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Episode 110. - ADHDville with Guest Jenny Lucas
42 Plays17 days ago
Ready for a dose of real talk and late-diagnosis wisdom? Welcome back to ADHDville!
This week, we are thrilled to be re-joined by the fantastic Jenny Lucas! When Jenny was last with us, she was just starting to write a book. Now, she’s back holding the finished product in her hands: 'Autism, ADHD And Me - Your no-bullshit guide to life after late diagnosis.'
In this candid conversation, Jenny pulls back the curtain on her entire process, from the initial idea to becoming an Amazon #1 bestseller (and even knocking a famous comedian off the top spot!). We dive into:
✨ The ADHD-friendly way she wrote and structured her book so you can cherry-pick chapters without the guilt.
✨ The hyper-focused "author weekends" she used to get it done with a busy family and a day job.
✨ The powerful message behind her work—moving beyond seeing our traits as "good" or "bad" and finding validation.
If you've ever struggled with self-acceptance, wondered how to tackle a big project, or just want to feel less alone on your neurodivergent journey, this episode is for you.
So, settle in and get ready for an inspiring chat. Let's get started!
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Link to all things Jenny Lucas
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Transcript
Introduction of Jenny Lucas as a guest
00:00:00
Speaker
We're back. We're back. We're back in the room. Yes. Yes. And we're not alone. we're not. Because it's a guest episode. And we have ah Jenny Lucas, who you may remember back from episode 75. Welcome. Welcome.
00:00:19
Speaker
welcome jenny I am delighted to be back. I couldn't think of anything I would rather be doing in this time than recording this with you guys. Yes! Oh, thank you so much.
00:00:30
Speaker
God, music to my ears. And speaking of music, let's go to a place where the distractions are landmarks and the details are the main
Jenny's book publication and cover design
00:00:39
Speaker
roads. Welcome to ADHDville.
00:00:41
Speaker
Cue the intro.
00:00:45
Speaker
We've got Lucas, we've got Jenny, Lucas in the house. Jenny from the block, Jenny from the block, Jenny from the block Don't look at the rocks that she's got Exactly Now, Jenny, episode 75, you were starting to write a book Yep And we said we would have you back when that that book has been published And here it is
00:01:20
Speaker
Up to the camera. Wow. Autism, ADHD and me by our friend Jenny Lucas. It's a pretty cover, isn't it?
00:01:32
Speaker
It is. ah What do you think of like is design, Paul? I like it. I like the diagonals. It's always a good one. for If you want to get a attention, get a diagonal in there.
From idea to publication: Jenny's journey
00:01:45
Speaker
And I like the fact that you've got Jenny Lucas next to me so that you know that me me means Jenny Lucas. There we go. Brilliant. I can't take credit for the design of that. I have to say the the publishing company that i was working with had an amazing, they they have an amazing guy that they work with that does the book covers for the the books that they release. add And I had four to choose from. I had basically had to fill in a Word document with like all of the things I like and send some pictures of book covers that I liked. It was like, oh, I kind of like these ideas. And then he had to turn that into a visual concept.
00:02:21
Speaker
And he sent me these four to look at. And that was the first one that i saw. And I was like, that is it. That's the one. The rest can get in the bin. This is the one. And it also says here... Your No Bullshit Guide to the to Life After Late Diagnosis.
00:02:39
Speaker
Correct. um I'm just going to put it but it here like that. Give give us a sense, Jenny, of how it went from idea to actually publish publishing it.
00:02:55
Speaker
But this is the thing, like I do not have a big enough following for publishing companies, traditional publishing companies to be knocking down my door and saying, Jenny, will you please write us a book?
Balancing writing with life commitments
00:03:04
Speaker
But I knew that I had ideas that I wanted to put out there.
00:03:07
Speaker
And um i'd so started, me but probably this time last year, actually, I started to like map out a concept and be like, oh, it'd be really good if I could talk about this sort of thing or I could really, I've got some material I could talk about that sort of thing.
00:03:19
Speaker
um And so I went to a pub, well, an independent publishing company um and asked them for advice about what to do and they signed me up um and that was in january of this year and then they had to give it they gave me a deadline where i had to put my ideas to paper and so there was a whole sort of process that we followed to actually get it out right into the wild last month and the deadline helped right the deadline helps oh i A
Achieving bestseller status on Amazon
00:03:50
Speaker
million percent. There is no that if I was doing this by myself and I was figuring out how to self-publish, how to list it, how to do the typography and yeah you know like the concept of understanding and learning about and then putting into action all of those technical things would just have been so overwhelming with life, with all the other things that are going on because there's no push.
00:04:14
Speaker
So that deadline really, really helps. I do, yeah. I've got two daughters, who one one one who's a teenager now, so, you know, that keeps me on my toes. um So, yeah, but it's a lot.
00:04:26
Speaker
And I've got a day job and a business. And, you know, like many people, I have a busy life. yeah I know. And and I will say that it reached the yeah didn't reach the Amazon bestseller list.
00:04:45
Speaker
side ah So a small ripple. That's amazing. That's fantastic. Congratulations. Thank you. it was a It's one of those things where just never quite know what's going to happen on the day.
