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E10 Compassion in World Farming: Progress, pressure and the path to 100 % cage-free
49 Plays7 days ago
In this episode of the Poultry Network Podcast, Tom Woolman and Tom Willings speak with Dr Tracey Jones, Global Director of Food Business at Compassion in World Farming, about the UK’s shift toward a cage-free future.
Tracey outlines the progress so far – 82 % of UK laying hens are now cage-free, compared with 50 % in 2016 – and the 2025 commitments made by major retailers. The conversation covers Iceland’s recent U-turn on its original pledge, public pressure driven by NGOs and high-profile campaigns, and the importance of retail alignment in creating industry change.
The discussion also addresses the 18 % of hens still in cages, the role of legislation in levelling the playing field, and the need for equivalent standards for imported eggs to avoid undermining UK producers. Funding and support for farmers transitioning to barn or free-range systems are explored, as are future welfare priorities such as enriched environments, veranda and natural light requirements, and phasing out beak trimming.
Tracey also comments on global cage-free efforts, the challenges and slower progress of the Better Chicken Commitment compared with eggs, and the balance of “carrot and stick” in driving corporate commitments. She emphasises the importance of early action, transparent reporting, and maintaining momentum toward higher welfare standards.
CTA:
If you’re involved in egg production, retail, foodservice or manufacturing, now is the time to act. Ensure your cage-free commitments are on track for 2025 and report progress by March 2026 to be included in the 2025 EggTrack. Contact Compassion In World Farming for more information.
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Transcript
Introduction to Cage-Free Systems
00:00:15
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to the Poultry Network podcast. um This week we're going to be talking to Compassion in World Farming and discussing the transition to cage-free.
00:00:27
Speaker
ah I'm Tom Woolman.
Mission of Compassion in World Farming
00:00:29
Speaker
I'm Tom Willings. And we are joined this week by Dr. Tracey Jones from Compassion in World Farming. Tracey is the Global Director of Food Business ah for the organisation.
00:00:40
Speaker
So I'm sure most of our listeners will know Compassion in World Farming, but can you just give us a bit of an outline, Tracey, as to what you do and how that fits in with the with the wider organisation? Yeah, so um i've been I've been here for nearly 15 years, 12 and a half as as the director and many of the audience might know me, um and also to know the programme. So ah ah the food business aim is to raise baseline standards for animal welfare throughout the supply chain of leading companies.
00:01:14
Speaker
And obviously sort of cage-free is a priority on that.
Impact of Cage-Free Policies
00:01:18
Speaker
And to date, more than 3.1 billion animals are set to benefit from our corporate partners' policies and practices each year.
00:01:27
Speaker
So we want commitments and um we want impact. So is the best to business part of your of your title is quite important and you and you reference corporate partners? It's about working with with businesses.
00:01:39
Speaker
Yeah, work working um as a critical friend um in partnership with food companies to help them secure commitments, um but also to um help them make the right implementation.
00:01:55
Speaker
and track compliance as well.
00:02:01
Speaker
Tracey, today we're we're focusing mainly on eggs. I'm sure we'll touch on on the poultry meat side ah as well in the conversation, but but mainly on eggs. Do you want to just sort of give us an overview as to where we've got to? I know it's been quite a big week with with and a certain announcement that we'll also touch on, but just give us a picture of the the the total yeah UK industry from Compassion's perspective in that transition um to Outer Cages.
UK's Cage-Free Transition Status
00:02:27
Speaker
so So we really believe we're at a tipping point here. We can see cage-free future for UK hens um at the end of June.
00:02:38
Speaker
DEFRA figures show that 82% of hens were cage-free in the UK, 70% were in free-range systems, just less than 4% organic, 8% in barn.
00:02:52
Speaker
But 18% still in cages, and that represents about 7 million hens. And, you know, we want to get those out of cages. We've come a long way.
00:03:04
Speaker
if I think back to 2016, when many of the companies, including the likes of, say, Tesco, Asda and Iceland, made their 2025 commitments, we were 50% caged at that point. So, you know, progress has been made, but still more to do.
