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Finding Your Style w/ Heather Buchanan
19 Plays1 year ago
In today’s episode, I chatted with artist, writer, and accidental astrologer, Heather Buchanan. You know her from her distinctive, goofy, watercolors and oil paintings with noseless faces as well as her weekly, totally real, horoscopes, Horror Scoops. We discussed her days of painting portraits and when she realized that she wanted to find her own style rather than relying on what other people wanted to see and what would make her money. Along with that process came putting in hours of work that no one would ever see, dealing with the fear of showing work that’s completely different than people were used to seeing, and learning to trust her inner weirdo.
Talking to Heather gave me so much hope in the creative process. Particularly in the hours of work that no one will see–those scribbles and doodles, those tiny poetry blurbs and short stories and first drafts–it’s all flexing the creative muscles and getting to know who you are and what you want to bring into the world. And when we bring our authentic weirdness into our art and share it with others, we give everyone permission to show up in their weirdness too. What a gift!
You can follow Heather on Instagram @heatherbuchanan and @horror.scoops, and you can purchase some of her incredible art at heatherbuchanan.ca.
References:
Heather’s interview with CBC
Hanni’s Kim Kardashian sculpture
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Ugly Podcast
00:00:03
Speaker
Welcome to the Ugly Podcast. I'm your host, Lauren Alexander, she, they, and this is the place where creatives are encouraged to make messy, ugly art and let go of perfectionism.
00:00:14
Speaker
I started this podcast with my creative partner, Emerson, and we've since grown into our businesses. And this podcast is now evolving into a space where I interview other creatives to discuss our creative processes and how we navigate the mental mind field of creativity. This podcast serves as a reminder that you and your art get to be whatever the hell you want to be, ugly and all.
00:00:41
Speaker
Okay, welcome back to the ugly podcast.
Meet Heather Buchanan
00:00:46
Speaker
I have a really I'm really excited about this episode today. This person I'm about to introduce to you is
00:00:55
Speaker
the person that I wanted to bring on to the Ugly Podcast as soon as I started interviewing people. So yeah, I'm really excited about this. She is an artist, writer, and accidental astrologer from Calgary, where she lives with her husband and cat and has been making art for nearly a decade. And a few years ago, she stopped making realistic portraits and started letting her personality come through her work, which is
00:01:21
Speaker
why she's just so perfect for the Ugly Podcast and to come here. So welcome. Can you please just introduce yourself with your name and your pronouns, please?
Art Inspired by Childhood
00:01:31
Speaker
Hello. Hi. Yeah, I'm Heather Buchanan. She, her. Thank you so much for having me, Lauren. I'm so excited to be here. Yay. This is just so good. Your art, it touches a place in me that, like,
00:01:50
Speaker
brings me back to doing Mad Libs with my best friend at her late cabin. Just like trying to pull out the most random silly things we can possibly muster and just making ourselves crack up forever and always. And that is what your art does for me. And I just love it so much. I told you I wouldn't gush too much, but that's the extent of it. I'll stop.
00:02:11
Speaker
Oh man, no that is, oh man, I haven't thought about Mad Libs in a really long time, but that is totally the vibe, like just trying to make it weird, trying to like, yeah, let the oddity flow and try to cause some strangeness. Yes, I wanna, do they still make Mad Libs? I hope so, I wanna do them now. Right? Yeah, they were really fun.
00:02:37
Speaker
I want to find some and then go on a really long drive and just like, yeah. Yeah. Oh, so good. So I want to kind of over the course of our conversation, I just I'd love to talk about like,
00:02:54
Speaker
how your art has evolved and I don't know just like how your process has been with that because I think like at least for me the realization that my art can be whatever I want it to be and that I can lean into my own personality was like the biggest realization and made me realize like oh I actually have some creativity in me like I didn't think of myself as a creative person before that so I'm really curious like
Career vs. Self-Expression
00:03:20
Speaker
what was your relationship to art before that shift when you were in your early days of art? Like, how did you start getting into making portraits? What was that like? Yeah, so I think my relationship to art was very much having it be a career and having it sort of be something that I needed to make a living with. I really
00:03:49
Speaker
didn't want to be stuck in an office. I had a lot of anxiety and had battled depression so much as like a teenager and a lot of it had to do with being at school and
00:04:07
Speaker
when I when I tried to hold down jobs and whatnot I just it was so miserable and the one thing I could always do was to make art and so I really really relied on art as a career because I could I could do that and I could not you know I could I could want I could I could do that and I'm trying not to get too bleak
00:04:34
Speaker
I could do that and be okay. So yeah, so basically, you know, making art was something I really needed to rely on for an income. And so I did sort of suppress my own personality in it a lot, not completely. Like there was always a sense of humor in it and always
00:05:02
Speaker
a bit of me in everything I made. I always came back to a part of myself where it always, it always sprung from something in me, but it was, you know, there's just the volume was turned way, way, way down. And sort of, you know, the question of would it sell was always, you know, way, way at the front.