00:05:01
Speaker
um And it did. it hit number one bestseller on paperback and Kindle and the and they within the 24 hours of it of it being launched. um And we actually knocked comedian Miranda Hart over in the UK. she We knocked her off the top spot for a little while.
Challenges with ADHD and managing writing
00:05:18
Speaker
Screw you, Miranda! Yeah! So that was a lovely little additional bit of kudos to say this book is out in the world. But yeah, the process itself is...
00:05:31
Speaker
It's a fascinating thing, I think, when you've got ADHD in particular. I'm lucky. yeah I'm going to say I'm lucky and I'm going to caveat that by saying because I have ADHD and autism, at times they tend to keep each other in check. And I think that's why I went so long not being diagnosed.
00:05:47
Speaker
and But I did need the deadline from the publisher. And the deadline was publication date, which was the 28th of October. And in January, I was going, that's ages away. And then when I was having conversations with them about what that actually meant, they were like, no, no, we actually need the finished product like at the end of June.
00:06:04
Speaker
And I was like, oh, that's not quite as long as I thought. And so their suggestion was, and oh, you know, figure out if you want to do up to 40,000 words and then work back and be like, oh, I'll do 1,500 words a week.
00:06:17
Speaker
And immediately as we were having that conversation, my brain's going, that's never going to work for us. buts never We can't be consistent like that. Don't we? Ridiculous. um So it ended up being very much a passion of hyper-focus in chunks of time ah across that sort six-month period. Okay. Crazy. I was going to ask, what does that look like? What does Jenny look like when she's hyper-focused? Do your kids just don't eat for three weeks? Yeah.
00:06:44
Speaker
ah Jenny had to take herself away for little weekends in an Airbnb somewhere far away from other human beings. Right. So that she had absolutely no excuse but to get into the book.
00:06:57
Speaker
That's how it worked in my head. but i think I think actually i remember we we suggested that you that you went to a a tropical island but somewhere and and that you did it there, but you did it in like of a sort of Holiday Inn, B&B.
00:07:17
Speaker
B&B. I stayed in a couple of lovely
ADHD-friendly book structure
00:07:20
Speaker
Airbnbs of by the coast. I thought I'll go and take myself down by the south coast somewhere. So it was island-like, sea view.
00:07:28
Speaker
That's author-y. Because I i knew I was going to need that time. i I felt like a proper author. I mean, I was booking one of them. I actually literally wrote because they let you to put a little message in. You are a proper author.
00:07:41
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's so weird. That's great. Now then, I've only had it a while, so I've only had a chance to read.
00:07:54
Speaker
I read all the intro stuff. Lovely. And then I kind of cherry-picked my way through the through the book. um And there's a couple of things I really liked about it, which are very ADHD-friendly, if you were.
00:08:09
Speaker
There's a lot of your personal stories in it. Like yeah you definitely like put yourself right in the book. Yeah. It isn't just like a sort of clinical sort of, you know, how to do ADHD, autism. yourre You're telling stories the whole time.
00:08:28
Speaker
I quite like that concept. And and i I didn't want it to be like an autobiography because who am I? Who am I? Who am I to write an autobiography? Nobody wants to read about my life. However, I did want it to be relatable to the people that were going to pick up and read it.
00:08:42
Speaker
And the way that you do that, obviously, as you guys know, is by storytelling um and giving people examples where they can go, oh, shit, yeah, that sounds like me or that's happened to me or that's very similar to my circumstance.
00:08:55
Speaker
That's great. I don't feel alone. and that was really important to me that people would pick that up
Publishing rights and distribution strategy
00:09:00
Speaker
and recognize themselves in it. and But I love what you said there, Martin, about cherry picking your way through the book because I've written it so that you could pick it up ah Any chapter, you know if you're having an issue with burnout or relationships or you want to know more about your sensory profile, you can literally just pick it up and read that chapter.
00:09:19
Speaker
You don't have to go from start to finish to get the information out of it. but yeah with that That's the point, Nick, as an ADHD reader. How many ADHD people or autistic people read from the first from the first page right through to the epilogue? No one.
00:09:40
Speaker
No one. It's quite a concept, isn't it? So i I wanted to make it readable from that perspective. The way that I've laid it out is also quite like it's in chunks, so it's not visually too overwhelming.
00:09:52
Speaker
and And it's not actually a very thick book. I'm not going to lie to you. If I pick up my own copy now, I think we're at 147 pages now.
00:10:00
Speaker
and yeah good Because I didn't want to fill it full of absolute shit of, you know, people waffle, waffle, waffle. What's the point in here? It's all... It's your no bullshit guide, as it says on the title. It's meant to be for people to be able to pick up and get value from straight away. But...
00:10:17
Speaker
I did make and a PDF download, a free little freebie that goes along with it for anybody that wants to dive into any of the concepts a little bit more deeply who's got capacity to do that. and I wanted to try and keep those separate so that people could just get there what they needed out of the book. And then if somebody wants to take it a little bit further, they can take it a little bit further. But it's not like you don't have to do it all in the book at the same time.
00:10:40
Speaker
Right, because there's like a sort of a QR code. There is indeed. and then they yeah And then you can sort of, there's workbooks and other kind of ah extra extra stuff, which is which is good.
