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Do you want to be published? - Jainé Kershner
199 Plays3 years ago
Happy Woo Wednesdays!
Today I have a special guest Jainé Kershner. I was on her podcast a month ago chatting about mastering the sales call. You can listen to it here. https://www.teawithjaine.com/blog/how-to-master-the-dreaded-sales-call-with-carissa-woo
Jainé Kershner is an amazing wedding photographer and coach in the Hamptons.
Today we have another HOT topic and it's all about Submissions. I remember the first time I got published on 100 Layer Cake, I almost died of happiness. It changes the trajectory of your business. You can see the feature here. https://www.100layercake.com/engagements/l-meets-paris-engagement-shoot/
Our Carissa Woo Photography team went on to get published on many other wedding blogs and magazines.
Today Jainé gives 5 tips on how to submit their next wedding to an online or print publication.
Bio about Jainé
In 2018, Jainé Kershner Photography launched Tea with Jainé to directly educate wedding photographers with honest answers, actionable steps, and tangible tips to successfully grow and create a profitable photography business.
Jainé Kershner hosts her weekly podcast “Tea with Jainé” where she chats with wedding industry insiders who share their knowledge, experience, and expertise directly with her audience. Jainé is a dedicated business coach who offers one-on-one sessions along with submission curations services for wedding photographers.
Visit www.teawithjaine.com to find out more & work with Jainé!
https://www.instagram.com/jainekershner/
https://www.instagram.com/teawithjaine/
Download her freebie - How to get published
https://www.teawithjaine.com/blog
Connect with Carissa Woo
Recommended
Transcript
Carissa's Birthday and Book Announcement
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome back to Get a Heck Yes with me your host, Carissa. I just celebrated my 37th birthday this past weekend and announced that I am publishing a book for wedding photographers coming out by the end of the year. Woo woo! Do I feel old you may ask? Heck no. 37 is a new 25.
Introducing Janae Kirschner
00:00:18
Speaker
Today's guest is a really big deal in the wedding industry, and she's also a sweetheart. Her name is Janae Kirschner, amazing wedding photographer in the Hamptons, coach and podcaster of Tea with Janae. I was a guest on her show a month ago talking about mastering the sales call. I love today's topic, submissions. If you want to get published on wedding blogs, you're going to love this episode. The first time I got published on 100 Layer Cake, I cried.
00:00:46
Speaker
Download her freebie, Five Secrets to Wedding Submissions. She can also personally help you with your submissions. Enjoy!
Carissa's Career and Transition
00:00:57
Speaker
Welcome to Get a Heck Yes with Carissa Wu. I'm your host, Carissa, and I've been a Los Angeles wedding photographer for over a decade. I've traveled the world, built my team, and seen it all. I now coach wedding photographers hit 10K a month and build a thriving business. In this podcast, we are going to deep dive into how top wedding creatives get that heck yes from their dream clients. We are not holding back on the struggles of the business and how to push through the noise. Some healthy hustle, mindset shifts, up-leveling your money story,
00:01:26
Speaker
Time hacks because I'm a mom of two, a little bit of woo woo, and most importantly, self-love and confidence are just a few of the many things we will talk about. I want to give you a genuine thank you for following along my journey. I hope to inspire you every Woo Wednesday so that you say heck yes to listening to this podcast. See you guys soon. Hey guys, welcome back to heck yes with me, Carissa Woo.
00:01:51
Speaker
I have a very special guest, Janae Kirshner. I was actually on her podcast a couple weeks back talking about mastering the sales call.
Exploring Wedding Industry Insights
00:02:00
Speaker
And actually her podcast is called Tea with Janae and it's one of my favorite podcasts for wedding professionals. And she hosts her weekly podcast where she chats with wedding insiders and to share their knowledge, experience and expertise directly with her audience.
00:02:15
Speaker
and she's a dedicated photographer and business coach who offers one-on-one sessions along with submission, curations, services for wedding photographers. Welcome Janay. Hi, thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be on your podcast. I know, it was such an honor to be on your podcast and just listening to it was so exciting. So I'm so excited to have you online. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Hi, everyone. It's so nice to meet you. If you haven't listened to Carissa on my show, definitely hop on over.
00:02:45
Speaker
Yeah, and Janae's in NYC and the Hamptons too. Yeah, yeah, New York born and raised. So it's nice to shoot around here. And I primarily shoot in the Hamptons now, which is where I grew up. So every time I go out there, I'm always like, it's like going home. So I love it. Wow. So what does the Hamptons like kind of paint the picture for me?
