Transcript
Speaker: but Back in the room. Back in the room. Back in the sexy room. um Sexy? Are you right, Martin? Well, this is the episode about love.
Speaker: Oh, okay. Baby. the Okay.
Speaker: All right. Well, let's crack on. Well, if... if if if um Barry White is the walrus of love. what What animal are you of love? oh oh The stoat of love.
Speaker: Stoat. I can see that, yeah. The stoat of love. Well, actually, I think I put on a little bit too much weight to be a stoat. What about yourself, Paul? What animal of love are you?
Speaker: ah think it would be like a meerkat. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hypervigilant. Hypervigilant. Yep. Looking around. Oh. Yeah. If you see me dancing, you know, really dancing.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: Oh. Okay. Right. Well, let's go to... What? Yes. Let's go to the place where the distract... Distracted alarm box and the details on the main road to welcome to ADHD where the music has already stopped.
Speaker: Oh, God. Slick. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker: music too early. down think it was nerves. Right. It doesn't happen to me very often. Right. Because we're going to talk about love. Does it make you a bit...
Speaker: Yeah, I just kind of got bit anxious, and and and then up then the music just came on. We'll come up to this, I think, won't we, about, you know, how was it like to be autistic and ADHD and love, you know, right it anyway. Anyway, I'm Paul Thompson. I was diagnosed with the combined ADH and the D again two years ago.
Speaker: I'm Martin West, and I was diagnosed with the combined ADHD poo-poo platter in 2013, and we start off, as we do, in the ADHDville pub, the King's Agitated Head, where we, the ex-co-mayors of ADHD, take care of business. And this week, we're going to talk about love.
Speaker: Love! Because it was Valentine's Day, it's just kind of gone. to three days Two, to three days ago. days ago. Right. And then we'll chat about that. We will rate it.
Speaker: and then we'll And then we'll have a quiz. It's the quiz. We'll ah have a have a quiz. um All right. So where are we going? Pulio. We're going downtown. downtown.
Speaker: Oh, very sexy. which What does that mean, downtown? Because it means different things in different parts of the world. Right. So um in the States, for example, it's kind of like you'll get various districts, right? You'll get like a sort of a business district and a whatever district. and the And the downtown tends to be the kind of, it's where all the bars are. It's it's it's it's where the kind of nightlife is. It's where the, the you know, the stores and the music stores are and the coffee shops. says It's kind of that.
Speaker: Is that more vibey? Right. In Italian, they say, we're going into the center. All right. ah jay charo Right. But um downtown, if if you're going downtown, it it it it also has sexual connotations when you're going downtown. Oh, does it? Yes. Okay. So that makes it quite ah appropriate already. Well, let's ah jump into the tractor. And you and me, Paul, we're goingnna go we going to go downtown. Okay. With each other.
Speaker: No, it would be. It depends on what you're saying. All right. Depends what you said. Oh, I was supposed to hit the music. I forgot. I was late that time. It took me ages to get to the music.
Speaker: Oh, God. Yeah, just out of sync. Yeah, but um I'm just discombobulated, mate. I'm all over the shop. but What a fine word that is. Right. It's one my favorite words, discombobulated.
Speaker: Right. What I will say, okay, so we're going to talk about love. You know what? i am As a slight side conversation.
Speaker: Right. Have you been watching the Olympic Games? Because it is in Italy, right? I have and I haven't. It's about two hours drive.
Speaker: Well, if I was going to the events in Milan, it's 40 minute drive in Rotogmalad. Close. Next door, mate. yeah Jesus. If I went into the mountain part of the the event, which is in Cortina, it take me about a solid two hours to get there because it's up in the mountains.
Speaker: Still, next door. And um I'm watching, I'm not. It's kind of, I'm a bit, ah I'm against the this how much they spent on it. ah But I like the games in themselves.
Speaker: right like I like watching the speed skating and the curling and all that malarkey. But mean theyve the government's made the right hack of of the yeah the money spent on it and claiming it was the most sustainable games ever. Bullshit.
Speaker: and i right So, is yeah, I'm watching it a lot. All right. Well, I thought, um i thought ah well, this is a love episode. i thought the Winter Olympics. Then I was thinking, I wonder if it was like a, if we did like a, if we had a a Winter Olympics, but it was about love.
Speaker: Right. And like ADHD, love. You're going to try and segue the Winter Olympics into love. Yeah. Well, I'm going to segue into into an a Winter Olympics event.
Speaker: that could be about love and about ADHD, right? So this is um this is a a new Winter Olympics event, right? Right. in my idea, the athletes must fall madly in love.
Speaker: Right. Then they must research their new partner's childhood hobbies Right. Then they must plan three trips.
Speaker: Then they have to burn out, have a big cry, then rediscover themselves all in under four hours. and so Okay. So in that time, you have to fall in love.
Speaker: okay stalk this their social media pages. um Okay. Overshare. Right.
Speaker: Okay. Yes, stalking. Maybe hire a private detective, a private dick. Blimey. And then there's extra points for creating a dramatic but a dramatic playlist that that okay of of songs. Okay, it could happen. It's not very wintery.
