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EP 6: Pros & Cons of Retainer vs. Project Work - Creating Value-Based Offers
131 Plays1 year ago
One of the (if not THE) most important aspects of your business as a freelancer or service provider is deciding what kind of offers you develop. In this episode, Lindsay and Betsy dive into two types: retainers vs. projects. We discuss the pros and cons of both types of offers and how you can create a value-based offer that fits into your season of life — not everyone wants to make TikTok videos to have a successful business.
Follow us online & come say hi!
- The Business Playdate Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thebusinessplaydate/
- Lindsay White's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lindsaywhite.co/
- Betsy Moorehead's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/betsymoorehead.biz/
- Learn more about Lindsay's marketing agency here: https://thewhitelabelcreative.com/
- Learn more about Betsy's marketing services here: https://betsymoorehead.com/
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Transcript
Introduction to Hosts and Podcast
00:00:01
Speaker
Welcome to the Business Playdate, a podcast hosted by Lindsay White and Betsy Moorehead, two internet strangers turned business besties. We're two marketing professionals living across the country, raising our kiddos while running our own individual businesses. We built these businesses based on our experiences working in corporate management roles with the end goal to be able to show up for our families first. And we did it. We're so happy you're here with us. Now let's get into this week's episode.
Weekly Catch-up and Parenting Adventures
00:00:31
Speaker
Hey guys, welcome back to the business play date. Lindsay, how's it going? Oh, it's going good over here. It's been a wild week. Lots of things going on. Lots of chaos. I mean, pretty usual. What else is new? I know chaos all the time. That's just kind of how we roll. No, things are good. These are good here. Just yeah. Rocking and rolling and it's been busy with work. Um, this has been like the first full week that my kids have been back in daycare for an actual full week.
00:00:58
Speaker
And I don't know, a month. So that's nice. No one has been sick this week, knock on wood. No one has like, had too big of a like,
00:01:09
Speaker
fit. So there's that. Oh, there's that's a that's a win. Yeah, I can't say the same over here. I mean, all children have been at school, but the fits the fits have been pretty astronomical. I mean, you know, we're seasons are changing too. So we're like, what is today or tomorrow, like the first day of fall. So just like, I don't know what it's like there. But here in Texas, and especially in the Houston area, summer is still alive and well, and it is miserable outside still.
00:01:36
Speaker
I have noticed a huge shift here. We are definitely entering fall and I am so grateful for it. So jealous. I'm ready to like be able to wear a sweater and like leggings and be cozy. You know, change my like work from home outfit from shorts in a tank or shorts in a sweater to like full on
00:01:53
Speaker
leggings and a sweater. I love it. I just ordered a bunch of sweaters online actually last weekend and I think I told you that I have had to secretly smuggle them all into my house without my husband noticing. So I've been pretty successful. Hopefully he doesn't listen to this podcast episode. But I was pretty proud of myself for that one. I know. The good thing about that is like online shopping, you can just buy a lot and then you return what you don't need. Exactly. Exactly.
00:02:21
Speaker
I mean, and if you're like me, you just like keep it until you can't return it anymore. And then you're just stuck with a whole closet full of clothes.