00:05:24
Speaker
And it was always, you know, I made a lot of sort of pop culture related work and a lot of, you know, funny sort of puns and greeting cards and things that, you know, just were like really, really commercial. And, you know, so my relationship is very much
00:05:42
Speaker
um you know just sort of like leaning into what would sell from a purely survival standpoint um and and i don't think that's necessarily a bad thing um especially you know i think it served me really well because it allowed me to sort of build up an audience for the first several years of my career and allowed me to sort of make a name for myself and even though
Commercial Art vs. Self-Expression
00:06:05
Speaker
that
00:06:05
Speaker
Sort of you know, then makes it harder to pivot because you you know use known for doing certain things And it sort of makes it You know sort of harder to ever shake that reputation as the person that does blank, you know It also there are benefits to it because I did spend a lot of years really honing my my technical skills as You know
00:06:33
Speaker
if you want to paint portraits of celebrities, you better actually get some chops painting portraits, because it actually has to look like them if anyone's going to paint them. So there are all these wonderful advantages, and you also get to make work of the
00:06:53
Speaker
the movies, the pop culture people that I'm into and that I think are funny or interesting in some way, which is really fun. And then you get to interact with people who are also fans of the same thing. So it creates all these sorts of wonderful connections in those ways, which is wonderful. But yeah, there was definitely always sort of a bit of an emptiness and a bit of like sort of a nagging feeling of it.
00:07:21
Speaker
not quite, you know, not being enough. Yeah, there was just something missing always. Yeah. Yeah, that element of just like, you're always, it's always in the back of your mind of this has to make me money. And so there's a certain pressure on your art at all times.
00:07:39
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. It's a lot of weight to put on art and on creating for sure. Yeah. So then when did you start to develop your own style with the noseless faces and then eventually horror scoops?
Developing Unique Style
00:07:59
Speaker
How did that come to be? Yeah, so it was, I guess, about three years ago, three or four years ago now. The noseless faces, yeah. So I knew I wanted to sort of, yeah, so there was that like, you know, nagging feeling of having more to say and knowing that I just
00:08:21
Speaker
really needed to start making work that was more myself. And I know people who make pop culture work and who don't have that, who are fully satisfied by doing that. So it's definitely not something everyone feels, but I felt it. I absolutely felt.
00:08:40
Speaker
nagged to like get messy and get weird and fully express all the nonsense going on in my brain. And yeah, so I just I really started just like drawing like two hours a day of just drawing like face after face after face, trying to figure out like what
00:09:05
Speaker
what it was gonna be, what was gonna be different in my own style. And I also had this like maybe like two week period where I was just, I took like all these like, you know, like canvas boards, like just the kind of cheap canvas panels. And I painted like the same character, like she had the same expression and hair color and sort of type of features. But I gave her sort of different
00:09:36
Speaker
She was just in a different style in about 30 different paintings. It was absolutely insane. I laid them all out. I was just trying to figure out in each one what was interesting and what wasn't and what seemed derivative of a different style. I was just painting over and over and over and trying to just
00:10:00
Speaker
figure out all this work that like no one will ever see and you know it was just like really trying to develop a style that felt like me and felt unique and felt original and I was trying to not look at a lot of other people's art at that time and trying to not absorb too much of other people because I you know like we are we are sponges we are right you know
00:10:28
Speaker
human tofu, you know, we take on the flavors of everything around us. It's a weird way of putting it. Cute human tofu, I love it. Yes, we are. Something like that. So, you know, I was just trying to like,
00:10:49
Speaker
come up with all these different things and and yeah I think a lot of people who have you know have gone through this or like it's like some people have just like always had a style since they were they were young but um but yeah I I definitely like I don't know about you but I I
00:11:09
Speaker
I don't know, I didn't. I squashed a lot of my own originality in myself at a young age. I killed that in myself to try to fit in, so I had to recover it at an older age.
00:11:26
Speaker
Yeah, so it was a long process and a lot of trial and error and a lot of experimenting until I found things that felt right. And there was a period of it feeling like nothing was ever gonna feel like me. And it was like the hopeless feeling of like, I'm just gonna like be painting faces forever and nothing's gonna feel right.
00:11:46
Speaker
Until finally there were some like breakthrough moments of like, oh this feels weird. This is interesting This is exciting. Oh my and and yes, so that was it's it actually happened which was Exciting because there were weeks where it was like Oh, there's this is never gonna happen and I'm never gonna have style and and the hopeless hopeless hopeless, but no It worked
00:12:11
Speaker
That's very encouraging. I'm still like discovering my style just because like my creative journey
Overcoming Artistic Fear
00:12:17
Speaker
has been so new. I mean, I only realized I was a creative person like two years ago. Yeah. So like.