00:03:23
Speaker
how How would you contextualise UK versus the rest of the world? Do you think that, you know as as certainly our industry would say, you know we're we're top of the class? Do you do you think that's right as you look at ah you know countries across the world or are we playing catch up?
Global Cage-Free Progress
00:03:42
Speaker
Well, if you think of Europe, you you know there's multiple countries there, but 60% cage-free there. 50% in the US and it'll be much lower in Asia Pacific, etc. But, you know, our programme works across not only the UK and Europe, but also in um in China as well and Asia Pacific. And we're getting commitments in China as well and progress there, albeit, you know, relatively slow. So I think the UK is doing doing really well, actually.
00:04:16
Speaker
So we're we're having this conversation in the context of um one retailer, Iceland, who has recently um said that they were going to abandon their 2025 cage free commitment, um received quite a reaction, I think it's fair to say, um and had reinstated that commitment, but they've reinstated it to 2027 now. so um Yes, talk a little bit about what's happened with Iceland and and and and why it's such a a concern for Compassion in World Farming.
Public Sentiment and Market Influence
00:04:50
Speaker
Well, it was a fair decision to to renege on that commitment showed, you know, real poor judgment, um especially given the market shift to cage-free and the weight then the weight of consumer um dislike of cages.
00:05:05
Speaker
And, you know, 87% of retail is actually cagefre um cage-free eggs. So They were really going against you know the the momentum in retail um and consumers.
00:05:20
Speaker
And 75% Britons you know feel that for cage-free eggs. And as we saw earlier, and sixty seven percent were pay pay more for cage freee eggs and and as we saw With Iceland's data itself, you know, caged egg sales had reduced by 15% last year anyway.
00:05:40
Speaker
So abandoning that commitment really put Iceland out of step with the rest of the UK retail and and risked huge reputational damage actually to the company.
00:05:51
Speaker
and And you mentioned the power of public sentiment. You know, this was was backed by a petition, wasn't it? Was it the Humane League that yeah um that put the petition out? And you'll remind me, I can't remember exactly how many signatures they they achieved, but in quite short order.
00:06:10
Speaker
yeah significant groundswell do you think that sentiment that public sentiment for hens is specific to uk are we are we a nation of backyard hen keepers and have got a a particularly close affinity with hens that we you you can garner that reaction i can't imagine you know the the french or the germans or or um you know the european nations getting that level of support or am i misguided well there are two parts to that question and and the first one was you know the the the um
00:06:41
Speaker
the multiple campaigns that the Humane League ran from May onwards against you know Iceland.
00:06:52
Speaker
um and And I think it was over 70,000 signatures in quite a short period of time. And that campaign was fronted by Joanna Lumley as well. So you know a huge, huge response from the UK public on that.
00:07:07
Speaker
um And also we wrote um an open letter to their chairman, to Richard Walker, in collaboration with the ah RSPCA, Humane League um and Open Cages. And what we saw was, you know, Iceland respond to that. And I can talk about that and what they did um um little bit once I've found answered your second part to your question, which is, you know,
00:07:36
Speaker
why why delaying hens incite such a emotional response you know from the uk public and i think it's that you know well compassion has been campaigning against um cages for you know almost 60 years and a caged hen is an iconic you know symbol of intensive factory farming um and you know that the UK consumer does want cage-free eggs.
00:08:10
Speaker
They also you know rescue lots of spent lots of end end of lay hens. And so you know they get to see those hens build their confidence, going outside, ah possibly even um you know um hatching their own eggs.
00:08:29
Speaker
and then the maternal aspect, you know, with their chicks. So it does garner a lot of interest and empathy. But I think it's that's the same across Europe as well.
00:08:42
Speaker
You know, I think it's over 90% of Europeans said they thought the cages were cruel in their latest Eurobarometer. So i don't think it's... so It's just the UK at all. I think it's across Europe and other countries.
00:08:55
Speaker
I wonder if we could emanate, the I suppose, the the growth of um of the rescue hens movement. um Maybe we could set up some sort of scheme where people can take cull cows from from dairy farms and and have one of those in the back garden and give it give it a scratch and just a bit bit be a bit more of an expensive ah enterprise, wouldn't it?