Speaker: It could be the Summer Olympics as well. Well, that that that that is a good point. Well put, mate. There is nothing specifically winter about it. It's not dependent on ice or snow or cold stuff.
Speaker: I think there's some more research that I clearly need to do. So so so I'm just going to take that back to the ah to the drawing board, Paul, and then I'll work on it.
Speaker: Okay. Blimey.
Speaker: Hard audience. Right. um All right. So, I don't know. um I mean, I i thought I would just start by just kind of like listing out some types of love. So just just some, you know, just start we can talk about like, you know, because there's all kinds of different.
Speaker: Oh, massively. Massive. You know, so there's like... Yeah, there's like a passionate love. So that's like ah you know, that's the one where you're like intense, got intense desire and in infatuation and you get that early spark chemistry. There's like a a companion love, which is more like a sort of a deep bond, trust, comfort, long-term yeah intimacy. You know, like you can kind of get, you know, I mean, I think, you know, like, yeah, lots of friendships in that one as well. and
Speaker: Then there's like an attachment love, which is like a bond that provides safety and and and security across relationships. So, you know, I mean, so family can sit in there and friends can sit in there as well. And then there's like a kind a a compassionate love, like a selfless love.
Speaker: right and unconditional care which again family or your friends they sit in there so i mean like you know mean i mean everyone like cuts the love into all kinds of different ways but i mean like you know this is just just to say it's ah it's a very broad spectrum it's massively broad i think and love is is so to me it's it's a word it's it's as a It seems totally inadequate.
Speaker: You know, it's it's as if I've always thought that we love should be given in theory. It'd be difficult. because you'd have an extremely big dictionary. But I think love could be did given it a different word, definition, for every situation, every friend, every lover, every partner, every pet, every family member. It's different for everyone.
Speaker: Right. Yeah. i know Reminded me of Shakespeare. All right. I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to segue into Shakespeare who invented over 200 words for his sonnets and his plays. Right.
Speaker: If he couldn't think of a word, he just invented Right. Some of them are still in the English dictionary, like ah fashionable, was that He invented that word. didn't exist before Shakespeare.
Speaker: All right. Bedroom. Oh, hang on. Okay. now its Now it's starting to get out. I was like, how is this on earth to do with love? Love. All right.
Speaker: Okay. Okay. Bedroom. There we go. There's one. Okay. Lonely. that's so sad. Addiction. Love can be addictive.
Speaker: So won't we. Right. So won't we. Eyeballs. He invented eyeballs. Some people might have an eyeball fetish. That could turn into love.
Speaker: The look of love. The look yeah of love. That's the look. That's the look. yeah Love. Let's get even more down to it. Uncomfortable. he invented that word.
Speaker: Alright Undress appears in The Taming of the Shrew Undress Okay Swagger Swagger invented it completely it's in ah A Midnight Summer's Dream and last but not least probably the least sexy and alarming love thing Puking Oh come on ah He invented it It's something you invented for As You Like It how poor As you don't. oh
Speaker: Exactly. How you do you don't. how How is it that we've skidded off the path of love so quickly? But it's still because i would invent, when I think of my the people I have loved...
Speaker: You think of... You think of... think of vomit. But I could quite easily invent a word for all of them that would more closely represent how love could be distinctly defined quite differently between...
Speaker: all the people in my past and present. So what we need is the Paul Thompson Love Dictionary. Yes, exactly. Where you invent all the words for all the different yeah loves.
Speaker: That's what I'm getting at. Get get get on it, Paul. After this podcast, that's your money-making fucking ah thing there. I love that.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. It's just so different for everyone, else for everyone isn't it? it's like every But what I'm mostly interested in is the context of autism and ADHD. I think when I reflect, um it's one of those things where you mask we mask probably the most, some of maybe the most awkward ways. Because we think we've have to we have to love or we have the perception that the people that we were with wanted a kind of neurotypical definition of love.
Speaker: Right. Which people with ADHD and autism don't do. Right? We don't. it's It's just like those like, don't look at me if you want that.
Speaker: And it has caused problems in the past, definitely. ah Yes, right, because you've got all these expectations that society says what you should be, what it should feel like, what it how how you act when yeah when you're in love. And perform even, right performative, I think. The neurotypical definition of love is very performative.
Speaker: you know what i i was thinking about this the other day um when you're queuing up for roses yeah when i was queuing up for roses at the and and but and and a box of chocolates and i was thinking how performative am and sexy underwear Oh, you know the um edible and underwear or the one with the ah elephant trunk?
Speaker: Yeah. In the front. ah Yeah, I'm thinking, I know, right? Because that that i mean that's the thing. It's fucking ridiculous. All of that is fucking ridiculous. um And I did think, you know, like...
Speaker: you know, if you've got autism and ADHD, there is not a lot of, I mean, like I think normal people generally have it better in lots of areas, right, rather than us.
Speaker: But one area that I feel sorry for them yes is in love because do know yeah i do not envy normal people's love in the slightest. Yes.