00:12:25
Speaker
I love hearing you say this. It makes me feel so hopeful. I can continue exploring this and I will find something that speaks to me. It's just part of the process. It's so funny that we're just like, no, this is how it's going to be forever. This is my life.
00:12:46
Speaker
we never leave room for that expansion at that change because we're always just like, no, this is just how it's going to be. Right. Or like, so reside. Yeah, or like, there's that like mythology, like you just have a style, like it's just there and you're right. And it's like ingrained in you, like, no, you've got to like, keep exploring, keep finding it, find it. Yeah, get curious. You know, dig around, root around in there.
00:13:16
Speaker
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Yes, that brings me so much hope. Yeah, I'm glad because yeah, it was it there were definitely some like dark moments of it feeling like it wasn't gonna ever sort of congeal into anything and
00:13:35
Speaker
What's really interesting, I think, is the things that aesthetically felt right, like the nozelessness, that just like something felt really good about that. And I didn't know why. And then as I like worked with that, I realized that like the faces without noses looked like they were having like a panic attack, like they were having trouble breathing.
00:14:00
Speaker
And then having had this whole history with anxiety and panic, but also being a total silly pants goofball.
00:14:13
Speaker
So these faces work on both those levels of having this serious element of expressing something about mental illness. But they also look absolutely bananas. So they work on these two levels and there's this push and pull of the serious and the silly.
00:14:39
Speaker
they just feel right. So it's, it's so interesting that, you know, sort of aesthetically, there's something interesting about them to me. But then also conceptually, they say exactly what I want to say. So it's just so interesting how that works out. You know, there's, there's that, like, creative magic thing that happens. Yeah, I don't know how else to explain it, you know, creative magic. That's what it is.
00:15:08
Speaker
We have this idea that everything we do has to be good or have value. This belief leads us to burn out. It can hold us back from creating altogether. But in my Ugly Art 101 course, I break down these restrictive beliefs and lead you through exercises that intentionally subvert perfectionism and bring playfulness back into your creative process. You can get the first day absolutely free by going to my website, scribeandsunshine.com and signing up on the homepage. Join me in my weird ugly art revolution. Back to the show.
00:15:38
Speaker
you
00:15:41
Speaker
So was there any one or any thing going on in particular? I mean, you said three to four years ago, so I can guess what was happening in the world at that time. But anything that inspired you to be like, no, you know what? I'm at my wit's end. I can't keep doing this. I need to lean into my silliness. I need to lean into my style rather than trying to paint what other people want to see. Was there someone or something in particular that pushed you in that direction?
00:16:11
Speaker
Yeah, well, I had, I had gotten into a car accident at the time. So I was Oh, different. I was thinking of like, you know, COVID. And I'm just like, you know, this was like two years before that. Yeah. Okay, okay. Gotcha. I think I'm in that like headspace where I don't know what years mean right now. I should I should throw out a timeline. I'm really bad in general at knowing
00:16:36
Speaker
how many years anything has been. Yeah. Yeah, COVID like minus two years, like two years. Gotcha. Okay. Don't, if I say anything has been a certain number of years, just don't. Okay. It's not gonna be accurate. Um, yeah, okay, you're right. Okay, yeah, I guess it's been five years. Wow. Wow. Yeah.
00:17:04
Speaker
Okay, now, now I'm attempting my first instinct there is to be like, you haven't done enough in the past five years. That's a, you know,
00:17:14
Speaker
that internal voice, that internal critic who's just always a big jerk. We're just going to ignore that voice. I was going to say, I'm happy to refute that voice for you and point out all of the amazing things that I've seen from you just in the year and a half that I've followed you. That voice is there. You're just going to be like, hello, hello, internal jerk. Oh, hi there. No voice in the test. You're never in love. Thanks for coming out.
00:17:45
Speaker
Um, anyway, um, yeah, yeah. So I, I had been in like a car accident and, and I was like stuck on the couch with like whiplash for a really long time. And so I think there was just like, uh, a bit of like self-reflection and some like reevaluating and, you know, just sort of like, you know, being in like some pain and some like, just like hanging out with your own thoughts there and,
00:18:12
Speaker
Yeah, so I think that's sort of what immediately preceded making some changes. So it kind of messed up my shoulders and I couldn't paint for a while. And yeah, so I think anything that makes you take some time away, I think can lead to those big reflections and some changes.
00:18:39
Speaker
So yeah, that kind of led to that big change. And I think it's also easier, if I'm being really, really honest, it's easier to make those big changes because you have that built-in excuse. Because then it's like, oh, oh, I made this big change. And it's like, it's the car accident stuff. It's not like me. It's like, look over there. That's why I made the change.
