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Night 3: The Tragic Terror of Pumpkinhead (1988)| 13 Nights of Halloween w/ @ABHorrorMovies
22 Plays1 month ago
In this episode, Tim and Johnathan dive into the grim, atmospheric world of Pumpkinhead (1988) and welcome special guest Aaron from A&B Horror to break down why this revenge-driven creature feature perfectly fits our Folk Horror theme. From rural curses to supernatural justice, we explore the movie’s eerie mood, practical effects, and lasting impact on horror fans. 📚 Want more horror? Check out our books on Amazon: 👉 https://a.co/d/bUtniBd 🎧 Check out our friends at Zencastr and get 30% off your first 3 months of Zencastr Pro: 👉 https://zen.ai/theaveragereviews 📖 Enjoy $5.00 off your first purchase when you use Tim Umpleby’s code “TIMOTHYREADS” at checkout: 👉 https://pangobooks.com/TIMOTHYREADS 💀 Special thanks to Aaron from A&B Horror for joining us in this episode—go show him some love! 👍 Don’t forget to like, comment, and subscribe for more horror deep dives. #Pumpkinhead #HorrorPodcast #FolkHorror #80sHorror #CreatureFeature #StanWinston #TheAverageReviews
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Transcript
Introduction to Pumpkinhead
00:00:28
Speaker
Welcome back everyone to 13 nights of Halloween. We are still somewhat fresh in our folk horror filled season and tonight ho ho tonight we're diving deep into one of the nastiest bits of Backwoods vengeance the 80s had to offer.
00:00:42
Speaker
That's right. We're talking about Pumpkinhead from 1988. The directorial debut of special effects legend Stan Winston.
00:00:54
Speaker
You know, the guy who's responsible for the Xenomorph Queen Predator, Terminator, that guy. So when he says, I'm going to make my own monster, you better believe we're getting something unforgettable.
Guest Aaron Joins
00:01:09
Speaker
And joining us for this trip into the dark woods is our friend Aaron from A&B Horror Movies. Yes. Hi guys. Thank you so much for having me back, Tim and Jonathan. This is fantastic.
00:01:20
Speaker
And I love Pumpkinhead, so I can't wait. I've been looking forward to this all day long. Sweet. All right. So he's here to help us dig into what makes this movie tick and why it's more than just a gnarly creature feature.
00:01:33
Speaker
And Aaron, we're so excited to have you back. It's been by the time this actually airs, it's been about a year since we had you on for Wolfman. But you have been a regular.
00:01:44
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Yeah. Over at the Dread broadcast and we love you over there. Love having you out there. So ah super guys are killing it. Yes. Thank you so much. Well, thank you.
Themes of Pumpkinhead
00:01:55
Speaker
And here's the thing. pumpkin head fits beautifully into our folk horror theme this season it's got all the hallmarks an isolated rural setting deeply ingrained traditions and an old world curse that locals whisper about but never really question it's the tragic morality tale of vengeance gone too far it's appalachian gothic with a supernatural kick Plus that monster design, top tier, practical effects at their finest. But it's not just about the gore and scares.
00:02:31
Speaker
It's about the grief, the desperation, and the deal Ed Harley makes that he can't take back.
Book Plug: Like, Comment, Survive
00:02:37
Speaker
But before we dive in, quick plug. If you're looking for a perfect October read filled with found footage, vibes, and YouTube Ghost Hunter Chaos, check out my book, Like, Comment, Survive.
00:02:49
Speaker
It's the kind of horror that'll make you want to keep the lights on and your comment section closed. All right, grab your lanterns and watch where you step because once you call Pumpkinhead, there's no one doing it.
00:03:01
Speaker
Let's get into it. All right. Diving in our first category is story. So Pumpkinhead, I'll just kick off a little bit about story here.
Ed Harley's Tragic Story
00:03:12
Speaker
Pumpkinhead kicks off with rural tragedy. Ed Harley's young son is accidentally killed by a group of reckless teenagers.
00:03:24
Speaker
I'm going to be honest right here. When the witch call talks to him, I hear Ed Hardy. And I know that's not right, but I just keep hearing Ed Hardy. And then I just keep thinking about those terrible t-shirts.
00:03:39
Speaker
The clothing line. are yeah but She's like, Ed Hardy. like, yeah. It's Harley, right? It's Harley. Yeah, it's Harley.
00:03:49
Speaker
But I was watching it and I was just ah zoning out a little bit when she started calling him Ed Harley. I heard Ed Hardy and added a little bit of PTSD.
00:04:01
Speaker
Killed by group of heedless teenagers. Ed is consumed by grief, rage, and To me, I thought maybe it's clearer. I've only seen this movie a couple times.
00:04:15
Speaker
um I thought he was going to the witch to resurrect the kid and then she's like, I can't do that. And then it kind of turns to vengeance. So I didn't take it that his initial onset was to seek revenge.
00:04:31
Speaker
I took it that that was kind of secondary, but. He seeks vengeance not through justice, but through something supernatural. He goes to this witch named Haggis and they summon a demonic creature from folklore fitting our folk tale to enact his revenge.
00:04:52
Speaker
But as the demon is exacting revenge on the kids, Ed feels every kill, every bit of it.
00:05:04
Speaker
as it goes. The film itself was inspired by a poem called pumpkin head. And the original working title for this movie was not pumpkin head, which actually the working title makes more sense. Vengeance the demon.
00:05:24
Speaker
And then United artists wanted a more memorable name and chose pumpkin head. So where are we at in the story? Guys, let's break down that story. a little one Aaron, why don't you go ahead and start us off?
00:05:35
Speaker
Me? yeah Aaron. Aaron. he Yeah. you You want to kick us off? Yeah, sure. With the story? Yeah, you said you love this movie, so let's hear your take, man. yeah. Oh, the story. Okay, okay. So it's like a modern-day Grimm's fairy tale, right? Yeah. It's sort of like be careful what you wish for.
00:05:55
Speaker
um i love this film. I grew up watching it. it's The nostalgic factor is huge. Maybe it doesn't hold up quite as well as it did when I was a kid watching it, but it's still so much fun. I usually watch it once every year, and especially – this time of year i always put pumpkin head on and it's one of those movies i hate to say it but it's kind of like when you watch titanic you think god maybe the ship won't sink this time you watch pumpkin head and you know it will and you're like oh man maybe the little boy won't get killed this time but you know he has to and and maybe blossom will be nicer in the beginning but
00:06:31
Speaker
but Yeah, yeah. So, okay, so you want my score, right? No, you can for we can just chat about it for a second and then we can drop the scores. Okay. at the end Yeah. ah you You kind of hit on one of the key things that stands out in this film for me is every time hoping the kid doesn't die.
00:06:53
Speaker
i remember the first time i watched this movie i knew very little about it other than the creature and so i thought it was going to be a very different
Exploring Grief and Revenge
00:07:01
Speaker
type of movie and i was blindsided by that kid dying i was like you whoa because it's just it's tragic and
00:07:18
Speaker
i don't want to say it's sad it's sad story ultimately Yes, and I don't want to say it's like unnecessarily brutal because they they do a really good job of not showing much. You just, the kid gets hit, they're dying.
00:07:32
Speaker
ah But it is it hit me it hit me like a like a like a motorcycle, I guess, because I did not expect it. Nicely done.
00:07:44
Speaker
Knocked the wind right out of you. was that But you know going back to the story, like I said, it's it's sad kind of all around because no one really wins in this story. No.