Speaker: Right. um I was once in um walking along the street in um where I used to live in Palermo and there's this like jewelry shop. I'm not it exists in in the States, but for sure it exists in a lot of places in Europe. It's called Pandora.
Speaker: Okay. All right. It's a chain, a big chain in Europe and they sell the cheapest you know, kind of jewelry, okay? but When there's some Valentine's, there are queues outside the shop.
Speaker: All right. And I thought, if I saw my partner or lover or whatever in the queue, find something for me, I'd say, it's over.
Speaker: stu night you It's You, me, finished. I'm throwing in the towel. That's it. You clearly have not got a clue about who I am.
Speaker: Right. Save your money, love. You know. so Save it for the for the for the bus bus ride home because that's where you're going.
Speaker: Don't buy the trinket, you know, with soppy words engraved on them, you know. No, no, no. No, because like as as as far as i I'm concerned, when think about like normal people like and love, like if love is and is an ocean, they they they put on all their like all their life preservers and their in inflatable...
Speaker: life jackets and stuff and they go and paddle around in the safe in the safe shallow water right yeah and that's it whereas whereas us neurodivergent people we fucking swim out into the fucking deep ocean where the swells are like mountainous and we're like bobbing about up there Totally. Going up and down like crazy people. Exactly. It's like, it's like, clean it's like, oh, it a a normal people's love is like, it it barely like, if it, it doesn't register, it? It's like, it's like what insane.
Speaker: I'm going to test you, Martin, with an anecdote, right? so okay just This standing time just came to me as you were talking just now. I was once, when when I lived in Crouch End, okay? Oh, yeah London.
Speaker: London, right? I was coming home from work, and it was late. It was about midnight. And I got on this London bus, classic London bus, went upstairs the top deck, right?
Speaker: Yes. And there was this girl there, and we, oh, no. Oh. We were waiting for the bus together, right? And we just like we just like connected and we were chatting away. And the bus journey was about 25 minutes. And we were just like chatting and chatting and chatting. And we were getting on like a house on fire. And then we got off at the same bus stop.
Speaker: And I forgot to ask her for her number, right? Yeah. So here's the thing. What do you think I'll do next? Oh, i so you think you know me, but do you really? um Okay.
Speaker: What would you do next? so So you've got off the bus, right? And you've both gone your separate ways. Yes. hi Oh, that was great. mom Yeah, yeah yeah yeah oh oh yeah. And then she just wanders off into the night. Yeah. And you're going, oh, bugger.
Speaker: I didn't get a number. Yeah. what What an arsehole I am. Yeah. That was the first thought. And then what would you do? What would you do?
Speaker: Fuck it. oh I mean, I, I, I, Oh Jesus. I mean, you could just head off in the direction that she vaguely went and then just wing it and hope you might see her. Or, or you take the same bus.
Speaker: mean the next week on the same day at the same time and hope she's there. so So you could stalk that bus stop yeah have put for for a couple of days and see if she turns up.
Speaker: Right. See, no, that's not what i did. i ran a poster campaign in the... Right? Printed out little A4...
Speaker: posters and nailed them to the lampposts along the street where I remembered she said roughly where she lived.
Speaker: oh i And it was vague enough that um um if her if if she did have a boyfriend, I didn't know if she did or not, it vague enough that only she would understand who had written it.
Speaker: Blimey, okay. Right? Now, the thing is, do you remember Emma, who used to, like, hang out with us quite a lot at Crown Chain?
Speaker: yeah She thought that was really creepy.
Speaker: is it But this is the thing, isn't it? I think if she was...
Speaker: if if If she was going to be someone interesting that I thought I could, you know, subconsciously, i would if she reacted to it, responded to it, I knew she was a kind of the right kind of person I wanted to spend some time with.
Speaker: Absolutely. If she found it creepers, like, well, you know, forget it. It's fine. Ciao. Right, because honestly, if uneeen how if that scene was in a film, you had some nice music under it, that would be like a classic rom-com kind of manoeuvre.
Speaker: Yeah. I love it. I love it. So then for several days afterwards, yes those are the days when I didn't have, well, i think I did have a cell phone just. had I think I just had i've had my first cell phone, but mostly it was the house phone, normal land phone, okay?
Speaker: Right. And so every time it didn't ring hardly ever. So when it rang, it was like quite a strange event. And it only rang once.
Speaker: Okay. And whoever was at the end of the phone, I said, hello, hello, didn't speak up.
Speaker: that was like the love of your life there could have been you know sliding doors oh she's like she was all shy and got the got the got the got the nerves yeah she heard your voice and panicked oh ah she's oh oh she was like what if it was that really weird bloke that i met on the bus that had that weird voice and i answered the phone hello hello It was him. Fuck it.
Speaker: Put the phone down. yep That's him. Yep. ah now Oh, Christ. um Anyway. Well, that was half the podcast, but but but but worth it.
Speaker: Worth it. Well, let us know, um you know, out there, you know, did you would you find that creepy? Whether you're a boy or a girl.
Speaker: Or a man. A man or a woman. that creepy? Right. Yeah. i I would put it in the not creepy camp, personally, um for the for the exact same reasons that that you said. Yeah.
