Introduction and Late Night Recording
00:00:13
DailySaintsPod
Hello and welcome back to the Daily Saints pod. My name is Greg and as you can tell, voice a little worse aware. And Zach, my friend, just a low-key Tuesday night.
00:00:26
DailySaintsPod
Yeah, feeling good?
00:00:27
Zak
Yeah, nothing too crazy. No stress levels through the roof. You say it's Tuesday night, it's now Wednesday morning.
00:00:37
DailySaintsPod
Yeah, valid.
00:00:37
Zak
We're recording this very much in the early hours. Yeah, what a what bizarre mixed emotion tie, right?
Fan Incident Reactions
00:00:48
Zak
Like Middlesbrough... i such a I have so many mixed emotions. like I feel bad for them. of There's a lot of things that I feel.
00:00:59
Zak
i feel like the the the scenes of if the scenes of us pelting their bus are like, you know, so some people say it's glass bottles, some people say it's used pyros, it's tin pot either way.
00:01:12
Zak
like it just It's just thuggery at the end of the day.
00:01:17
DailySaintsPod
Look, I think that there are there are sections of both fanbases that have not covered themselves in glory in the last few days.
00:01:26
Zak
No. it's it's It's been...
00:01:27
DailySaintsPod
Let's start with that.
00:01:28
Zak
i'm not going to it's been horrible. Like, it's really weird that we've gone from... almost being like a nice little, it was you know, nice little kind of team that other people were aware of, right? Like the wins over Arsenal or things like that. Everyone being like, oh, i don't mind Southampton. And now i'm I'm seeing us be accused of like, we spent the whole season cheating.
00:01:50
Zak
We're a scummy club. We've always been horrible. We're in the same sort of bracket as, and it's just so sort of
Media Judgment and Social Media's Role
00:01:58
Zak
bizarre to have this happen over the space of like three days.
00:01:58
DailySaintsPod
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:02:01
Zak
And I never really thought much about like trial by social media before. And honestly, it's wild. Like the things that people do to sell papers and like, you've got our BBC correspondence being like, oh, congratulations.
00:02:14
Zak
This is incredible. We made it to Wembley again. this is what it means, cetera, et cetera. And then you've got like BBC Teesside talking about, well, we've lost the game. What about throwing them out of the playoffs? And it's just like, the whole thing is just bizarre.
00:02:27
DailySaintsPod
it's It's ridiculous. And oh if there was... and Let's be honest. If there was any thought or prospect of kicking us out of the playoffs, then they wouldn't have played these two games because what's the point?
00:02:40
Zak
Yeah, this is this is also, but then also you could say the same about Afkord with Senegal Baraka, right?
00:02:41
DailySaintsPod
But... but let but But... sir Bringing it to the game, mate, it did add a bit of needle, didn't it? There were some fiery moments from both sides and...
00:02:53
Zak
Yeah, and like on that, it's just...
00:02:55
DailySaintsPod
I think if you're a neutral watching it, it was probably and a fantastic watch start to finish. As a Saints fan, I can't say that I actively enjoyed much of it.
00:03:08
Zak
i I don't think I enjoyed most of that game. yeah the you know I'll shout out to Ross Stewart for being absolutely plagued with injuries and managing to you know score a crucial goal again.
00:03:22
Zak
and really, really put in a performance. Same with Kyle Lahren when he got on the pitch, just brought the energy that we needed to get us through to the end.
Player Performances and Praise
00:03:31
Zak
Shea Charles went man of the match for scoring his, what, like fourth most like ridiculous, crucial goal, goal against Arsenal.
00:03:39
DailySaintsPod
It was a cross, by the way.
00:03:41
Zak
Yeah. Oh yeah, obviously the goal.
00:03:44
Zak
I said, I said goal, not shot. Yeah.