00:07:57
Speaker
Yeah. So watching it this time, i was definitely struck by the messages about grief and the messages about vengeance and revenge that like i kept coming to mind the old phrase when you go, is it when you go to seek revenge, dig two graves?
00:08:18
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's yeah that's how it goes. Something like that. And I that i was definitely thinking about that this time. Like he's out for vengeance, but he is also suffering from it. It's not healing his hurt at all. They're going to pay for it.
00:08:34
Speaker
So that definitely stood out to me. And I think that stands out more than a lot of other movies in in this era of telling that kind of deeper revenge story.
00:08:48
Speaker
I know we have plenty of revenge movies from the 80s, but this one kind of that tragic gothic tale take on it. If I'm honest, it reminded me of this year's.
00:09:01
Speaker
In notes, not not a lot. It reminded me of this year's Bring Her Back. I kept thinking about that film about parent losing a child and the lengths that they will go to.
First Impressions of Pumpkinhead
00:09:16
Speaker
in their grief and so i was drawing parallels from that this time so it stuck this time i could see the parallels there and yeah it's the grief drives them to become something that they normally never would but then because of making that decision there's no turning back yep exactly yeah So for me, man, like I saw this movie when it first came out on VHS.
00:09:45
Speaker
And so I was like five or six years old watching this and probably not a good idea. um i don't recall having any nightmares from it, but definitely impactful. And like you said, Aaron, now that I've watched it again as then when I'm older, because I haven't watched this in a long time. So I watched it last night and I watched it today.
00:10:07
Speaker
and so it's been a while. so it does hit, it lands a little differently for sure. um But still, I think it's a pretty awesome story. Just that sense of this rural mountain holler folklore terror, you know, and the way the movie starts out with Ed Harley as a kid witnessing this in action, you know, and then it finally kept being being a tool that he utilizes himself in his anger just is incredible.
00:10:33
Speaker
you know And it's amazing that they don't hide the the demon from you. There's no waiting to see it. You know ah right up front. When you do this kind of stuff, when you get involved in something like this, this is what you get.
00:10:44
Speaker
you know So it's crazy awesome. And just the fact that you've got Ed Harley, who is just, could tell early in the movie with his son now how tender he is. He's a loving father. He's a good man. you know he's It's not a big community out there in the hollers, but it's something that he cares about. and he's He's a good man.
00:11:02
Speaker
And just to see what has happened to him and the characters to the other people and how it twists him and then how he finds and how he learns, like, this is not what I wanted. What was I thinking? And like having to deal with those consequences and having to bite the bullet at the end in order to to save lives, you know, it is is an incredible story for me. I think it's fantastic.
00:11:23
Speaker
yeah Yeah, I'm in agreement. So I think if we were going to talk any more about the story, it's going to lead directly to the character arc. So scores for the story, where are we at for the uniqueness of the story?
00:11:37
Speaker
So I didn't go so super high, um but only because it's kind of a thinking of the story. It's a sort of a simple vengeance story. I gave it a three um based on that.
00:11:51
Speaker
I gave it a four. Okay, I'm sitting right there with you, Tim. I'm a four as well. So we're not all all all that different, Aaron, not all that. Okay, okay. oh The character arcs on this one. So like I said, diving a little bit more into the story. And I think this is why I gave the story a little bit more is we see Ed is evolving from the loving father to a devastated father to some kind of demonic vessel of revenge and we see in the end he's a tormented soul that vengeance that revenge did nothing to heal him and then in fact made him worse and i think there's some
00:12:43
Speaker
that's where like I was I was sitting on a three for a while and then I was like I do think there's some poeticism to that that the revenge doesn't solve anything and in fact Ed comes out the other side hurting even more than he did at the beginning so I love that tragic arc for Ed and this is where I think this movie stands out almost more modern in its storytelling is that this movie's pretty bleak.
Ed Harley's Character Arc
00:13:19
Speaker
It's pretty bleak horror. Like you said, there are no winners in the end. There's no happy ending. Yeah, this is not a happy ending. It's tragedy through and through. So, but Ed does go on that journey of loving father to broken, beaten father who seeks revenge and then realizes at the end that,
00:13:41
Speaker
That wasn't the answer. And he learns through that trial. So I love that arc. My issue here is teenagers. So, and we can, someone might feel different, but I felt like each of these teenagers was an extremely just kind of average person.
00:14:02
Speaker
I honestly, I barely remember them from the multiple times I've seen this movie. I know they're there. I know the one guy who kills Ed's son is kind of a D bag anyways, and he's just awful.
00:14:15
Speaker
And then there's one who there's one who wants to be the good guy. So, but outside of that, I don't really like, I feel like the teenagers were there to have bodies to pick out, to pick apart.
00:14:28
Speaker
That's it. I didn't see much growth from them. They just become prey. And that's my personal take on their character arcs. But where are you guys? Do
00:14:41
Speaker
you want me to jump in? Yeah, I completely agree. I mean, it's, it's, it's Harley's story, right? He's the one who evolves and, and, makes a bad decision with because of the grief and then realizes that he made a mistake and and tries to make amends while also going through a very difficult time.
00:15:01
Speaker
So um yeah, the teenagers are just there to be, killed off one by one. You know, we do have that one couple, like you mentioned, the guy and his girlfriend, they're like the wholesome couple, like we've got to do the right thing.
00:15:13
Speaker
mean, they sort of stand out, but then the others are like, oh, can't go back to prison or yeah forget what he's like, oh, I have a record or something. um Hit and run, I can't remember. yeah He'd done this before. he it was something very similar to this before. Months prior, he hit a girl.
00:15:30
Speaker
Yeah, got her and he had been drinking. yeah Probation, yes, that's it, yeah. you yeah but you kind of expect that in a movie like this but i think the depth really comes into play with lance henriksen's character and that's what stands out and that's what's most memorable about the film setting aside the effects of the monster of course yeah right on so yeah while it's about ed there's some other weird parts maybe that stand out for everybody but the that the the stupid teenage hillbilly boy who helps ed harley and kind of helps spur on this whole situation that kids you know he seems like just a little just little idiot but eventually his curiosity i think really taught him something not to mess around with it you know because he almost bites it at the end when he's like upside down being hung up by a pumpkin head
00:16:23
Speaker
boy gets his life saved by Ed Hardy and his eventual sacrifice at the end in order to stop the monster. So I think that boy, i don't know. i haven't seen the other three. I think there's like at least four pumpkin head movies.
00:16:36
Speaker
um So I'm not sure how it plays into the next one. Hopefully that boy is in the next one and has some perspective. Hey, right there. Nice. I don't know if I own any more beyond this one, but I do. Oh, really? Yeah, i can barely remember the second one. So I don't know if any of this one really plays into it um as much as I would like to think it would.
00:16:57
Speaker
But yeah, little bit. And then Ed Harley. Before I forget, I want to share a funny story, but keep going. I'll jump in in a second. Go ahead, Swim. A friend of mine went to a convention and met Lance Henriksen, and I did too, but he was talking to Lance Henriksen about the future Pumpkinheads. And i don't I don't think it's part two. There's a future one that he was in, and he basically did it for the money.
00:17:19
Speaker
And he said it's so awful. It's like one of the worst movies he's ever been in. And so Lance Henriksen was at the convention and the and the director and they watched the film and the director was like, we have big surprise. Lance Henriksen's here in the audience. Lance, come on up.
00:17:32
Speaker
And Lance told my buddy, he's like, I was so embarrassed about the film that I snuck out of the theater. It didn't go up stage. I don't remember which one it was. I should have. been Wow. My friend. But anyway.
