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00:00:01
Low Key Happy (Insecure)
12 Plays4 years ago
In this week's episode my good friend Crystal and I talk about our favorite show Insecure.
If you're interested in following Crystal on social media you can find her on instagram at @doc_martin_2.0
Follow me on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter! I'm @elianeanita!
If you want to send me an email you can email me at [email protected] instagram.com/elianeanita
twitter.com/elianeanita
Snapchat: ElianeAnita
Track Produced by: Devo Beats
Recorded, Produced and Edited by: Éliane Anita
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Transcript
Introduction and Theme
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to the Eliana Nita podcast, the podcast created to inform, challenge and empower you. Now let's get down to business.
00:00:23
Speaker
Hi guys, welcome back to the show. I am so excited to have you join me this week for the show. I brought on a special guest who is not a stranger to the podcast, Dr. Crystal Martin, and we discussed our favorite show, Insecure. This is a very light and airy episode. I just kinda wanted to break up the episode because I know that
00:00:51
Speaker
future shows I'm going to be talking about some very heavy topics so I wanted to put this in the middle of some of the heavy topics that I'll be talking about to kind of give us something to relax and decompress with and so this episode is very fun we give a lot of insights we give our theories and what we feel and what we've learned from the show so I hope you guys enjoy it and until I talk to you guys again
00:01:21
Speaker
Love you and peace.
Introducing Dr. Crystal Martin and 'Insecure' Discussion
00:01:25
Speaker
So guys, I have the wonderful and brilliant Dr. Crystal Martin and she is no stranger to the Alienity podcast. She was on and she talked with us about the show Insecure, one of our favorite shows. So Crystal, go ahead and introduce yourself. Say hi to everybody. We miss you.
00:01:46
Speaker
Hey girl, hey. You know the doctor title when we're doing this kind of subject matter is really, really interesting because it's really like I'm about to drop some profound insight and we're talking about a TV show. Right.
00:02:03
Speaker
I'm so excited to have you. I mean, this is, we need this. We just need a moment, especially in this climate. So our favorite TV show is in its fourth season, which is so phenomenal. And they, I, they actually signed on for fifth season. So we know for sure we're getting one more season.
00:02:24
Speaker
from Insecure. So this is crazy. Like this, I feel like this whole season of the show has been a roller coaster ride.
Episode Pacing and Content Choices
00:02:33
Speaker
What do you think? Girl, girl, you know, I was, I had a very interesting take on this season because I was not very interested in the episodes that followed the block party. You know, I did watch them of course, but I, you know, they, they,
00:02:51
Speaker
did not captivate me in ways that, you know, previous episodes have. And maybe that's something we can talk about, the reasons why, just by talking about the content of what was going on in those particular episodes. But, so I didn't have huge expectations for the season until this past episode, which knocked me off my feet, and I'm sure we're gonna talk about it.
00:03:18
Speaker
Oh, for sure. I feel like I agree with you because I felt like a lot of this season lackluster. And I feel like all of the other seasons went so hard, but I feel like the reason why they
00:03:34
Speaker
could take some time and breathe and kind of like drag out some of the episodes is because they know they have another season coming up and I feel like like all of the other seasons they had to really like give us so much from every episode and now that we know we have another season coming they can kind of like drag out some of the content because like even the
00:03:55
Speaker
I feel like the last episode with Molly and her man when they was in Mexico, and it was just basically about them two, I was like, this was a very boring episode. It was like nothing came from it. I know that she was triggered, obviously, by her boyfriend's brother. And she called her therapist because she realized she has trouble letting things go. But it was like, OK, well, what is the point of this episode?
00:04:25
Speaker
Right. No, I agree. And I think that I feel like the episode, the the block party episode was so explosive. So I think I'm enjoying Candola a little bit, but I I just, you know, I feel like the way that she ghosted is the isa was ridiculous. What do you feel about that?
Character Relationships and Dynamics
00:04:50
Speaker
Oh, Condola is a very
00:04:53
Speaker
interesting character, because I have never been, I have not been able to resolve my feelings for her. Now, um, here's the thing that I do know, for whatever reason, and maybe I'm the only person that feels this way, I have never felt truly invested in the friendship between Issa and Molly. Like, I know they're friends in long term. No, never felt it. Nope.
00:05:21
Speaker
I just told someone like, I'm good on Molly. Yes. Molly is trash this season. Molly is trash. Yeah. I like Molly as a character independent of Isa. I even like her as a part of their
00:05:38
Speaker
What do you call it? Like their friendship circle? Yeah. Like I like her as a part of that. I don't know if I like her as a best friend and I don't know that I ever have because something has always felt disingenuine about their relationship from the very first season to me.
00:05:57
Speaker
You know, I think that's a very, very interesting thing that I took away from this season, especially with the development of Issa and Molly's relationship or the decline of it, rather. But I think that I realized that as long as Issa had drama, as long as Issa was
00:06:16
Speaker
you know, kind of in between stuff and was needy. And I feel like when she started to see how Issa was finding her voice, she was finding her place, she was really getting into the groove of things. I felt like she had to find a way to sabotage it.
00:06:33
Speaker
And I think that Molly is such, she is a self-sabotage in many ways. And so I felt like she had to sabotage a relationship in some facet or another, whether it was with Issa, whether it was with her boyfriend or somebody, she had to sabotage it.
00:06:52
Speaker
And I just don't understand why because I mean, like even in the season where I mean, like in this particular season where you see her get jealous when she spent the time with Condola and how she even thanking Dola for remembering. I think it was like either the first or second second episode when she had like kickback at her place.
00:07:13
Speaker
And she was kind of just saying, like, thank you, Kedola, for everything you've done. And Molly kind of like rolled her eyes and was like super jealous. And I was like, hey, this is her business partner. Like, she's helping her out. So yeah. Their relationship is very, very much so. Co-dependent.