00:09:16
Speaker
i don't I don't know about that, but you know the fact that... um 70% of UK production is free range, sings volumes to what people will pay for and buy for their eggs. yeah And Tracy, you mentioned the importance of retail in in creating um change, in in in building momentum in in any movement. And you know the petition with Iceland takes me back to 2015 and the petition by ah schoolgirl who um approached Tesco and and had ah an audience with the Tesco management at the time. and
00:09:51
Speaker
And that was one of the early dominoes. I realised the cage movement was going on well before that um internationally and and your pressure. um domestically in the UK. But um you know that that meeting itself made made headlines, I'm sure national press coverage of of Tesco being challenged by um by a member of the public and such ah a young member of the public as well.
00:10:14
Speaker
um yeah we've We've kind of got to where we've got to on the back of the the supermarkets all aligning and the supermarkets being such a ah vast share of where the public buy their food in this country, either you know fresh whole eggs or through manufactured processes into into ready meals, et cetera, et cetera.
00:10:39
Speaker
But there's still quite a section of of production and industry then orientated away from retail that I guess is going to remain very much more kind of cost focused.
Encouraging Businesses to Go Cage-Free
00:10:52
Speaker
And I wonder what your um you kind of approach is to um appealing to those producers and then food businesses and to encourage them to to to follow the retail path and and and ultimately move out of cages.
00:11:05
Speaker
Well, they are ready. You know, um the the number of cage-free commitments in ah food service and manufacturers is is large, you know, and it started with the likes of Unilever and their Helmand Mayonnaise back in 2008, you know, and we've got great companies like Greggs, McDonald's, Green King, Pizza, Subway, many um already cage-free.
00:11:34
Speaker
um as well as, you know, your B2B caterers as well. So really there are opportunities for all producers across all sectors um to be supplying cage-free eggs.
00:11:47
Speaker
And, um you know, of course, the low-cost argument that Iceland put in place, you know, for its predominant reason to renege on its commitment, you know,
00:12:02
Speaker
ah subsequently they found that you know they can they can afford to to move to barn their their trial that they did with the bali uh garvey branded eggs you know selling packs of 10 for two pounds 35 so three 23 pence um 23 and a half pence um per egg compared to 14.6 cages was was was a success and the consumers voted by buying those eggs and um You know, Iceland worked out that actually they could go cage free. And in the words of Stuart Lendrum, you know, balm was the right route to protect affordable choice and welfare.
00:12:43
Speaker
um So i don't think we can really use the affordability. um argument across the board because companies are finding ways to do this.
Role of Legislation in Cage-Free Transition
00:12:55
Speaker
So yeah the 18% that have yet to convert um that you mentioned at the at the top, what's the what's the route then to to to reach those guys? is it Is it just a matter of waiting and everyone will ah ultimately follow suit or does it does it require legislation? And if so, you know what's the timescale? What do you foresee?
00:13:20
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you know, look, the the retailers made great progress. They're well on their way to meeting their 2025 deadlines, as are, you know, the food service industry as well.
00:13:32
Speaker
um It will come that legislation is required to, you know, make a level standard, to create a level playing field, and encourage those laggards to to move forward to cage-free. know, unfortunately, some Some producers or some companies might might just need legislation to do that.
00:13:55
Speaker
I was just going to ask Tracy, um in terms of legislation and bringing forward legislation regarding production systems, whether ah now might be the best time, given that um the UK at the moment is um is importing a fair amount of egg from from countries like Ukraine.
00:14:12
Speaker
which are outside of the EU and um and and don't even have enriched cages. If we bring in legislation outlawing ah cage systems in the UK, isn't that just going to mean that actually people end up with with lower standards of welfare for the ah for the eggs that ah that ah that ah people are having on there ah in their in their meals, whatever, in food service and and not necessarily through retail?
00:14:35
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's, you know, compassion is not only asking for, you know, a phasing out of cages for UK production, also asking for the same standards to be set for imported eggs or egg products so that that level playing field is maintained.