00:17:47
Speaker
yeah good delivery That fits what I've heard about the later installments of Pumpkinhead. They get pretty bad, yeah. Yeah, I think I've seen one and two, and and then I stopped there. I think even the last one, four, is a sci-fi original.
00:18:02
Speaker
Like, it went to sci-fi channel. In space, right? Maybe that's the one. in string Nothing can top Jason in space.
00:18:13
Speaker
we supposed go say yeah We still need Freddy in space, but we got a lepercon in space before we got Freddy in space. But anyways, jonathan Jonathan. Yeah, I cut you off. My apologies.
00:18:25
Speaker
No, no. all you twitter dude i love good stories. it's and perfect um I got to say, our D-bag, Joel. um but First off, i don't none of these people really look like teenagers, except for maybe like the the good guy, Steve, who is like yeah trying and stay with the boy after the hit.
00:18:41
Speaker
The rest of them, they're at least in college or some shit. They do not look like teenagers at all, but especially Joel. Yeah. our hate man of the hour, just destroy that dude. He at first, he was like, you Steve tries to defend him like, oh, he's a good guy. If you get to know him, the guy just acts like a complete D bag.
00:18:59
Speaker
And then this happens and you just see a downward spiral in his panic, trying to save his own ass instead of doing what's right. And the guy just goes psychopath. You know, the rest of the friends come back to the cabin.
00:19:11
Speaker
They're like, what are you doing? He rips the cord out of the wall. Right. Then the one dude like socks him and he's like, tries to take the keys and then bashes him in the back of the head with a log. And the girls are just like, what are we going to do? This guy's going off. He has lost his fucking mind. Extreme.
00:19:26
Speaker
And it's like, what are you going to do? You can't just keep everybody there forever. Then he's got this couple like in stuck in the closet and then finally decides, okay, I got to do what's right. Enough of this shit is bad. We can't just stay here.
00:19:38
Speaker
This thing is fucking after us, so might well try and do the right thing. it's It's great that there's that sense of growth him in him, but man, just the really worst way to fucking go about it You know, so satisfying when you finally see him get his just desserts and have that rifle shoved in him and impaled.
00:19:56
Speaker
Yes, I was like, you scumbag, you fucking deserve this so hard. Yes, absolutely. And ah man, I love that. So mean, I don't know carol rid an arc so much. It has its moments to it, but it's it's good seeing that justice there.
Role of Haggis, the Witch
00:20:11
Speaker
And if only and it applied just to that guy, if maybe Ed had taken a moment to listen to Steve and explain what happened in the accident, maybe they wouldn't have all had to die.
00:20:21
Speaker
But still, Ed, though, you know, we all know what happened with you guys have already spoken that but Haggis though the witch oh yes she's fantastic clearly there's no there's a clear there's no arc there but I still just want to mention her because she's like the gatekeeper of this evil you know and you know she can only do so much she warns them they they foolishly go with it and then at the end there she is burying pumpkin head ready for the cycle repeat to go on and on exactly you know it's still i know it's dorker still cool to
00:20:53
Speaker
Where she lives. It's like Aunt Gladys in Weapons. Yes. ah aunt gladyson weapons yes oh andjuning Jonathan, you you still got to see Weapons, don't you?
00:21:04
Speaker
I have not seen it yet. i've just i've been I've just caught up on some other stuff. like I just watched Sinners the other night, which was fantastic. I loved that. great so good and That was so good. Then I watched the the new Final Destination Bloodlines. I really they liked that. of the tie-ins from the original and all this other stuff. Death of Unicorn. i I'm doing a lot of catching up this. that one yet.
00:21:27
Speaker
Death of the Unicorn was cool too. That was pretty rad. yeah Go ahead. Paul Rudd was so good. Absolutely. Hot take on sinners. Yes. I think the movie gets worse once the vampires show up.
00:21:40
Speaker
no And that that's my hot take. I think the first like hour so of that movie is a masterpiece when it's just like a bluesy Southern Godfather.
00:21:56
Speaker
Love it. Loving that. And then the vampires show up and it's like, all right, Irish vampires. It's not bad. I'm not saying it's bad. I still yeah really enjoyed the movie. I still really enjoyed the movie. I was just the vampires were my least favorite part of it.
00:22:12
Speaker
That's my heart. It does sort of fall out the flow works, though. But yeah, I hear what you're saying. I left the theater. The credits rolled. They showed him in the future of the Yeah. yeah And we left.
00:22:23
Speaker
I didn't realize there was another like 10 minute scene. oh yeah. After that, until I watched it at home, i was like, how did I miss this? And it's a good in cut scene. It's a good rap. Yeah, that rape scene.
00:22:38
Speaker
But yeah, because they've been watching you all these years or something. you Even though this will air in October, we're recording it August 14th. So Jonathan, you need to I would say weapons is worth getting to the theater for.
00:22:52
Speaker
it was It was good. Okay, I might do that on Sunday then. I enjoyed that one. I knew this was airing in October and I almost wore a Halloween 2 t-shirt and now I'm kicking off. That's okay. Poltergeist. Poltergeist is still a great selection.
00:23:10
Speaker
So our core
00:23:14
Speaker
scores on character arcs. I am a four because I really liked the just the underlying message that vengeance doesn't actually solve anything.
00:23:26
Speaker
and how transformative it was literally for Ed. Like this is one of those movies where the message is not preaching. It's not message forward movie, but this is one of those movies where horror can be used to deliver that kind of story so beautifully.
00:23:49
Speaker
So I was a four on character arc because of Ed.
00:23:56
Speaker
Yeah, me too. I went with it for two. yeah Yes. we Forget all the other characters. It's his story. I would go with four as well on this. You know, like as a kid watching this, like when I was thought about the other day before rewatching it, I was thinking, man, Lance Henderson gave like a raw ass performance in this film.
00:24:13
Speaker
And then I watched it last night after so long. OK, maybe not as raw, but still pretty damn good. Still pretty damn good. And then of course you've got Mayim Bialik as a little hillbilly girl.
00:24:23
Speaker
How funny is that? We're not on acting yet. I saw that in the credits while watching last I'm like, there's no way she's not in this movie. And I saw what it was. So I watched it. When I watched it again today, I looked for I'm like, oh, that is her. Like, holy shit.
00:24:36
Speaker
It's the origins of Amy Farrah Fowler. ah yeah I wouldn't it be funny to like do an interview with her and ask her about pumpkin head. Yeah. And I was thinking that exact thing earlier. for Anderson doesn't like to talk about leprechaun.
00:24:53
Speaker
Oh, it's a shame. Missed opportunity. I bet Leonardo DiCaprio doesn't like talking about Critters for but hey, I'm not here to talk about Wolf on Wall Street, Titanic. None of that. I want to know about Critters for.
00:25:09
Speaker
ah And what was your motivation for this? What inspired you for this movie? was it All right. Music and sound design.
00:25:21
Speaker
So this is one where I just have a couple notes on this, not a whole lot to say. they i feel like sometimes they go a little too hard into the southern folky folksy sound on the music.
00:25:34
Speaker
Sometimes it's perfect. So it kind of sometimes it works for me. Sometimes it's a little bit too much. ah But what I do really like is the sound design.
00:25:45
Speaker
I notice, I don't know if I'm picking up the ambient sound outside my house right now, but like we have the cicadas going on in the movie. You get frogs, you get the crickets, you get the sound of where they are.
00:25:59
Speaker
And anybody who actually lives in those areas knows that at night, you should be scared when it's quiet. And so I liked that this movie is pumping in those background ambient sounds. They did a really nice job.
