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EP 16 Broiler performance, co-grazing risks and new breeding technology image

EP 16 Broiler performance, co-grazing risks and new breeding technology

The Poultry Network Podcast
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73 Plays15 days ago

A chilly house, ten uncooperative sheep, and some serious industry talking points.

In this episode of the Poultry Network Podcast, hosts Tom Woolman and Tom Willings catch up on the latest from Aviagen’s producer roadshows and discuss why UK broiler performance is comparing favourably with results seen elsewhere in Europe. While some of the improvement may reflect down-stocking, they note that good margins are allowing reinvestment in housing, equipment and farm infrastructure – small but important details that continue to lift performance.

That discussion leads neatly into one of the more striking messages from Poultry Network Live, where Gordon Hickman OBE warned producers against grazing poultry alongside sheep or cattle. Similar advice has since been circulated by the Rare Breeds Survival Trust. The Toms consider what this could mean in practice for mixed farms with free-range or organic flocks, and how any future policy shift might test the balance between maintaining livestock enterprises and outdoor access for laying hens.

The conversation broadens to the global disease picture following a recent BBC documentary on “the next pandemic”. The programme focused on H5N1 infections now found across more than a thousand dairy herds in the United States. The hosts reflect on scientists’ concern that the virus is becoming more resilient in mammalian conditions – a reminder that avian influenza remains a live risk for agriculture and public health alike.

A second emerging story catching their attention is the concept of “layers laying broilers.” Developed by the international research project NextHen, it involves inserting broiler germ cells into sterile layer embryos, creating parent stock capable of laying broiler chicks rather than conventional hatching eggs. The technology could, in theory, simplify breeder management, free up rearing capacity and improve efficiency – but also raises complex regulatory questions. The company claims the process does not constitute genetic modification, yet it is unclear how that position would be treated in the UK or EU markets.

The pair also take a lighter look at their own livestock ventures. Tom Willings reports on the challenges of integrating his small flock of Beulah crosses and Black Welsh Mountain ewes, while Tom Woolman admits to discovering an unexpected resident at his new home – a peacock that insists on visiting his window each afternoon.

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Transcript

Tom's Week: Living Arrangements & Poultry Roadshows

00:00:16
Tom Woolman
Hello, and welcome back to the Poultry Network podcast. ah It's Tom Woolman here, and I'm joined as ever um by the by the gracious Tom Willings. Hello, Tom.
00:00:27
Tom Willings
Hello, Tom. Gracious, I'm not sure about, but it's it's lovely to see you again. been a little while.
00:00:32
Tom Woolman
Yeah, well, i was trying I was trying to big you up and and just gracious was the adjective that popped into my head at the moment, but so yeah, we'll
00:00:33
Tom Willings
Keeping well?
00:00:40
Tom Willings
Yeah. To be honest, it's better than bald, and that's but that's the adjective that that I most get slapped with. So, yeah, anything else?
00:00:46
Tom Woolman
Sometimes we've got to vary it a little bit, haven't we?
00:00:48
Tom Willings
Yeah, yeah.
00:00:49
Tom Woolman
Yeah. um
00:00:50
Tom Willings
like Good man.
00:00:50
Tom Woolman
But to yeah, how's your week been?