00:14:51
Speaker
I think, you know, UK consumers would be horrified to know that eggs or egg product from barren battery cages is entering the supplies. um and And that's what we need to do you know in legislation is make sure that that trade is trade element is there as well so that that we don't undermine or undercut UK producers because that's absolutely not the intention of what we want in making UK cage-free.
Lobbying Against Lower Welfare Imports
00:15:19
Speaker
Tracy, can i can i ask a direct question there? Is that something that Compassion are currently actively involved with lobbying against? Because it wouldn't just be the consumer that's horrified about being um you know sold eggs that are illegal to produce in in this country imported from from afar.
00:15:39
Speaker
trade themselves are horrified that that is the status quo. So, are Compassion actively talking to government, for example, about changing that loophole?
00:15:53
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Our policy team are in in discussions with DEFRA when they can, and that is definitely one of the strong asks that we are you know requiring.
00:16:04
Speaker
So yeah, absolutely. and And wondering as well, ah is there more that could be done in terms of um ah support mechanisms for for ah supporting farmers to to move away from from from cage production to to to barn or to free range, whether that's price premiums, etc.?
00:16:24
Speaker
Yeah, so, you know, i think it's fair to say that, um you know, those but producers do need, um you know, long term contracts. a fair price for a fair product, whatever that means in terms of their their price point.
00:16:40
Speaker
um And even things like access to loans help with that, um you know, whether their customers can help with that or you know, go to, you know, certain banks. I heard that the Oxbury Bank, you know, is so does does good things for higher welfare systems. So, you know, securing that investment is going to be important.
Funding for Cage-Free Transition
00:17:02
Speaker
um There was um the DEFRA Laying Hen Welfare Grant System. I think that closed i traffic get closed September last year um for checking if you were viable or feasible.
00:17:20
Speaker
um And I think that applications have been extended to April 2026, I believe. So you know there are potential funding mechanisms through DEFRA if you're in the system already, and that is between, I think it's £5,000 £500,000 worth of grants at individuals for upgrading their existing Lane Hen or Pullet farms um or putting verandas on existing buildings.
Post-Transition System Designs
00:17:52
Speaker
Tracy, I was going to ask you, when we get to the end of the cage transition and either the entirety of the UK industry has moved or maybe the focus on retail is complete and whether it's 25 or the in 27 beyond,
00:18:10
Speaker
um catch up where where are we headed next from a ah laying hen welfare perspective is it the same cage transition um but a focus abroad and and look for global equivalence or is it um you know that suddenly there is focus on indoor production on barn aviary systems that of course have replaced many of the of the colony systems what do what do you foresee?
00:18:39
Speaker
Well, we're already working on um what constitutes a good system. You know, we haven have good resources on this, what constitutes a good Avery system. and as we know, um not all systems are equal.
00:18:54
Speaker
Some are, you know, quite intensive, compact systems. Other can be ah that spacious, you know, um avery and Avery designs. ah we We did stop the influx of any combination systems back in 2018, 2019, so we were pleased with that.
00:19:12
Speaker
But I think for people who are looking to you know get out of cages now, really need to look at um some of the key features that make their system fit for future.
00:19:24
Speaker
And that's ensuring there's enough space to allow the birds to move freely around the structure with injur without injuring themselves. but there's separate functional areas for nesting, resting, perching, dust bathing.
00:19:39
Speaker
um It's a really enriched environment for occupation. and we really need to, as you say, look ahead as well, because we've just seen, you know, with the ah RSPCA new standards coming out, veranda requirement for barn by 2030, natural light requirement by 2032. You so that's signalling um a future expectation of, you know, good systems for barn.
00:20:05
Speaker
And we really need all systems to be operating, you know, without beet trimming or maintaining good feather cover and reducing keel bone fractures. um So, you know, there's a lot of work and that out there and a lot of advice out there for what constitutes a good system, whether that's barn, free range, or organic.
00:20:25
Speaker
And, I think you asked me about um global commitments. We're already, you know, asking global companies for global commitments, and many and many of them have that. They are struggling.
00:20:36
Speaker
um And our role would be to facilitate, you know, implementation on those and to ensure that, um you know, there's no reneging of those commitments.