Speaker: I'm really glad that I did it. Yeah, I love that. yeah of that Yeah. You threw your hat over the boat. um Yeah, which is okay. Well, I think, you know, like just kind of going, you know, I think that kind of indicates that we love in a very different why ah Totally, yeah. you know and And as I said before, you know like I think our you know ADHD or LDHD, we yeah that you know that thing that kind of that we have that we use hyperfocus?
Speaker: Yeah. and That's the thing that we can do like really intensely. focus on something when that something is like a a person. um And it, and it doesn't necessarily have to be a you know, a, you know, a potential partner, but um you know, it can be other people as well. But, but, but, but, but that kind of early,
Speaker: experience You know that experience, Paul, when you've met someone like that, right, but but then you take it to the next the level and you both go, yeah, I'm i'm i'm interested in Oh, I'm interested in you. And then you just kind of go, then just kind of ah almost like...
Speaker: just just are really intensely into them and you have this like this really intense period where you're just kind of visceral into the other person you when you and you want to know everything about them and you what their favorite song is and what socks do they wear on a wednesday and i mean it's just uh or tuesday all the days of the week, mate. I just say i want to see a lineup of socks each day. Yeah.
Speaker: You know, that, ah it and I mean, we have to, you know, like, yeah it's generally called like the love bombing, period which is something that neurodivergence really well is that when you meet that certain people you just like you just literally love bomb each each e each other with intense but long but not love bombing in a narcissistic definition of love bombing when you know because with narcissists with love bombing there is a a a um
Speaker: There's an objective behind it that is pretty nasty. You know, it's about controlling. it With ADHD, it's just love bobbing, intensity, and that's There's no particular, you know,
Speaker: right we aren't active Right, we aren't trying to manipulate the other person. Exactly. Yeah, but and and, you know, those there was some TikToks. So Alexandra, you know, um from the from the Haunted Inn, she did a TikTok on on ah love bombing, um and there was a lot of chat around there. and and and that was And then that was her point, was that, you know, is that...
Speaker: ah Love bombing from a narcissistic or or yeah point of view is very different to a... but it It feels the same. It almost looks the same as as love bombing from a neurodivergent person. but But as you say, there there is a...
Speaker: there is the intent behind It's very different. but it can so yes But it can be very exciting when there is that connection. And it's it's happened to me many times, quite ah many times, and quite a few times in my life. um Maybe I'm quite lucky, but when it happens, it's great.
Speaker: Right. It's like this incredible energy. Right. it's It's like it's one of the high points of being alive. Is that? Yeah. that that That thing? That's just like, woohoo.
Speaker: Yeah, no, I mean, I can be like, you know, like those periods have been been pretty pretty pretty crazy. And then because we are neurodivergent, that kind of starts to tail off.
Speaker: yeah And then the other person kind of goes, wait, wait where did where did where did all that go? Yeah. so that has a bit of a shiny new toy element to it.
Speaker: Right. I mean, you know, you can't maintain that. Like, it has its place and its time. but here's a provocation, right? that this I think in, well, I don't know about, well, I'm speaking from knowledge of my culture in in England, which is very different, by the way.
Speaker: a a British definition of love can do can have subtle differences, nuances that different from other places. But anyway, um that um there's a sense of of failure if if a relationship breaks up there's a sense of failure what if that intensity between two people and it only lasts for two or three months was was not a failure at all it was just fucking amazing two or three months you know right yeah and we get so like too hooked up in sense the kind of sense of failure that if it didn't last a lifetime
Speaker: Right. You know? And I think, yes. Why not celebrate that it was fucking amazing for three months and it's fine? Yes, because like i I think when you when you do understand yours yourself and you are neurodivergent and you do know that that is that you are in this window of you know like intense intense feelings, that that it will taper off. yeah And it will kind of come back at some points and it will go away and will come back and go away. it will just kind of come in in in in waves.
Speaker: Mm-hmm. we And then in between the waves is this kind of like normal stuff. And then it'll go, ooh, it'll go up again. Like the Blumont song. waves they're coming over me yes yeah exactly i've got some research paul just okay quick ones about or about love i wish i had blemange research and i i feel like i've come to this podcast unprepared suddenly um
Speaker: So research shows that more intense, passionate love then than people without ADHD. so So we have more intense, passionate love than normal people.
Speaker: Ours more intense. Also, there are higher rates of romantic partners and early sexual activity you know when you're ah in your in your teens. so When you say love can be in tents, can it also be in like caravans as well? it can of mate, it can be in caravans. It have to be in a tent.
Speaker: No, no, it can be an in in an RV. LAUGHTER um Right. you know in a Yeah. okay um So, yeah, so we, we so early on, we tend to have more more romantic partners.
Speaker: Yes. um And some studies find attachment anxiety and avoidance patterns, meaning fear of intimacy and relationship into insecurity, can be common. So while we do have that, I think this is what you're kind of saying, is we'll have this intense periods and then we'll have these up and then when it...