00:10:56
Speaker
and like that So for for a lot of publishing, yeah you know getting the print the the book published and printed is only the start, right? you have to you now expected contractually to go around and promote?
00:11:13
Speaker
Well, this is the nice thing about working with this particular publishing company, because they are like an independent publishing company.
Impact of personal storytelling and reader feedback
00:11:20
Speaker
I own the rights to the book. and So we have published it through Amazon KDP. So it's a be available paperback and Kindle through KDP and the audiobook is coming. We're having a bit of a logistical nightmare with Amazon at the minute, but hopefully...
00:11:35
Speaker
By the time this goes out live, there will be an audiobook version for people to download. okay and and it's all sort and yeah And it's going to be your your voice, right? Because you have a nice voice. Thank you. It is going to be my lovely Scottish tones that read the book to you and the audiobook version. I love a Scottish accent. Thank you. It feels like putting on slippers you know and like warm your your hands on the hearth and it's just it's a night but just love it
00:12:08
Speaker
It makes me homesick, Jenny. I've never been...
00:12:13
Speaker
Homesick for what, Paul? For being in Blighty. You're not Scottish. No, but Blighty, you know. for being in Blighty. Yeah. Fair enough. It's not that great here at the moment, Paul, to be honest. I wouldn't mess it too much, to be fair.
00:12:29
Speaker
Yeah, I've heard some stuff. Yes. I've heard some stuff going on. Yes. Oh, man. But you know in terms of what you were saying there, i am I'm not contractually obliged because i i um with the publishing company, I paid them a fee for their services for all that, like we we mentioned before, the book cover and the typography, and a little bit of editorial input, them doing behind the scenes things and getting up on Amazon for me. and
00:13:00
Speaker
And so the book is mine, their job is finished. And I'm In terms of percentage, I get what Amazon don't take in terms of there's a cost to listing it on Amazon and they print the books on demand and all that jazz.
00:13:14
Speaker
and So I get a percentage of the book price and then it's mine. And so if it became wildly famous and I made it to the Sunday Times bestseller list, for example, ah traditional publisher could then knock on the door and say, we'd like to buy the rights to your book.
00:13:29
Speaker
And then a whole different process would start. oh Okay, that's good. I heard, i was listening to another podcast ah last week about a guy. He actually won an Oscar for a book that he wrote about a children's book, but it actually turns into ah an adult's book in the end. It's called Donkeys and Stuff, and it's like really simple little um quotes between, you know, discussions between a donkey and whatever.
00:13:57
Speaker
He won an Oscar for it. But he said something really amazing. He said he he doesn't care about all the things that he'd won, you know, awards that he'd won. He said he was walking through Liverpool Street in London and someone came up to him and said, oh, are you such and such an author?
00:14:14
Speaker
And he said, yeah. He said, I just want to say that you really, really helped me.
00:14:20
Speaker
And he said that was... That's what it's all about. That's what it's about.
00:14:27
Speaker
is, 100%. ah hundred percent
00:14:30
Speaker
but night i mean yeah You could have have think all the like trophies in the world and have all the numbers, but if someone comes up and says, look, you really helped me get through this.
00:14:42
Speaker
Yeah, and i mean what you were mentioning earlier on about it being an Amazon bestseller, that's a lovely thing, and I am grateful for that. But i am aware i I use that as a tool to get it out wider so that more people can get their hands on it, if you know what I mean. That is...
00:14:57
Speaker
yeah That's the the plus of having that little badge on my book cover, if you will, is that hopefully it'll then get into the hands of more people. And I have had some nice feedback ah about about it and about people sort of, like you say, getting in contact and saying, wow, this is like the first time that I've seen something as supportive as this. And that is literally the whole point. I want somebody to
Upcoming webinar and group program on self-discovery
00:15:20
Speaker
pick it up and feel valued and seen and validated, really.
00:15:25
Speaker
Right. Yeah, yeah and I know. I mean, it is is it is nice, isn't it, Paul? Like when we get someone who listens to the podcast and go, that was, oh got yeah thanks guys for doing this.
00:15:37
Speaker
And you kind of go, yeah yes, it's worth it. so I mean, exactly. I've got, ah there was someone there was someone who left a message a couple of weeks ago and I was it really emotional about it, you know. They said, oh, it's an important part of their day, you know. It's not you know what What more do you want?
00:16:00
Speaker
Do you know what? It's lovely when that happens because you know what what it feels like when you find something that you identify with that becomes an important part of your life. And so for somebody else to sort say that about something you've produced, it's kind of mind-blowing, isn't it?
00:16:15
Speaker
It is. Yeah, yeah. And speaking of and things, um Paul, this is this is a a a Matt Lamb cover. Yes. um um I'm getting technical here, but he'll know exactly what i'm talking about.
00:16:31
Speaker
Yes. What? And it's also um DIN, DIN Extra Bold Font. Yeah, there we go. Yeah. See, so we write the font. The curse of being a graphic designer.
00:16:46
Speaker
You can go with it. You go around, right you spend your whole life going around you just spotting what font it is. And you think, God, is that it? was not eight What a scale.
00:16:58
Speaker
What the hell. Yes. So so from and from an autistic ah aide ADHD perspective, having a matte laminated cover means it feels really nice. It's soft, isn't it?