00:26:14
Speaker
It really stands out in the witch's house. when they are at haggis's house oh yeah you really hear that she is deep in the swamp and i love that about this movie so the music neither here nor there on it it's serviceable but i really do like the ambient sounds that they're using in the film and the fog and i know that's not sound the whole swamp kind of marsh at night feel i mean i went with the four as well i didn't or and did you say four
00:26:46
Speaker
I'm actually at three, but. Oh, you said three. Okay. Well, I went with a four because i mean, i didn't really overthink it, but i I feel like sound, if you don't notice it, that it works really well. Yeah. yeah I mean, don't really have whole lot to say, but I agree with what you're saying. Maybe I went a little too high.
00:27:03
Speaker
oh However you feel. Yeah, I mean, yeah it's hard. There's really not much to really say when it comes to music, and aside from the sound design specifically. um Everything blended really well. And for a person who grew up in the woods in Southeast Arkansas, like it felt very natural to hear that for me. So there's a sense of comfort there.
00:27:23
Speaker
um And just like the sound of cicadas, every time pumpkin kind of comes around and you get your strobe light effects and everything going on, like, okay, where's the lighting for that coming from? That's weird supernatural shit, but okay.
00:27:34
Speaker
um But just like the sound of Pumpkinhead and the movement and the way that all worked out, I thought was really well. it was pretty seamless for the most part. And the sound effects, man, I really loved it, the especially the part where He takes the one girl and like goes to the top of the tree and just drops her on that rock.
00:27:52
Speaker
That sounded that hit. I was like, oh yeah, she's toast. Oh gosh. Really good, brutal sound effects in there. You know, you got to appreciate that so much.
Sound Design and Atmosphere
00:28:05
Speaker
yeah definite so i'm go ahead yeah so i'm i'm a three on that it was just kind of like midline for me no so we're we're this is probably the low point of the movie but we followed that up with the high point so right into the editing and special effects so stan winston is known for special effects but he read this script and was like I'll he was brought in to do the effects.
00:28:36
Speaker
And he read the script and was like, I'll do it. But I want to direct it. And then he brought in a team that he had previously worked with if these names are correct. Alec Gillis, Shane Mayan, John Rosen Grant, Tom Woodruff, Jr. I don't trust Wikipedia to be correct all the time.
00:28:54
Speaker
That's why I'm proud is that. ah But all together, they worked on this. and tom woodruff jr even wore the suit for the film but this creature is insanely awesome just another it it is one of the high points of the movies this is we talked about or tomorrow on tomorrow's episode since this is coming out later we talk about
00:29:27
Speaker
um
00:29:29
Speaker
dang it the ritual where we get some great creature design at the end of that one and how that movie keeps the creature out of sight for a long time this movie doesn't do that because they know they have an awesome creature and they put it right in front of us this is one where like the practical effects 100 stand the test of time between puppetry costuming the i love the puppetry on just like making the creature smile dude or grimace or whatever you want to think like that little growl oh it is so good you believe this thing is alive
00:30:13
Speaker
the way it The way it moves, right? The whole, like, kind I don't know. articulation's awesome. It blows. Yeah. yeah It is fantastic. ah And then he, I'm putting it in here, it's also going to be part of my director score, so I'll just tell you that here.
00:30:31
Speaker
But the way he frames the creature is always fantastic as well. So, I think it's Tom Savini who said that when you have a special effects shot, the special effects artist is the director the special effects artist knows you need to shoot it from this angle to get the desired effect he's kind of taking charge this is an example of stan winston who is the special effects artist is also the director and the way he frames the monster in every shot the monster's in
00:31:04
Speaker
is is what makes this movie stand out. It looks insane. One of my favorite moments with the lighting and everything is when he finds that when they go to that old church in the woods and we have a blue light shining through the cross in the top part and it looks awesome and then the creature just comes through and finds the old cross and picks it up and stares at it and starts smashing. I'm like,
00:31:36
Speaker
every bit of that was just dripping in perfect imagery and perfect puppetry set design like it's so good we could probably talk all night just about the special effects scenes like jonathan said pulling up and into the tree but even my favorite kill is uh the one where he pushes the girl's face against the window and kind of like and then bam, right through brutal. Oh, yeah. So good.
00:32:08
Speaker
So good.
00:32:12
Speaker
i can stop gushing about it now.
00:32:18
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I don't even I don't really know what to add to that. It's um it's one of those monsters ah effects that's just unbelievable. um Stays with you. It seems real. These feels real.
00:32:32
Speaker
And it's scary at times as well. I mean, plus it led to some fantastic artwork. Like I've got a couple. I grabbed some of the steelbooks here like this one.
00:32:43
Speaker
And look at that. I like that one a lot. Yeah. yeah And on the back, it's got the the the mound. Oh, yeah. Sweet. But this one, I think Orlando Aerosena did this one. but Oh, if you can apple see it. Isn't that cool? That is cool.
00:33:00
Speaker
Yeah. yeah mean um I love it. I had to. And I do have an autograph, but I'll show that. I'm glad. I'm glad. oh ah Conversation progresses. i did meet Lance Hendrickson about a year or two ago.
00:33:14
Speaker
Oh, but I will share in that. I mean, I ranked the effects. This one, probably the definitely the highest of all of them. um So I'll leave it at that till we start shouting out our numbers. Yeah. All right. darling and You can't go wrong with a flamethrower.
00:33:29
Speaker
You got love a little fire. You know, especially when you're trying to get rid of a demon. gotta appreciate that shit. But for me, like one of the biggest parts of it is like as after it gets the thing out of the just the pumpkin head out of the graveyard and brings it and she starts doing the ritual to bring it to life, just seeing how it expands and fills and starts to grow into its full form, you know, is an awesome thing to see.
00:33:57
Speaker
I'm glad you're coming up. And then as the film goes on towards the end, you see that as Ed and Pumpkinhead keep deepening that connection and them seeing each other, that Pumpkinhead's face starts to kind of change a little bit as well to start resembling Ed, you know? And yeah I thought that was really cool. And I think it kind of goes into direction as well because of how it plays into once Ed's dead and Pumpkinhead's been burned.
00:34:25
Speaker
You know, you see at the end where Haggis is taking Ed's form, you can tell it's him because he's got his son's necklace on, but his his head's kind of enlarged, but you still see the face for that transformation that Ed has now become the next line in this curse for the next fool who wants to use vengeance as a tool.
00:34:42
Speaker
You know, I think that like I said, it's little more in the direction side, but with the special effects of all of that and. I thought that was good as far as like stage prop action when you see her burying that at the end was was pretty cool.
00:34:54
Speaker
Definitely. Definitely. And I love that pumpkin head starts out almost like a child in itself. Yes. And then becomes those monsters. It comes out looking like the baby from a racer head and then it just kind of slowly. Yeah.
00:35:09
Speaker
Yes. Yeah, it really does. It's because that was a fantastic effect. to basically like laying down to sitting up and then it's huge. It's awesome. I don't think we need to say it. But for the sake of just clarity.
00:35:26
Speaker
I'm a five.
00:35:28
Speaker
Yeah, me too. I actually went with a four. There were some parts where it looked a little rubbery. you know ah that's just me although Haggis though with her stuff like there was some cool detail on there with wispy hair and like the floral skin apparently her costume was like 65 pounds from the last stuff she had to wear yeah that's pretty weighty you know heavy so I mean it looked cool there's some there's some small things like that I mean know maybe it's being a little nitpicky but four yeah all right yeah all right that's a good sport I'm surprised
00:36:01
Speaker
All right, so on rip on to the script. So we already said it's based on a poem. i But this is one this is one where I do I praise the story a lot.