00:19:09
Speaker
It wasn't like me desperately needing to share something true and real within me. It's over there. That's why I did it. Well, I mean, we had that globally with the pandemic. We were like, no, I didn't always have this. It's this pandemic. It's making me change. It's making me address these really deep inner problems that I've been ignoring so desperately for so long. Yeah, exactly. This isn't something real and true and honest with the pandemic.
00:19:40
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's so right. Yeah, totally. There's something there. Look over there. Yeah. Do you watch RuPaul's Drag Race?
00:19:53
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. So what has been the process of trusting in
Trusting Unique Artistic Style
00:20:06
Speaker
your style? Like when you first started releasing and sharing those images, like, was there a lot of fear when you were first starting to share those?
00:20:19
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think it's like, you know, because the place that we usually like start sharing is social media and it is always like,
00:20:31
Speaker
a bit weird to be like, okay, for like, you know, X number of years, I've shared this thing. And now I'm just gonna switch Roo and share this totally different thing. Like you've all known me and followed me for like this thing that you like. And now I'm gonna give you something. You know, it's like that you didn't ask for. Yeah, exactly. You ordered a steak off the menu. And now I'm gonna give you chicken fingers.
00:21:01
Speaker
hope you like it. Yeah, who wouldn't want chicken fingers? Who, when they order a delightful steak, wouldn't be happy with a plate of chicken fingers? Yeah, but I mean, I think, you know, for one, I think I think what I learned is that like, you know, people
00:21:23
Speaker
People don't think about you that much and don't care about you that much. So it's okay. You put it out there. They're not gonna run screaming for the hills. They'll just quietly unfollow you if they don't like it. That's fine. It's not that big of a deal. So I mean, it was scary and I think I built it up in my head a lot more than I needed to. Because the people who liked it liked it and the people who didn't,
00:21:51
Speaker
left and people who were like just my friends were like oh cool you know yeah weird okay and and I think you know everyone else just like got used to it and like most people are just like oh yeah that's this is like the art you make you know most people are just
00:22:10
Speaker
Or like really what happened, like honestly, like the algorithm is just so slow at actually showing people anything. Is that like, those people don't even see it until you've been making it for like six months or a year. And so by then they're like, oh, that's what she makes. And then they look back and they're like, oh, she's been making this forever. Oh, I've got to get on board. Right. Oh.
00:22:35
Speaker
I'm behind the times. I was very curious when this started, so I scrolled back and back and back on your Instagram and I found your early portraits. I was like, oh, holy shit. So different. I know sometimes I'm like, should I archive it? Should I get rid of it? Then I'm like, I kind of like that it's like this. I love seeing the evolution.
00:23:00
Speaker
I really loved your pieces that were like the scribbles and then saying like, this piece of art has decided that it's not art. It's too much pressure and it doesn't want to be art anymore. I love those. I actually want to revisit those ones a little bit. I want to make bigger versions of those ones because I feel like that's a good expression of, I feel like, I don't know. Yeah, I think I've got more to say on those pieces.
00:23:29
Speaker
Those really spoke to me. I love them. Especially the ones that are like, whoever buys this art is a beautiful person. You're just manipulating your viewers. I feel like that's like capitalism in a nutshell. Yes, exactly. I bought this thing. I spent money on it, therefore I am X.
00:23:48
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. Right. So that's what like, that's why we buy paintings is because like, you know, we want it to say something about us or that's like part of the reason of like why capitalism might say you bought a painting. Right. Because you're because you're beautiful and intelligent. And yeah.
00:24:06
Speaker
you want it to like augment your personality. Anyway, that's like this, that's like the cynic in me. So that's, yeah, the person in this painting is attractive and pretty and smarter than you.
00:24:21
Speaker
I loved what you said about people don't think about you that much, as much as you think that they will, how much we build it up in our heads. I remember the first time, it was just a blog post for my business that I was gonna post, and I had it in my head that either people were going to absolutely hate it, or they were going to love it, and they were going to wanna work with me immediately, and it was gonna change everything.
00:24:46
Speaker
blog post yeah and like thinking back on it now I'm just like no honey sweet baby no like no one's gonna care like three people are gonna read it two of them are your parents yeah yeah get it out there oh I mean your parents read it that's
00:25:12
Speaker
That might be generous, that's probably just my mom. And she just skimmed it, let's be honest. But I mean, yeah, yeah, like truly, like, you know, like getting people to like really actually care like it's, you know, like,
00:25:31
Speaker
They do a bit. Like, honestly, I mean, you know, they do care, but it's not as much as we think, as we build up in our head. They do, you know, like, so when you're when you're making these big changes or if you like, you know, experiment with something that feels like, you know, because creative fear is real and it's big and it's
00:25:52
Speaker
It's daunting and it's, you know, it's very real and it's a lot, but then you actually put it out there and it's just like, you know, it's fart in the wind. Yeah, even if people like really love it, I mean, obviously they might buy it, but like, even if they just love it, they'll like it, they might comment on it, but they won't think about it.
