00:12:26
Speaker
Absolutely. and And your writing skills and your oral advocacy skills, those those really are transferable skills and you're going to use them no matter what. Even if you decided tomorrow that you didn't want to practice law, that writing ability, the fact that you have honed that at law school is is going to be very helpful no matter what you end up doing. So I i i think that that's really an invaluable skill that we teach.
Experiential Learning Importance
00:12:51
Speaker
How about you, Emma? For me, I think the most important thing that I've learned Rutgers is how to be a zealous advocate.
00:13:02
Speaker
I think that Rutgers specifically takes a lot of time and effort to teach methods and strategy and techniques that will serve you, regardless if you're going to be a a litigator or not.
00:13:20
Speaker
And it's that's why trial advocacy was my my favorite class by far in law school because it was an opportunity to test things out without the risk of an actual client um facing any backlash. So it was really an amazing opportunity for me to learn not only the skills, but also how to incorporate the knowledge into that, like rules of evidence and um everything like that. You know, it was a really opening experience for me. And I think it's easily one of the most important things I've learned.
00:14:03
Speaker
That's wonderful. i I completely agree. I mean, i think I think a lot of people come to law school because they envision themselves in a courtroom. and And we provide those opportunities to really step into the shoes of a lawyer and try it out, whether it's a trial ad or or in a clinic or an externship. Those are those are fantastic opportunities. um And and i always encourage students to take advantage of those experiential opportunities where you really can, as you put it, test things out and and see for yourself what you enjoy, what you're good at, what you need more work on. ah it's It's such a great opportunity in law school. So kudos to you for taking advantage of that.
Self-Care in Law School
00:14:45
Speaker
I have a question for you, Dean Bond. How about the most rewarding aspect of your role as a Dean? Is it fair to say ah that there are things to be learned as Dean or is it or is this like a perfect, um or has the learning stopped?
00:15:02
Speaker
The learning has definitely not stopped. I will say that. There are a lot of things I love about my job. And one of them is um is interacting with students like like you guys. I mean, I get to do that fairly regularly at um at events and meetings and things like that. But because my my role is fairly all-consuming, I'm not not in the classroom but this year and um So I miss that kind of day-to-day contact with students, but but I love getting to know you all um as students in the in the kind of co-curricular spaces where where I interact with students.
00:15:43
Speaker
And then and then i ah the other thing I say all the time, and it's truly genuine, is I love interacting with our alumni too. Rutgers Law School has phenomenal alums, and they care deeply about the institution. They care about the students. They ask me all the time, what are students concerned about? what you know What's on the minds of students? and And they they really want to give back. And so... A lot of them do that through mentoring programs, um sometimes through adjunct teaching at the law school, ah sometimes through financial contributions and scholarships. but
00:16:18
Speaker
But there's really ah great energy ah that comes from our alumni community. And so I i love every chance I get to interact with with the alums. It's really just a ah fantastic group of folks.
00:16:32
Speaker
So that's like those are two my favorite parts of the job. That's awesome. um I have a question. So from what I understand about this podcast, the majority of the listeners are um prospective students thinking about going to law school.
00:16:47
Speaker
So in that sense, what would you tell them were your go to methods of self care to get you through law school? ah That's such a great question. i I'm a huge proponent of of self-care and and we talk a lot about what students need in terms of um mental health and and work-life balance. ah I think students nowadays are are much more attuned to those issues than than when I was in school. um
00:17:19
Speaker
but But I think ah i I sort of knew intuitively that I needed that. And so I'll tell you what I did during my first year of a law school, which is not the solution for everybody, I'm sure.
00:17:30
Speaker
But I got a puppy. And I loved it. It was fantastic. So I went to the pound, I adopted it. a puppy and ah and she was really ah fantastic reminder that you I couldn't be ah consumed by law school, that you know I had responsibilities to take care of her and take her for walks. And ah so it got me out of the library on a regular basis. And it was just a really, really nice thing to have a companion to go through law school with. So ah i I think that you know just paying attention to what your needs are outside of law school, whether it's whether it's a dog or you know the
00:18:09
Speaker
the um ah surrounding yourself with peers that you can count on and rely on when year when you're having a bad day or when you're celebrating your successes. you know It's just really important to have people in your life and in your community who you can depend on.
00:18:26
Speaker
um So in my case, i I had that, but I also had a dog in my life that was a wonderful companion. So I do recommend that, but I realize it's not for everyone. Yeah, I feel very strongly about that in the same sense that it's really important to have a strong um support system.
00:18:46
Speaker
I spoke about this to the incoming 1Ls during their orientation that I heard a lot of advice before law school, like you were saying, Dan, about oh, you're going to be like in the library nonstop. You're not going to see your friends for three years.