Speaker: then when it's not intense, we we as you say, we we we kind of feel like we've failed. Yeah. and also Also, the the the um the rejection, the you know, the fear of rejection also means youre to avoid that rejection, you're putting in some serious effort probably delay that moment, you know.
Speaker: to delay that moment you know When you when you increases the intensity.
Speaker: Right. No, I mean that, um you know, that pain, that emotional pain, you know, like really kind of amps up. you know, the anxiety, right? Because it's like, because it's this push pull thing, right? Where you feel like you want to, you know, um really connect with someone else.
Speaker: Yeah. And and it it doesn't have to be like, it doesn't have to be a romantic. It could be like someone that you meet, right? That you really like. you know, like friend, like a mate, where yeah where you kind of like want to start, you think, oh, we have a connection here. I want to share some of myself. But then you're like, ooh, what if I share that that thing about, you know about that thing that I like and all whatever it is. And, oh, let me just, let me just, and let me just, so you end up doing this like kind of odd masking. You're like jumping between wanting to unmask and then yeah having the the the anxiety of having to mask again. Like, he's just like, he's in this constant state of like, am I masking? Am unmasking? What am I doing here? State of flux.
Speaker: Right. Yeah. right ah what What about the other dynamic can sometimes happen, right? Because i I was reading an article once, was an interview with the French actress called Juliette Binoche.
Speaker: Okay. um Right. she she She talked about the fact that she was very much in love with two different men for two very different reasons.
Speaker: Okay. And she said, you know, and the only reason, you should usually the biggest barrier is self-esteem because she she personally had no problem with that at all. Oh, right.
Speaker: that She loved one man, but didn't mean she couldn't love the other man in completely different ways. Yeah, that is so true. and that's like I think that is so difficult, though. It's really difficult thing, too.
Speaker: I can appreciate it to manage, you know. So do you have, do you, do we, do I have the self-esteem to actually have that happen, you and be okay with it?
Speaker: Right? Yeah. No, it's it's like of a a mate of mine. He was... ah So he's married to his wife, right?
Speaker: And she wanted... know she um ah She wanted to experience other people in that in that way, right? She wanted to have... don't know. Other experiences. Other experiences. And so she...
Speaker: other other experiences and and so she she So she was like, I wanna want to do this. I think that we should have an an open a marriage. Yeah. yeah And he wasn't into it.
Speaker: he was He was thinking that this was a bad idea. But but he was like, fine, okay, all right, well, let you know like you're obviously unhappy. Let's let let's do this. so yeah so So she had a man and then she went out and then he went out and found found my girl, a woman, I should say. and And they kind of started their own little in individual dating. And then the the woman split up from the man.
Speaker: but but but the But the husband, my mate, and he actually fell in love with his his new woman and was like, you know what?
Speaker: our marriage is over i'm going to go off with this this new girl and uh it's usually messy so she she brought up this whole thing this open relationship and then it bit her in the ass in the end i'm not saying that you know that that's the moral of the story is don't but i'm just saying that usually is messy because love love is messy martin it's like youre right It's like, I think probably what happened with them is it's like home cooking is all right, but sometimes you want to take away.
Speaker: I guess. I guess. um So um'm I'm not putting any, any, like any, any judgment on it. It's just. Oh, no, it's no judgment at all. It's just interesting how.
Speaker: I really admire couples that can make that happen massively. It demonstrates um a very mature definition of love. Right.
Speaker: And demonstrates really strong self-esteem. Yes. i There was a, i think it was a Netflix show. but I watched about, I don't know a couple of weeks ago, it's it's it was like a it it was like a a real, you know, one of those, um oh, fucking hell, I can't think of the term. But um it was ah it was called like Couple to Thruple, I think. So what it was was that they got all these couples who were interested in having a third person enter the relationship. And was, it was, oh it was
Speaker: a reality show. So they had these, yeah, they're the okay they all real couples, right? And then they bring, and then they have to interview, then they bring all these other single people and they're parties and they're mixing and they're chatting and then they're trying, you know, and they're kind of trying to see what a threesome would be like.
Speaker: then we And then, you know, cameras were following these people around and interviewing everyone and all that kind of stuff. And it was really interesting yeah how, know, yeah from me because i'm I'm interested in people and how they work and think I was like i was i was like how does this work how I was having trouble wrapping my brains around that concept personally I bet it was interesting there was another again on Netflix it was american' um an American miniseries about I think it was called something like Modern Love
Speaker: is really nicely made. It's based in New York. beautifully made and very much about you know those kind of modern dynamics and modern interpretations of of love it was really really nicely made um even like there was so one of the characters in it was uh for each episode there was a slightly different dynamic and different couples and stuff there was even one with a prostitute who actually you know she was very cool how she
Speaker: redefined what people thought of what what a prostitute is or who she is, you know, what she represents and service that she gives to society, you know, and sometimes to couples as well. It was very cool anyway, really cool.
Speaker: Right. Yeah, yeah. So, like, um I guess, yeah, yeah so i was, I guess you you you you end up in this place where,
Speaker: i think and This is what we talked about last week, is that is that is that there is a romantic love, but actually we can have more intense relationships with people, other people who we don't have a a romantic connection.