00:03:48
Zak
You've got the the four three game against Leicester, the outstanding goal against Oxford. Yeah, just crucial moments all season and an all-round good guy who you know gave his all for for Sheffield Wednesday when he played for them, is extremely well-liked there. His brother still plays for them. And for him to come back off loan this season and just be an instrumental part of our midfield Yander picking pockets for days absolutely outstanding game
00:04:22
Zak
Sienza, players, player of the season, fans, player of the season, seemingly played most of that game with a completely bum knee. I don't understand how he managed to find it in him to get through it.
00:04:36
Zak
Peretz doing Peretz things, but that also includes what can only describe as the most outrageous running out and kicking the ball during a crucial time of the game that, again, has only ended badly for him like once this season, but...
00:04:46
DailySaintsPod
this thing slight Slight moment of panic, but turned out to be an excellent pass.
00:04:54
Zak
Adozi being great when he got on and playing really, really well.
00:04:57
DailySaintsPod
Until he broke his shoulder.
00:04:57
Zak
And I hope he's all right. Is that what it was confirmed?
00:05:02
DailySaintsPod
I mean, no, but from from pitch side, mate.
00:05:03
Zak
i mean, when he came off, that he was holding it up. I couldn't tell if he was dislocated or what. It was nuts.
00:05:09
DailySaintsPod
Yeah, it looked immediately like to me, like as someone who has spent a lot of time putting their shoulder back in the socket, it looked to me like he dislocated his shoulder pretty bad. It was dangling.
00:05:20
Zak
Oh, that's grim. James Bree, who I still don't quite understand why we sent him on loan. and he's He's been outstanding.
00:05:29
DailySaintsPod
Honestly, it's got to go down as one of the worst decisions.
00:05:33
DailySaintsPod
I mean, we'll talk about it, I'm sure, at length in our like post-season reviews.
00:05:37
DailySaintsPod
But yeah, just in such a crucial part since we came back and was just immense today.
00:05:45
Zak
Manning, who's just played every minute of every game.
00:05:50
DailySaintsPod
just Just all of them, mate.
00:05:51
DailySaintsPod
The whole team.
00:05:52
Zak
like i do i like like I don't know. It's going to be an elephant in the room. I don't know if it's got legs. If what Taylor Harbour-Bellis said is true...
00:06:03
Zak
it's a ban as far as I'm concerned and there's no place for it. I don't know, like at the end of the day, none of us were the pitch. None of us know what was said. None of us know, but, but where I'm at is to remove any of that kind of, I don't want to just make assumptions, but if that is true, I want people to know that the moral standpoint that I'm on is that that is a ban and not okay.
00:06:14
DailySaintsPod
It's also... Yeah. in an no
00:06:24
DailySaintsPod
No, I agree.
00:06:24
DailySaintsPod
But look, it's it's a noisy, fired up stadium and things could be said in the heat of the moment that could be construed as worse than they were intended, right?
00:06:35
DailySaintsPod
Like it it depends exactly on what was said. It
00:06:41
Zak
we we might have just differing opinions on that and that's fine but i wanted to at least say my piece because i can't sit here in good conscience and talk about that game and not address at least that thing the ball boy thing i will address if stevens had a ball was trying to hand it to them and they tried to wrestle it off the ball boy.
00:06:41
DailySaintsPod
it might not have been bad.
Playoff Controversies and Fair Play
00:06:59
DailySaintsPod
just baffling.
00:07:00
Zak
ball puts me in 10 points.
00:07:01
Zak
But the idea that that has somehow tainted the club, like, is this ridiculous? Like, it's a ball boy. It's not like he was given a directive. It's not like he believes in that kind of stuff.
00:07:10
DailySaintsPod
Also, Stephens was stood right there with a ball trying to throw it to them, and they were just...
00:07:13
Zak
that that's That's just ridiculous. And I'm sorry, I won't. that That's where I'm like, well, that's indicative of their character. That's one of the things that I'll be like, nah.
00:07:21
DailySaintsPod
Well, look thats here's here's the thing, right? Obviously, you know, being as switched on and or trying to be as switched on to the club as we are to do this show, we've, you know, opened ourselves to a lot of the discourse in the last few days and maybe more...