00:36:15
Speaker
This is one where like those teenager characters I thought were awfully thin. in very thinly written. They kind of just serve, I don't want to say tropes because they're not necessarily tropes, but they're there to be the catalyst for these events and not much more.
00:36:34
Speaker
So they they kick everything off and then they're picked off. but that's where i think ed's script is a little bit stronger i think haggis is great but i do gotta come down on the script because i think the teenagers are a weak part of this film and maybe that's just me personally i don't really like i love the friday the 13th movie and i think each of them has more memorable teenagers than this yeah So I think that's where I have to compare it. Like, even though, yeah, we're, they're here to be body counts.
00:37:10
Speaker
I'm like, yeah, but I remember the Friday teens more than I remember any of the teens from this film, this movie. I remember the boy and Ed and the other town folk down in the holler.
00:37:22
Speaker
Like those are the people I remember. Yeah. And I, I think that's, that's on the script for me for not giving them enough. meet to be unique.
00:37:38
Speaker
Yeah, fair enough. I mean, that makes sense. I with this one, I was sort of approaching it from the structure of the script, because I think structurally, it works really well. so um They the introduction in the beginning with Ed as a as a little boy, and then you know, setting up what's to come. I thought that was fantastic. And and the way um the different acts where acts work together.
00:38:04
Speaker
um I probably, i think I may have gone a little higher than you and you did. But from a screenwriting perspective, it feels tight to me. I think they hit all the beats really well and explored some unexpected, I don't know, some unexpected scenes while still staying true to the ah flow of the story.
00:38:29
Speaker
yeah that's fair that's fair but i think you're 100 right about those te are they teenagers or are they college kids the wikipedia says they're teenagers but like said they don't look like teenagers they look like young adults to me you know especially the dude that hit the kid with the bike you know he looked like he was in like his mid-20s i mean they have like motorbikes they're going to rent like a house in the woods and they i don't i don't here's the 80s teenagers high school that's true ah Yeah, I mean, dude's been drinking and you he's been drinking a lot before. So sounds like it's just a party thing. Like it's a normal out and about for him. i don't know. Well, in the eighty s didn't each state have different drinking ages?
00:39:12
Speaker
I don't likely I don't think we had nationwide drinking ages until the 90s. Because I know people in my life who have told stories about driving across the Indiana line to Michigan to buy alcohol.
00:39:25
Speaker
Because Oh, maybe. It was 18 in Michigan and 21 in Indiana. Well, grew up in a dry county in southeast Arkansas. So you had to either drive a half hour west to the woods or 30 hours south into Louisiana to Porterhouse Liquors in Bastrop, Louisiana. So there's a whole lot going on with drinking in our town. It was...
00:39:46
Speaker
out in the woods somewhere where were a bonfire, kegs in a bunch of Boone's Farm, making girls throw up. Yeah, kegs in the ground. Well, I grew up five miles from the Quebec border where the drinking age was 18. So i spent most of my high school years in Quebec.
00:40:01
Speaker
Yeah, Quebec. Montreal, man. That was a lot of fun. and i wish Jonathan, we distracted you from this group. from Oh, drinking. Yeah.
00:40:14
Speaker
But yeah, for me, it's it's more about the dialogue than the structure of it. um I really liked a lot the dialogue, especially what's going on between Ed and Haggis when he's trying to appeal to her to stop it.
00:40:26
Speaker
you know in you know him freaking out after everything's experiencing once they start dying you know she's like it's what you wanted it's like no so not like this not like this i see it this is humanity yeah you know he just loses like the feeling that it's like nothing i can do it's got to run its course now What did you think? It'd be easy, neat and clean and painless.
00:40:46
Speaker
You're a fool. You know,
Script Critique
00:40:48
Speaker
stuff like that. And just all the back and forth that the dialogue so much with the kids isn't so much there except from do just being kind of a psycho asshole.
00:40:58
Speaker
But yeah, don't know. All right. I think I was a three on the script. I thought I think it's good. I think it is a good script. Oh, I gave it a four.
00:41:11
Speaker
Okay. As did i Am A Four as well. Alrighty. So the acting, we have mentioned Lance Henriksen multiple times already, but he is the anchor in this film. He's also been, I think I saw he's one of the only actors to have been killed by Xenomorph, a Predator, and a Terminator.
00:41:35
Speaker
And a Terminator? Was he... Was he I may be misremembering, but ah he's one of them. don't know what but I don't think he was in Terminator. Any of the Terminator movies was he?
00:41:49
Speaker
maybe I'm thinking as Stan Winston was in Terminator was responsible for term. OK, going to say like I remember him in that one. ah He was an alien. No, he was Detective Hal Vukovic in the Terminator.
00:42:04
Speaker
Oh, shit. So Henriksen. Yeah, I think he's the only person to have been killed by all three of those.
00:42:16
Speaker
Was he in? Oh, he was in Piranha 2. i i have no idea on that one. He was in the He in the one. I was like, think it was way over somewhere else. but What is it?
00:42:27
Speaker
Piranha. Okay. ah but He does like a great as a lead in this film. So he really steps up as a lead. Yes. The teens... fine uh we've they're they're not bad they're not bad by any stretch uh and then we've mentioned we have maya bialik in her debut role so she's just a mischievous child but much later would go on to be widely known in
00:42:58
Speaker
most nerds favorite show sitcom, The Big Bang Theory. i how you're going to say You're not going to say Blossom? Come on. Oh, no. and Come on. Yeah, you get those 90s kids covered, man.
00:43:11
Speaker
I remember her first time I saw her was the Big Bang Theory because I watched that show religiously. I love that show. It is a big show. When she first popped up on that show, I thought, oh my God, Blossom's back.
00:43:25
Speaker
Really? Not that I was a huge fan of Blossom, but it was one of those like sitcoms. You just kind of yeah but yeah like, I watched a few of the episodes. Let's leave it at that. Yeah. No admissions here.
00:43:38
Speaker
No admissions here.
00:43:42
Speaker
Oh, is it back to me? What are we doing now? Go ahead. Acting. Whoever has more thoughts on acting. I didn't have a lot to say on it. Yeah, I mean, again, at Lance Henderson, it's his movie.
00:43:53
Speaker
It's his moment.
00:43:55
Speaker
That look he gives the kid when he picks his son up. My God, his eyes. It's, oh, wow. um So I'm leaning toward the higher side, the teenagers, yeah or college kids, um and the hillbilly kids. I thought we're actually pretty good.
00:44:12
Speaker
The hillbilly kids were good. Yeah. Which most of them never want to do anything else. Most of the people in this movie had like maybe three parts, three acting roles.
00:44:24
Speaker
in there across the board. all yeah. Okay. I know that the, the girlfriend of the, the bad guy, you died very young of cancer. 2006. I think she was 47.
00:44:35
Speaker
Yes. then the, I think good guy in movie yes and then the i think the good guy in the movie had ah Jonathan Jeff East right Jonathan can tell his thoughts on acting while I look up because he I think he was in slumber party massacre 2 was in a couple like he had a streak of four movies but that was it Joel Hoffman that played Steve the guy who stayed with the kid after the hit I think about Jeff East right oh I thought I'm still talking no Jeff East was the the boyfriend who socked uh Joel in the face and tried to get the keys and got whacked in the back of the head yeah he was kind of a nice guy yes
00:45:16
Speaker
Well, yeah, so yeah i said they're both nice guys. So Steve and Chris were both the nice guys. in this Yeah, that's true. Yes. Yes. Okay. So yeah, we we just have different views of who was nice guy. All right. No, you're right. You're right.