00:07:32
Speaker
you know on both sides and i think that that has been true for the duration of what we've seen now what's interesting is we do not know the context of their or the nature of their relationship while you know prior to isa and lawrence's breakup so we don't know what kind of real like friend she was to
00:07:53
Speaker
when the relationship with Lawrence was good, because I'm assuming there had to be at least a point of time where their relationship was at least functioning. And we don't know if Molly was a, you know, if she was the same kind of friend there because the series started at the
00:08:10
Speaker
crux of the problems between Isa and Lawrence. So we know her as a savior almost to Isa. That's the only way we've seen her. So we don't know if when things were good in Isa's life, if she was the same type of friend or not. But what we're learning about her, what we're learning about the two of them is that their relationship is codependent. I see Isa as Miley's struggle friend.
00:08:35
Speaker
And their relationship is good if Issa is struggling because then Mollie feels needed. I think that it is great that they introduce the whole therapy part for her because then at least we know that she recognizes there's a problem so we can't fully hate her. But I feel like this season gave me my resolve. Prior seasons, I was like, something awful about Mollie. But this season, I was like, OK, I've settled it. No.
00:09:06
Speaker
But you know, with Molly, she has, she is, it's not only, um, if you remember at the end of last season, when she was with the last episode, when she was with her therapist and she was having issues at work and her therapist said, she said this, like, why do you feel the need to always win?
00:09:27
Speaker
Like, why do you feel, or something to that degree. She was like, why do you feel like you always have to be on top or always
Character Analysis: Molly and Issa
00:09:35
Speaker
win? And I think that that is a struggle for Molly because I feel like her whole reasoning for not wanting to help Issa, it had nothing to do with her setting boundaries around her relationship.
00:09:47
Speaker
It had everything to do with her wanting to see Issa struggle and fail. And when it was such a huge success, it was like, I got to blow up. I got to do something to ruin this moment for her. And I just felt like even at that moment, like, OK, even if you were upset, I felt like you could have took that time and let her have her moment and then talk to her about it later. I just did not think it was necessary to.
00:10:13
Speaker
Yes. And I mean, people even thought that she pulled out a gun. It was just ridiculous. She totally ruined that moment for her. Interesting thing about that part. Sorry to cut you off, but interesting thing about that scene, and I'm probably the only person who picked up on this, is that Molly used the line from The Five Heartbeats. She said,
00:10:37
Speaker
You're saying selfish bastard, you always better something to that effect. And it made me think of that. Well, that that line to me is directly correlates with line from the five heartbeats between Duck and his brother. I forget the Leon's character. I can't remember his name. Oh, yeah. Yeah. But but I stole his girlfriend.
00:11:00
Speaker
And so I was like, hmm, I wonder if it was coincidental that that line directly corresponds to the line from the five heartbeats, but in the event that it doesn't, I was like, what would Issa have stolen from Molly? And the only thing I could think is in that moment, she stole success.
00:11:18
Speaker
You know, in that particular moment, she was successful and that unnerved her. I feel like that unnerved Miley in a way. Yeah, I'm like, this is your struggle for anger. Miley feels validated by Lisa, by Isa's struggle.
00:11:38
Speaker
Oh, yeah, for sure. I think that, I mean, even if we look at her work dynamic, she feels like she always has to be the center of attention. She has to be the person that's on top. She has to be the person that everybody go to, everybody look to, so forth and so on. And that's why her relationship is so strained with the guy at work, where he's just like, I don't even want to be bothered with you because you snub us.
00:12:05
Speaker
I feel like she has to work her way back to that. But I think that it's only so much time before she ruins that relationship. And even with Molly, with her dad, I feel like I know it was devastating for her to find out that her father had an affair. But it was years ago. And they got over it. And the parents are fine. And they're still married.
00:12:29
Speaker
And for her to feel like she has to carry that burden, that anger, that hatred, I want to understand more behind that. Why do she feel like you have to have that? I didn't understand, because I'm like, OK, so you're this upset about your parents having your dad having this affair on your mom. But you resolved your feelings by having this relationship with Jerome, who, even though he was in an open relationship, was still married. So is this really a strong value of yours?
00:12:58
Speaker
Or what do you just think was convenient for you in the moment? So I'm telling you, I don't know, maybe I got my own scars about friendships. But I'm telling you, you know, since maybe the first season, I was, you know, I was kind of on the fence about Molly Bobthilling. I'm good on Molly this season.
00:13:18
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I was like, after that, after the block party, I was like, okay, I feel like I was building up my discontentment for her, because I felt like they, they had like a really good relationship, at least it appeared to be and then after this season, I started to think about Molly's behavior in the past and I'm like,
00:13:40
Speaker
Oh, she really don't like Issa's success. She just don't want to ever see her win or ever take advantage of her brilliance. And honestly, Issa really glowed up this season. She looks pretty up. She does. She honestly took a whole jump.
00:14:04
Speaker
Yeah. And I mean, like, even I feel like when and this is what I guess we're building up to this, this one, this last episode that we've seen Loki happy. But I really feel like Isa really took the steps to become a happier person, a healthier person. Now, obviously,
00:14:22
Speaker
She's not perfect, and she's still making some mistakes. But I really feel like in the essence of her taking the steps, even from her quitting her job last season to getting her own place, to organizing it, to organizing her thoughts, her feelings, and actually doing something impactful for her community. And I feel like these steps was leading up to her being able to communicate herself better, to be able to know what she wants in the moment,
00:14:51
Speaker
to even know what makes her happy is a huge thing because most people don't even know what makes them happy. Absolutely. I think a huge scene for me, just showing her level of growth is when after the black party, she stopped and she cleaned up her house and they had that whole montage of her cleaning. And I'm like, people don't know what cleaning up your house will do for your mental health. Like, I feel like all of that clutter was a sign of her kind of getting her stuff in order.