00:07:37
DailySaintsPod
subject to it than the standard. But for for for a fan base that's gone out and made it very clear that Saints are cheaters and should be kicked out, they spent a lot of that game throwing themselves on the floor diving, time wasting, sitting down to this specifically because they wanted to have a little team regroup and kill the momentum of the game and not because someone was hurt. So...
00:08:05
DailySaintsPod
I just, it baffles me, mate. I mean, Luke Ayling, regardless of what happened with Harwood Bellis, shouldn't have been on the pitch.
00:08:13
Zak
yeah when you uh the The other, like, obviously we're slightly guilty about that. Sienza goes down soft, but at the same time, I think that Sienza went down because he he had contact, right?
00:08:24
Zak
And because he goes down so often like that, they thought it was put on.
00:08:28
Zak
Correct one was a joke. That is, like, that's the... so that's the that's's That's about the third or set fourth time he's done that this season where he's gone down, and that was a bit silly.
00:08:36
Zak
But again, like, I think as you pointed out, like, the... I think the tensions and the emotions of this game have been... obvious to see around the entirety of the footballing world. And there has never been as much scrutiny and eyes on a semi-playoff final. it's fantastic for all the journos, the needless media. and honestly, like everybody that i guess just wants a scrap and wants an argument. but And I think like 90% of reasonable fans on both sides are kind of like, uh...
00:09:04
Zak
And ultimately, like, you know, I feel like Borough will feel like they were hard done by, but they were two incredible games. That was like the most tense, the toughest fought battle we've had this season. Bear in mind, like we played Arsenal.
00:09:15
Zak
We played a semi-final city.
00:09:16
DailySaintsPod
Yeah. Yeah, look, i tried tried after the game to to do what I tried to do before I come onto the show and like...
00:09:17
Zak
I still think it's harder game.
00:09:25
DailySaintsPod
step back and assess the game trying to take the emotions out of it, right? Because when I'm watching the game live, I feel it with every inch and of my being. But i tried to take a step back and I thought about it.
00:09:36
DailySaintsPod
I'm like, if you were a neutral tuning in to watch the game, what better advert for the special entertainment that the championship brings could you have?
00:09:49
DailySaintsPod
Because it was such a tough... what it It was a battle that...
00:09:52
Zak
she's not That was just the battle.
00:09:54
Zak
That entire game was a battle.
00:09:54
DailySaintsPod
It was the battle that you would expect from two teams that after 46 games were only separated by one goal of goal difference, right? it was And
Game Analysis and Emotional Investment
00:10:04
DailySaintsPod
it was a similar story to to the first leg in that Borough started very well and very fast.
00:10:11
DailySaintsPod
And for most of the first...
00:10:11
Zak
They got their goat this time around as well.
00:10:13
DailySaintsPod
for most of the first half, we we struggled to get a look in. It was it was a you know a bit more open than at Middlesbrough, at least, but they got their goal and and just seemed to be the better side for for a majority of that first half. And then i thought Ross Stewart had scored and somehow it went wide. I was off my feet by the point it had gone past the goal because I had assumed it was in. Just crazy. And then we score a scrappy goal from a corner, but you take them wherever you can get them. And and at that point, you know, the atmosphere was nervy for sure because the stakes are so high, but there was still genuine belief. like Oh yeah, they were just doing Saints things. We had to make it difficult and go a goal behind. Now we're just going to go on and get the winner.
00:11:03
Zak
No, no, no. I'm sorry. I'm not having you rewrite this narrative because i've reposted the I've already posted a tweet out of you saying, oh, I think that it's going to go to penalties because your your sister-in-law managed to get in your ear and convince you it's going to go penalties.
00:11:20
Zak
And then I remember you said, I feel it my gut.
00:11:22
Zak
And I'm like, mate, in the nicest possible way, the entirety of the season, you felt many things and none of them have ended up being right.
00:11:27
DailySaintsPod
Never been right. No.
00:11:29
Zak
Yeah. I had the belief that ironically you have instilled in me throughout the entirety of the season that we would just get it done I didn't think it would come from a misplaced cross that ended up in the goal like I didn't see that
00:11:43
DailySaintsPod
i would argue that I would argue that it was a perfectly placed cross. Yeah.