00:45:28
Speaker
But like I said earlier, with the acting, I was from from a childhood memory, Lance Henriksen seemed to be like a pretty hard performance in this, which is well delivered. Now, as I see it as an adult, still good, but little less impactful than the memory I had as a child.
00:45:41
Speaker
But you know, different perspectives and age, whatever. all that. But yeah, Florence Schauffler as Haggis did a great job, you know, ah very creepy, you know, especially the voice.
00:45:52
Speaker
um Everybody else just is kind of whatever. Although I do, you Mayim Bialik, that's cool. But I just find it funny because there's one actor in there, the guy who, when when ah the two tried to steal the truck and the guy comes out to shoot him, ah Clayton Heller, that dude's actual name is Dick Warlock.
00:46:12
Speaker
That's badass. Yeah. That's a badass name. and That is a good name. But aside from that. Florence Schofler lived to be 97 years old.
00:46:22
Speaker
Oh, wow. Goddamn. does She died Christmas Eve, 2017.
00:46:28
Speaker
that is That is a long run. run In Arizona. Clarkdale, Arizona. But yeah, performances otherwise, aside from Lance, we're all just, you know,
00:46:40
Speaker
there delivered the hillbillies did their thing they seemed like hillbilly people you know especially the the annoying uh teenage hillbilly son you know he was fun to kind of watch goof around and be like oh shit yeah did he go on to do anything as an actor i don't know uh which one the little boy no like the teenage hillbilly yeah guy oh
00:47:05
Speaker
i don't even see him on eye number one i don't remember if they called him by a name Oh, but, yeah. Ryan Brimmer.
00:47:16
Speaker
Okay. Has he done anything? Yeah. Oh, he was in Society. yeah. Oh, my gosh. Of course. but that was the That was the first episode Jonathan ever recorded with me. i made him watch Society.
00:47:30
Speaker
That is true, yeah. He was in Piglet Rising. I didn't even make that connection. Here's an older picture of Yep. Oh, yeah.
00:47:40
Speaker
Yeah. Nice. All right. So where were we on our scores for the acting? If it was just if it was just Lance, I was scoring, I'd give it a four, but I'm going to be a three for the acting.
00:47:58
Speaker
I went with four. Like I said, I was just thinking about Lance. That's fair. That is fair. There was some good panic in there and some terror um from from our our fodder. So aside from that, with Lance and everybody in the in the witch, I'm sitting at a four.
00:48:13
Speaker
Okay. So the direction, we've already mentioned it was directed by Stan Winston, his first, and I think his only.
00:48:23
Speaker
I'm double checking.
00:48:26
Speaker
job back and Because most of his credits are special effects department makeup and so on. IMDB has six. ah But oh, that's right. He did a gnome named Norm.
00:48:45
Speaker
In 1990, a gnome named Norm. I think it was sounds familiar, but I'm pretty sure I've never seen it. our buddies at movie dumpster who were on the drug broadcast. I know they covered that one, but then he did a couple of Michael Jackson music videos.
00:49:01
Speaker
I wonder if it was one where his hair lit on fire. yeah through was that commercial Michael Jackson's ghost and the short version. And he did a Guns N' Roses You Could Be Mine music video. but Oh, that was a good one. Yeah.
00:49:14
Speaker
Love some Guns N' Roses. But he... I love his approach to this film so one of the things that stands out on watching it is his color choices the color grading for the film is blue or orange once it really gets going the early one the early scenes are really sun drenched but then he uses deep blues the witch's cabin is deep oranges And there's very distinct, very different.
00:49:44
Speaker
But just about every scene with the monster. what What is the monster's real name? Is it pumpkin head? They don't. That's what they call it.
00:49:56
Speaker
Do they call it that in the movie? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Eugene works when they when he shows it on the screen, it looks you eugene when they when he shows it on its screen it looks like a balanced painting like most of the time that image is shown the lighting the fog like we talked about the set everything is composed for maximum effect and it is shot beautifully lots of dolly shots moving shots which elevate the film it feels higher budget than when it's just sitting there with static quick cuts
00:50:39
Speaker
ah He also does, i don't know what the technical term is for it is, but when he shifts his focus during conversations, like he'll have the kids both sitting in frame,
00:50:52
Speaker
and then he'll shift focus so whoever's speaking is in focus instead of cutting from one to another. It's just those little touches that's like this guy has been around movies.
00:51:04
Speaker
Like he clearly knows what he's doing. It's a shame this and a gnome named Norm are the only movies he ever directed because I think like this is good and I think he could have done some great work But we also get his great work in special effects. So which one would we choose? Probably special effects, Stan.
00:51:26
Speaker
But for the only horror movie he ever directed, this movie is visually stunning. He did an excellent job. So I'm very happy with that.
00:51:40
Speaker
I'm done.
Direction and Pacing
00:51:41
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know what to say. i actually didn't rate it very high. and Now I feel like I perhaps I should have.
00:51:50
Speaker
I don't know. It's okay. whatever However it strikes you, that's why that's why we do our multi-leveled scoring system. Not everybody watches that same one. Yeah, how do I follow that up?
00:52:04
Speaker
I love the film. i don't know. i thought feel like the second act drags a little bit. I would agree. but I don't know if that's the director's fault. Maybe that comes back to the ah script.
00:52:19
Speaker
um Although the director should have an eye for that too, right? Like this is dragging. We need to take a look at the script or let's take a look at the structure, how we're how how much time we're spending on these scenes perhaps.
00:52:33
Speaker
um And maybe that's why I went a little bit lower. Yeah. I don't know. i'm sorry i don't really have anything else to say. Don't feel bad because this is usually the worst category for me. And I always stumble and struggle to like kind of elaborate yeah yeah on this kind of part. So don't feel bad at all.
00:52:52
Speaker
um But but i with this being a setting in like a rural mountain holler where it's pretty much off the grid, the exception of the the cabinet the teens are in. I really appreciate the the use of firelight, just those warmth colors yeah at night of a fire.
00:53:09
Speaker
And like even you even kind of starts off that way with the opening credits because you get the fire in the background and those kind of soft warm 80s intro graphics for for the for the intro credits.
00:53:21
Speaker
you know It just had a nice warm feel to it watching that. And then the good use of backlighting in the distance for all those night shots. you know so it's not completely dark. you know I thought that they they had that set far enough backwards, set a good tone. you can still see everything.
00:53:37
Speaker
And it's not like hard to see what's going on action-wise in the film. So they had really good lighting effects in this. Yeah. Aside from that, ah camera work was good for the most part, although it was a little shaky at the end, especially when like they're kind of coming up and over with boom. It's kind of like shaking and readjusting a little bit as they're going to see the burning pumpkin head.
00:53:58
Speaker
So that kind of put me off a little bit, but it's not that bad. Yeah. Okay. I was a four on that direction. Aaron, did you have more to say?
00:54:10
Speaker
I was just going to say, you know, a good director let it lets their actors act and sort of interpret the script. And I think he really did. I don't know. I wasn't there. But it seems like he really did that with Lance Henriksen.
00:54:22
Speaker
And maybe he he did that with the teenager, the actors playing teenagers or college kids, whatever they are. Yeah. Maybe he should have not let them have full reign as much as he did.
