Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Episode 37 - Part 2: Applications of Charging Concrete with Mauricio Esguerra from Magment
49 Plays1 year ago
In this episode, Mauricio from Magment explores the applications of charging concrete in various environments, including warehouses, roads, and docks.
Key points discussed include the potential for wireless charging to decarbonize mobility, the broader use of wireless technology beyond vehicles, the challenges and opportunities in market adoption, specific applications such as electric buses in South America, and the cost implications and ROI for installing charging concrete in warehouses.
00:00 Introduction to Charging Concrete Applications
00:42 Future of Mobility and Wireless Charging
03:18 Transformers and Broader Applications
05:32 Trials and Results
07:39 Limitations and Market Adoption
13:23 Global Interest and Adoption
17:04 Cost and Return on Investment
20:34 Conclusion and Contact Information
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Charging Concrete with Mauricio
00:00:00
Speaker
For part two ah with Mauricio from Magment, we're looking at applications of charging concrete in the built environment. So we've covered in part one sort of um how how concrete can be used to charge vehicles. Now we're going to look at applications.
Key Application Areas: Warehouses, Roads, and Docks
00:00:13
Speaker
I believe if if I'm not wrong, there's sort of three main types. So ah warehouse applications, which we sort of touched on um roads and and docks. and I'm guessing from what you said in part one, warehouse warehouses are the,
00:00:27
Speaker
the big driver at the moment in terms of the number of vehicles that are suited to it in the and that environment.
Decarbonizing Mobility with EVs
00:00:34
Speaker
ah are there other um but but yeah i suppose What do you see as the future potentially of of um application?
00:00:41
Speaker
yeah okay Of course, I tried to draw a picture so that we we see this. As debatable as it may be, ah mobility is getting decarbonized and electric more and more and more. I mean, you may find still ah some exceptions being being still on combustion or on hydrogen, but those are are going to be the exceptions. So it's quite clear that the the mobility is going into this direction.
The Rise of Wireless Charging
00:01:17
Speaker
So the applications we see here is because
00:01:22
Speaker
oh all around our technology is about transmission of energy. So we need we need to think a bit, ah at a lot or let's say we need to see a larger picture. It's not just as well as charging, which would be the, or will become certainly the preferred way to charge vehicles. And our conviction about this is coming from the fact that Everything at the end of the day becomes wireless. If you should take a normal phone like this one, it's wireless. Our mobile phones are wireless. Our computers are wireless. Everything. you know it's It's a normal trend in in industry and in applications to go this this way. so but Because that doesn't happen overnight, we need we need to go in in steps, showing the benefits ah because ah
00:02:22
Speaker
When you see especially wireless charging in motion, it's the type of of charging where people just don't notice that they are charging.
Charging Vehicles On the Move
00:02:33
Speaker
They're just driving. They're just moving goods. They are moving people, whatever, you know. Kind of think of the bus, for example. It's a very good case for wireless charging. And then the charging happens.
00:02:46
Speaker
Either I'm taking the example of the bus while the bus is moving or even when the bus is stopping at the bus stop just to get on led passengers and during this time, this half a minute or whatever time, it can't charge. So those are the things that we envision.
00:03:08
Speaker
ah as a way to transmit or even to distribute power through this wireless charge.
Role of Transformers in Energy Transmission
00:03:17
Speaker
And interesting enough, and let me mention this as a very new and special type of obligation we are developing currently, which is also ah transformers.
00:03:31
Speaker
Because you need to think about when you generate these days electricity more and more on a renewable way, take wind energy. So you need to bring this wind energy with high voltage transmission lines. You need to bring them to the to the urban centers and you need to transform it down to lower and lower voltages, right? That's how it's been done. So you need transformers all that way. And our technology is also fantastic for transformers. In our words, we are not linked
00:04:04
Speaker
exclusively to charging vehicles wirelessly, we also are part of the infrastructure of the grids to bring the energy to the vehicles or to the homes or to whatever.