Aviagen's Engagement & UK Broiler Performance

00:00:53
Tom Willings
um well i'm in new digs really relatively new in new house you can probably see that i've got my arms folded because i'm freezing cold and the weather's got chilly hasn't it and i haven't really mastered the heating so um yeah my week has been has been furious with activity simply as a way of keeping warm what what about what about you
00:01:14
Tom Woolman
ahve I've had a good week, um doing a bit travelling as per normal. I've been to a couple of AVGN roadshows this week, which has been good and enlightening.
00:01:26
Tom Woolman
um And they're just great events to see see a whole range of people. um So yeah, i went to one in Talbot.
00:01:34
Tom Willings
We did, we had, in fact, Aviagen were the first guest on the Sustainability Hub podcast um nearly a year ago, Tim Burnside, and he was a brilliant guest. I learned yeah more in the space of an hour and a half with him than than like the last three years. It's been but cracking download. if If anyone hasn't listened to that, I would, yeah. Yeah.
00:01:55
Tom Willings
Highly, highly recommend it. I would say that, wouldn't I? But they're an incredible business.
00:01:57
Tom Woolman
Yeah, Tim tim was at...
00:02:00
Tom Willings
One point I made to Tim was just how strong their engagement was with their customer base or the or the commercial grower base. They're a huge organization, but making incredible efforts to recognize and reward best results, you know share knowledge and everything else.
00:02:21
Tom Woolman
Yeah, and and they do a lot now in terms of data collection. They've always collected a bit of data on... them on on breeders. They've started to do more on broilers. And it was one of the things that came out of um yeah the Bradford Roadshow that i was at. there The UK is is um is's doing really well in comparison to other European countries that that that they deal with in terms of broiler performance.
00:02:45
Tom Woolman
We're saying some of it is is probably linked down to the downstocking that's going on um with a lot of the sector at the moment, but that doesn't account for all of it.
00:02:45
Tom Willings
Mm-hmm.
00:02:55
Tom Woolman
um Whether people are, you know, ah people are ah making a reasonable margin and that's allowing them to invest money back in performance, in chemicals, in concrete, in all these little things that add up to, um, to improving performance. But, um, yeah, that was quite interesting now that they're they're starting to to pull through some of that data. It's really yeah quite insightful.

Sheep Farming: Integrating Breeds

00:03:16
Tom Woolman
but to Um, I was going to say, Tom, one of the other things that I've, um, I've started doing, I've, um, I'm dabbling in, uh, in sheep farming now and, uh,
00:03:17
Tom Willings
Interesting stuff.
00:03:26
Tom Woolman
um I've researched.
00:03:27
Tom Willings
Your what?
00:03:29
Tom Woolman
Well, hear me out. So um as I work in the poultry industry, and everyone knows that whoever works in the poultry industry, whatever contract you sign, yeah're you're not allowed to keep any feathered pets, birds, you know, no ostriches is in the garden.
00:03:43
Tom Woolman
Yeah. Or...
00:03:45
Tom Willings
I have a confession to make, but we'll come back to it at the end of your sheep, sheep, um, yeah, sermon.
00:03:50
Tom Woolman
so So um so i've I've gone ahead and I've got sheep. And i used to um sheep actually were what got me into farming when I was 17, 18. So it's been a bit of an ambition to to to get some back. um And but I've got, um from from a a few different sources, I've only got 10, but I've got um seven ah white sheep, which are Beulah crosses, nice speckled faces.
00:04:15
Tom Woolman
and Got them from a friend of a friend. um And then also I've got some ah some black Welsh mountain sheep. um so But the the trouble is um they're not integrating.
00:04:29
Tom Woolman
So we had the white sheep arrived and then ah next weekend the black sheep turned up and the black sheep came off the trailer and trotted into the field.
00:04:30
Tom Willings
oh
00:04:39
Tom Woolman
And honestly,
00:04:39
Tom Willings
Like they own the place.
00:04:40
Tom Woolman
well and you would have thought that um i don't know you just put three lions into the uh into the into the field with uh with these other sheep and they just started running um sorry if you can hear that noise that's uh one well it's not me drilling it's my my my neighbors getting a getting a new kitchen um so you'll have to bear with me um but yes they started um they they started running away and um
00:04:54
Tom Willings
Are you drilling?
00:05:08
Tom Woolman
And this was a week ago. I've gone back. They're still not integrating. I still go down. They're still sat in different parts of the field.
00:05:14
Tom Willings
You've had 10 sheep for a week. Are you sure you've still got 10?
00:05:18
Tom Woolman
No, I have. I've i've counted them. Yeah. Yeah. Why are you suggesting I'd i'd have more or less?
00:05:23
Tom Willings
The rumour is that sheep sort of die for fun and a week going by seems like quite quite a long time in a sheep's sheep's lifespan.
00:05:30
Tom Woolman
Yeah, I did.
00:05:30
Tom Willings
I've got some amazing looking sheep out of my window. I've got some valets next door. They don't belong to me and they're in a they're in a um the same field as ah as a herd of sheep. wagyu um i don't know what you call it uh i'm gonna guess they're about eight months nine months old um mix of beef cattle but uh but yeah astonishing looking things complete with their with their probably 20 valet sheep so um yeah woman and by name woman by nature a very good
00:05:58
Tom Woolman
Yeah, well, that's very good. Well, absolutely. Yeah.