00:02:29
Speaker
I've been pretty good about returning, at least so far. So we will see. But as I think I told you this story, I drove up to the FedEx store to make a return from some shoes that I was hiding in the car. And as I drove up, my husband was walking right out of the restaurant next door and was like, What are you doing here? I was like, I am making a return. Surprise. I'm returning clothes. Have you seen the like
00:02:56
Speaker
I'm making money. Right? Have you seen the whole girl math thing? Yes. Oh, yes. I'm like, this is me earning money. I'm getting money back. I'm earning money. It's they're basically free. Oh my gosh. So funny. It is like, I don't know. I go back and forth with like that kind of stuff because it's like, Oh, it's making women sound dumb. But it is really funny because
00:03:16
Speaker
Well, I feel like it's so accurate because there's like the side where it's like, oh, it was only $22. So that means it was $20 and it was worth the buy. And then it's like, oh, but it was then with tax, it was $27.50. And now that's like practically $30, which is practically $50. So I can't buy it now. And I'm like, that's exactly how my brain works. It is. And then I'm always like, well, on Amazon, like I'm getting free shipping. So what's the deal? Yeah, deduct that. Yeah. And then anytime like I come home with a bunch of old Navy bags, Ryan will be like,
00:03:46
Speaker
What is going on? I'm like, listen, it was practically free. Yeah, it was on sale. It was on, it was, yeah, it was practically free and their clearance rack. I mean, I've gotten things off there for 50 cents. I know it's ridiculous. It's insane so much. Love it. Love it. Love it. Love it. Um, well, speaking of spending money, let's talk about how to make some
Project vs. Retainer Work: Aligning with Life Goals
00:04:07
Speaker
money. What's one of my favorite things so I can spend it. Um, so we wanted to dive into, um, a topic today that
00:04:18
Speaker
most of us know about but really like project work versus retainer work and kind of the difference between the two and you know what what might be good for your business and like what makes the most sense for you and for everybody.
00:04:34
Speaker
Yeah. And I mean, Betsy, you know, I talk about this a lot, but you know, aligning how you want your life and your business and your structure to be with the kinds of offers that you create is so important. It really is. We can touch on that too. It definitely defines like what your time is going to be, however you want to structure that for sure. What kind of services you offer. And I feel like you're fulfillment, you know, like, and obviously there's always going to be seasons of your life and seasons of your business that are different.
00:05:02
Speaker
being able to stay on top of like, am I happy with how I'm having structured right now? Do I need to change? Do I need to add a little more excitement? Or do I want to just be really steady right now? So we'll dive into all those
Understanding Retainer and Project Work Structures
00:05:12
Speaker
things. Yeah, yeah.
00:05:13
Speaker
So why don't we walk through real quick the difference between the two project work versus retainer work? Definitely. So retainer work we can start with. Retainer work is work that's done on a recurring basis. Usually there's some amount of deliverables involved and pretty much it is generally recurs. I don't know for me, they always recur monthly, but you know, it can, I've read, you know, yearly or 18 months. It just kind of depends on what you've got going on.
00:05:40
Speaker
Yeah, and then when it comes to project work, that's kind of what it sounds like. It's like a one time project that a client is hiring you for to come in, execute. And then generally you kind of get in, get out, like you come in as the expert, you execute the project, and then you're done. You know, they could be a one week deal, a six week deal, a six month project, you know, you can kind of just whatever the client needs. But there is a beginning and an end date that is firm that you've decided on.
00:06:08
Speaker
So, Betsy, what do you prefer? Do you have a preference between the two?
Personal Preferences in Work Types
00:06:14
Speaker
You know, it's funny because, I mean, I think it'd be silly not to say I prefer retainer work because of the steady income, but I do love a project. I do love the idea of something with a solid beginning and end date. I'm actually doing a big six-week project for a client right now, and we are three weeks in.
00:06:37
Speaker
It's been a lot of fun. I love that there's timelines and that there's a little bit more structure of deadlines and what you need and all of that. So I guess if I had a preference on recurring things coming in, I do love project work, but I don't have a lot of it. I have a lot of retainers. Yeah, yeah. No, I get that.