00:17:13
Speaker
Like it feels soft. That's why I like a good matte lam. Mmm. I had the option to make it shiny and I was like, no, no, no, we want it matte. Thank you very much. You know made the right choice.
00:17:28
Speaker
You never want a shiny... laminated thing. So what's happening now, Jenny? What's on the horizon now?
00:17:40
Speaker
So now i've got to sell the book. and So that is a sort of, it's continuing on, like, you know, trying to make sure that it's getting out there and that that people can find it.
00:17:52
Speaker
ah But off off the back of that, I'm running a webinar at the end of November, which continues along the theme of how I like to speak um And it is called The Magical Vortex of Giving a Shit About Yourself.
00:18:06
Speaker
Nice. Catchy title. you I love a catchy title. So I'm doing a webinar at the end of November and that's all about sort self-love and looking after yourself and how important that is to your overall well-being.
00:18:24
Speaker
And then I've got a little group program that I'm running for the first time in January. ah which has also got more swear words in it, the title of it. I don't if you'd like me to share it here or not.
00:18:34
Speaker
Yeah, please. I do like a good, a good, I mean, our book, as as as I think I alluded to last, our book has got swearing everywhere.
00:18:45
Speaker
It is. Excellent. It is like literally every page will have swearing in it. Guaranteed. 20% more swearing. bearing bear mind to Bear in mind that after 104 5 episodes that we've done, Martin says at the end of every episode, take fucking good care of yourself.
00:19:06
Speaker
ah Right. but I mean, that is it, isn't it? Because we're so used to like being hard on ourselves. Yeah. Especially if you're late diagnosed.
00:19:17
Speaker
You know, like the monkey in your back is just really severe. you've spent a lifetime embodying and sort of imbibing, it's not the word I want to use, but and absorbing all of those different negative things and points of view and labels from other people.
00:19:37
Speaker
But that is, it's a real piece of work to start even being aware of that, let alone sort of working to try and reverse that. Right. and then Okay. So you, you, so you mentioned that there was going to be some swearing and then I, I cut in.
00:19:53
Speaker
there so the webinar is called um the magical vortex of having a shit about yourself and the group program that's coming in january is called find your fucking self uh and it's a 12-week program which kind of takes you through that journey of of self-discovery what does this mean now whether you've got a diagnosis or you just are suspecting that you are neurodivergent and sort taking people through the main themes that are in the book to explore on a more personal level and then hopefully come out at the end of it having found a bit more of their fucking selves.
00:20:27
Speaker
Nice. I like that. Find your fucking self. FYFS. Yes. FYFS. Yes. I've gone from life. I did that.
00:20:39
Speaker
eighty thousand I did I did that when i had a like massive breakdown about 12 years ago. and i said And it started from a really hard, difficult point, but a just a life-changing point in my life.
00:20:55
Speaker
I said, Paul, who the fucking hell are you?
00:21:00
Speaker
And it sounds simplistic. The hardest questions are those simple ones. like I'd be pretend to be someone else. And that was 10 years before I got a diagnosis.
00:21:14
Speaker
Yeah. You know, since like... It's having that curiosity, isn't it, Paul? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I remember that being really hard point, but I was excited about it as well.
00:21:29
Speaker
was really curious, like, oh, oh who are you? Yeah. And do you know what? You've touched on a really good point there in terms of that. So I've... For people that are discovering this about themselves or that have that late diagnosis, it's a complete rollercoaster ride. And you guys will both know this and you'll have experienced your own version of it.
00:21:48
Speaker
The idea of, oh, thank God, I've got a bit of information that explains things. This is amazing. And then... yeah oh, but my whole life before this point is like being a total lie. And it's like you're constantly having these, that's why that happens. That makes sense. And oh my God, why did nobody notice? And it's just like constantly. And I have to say that that is one of the things that people have said to me as well in conversation about the book is that like, you know, when does it, when do I stop feeling so like overwhelmed about all these things that I'm experiencing? And it does, it does come eventually, but it's a real up and down to begin with, isn't it?
00:22:23
Speaker
Oh, God, ruy it's such a rollercoaster. And then you start thinking about When do you start sharing it with with the family? You know. oh that is a loaded question. That's a very personal question, isn't it?
00:22:36
Speaker
Yeah. I told my father last week.
00:22:41
Speaker
Oh, how did he take that? Not bad. Well, I don't think he knew how to take it. It was like it wasn't good or it wasn't bad. it was just like... Yeah. Yeah, I knew it i knew it would be, like, pointless, put it that way.
00:23:01
Speaker
Yeah. He's 83, it's difficult, you know. They're really difficult concepts at that age. But, yeah. Yeah. um Yeah.
00:23:15
Speaker
I know what is fascinating, and though, when you say... When you say so he was 83, I've had so many eight women in their 60s contact me to say that they've just had a diagnosis or is it worth me going to get a diagnosis at this point in my life?
00:23:32
Speaker
And just even, you know, in your 60s and beyond, in fact, I had one lady that was in her 70s, only one so far. And it's just even at that point that it It has had an impact in a positive way, even having gone through so much life to just have that information, even at that point changed.