Co-Grazing Debate & Policy Changes

00:06:02
Tom Woolman
Well, I'm, um yeah, I'm, I'm already looking forward to trying to share them next year. That'd be good fun.
00:06:06
Tom Willings
yeah
00:06:06
Tom Woolman
But, um, one thing that did make me think of connection with sheep and poultry is I'm, I'm, I get the rare breed survival trust newsletter through, uh, periodically on my email and actually, yeah.
00:06:17
Tom Willings
I know where you're going with this.
00:06:19
Tom Woolman
yeah One of the things that, that, that I saw, um this week was, uh, there was a note on there saying that, um,
00:06:19
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:06:26
Tom Woolman
ah poultry keepers are being advised not to graze sheep and cattle um with poultry.
00:06:31
Tom Willings
Well, that was, that was of course news from, from our conference. Last time I saw you poultry network live conference, Gordon Hickman, OBE, um, giving a very stark warning.
00:06:42
Tom Willings
and And I think probably an unexpected, warning to to people saying they should not as you say co-graze or or share the same space that's got that's got the potential to turn into a much bigger discussion i would suggest i don't know you'd be completely guessing as to what proportion of free range or organic um egg producers have got livestock on range for um for whatever proportion of the life cycle of either species i suppose thinking about it but but i
00:07:17
Tom Willings
I would imagine a fair chunk of them of co-grazing.
00:07:19
Tom Woolman
It'll be a lot, won't it? Because a lot of the expansion for for for free range sites has has come on farms with with land and with livestock um yeah as ah as as a way of developing their business, hasn't it?
00:07:21
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:07:32
Tom Woolman
So I'm sure there's an awful lot of crossover out there.
00:07:35
Tom Willings
Yeah. I think the tension will come when you say, right, if if if it were to transpire that policymakers would say, no, you cannot do that.
00:07:45
Tom Willings
That's not just ill-advised, that's against the rules. Then, you know, the obvious question is what takes priority? Is that is is the poultry the priority or the livestock? And and I would guess that...
00:07:57
Tom Willings
In their heart of hearts, many farms that keep birds still see themselves as, you know, the original livestock species keeper first and foremost.
00:08:08
Tom Woolman
Yeah. Yeah.
00:08:10
Tom Willings
And the birds can either stay indoors or they can jog on because the the cattle are going to be there a long time after the birds have gone. You know, i wonder how many people are building laying hen farms thinking that this is now a lifelong generational choice. Not many, whereas you talk to a lot of farms who, you know,
00:08:26
Tom Willings
they've inherited herds from um from their forebears and they fully intend them you fully respect um intend to pass them on to to their successors
00:08:37
Tom Woolman
yeah Yeah. I mean, it's really a question of identity, isn't it? And and you're right. Um, different farming families will develop their own identity over various generations. Yeah. This is, this is what we're into.
00:08:48
Tom Woolman
Um, this is what, um, yeah, father or grandfather started and and this is what we're carrying on with.
00:08:48
Tom Willings
hmm
00:08:54
Tom Woolman
Um, so you're right. If you, uh, yeah, you put sheep and cattle up against, um, laying hens, even if the laying hens are making money, it's not, it's not always about the money when these decisions are made. So, um,
00:09:05
Tom Willings
Yeah, yeah.
00:09:05
Tom Woolman
Yeah, that will be an interesting one to keep on.
00:09:06
Tom Willings
I think it's only the free range element of it that's that's in jeopardy, isn't it? You know, the potential is there to say, well, there's a demand for barn eggs. So if it it really is a case that it's it's one or the other, then the way to have both is to not have the birds going outside.
00:09:22
Tom Willings
Job done.
00:09:23
Tom Woolman
Hmm. Hmm.