00:15:18
Speaker
You know, like, like, okay, now that was over. I did that. It was great. Now, let me get every aspect of my life in alignment with that one success. It's that, that built her self-confidence, not self-esteem, but, but just having that, that win of the black party built her confidence in other areas. And I do, I agree with you, but it's starting to show, um, in her behaviors and it's even,
00:15:47
Speaker
You know, it's a character, but it's even showing hourly this last episode. I was like, you're pretty, pretty on this episode. Yes. I mean, I feel like even the awkwardness about her is shifting into a more mature,
00:16:04
Speaker
Yeah, a more steady and stable ESA. And I mean, like, even even listening to her, like, I don't know if you, you know, pay attention to how she communicated throughout the seasons, but her directness, I love
00:16:19
Speaker
I love the engagement that her and Lawrence had in this past episode where they were sitting at the table and they was able to talk and really express their feelings towards one another. I mean, Issa told him how she was miserable in the relationship at the end and how he wasn't communicating and opening up. And he was able to tell her how he felt. And even I so appreciate this part about Lawrence when he said,
00:16:45
Speaker
You know, it was so easy for me when you cheated to just blame it on you and not deal with my own stuff. Yeah. And I was like, you know what? That is huge. Like, huge for self-care, huge for self-growth. Like, I think that Lawrence really leveled up in this season. And I feel like Issa leveled up as well, but like,
00:17:07
Speaker
It's just, it's so interesting to just see the dynamic between them too, as they begin to communicate where it's not like touch and go, like, I don't like you. I don't want to be around you. You cheated on me. And you know, her having that looming guilt of, I know I hurt you, that kind of thing. It was just like, now they can talk and be open and that's beautiful. And I think that, and honestly,
00:17:32
Speaker
Yes. And I honestly think that even with Molly's relationships, even with this current relationship, I feel like she doesn't even have what Issa and Lawrence have currently. I agree. I 100% agree. Girl, let's just get to this episode because listen, this is why we would call this mandatory meeting. Right.
00:17:52
Speaker
We have a family meeting. We have a family meeting about this episode. Yes. I don't even know where to start. I don't either. You start. But since you started with dinner, let's just go with dinner. OK. I think, here's the thing, and I'm going to just bounce this off of you. You know, as friends, let's just
00:18:09
Speaker
Let's just think this out, because I don't know. I have any real conversations about this up until this point. I feel like the conversation she had with Lawrence, used to have with Lawrence at the dinner, she couldn't have had if her and Molly were in a good place. And let me defend that argument.
00:18:30
Speaker
Okay, yeah. Oftentimes, when our friends are closest to us, so you know, we got a best friend or whatever, we, this is how the conversation goes.
00:18:42
Speaker
Hey, Ellie, I'm going to meet up with Lawrence. Girl, what? For what? He called me, said he just got back from San Francisco, and he wanted to meet up and talk. Talk about what? And then you kind of have that preliminary conversation with your friends where you come in with preconceived notions because you've had somebody else viewing it like, oh, girl, he probably want to get back with you. He saw you had success at this black party. Now he want you. You know, you have all that dialogue that taints your perspective.
00:19:10
Speaker
But I feel like because Miley was not in the picture in that moment, Issa went in with her own thoughts and feelings, whatever they may be. If she was feeling regret, if she was feeling, you know, competition with Candola, if she was feeling happy because he just called, those feelings were all her own without being massaged by an outside influence. I just feel like it may have been different if Miley had been in her corner because we know when Miley looked down in that window,
00:19:42
Speaker
I don't remember what event that was there at, but when she looked down that window and she saw Issa talking to Lauren, she had thoughts about that, very clear thoughts, very clear opinions that she was kind of going back to something old and her thoughts, her expressions in that moment
00:20:01
Speaker
were not positive. They were not in favor of and they were very clear and very direct. It was like written upon her face. You can see exactly how she felt about a simple conversation with him. So to know that they would be meeting up and sort of kind of going out on a date, I'm sure she would have had something to say about that.
00:20:21
Speaker
Oh, yeah. I agree with you totally because even when Issa, when she found out now to go back to the very first episode, when she found out that Kendola was dating Issa or sorry, Lauren, and she came and made that comment at the garbage can like, you just like your life to have a bunch of drama. I feel like she was one in that moment she was blocking Issa from
00:20:45
Speaker
trying to accomplish success, because she obviously had the tools and the keys that Issa needed. And like you said, I couldn't agree with that point, because if she would have talked with Lawrence now, we know how she felt about her talking with Lawrence, even when they was at the Come See the Baby event at her friend's house. So even with that, I think that she would have casted a shadow over Issa giving a closer. She would have convinced her about the cold.
00:21:14
Speaker
Oh, yeah. And if she would have went, it would have been totally awkward because Issa would... You know what? I'm gonna tell you something. I think that the decline of their relationship is the opening up of Issa. To be honest, I feel like we're seeing... Honestly, it's just been one episode, but I feel like we're honestly seeing a smarter, a more savvier... Honestly, when she was away from
00:21:44
Speaker
Um, Molly, she is like, she blossoms, she grows. And I think that somebody needs to tell her that. Sis is winning. Sis is winning right now without Molly. And this is what I'm telling you, like, I don't know, I'm good on Molly. I like Eso sans Molly. I like her without Molly. Um, and I'm not saying that I don't, that I don't like Molly because I do, I do like Molly. I just,
00:22:12
Speaker
I don't like I said I want them as best friends out. You really kind of sway me on this because at first I was like oh they need to get back together but I'm kind of like now that I'm thinking about it honestly he says so much better without her like she.
00:22:28
Speaker
Honestly, I think that what this season is doing low key is making us think about relationships that we're in and how happy are we in them and how do they make us progress? How do we grow? How do we achieve our goals? Because honestly, Molly was not down for Issa at all. She didn't lend a hand at all.
00:22:54
Speaker
for Issa doing this whole process. The only reason why she stuck around at the first event was because she was mad at her boyfriend.
00:23:03
Speaker
Yep. The title of the show is Insecure. So at every given point, we got to think that that's got to be a running theme that kind of drives the plot.
Themes of Insecurity and Personal Growth
00:23:14
Speaker
And so it's like, what is Insecure? What is Molly insecure about? Well, Molly is insecure when it comes to relationships, period. Whether it is love, whether it is friendship, she is insecure about those.