00:54:36
Speaker
Maybe that's why the second act dragged a little bit for me. um But again, I wasn't there. I mean, he could have been so rigid and stick to the script. Don't, you know, no interpretation here, but like that, that one guy, the bad guy, when he like hits the other guy with pulls the phone out and hits him with the log i don't know is that in the script that seems like that could have been a little over the top and what if we make him really bad but then he becomes sort of caricature caricature of just a really bad dude you know those are good points okay i don't know i went with a three or what direction right on um i know what you mean kind of when you say about i talk about dragging it's that part
00:55:18
Speaker
After Joel gets the gun rammed in his spiritium, where the last two are at the Wallace house, they spend too much time standing around there. This thing is after them. They should be hauling ass instead of still standing outside until the kid finally decides to come out. that They should have been dead already at that point, you know, by the time the kid gets out there.
00:55:38
Speaker
So i that did take a little too long, I think.
00:55:43
Speaker
No, I mean, does he really, though? It seems like maybe he's got he moves a little quicker than you think, because by the time they get from there to where they have the vehicles parked, that they're all tore up.
00:55:55
Speaker
The vehicles are smashed. We don't know if Pumkinhead did that preemptively or not, or if you beat them to the punch and got out there, because as soon as he turns around a bike, there he is. So I think maybe he loot lighted in weight a little bit after destroying the vehicles.
00:56:08
Speaker
And he's smart too, because dude tries to start the bike and he's got the chain, like, ha ha, you're not going anywhere. It's smarter than you think it would be for a demon. Right. um So I thought that was pretty awesome with how they did that.
00:56:21
Speaker
But other than that, overall, I'd say I'm at a three on the direction. All right. yeah His legs are very long, right? Pumpkin heads. So when the camera's not on him, he can run really fast. That's why. Because you know more swiftness, man, with those 90s that you're wearing in one scene. i do enjoy... They move much faster when they're off screen.
00:56:41
Speaker
ah Yeah. One of the effects of... The Jason effect, you know. Costuming. I do really like... that one shot when he pulls the girl over the roof of the house oh yeah the hand comes down yeah that's pretty agile to grab quick and be up and over by the time the girl gets out from under the eve to see yep and she gets out from under the even she just sees her friend's feet kicking over like that's a nice shot i love that so that's why it was good one of my favorite shots but cultural significance this is an interesting one the it factor
00:57:18
Speaker
So Pumpkinhead was not a huge success on its release.
Pumpkinhead's Cult Following
00:57:24
Speaker
Grossed $44 against a $35 million budget. But VHS, what we are missing nowadays with the world of streaming is the VHS and Rental World blockbuster DVDs brought on a cult following that made it more popular.
00:57:49
Speaker
It spawned multiple direct-to-video sequels, like we said, TV movies, the sci-fi original that I saw. There were some comic books in the 90s that i want I would love to get my hands on that because apparently they were very good.
00:58:02
Speaker
A video game in the early ninety s hopeful i didn't know that. Me neither. Yeah. called Blood Wings Pumpkin Heads Revenge was a video game.
00:58:15
Speaker
I think it might have been in Nintendo 64. Like in Nintendo. Okay, it's in 64. Yeah. But it is one of the best examples of budget, horror and practical effects.
00:58:30
Speaker
I think it's a shining example of what can be done with low budget, practical effects. Because sometimes you get some that just don't succeed in those areas, even if they're earnest and have a lot of heart and passion behind them and then you see these so i think this is a standout example i think it was pretty popular even if it wasn't a major financial success and i do i didn't see this movie i think the first time i saw this movie was maybe two or three years ago and okay but i knew of pumpkin head before that
00:59:10
Speaker
It was a name that I knew it was out there in my world. It was like you have your Freddie, Michael, Jason, and then I knew Pumpkinhead before I knew Leatherface.
00:59:23
Speaker
So. Oh, wow. Okay. So I don't know. That's my world. You know, just who I grew up with. My neighbors probably knew Pumpkinhead. That's why I knew Pumpkinhead, but I didn't know Leather, you know? So I think it it has a decent cultural impact I'm not going to say it's a great cultural impact but I I do think this was one of those movies that those special effects stood out enough that people talked about this movie well decades later we're still talking about it now so
01:00:00
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. I think that it has longevity. um When i thought about how I would rate this one, i it had impact on me as a kid and with my friends. I mean, we loved it. We talked about it.
01:00:15
Speaker
And I think within the horror community, has a pretty significant impact. um Now, if you're like talking about like rom-coms or dramas, I don't think it's going to be high on the impact list.
01:00:28
Speaker
um Although there's some, there's some drama here, like we said, right? It's a sad, sad story ultimately. um Yeah. So I went kind of high with, with the it factor because I mean, you're right. and Pumpkinhead isn't Jason or Michael Myers or Leatherface.
01:00:47
Speaker
But ah he's a, I don't know. He's a contender, let's say. a top creature feature, let's say if you're there we go. I think he's at the top of the list there.
01:01:00
Speaker
I think thinking back on it, this may have been like one of the first like creature horror films I saw ah at such a young age, because I don't remember really any others that I might have seen before. because I think I saw like Puppet Master and Freddy and all those other like the blob and everything. I think I saw all those after all that. So yeah.
01:01:20
Speaker
It's cool that I think back on it and think that maybe the first one, but I mean, cultural impact is, I can't really say too much. I mean, it spawned four movies, whether some of those are great or not, it's debatable from what you guys may have said i think earlier that they were pretty crappy, like third and fourth one.
01:01:35
Speaker
don't think I can barely remember the second one. um The video game is surprising and it looks like it came out in 95 for PC. It was like a shitty doom ripoff for DOS.
01:01:46
Speaker
oh Okay. Yeah. sauce game yeah um But yeah, it definitely fits in with creature features and it definitely with that cult classic status. It's pretty cool, but I don't really think it has much impact otherwise.
01:02:00
Speaker
So I can't really say too much on it besides that. But I put it it at a three. I was a three as well. Okay. Well, I went with four. but like I said, i from my perspective and the impact it had on on me.
01:02:15
Speaker
Good, good. what it's Aaron, that's what i that's why I like doing our scoring system is because this should be about your perspective on it. So you go for that score because it is your score. You own that.
01:02:29
Speaker
Yeah, right.
Overall Enjoyment Ratings
01:02:30
Speaker
I don't know if it had an impact on anyone else, but it did on me. And that's why we do it. All right. So our overall enjoyment out of 10 and then we'll your our final thoughts on it and then I'll get us our average.
01:02:46
Speaker
So
01:02:49
Speaker
i'll go first overall. dreaming out of 10. This might be a little surprising. I am at a six out of 10. And wow part of that is because
01:03:01
Speaker
i don't think this movie has enough balance overall. I need the teenagers to be a little bit more fun. I need because Ed's story is so serious.
01:03:16
Speaker
Ed's story is tragic and serious and beautiful. And to to make a comparative again, to say, bring her back, we had a beautiful relationship between a brother and a sister that had some genuine laughs and some lightheartedness in the movie that worked.
01:03:35
Speaker
This movie is missing that for me, even if it was the teenagers just having some lighthearted moments. I kind of needed that. I think it starts off really well showing the father-son bond.
01:03:50
Speaker
I think it's tragic, but then it just is bleak for the rest of the film. And I just want a little bit of balance there. So, and I think that actually adding that balance brings the darker, moment makes the darker moments darker when you feel a little bit of levity in there. It makes those darker moments harder.