H5N1 Threat & Poultry Industry Implications

00:09:24
Tom Woolman
Hmm.
00:09:24
Tom Willings
um Yeah, i one of the things I saw this week, and I don't know if you caught it, was the BBC documentary on Monday about um the the next pandemic. So I'm going to try and remember the professor's name accurately. I think it was Chris Vantalicum.
00:09:41
Tom Willings
um And he was, you know, kind of but spent an hour trawling the world looking for um the next thing that was going to kill us all, um kind of inspired by by COVID.
00:09:53
Tom Willings
And he spent a lot of time talking about H5N1. And I think he it sort of speculated that that was his favourite. And as in odds on, not...
00:10:03
Tom Woolman
His favorite thing to kill us.
00:10:04
Tom Willings
Yeah, not not not kind of personal choice, but um what he saw as the most likely threat. And a lot of the programme focused on what was going on in the US.
00:10:16
Tom Willings
And I think there's over a thousand dairy herds that have been um infected by H5N1.
00:10:20
Tom Woolman
Hmm.
00:10:22
Tom Woolman
Hmm.
00:10:24
Tom Willings
And, um you know, the the the scientists interviewed on the programme were really quite shocking in saying, you know, these are the things that keep us up at night. These are the things that as virologists cause us sleepless nights because, you know, the...
00:10:42
Tom Willings
infection in cattle and the survivability of that virus in um laboratory conditions, I guess, in in the equivalent of human nasal passages, which then allows the virus to be airborne and therefore to but to be um at a much greater risk of of fast and far spread.
00:11:01
Tom Willings
you know that That bovine strain is much more survivable in those conditions. and And it's a very significant step in the direction of an you know um uptick in that zoonotic transfer from of animal into human disease.
00:11:18
Tom Willings
ah threat And I wonder whether or not Gordon already knew that was coming out when he said what he said at the conference, because if and it took me and a lot of people by surprise. And I saw it in Farmers Weekly today. You saw it in this week. You've seen it somewhere else. i guess it's news that's not going to go away fast.
00:11:35
Tom Woolman
No, no,
00:11:35
Tom Willings
Be interesting to see how it develops.