00:23:32
Speaker
Well, we've gotten to see a little bit of the context of her family. I don't know that we've seen enough. So maybe we need to see more of that to fill a little bit of compassion for her. Because on the web, what I've been seeing is everybody is like, Molly is wrong. She's wrong. Molly is wrong. I don't know that I saw anybody say, Issa overstepped. Yeah, I haven't seen any of her. They got to repeat Molly.
00:23:56
Speaker
We got to learn what kind of baby sis was, because at this point, she is not winning. But yes, I do. Molly aside, because I want to talk about Easton Lawrence. I've been Team Lawrence. I see it on the very first podcast. We do it. Yes, you did. You have been Team Lawrence.
00:24:16
Speaker
And I had to tell you, I went back and listened to the old podcast. And I was like, I told Crystal the reason why they made it seem like they used to get back together and they didn't was because they thought that they was out of time as far as seasons. So now that they have seasons, we might get to see Easton Lawrence back together. And it's so much fear. It's so much fear of the weight.
00:24:43
Speaker
We waited because they are, they're, they're both individually different. They're different people. They're the people right now that they wish the other was then, you know, it's like, you're the girlfriend that I wish you, you're the girlfriend. Now I wish I had been, and you're the boyfriend now that I wish I had been.
00:25:02
Speaker
Right, right. But they needed that time to kind of grow and learn and mature and their own ambitions. And that made them better. I'm here for it.
00:25:13
Speaker
Yeah, I'm totally here for a reunite between Issa and Lawrence. I think that it would really help the both of them. I'm just interested in the hurdles that they would have to jump over because they got tons of them. I mean, you have a really huge, huge suspicion that Candola could be pregnant.
00:25:38
Speaker
And if she is pregnant, I am going to fall out. I am going to petition Issa and tell her that this cannot be. You know I always send her DM on Instagram. I was like, listen, you got time to change your sense. I was like, I'm not even this kind of person. But I know Issa and her and Instagram DM like, sis, you got time to change it. If 50 Cent can change the power theme song back in one week,
00:26:06
Speaker
If he did it before he could do it again, he could do it by us. Change it back. Change it back, girl. Right. Undo that. This is one suspicion. If Condola is pregnant, this is one suspicion that I hope I am wrong on. But let's just talk about
00:26:27
Speaker
kind of the why, okay? Why I think it might be that she may be leading up to a pregnancy. God, please, Lord, don't do it to me. I don't know if my heart can take it. I don't think I can take it either. I think I will fall straight out. But I think that like, because she was so like adamant about seeing him. And like honestly,
00:26:50
Speaker
Yeah, she was. And the interesting thing about it was, was that, like, even during Thanksgiving, she was like, well, you kind of invited yourself over. I really didn't invite you. And like, she was just like, well, I'm happy you were here, but still. And I'm just like.
00:27:06
Speaker
Candola, are you just calling him over for a late night rendezvous? Or are you, you know, like, what's your deal? Because I honestly did not understand why, why her persistence was so, and like, he never really clarified or said much to it. And so... And here's the thing, somebody was calling you like, Hey, I want to talk. Hey, I want to talk. If you call me like, Hey, Chris,
00:27:30
Speaker
I want to talk to you. Can you come by? I'd be like, absolutely. But I'm trying to gauge on level one to 10 how urgent is this. Do I need to stop what I'm doing to come? Or is it like I can hold this off? So I would be like, what's up? What you want to talk about? He asked that. Maybe there's a difference between men and women, because he just was like, yeah, I got some things I'm doing, and I'm going to wrap them up, and then I'm coming.
00:27:51
Speaker
But not even just her phone calls and text messages and things like that on that evening. We got to think of what led up to it in the character development. And there's two particular instances that, to me, point towards possible pregnancy. God help. I don't even want to say it.
00:28:15
Speaker
The first is the beginning of, I want to say it's the beginning of season three, where we get this montage of Lawrence. The very first time we see Lawrence, Lawrence is out here hitting everything, walking. He's just out here just doing all kinds of things. And then very conveniently, we see him go to the clinic and he has contracted an STD.
00:28:39
Speaker
So already there's a suspicion that Lawrence could be out here possibly not using protection. Okay? There's already that suspicion on his end. Then there is her, because one of my friends said, she just doesn't strike me as the kind of person who would get caught up like that. And I agree. Condola seems to have her head on straight.
00:29:07
Speaker
But then there was that conversation on Thanksgiving about having a family or not. Her saying that she
00:29:18
Speaker
You know, well, he asked her, he made the statement that he didn't know that she didn't want to have a family. And she said, well, that's not what I said. I just got divorced a year and a half ago. So she never said yes or no, I do or I don't. But there is a question raised about whether or not she watched, not a husband, because they didn't say husband.
00:29:39
Speaker
whether or not she wants a family. So that automatically sows the seed of children to me. The thought of, does Candola want kids? Does Lawrence want kids? To Lawrence, that was kind of sort of a deal breaker. Or do you want kids with her? Yeah. That was kind of sort of a deal breaker for him. Like, oh, you don't want a family? Okay, well then I'm good on this. You ain't for me. And
00:30:04
Speaker
I have always gathered that she, that Kondola genuinely and truly liked him, but it was just the Isakard that was causing her to, you know, put things into question. Aside from that, she didn't really have many complaints about dudes. She was straight on him.
00:30:21
Speaker
So, well, yeah, I mean, I don't think that she had much complaints, but I do think that Condola definitely has wounds and those can potentially get in the way of because like I feel like with Lawrence
00:30:36
Speaker
As much as he tried to do the Playboy thing, I really believe he bears his heart on the sea. And it's really just not who he is. He really wanted something steady and stable. And you could see that even in his, like, when he was like, you know what? And this is what I love about the conversation that he and Issa had at the table, where he said, I realized that, you know, I thought I was interested in doing my own thing. I wanted to just work for myself. But I realized I'm really good at being a number two.