Electrification with Recycled Magnetic Materials
00:04:18
Speaker
And I think at the end of the day, with this broader picture of applications, what we see is our world is becoming more and more electric.
00:04:29
Speaker
oh Even heating is becoming electric. yeah Everything just is less and less combustion and more and more electric. So the function of our our magnetic materials is to support this growth of electrification of our world, in in a sense. So we are happy to be part of this, um given the fact that this is very affordable materials, very easy to manufacture,
00:05:02
Speaker
you can get all these raw materials, all these recycled raw materials all around the world. There's no limitations to that. So that we can, you know, with this technology, which is going back tool there to the very an easy way of making a concrete, but now with a magnetic and electric function. So that's where we see that our application base will naturally grow into these different durations I just explained before.
Results from Indiana Wireless Charging Trials
00:05:31
Speaker
Definitely. And from from the, um well I read that you've obviously done some trials so far. Are there sort of interesting results that have come out of those so far in terms of, because I believe you ah you're sort of doing an an Indiana trial, for example, or are there they're better results than you expected in terms of how it's been implemented in different situations? Well, um I'm not sure I got your your question here, but I mean, it's it's within all this transition we are all experiencing, right? Within this, there is a lot of there is a lot of ah different ways also to, for example, generate energy, and but still you need to transmit it and distribute it, right? So I think that's kind of of the thought that we need to have. it's not
00:06:27
Speaker
just thinking about, ah I don't know what you have in the in the North Sea, as I say, offshore wind energy generation. You also have photovoltaic on your roof, on your home, right? And so everything needs to, at the end of the day, be be brought to the devices, which are quite different ones, but more and more also the the cars themselves or the the devices, whatever those are,
00:06:57
Speaker
that need to be fed with power. So I don't know if if if if your question was pointing into this direction, but it's it's really um the basic idea of of you need to bring energy ah to different to different to different devices to be able to fulfill certain functions. And and yeah let me stress this. Charging is not a goal in itself. Charging is a condition. If you cannot charge,
00:07:25
Speaker
your phone, you cannot use it. but yeah look at char a video can of do and so So what we are trying to solve is how things are being charged and how the energy gets there in in in in in an option. Interesting.
Limitations of Wireless Charging Technology
00:07:39
Speaker
I suppose from from from the work you've been doing, are there and their limitations to the this technology in terms of when it can be applied? Or has it is it quite is it quite got quite a wide number of uses?
00:07:54
Speaker
I would say there's two sorts of limitations, if you wish. And there there are some, of course. ah One ah kind would be the more technical type of limitations. I would i would say currently um one could be a certain amount of power. you know that i mean There is a limitation, but it's not the principle or limitation of principle, it's a limitation maybe of size or of cost. So that's the technical side. The other limitations may be much more about the the commercial adoption of the solutions. And this is an interesting question because ah quite often we are engaged in discussions where people are concerned about the first type of limitations and they learn open. Those limitations are very little, like for example,
00:08:55
Speaker
One classical question we are asked often is, how about health concerns? Are there emissions, radiation, that could be a hazard to people, to human beings, and sorry to living beings like animals, whatever?
00:09:19
Speaker
So and that means the answer is no. It's a very well controlled type of transmission. There's even in some systems, ah it's mandatory to have sensors to detect the presence of living objects as they are called.
Infrastructure Challenges in Wireless Charging
00:09:38
Speaker
And that would yield if they will be too close to the magnetic fields, they would yield a shutoff of the system. So those things are really well under control. So that's not a limitation. But having said that, when it comes then more to the understanding or where does it make sense in in in commercial or economical terms. So I would say that the limitation there could be
00:10:10
Speaker
just the building up of the infrastructure. In other words, um as you can imagine these days, you are seeing ah a lot of cable or parking charging stations being deployed all around the world. you know Like ah here in Germany, you can say it's like two charging stations a day, constantly. So if you would say, well,
00:10:37
Speaker
wireless charging is more convenient, wireless charging is it's even better in many respects. How could you um change this this running deployment of of cable charging stations? So that's that's kind of kind of a challenge.