Innovative Tech: Laying Hens & Broiler Production

00:11:37
Tom Woolman
no, absolutely well.
00:11:37
Tom Willings
ah it's not It's not the only bit of news this week. The other bit of news I saw was on your side of the fence, not not the laying side of things, to do with um a crossover between layers and and andb broilers at a breeder level.
00:11:52
Tom Woolman
Yeah.
00:11:53
Tom Willings
And um yeah, layers laying broilers.
00:11:53
Tom Woolman
Yeah.
00:11:56
Tom Willings
what
00:11:56
Tom Woolman
Yes.
00:11:57
Tom Willings
I know you've seen it.
00:11:57
Tom Woolman
I, I, I saw this and I, and i yeah, I think back to when I, i i started off in, cause I, my, my background is predominantly in, in, in breeders, broiler breeders and sheep.
00:11:58
Tom Willings
What did you make of that?
00:12:08
Tom Willings
and shape.
00:12:10
Tom Woolman
Yes. Although I do have to say on balance, spent an awful lot more time with the, with broiler breeders than I have with sheep at the moment. Maybe that'll change over the next 10 years, but yeah,
00:12:22
Tom Woolman
and And I remember ah the old wizened farmers talking about, well, they're not so old and wizened, but talking about when automatic nest boxes came in and how that really revolutionized how broiler breeding was done and changed how they went about it. And, and,
00:12:39
Tom Woolman
And I thought, and I've always thought there something else will come along and and and maybe it could produce a bit of a seismic shift in terms of the way that we that we operate and the way that we run our farms. and And when I saw this, I mean, there's not a whole lot of information about it, but like I did wonder whether um this technology um potentially could have the opportunity to um to to affect our industry quite significantly. So I think the premise of it is effectively, um for those that do broiler breeders doing um broader breeders as ah as a job is not an easy job because genetically ah the bird wants to eat and it wants to put on weight but actually what you want to do is you want it to lay eggs and you want it to reproduce um and and all the the hens are mated naturally as well so you've got to keep all your cockerels fighting fit um it's a bit like managing a rugby team under pressure and you've got to keep them going for the whole season so
00:13:34
Tom Woolman
yeah So, yeah, there's a lot of things that can go wrong with broiler breeders um where um you you don't get great outcomes in terms of egg persistency or in terms of fertility if your males go overweight, et cetera.
00:13:47
Tom Woolman
So what this technology um was proposing in a nutshell was that um they take um laying hens, you know, um sort of white white genetics that that that are used to laying lots and lots of eggs.
00:14:00
Tom Woolman
They create sterile embryos. They insert... um sort of broiler germ cells into into the the embryos in ovo. And then those um yeah those hens turn out to be parent stock, I suppose, that can then just lay broilers, but they can lay instead of, ah yeah, I mean, ah an average broiler breeder hen would lay about 180 in a cycle.
00:14:28
Tom Woolman
um as we all know with the, with the genetics of of some of these laying birds, you know, they can, they can potentially lay double that, um, albeit over a ah longer space of time as well.
00:14:33
Tom Willings
Mm.
00:14:36
Tom Willings
And some.
00:14:38
Tom Woolman
So, um, yeah.
00:14:38
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:14:41
Tom Woolman
And when we look at where the industry's at in terms of resources space, we don't have a, you know, we we don't have enough farming space. If we could be able to produce broilers in a, in a way that is more efficient, um, and, and simpler and more reliable, uh,
00:14:58
Tom Woolman
And we can free up some some some breeder space to be used for broilers. you know Surely that could that could be a ah good thing in terms of how the industry is going to progress. But yeah, it'll be quite an interesting thing to to dig into as as as as more details come out.
00:15:14
Tom Willings
i've read I've read the article, you were kind enough to share the article with me, but there were a couple of other things that sort of jumped out at me. Firstly, the the the the progeny, that the broiler, the commercial bird itself, um thinking that it would have kind of less stress hormones and be less predisposed to have some of the behavioral, um or or again, stress challenges that that existing birds would have, which I thought that was interesting.
00:15:43
Tom Willings
um But probably most interesting ah of all was the assertion that despite having kind of changed the breeder, the breed ah ah parent stock, um and you have a laying hen that lays an egg that hatches as a broiler, that somehow this is not genetic modification. This isn't classed as as being GMO.
00:16:08
Tom Willings
And I'm I can't quite get my head around the categorization of that and who determines that that is right and or or not.
00:16:10
Tom Woolman
nine
00:16:16
Tom Willings
you know Will this be something that we see and in, say, Europe or or countries where GMO is currently um out outlawed?
00:16:23
Tom Woolman
Yeah, because it it looks like this the organization. um What are they? I'm trying to look up what what are they called? ah Next Hen I think is the um is the organization and their project is is layers laying broilers.
00:16:34
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:16:36
Tom Woolman
I think they're they look like they're ah a mix of ah yeah US and and and and is an Israeli research.
00:16:41
Tom Willings
Israeli, wasn't it
00:16:43
Tom Woolman
So yeah, just because it works in another part of the world doesn't necessarily mean that um that we could start doing it in the UK next year. But I'm sure that will be something that people are talking about.
00:16:54
Tom Woolman
and And it looks like actually a lot of the technology, there's been some crossover in terms of Innovo sexing and all that work that's going on in in the laying industry at the moment around Europe and different parts of the world.
00:17:01
Tom Willings
it?
00:17:06
Tom Woolman
so um
00:17:08
Tom Willings
Definitely one to watch.
00:17:09
Tom Woolman
Mm-hmm.