01:04:14
Speaker
So like make me actually feel bad for those teenagers who died tragically because of their friends' actions. They didn't deserve it. remind me why and i think we've mentioned it it does lag a little bit i i think the lagging for me is once ed's son dies to the time pumpkin head is resurrected i think the only moment i remember after that is in haggis's house that's about all that really stands out to me in that stretch
01:04:49
Speaker
so and we do we've jonathan's mentioned like the one guy goes nuts yeah i i'm with you there but it does dip a little bit for me i like the first act and i like the third act and i think that's middle act is missing something so for me i'm at a six i want a little bit more um want to feel a little bit more for those teenagers deaths ah even like you're rooting for a couple of them to die. We get that.
01:05:20
Speaker
But make make a couple of them make me realize that they really didn't deserve this and lean into that tragedy a little bit more by showing me how good they were before that.
01:05:32
Speaker
so um' i'm fine with that so i am at a six on this movie i do this is a standout movie for me i i feel like sticks is low and so i'm having to justify it but i genuinely do like this movie i've watched it a couple of times now and each time i like it a little bit more but there is just something about it that is off for me every time i watch it not off enough that I hate it or won't ever watch it again.
01:06:00
Speaker
yeah i feel like it's missing something, a sprinkle of something. And so that's where that's where I'm landing.
01:06:10
Speaker
I think that makes complete sense. With me, i went higher because of the nostalgic factor and my experience with the film. and But I will say every time I watch it, it's maybe not quite as good as I remember it as a kid in the eighty s um But then ah then it gets sort of old again, and I kind of revert back to remembering how much I loved it. So theres so that I think that's why i went higher.
01:06:33
Speaker
thing you were just talking about now that reminded me of something, or made me think about something, with those teenage characters, they don't even seem like they would be friends, even in the beginning before anything happens.
01:06:46
Speaker
They don't even seem to like each other. Even the couples don't even really seem to like each other. And maybe that's the flaw right from the start with the film. if they had presented them more as we're friends and then when this accident happens then it really starts to fall apart maybe then it would have been more believable and maybe there could have been an arc with those characters and little bit more depth um accident fractures their friendships yeah i like that but yes yes I mean, it's one of those films. I love it. I start watching it and then halfway through i might get distracted and start doing something else while it's still playing.
01:07:23
Speaker
um But I still love it. i went with an A for an entertainment factor um good for me. Yeah. Nice. um Like I said, I've got that sense of nostalgia like you do, Aaron, from seeing it such a young age.
01:07:36
Speaker
ah So there's a good connection there. but I do like the film overall, despite some of those slow parts. And yeah, it does kind of drag little also in those parts, like in that middle where you're you're getting to like the start of the deaths and all the running around trying to see what's going on. Seems like too much of that.
01:07:53
Speaker
But overall, it's still something that I i know i could talk about with my other friends that I grew up with because i know they've all seen it fond memories. You can hash it out. um Seeing one girl lose her shit and go like into religious panic is kind of fun as well.
01:08:08
Speaker
Maggie, like Steve's girlfriend, was losing her shit, man, and watched her flip out. woo Tough stuff, but overall, I can't hate on this film, man. I'd be down. like cause I've already watched it like three times since yesterday.
01:08:23
Speaker
So it's like, it's a good movie. And it's like trying to see what else you miss and can catch detail wise in the film is as fun. So I'm at an eight as well. Yeah. Awesome. So I have our totals. I was at 35. Aaron, I had you at a 39. I'm a 38.
01:08:43
Speaker
and So Aaron, your total would round up to four out of five stars. all together our average what we did yeah the average is a 37.5 which would round it up to four out of it's right on that line but i round up not down so that's right four out of five stars is what our average is if you're looking for that halloween party film chances are this is going to be a good choice for a halloween party i that's kind of why our scoring system exists will work for a group most likely in this case it's got enough going for it got great for halloween great atmosphere this movie nails atmosphere and creeps and dread and all of that this movie is great for it so aaron final thoughts on pumpkin head
01:09:39
Speaker
yeah I love what you just said at about Halloween
Aaron's Final Thoughts
01:09:41
Speaker
party. This is a movie you could put on, like on the big screen to but for a party and just turn all the turn the volume down with everybody, you know, and then be like, oh my God, look on the TV.
01:09:53
Speaker
Final thoughts. ah I'm a fan. i think our score is is solid and and makes complete sense. um i so I said I was going to show this. I have the autograph from Lance Henriksen.
01:10:04
Speaker
ah Hey, all right. you got it hum Isn't it funny? You can see it smiling. That is awesome. What's funny about this is it was kind of a weird moment when I met him because he and his handler were arguing about something which had nothing to do with me.
01:10:18
Speaker
At least I hope it didn't have anything to do with me. So he wasn't that happy. um So I have no idea what he signed. i mean, I've looked at this and you guys aren't even going to be able to see it here.
01:10:29
Speaker
It, it, It doesn't make it. I showed friends and i have no idea what he wrote on there. I'll send you guys a picture after. are trump or Something trivia. but We are tribe. We are trivia. i don't know.
01:10:45
Speaker
Huh. Interesting. yeah So $80 on this, and I have no idea what he wrote to me, and he did not say a single word to me because he was in a very bad mood. Oh, that's too bad. Kind of bummer, but I did get to meet him, yeah so I can say I met Lance Henriksen.
01:11:03
Speaker
That is awesome. Overall, I'm a fan of the film. And I just want to say you guys are awesome. It's always a fun chatting with you. It's always fun chatting. I will come on anytime.
01:11:13
Speaker
Just to say the word. Awesome. Aaron, you're awesome. Thank you for being here. Thank you. Thanks, man. Thank you for being loyal to the Dread broadcast as we're getting that first year jitters and figuring everything out.
01:11:26
Speaker
Yeah, oh for sure. Being in here, it's been a ton of fun having your support and your help with everything. Can't thank you enough. Of course. You're welcome. Jonathan, do you have final words on Pumpkinhead or we ready to read out?
01:11:41
Speaker
Tell everybody to watch it. I need to go watch the the second one and see if I remember anything from that. Probably not going to watch three or four, depending on how bad the second one is. We'll we'll see. Other than that, ah that's all I got to say on it.
01:11:53
Speaker
I'll do the same. Let's report back. We'll see. that still yeah sound youtube Jonathan or Aaron, do you want to tell people where they can find you? If they made it this far, where, I mean, most people watching this probably know where to find you.
01:12:09
Speaker
But ah yeah, sure. Yeah, of course. um I'm on YouTube, A&B Horror Movies. Search search for A&B Horror, A&B Horror Movies with the ampersand. And on Instagram, we have AAB Horror Movies.
01:12:21
Speaker
And I'm also at Aaron's Movies 8587 on Instagram as well. All right. So, and that's going to wrap up our deep dive into Pumpkinhead, a movie that proves some legends are best left buried, or at least not summoned by old witches in the woods.
01:12:39
Speaker
Huge thanks to our guest Aaron from A&B Horror for joining us tonight and helping us dig into the creepy folklore, the creature effects, and the bittersweet tragedy of Ed Harley's story. I think I've been calling him Ed Hardy the whole movie, the whole thing. I'm not sure. If it is, it's a joke about the t-shirts, okay?
01:12:56
Speaker
But, Hulk horror comes in all shapes and shadows. But Pumpkinhead stands out for the way it blends small town superstition with a gut punch of emotion.
01:13:10
Speaker
And it gives us one of the best looking practical effects monsters ever put on screen. And hey, if you're in the mood for more scares this October, especially the kind with a found footage twist and a dose of YouTube ghost hunter chaos, grab a copy of Tim's book, like, comment, survive.
01:13:28
Speaker
Perfect for late night reading, just maybe not in an abandoned asylum. This has been The Average, where the real review happens with your friends. Good night.