00:23:51
Speaker
been really positive so i don't think it's ever too late it's not understanding yourself never too late i've heard people that you know doctors or psychologists that have diagnosed people corps psychiatrists that have diagnosed people in their 80s it's never too late i mean it's a shame um we did an episode about regret you know ah ah wish I wish I'd discovered it many years before, but hey, you know it's okay.
00:24:23
Speaker
Yeah. It is. And that struggle, I like where... in your Just to kind of bring it back to your to to your book, you're quite open about where you do struggle.
00:24:37
Speaker
it's It's not like that you place yourself in a kind of like, I've reached the top of the highest mountain of this and I'm just going to teach everyone. It's like, no. It's superpower. Yay.
00:24:50
Speaker
hat but sp you but you But you do wear you know like ah where you do struggle, like in friendships, say, you you yeah you'll say, yeah, you know, like, look, this is something that I'm working on as well. So you definitely feel like you're a couple of steps ahead, but you're not but you're not in the distance. You know, you you are part of that person's journey as well. the Thank you for saying that, Martin.
00:25:19
Speaker
I appreciate that because... I think it's really ah authenticity is really important to me. And then all of my social media stuff that i put across, I ah ah want to always strike the balance between, oh my God, my life is so hard and shit.
00:25:33
Speaker
And, oh, it's OK. Everything's great all the time. Do you know what I mean? Because we all have days where it feels like that, like 10 times in the same day. And it's important that you know no one has got it all figured out. There is absolutely no one on the planet who has like reached peak. I understand myself and now I know everything.
00:25:52
Speaker
And I think all we can strive for is like knowing ourselves better and having grace and compassion with ourselves as we still figure shit out as we're going through life. Because we're I don't think we're ever going to and reach an age where we feel like the adultiest adult in the room, let's be honest.
00:26:10
Speaker
So you've just got have some compassion for the fact that it is still a journey. Yeah, yeah. I like the adultiest person in the room. but Friendship is such a common...
00:26:22
Speaker
Even if, you know, it's as we know, you know autism and ADHD, there's so many so many different aspects of it. and You know, different people have different clusters of those characteristics.
00:26:36
Speaker
But friendship is so common. Yeah. You know, it's actually such an interested developing and taking care of friendship, friendships.
00:26:50
Speaker
Yeah, and and I mean, I am quite honest in the book and i and actually I did a ah podcast episode on my own podcast for the start of this season about friends and friendship and how at the ripe old age of 41, don't think I'm ever going to find that tribe because I just haven't ever quite throughout my life just found those people. And interestingly, somebody put a comment on one of the posts I put on social media when I was describing this and what I was hoping for in a friendship.
00:27:17
Speaker
And they said, I think you're looking more for like a sibling type relationship, that kind of bond that you have with, you can have with siblings. They said, I think that that's what you're looking for. And I was like, oh, I'd never thought about that before, actually.
00:27:29
Speaker
Never crossed my mind. That's interesting. yeah Yeah, it's It's not easy, is it? Like when you get to a certain age, it it becomes like... It's almost like people almost kind of oh, I have enough friends now. I don't need any more friends. So, yeah, it it becomes hard to find people.
00:27:51
Speaker
Being late diagnosed, as I found on a lot of issues, like accepting some things, is so freaking liberating. Yeah, definitely. and just those...
00:28:06
Speaker
it's acknowledging that it's a struggle even. you know what mean? Like you say, it's really liberating. just that Instead of like beating yourself with a stick and being like, when am I going to get better at this thing? I need to be better at this. To be able to say, actually, I'm not very good at that and that's okay.
00:28:19
Speaker
Like you say, that's really liberating because then you can kind of like park that and move on with another aspect of your life. Yesterday, for example, it might seem like a really tiny detail, but yesterday went out of the house to get bread, some things for acid reflux, and to recharge my phone.
00:28:43
Speaker
I forgot two of those.
00:28:47
Speaker
I went back home. And where is maybe before my diagnosis or even... even after my do diagnosis, about a year ago, i would have been really hard on myself, you know, and would have trooped back, would have turned back, you know, in a mood, in a fluster.
00:29:07
Speaker
And this time, this time, yesterday went, it's okay. It's all right, Paul. You have a nice conversation with this yourself. We just walked back. It's just around the corner. But Paul,
00:29:20
Speaker
Paul, you you you you you basically violated this this golden ADHD rule, which I have in my head, right? Which is you can't remember three things, here right? You can only remember two things.
00:29:37
Speaker
If you add a third in, it's like a house of cards. It all just, you you'll forget either two of them or one of them. yeah luckily Luckily, one of the things i did remember was the acid reflux.
00:29:51
Speaker
Good, that's really important. God, it's a nightmare. When you get older.
00:29:58
Speaker
I don't. I used to have it, but i but I don't anymore. But weirdly, my green tea tastes a little bit like fish. And I'm not quite sure why. Okay.
00:30:09
Speaker
I feel like somehow, you know, like... if you've cooked fish and then somehow the fishy fish taste or the smell permeates into other things yeah it's somehow got into my green green tea and I'm not enjoying it to be honest so that's not very nice that's not I just thought share that where do you stand on kippers Jenny o my father-in-law likes a kipper on a Saturday morning I'm not a big fan
00:30:43
Speaker
Because it's Scottish thing, isn't it, the kipper? yeah Yeah, it's not my favourite, I'm not going to lie. Yeah, glad it's too much for me. It's a bit strong for me.