00:18:59
Speaker
And i really found myself leaning on my friends and my support system. And I thought I was going to be completely isolated, but it turns out like,
00:19:11
Speaker
I really needed them. And it was really nice to not shut them out. And I urged the 1Ls at the time to to hold on to their friendships and and put work into them, even though you have a lot going on. It's it's important.
00:19:26
Speaker
Absolutely. That's great advice. I'm so glad you're communicating that to our prospective students. That's fantastic. Yeah, I couldn't agree more with that, too. I do wish I could fit a puppy in my dorm room, but definitely have learned also leaning on as many supports as possible. I think that is really good advice.
00:19:45
Speaker
um I have have another question.
Challenges in Legal Education
00:19:47
Speaker
um ah Dean Bob, what is the biggest challenge facing law schools now? um And if I may, like, because we are in this climate, um I think it can't be ah glossed over of but swift you and kind of shocking changes sometimes with the new administration. So has that affected um law schools from your perspective?
00:20:09
Speaker
Absolutely. i mean, in in dramatic ways. ah and And if you'd asked me that question a few months ago, the answer probably would have been different. There were challenges then too, but they were different challenges. And and now ah trying to figure out what the path forward looks like ah is is a challenge and it's unfolding daily, as you know.
00:20:32
Speaker
um So, you know, there are more challenges ah more policy initiatives and executive orders coming out of the White House that affect higher ed.
00:20:43
Speaker
ah and And that is against a backdrop of, I think, what is unfortunately some widespread skepticism about higher education and the education.
00:20:55
Speaker
utility of it. And and so that that makes me sad just because i've I've always been a proponent of the power of higher education to to be a real um to be a real source of of mobility, social mobility. And so I think that that the fact that that there is this um In my view, unwarranted skepticism about the power of higher education is is really ah kind of a sad statement about where things are. But then but then that's the backdrop. And then you have these more acute issues that are sort of coming to us on a daily basis. ah
00:21:39
Speaker
and And that involves some restrictions on funding, federal funding for certain projects and things like that. But also, you know, ah things as mundane as as the and NIH cap on F&A, which is sort of the overhead expenses that – That a lot of schools, not just law schools, but but in a lot of cases, med schools who are getting grants from NIH, they have a certain percentage of those grants that go towards overhead expenses. And and NIH has now capped those at 15%. So that's
00:22:13
Speaker
that's a a really dramatic funding cut for ah a huge range of universities. And, you know, we're going to, even though we as the law school don't have ah n NIH grants per se, we're still going to feel the trickle down effects of that. So so it's a it's a very dynamic landscape right now, as as I know you know, um but but that absolutely has to be, you know, the biggest challenge that we're facing today.
00:22:43
Speaker
And I know you mentioned it's dynamic. is Is there any, like standing here now in the middle the storm, so to speak, um is there any way that we can incorporate this into actionable advice? Or is it kind of an impractical thing to think about for prospective students, especially sometimes the law school process is like a two-year process or a whole year in advance process?
00:23:05
Speaker
Is there any kind of advice you'd give like that?
Law School's Societal Impact
00:23:07
Speaker
Yeah, that's ah that's a great question. I mean, ah one thing that's important to keep in mind is that ah we've we've been through challenging policy environments before. we we you know we will survive. We will we will um fight the good fight and ah and come out the other side.
00:23:25
Speaker
but um i would I would encourage you to think about law school. It's a it's a really great way to ah to influence national policy, to sort of have a say in the direction of of this country.
00:23:38
Speaker
And even at the state and local level, you know we need we need good lawyers everywhere. ah so So now is actually a great time to go to law school, I think. um if If you ah share the sense of that law...
00:23:51
Speaker
can be a powerful tool um and and a powerful influence on society. So I would end with that hopeful note.
Rutgers Law School's Strengths
00:23:59
Speaker
So on that note, what are the strengths of Rutgers Law specifically that people might not know about?
00:24:07
Speaker
Well, there are a lot. I mean, I can talk a little bit about the kinds of things that drew me to Rutgers Law School. I'm still a relatively new dean. I came here 18 months ago and And one of the things that that attracted me ah was Rutgers' longstanding investment in – um fostering a rich diversity of students. And so, you know, Rutgers has a high number of first gen students. It has ah ah a really um high rate percentage of diverse students in its student body. um
00:24:46
Speaker
On the Newark campus, this year is the first year that we are a majority minority ah campus. and And it's it's that kind of investment in um in diversity that that I really value. And that the minority student program has been in existence now over 50 years in Newark and since 2016 in Camden. ah And that is a hallmark program of the law school. And it's one that that I think should be a national model.