00:31:05
Speaker
And for somebody to come to that realization, particularly as a man, that's huge. To be able to say, look, I know that I could do good work and I could probably make it fine on my own, but I realize that I'm much more structured and better when I'm helping somebody else build their own stuff.
Support Systems and Relationships
00:31:27
Speaker
Hold on, why are you right there on that train of thought as two women who are highly ambitious? Just because I know what you work on, what you do, what you're good at, and I think vice versa. You know how intimidating it can be in relationships for a guy to look at a woman who's ambitious and be like,
00:31:46
Speaker
Nope. Not for me. Don't want to play the bag. Nope. I want a woman who's up front. And now Issa was becoming that type of person. She had conquered this black party thing and was now thinking of what she would do next. She was chasing ambition. She was chasing one event to the next event and looking for ways to further progress and grow in what she enjoyed doing.
00:32:13
Speaker
for a person like that, you need somebody who's like, hey, I'm willing to be your piece when you come home from...
00:32:21
Speaker
you know, what working on projects like that will do, you and I have both been in those kinds of spaces to know what kind of mental anguish that is, and how important it is to have a partner at home who supports your ambition, is not intimidated by your ambition, and still can see to your care, you know? And I feel like he was kind of sort of making that statement without making it, like,
00:32:45
Speaker
I can do a number two. I can let my girl had a spotlight. I can let... Which, sorry to make this about Molly, is what Molly was not able to do.
00:32:54
Speaker
Right. She was not able to play her position as a friend to be supportive. Even though you're on top, you're doing because, okay, here's the thing that I think to really further prove your point is a very small piece that happened on the, I think it was the episode prior.
00:33:18
Speaker
or maybe two episodes before. But even when Issa and Mollie had kind of ended up trying to park in the same spot, Issa was clearly there first. And Mollie was like, I'm not moving. You know what I'm saying? And Issa ended up, and even in that little small thing, Issa ended up sacrificing herself. I was like, I was here first. Obviously, I had to pull up tobacco. I had to get back and up. Right.
00:33:46
Speaker
It's hard to walk if you want to, but... Absolutely. So it goes to show you how much Issa has been self-sacrificing for Molly and how selfish Molly has been towards Issa. I mean, honestly, you think about the Thanksgiving situation where Issa was hanging out with her brother and then she was like, hey, I can't make it. And then she just was kind of cold and distanced towards her. It would seem like
00:34:11
Speaker
Oh, Issa forgot about Molly, but it's not the case. Like Molly is, Issa is like on a whole different wave and Molly is not even trying to catch up or stay up with her friend. And so I think that like, even with, with Lawrence, like the fact that he even mentioned that he's okay with being a number two, I feel like that made Issa feel safe to even say like, you know what, this guy honestly makes me happy. And if you think about even in the first season, when they worked together, like
00:34:41
Speaker
He was at home basically doing nothing, but he was okay with helping her, you know what I'm saying? Or being there with her as she worked. Most guys that have issues with pride and stuff like that, they'll be like, well, I'm going to get a job and I don't care, whatever, and be real destructive. But he was like, I'm really focused on this and I really want to do this, but I'm here for you.
00:35:04
Speaker
And I think that like, that's what Issa has been missing the entire time. It's just like having somebody there in her corner. And if you know this, like even with Lawrence, like every woman he dated has always been very strong.
00:35:20
Speaker
So you think about the girl, the, the, uh, I don't even know her name. I hate to really refer to her like this, but the hood girl, the girl from the band. She was, you know what I'm saying? Like she was very strong and like go get mama from off the curve. You know what I'm saying?
00:35:39
Speaker
So he was like, nah, this ain't me. I'm just here sleeping around with you. And then he starts the day. Condola. And Condola is very strong. She knows what she wants. She already have her own stuff. And even then, he was just saying, even at Thanksgiving, he was saying, you got your own stuff. You're doing your own thing. I feel like I need to match you. But I feel like with him, with Issa, Issa is like, look, if you treat me right,
00:36:05
Speaker
I'm fine with us just being together. You know what I'm saying? It's just interesting to see how, even in this episode, it showed happiness, but it showed the balance of it. And that's what I appreciate the most because it wasn't just like,
00:36:22
Speaker
Oh, we're just skipping through the tulips and we're just happy. But it shows the balance in how you can become happy with understanding yourself. And I think that both of them learned themselves enough to know what makes them happy and how they can find happiness within each other.
00:36:40
Speaker
I have found that, I think you summed that up perfectly. I have found that the episodes that have been written by Natasha Rothwell have been my favorite. They've always been the ones who know.
00:36:54
Speaker
because she is amazing. I know she wrote the episode with Coachella, which like there's a now listen, I didn't watch this whole series front to back probably three, three, four times. Cause anytime I have a friend who's like, I haven't seen it. I'm like, well, let me log into my HBO account. Cause we about to do this right now. Absolutely. We gonna do it now. I can always watch it again. Um, but, uh,
00:37:23
Speaker
I know that the Coachella episode was one that I rewound, like literally watched it and then watched it again because I felt like it was incredibly funny. I feel like when she writes the episodes, the emotion that she wants you to feel is very much present. Like, you ain't got a second guess. Like, you know exactly how you're supposed to feel in this episode. I thought Coachella was hilarious.
Visual Storytelling and Cinematography
00:37:48
Speaker
Like, it's a higher thing.
00:37:52
Speaker
And with this one, I was just like, first of all, the cinematography on this thing, I mean, I was like, I barely, now channel back to one of them degrees I got this in television production and directing, but this is one of those episodes that made me
00:38:14
Speaker
remember why when I was 18, I wanted to direct TV shows because when they did that side by side of East and Lawrence facing each other, and there was that juxtaposition of those neon lights, I literally paused the screen, took a picture with my phone, because I was like, the composition of this is stunning. I feel like they always- The entire episode was a beautiful episode.
00:38:41
Speaker
When they came through that art walk, and those little clouds were hanging there, and they had that music playing, I was like, oh, oh, listen. OK, this is a great day. Honestly, when they left the first place where it got crowded, and he ordered the lift, I was like, you know what? I want to go on a date. Like, I started thinking about, like, you're bright like me, but I'm in these streets. Yes.