00:07:01
Speaker
I agree with you on a lot of the project work stuff. I think that projects are great, and I like how you mentioned the timelines because that's something I wasn't thinking about, but I'm working on a big project right now as well. I love the timeline aspect because oftentimes with my retainer clients, they'll suddenly pop up out of the blue and say, where is this
00:07:20
Speaker
piece, where is this project that we're working on at? Or what's the status of this? And it's like, Hey, I sent you like 12 emails and you haven't been getting back to me. And so like, it's kind of fallen off the radar and it's moved to the bottom of our priority list. We have all these other projects that are at the top of our priority list. But you know, there's kind of your inner retainer, your managing workflow in a different way and prioritizing things. Whereas in a project, obviously, you're working on probably one big deliverable. And you can give the client like I gave my client a huge
00:07:50
Speaker
timeline of exactly how this project is going to go and milestones that they needed to meet. I needed interviews with certain people, and if I didn't get those, then it was going to push our timeline back. So in order to have the deliverable by the end of the month, they needed to meet their milestones. And if they didn't, then it would result in the project being pushed out longer, which is fine. I'm absolutely okay with that.
00:08:11
Speaker
It's so much easier to have that upfront communication when you're working in a project style that has those timelines. So would you say you prefer projects over retainers or is it kind of like being like, I mean, it's nice to have both.
Client Compatibility and Financial Strategies
00:08:25
Speaker
I think it's nice to have both. I love Intensive First where you do a project on the front end and then you kind of roll into retainer. I like it because I can try out my client before I actually sign them on for recurring, you know, marrying myself to them, knowing we're going to work together for the long haul.
00:08:41
Speaker
Um, and I also like it because it allows me to kind of know what the retainer is going to look like a lot better. But that said, you know, I like, I like both. I kind of have always treated retainer income like my salary, right? Like I know it's coming in each month. I can budget my life around that. And then project income, I kind of treat as like my bonus money, like my fund money. Yeah. Oh, that's a good way of looking at it. Yeah.
00:09:07
Speaker
I would agree with that, but I would have never thought of it like that. So it's a good... Yeah, like I bottle those sweaters last weekend and I smuggled them into my house with my project money. And two, I mean, I know we're going to get into the pros and cons of each, but that just like made me think.
00:09:22
Speaker
Let's say you have steady retainers every month, but yeah, you want to go on a trip or you're planning a vacation or you Christmas, you know, you could look at the six to eight weeks before these big events trying to find a project or working with, you know, an old client that maybe needs somebody to come in and help them with some project work. So that's a good, that's a good way to look at it as like your bonus money. Yeah, definitely.
00:09:48
Speaker
I mean, I'm sure too, there's some people who only work on project basis and I would love to learn a little bit more about how that works. We should bring someone in who only works on project basis. We should. If you only work on project basis, hit us up in the DMs. We would love to learn more about that.
00:10:03
Speaker
Absolutely. I think projects are interesting too, because I know we wanted to dive into the pros and cons and there's no structure as to what we're talking about at this exact moment. Never. Chaos, always. But with projects, I think one of the things that also deters me from projects is the requirement to constantly be hustling. I am not like a super salesy person. I love creating relationships. And so I also like that aspect of retainers.
00:10:32
Speaker
But with projects, if you are only offering projects, you have to constantly be selling. I mean, unless your projects are like $40,000 and you can just sell a couple a year. But if your projects are a couple thousand dollars, you probably need to be selling them pretty frequently in order to hit your income goals.
Value and Benefits of Project Work
00:10:51
Speaker
Yeah. It's interesting you said that about a really high value project because in my old job,
00:10:57
Speaker
We did have a contractor that we worked with who did one big project. I mean, it was like a couple months long project and it was probably one of two projects that they did all year long. Oh yeah. One of my, one of my very first clients that I did a marketing strategy plan for, she only offers one project spot a year.
00:11:14
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Which is wild, but I don't know how much it was worth, but it was very high value, very high ticket, and she only offered one of them a year. But she worked on it almost the whole year. Yeah, that's interesting. Well, let's get into that then. Let's get into the pros and cons of each. So maybe we start with the pros of
00:11:34
Speaker
project work? Yeah, that sounds great. Okay, so we touched on a couple of these. But so some of the pros on project work would be, you know, they're one time, you get in, you get out, there's a strict timeline, there's, you know, you can kind of put some of it back on the client as to, you know, here are the deadlines we need to meet.