00:20:47
Speaker
um Because as I said, i hope I said earlier, commitments are, oh you know, are meaningless unless progress is made and they add them and they're actually fulfilled.
00:21:00
Speaker
but could Could I just come in there and just just ah switching the focus to to the poultry meat sector and looking at what's been happening with the Better Chicken Commitment? Because I can see that, although I think progress is um as as has been quite steady, certainly going towards the 2025 deadline in terms of eggs, um the Better Chicken Commitment has has made a bit of a start, but
Challenges in Better Chicken Commitment
00:21:21
Speaker
it's certainly faltered. And there's there's very big names like KFC, um which are you know arguably a ah ah much bigger business than Iceland.
00:21:29
Speaker
that have um that have now said they're not going to be able to meet the requirements of the Better Chicken commitment, having having earlier signed up for it. um So, yeah what's different about what's happened with KFC to what's happened with with with Iceland? You know, why have we seen one change their mind quite quickly and and um why is the other one stuck to their guns?
00:21:49
Speaker
The transition to the Better Chicken commitment is is harder. There's a lot of factors at play here. Price differential is is much bigger. um the availability of the product um has become harder, actually, since the UK retailers um have i' mopped up all the 30 kilogram per metre squared production.
00:22:15
Speaker
um But it doesn't mean to say that ah it's not ah ah attainable, maybe not by the 2026 deadline for some companies. They may need longer.
00:22:27
Speaker
But, um you know, it's still attainable and and progress is being made, you know, particularly with the likes of M&S and the 100% on their fresh and Waitrose are going to be 100% across fresh and, you know, their products by September this year.
00:22:48
Speaker
And we do report on progress there, you know, and there is some reasonable progress to be made. But, yeah, I mean, Again, we'll be working with the companies to overcome the barriers um and to ensure that actions and plans are put in place you know for a transition ultimately to 100% of their commitment.
00:23:14
Speaker
Tracy, there there's carrot and there's stick. and they in back in Back in my day, little while now since I was in the in the corporate world, but um the Good Egg Award was always a ah ah tremendous um achievement and and something that businesses strive for.
Role and Limitations of the Good Egg Award
00:23:30
Speaker
um and and often given on the basis of a of a promise yet to be completely fulfilled or or delivered. i wonder if that's still the case or you know does the Iceland experience just as as as one example of people saying one thing but then deciding at a later stage to change their mind, does does that slightly move the goalposts and make you reflect differently on on awarding gongs for best practice, on on providing the carrot when perhaps a little bit more sticks required first?
00:24:02
Speaker
We do assess you know everybody's um willingness to move when we award when we award them. And I think the Good Egg Award has has created a huge ripple across the across you know food companies from um the early 2010s onwards, etc. We do track those companies as well.
00:24:23
Speaker
Maybe not every company that's awarded, but we do track companies. And obviously the commitment for the Good Egg Awards was in within five years as well.
00:24:33
Speaker
So some of these commitments are, you know, nine years, 2016 to 2025. So they would have fallen out of the the awards programme.
00:24:44
Speaker
um But, you know, given and I'll talk about Iceland again, you know, given that they had nine years to meet their commitment with they when they um pledged in Ireland,
00:24:56
Speaker
2016 they had nine years to complete that cage transition they've now got two years to transition 60 of their shell eggs so they're confident they can do it they've come out with that timeline so just shows that early action you know is really needed on these commitments and that waiting just is counterproductive so you do just have to get on and do the job really and um you know, we are there to to to track and make sure that that people do fulfill those commitments.
Conclusion and 2025 Deadline
00:25:34
Speaker
and And there's loads of NGOs ready to use the stick if they if they don't. but this this There certainly are, yes. it's it's it's yeah It's interesting, I think, how some of you collaborate on certain things, but obviously you have quite different approaches and in other ways as well. so But yeah, thank you ever so much for ah for coming on and talking to us, Tracy. Really appreciate it. And um yeah, and a really interesting time um for the cage-free commitment as we as we reach that momentous year of 2025. So um yeah, thank you very much.
00:26:08
Speaker
Thanks, Tom.