00:11:00
Speaker
to convince the responsible actors, which can be governments, can be even municipalities, can be industrial companies, had to change their their model to say, okay, we'll stop the this normal way of of charging and go to the next one. So the only way to get to this point is, of course, ah by keeping are demonstrating, keep showing the benefits, doing the benchmarks, these kind of things. But I would call this limitation a natural market limitation. Markets are not very permeable to innovations. I would regard markets even as quite conservative sometimes. But whenever things are getting so clear and so convincing,
00:11:55
Speaker
then the adoption comes, but possibly all of a sudden. Everybody's like, for example, 50 years ago, who would think that you would have internet in your pocket? yeah hu yeah Today, everybody has, you know? When did it happen? Nobody knows, it happens. We will see, at some point, we'll see something similar up to that.
00:12:23
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's going to be interesting to see how things change because because you're right. What you mentioned in part one is the the the the the adoption or the commercial limitation is ah how many vehicles, for example, would benefit from it. So in a warehouse, most vehicles are electric, therefore, you know, great adoption idea. At the moment, cars, obviously not not as many, but I can see in the future as that transitions.
00:12:46
Speaker
um that you know potentially supermarket car parks or office car parks all have these in each of the spaces so the cars can charge while they're sat there. um But um one one will influence the other at the same time because obviously the benefit as you say of having this self-charging is that cars don't need such big batteries they become cheaper um as a result therefore easier to adopt. So there's kind of yeah different factors hand in hand that will help different areas accelerate at different rates and therefore what becomes commercially um interesting or viable for
00:13:20
Speaker
for for the adoption of
Global Interest and Regional Adoption
00:13:21
Speaker
it. It's really interesting as a material. what you If you think about this, ah that they're the biggest challenge to us is to find the right places, the right regions in the world where we believe that the, let's say, that the interest and the and the and the access hu is is better. you know i I mean, you could say, like,
00:13:49
Speaker
there are places like maybe the US or maybe even China or maybe even the MRA's or you know and just mentioning kind of kind of like the conventional thinking about possibly less in in in in in <unk> etc Europe or maybe less in the UK or you know but Our experience is not like this. so We have learned that it's a matter of of keeping, of course, a high level of communication with different actors. We often find conditions in
Unexpected Adoption in Spain and South America
00:14:29
Speaker
in places where you wouldn't expect this to happen. know Let me tell you two examples which show how that is. We have found, for example, a lot of interest and a lot of eagerness to a lot of our technology in Spain.
00:14:43
Speaker
you know You wouldn't regard Spain as the first place you would like to go, but it happened there. So that's why we're very eager working in that market. um And another market where things are starting to move for buses, we found a very interesting place in South America.
00:15:04
Speaker
Well, there is a lot of electric buses in South America. I know that also right now the adoption of electric vehicles in bottom, for example, is very huge as well. South America is even larger.
00:15:15
Speaker
So the issues there is the cost of the battery and the weight of the battery is a huge problem because in some cases the weight could be so high if you need to charge those vehicles like overnight, you need big, big batteries. And those weights could become an issue for the load grain capacity of the roads, you know,
00:15:45
Speaker
they would not be even allowed to be used oh passing a certain value because it could just destroy there the roads, right? So that's where wireless charging is being considered in many cities that are starting to look into not only adoption of electric buses, but adoption of electric buses with certain characteristics.