00:11:52
Speaker
You have these responsibilities to help us meet these deadlines. There's a very structured look at the scope of the project. Absolutely. They're very concrete, but they're deliverables. You know you're selling a specific deliverable or set of deliverables,
00:12:08
Speaker
And you know what to provide. The client knows what to expect. And it's very concrete. There's no wishy-washiness there. There's two. Sometimes companies have annual projects that they need someone to come in and do, like I was talking about this project that I used to work with in my nine to five. And so there's the chance, maybe it's not a retainer, monthly income, but you know annually that if you do a good job on that project one year, they're probably going to hire you to do it again the next.
00:12:36
Speaker
So there's that opportunity too, that's a pro. Yeah. And the high value, I mean, I think that when it comes to most projects, usually you can charge more, especially if you're not attributing it to hourly income, you know? So your project is based off these deliverables and this is the price, generally you're going to come out ahead.
00:12:56
Speaker
in those kinds of projects from an income perspective. And then, you know, obviously this kind of goes back to what the point before, but you get you in the door with people, you know, maybe you are trying to get in the door with somebody as a retainer client, come in and do an intensive first, a high value project for them.
00:13:15
Speaker
It gets your name in the industry or in the space. And then that gives you the opportunity to be hired out or referred, you know, so it kind of gets you in the door with a certain company, a certain industry.
00:13:27
Speaker
I mean, I'm sure even like a lot of corporate companies are looking for one-time projects that they need people to do, like their marketing team or their internal people don't have the capacity or time to take on. Or their skill set. I mean, I was talking, I was featured on a podcast yesterday and her and I were talking about the podcasting and how a lot of corporate companies are starting these podcasts, but they may not know how to start the podcast, you know, and they could bring in an expert because their marketing team probably doesn't have a podcast on it.
00:13:57
Speaker
And so thinking about what you can do from a value standpoint, like what are you a subject matter expert on and how can you provide that in a project basis to some of these companies that might have a marketing department but need to pull in an expert for certain things? Oh yeah, come in as the authority. That's a huge pro too.
Advantages of Retainer Work for Stability
00:14:16
Speaker
Definitely. What about some cons?
00:14:18
Speaker
Yeah, let's talk about some cons. Not a steady income. That's kind of a con for me. Yeah, you can't really, like you said, treat it as a salary. You can't really budget your life around project work because it may come in, it may not. Yeah. I mean, you have to constantly be hustling to bring those clients in. And I talk about this a lot with the director of marketing group.
00:14:41
Speaker
The need to hustle can be such a turn off to some people or people love it. It's like, do you want to have face to camera on social media? Do you want to constantly be creating content to sell your deliverables?
00:14:52
Speaker
If you do, then projects are probably for you. But if you are like, I hate being on social media, I do not want to be the face guy, then retainers are probably great for you. And I know we'll kind of dive into that in a minute, but you know, one of the cons or pros depends on who you are and how you look at it, what you like to do and get fulfillment from is that constant need to hustle or make sales. Totally agree. I personally do not like, I mean, I know I'm like, my face is on my Instagram a lot.
00:15:23
Speaker
But I personally don't like to have to market myself, like market my services, all of that. I'm not like a dance on reels kind of girl. It's just not for me. I've tried. It's just awkward. I can't make it work. There are a lot of people out there that can. And I love watching them. Love that for you. Not for me. I feel very awkward. It's very awkward.
00:15:43
Speaker
Well, I think too, so that's a good segue into some of the pros of retainer work. You also don't have to hustle because you do have a steady income. You can find your sweet spot. You can find your sweet spot. I mean, how many clients do you need to hit your income goals? Do you want $10,000 a month? You can get four retainer clients at $2,500 a piece. That's very attainable.