00:11:49
Zak
Okay. And I guess that's also accurate.
00:11:51
Zak
If it bounces it to the goal, what more can you say? Right? Like, yeah, that no that's the thing.
00:11:57
Zak
I know that, yeah, you're right. there's There's the belief, but I know that as soon as we started to get to that extra time, there was a different feeling and that's fine because again, we feel things very differently.
00:12:09
Zak
I also can get very, very heated in moments where you're like, nah, mate, that's not a foul. Never usually the other way. It's usually me that gets those calls wrong because I get, you know, I write and before I know it, my blood pressure's at 1,000...
00:12:21
DailySaintsPod
Yeah. It's my standard approach, mate. You shout first and then you assess it and go, no, he's got bad stuff there.
00:12:29
Zak
Yeah, but where whereas I will still take too long to assess it because I'm too busy shouting.
00:12:34
Zak
But yeah, exactly that. But it ended up you know being a being different. And that has got to be heartbreaking, especially towards the end where, you know, you're right.
00:12:44
Zak
Clearly, they were playing for pens. I think the ref was okay for some of the game. And then I think he kind of tailed off. There's been a lot of criticism thrown at him because he's usually a prem ref.
00:12:54
Zak
And basically, it's an example of how the world has gone soft without VAR. there's been arguments that Stuart Skoll shouldn't have stood because there was potentially a foul in the box.
00:13:04
Zak
Once again, we point you back to our entire coverage of what our opinion of VAR has been the entirety of this season, which is okay. But at the same time, when you rule out moments like this, you have what's happened with West Ham and Arsenal, where if West Ham go down because of potentially a a silly VAR call and Arsenal win the league, all down to a moment,
00:13:24
Zak
That's even more nuts. But the other things that, you know, I would like to point out, and, you know, this is one of the things where remove Spygate from it, ultimately, Middlesbrough was second, then ended up fifth.
00:13:35
Zak
That is what put them in this position. we were 21st and have managed to make it to the playoffs, which we didn't think would happen in a million years. Now, again, the unsupported accusations that apparently we have our own version of MI5 that has managed to get us there and not the 11 players on the pitch giving it their all.
00:13:55
Zak
The biggest difference tonight is one of the things that you pointed out most of our coverage last season, which is a height difference and a physicality difference that we never had previously and a fitness difference.
00:14:05
DailySaintsPod
Just the fitness. Yeah, they...
00:14:06
Zak
The levels fitness that you pointed out the entirety of last season that was a problem with a vast majority of the squad, which is why we'd only be good for spells of 60 minutes and then everyone everyone would huff and puff and have to be sub-mouth in comparison to Ryan Manning just running for 120 minutes without really much of an issue.
00:14:22
Zak
is is I think the biggest difference because they they went balls to the wall for 30 minutes and they ran out of gas, which is what they did that first half. And obviously once they got that goal, they kind of hoped that they would be able to see it out. And they did. They withstood a lot of pressure. And obviously after our equaliser, they then withstood, like they didn't have a shot after the 63rd minute until late into extra time. that That's how much pressure they withstood. and When it comes to a game of football and you know championship playoffs, as you pointed out, it's like the perfect the advert for it.
00:14:55
Zak
And obviously, for for the neutral, you've got like the added spice of us being villains and this the other. And the whole Spygate thing is, to be honest, either galvanized all the fans or ruined it for a little bit.
00:15:07
Zak
I actually think that me and you are slightly on opposing side to it, because I think that, for me, it's ruined it a little bit.
00:15:13
Zak
And maybe that's because I'm just soft as a human being. And for you, I think it's galvanized, where... You know, one of our clips that's had the most vitriol is you talking about how you're like, yeah, but you know, we've taken it in our funny way of comedy and then you've got people dressed spies and that's one way of taking it.
00:15:29
Zak
And then there's me, which as a bit of a soft person in general, I'm like, oh, kind of think it's a bit all all a bit gross.