00:30:54
Speaker
if feel If you say, so what about haggis? um ah I am going to get it. I'm just going to have to test how much Scottish you you really really are. I very much do enjoy a bit of haggis, I'm not going to lie. yeah, but you all lack it.
00:31:10
Speaker
It's got to be with the tatties. Not a big fan of the neeps. Could take or leave them, to be fair. But yeah, bit mash. Lovely. Okay. All right. ninety nine point nine percent 99.9% Scottish then.
00:31:20
Speaker
There we go. Never had a deep fried Mars bar, so I don't know. That leaves some people to question my... it It's a bit of an urban myth, isn't it? It's mostly an urban myth, isn't yeah Yeah. they don't get me wrong. We do love a battered pizza, especially in the west of Scotland. Battered pizza's very nice.
00:31:40
Speaker
I have had, in New York, I had deep fried Oreos. so um Crunchy. wow it was it was It was good, man. It was good. I mean, just have one in your entire life.
00:31:56
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, exactly. good. I was watching last night a documentary about the demise of the of the chip shop.
00:32:06
Speaker
theyning in In the UK, the chip shop, there's virtually one closing every ah every other week. I do miss a fish and a chip supper.
00:32:19
Speaker
Yeah.
00:32:21
Speaker
That's sad. A little chat about suppers and general eating. ah Right. So um I'm going to bring it back back to the book. just Do that. That's your job, Martin.
00:32:35
Speaker
Because that is my job. It's like herding ADHD people. That's my my my job. ah And, um oh, ah yeah what I was going to do, Paul, was to work out the font size for you.
00:32:51
Speaker
Because I did want to kind of like... can guess it....say... definitely looks... It is, yeah, I mean, i would I would say that you're looking at a sort of a 13, possibly 14 point.
00:33:07
Speaker
Yeah, maybe 14 point. Yeah. a And it is a dyslexia-friendly font as well. i was I was made sure that we chose a dyslexia-friendly font make it accessible as possible. I didn't know that existed until Martin told me about two months ago there's a dyslexia-friendly font. I didn't know that.
00:33:30
Speaker
That's very cool. Yeah. and And then the other thing that i was going like is that it's kind of, it's broken up into like little chunks, into chunks.
00:33:40
Speaker
It's kind of quite, as you were saying, like when you were just, if you wanted to kind of like just cherry pick. But even within that, It's all kind of like bullet pointed out. it's just kind of got It's quite easy to just get something out of it without it being like don't have to read like these solid pages of text. It's kind of quite broken out, so you which I appreciate it.
00:34:07
Speaker
you So you the ah the webinars, how does that how does the ADHD ad asd autistic gen deal with webinars? Are you okay with those?
00:34:19
Speaker
I don't mind because I was a teacher for 16 years. So I've spoken in front of loads people. Like that's not a problem. And speaking in front of people, I've i've been i've done CPD delivery. Like I am...
00:34:32
Speaker
I don't mind that. The Scottish ADHD part of me really quite enjoys interacting with other human beings. And then the autistic part is like, no, we don't enjoy that. Pipe down. and So for the most part, the interaction with other humans on that level is quite good. And it's you know it's a webinar. I'm talking to a screen. I did that loads during COVID. So it's all good.
00:34:53
Speaker
I'm quite looking forward to that, to be honest. It's funny you mention that because um until I started teaching at high school two years ago, I'd never have believed that I could stand up in front of, even if it's teenagers, stand up in front of people and and talk.
00:35:12
Speaker
And now it's like second nature. I could do it, you know, no problem at all. It's just you trick your brain. You know, you can train your brain, even ADHD brain.
00:35:23
Speaker
You can do it. Yep. Definitely. You can absolutely trick it. And I find it really fascinating because I i was a music teacher for 16 years and I discovered in my autism assessment when we were going through various different things that one of my highest sensory issues is sound and sound input.
00:35:41
Speaker
And I was like, well, how come I was able to be a music teacher for 16 years and be in these really noisy, loud classrooms with keyboards and drum kits and like, you know, you can imagine. um And he said that in your sensory profile, your area of greatest need or distress s can also be your area of greatest strength.
00:36:01
Speaker
And was like, that just blows my mind. i don't understand how, but you know, I could be sitting in this room getting pissed off at hearing the sound of the electricity in the printer. yeah And yet I could also be in a classroom with 30 kids with keyboards playing with their headphones off. Do you know what mean? It's like, it just, I don't understand.
00:36:18
Speaker
That's really is interesting. You know what i i this This morning I went to the eye doctor to kind of like have my annual tests and stuff, and she pointed out that my optical nerve is is abnormally large.
00:36:38
Speaker
Wow. um Is that compliment? Ooh, sir. Your optic nerve is Thank you. just's take um And um was having this conversation with her, which was like, oh, so that means I'm getting more visual information in my in my brain than normal people. and she said, yeah.