00:03:08
Speaker
Oh, that's a good question. So it's definitely changed since I was a little girl. But it's definitely a place where the ocean is very beautiful. And you can go to any beach and just enjoy the sun. And then the towns really make it special. So you're really close to the water. The beach is really soft. And it's just really luxurious and feels great. Because I feel like I live in Brooklyn. So the beaches here are all rocks. And the water is not
00:03:37
Speaker
But once we drive out there, it's just a whole new ballgame. So it's really nice and the dish the I grew up in Zach Harbor So it's like this cute little quaint town that still is small But it has grown a lot like I do a lot of building but East Hampton is beautiful we spend a lot of time in Montauk which is Still the same from when I was a kid and it's just it's a beach town. It's a surf town I'm sure you would really like it. It's just
00:04:05
Speaker
Yeah, jean shorts, surfboards, people just want to have a nice time and enjoy summer and just be outside a lot. We do a lot of outside things, so I love working out there. Nice. What do your parents do? I never met anyone that lived in the Hamptons.
00:04:20
Speaker
Oh, my parents, they had a store and my dad worked for, I guess it's like an audio visual company for several years. And then the Hamptons, you know, it just got really congested. It's even worse now, but my parents couldn't take it anymore. So they sold the house when I was in college, which I wish we still had it. Yeah.
00:04:47
Speaker
That's awesome.
Navigating the NYC Wedding Scene
00:04:48
Speaker
So what's wedding photography like over there? Is it pretty competitive?
00:04:52
Speaker
Yeah, I think, well, okay, so like New York City is like nine million people. So, you know, there's definitely enough work to go around. I think when you get started, you know, it can feel very competitive. It can feel oversaturated. But over time, if you sort of get the right education and the right mindset and the sort of the right frame of mind,
00:05:19
Speaker
you'll see that there's enough for everyone, right? Like you'll find your people, yeah, you'll find your people, you'll find your sort of a zone of genius and where you want to work and the places you want to be in. And that's definitely what happened for me. I think when I first started out,
00:05:35
Speaker
I was a really primarily Brooklyn based and then I moved into New York City like Manhattan based and then really moving out to the Hamptons and that was just sort of my demographic and I do like a couple destination weddings. But with when I had a kid, I have a daughter, you know,
00:05:55
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, she's six and a half. So when I had her when I was pregnant I made the conscious decision really to say I do like local destinations and I say that with air quotes because it's sort of You know things that are like three to four hour drives So that's kind of where my focus went and you know six years in after that it's been it's been great It's a good journey. But yeah, I think
00:06:23
Speaker
New York City to shoot here, it definitely makes you a great photographer because the venues are dark, so you have to be proficient with your flash. We don't have the golden glowy hour like you do all the time in California.
00:06:40
Speaker
I swear spoil. Yes, totally. I'm always jealous when I go to California. I'm like, why don't we live here? Because it would be amazing. But when we have the golden glowiness, and if I'm with a couple, we definitely chase the light. So it's really fun. And they get into it. And it's like these pictures are insane.
00:07:00
Speaker
Yeah, I think you have to kind of, you're a photographer, so when you first start out, you're understanding light and how to read light and blue light, yellow light, golden light, harsh light, mixed light, dappled light. There's so many different versions of light that in the beginning, I was really nervous that I would never know how to shoot in all of those scenarios. Yeah.
00:07:25
Speaker
And then you know i'm doing this twelve years now it's like i love all types of light and i find it really fun and challenging and how can i make this look beautiful so i like shooting in new york city but you know there's nothing like california golden light.
00:07:41
Speaker
Yeah, I shot a wedding in New York City and I almost died. Well, first of all, the couple was late with everything and then the light went down and I was so novice of my photography skills. So I just didn't know what was going on. And then we're in like a Rolls Royce and then we're driving and I think I didn't close the door correctly and it just swung open.
00:08:06
Speaker
Yeah. Oh my God. If you could see me, my mouth is like wide open. Oh my goodness. And another thing happened. Like, um, I was just so crazy back then. Like, you know, kind of a psycho photographer, like, go do this, do this, whatever. I'm way more chill now. But, um, I told them to go, like the couple to start walking and that's when like the traffic was going to come. And I like, I don't know. It was just a total shit show.
00:08:32
Speaker
I know. Now you're like, I'm going to wait for the stop sign. No, I'm like 51st, guys. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. And that's the funny thing is that when you shoot in the city, you know, most couples, they want some iconic pictures. New York is pretty iconic. So they want the crossing the street, maybe Empire State in the background or the Freedom Tower, you know, or Flatiron. It depends. And you're you have to sort of explain to them
00:08:58
Speaker
okay we're gonna do this and we gotta be quick and we're probably gonna do it 10 times until we get what we need but you know being experienced and you know the more you do it the more you know proficient you are with your camera and your gear so yeah sometimes you can get it on the first try and then you're like no let's go back oh yeah yeah i love your work what how would you explain your style to the audience
00:09:21
Speaker
Oh, that's a great question.