Speaker: Yeah. too like it doesn't necessarily i think So I think for normal people, they tend to think of it as like, oh, I have this intense and emotional reaction to you and this connection. Therefore, it must be love. Therefore, I'm going to go and buy some chocolates and I'm going to line up for so for some cheap jewelry in Palermo. And and That's what it is. But but but for neurodivergent people, it it it doesn't have – like once you break out of that way of thinking, yeah as we were saying earlier, it's it's like, oh, okay, actually you can you can still love someone without the kind of sex part being a part of the thing. It doesn't have to go down there. You can just enjoy – Totally. you know that kind of like ah That's a really Yeah.
Speaker: It's very liberating when you arrive at that point as well. Right. It is. It's not, you know, it's not the default isn't, you know, intimacy means, you know, sexually intimacy. And especially if the other person is clocked in on that as well, because you can both go...
Speaker: i love I love you so, so much. The other person can go, I love you so much. and And you can feel that. Yeah. That heart hug.
Speaker: But without it kind of like, it doesn't mean, ah right, well, you know. that was Funny to say that because um I was reading a story. ah Billy Conney was telling him telling a story about his love affair with rob Robin Williams.
Speaker: Oh. Okay. and um And he said there was a deep, deep connection between the two of them. And in fact, two days before Robert Williams committed suicide, he arranged lunch with Billy Codney. And Robert Williams told Billy Codney how much he loved him. Aw. Isn't that nice? It's amazing.
Speaker: Yeah, bromance. Yeah. Bro, man. There's a subject because we don't have time for it, but men, they just can't, you know, inter men having an inter intimate relationship with another man, that ah most men get all kinds of problems with that.
Speaker: Yes. which is as dumb as fuck. It really is Right, right, right. Absolutely. um um I mean, it's it's definitely worth mentioning that, you know, because ADHD is about the dopamine and it is about risky behavior and it is about, you know, like, yeah you know, sort of addiction, you know, that you yeah can,
Speaker: like If you're undiagnosed and you don't really understand yourself that that well, that i mean and and that has led to me personally, all kinds of fucking shady shit in the past. you know Because I just didn't and and ah didn't understand myself well enough to um totally to you know know what i was doing or thinking.
Speaker: I ah once, in in a fairly recent history, ah kind of um chased a a relationship. in Well, didn't chase it. i kind of I ah kind of went head first into a relationship that I knew on all kinds of levels, I knew was going to be dangerous and it was going to be shit and it was going to be where there's going to be problems. And it And there were.
Speaker: And there were. And more than I've ever had in my life. Unbelievable. And I think in a part of me now, you know, looking back on that, that was that was a dopamine chase.
Speaker: Right. Danger. Danger. will I so knew it was going to be a wrong one. Oh, blimey. I just so knew it. But yeah, blimey.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah. All right. Well, i have you got... I mean, like, honestly, the thing is about this subject is, ah you know, like, books have been written and films and so much about this topic.
Speaker: and there's And there's all the sciences as as well. It's just like there's so much of it that... Yeah....that we barely scratch the surface. I would say that um if if anyone wants to...
Speaker: um Read up on it. One of the one really good books, I thought wealth was really good, is Alain de Botton, who's a British psychologist. He's written about about um love in a really cool way. It's very, very easy to read and really cool, really good, really rich really well written.
Speaker: Right. which um and i yeah So I would have to add, i i often go back to um car hill gay Car Hill, a Gibran poet, on his um his poem, On Love. um Okay. So, we're yeah, ah from The the Prophet, i think is his is is that collection of of of work. Very nice. Very nice.
Speaker: All right. Well, I think um i think we should. Let me just check it. Yeah, we should um maybe just kind of have to draw a line, sadly.
Speaker: Yeah. um And crack on. um So let's go to the... go to We have to rate it, Paul. We have to rate love.
Speaker: Right. yeah oh It's a monumental task, mate. It's it's monumental. That's totally the right word. it's the it's a ah Hang on, hang on. Here we go. We have to play the ah the little jingle. track to it. No, no, no. Oh, no, it's a banjo.
Speaker: Yes, so I'm just getting your ears. It's banjo bit. Here we go, here we go. Come on. Is it a dopamine hit or is it a pronouncing hit? love is it a dopamine hit or is it a burnout thing because okay you go first mate all right you go first dopamine naught out of 10. 10 right it is a full of it is the most dopes you can possibly it's there's a lot there's some heaps of dopes yeah heaps of heaps of dopes and i i concur
Speaker: i concur Is there a better dopamine here than love? Let us know in the comments. Well, for some people, be a class you know some drugs could be a replacement for some people. Okay.
Speaker: um All right. So ah burnout score, 10. ten It's a 10. it's a ten it will it will It has to be.
Speaker: Level you out. it will Massively. Sink you to your knees and then it'll dig a hole and you'll move further into it. Nice. Nice. There you go. that that is ah that I can't think of any other thing that would get a full 10-10. No. such Such is the... such as the they have um he puts it I have no idea, but you're searching around for words here. I am. either They're not coming.