00:37:05
Speaker
And I said, oh, Jesus, you know, like that with ADHD is like ah not necessarily always a great combo. But you're saying that, you know, that the that it can be your biggest strength as you know which I do find because you know I'm a visual artist-y yeah creative type, but also you know the actual visual world can actually just kind of ah burn me out yeah as well in in the in some way that you're saying that you're quite listening-centric.
00:37:43
Speaker
Yeah. and that that it's like that that It's a two-sided thing that you know that that has a good side and has ah That's a weird, bad bad sign. Yeah. That's very interesting. about Paul?
00:37:57
Speaker
I thought I was with you. When I was teaching, oh I got really uppity. There's a word I didn't think I was going to use today, uppity, about how bad the acoustics are, about how bad the acoustics are at school, you know, for learning.
00:38:15
Speaker
You know basic stuff. You know, they spend money on, like, really amazing, know, technological kind of... um projectors and stuff like that and connectivity.
00:38:29
Speaker
But the acoustics is so bad. And the problem for me was could hear if, like, there were two students at the back of the class who were whispering to each other.
00:38:43
Speaker
And if I had someone at the front of the class with me and they were talking to me, doing a presentation to me with their homework whatever, all I could hear was the two at the back, like, really loud,
00:38:58
Speaker
And the they just i gave them such hell about it. Saying, look, I know Prof Thompson always goes as on about this. Can you please, please learn to listen and just shut up?
00:39:12
Speaker
I didn't say it in those words. But I could literally hear the tiniest... the most you know really most um the most whispered conversation at the back of the class, that that's what drove me crazy.
00:39:29
Speaker
with the kind of The general chaos didn't really bother me that much. It was like more the subtle stuff. Yeah. So annoying. You don't teach anymore, Jenny.
00:39:42
Speaker
I do not. No, I got out the classroom in 2022. I left our left teaching and now I work for our local council. It's very boring. Okay. Is it?
00:39:54
Speaker
Yeah. Solid work though. Solid. Working for the council. Solid. Yeah, solid. That's it. We'll never go out a business. It's always going to be residents to look after, that's for sure.
00:40:05
Speaker
Right, right, right. Our local authorities, not one of the ones that has gone bust this year. So, you know, every cloud. Mm-hmm. Right, okay. Yeah.
00:40:17
Speaker
My sister-in-law, she's like, she she works for, I think she's like, she's fairly high up. she She's an accountant and she works for, like, I don't know, it used to be Hammersmith.
00:40:34
Speaker
But so like she was one of the ones that would like look at those but those were budgets and the money and and this this decide who was going bust and who was... Yeah.
00:40:47
Speaker
And you who who wasn't... I don't know why I mentioned it, but... The gor i last time we last time we last time we spoke, Jenny, I was still teaching at school and I gave it up in June.
00:41:03
Speaker
ah had to item I had an argument with the headmistress. Oh, yeah. Because she wanted me to go to all the meetings. Yeah. Oh, no.
00:41:16
Speaker
oh Yeah. and And I told her that she was unreasonable. and i'm sure that went down really well. It didn't go well at all.
00:41:30
Speaker
Didn't go well at all. I didn't get invited back, but they did give me a referral for another school. Well, I didn't want to go back. I'd burned my bridges at the school with their mistress,
00:41:44
Speaker
definitely But that's i found that I found everything about teaching was fine other than dealing with the bureaucracy and yeah the kind of um it's in the kind of um gossip between the teachers. Yeah.
00:42:04
Speaker
Oh, God, it was horrendous. Endless meetings. And I can't do meetings. Well, that's it endless meetings and emails yeah and parents' evenings.
00:42:16
Speaker
Oh, yeah, parents. I'm going to take us back to the book. Go on, Mark. Back to the book. Yeah.
00:42:25
Speaker
All right. You know what? You know what? You know what? let's Let's make this interesting. Paul, yeah give me a number between, like, I don't know. All right. Fair enough. There we go. Page 23. Let's see what little little nugget just comes, just springs out at at me.
00:42:45
Speaker
um Okay, there we go. Acceptance doesn't mean you stop striving to to to grow or to adapt. It means you stop seeing your traits through a purely moral lens of good or bad.
00:43:03
Speaker
Yeah, that's exactly what we were talking about before, isn't it? yeah we were talking by you know Just a random page, a nugget of gold, pull it out. What are chances?
00:43:15
Speaker
That was a really bizarre one. Very high. Very high. on the nail See, Paul? Yeah. On the nail. Very high. Yeah. Nail on the head.
00:43:27
Speaker
yeah Well. No, so I mean like, so go on. Well, coincidentally, Jenny, I did mention to Martin, we're like half, well, maybe halfway, almost halfway through our book, developing our book.
00:43:43
Speaker
ah You came up in my mind, i think I mentioned to Martin, that you could be potentially um ah kind of a sounding board for maybe, you know, the first draft, if you're up for that.
00:44:00
Speaker
I would love to critique the swear words that you're putting in your book. That would be a great pleasure. ah Thankfully for you, there isn't too much to read. It's not really lots of words.
00:44:16
Speaker
so Okay. So, you know, we're just going to make it easy on everyone by by taking most of the words out. That sounds excellent. it's like There's a lot of emphasis on the kind of visual part, that's for sure.