00:16:06
Speaker
Oh, it's very attainable. Oh yeah. I think too, like when you first get started, especially like coming from the corporate world, right? You're trying to recoup a salary. It's probably pretty decent. Pretty decent salary. Yeah. And I remember when I started, it was like, okay, I need to try to recoup my income. Here's what I need to get for that. And then, oh, it'd be nice if I could actually make a little bit more than I was because taxes, you know?
00:16:28
Speaker
self employed, that's a fun journey. But yeah, you have to think about structuring them what that looks like, who's going to pay that much, you know, so there is a little bit more maybe, and that's maybe a con, but like, there's a little bit more upfront thought to it all on how you're going to charge and whatnot. But once you get in and get your
00:16:51
Speaker
sweet spot of, yeah, for me, it's like three or four retainers a month. I love having that. Yeah, same. I don't like to work with much more than a handful of clients at a time. And you hit your goals through what kind of clients you're working with. Do you have a niche? Are you an expert at something? Do you command authority when you walk in? And so being able to exude all of those leadership skills is something that's going to continue to help you get paid in these retainer positions.
00:17:16
Speaker
Yeah, and to like you, another pro would be you're, you're building relationships, you're learning more about your client, their business, like you're truly coming in and being a part of their team. And I like that about retainers because, you know, coming from a corporate job where you were working with people very closely every day in an office setting or remotely, you know, you feel like you're part of a team when it comes to a retainer. And I like that aspect of it.
00:17:43
Speaker
And I also like the relationship aspect where you know kind of what to expect. I have clients who are just totally different. Some of them are like, oh, just take it. Run with it. I don't care. Don't run it by me. You have full authority. And then I have other ones that I know are going to nitpick the shit out of something. And so I can balance that into my brain or my timelines. I'm like, OK, client A, I can send it the day we need to post it and just be like, this was posted. Client B, I need to send it a week in advance because I know we're going to have some back and forth on it.
00:18:13
Speaker
Oh yeah, you definitely learn the personalities that you're working with and can structure your communication around that. And you can set your own expectations and your client's expectations way better that way. Absolutely. Cons to retainer work and this, we have a whole episode on this scope creep can happen pretty easily with retainer work. And so that's just, that's a con, but you manage it, go back and listen to that. What was it? Four or five? Oh no, episode four. Was it four?
00:18:43
Speaker
I think it's the fifth one on there, but it's called scope for you. You'll find it. We're new to this. Okay. We're all learning. Yeah. Go listen to that. There's definitely ways to avoid it with retainer work, but you know, I think that would be probably the first column that stands out in my mind is definitely a potential for that. Definitely. I think also the ability to get bored pretty easily, you know, you're kind of just in that mundane, I don't know about you, but especially when I was in corporate, I mean, I would work in a job for maybe six months to a year and I'd be like, all right, what's the next thing?
00:19:11
Speaker
I need something new. So you can get kind of bored with retainer work and you have to constantly, you know, think of new ideas to make it your own. I mean, it is it's what you make of it. So yeah, I mean, the room for growth is kind of minimal from like a professional level for you, right? Unless you are going to just totally change what your retainer is with your client or your services. I've had to do that a couple of times like, okay, well, we, we've been doing this for, you know, eight months to a year.
00:19:40
Speaker
on changing my business a little bit, you know, that's kind of a con like having to have that uncomfortable conversation like what if they can't afford to pay your your rates or whatever you're so there is kind of that like limited room for growth, right with the potential of like
00:19:54
Speaker
Ooh, it may not work out, but you just move on and you find something else. Exactly. And I mean, with projects, it's so easy to raise your rates because you just changed on your website or whatever that my price went from $500 to $750. But with a retainer, you have to have those conversations and raise those rates with your clients directly. Yeah. I think those are some pretty good pros and cons of both. Absolutely. You've talked about this a lot and I know in the director of marketing group, but can you tell everyone a little bit more about like
00:20:24
Speaker
not the intensive first, but like how those can lead into retainer work. And again, I know we've talked about it a little bit, but I think this episode really lends to that topic of project work could lead into retainer work.