00:39:09
Speaker
It was such a beautiful development of a friendship and love. I just feel like they just never let our girl be happy. Yes. I'm just like, oh, she is just so happy. The fact that she took that walk home, which was a long walk, since it was like that. That was a long walk. But she took that walk.
00:39:34
Speaker
I'm like, girl, you ain't home yet? You walk through the neighborhood by the stores, you ain't home. But anyway, when she took that walk, I feel like it was like her just bliss, just like, oh, this is like, even if I don't know what I want, even if I don't know if I want to be back with dude, or I do want to be back with him, I am just happy with where things are in life in general. I've had this huge success with my bike party. I know what I want to do next. And then XB, who I really feel bad about, you know,
00:40:03
Speaker
is acting right. I just feel like- And here's the thing, not only does she feel bad, like not only the part of her feeling bad about cheating on him, but I think that she really was able to have a, I think that Lawrence and her and their development of their relationship after her cheating.
00:40:22
Speaker
He created a safe place for her to express her grievances and what makes her happy. Because even when she was getting ready to leave his house, she was just like, I want to stay because that would make me happy. And that made like, it was.
00:40:39
Speaker
so many parts of it was so poetic and I think that's like just the dance of their conversation and I think that like we just forget how beautiful conversation is because we're so used to doing things on the digital scale. We just forget how beautiful it is to just sit in front of someone and have a conversation and especially now with
00:41:02
Speaker
with the climate that we're in with the coronavirus and everything that's happening, we just honestly don't take, we took for granted the beautifulness or the beauty of person-to-person connection.
00:41:20
Speaker
And I think that this episode really painted that picture beautifully. And even on the cinematography level, it was just visually engaging. And just looking as they walked through that gala, it was just like, oh my gosh, this is just the... I love how Issa really finds ways to amplify Black art, whether it's through music or this through music. Right, I agree.
00:41:47
Speaker
or whatever. The block party was a very beautiful event. I think how she tied in doing the wobble with everybody. Who doesn't do the wobble? You know what I mean? Everybody knows the wobble. Right. It's such a beautiful thing. Her team knows how to bring out the beauty in blackness.
00:42:07
Speaker
And I really feel like this episode was just so visually stimulating. It was insane. And it's an episode, honestly, even if Lawrence and Issa don't get together, I am so satisfied with this one episode. I appreciate that Natasha wrote
00:42:29
Speaker
this episode the way that she did because she was able to let express herself, which is something that nobody gives Isa room to do. You know what I'm saying? Like, she's like, you see her struggling going from pillow to post last season and now she got her.
00:42:45
Speaker
her own and she's stable and nobody's running over her. Nobody's thinking for her. She doesn't have to move herself or dumb herself down. This episode allowed her to just say, this is where I am. This is where I was. And like, even, even Lawrence, his receptiveness of it was like, you know what? I realize now I wasn't the best man for you. I wasn't doing everything right. I thought I was, but I wasn't. And now I realize
00:43:13
Speaker
Go ahead. No, I think that's one of the issues that we've been having with the two of them as we get these glimpses of the two individually throughout these seasons is we've always been wondering, are they better together? Are they better apart? Like it's kind of what we were seeing about Molly. Is she better with Molly? What are the advantages without Molly? And I feel like we always wonder because when we met them as a couple,
00:43:38
Speaker
they were in the heat of it. Things are not going well between them when we met them as a couple. And then from there, we've only known them as individuals. And now, we got to see what... And we've been seeing little glimpses, like even when they were making the movie jokes at the coffee shop and Condola walked up like, oh, y'all make jokes together. Even Condola asking the question, if she hadn't cheated, would you guys be together?
00:44:07
Speaker
I think that was the question that we all have through the four seasons of Insecure is if she hadn't cheated, would this have been a great show about a great couple, you know, or what?
00:44:22
Speaker
about it, what I find very interesting about that piece is that I feel like they needed to separate because even when Issa didn't cheat, she wasn't happy. You know what I'm saying? And like, she mentioned in the conversation that she had with Lawrence how she wanted to feel wanted. She wanted to feel loved. She was like, you know, you stopped talking to me. We didn't have sex. We didn't do this. We didn't do that. So now I got a question for you. Since you feel like that, I got a question for you.
00:44:51
Speaker
Do you think that with all these great successes they've had apart, do you think that they can be happy
Issa's Independent Journey and Friendships
00:45:01
Speaker
together? Do you think it'll continue? Do you think?
00:45:04
Speaker
It's gonna fall off. You know what? Okay, in my ideal world, what I would love to see is Issa continue to find her voice. And I think that she hasn't really been able to find her voice independently.
00:45:23
Speaker
So one thing I noticed about even with Isa and Molly is that she, that neither one of them really know who they are and that's why they're so insecure. So it's always been some kind of man to interrupt. Like Molly has like throughout this whole entire season or this whole entire show, Molly has always had some kind of guy to interrupt her growth, her path, you know, like Molly would get on the track of growth and development.
00:45:49
Speaker
It will always be some random guy come, and she'll sleep with another throw her way off. And I feel like Issa, even though she was on the track of getting herself together, even in the season where she really took this real huge glow up, she even still had TSA Bay. And then she kind of dipped back in with Nathan.
00:46:10
Speaker
And now Lawrence is back in the picture. So I would love to see Issa continue to develop. I would love to see them together. I just want Issa and Lawrence to be together, but I feel like
00:46:25
Speaker
they evolve separately enough to come back together, but live in separate apartments, come visit each other, and just kind of grow from there. And I think that if they could have genuine conversations, I would love to see the show take a turn
00:46:47
Speaker
where it goes from constant drama with men and relationships to how we evolve in communication, how we evolve with each other to make it actually work. And even if they sacrifice Easton Molly's relationship for that, I would be satisfied.