00:44:31
Speaker
Okay, I'm intrigued. And the cartoons and the sheer lunacy of the Monty Python-ness of it. Yeah, it's very Monty Python-y.
00:44:43
Speaker
and and Basically, every every time you turn a page, you think, what the hell is going to be next? So it's pretty, yeah, yeah pretty bad. Well, that's what you want in a book, though. That's what you want. Yeah.
00:44:55
Speaker
You want it to be a page turner. Absolutely. yeah And there'll be Easter eggs in there that you won't see until you see that page for the full time and then realise.
00:45:07
Speaker
um love that. Like a pick your own murder mystery book. Yeah. thick yeah go back ah okay Wait, i've seen I've seen that thing. there is There is a skunk on this page. Hang on second. There's exactly the same skunk over over on page 13. Oh, and on page 14.
00:45:25
Speaker
It's like fine like find like the the hidden skunk. It'd be like going to Woolworths in the nineteen eighty s to the pick and make section. Yeah. and Yeah. Yeah.
00:45:38
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, like, I think, you know, i think that kind of gets us to like where, you know, like we were trying to make this sort of, uh, this relatable to other people, which is like, you know, a lot of us have busy days.
00:45:51
Speaker
Yeah. And then those, these little, or I say little projects, I mean, they're, they they can be quite large projects that are on the side that we really struggle. I mean, like Paul and I are kind of doing it in ah doing our book in spits and starts, and he'll do a couple of pages and a couple of weeks will pass, and I'll do one. and But, you know, it's hard to kind of like focus on and get something achieved. So, i mean, firstly, it's a huge achievement to kind of get to get the book out when you've got everything else going on.
00:46:24
Speaker
But, you know, like how do we as ADHDers like, managed to make things happen that are on this what what the what ah what the Americans call the side of the desk.
00:46:37
Speaker
ah the the side of the of the te mual ze now the side of the of the desk You know, like where these kind of like things are not on your proper desk. They're on the side of the desk. These little yeah projects.
00:46:53
Speaker
so I think you've got to find a way. I think you've to find a way to bring it onto the desk and make it important. And the way I did that was to pay money to a company that were going to hold me accountable to a specific deadline. And then I had to say,
00:47:07
Speaker
right I need to go away for this weekend and i need to go away for this weekend and I need to get it written and I need to you know make sure I've got things done. And I also brought other people into the project. So I had five beta readers that I needed to have the book done to a certain point by so that they could have it because they were giving up their time for free to like give me the feedback on the book. So I made myself accountable to other people.
00:47:29
Speaker
and And I but put money on the project as well, which doesn't always, i mean, that isn't always a guarantee that I will be successful because, you know, ADHD tax, et cetera. But had to make I had to make it not just be my responsibility. I had to make sure that other people, I felt responsible to other people as well.
00:47:47
Speaker
But on the flip side of that, if you go down the traditional route, this though yeah especially for ADHD, there's a genuine possibility you could put a hell of a lot of time and effort into it and you just will never never find the right publisher at the right time.
00:48:05
Speaker
yeah not particularly Not necessarily because it's good or bad, but just because you know it just it's really hard. You need a lot luck. And if you haven't got a name for yourself, people aren't just going to bother.
00:48:21
Speaker
It's really hard out there, isn't it, to get published. Yeah, definitely. All right. Well, I think we can start to close things up, Paul. All I think. Yes. it we start to wrap things that All right.
00:48:34
Speaker
let' Just remind us the name of your webinar that you've got coming up, Jenny. It's the magical vortex of giving a shit about yourself on, I want to say the 26th of November. Is that a Wednesday? and day Yes. 26th of November. 2025. 2025.
00:48:48
Speaker
twenty seven twenty twenty five And I'm sure there'll be a link somewhere potentially in the show notes that people can click on. So i will I will put all of your, because um I will put your your your website, ah your TikTok page, your Facebook, um and I'll put all of that on to the show notes.
00:49:12
Speaker
And it says here, paid support. You can also do one-on-one coaching. Correct. I've got some spaces left this year. with With journey for personalised support of your unique journey.
00:49:24
Speaker
Yeah. yeah So there is lots of options for you to get in involved because it says the last words in this book, the last words, Paul, remember you don't have to do this journey alone.
00:49:41
Speaker
Correct. Yes. Okay. Okay. There we go. Excellent. Great job, Jenny. Brilliant. Amazing. right Well, thanks a lot. um And it just leaves ah me to say ADHDville is delivered every... Let's talk that again with the music.
00:50:01
Speaker
ADH Deville is delivered fresh every Tuesday to all providers of fine podcasts. Please subscribe to the pod and rate as most pumpkin-spice. Feel free to correspond at will in the comments. But wait, there's more if you wish to see our beautiful, beautiful faces and sunny forth to the YouTubes and the TikToks. You can also pick up a quill and email us at adhdville at gmail.com. But in the meantime, be fucking kind to yourself.
00:50:26
Speaker
And I beseech you fellow ADHDers, fare thee well with gladness of heart. And thanks a lot, Jenny, for coming on. Thanks, Jenny. um A pleasure to see you again. Thanks for having me, guys. Pleasure. It's been a real pleasure.
00:50:43
Speaker
All right. We can wave ourselves goodbye. I'm not going to hit the stop button.