00:26:20
Speaker
the way that you think about it. It'll just, yeah, like you said, fart in the wind. There it goes. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, you're right. Like someone might like really engage at it and like, you know, look at it and like really like have a moment with it and it might stick with them. Like you never know. Like that, that's, that's totally a possibility, but like the vast majority of the time. Right. It's, we're just scrolling. We're just scrolling. Yeah. It's usually what happens.
Creating 'Horror Scoops'
00:26:49
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah.
00:26:51
Speaker
Tell me more about your process with Horror Scoops. How has it been to start integrating more writing into your creative practice? Yeah, so Horror Scoops was such a...
00:27:03
Speaker
such a funny thing that i i stumbled upon i never expected to become um a an astrologer um but apparently i am now and it's like the greatest thing ever i am loving every second of it um because yeah because i get to um play around with writing um it's it's so funny because it's actually just like okay did you ever have like
00:27:31
Speaker
uh like a sort of a like a micro blog that you wrote in like in your teens or yes what were they called um exopia or like um i don't know
00:27:47
Speaker
tumblr yeah yeah a lot of people had tumblr um for some reason everyone at my high school had diary land um yeah i know it wasn't a it wasn't a big one everyone had anyway anyway so i had a diary land diary where i would write these little bits so everyone else wrote like you know like what
00:28:06
Speaker
the you know the teachers did that was mean or what the other kids were up to or you know like their emotions and cute boys or cute girls or whatever um but i would write these things of absolute like nonsensical microfiction about like you know characters with like pants made of lemonade and goldfish with psychic powers that like melted into birthday cakes like i
00:28:34
Speaker
you know like whatever they're just you know stream of consciousness nonsense and you know so all my friends would just be like okay all right and um so you know and and that was just that and and i would you know occasionally turn in something like that for like an english class class project or or something but you know i've always like had these bits of writing that were like that that i did and
00:29:05
Speaker
I always really loved doing it. And it was just like something, you know, in my back pocket, like, I would like take it out and play around and write some absurdist poetry or something. But yeah, now, um,
00:29:23
Speaker
getting to write these horror scoops every week is so much fun. Yeah, it's an absurd volume of work, but it's- It's a lot. Yeah. Every week, it's just, it's so much, and I love them every time. I look for my clapper crumb and I'm just like right on the nose. I love it.
00:29:50
Speaker
I think one time you actually said something about the dentist and I had just come home from the dentist and I was just like, Heather's an oracle. Heather knows exactly. Well-renowned astrology. Yeah. No, I'd actually been, I had come to Seattle and was following you. Yeah.
00:30:14
Speaker
if only, if only I have the powers. Did you find that like, so for me, sharing drawings and scribbles on social media doesn't bother me at all. I'm just like, yeah, here's my scribbleness. Here's my nonsense. But when it comes to writing, it there's like another level of vulnerability there that I'm just like,
00:30:37
Speaker
maybe later. It's taken me a lot more work to start to share my writing just in like my writers group. And so I'm just curious if that if you experienced something similar or like since you had already been doing it, you know, like you said, when you were younger, it just like kind of a little easier for you. Well, okay, I think as like the horror scoops themselves, I have no, like,
00:31:06
Speaker
fear sharing those. I love them. I think they're just fun and silly and like, like wonderful and
00:31:15
Speaker
it's like my absolute pleasure to like toss them out into the world and you know, people really enjoy them and therefore it's just like the greatest like thing to like gift them to people. I mean, it's like a ton of work and I'm just like giving them out for free and it's, you know, it's so it's just really a labor of love to make these just, you know,
00:31:43
Speaker
For the people for for a laugh or for fun. So it's just like it's truly just a joy But as for like, you know, so but it's it's caused me to You know think about doing a lot more more writing writing and actually even before this I've been doing some more fiction writing as well and and sharing that
00:32:09
Speaker
You know, fills me with this sort of perilous dread that is, you know, I'd rather sort of like stick a fork in my own spleen and rip it out and eat it than pair it with another human being. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I relate to that.
00:32:35
Speaker
Yeah, words are just so vulnerable. I mean, all sharing all creativity, especially if it like means something to you is vulnerable. But there is like when it comes to just like trying to convey human experience in fiction and memoir and whatever. Yeah, it's like another level of vulnerability that just feels so yucky.
00:33:00
Speaker
Yeah, and I'm trying to get to a point where I can be like, hello, I am an artist and a writer. Yeah, that second word. It's not coming out fluidly yet. Writer.