00:25:18
Speaker
It's a program in which you know we we have intentionally developed pipelines for students from communities that are underrepresented in the law. And um we have not only established these pipelines to get students...
00:25:34
Speaker
to come to law school. But then we've designed an entire program around supporting those students once they once they get here. so So the MSP program, or our minority student program, um on both campuses is open to everyone. um It's a post-admissions program that's ah open to all.
00:25:52
Speaker
but But it really does create an intentional community um to foster a sense of belonging in all of our students. And and the the early, early investment in this program is something that I i was so impressed with when I was looking around at at law schools.
00:26:12
Speaker
um and And I continue to be impressed with that program day in and day out. It's really just a phenomenal program. so So that's one of the things that that um is certainly a strength of Rutgers Law School that some people may know about, others may not.
00:26:29
Speaker
um And then I have to give a shout out to our faculty, too. We have an extraordinary faculty here at Rutgers Law School. are I knew that coming in, but it's been underscored over and over again for me um since I've been here. And it's really...
00:26:46
Speaker
Extraordinary to me. Our faculty are really thought leaders in their area of expertise. And so they're engaged not just in in writing, um really engaging law review articles.
00:26:58
Speaker
They're also engaged in teaching. testifying before Congress about various issues and within their areas of expertise and writing amicus briefs to the courts. And so it's it's not as though they're they're just producing scholarship that other scholars will read. They're they're very engaged in in kind of pushing the envelope um as far as policy, as far as law and policy goes. So really an incredible faculty and they're so talented in the classroom. I hope that you all have had that experience.
00:27:27
Speaker
I continue to be so impressed with with our faculty. um So I think it's really an extraordinary place to get an education and to find community.
00:27:38
Speaker
Yeah, I really agree. Our faculty are excellent and um I do regret all the time that i didn't join MSP. I think it's an incredible program. It really is.
00:27:52
Speaker
Okay, let me ask you a question. ah Let's see, how do you... Well, let me ask about your SBA experience. You both have experience now as student bar association presidents in and in other student organizations too. um How do you think those and other extracurricular activities have have shaped your law school experience?
00:28:19
Speaker
Yeah, I can start. um I think it has had a really big impact on my experience. um I've been part of the SBA for three years now. So I started as a 1L rep.
00:28:32
Speaker
And then for 2L, I was the vice president. And now I'm the president. And it has given me an opportunity not only to meet more students and to become more engaged with the student body, also to truly leave a legacy and make change.
00:28:50
Speaker
um And I think that's been really exciting um to not feel like a a cog in the wheel, so to say, um and to feel like I can really make an impact. And that's the same with other student organizations and even being on a journal.
00:29:06
Speaker
I feel like the work that I'm doing is meaningful. it it is It's going to be read. It's going to be heard. And so I think it's made going to law school feel a little bit more fulfilling.
00:29:22
Speaker
That's wonderful. That is, that's so great to hear. How about you, Dan? Yeah, I do want to echo what Emma said about how, how it's fulfilling and, um,
00:29:34
Speaker
And well, yeah, a lot of it's being a big member of SBA has been a huge part of my life here as a 3L. um This is also my third consecutive year in the Student Bar Association. And I was pretty involved in other organizations before this.
00:29:48
Speaker
I think in addition to what... um Emma mentioned, probably the biggest thing it's done is it really has connected me with all sorts of groups. ah Not just like, I feel like I, I know this isn't true, but I feel like I've met every student on the Newark campus. um Emma and I got to meet in person recently.
00:30:08
Speaker
I got to, engaged with the alumni association board frequently. I've engaged with almost every Dean. i met the chancellor and, uh, and ah i've I just, you get your hands and fingers on the the complete like pulse of the of the student body and everything that's going on. And um I feel like in addition to ah real advocacy skills, which I've developed, like there has been real, um i think there's a difference between like knowing and practice or knowing and experience. And sometimes it's the little things, like just literally procedure of how to do things, how to craft a message, how to find a tone, how to organize people.
00:30:49
Speaker
um And all of that, in addition to, I think probably the the biggest thing would be just all the opportunities that's opened up for me personally. and And hopefully, i know I've made an effort, but I don't know how how it's paid off, but hopefully connecting those opportunities with as many students as possible. Because there is so much here at Rutgers Law, ah truly, truly. And the more we can connect each other to all these opportunities, the greater experience we can all have.