00:15:36
Zak
But either way, like the...
00:15:36
DailySaintsPod
No, I think it is gross. And I think that it definitely, i think that you felt the difference today because, you know, it was not a West Brom atmosphere, the same as the last playoff semifinal.
00:15:50
DailySaintsPod
There was there was tension and there were nerves. And i think that a large part of that is down to the fact that you know, this image has been cast upon us, but at the same time, you've got
Spygate Impact on Reputation and Fans
00:16:04
DailySaintsPod
more intimate than nobody.
00:16:04
Zak
what can you do about it? We can't remove it.
00:16:06
DailySaintsPod
That's what it is. Yeah.
00:16:07
Zak
There's not going to be a fan petition to throw ourselves out, is there? This is the bad thing about It's like, what do you want? And it's like, you're seeing crazy ends of the spectrum being like, fine's not enough and they should just liquidate the club.
00:16:21
Zak
And you're like, what heck have we done? We just support the team. We've never had so many eyes on a podcast before where we just talk about Saints. Most people don't We haven't known we've existed. We've got a really, really, we really appreciate it.
00:16:33
Zak
We've loyal fan base who've been through us since the Prem, since we were part of a completely different network. And we've all felt the ups and downs of being a Saints fan. Last season, we had some horrific, we had some horrible, horrible official decisions go against us, right?
00:16:49
Zak
I still can't get over that goal of Wolves being ruled out because Adam Armstrong might have had the ability to shoot against them, right?
00:16:56
Zak
But yeah, like this game has had a completely different narrative and people have, I guess, had to kind of take it and absorb it in in their own way. And this is down to some stupid decision that's been made at some stupid place. And ultimately, as you so as you pointed out, the zeitgeist will move on, there'll be another thing. Maybe it's Spurs getting relegated. Right. A lot of people can dream. Maybe it's Arsenal winning the league and becoming completely... And now I think that we have some sort of rivalry with Middlesbrough maybe forever. That's probably never going away.
00:17:32
Zak
It is what it is. And it's just a...
00:17:34
DailySaintsPod
That's fine, mate. It's all part and parcel of
00:17:36
Zak
But like when you look at the game and if you remove all of that away, what
Emotional Ties to Football
00:17:40
Zak
that was like that is, for me, an advert of what is absolutely incredible about football. like What a battle.
00:17:46
Zak
And again, like the fact that we can go through all of the individual performances. and like you know I tried to explain for years to to to my wife like why... what it means and how, how important it is and why it's so important. And like you, you watch that and it's, it's like, I can't explain why i feel sick to my stomach and how I even text you that if it went to pens, I probably wasn't, you know, was going to close my eyes for the whole of that thing. Right. Cause like, I can't deal with that.
00:18:13
DailySaintsPod
I said, had wonderful conversation with my daughter who, on the way out of the stadium, who was of course absolutely buzzing. And I was just like, look, if you could bottle this feeling and sell it, you'd be a millionaire.
00:18:27
DailySaintsPod
Because at the end of the it's what it's all about.
00:18:29
DailySaintsPod
And it's one of the things, if you don't get it and do you don't understand it and haven't experienced it, it's not something you can explain. But it's just, it moves you and it makes you feel...
00:18:43
DailySaintsPod
I'm going to drag us towards wrapping up, mate, because the time my alarm is set for is rapidly approaching. but i want but We're to touch on the actual game and talk about it properly tomorrow.
00:18:52
Zak
No, again, this is this is our...
00:18:59
DailySaintsPod
but I want to, I've got three things I've seen since we've come on the air that I want to to to point out before we go.
00:19:07
DailySaintsPod
i did see that apparently Harba Belis and Ayling did make up on the pitch later in the game. whilst Adozi was being treated, apparently exchanging a hug and a handshake.
00:19:17
DailySaintsPod
So, you know, hopefully that is what it is and that's that'll be the end of it, right?
00:19:22
DailySaintsPod
Call-aheads prevail eventually. i mean, let's be honest, knowing Luke Ayling, equally as likely to have given it at some point as good as he got, right?