00:33:21
Speaker
It'll, it'll happen maybe. It'll come, it'll come. Yeah, working on things. But yeah, it's, it's like wonderful that at least these like absurdist, you know, 12 ridiculous bits of micro fiction are getting out into the world every week. I mean, micro reality, they're not fiction. They're very real. They're, they're, they're, they're destiny. They're real. My brain directly from outer space from the stars. And they're real.
00:33:52
Speaker
Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. Hey, writer. Are you feeling addressed in your writing practice? Like the word swept you out to sea, but you have no idea where you're going. Climb aboard the writer's helm. I'm Lauren. And I'm Gabby. And we're both writers and professional editors who are here to support you on your writing voyage. With the writer's helm, you get access to group co-writing sessions, Q&A sessions, our private community chat room,
00:34:20
Speaker
and group coaching calls to help you along no matter what stage of the writing process you're in. Members of our crew have said that they've reconnected with their excitement for writing and feel energized from the support they've received from us and each other. You can sign up for the writer's home at any time, which comes with a one-week free trial to make sure that we're the right crew for you. You don't need to navigate these stormy seas alone. Let the writer's home take you to New Shores.
00:34:45
Speaker
um you mentioned that like the process of coming up with that much content every week has been like a lot about just like letting go of expectations and opening yourself up can you
00:35:00
Speaker
Talk more about that. Explain what your process is.
Creative Process and Artistic Blocks
00:35:04
Speaker
Well, now, see, at the beginning, you gave me the idea of Mad Libs. I'm going to go down that well. I'm going to go fill in some adverbs and some adjectives.
00:35:18
Speaker
No one else is allowed to look at Mad Libs. Heather is taking all the Mad Libs and using them. Okay, no, but for real. Yeah, so I've definitely been in that place where you're trying to sort of like,
00:35:43
Speaker
tense up and squeeze out an idea really hard and force creativity by pushing it out and that doesn't work.
00:35:58
Speaker
It definitely is creative constipation. Yeah, I was trying to avoid saying that. I mean, it's all like a picture. Yeah, you can see my face making the creative constipation face. Yeah, creative constipation. Yeah, yeah.
00:36:28
Speaker
And, uh, yeah, that, that just really doesn't work. So like the tensing and the forcing, um, it definitely, um, so you brought in some laxatives. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of fiber. You have to have a high, um, and mentally fibrous diet. That metaphor works maybe. Um, yeah, we'll just pretend it does. Um, a lot of, uh,
00:36:56
Speaker
a lot of mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental, mental,
00:37:19
Speaker
Oh no! In the subject of mental measles. Okay, anyway. I expected nothing less from this conversation. I didn't think I'd be able to get through a conversation with you without it devolving into something silly. Into something as silly as mental accidents. Okay.
00:37:43
Speaker
Anyway, so we were talking about my process for horoscopes. Yes. So you just take two scoops of mex lab and you stir that in to a cup of warm water. And anyway, no. There are no clumps. No clumps. You don't want a clumpy. You don't want a clumping. You do not want a clumping.
00:38:11
Speaker
Okay, okay, I think we've composed ourselves, come back down to reality, and are ready to talk about that process again.
00:38:23
Speaker
Um, yeah, okay. Cause yeah, like making horn scoops is like, it's, it's an intense like volume of, of work. It's like, you know, if, if I come up with like two a day, that's, that's good. Or if I'm procrastinating and I have to write, you know, 12 pieces of microfiction on a Sunday, that's a lot. I do have like a notes app in my phone that's like full of potential scoops.
00:38:53
Speaker
um as well as like you know bits and pieces written here and there and you know whenever something comes to me like i write it down so there you know i am collecting them along the way and um you know certain friends know that like you know when something silly is said sometimes someone's like writing a 10 like party like
00:39:17
Speaker
I've got to write this down. This is going to be material, sorry about it. You know, just because it's just so much that I've got to like take from everywhere. And, you know, it suggests it's too much to like let anything sort of slide. But, you know, for the most part, the vast majority of them
00:39:42
Speaker
really what I do is, and actually I learned that this is really similar to how actual astrologers work. I learned this, I did an interview with a woman from the CBC and she told me that this is like what actual astrologers do. So basically what I do is I like meditate, I'll take some deep breaths, I'll relax and
00:40:09
Speaker
You know, do I have a little like routine and I'll like clear clear my mind and I'll like just like wait for some like images and whatnot to like come into my mind and
00:40:21
Speaker
wait you know kind of like let them let them congeal let like sort of a story unfold and and see what see what comes up and apparently that's very similar to what like actual astrologers do they'll like get into it actually channeling from the stars you know i guess maybe i am an astrologer oh my god
00:40:50
Speaker
Um, but you know, I think that's like, that's really interesting. I think it's just like the only difference is, you know, sort of like the approach, the intention, you know, sort of the like impetus behind it. Um, you know, sort of like, I imagine an actual astrologer would be like, all right, you know, Sagittarius go brain or, you know, or, or they'll have some like ideas based on
00:41:20
Speaker
I don't know, I actually don't know anything about astrology, so I don't know.