00:31:17
Speaker
That's great. Well said. And so I know you both have been very involved in in the SBA. Are you going to miss it when you graduate or is are you ready to sort of pass the torch? I think i' be honest emma i think I'm definitely ready to pass the torch. i I know that there are so many other people who are so ready to take on this role and are so passionate.
00:31:42
Speaker
um But I haven't really enjoyed my time. But I, and I think I will look back very fondly of it, but I am looking forward to seeing my my work kind of come to fruition. Because sometimes when you when you make, when you propose change, you won't get to see it.
00:32:05
Speaker
um It's like planting seeds in a garden you'll never get to see. And so I'm actually really excited to pass the torch along and see what else is capable, who else is capable and what.
00:32:19
Speaker
So and then hopefully looking back as an alumni and seeing all the change that has been made and um getting to admire that from a distance. That's great. That's great. How about you, Dan?
00:32:32
Speaker
Yeah, again, I really agree with Emma. I had a moment during winter break where was I'm ready to be a lame duck president. I haven't figured out how to do that exactly. I'm still very engaged, but I, one of the first things I did this semester was set the election schedule.
00:32:48
Speaker
um And there are definitely a lot of so many excellent um student leaders here waiting in the wings, chomping at the bit, and I cannot wait to help them get in the position. But in addition to what Emma just said, also want to say, ah You know, leadership, true leadership, like the kind that Emma represents and especially that you were representing, Vaughn, is difficult.
00:33:08
Speaker
And I just want to say, having worked with you off and on, like obviously you have much, much bigger responsibilities um to campuses, but I really respect the work you've done. And I think you've done an excellent job.
00:33:19
Speaker
And it is difficult. and It's difficult to manage so many groups of constituents. um It's one of the things I learned and one of the things I will love and look back fondly on and I'm ready to look back on.
00:33:32
Speaker
Right. I can appreciate that completely. Well, and likewise, Dan, it it has been such a pleasure to work with you and Emma. ah You both have been really extraordinary leaders of this, of both campuses. And so I will be sorry to see you go, but I i i look forward to seeing who comes next too and and to see the the great work that that they will do. But you're you're leaving big shoes to fill both of you.
00:33:57
Speaker
Thank you. So let me ask you this. What are your, I mean, we're sort of talking about the future anyway, but can you tell me a little bit about what your plans are after law school?
00:34:10
Speaker
Dan, do you want to start? ah Sure, yeah. Immediately afterwards, I will be clerking in state court, family court. um And in the long term view, I hope to practice some kind of environmental law.
00:34:23
Speaker
I don't know if I will be domestic or international both. Who knows what the future holds, but I will be clerking immediately after law school. Great. That's wonderful. and And which judge clerking with?
00:34:36
Speaker
Judge Damien Santamuro here in Essex County. Fantastic. Great. that That will be a wonderful learning experience, I am certain. i Whenever I get the chance talking to students, i I really encourage them to do clerkships. I think it's such an extraordinary learning opportunity. And you spend a lot of time with a judge in court who who often teaches you a tremendous amount about what is effective advocacy and what isn't.
00:35:05
Speaker
ah So it's it's a wonderful, wonderful way to spend a year or two after law school. That's great. How about you, Emma? I am fortunate enough to have a job after graduation, and i will be working for the Delaware Department of Justice as a Deputy Attorney General.
00:35:23
Speaker
and I am extremely excited for this opportunity. i interned with them in the this past summer and It really, it was the first time I felt like it really fit and that I was doing exactly what I was put on this earth to do.
00:35:39
Speaker
And I am very much looking forward to finishing up bar prep at the end of the summer and getting right into into work. Great. That's wonderful.
00:35:50
Speaker
How lucky to have that feeling that that that is such a good fit for you personally. That's wonderful. I I wish you both the best and and I will keep an eye on you, I'm sure, um with all the great things that you're doing. And and I hope that you will stay in touch with us at Rutgers. I mean, one of the things, as I said earlier, one of the things that that I really value about this place is our our thriving community. Rutgers alumni community. so So I know that you two will be active participants within the alumni community, but um don't be strangers. Come back and see us on campus whenever you can. um i always I always love to reconnect with with students who've moved on. So
00:36:28
Speaker
ah But but I i want to also take a moment to just say thank you for it for all of your service to the law school and for being here today to to talk to me about your your experiences and and your future plans. It's wonderful to hear.
00:36:44
Speaker
Thank you both. Thank you so much. Thanks for having us The Power of Attorney is a production of Rutgers Law School. With two locations just minutes from New York City and Philadelphia, Rutgers Law offers the prestige and reputation of a large nationally known university with a personal small campus experience.
00:37:04
Speaker
Learn more today by visiting us at law.rutgers.edu.