00:47:05
Speaker
So I would be perfectly OK if Issa and Lawrence together evolve and grow and really show true Black love and evolution of it and how it works. And Issa just find a better friend. I'm OK with Issa and Molly not being friends as long as Issa can grow. Now, if they take a term where Issa and Lawrence don't end up together,
00:47:34
Speaker
I am perfectly OK with it if Issa continues to grow. Like, I don't want to see Issa revert back to old Issa. Like, I just would like to see her glow up and continue to evolve as a woman. And I would love to see her even get back in the nonprofit sector where she's actually impacting kids' life, which is something she's passionate about. Right, right.
00:48:02
Speaker
I mean, I would love to see the show do that, but I would like for her to really heal from her friendship wounds with Molly. And I would love for her to see how toxic Molly is in her life. Yeah, same. I hope they see that in the very next episode. I hope that is the conversation they're going to have.
00:48:21
Speaker
Yeah, I think that I feel like in this season, they really honed in on how necessary it is to have good friendships around you and good relationships, good partnerships that can advance you forward. And I honestly believe that Easton and Lawrence could advance each other forward, but the communication piece is going to have to be king.
00:48:49
Speaker
That's something that I don't know if they're ready for or able to do. But I think that that's going to have to be phenomenally huge in their life. But here's a wild card I want to talk about. I want to talk about, what is their friend? I can't call anybody's name. Not Kelly, but the other girl.
00:49:11
Speaker
Is her name Tiffany? I was trying to think of her name, too. Tiffany, yes. Thank you. Tiffany, I do not believe that's her husband's baby. You know, something's awful about that. And she's definitely dealing with postpartum, for sure. It's a very weird situation happening there. When I watched this series for probably the third or fourth time on the quarantine with one of my coworkers,
00:49:39
Speaker
And it was a male coworker. He was like, that's not dudes, baby. I said, you think? Because it is weird. But we do not know her to be like a sleeping around type girl. But I agree that she's probably going through postpartum, but something's very off about that situation. Oh, yeah. Sometimes. Because even like her disposition towards her daughter,
00:50:07
Speaker
The little slide comments that she's been making is eerie. Like, they asked us to come out breast milk. And she was just like, oh, well, her loss. And even when the baby was crying, and she was just this interested in going home.
00:50:24
Speaker
Yeah, so it's definitely there that's developing. I don't know what, but I'm waiting for the ball to drop. Because I feel like they've been hinting around it. But obviously, Issa and Molly is the two main characters. But oh, wait. I have to say this before I lose my train of thought and then I'm going to come right back, I promise. If you look at the, I don't even know if they're like,
00:50:51
Speaker
what would you call it, the cover art of each season? Like you see Issa this season sitting by herself, very confident. And like, I think that those, they really tell a story. I agree. It was her and Molly. I thought I was the only person that paid attention to that.
00:51:14
Speaker
You have to pay attention to everything. I mean, this goes back to the very first podcast we had about this.
00:51:22
Speaker
where I was saying like this show is smart. It's one of the things that I really like about it is there is nothing that you can just take for face value. Like even though I was talking about the line possibly being a, you know, call back to the five heartbeats, it's like, you can't dismiss it because most things on the show are done intentionally. And I agree that
00:51:49
Speaker
In every other piece of cover, the very first one was Issa making this obscure face where she's awkward and it looks weird, and she's by herself, and we're figuring out who she is, what's her identity. Then she goes to this party girl in the pool.
00:52:10
Speaker
enjoying life type cover. There's the Molly and Isa one, where something's a skew. And then the, you know, for the last one, we see her with a very confident smile and other people. It's like it's the other people that are in the world, where she's not confined to her own smaller world, like we're seeing her be somebody amongst other people.
00:52:35
Speaker
So I thought I was the only person who paid attention to that, but this is why me and you talk about this. Right.
00:52:46
Speaker
Yeah, so I think that, like, that is a symbol, honestly, that those clip arts, if you so speak, like, for lack of a better word, usage. I think that those really tell the story of each season and how they develop. And what I really, really, really appreciate is how, like, they just have Issa as, like, Issa, honestly, her hair, from her hair to her skin, the makeup, everything has just been flawless. I was like, oh, this is
00:53:15
Speaker
Such great cinematography. Just been hitting them angles. She been hitting them angles. Girl, when he came from outside on the phone with Condola back into the house and she was standing there, I said, he been sitting there, girl, home. She look pretty today. Yes. Like, just her skin, like, we need to DM me. It's the fact that why our skincare regimen is.
00:53:40
Speaker
That's one of the things I love about the directors for the show is that they've always known how to light these characters. I remember second season with Daniel very much in the mix and they were shooting with all those blues. I'm like, they know that he was right off brown skin.
00:53:58
Speaker
So, you know, they're doing all those club scenes and just a very visually pleasing show, which is one of the reasons why I love that this comes on HBO is because we know that there's a production quality that we're going to get every time. They've delivered, you know, I'm here for it.
00:54:17
Speaker
Yes, every single time. And so circle back to the Tiffany situation. I think that when our husband was saying, like, well, Lawrence made the comment, well, you guys are going to be great parents. You generally plan everything out. And he said, we didn't plan this. We was just going to buy a house. And you're right.
00:54:38
Speaker
And all of that. And remember when her husband and Lawrence was having this conversation, and he was like, yeah, it was a dude at work. I handled it. You know what I'm saying? So it was like, oh, let me find out you're right. You remember that? Do you not remember that?
00:54:58
Speaker
Yes, right when she was pregnant, right? After that, she ended up pregnant. So I am not 100% certain, because remember, she was like, my husband, my husband, my man. And all of that, that was season dismissed after this baby. And I really think we're going to find out a bombshell truth in these last, what, two episodes.
00:55:22
Speaker
Whoo, God, girl. I'm hoping the something come out, but I'm hoping that it won't spiral Issa out of control, because you know how they kind of feed off each other drama? I'm just really, I need a break, y'all. Issa, if you're listening, please give us something. Please, please, please. Make your character happy. Give it to us in fourth season or something, fifth season, because if they take anywhere near as long,
00:55:52
Speaker
to put out season five as they did to put out season four. Remember when we were like, what are we supposed to do? We don't know what happened to these characters.