00:41:25
Speaker
I purposely I don't want to sell in my mind with actual knowledge. So I do have some astrology books that I've picked up along the way from like use bookstores just because I think they're interesting and and a few other reasons. There's like some peripheral astrology research I want to do but not about the actual signs themselves.
00:41:52
Speaker
But yeah, so I don't know, I imagine that astrologers, they do some research about what the stars are doing, and then for the nitty-gritty of the sign, they let, you know, get meditative, let the ideas flow to them. Anyway, it's very similar to that for the vast majority of them.
00:42:18
Speaker
Just like get quiet, let some ideas come and try, you know, if I like panic and try to force it, it's gonna go wrong. It's not gonna be good, but if I'm like calm and I just like trust that something will come, it's a lot about that trust and it's a lot about being calm, being loose to goosey.
00:42:42
Speaker
and trusting, which is scary. Scary to, you know, sometimes when it's like, you know, I post them on Monday and sometimes it's the weekend and I'm like, oh crap, oh no. Uh oh. You know, like being loose and trying to be like chill then is not always easy. Yeah, that trust is definitely hard to come by.
00:43:11
Speaker
good for you for coming up with that routine and just channeling your creativity and like learning to trust. I mean, obviously, I'm sure it's not like always easy, but yeah. Yeah, and sometimes I'm like, not able to and that's when I go to the well of the notes app and like, yeah, the other ones like I try not to use those in less like that's kind of the like,
00:43:36
Speaker
emergency parachute, you know, like, right up one, that's the one you use, like when the other one doesn't open. But yeah, yeah, usually, usually, the trusting works, usually, um, flow, meditative, relaxing, usually they come. Yeah, days that doesn't happen.
00:44:03
Speaker
And that's when you have a backup. Oh, so good. What would you tell creatives who think that their work is too out there to appeal to people?
Embracing Niche Art in Modern Era
00:44:19
Speaker
Oh, that's such a good question. Because I think we're actually in like the absolute best time for people who make work that is
00:44:33
Speaker
out there and weird and niche like I think if you are making work that is really really weird or out there or strange like I think now is like I think we're really lucky right now um because I think even like
00:44:56
Speaker
you know, even 20 years ago, I think there was a lot of pressure to sort of appeal to everyone with your work. But I think right now, like, you don't need to appeal to everyone. You don't need, you don't need everyone to be your fan. Like all you really need is a very small group of people who dig your work
00:45:25
Speaker
and who occasionally buy it and you can make a living from it. You know, it doesn't take, you don't need like two bazillion followers to make a living from your work anymore, you know, or really it's not even about that. Maybe all you want is to just like put it out there.
00:45:46
Speaker
for fun. That's also just fine. I think we live in an amazing time for work that is out there. There are so many weirdos waiting to accept you and who aren't just waiting to accept you, but are waiting to feel accepted by you, to feel the acceptance
00:46:10
Speaker
that they're going to feel by seeing your work. Your work is going to make them feel accepted and they're going to make them feel seen because of what you're saying. Your work might be so out there and so weird and so ridiculous and so silly that
00:46:33
Speaker
you know, someone is going to be like, oh wow, I thought it was just me that felt this, but oh my gosh, it's this oddball too. It's this absolute weirdo as well. And I think that's, that's definitely something I found in horror scoops. You know, a lot of the people who are the biggest fans of it are people who are like,
00:46:57
Speaker
Oh, this is like the way I think. This is like, this is like me. This is like me and my friends. And it's the people who send their horror scoops to, you know, all their friends every Monday. And that's the people who, you know, think the same way and who are big weirdos too and who are big goofballs and, you know, just
00:47:26
Speaker
are probably very similar to me and we'd probably be pals and hang out if we'd ever met because they're the same way and are probably like big loser nerds. We're probably very similar types of people and that's the power of art is that it connects us.
00:47:48
Speaker
and makes us feel seen. It builds a little bridge between something I felt and something you felt. And when you put it out there, you're putting this little bridge, this little invitation out there. And so I think it's such a great time to be making work that's out there. So yeah, go for it.
00:48:17
Speaker
Absolutely. Yeah, I think also people are so tired of the curated, perfect imagery of what things are supposed to be. Because how many people actually fit into those categories? Zero. Nobody fits into those categories, even the people who are saying that they fit into those categories. We are all weird little animals.