00:16:09
Speaker
and and And so we we have found there a nice access for our technology. Yeah, I suppose the other key thing is because it's not um the vehicle has to constantly, it's not like a electric car where it has to be constantly in contact with it with electricity. You don't have to have the entire network um fully covered. You only need sort of key areas ah where it's installed. so Absolutely. That's enough in in like the most um or the areas um of the warehouse where most of the traffic is. and all it's It's like the hot areas where all the vehicles go back and forth and only a few go into aisles or into remote areas within the hole within the warehouse. So that's an easy task to find those areas and you you want to have that infrastructure only there because that reduces the cost of installation.
Cost and ROI of Wireless Charging Installations
00:17:03
Speaker
Perfect. but my My final question I think then before before we finish is around that cost part, um what does it currently look like to in terms of ah cost? um I don't know, maybe per meter. I don't know what's the good way of measuring it. but yeah I'm happy to answer that because um quite often people don't have any idea. I mean, how much could that be, right? So we we have figured out ah in ah in a warehouse you know with with the right amount of power. So for example such a such a vehicle and needs to recharge at around 10 kilowatts to have a number. So if you would install here we would um do this for around two and a half thousand euros
00:17:54
Speaker
per installed meter. So that that's the cost of the full installation. If it's of course a green field building, it's cheaper than that. If it's an existing building, when you need to have also the cutting out of the floor as part of the installation, then that's the value I just gave. So that means with that in mind, if you take for example, 20,000 square meter building, and you say, well, we need to do like,
00:18:25
Speaker
200 meters, which is about 1%. So you know, the cost of this would be about 500,000 euros. But then you can, in order to make the return on investment, you can say, well, but you are saving about a quarter of the fleet. So you don't need any more 100 vehicles, you need only 75 vehicles, because they they are not standing around charging. And then you take off half of the batteries,
00:18:55
Speaker
And then you eliminate ah also all all the the manpower, you know the the manual handling of charging. So doing all this, we've done it in ah in a a very detailed way. that I'm just trying to explain it. With a savings that justify the investment.
00:19:15
Speaker
And we see a return on investment for that capex that could go all the way to about two and a half to three years. However, um given the way that our world works these days, we are also looking into leasing, renting models, you know, we have other ways of offering this. So that, you know, some operations would like to have this more as an OPEX rather than a CAPEX. You know, those are the things that we're working right now, but we are already in the middle of commercialization, justification, return on investment, productivity, you know, that's where the technology allows you to go this far.
00:20:05
Speaker
yeah Yeah, I think it's fascinating. I think it's um yeah an interesting one, particularly for um surveyors to watch in terms of how that's going to change the built environment, how that affects valuations of of properties and um yeah use cases and all that type of stuff. so but um But in terms of use day-to-day by firms, it's you're very interesting to see how ah how that gets adopted. As you say, more and more warehouses of robots now and as well as Fortless and so on. So yeah, big opportunity. Thank you very much for coming on today. um Yeah, if anyone wants to get in touch to to learn more about your products or your service, how do they get in touch? Yes, ah thanks very much for
Connecting with Magment: Investment and Collaboration Opportunities
00:20:46
Speaker
that. So the best would be whoever is interested, just email us at info at Macment.co. Okay.
00:20:56
Speaker
That's our email address, happy to receiving all inquiries, all questions, even, and I just want to mention that if somebody feels like he would like to invest in our company, more than happy to discuss that, we have have a lot of investment ways, we have doing crowdfunding, we have doing equity funding, we are doing also business angels funding, there are different things,
00:21:25
Speaker
because ah people feel very attracted to this technology and often are often interested to participate, but also customers, of course, interested users, and even developers of product, of projects, you all construction companies. So everybody, we welcome to contact us. Last but not least, we're in Munich and somebody happens to be here in a month from now, which is October 1st.
00:21:53
Speaker
You know, yes don't hesitate and pay us a visit here. We're very close to downtown Munich. So if somebody wants to come here and and look up what we do, everybody welcome to to pass by and looking at how we do things, how things work. So our pleasure hosting you here. Fantastic invite.
00:22:19
Speaker
awesome Well thank you again for coming on and I look forward to catching up soon. Thank you.