Speaker: Searching and they're not happening. such Such is the everlasting riddle of the circus that is love.
Speaker: Oh, there we go. You're a poet, Paul. You're a poet. All right, well, let's jump in the tractor and let's get our asses over to Alexander's. What's it in?
Speaker: Wow. Okay, right. ah Yeah, I mean, so yeah, she did a whole bunch of stuff on on Tick, Tick, Tick to talk about love. So a huge thanks to that. And she did say um one one thing about love. She says... ah inter And I think we've touched on this. um in Interconnection among neurodivergence is precious. It goes way deeper than than but than but rather than than yeah and romance. Friendship is more valuable after all. um even even but between even between ah room romantic partners in in my opinion love you you guys so yeah you know like friendship is know having that that a a love around friendship i mean i mean i wouldn't say that i love you paul i mean i kind of
Speaker: I kind of like you oh barely, I don't know, what ah you know, I look like I like you. think I think that's right. That's enough for me. The level of masking.
Speaker: I'll take those breadcrumbs. I'll take those crumbs. ah Thank you, mate. By the way, I'm not sure if this is how Alexandra wrote it, but it's written written here, is internet interconnection between neurodivergence.
Speaker: it sounds like like a dance routine for neuro divergence neuroogi verdance all right have talking but my eyes five talking new i die virgins lovely um all right so ah so yeah i mean get into the comments come right his This is where you say. This is a bit where I say, yeah, your feedback is vital to us. We read all of your comments and maybe we'll um give you a shout out in future podcasts.
Speaker: Absolutely. All right. I think it's now time for for the quiz the quiz. Let's do it. It's the quiz.
Speaker: It's the quiz. It's the quiz. 4-2 down. you are Let me just check by my my scores on the doors. 4-2 down. Let's see if you can pull one back.
Speaker: this I decided that i would that i that I wasn't going to do a quiz about me. I was going to do one about um I'll do that next week. But I thought I would do one about love.
Speaker: Right? Oh, OK. So this is a love-themed classic old-school ADHD real quiz. All right, here we go. So it's three questions with three multiple choice answers. You have to...
Speaker: find out which one of the three answers is true right all right so question number one here we go eyes down for a full house okay which which historical lover once wrote so many dramatic love letters that they're that they are basically the 18th century equivalent of a of a of 3 a.m emotional texting so Lord Byron.
Speaker: So was it A, Napoleon Bonaparte, b Abraham Lincoln, or C, Casanova? Who wrote so many dramatic love letters? You're a cheeky boy, aren't you? Cheeky boy, Martin, because you' you've thrown in Casanova because you think, because I think it's Napoleon. I know that his love letters to...
Speaker: his lovers were ah josephine beyond Josephine, were beyond, oh but i mean, just unbelievable.
Speaker: All right. So is that your answer? Passanova is too obvious. Okay. Yeah. and And you would be right. he wrote as you say he wrote obsessively to yeah to to to to saying to to josephine at one point he wrote i wake filled with i have to do it in french accent of course a week filled with thoughts of you i kiss your heart um Meanwhile, she was not really obsessed with him.
Speaker: so yeah, there we go. okay Well, I know that he, ah well, you know, if you want to cut this out, Martin, for feel free. He used to send ah someone on from, say, be on his way back from a battle somewhere in Europe, going back to Paris, and he would send some oik, some kind of messenger ahead of him to tell Josephine not to take a bath.
Speaker: before or wash before he got back because because he liked her human womanly smells all right there we go this kid was like set off go on lad go on boy joseph don't get in that bath no no no burn out no what soap are you having a laugh no soap Exactly. Yeah.
Speaker: He wanted to have, you know. Yeah. her Yeah. and that's Yeah. Anyway, question number number two. Let's keep this rolling along. All right.
Speaker: Which royal love affair ah um involved disguises, secret tunnels, um and one of history's most powerful empires.
Speaker: So royal love story. Yes. Was it Cleopatra and and Julius Caesar? Was it kather Catherine the Great and Grigory Potemkin? Or was it Queen Elizabeth I and robert robert Robert Dudley? So which royal love affair involved disguises, secret tunnels?
Speaker: Wow. Okay. Well, Queen Elizabeth Secret time. See, this this is right up my street because this is this is this is this could be by could be my specialist subject. See, now, I know that Elizabeth I, there's very, very little evidence of her romantic liaisons with other men. Right. Most of it was gossip. Right.
Speaker: Yes. So the other ones were, so I think Cleopatra, Tullors, Julius Caesar. And Catherine the Great and Grigory Potemkin.
Speaker: I think it's Catherine the Great and Grigory Potemkin. oh Oh, so close. It was Cleopatra. And and you you ah you might get this um when I want explain it. So so it was it was Cleopatra and Julius Caesar. So legend says that Cleopatra had herself smuggled into du into Caesar's ah into Caesar's room wrapped in a rug and she was unfurled out from from a rug but actually it was more like it was just sort of bedding rather than a rug but something like a fetish to me
Speaker: Well, yeah, yeah, yeah. A rug fetish. So she sneaked herself in, wrapped in that in dirty laundry, probably.