00:48:46
Speaker
And, you know, the more you can like show your weird little animal self to other people, like the more you'll connect on that. Like, oh, thank God. I thought I was like in this human suit and I had to act a certain way. But like you're showing me that I don't have to act like this and like, oh, thank God. Yeah. Yeah. It's like such a relief. Second, someone like gives you permission. Sorry, I just burped into the microphone.
00:49:11
Speaker
Hopefully that didn't get caught. But yeah, like, like, yeah, you're just like giving them permission and and like a beautiful like invitation to be weird and to be
00:49:25
Speaker
Yeah, not the normal thing that has probably like been killing them and been like painful to be and like been like a horrible pressure in their lives to be like any sort of wonderful invitation to like jump ship out of that like painful existence. Oh my god, beautiful thing. Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
00:49:53
Speaker
I want to see the imaginary art we're talking about.
00:49:57
Speaker
out there people. Oh my god. Sounds great. All the way. I've since delving into like just ugly art and like searching for ugly art out in the world. I have found some incredible things like Hani is an artist in Australia who made this gigantic Kim Kardashian sculpture like humongous and like it's
00:50:25
Speaker
her giant ass and then there's like a place where you can put your head like between her cheeks and like it shows you a video of like all this like social media stuff it's like a huge commentary but like it's like the funniest thing and i love it so i want i want i want to end i want to i'll send it to you it's great
00:50:52
Speaker
That sounds so good. Okay, so we're wrapping
Growth Through Perseverance
00:50:58
Speaker
up. At the end of every episode, I like to ask if there's anything ugly that you've made this week or recently. Obviously doesn't have to specifically be ugly. It could just be something that you let go of the outcome while making it. Sounds like you do that frequently with horror scoops. So maybe something outside of that. Yeah, anything ugly you've made.
00:51:20
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, I made a painting recently, like one of my portraits with text on it. I actually like found one that I had made and I had, I really liked the text on it, but the portrait just, oh gosh, it just didn't work out. It just looked really, really, really bad. The face looked just,
00:51:48
Speaker
I don't know, she looked too, like, cutesy and, like, I wanted her to look cool, you know? Like, I wanted her to look, I don't know, a certain way and she just didn't. But, you know, like, and I used to, like, think I just had to paint everything, like, one time. Like, I had, like, one shot to, like, make a painting. But then I just, I just redid it. I just did it over again. Like, I don't know why I thought, like,
00:52:14
Speaker
every painting had one energy to it. I just had to have one go at it. It only had this one life force and I just had to do it and that was it. I realized that this weird misconception I had, yeah, I was just wrong. I could just redo it. I could just make this version of that painting.
00:52:40
Speaker
Oh, yeah, exactly. I think so many writers to think that I mean, painters and other kinds of artists, but like writers think like, especially first time writers, I have to write a book like and writing a book is the thing. And they don't really think about the fact that like, you're gonna write so many drafts of the same book.
00:53:00
Speaker
And it's just like, it's not just one shot. You get to like redo it and edit it and revise it. And it's like this whole long process. Like you get to redo it as many times as you think it's ready. Like you can just, if you've made something bad, you can just.
00:53:15
Speaker
take the part that's good, like the text I wrote was good. There was one salvageable thing in this painting. Just throw out the ugly part. And then just make a new one. And the new one was fine. It was a good painting. It went from a C- to an A-.
00:53:39
Speaker
It wasn't great. It wasn't ranking any records, any new ground, but it was fine. It was good. Yeah. Amazing. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you so much for having me. This was really fun. I laughed very hard. I'm gonna go have some Metamucil now. Just really craving it after that conversation. Yeah, I don't know why.
00:54:08
Speaker
Um, is there anything you want to announce, anything coming up or any, anywhere people should go to support you? Um, people can follow me on Instagram at Heather Buchanan, uh, E G A T H E R B U C H A N A N or at horror scoops, horror dot scoops. Um, and yeah, that's, that's pretty much it. You know, um, someday going to have the confidence to have a short story somewhere. That's true.
00:54:38
Speaker
Who knows? It could happen. We will see. Or I'll eat my own spleen. One of the two things. Well, let's hope for the former. Thank you so much. And thank you everybody for listening. Keep it ugly, everybody.
00:55:01
Speaker
The Ugly podcast is created by me, Lauren Alexander of Scribe and Sunshine. It is produced and sort of edited, also by me, and written and directed by absolutely nobody. If you like the podcast, be sure to rate and leave a review on your preferred platform and share with the creative people in your life. If you're interested in learning more about what I do, head to scribeandsunshine.com to learn more about my Ugly Art 101 course, my perfectionism workshop, my editing services, and The Writer's Home, which is an online community for writers, co-captain by myself and Gabby Goodlow. As always, keep it ugly.