00:20:37
Speaker
Absolutely. So one thing that I always preface is starting with a really big project, even if you do intend on bringing the client on, on retainer, make it a planning project or some sort of strategy oriented project. So I always do marketing strategy plans as my first project with clients, because it sets us up on the right foot together, but it allows me to dive so deep into their business and try them out as a client, you know, like we make a plan. So this big,
00:21:06
Speaker
projects that I'll do. I'll dive into their business. I'll learn all about their business. I will figure out what makes them better than other competitors within the marketplace and all of those different pieces of the puzzle. And then we'll put a plan together that's like, okay, this is what we need to do to hit your marketing goals. And these are the tactics we need to take. And this is what I can manage for you. And so it allows me to get paid to put a proposal together, which I think is amazing because sometimes you spend hours on proposals.
00:21:34
Speaker
And you're not getting paid for that time. You're just hoping that you get the client where if you can sell a package on the front end that's like, hey, this is what's in my package. This is where we're going to start. Then you can kind of go down the path. So one thing that I always push with my clients is in order to work with me, because I do director of marketing services, fractional director of marketing services,
00:22:00
Speaker
And so you have to have a brand before we do anything. If you don't have a brand established and that's more than just your colors and your logos, that is colors, logos, typography, plus your mission statement, plus your value statement, plus your vision statement. Like we need to know from a cultural perspective who you are because I can't build out a content plan for you or start speaking in your voice until you have all of that.
00:22:25
Speaker
Yeah. And that takes a lot of research and really diving into the company to understand all of that. And if they don't have that already in place, then you as an outsider coming in. How are you going to know it? Right. So that's kind of the first thing. That's a project that me and my team can do for you if you don't have that established. If you do have that established, great. Then we go into the next project phase, which would be a marketing strategy plan, which is really diving into
00:22:48
Speaker
the competitive landscape, what their business goals are, what their marketing goals are, and then aligning those marketing tactics with those business goals so that they can reach them. And so part of that is of course figuring out, okay, each quarter, you know, what piece of content are we going to focus on? What does this look like? Are we putting out
00:23:03
Speaker
monthly YouTube videos or weekly podcasts, how are we leveraging that content? What does our content repurposing wheel look like? And so through these series of projects, we are making a plan and knowing what the rest of the year is going to look like once we're on retainer. From a proactive standpoint. From a proactive standpoint. Huge to understand. Yes.
00:23:29
Speaker
There is the total difference between proactive and reactive when it comes to your marketing efforts. And like Lindsay's talking about, having that marketing strategy established upfront for a client helps everything be proactive throughout the year. Yes. I mean, having a plan to follow, it's
00:23:45
Speaker
allows you to set expectations with the client. It allows the client to know what's up and it also allows you guys to stay the course. You know what the goals are and you've made a plan to reach those goals rather than, I'll have clients who listen to a podcast and it's like, oh my gosh, Lindsay, I heard about, we should launch a podcast. We should launch our own podcast. I heard it's the greatest new marketing tool. I'm like, well,
00:24:09
Speaker
Are your clients on podcasts? You're a restaurant. Do you really need a podcast to bring people through the door? And so it's these wild ideas, shiny object syndrome, and throwing spaghetti at the wall that you just totally avoid if you have a plan in place, a proactive plan in place. Now, of course, there's going to be reactive efforts. I mean, I would say my rules of thumb is always 80-20 is 80% proactive, 20% reactive. I don't know what yours is, Betsy. I like that. Sure.
00:24:39
Speaker
So I always kind of operate under that mindset, like, yes, we're going to have great opportunities thrown our way, or maybe there's an event that we want to sponsor and it suddenly comes up, but we'll capitalize on that. We will build out what's needed and make sure that it's the best it can possibly be, but that should only be 20% of our efforts.