00:19:33
Zak
I think this is what I mean, like with the vitriol spilling over, like but by the sounds of it, the players weren't like, obviously, middle school players would have been more, more sort of involved in it, but we, our players didn't have been involved in this up until this point, you know, they probably found out when we did, you know, like through the media.
00:19:51
Zak
So yeah, that's hopefully that, that kind of puts it to bed anyway.
00:19:56
DailySaintsPod
yeah The second thing i want to point out is this set of stats I've just seen for Kasper Yander from this game. 72 out of 79 passes complete.
00:20:10
DailySaintsPod
So like a 90-something percent pass accuracy. Two key passes, 8 of 9 tackles 10 ground duels won and three interceptions.
00:20:22
DailySaintsPod
One, of course, being the the big interception that nearly led to all led to the very big save from Laren's opportunity, right?
00:20:31
DailySaintsPod
So it's just unbelievable.
00:20:35
DailySaintsPod
And the third and final thing I want to shout out before leave is Kyle Laren on Instagram, who's just shared the picture of Shea Charles after scoring against Arsenal.
00:20:47
DailySaintsPod
Which is just fantastic. Perfect reaction.
Season Highlights and Perseverance
00:20:54
Zak
If you remove one of the noise and you look over the entirety of the season, like... incredible, genuinely. like The players have stepped up, and regardless of what happens at Wembley.
00:21:06
Zak
Because, you know, Harland are going to be a pushover, right? like weve we They did the double over us this season, it's going to be easy.
00:21:13
Zak
But you look at what these these players have done and the difference that Eckert has made,
00:21:13
DailySaintsPod
Tough game.
00:21:20
Zak
But specifically, you know, how even poor Azaz started the season barely getting a start, right? After after we brought him in and, you know, for him to play as the most hated player over two legs and, you know, put in some... I think he struggled a little bit towards the end there, but, you know, he still managed to make some so so
00:21:43
DailySaintsPod
I wanted him to score so badly.
00:21:44
Zak
key I think everyone did, to be honest, mate.
00:21:47
Zak
But, like, he made them some key parts of that game.
00:21:47
DailySaintsPod
It would have been the perfect poetic moment, but yeah.
00:21:51
Zak
But, yeah, it's just, you know, everything. And it will be it will be what it will be come around the next game.
Wembley Excitement and Team Spirit
00:21:57
DailySaintsPod
It will be what will because we are going to Wembley.
00:21:57
Zak
And it's just... Hey, hi, Keisarasa, mate.
00:22:02
DailySaintsPod
That's what they say, mate. Right, let's call it there and wrap it up. Like i say, we will be back tomorrow on a bit more sleep to talk in depth with our proper match review where we can talk about lineups and chances and stats and and all the good stuff.
00:22:19
DailySaintsPod
But until then, look let us know how you are feeling after that because... I mean, even after wrapping this up, mate, the chances of me coming down enough to go to sleep are not looking good, are they?
00:22:31
Zak
There's going to be adrenaline for a while for both of us, right? That's the thing. It's it's kind of crazy. it's it's It's mad. and
00:22:40
Zak
What time to be a Saints fan? We kept saying it. Now it has a bit more pizzazz to it. But what time to be a Saints fan?
00:22:48
DailySaintsPod
Absolutely. And look, seeing the team celebrating together in front of the fans tonight, and all of them coming up together to do the the cheers that they do with the fans.
00:22:58
DailySaintsPod
Just just just exactly the moment joy we needed.
00:22:59
Zak
But after last season, it's it's nice to have it
00:23:05
DailySaintsPod
And look, now we we get to plan another trip to Wembley and go from there. But look, that's it. Until tomorrow, everyone, have a wonderful day.
00:23:18
DailySaintsPod
Try and not feed off the adrenaline too much. Try and rest up a bit. We've got, we've got we got what, nine days to to get ready? Something like that.
00:23:29
DailySaintsPod
more. I don't know. It's coming up fast, so let's get to it. But until then, everyone, have a wonderful day, and we'll see you then.