00:56:02
Speaker
Girl. Right. But see, I blame it on HBO because Issa is a very busy woman. She couldn't check, getting checks. And she was like, look, by the time y'all renewed us, I had already had obligations. So I understand. I respect that. And I understand that much of the situation. But I'm glad that they know that they have a fifth season. So they probably should be writing and recording now because we know long. Please.
00:56:33
Speaker
There was something else I was going to say. Oh, what do you think about the new show they're watching? I love that they watch these shows. What is it? Private lawyers? Yeah. I am trying to really understand. I'm trying to understand the connection or the point of that show, honestly. I'm trying to get with it. Because you know there's a connection. You know there's got to be a connection. The only thing that I know that
00:57:00
Speaker
Who is Molly on the phone with? I think she's on the phone with Nathan. And she said something about her and Molly not really talking anymore or something like that. Oh, yeah. It was maybe like the second episode. It was right after the Black Party or something like that. And she was watching that show. And the show is asking, what happened? Who was responsible?
00:57:29
Speaker
Is Latoya really missing or was she murdered? I don't know, I feel like maybe it's supposed to give us some insight into Molly and Issa. So maybe we need to pay more attention to the show and the times at which they're watching it because Lawrence was watching it too. Yeah, Lawrence was into it too. He was like, yeah. And remember when she drove the old man who missed the bus? Yes. It was on the bench.
00:57:59
Speaker
It was. We gotta find out the correlation to that. I don't know. I'm gonna have to go back and watch this season because it was like, what are you missing? Like, is she really lost or like, yeah, I think I get what you're saying with that. You know, it's just extremely interesting because like, like you said, everything plays off of each other. So you can't really miss a little spot. But I think that
00:58:23
Speaker
This last episode for everybody that was an ESA fan or a Lawrence fan, you know, like what was, what was the thing that it was doing? Yes, when the Lawrence have, I think that this gave all of us
00:58:46
Speaker
a little deep breath. I mean, it just helped us all. We were just like, thank you, Isa and Drew. We needed that moment. So I had you on here for an hour, almost an hour. So do you have any more final thoughts or feelings or anything? I just want to say I laughed, I cried, everything in between. And if that girl comes back, if Condola is pregnant, that's all I'm going to say. If that girl was pregnant,
00:59:16
Speaker
I'm coming through with TSA Bay. How? You have to come back on the show. Oh, we coming right back. Same day. We don't have to do it the very same day. We coming right back. Which happens to be my birthday, by the way. Yay. Happy birthday. Happy birthday. But we get right back on here. I'm going to stop what I'm doing because we got to talk about it if she is. I don't think we're going to know in this very next episode. I don't think we're going to know till the finale.
00:59:42
Speaker
Because I think they're going to be sitting there waiting. Right. Yeah, I think that is wise. I think if I can give Issa any advice when she goes to meet with Molly next week, I would not discuss anything that happened with Lawrence. I just would not give Molly the room. No, please don't let Molly come ruin her high.
01:00:15
Speaker
Fun times is always fun. No, I just can't wait to see what happens next. It's always fun talking about this with you. You're the only person that relates all of my random thoughts about it.
01:00:29
Speaker
No, I'm so glad that I have you to talk about it, because this show has been, honestly, I think, if I can say this, that show last week, I don't know if it was just because of the climate of everything that happened in the world at that time. And honestly, you don't know this, I'm telling you now, but I'm currently healing from having the coronavirus. Oh, yikes. No, I didn't know that.
01:00:56
Speaker
I'm actually home quarantined now so I am I think that like after some like getting through the thick of the virus because it's such a like I can't even give you words for how bad that virus is but
01:01:12
Speaker
After getting through the thick of it but still having some side effects, some residuals from it, it really challenged me to think about after you can get back up on your feet and be yourself again, what makes you happy?
01:01:27
Speaker
What are things that bring you joy? How do you, how do you embrace your own happiness? And I think honestly, like, and I know this is strange and people know that I'm a Christian, but I don't really care if you judge me for this, but even her telling him that she wanted him.
01:01:44
Speaker
and opening herself to receive that happiness from him. She could have went when Nathan, she could have called TSA Bay. She could have went home and did something destructive if she wanted to, but the fact that she knew what made her happy and she went after that. Now, obviously, I'm not condoning for an occasion, but what I am saying is that
01:02:05
Speaker
The fact that you can open up your mind to say, I'm happy and I want this and articulate that and articulate it well and receive it is a beautiful thing. And I think that we take that for granted so much.
01:02:23
Speaker
just to see her happy. Like, I think that that's why this episode is so important to me is because we got to see Issa happy after seeing her being drug for the last three seasons and not really finding it.
01:02:39
Speaker
So for me as a woman, as a growing woman, I am understanding to pursue my own happiness and not be ashamed of it. So I love that episode for that reason alone. And that's why I can watch it over and over again, because it is a beautiful montage of happiness. I think that's the motto. That's the motto for 2020 is like, protect your peace, be happy.
01:03:06
Speaker
like yeah that like because because at this point in time things are so uncertain around us you just have to protect your peace if that means cutting cutting people off getting rid of france taking a even if you're not getting rid of them but even taking a point for them so that your thoughts are your own your feelings are your own they're without other people's influence and you can't really begin to get a handle on your life the way that you see it
01:03:32
Speaker
Because at the end of the day, these people aren't the ones who are going to live with the consequences of your decisions. You are. So do what makes you happy, protect your piece at all costs, and be safe. Yes. That is beautiful. And I think that is a perfect way to end this episode. So thank you so much, Crystal, for joining me. Thank you. I was so excited to have you on. So after the season end, you're coming back, right?
01:04:02
Speaker
Uh, excuse me. We're coming back Sunday. Well, yeah. If we find out about Condola Sunday, then we come back Sunday. Yes. Just text me girl. You know, just send me a text. Gotcha. Gotcha. All right, Crystal. Thank you. Have a good day. Bye. Love you too. Bye.