00:24:57
Speaker
Yeah, and to like, so back to like the retainer versus project work, what Lindsay just talked about was building up this marketing strategy, having this intensive first, first, as your project work, it could then lead into a retainer opportunity, which then you get to be the one essentially, let's say that's what the deal is to execute it and handle the reactive marketing as it comes up for your client, because you're on a retainer monthly retainer basis with them.
00:25:25
Speaker
And it allows you to try out the client first. I have had people that I've done projects for, I've done marketing strategies for, and I'm like, yeah, I don't think this is going to be a great fit, but I'm happy to.
00:25:36
Speaker
provide you some other recommendations of people who could take this plan and execute it for you because we went into the project on the agreement that we were just working on the project and then the next phase would potentially be a retainer. And so it allows you to make sure that you're the right fit, that you have the skills to provide them the most value that they need.
00:25:55
Speaker
Or that from a relationship standpoint, you know, they are the right fit for you. Or maybe there's a bunch of red flags that come up. Who knows? Like projects can be a lot more creative sometimes. Like we, I think we set a con to retainer work is sometimes you can get a little bored. So taking on a project here and there can really help that creative side of your brain, whether it's
00:26:14
Speaker
know, marketing strategy, I mean, like really like diving into the details, building out like this beautiful deck, whatever it is, I love that I'm working on like an annual report for a client right now to which is going to be have some creative aspects to it. But to like with projects, if they're really, really massive, like that you have the opportunity to bring on, I know you do this, like you have people on a team that you work with, like a dedicated copywriter, a dedicated
00:26:41
Speaker
graphic designer, you know, if you can handle all that on your own, and it's a smaller scale project, great. But that gives you the opportunity to test even out like an agency model a little bit with project work. Yeah. And I mean, going into a project, you should know exactly what deliverables are coming out of it. So it's a lot easier to scope out what you need to bring on to your team to make it happen.
00:27:03
Speaker
No, I love it. I think, you know, there's obviously pros and cons to both. There's really, it's just kind of whatever makes sense for your life and how you want, like you were talking at the beginning, how you want your business to fit the values that you have for your life. Yeah. I mean, you have to think about what fulfills a lot of times people will come to me and they'll say, Hey, like I'm not loving this whole business day. And it's like, well, why? And you can get to the, oftentimes the root of the issue is their offer.
00:27:34
Speaker
It's less to do with the skills and more to do with the offer. It's like, oh, I feel overwhelmed. I need all this childcare and I am not able to structure my days the way that I wanted to and I don't have as much as control. And it's like, okay, well, let's look at why. Maybe you're working on retainers and you feel like you're a slave to your clients and maybe we need to find
00:27:53
Speaker
a different retainer structure, or maybe we need to go into just projects. Or maybe you feel like you need to be dancing on cameras in order to get these projects based clients. And you're like, this is not fun. Like I didn't go into business to make TikToks all day. It's like, well, let's stop selling projects and let's find four retainer clients for you. Kind of make it what you want. And there's a way to do that with both of these models. But you know, you could be like us and do both of them and kind of
00:28:20
Speaker
Yeah. Figure out what works for you. Yeah. Christmas is right around the corner. It's a great time to try to project. It is. It is, man. And what a busy season for companies in general. I mean, talk about not having to hustle. Like right now, people need help. Yes. And so there might be a lot of project opportunities on the horizon if you hear about them or if you
00:28:44
Speaker
If you look for them, definitely, but I think this was good. And again, you know, if you guys have questions about projects versus retainers, shoot them into our DMS. We are constantly looking for new ideas to help you. So shoot your questions in there.
00:29:00
Speaker
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00:29:29
Speaker
It totally makes our day. It definitely does. But thanks for joining us. We hope you like this episode. And make sure you're also following at the Business Playdate on Instagram. And we'll see you next time. Bye guys.