Podcast Feedback & Future Guests

00:17:10
Tom Woolman
So that's something we'll we yeah we'll keep an eye on and um and and try and look into a little bit more. Yeah, yeah.
00:17:15
Tom Willings
We need to get them on the podcast, Tom.
00:17:17
Tom Woolman
Well, yeah, I mean, the list is long, isn't it? Every time I see someone and and they say, oh, I like the podcast, i I always extend an invitation and say, well, you're you know you're welcome to come on.
00:17:28
Tom Woolman
um So um
00:17:30
Tom Willings
Jake tells me we're 16 episodes in and that and that most podcasts don't get past 10.
00:17:33
Tom Woolman
are we really...
00:17:36
Tom Willings
Yeah, rarefied air. We've probably already said that in a previous episode, and celebrating the 11th and the 12th and the 13th and so on.
00:17:43
Tom Woolman
Well, I don't think we we have had, yes.
00:17:43
Tom Willings
We've had some good guests, though.
00:17:45
Tom Woolman
um Yeah, and actually some people that have probably, um ah maybe it's a bit of a halo effect. Some of these guests that we've had have set us off in the right direction and um and and meant that people have have enjoyed listening. We had Paul Kelly, didn't we, early on, who's who's always entertaining ah to listen to.
00:18:04
Tom Woolman
um And in fact, someone told me, that they almost crashed their car while they were listening to Paul Kelly um because he did his he did his turkey impression and they were on the N62.
00:18:15
Tom Woolman
and yeah And when he and when he made his tot did his turkey impression, that they they almost swerved. So
00:18:21
Tom Willings
Yeah, it should be available as a ringtone or a text alert, shouldn't it? It's it's said it's a unique sound. Yeah.
00:18:28
Tom Woolman
yeah, yeah. um But yeah, we also had Richard Griffiths, didn't we, back at the start from the BPC.
00:18:30
Tom Willings
but
00:18:34
Tom Willings
Yeah, well, that's two from the meat side and we haven't had anyone from the egg policy side yet.
00:18:34
Tom Woolman
um
00:18:38
Tom Willings
So it'd be nice to get the BEIC or even Befrepper or one of those sort of guys on and come and talk about, you know, how that landscape might be ah might be changing or what, you know, what they're all doing to to further the interests of the egg industry.
00:18:52
Tom Willings
I'd love that conversation.
00:18:53
Tom Woolman
Absolutely. and But also when I reflect, I think we were and we were very lucky to to to speak to Graham Atkinson as well um about about contracts.
00:18:54
Tom Willings
We'll get them on.
00:19:00
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:19:03
Tom Woolman
That was, um yeah, that was a great conversation and we could have just gone on on and on and on with that. And I'm sure we could get him back to talk about some other some other things.
00:19:07
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:19:11
Tom Willings
yeah
00:19:11
Tom Woolman
He's got an awful lot of insight.
00:19:13
Tom Willings
Yeah. and i'm um I'm particularly interested to follow up with the Try Some Chicken people. um
00:19:19
Tom Woolman
Mm-hmm.
00:19:19
Tom Willings
that that That study that sort of combines the social science or social geography, isn't it? They call it human geography with the industry that we that we know and love, I think is absolutely fascinating. like I know they've got their event coming up towards the end of October. i'm I'm going just as an interested bystander. I don't know if we'll end up doing ah um another interview or or podcast episode with them but I'm definitely going to watch that with
00:19:49
Tom Woolman
I mean, it's it's it's such an interesting project because it is it's massive. They're really looking at everything. It'll be very interesting to see how it all actually knits together. how how how do that How do they research that? you know What does it look like? What questions are they asking? And um how yeah and how does how does the end product appear?
00:20:08
Tom Woolman
um But yes, I did note down that it's on the 23rd of October, I think, is their sort of
00:20:08
Tom Willings
yeah
00:20:13
Tom Willings
Yeah. Are you going?