Speaker: Nice. like that. Nice. Yeah. All right. last Last one. night i think i think the think I think you'll get this, mate. I think you'll get this. I hope. All right. So which historical figure proposed marriage by literally making a pros and cons list?
Speaker: So he proposed marriage. You know, like when you get down on one knee and you propose, he had a pros and cons list. That was his proposal.
Speaker: That was his delivery? Yes. That was his form of delivery, a pros and cons list? Pros and cons list. All right. So was it Albert Einstein...
Speaker: Was it charles du Charles Darwin or was it Ludwig von Beethoven? Which of those do you think did a pros and cons list?
Speaker: See, now I think the the first one, um Freud, kind of um very autistic Freud.
Speaker: Right. Pros and cons list. Autistic. Albert Einstein. ah Sorry, Einstein. He was also autistic. Charles Darwin.
Speaker: Beethoven. I'll go for Darwin. And you'd be right, mate. Oh, yes. You'd be absolutely right. So, ah so ah yeah, he he made an an actual written list before proposing to Emma Wedgwood. And here are some other things, Paul, because I thought you might be interested in what are the pros and what is the pros. Oh, nice. I like that. Details.
Speaker: yeah So on the on his pros list, he had Constant Companion. He had he had a ah it's but It's Better Than a Dog.
Speaker: Wow. ah Children. And he should know. Charles Darwin. Right. ah You got children out of it. and And he literally wrote this, object to be beloved and played with.
Speaker: Wow. That's the proposal. Amazing. On the cons list, less money. Wow.
Speaker: let this is christ Less money for so
Speaker: ah Wow, that's specific. Oh, no, this is such an odd autistic list. Totally. um Also, less time for scientific work.
Speaker: Yeah. um Which he kind of ah called um a terrible loss of time was his way of marriage. If I got married to you, it would be a terrible, terrible loss of my time. And ah ah he he also didn't really like the obligation to visit and receive and receive ah ah the the in-laws. Okay. So that sounds very Einstein-y as well. he was quite He was a bit of a rogue, I understand, very...
Speaker: Very egotistic egotistical. Right. but But he still managed to remain married 43 years. so Good on him. Good on the fella.
Speaker: Good on the fella. Jesus Christ. he's like That next level. All right. Well, let me just squidgy up my what is next. All right. So ah that just leaves. Oh, that so, okay. So you you are now just top up the scores. It's 4-3. Oh, 4-3, mate. 4-3.
Speaker: all for three mate four three So you're creeping up. So if you win next next week, you'll be all level. So we've got next week. yeah Next week's episode is ADHD and aging.
Speaker: Oh, getting old. Getting old. Aging, yeah. I bet you've got something to say about that, haven't you, Martin? Well, I'm 61 years young, mate. 61 years fun.
Speaker: um Yeah. it happened to this it happens to me on a fairly regular basis. I think, am i don't think am I 59 this year or am I 49? And I have to really think about it.
Speaker: Yes. That's 10 years difference. I think, no, I'm 49, surely. Yeah. Holy crap. That's brutal. I'm 59. That's brutal.
Speaker: That is a brutal swing. That is a brutal swing, Martin. ah All right. So I have to think. all right. So I've got to think about what what ah what is ADHD and getting older and how that affects.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. that's it That is going to be interesting because I can tell you, mate, there is no research on ADHD and old people.
Speaker: Right. Yeah, yeah. Anyone getting on into there. None. Nothing. Zero. By complete coincidence, because I'd already decided that it was going to ADHD and aging two days ago, by complete coincidence, today I was listening to someone talking about um the midlife men and midlife crises.
Speaker: All right. And how it's linked to their sudden realization of being mortal. Right.
Speaker: That part. Yeah. right All right. Mortal immortality. Right. I will live forever. um I'm not dying, mate. What are you talking about? i'm fucking, I'm like,
Speaker: I'm going to be running, running for the next 40 years. i like and spi Spike Milligan's view on this. He said, i don't i don't mind the concept of dying. I just don't want to be there when it happens.
Speaker: Perfect. All right. Well, that that is a good place to launch chin into the next bit, which is ah for me to say that ADHDville is delivered fresh every Tuesday to all providers of fine podcasts.
Speaker: Please subscribe to the pod and rate us most lovable. And feel free to correspond out well in the comments. But wait, there's more if you wish to see our beautiful... Beautiful faces and so forth to the YouTubes and the TikToks and you can also pick up a quillly email and email us at adhdv at gmail.com. But in the meantime, be fucking kind to yourself.
Speaker: And I beseech you fellow ADHDs fairly well with gladness of heart. D'aw. D'aw. Where's my button that There, says the mayor.
Speaker: That's that. That's that. Oh. Well that's pretty good. And your new internet. Your new internet. It's rocking isn't it?
Speaker: Fucking killing it mate. It's killing. Your video's bullying, your audio's... It's like about to scratch my nose. It's like for it's in real time right? In real time yeah yeah. No this is like... This is like... So much easier.
Speaker: It's easier isn't it? It is. Less stressful as well. Yeah. Oh yeah. Not for you.