Sheep Challenges & Humorous Anecdotes

00:20:15
Tom Woolman
um Maybe. Maybe. I don't know.
00:20:17
Tom Willings
Maybe.
00:20:17
Tom Woolman
It's like with all these things, you've got to see um get to the week and see see what's going on. But um's I've certainly made a note of it in my diary.
00:20:21
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:20:24
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:20:24
Tom Woolman
I think it's somewhere in the Midlands, isn't it? Somewhere near Birmingham, these things usually are.
00:20:27
Tom Willings
That's right. Yeah. Yeah.
00:20:29
Tom Woolman
Yeah.
00:20:29
Tom Willings
Edge bastard. No, it's been a good three months, Tom. I've enjoyed it. We, um, we ought to do more of this chit chat. I know we talked about the format and, um, you know, on reflection, some of our, some of our interviews have been a bit kind of, they start and they finish with our guest and that's the end of it.
00:20:44
Tom Willings
And it'd be nice just to have an opportunity to, to, to chew over some of the things that we've learned or talked about on each episode. And so I guess that's something that we'll be, we'll be looking at in, in futures, but, um,
00:20:53
Tom Woolman
Yeah, and and and try and provide a a little bit of context. Sometimes when you're speaking to people or you're interviewing people, they'll give their side of the story, won't won't they? and And we know that actually quite often there's a bigger picture and it would be nice to spend a little bit more time talking about that bigger picture and, and and yeah, filling in a few more of the dots for for people.
00:21:11
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:21:12
Tom Woolman
and So, yeah.
00:21:13
Tom Willings
Yeah. So if you are listening and then guess what is what? Watch out for the changes, isn't it? Let's see how we shape it.
00:21:17
Tom Woolman
Yeah, yeah, yeah. and um And I guess thank you to to to everyone that has and provided us with positive feedback. um Yeah. um Please keep keep on with the feedback and and let us know honestly, you know, if there's if there are things that you think we could change or or things you'd like us to do, then then don't hold back and and let us know.
00:21:38
Tom Woolman
um
00:21:38
Tom Willings
Don't be so polite. We want to hear the bad stuff too. Yeah.
00:21:41
Tom Woolman
Yeah, although I'm i'm already regretting saying that because I'm going to be involved in some in some and some fairly forthright conversations, I'm sure, at the next social event that I go to now.
00:21:53
Tom Woolman
ah but i've I've just given someone carte blanche to to to go to town on my presenting style. Yeah.
00:21:59
Tom Willings
I think your bigger issue is the sheep admission.
00:22:03
Tom Woolman
yes yes yeah and um yeah i sent someone a picture saying look i've got some sheep and um and and they replied and they said well i can't see a shovel in the picture you're going to need one of those so um yeah we'll see i'll i'll every week maybe i could do a sheep count and i could let you know have i still got 10 or um or are they diminishing but um
00:22:03
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:22:18
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:22:21
Tom Willings
Yeah, exactly.

The Peacock Visitor at Tom's New Home

00:22:22
Tom Willings
I told you I had a confession of my own and that the people in our industry ought not keep poultry. um I didn't know it at the time, but we've moved in and subsequently found that we have a peacock. Only only one, only one.
00:22:22
Tom Woolman
at least keep
00:22:35
Tom Willings
But um it's about this time of day ah we're recording, what, it's 10 to 2. And he tends to arrive at the window, taps on the window with his beak. yeah Quite a shock the first time that happened, let me tell you.
00:22:45
Tom Woolman
ah see Is he wait waving at you with his with his tail?
00:22:49
Tom Willings
Yeah, waiting.
00:22:49
Tom Woolman
is it
00:22:49
Tom Willings
Waiting. Yeah, yeah. So it stands on one leg and then he's got these incredible spurs halfway up his hock and he rests his non-standing foot on that and um and peers through the window as if to say, what are you doing in my house?
00:23:07
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:23:07
Tom Woolman
Well, they quite they can be quite vocal, can't they, peacocks?
00:23:10
Tom Willings
I think it might be a time of the year thing. I don't know that we're quite in season for it, but yeah, on on um I'll send a photo.
00:23:16
Tom Woolman
Or maybe maybe you just haven't upset him yet.
00:23:17
Tom Willings
like
00:23:18
Tom Woolman
Maybe when you do, he'll um it'll ah it it'll let you know, won't he?
00:23:23
Tom Willings
He'll let me know. Exactly. Exactly.
00:23:24
Tom Woolman
Very good.
00:23:26
Tom Willings
Tom, I think that's enough for this week. It's good to see you.
00:23:28
Tom Woolman
Yeah, like you too. Look after yourself. And yeah, we'll speak again soon.
00:23:31
Tom Willings
Yeah.
00:23:34
Tom Willings
Look forward to it.