Janae's Photography Style
00:09:23
Speaker
So I think for me, the way that I explain my style is that I want your images to feel exactly how the day was, right? How I want you to look at your images in 30 years
00:09:40
Speaker
and have those emotions come flooding back and remember being with each other and having fun and sharing that kiss versus being edited in a 2022 style. You know what I mean? I feel like it took me a long time to figure out my personal style and aesthetic. It took about three years
00:10:02
Speaker
of shooting all the time and working with couples of all skin tones and backgrounds to realize that I love film. I shoot film and digital. So film for me has dictated the colors and the hues and how I shoot.
00:10:19
Speaker
and how I use light. So it's definitely, um, I don't want to say light, bright and airy, but that kind of, you know, I think if you're listening, if you're a photographer like that might be the best style, but it's actually not too bright. Like I definitely want those highlights retained and the details of the dress retained. Um, so maybe it's just like a little bit above, a little bit below bright. You know what I mean? You have lots of pop to color too.
00:10:43
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. And so I have just, I think it's just classic. That's really how I look at things like classic chic. Um, I don't want to say simple, but just, and I hate the word timeless, but it is sort of how I,
00:10:59
Speaker
would see my photography. You know, I wanted to endure time. You know, when you give your photos to your grandchildren or your album, when you pass it down, I want them just to be transported back and not, you know, I mean, to be honest, when I first started, I would, you know, VSCO had just started. Right. So VSCO, this is like aging myself, but VSCO is going to be around for a while.
00:11:22
Speaker
Yeah, so what so this go had just started and this is before I was learning digital photography. I was trying to figure out Lightroom presets were brand new and I didn't go back to film till about two three years into being a full-time world going into full-time.
00:11:40
Speaker
So I couldn't find my color, you know, I couldn't find my colors or like editing style. So I think one of my very first weddings, which was for free, it was City Hall was a friend of a friend and their wedding images are like yellow, like they are all yellow. And once I found this go and I saw the Fuji green and then I literally re-edited their, edited their entire
00:12:06
Speaker
her wedding to be like proper, you know what I mean? At least she was Asian and he was white and like they were both like in the first set of images with terrible skin tones. And then I finally got it together and redid it and was like, this is my style. And then I went back into film and found, you know, my greens and all that stuff. But yeah, I think it's just funny looking back, you know. When I found out about Bisco, I thought it was so cool.
00:12:37
Speaker
Even the ones on Lightroom but the app I was like taking photos at the art district and I'm like, oh my god, I'm so hipster Yeah, I mean it's like they have a whole thing now VSCO girls and I don't even know Yeah, yeah, I was like, oh I was like well I knew about them in 2010 when they started
00:13:01
Speaker
Oh my God. Well, I love the podcast you just posted about diversity with the Huddie Moria Cape Girl. Yeah. And I feel like your portfolio is very diverse.
00:13:11
Speaker
Thank you. Yeah, I think that's really a benefit to being in New York City. We have people from all over the country, all over the world come here and live here. And I've been very fortunate that couples choose to work with me of all different ethnicities and backgrounds, skin tones. And I really work hard to make sure that their true colors come out.
00:13:36
Speaker
You don't want an African-American bride to be green. I don't want my Asian climates to be yellow. I want them to look like they're real skin. If you're pale, you're pale. If you have a fake tan and you're orange, you're orange. Me and my husband are kind of hard to edit because I do run the yellow tones. And then he's Japanese, but he's more like the red tone. We can't edit ourselves.
00:14:06
Speaker
Yeah, I had a couple I've had a couple couples who are of darker skin tones reach out to me and hire me specifically because they liked my editing and they liked that they could see themselves in my photos. And that was really like a really good moment for me. You know what I mean? I was like, Oh, this is awesome. And yeah, I love it. And I see them year after year and I'm part of the family and it's really nice. So yeah, I guess that's a good segue to how do you get
00:14:35
Speaker
a heck yes from your dream clients. That's a good one. Yeah, I think how do I get a heck yes is that I work with a lot of different clients and I really want to show diversity in my portfolio and I really want to attract people like that, who value that and also who appreciate it.
00:14:58
Speaker
and also who I like working with. So I feel like to get a heck yes, they have to be all in. They're excited to work with me. And I'm excited to work with them. I really believe it has to be mutual. And I always say to my coaching clients, too, and even on my podcast. And so I say it like a zillion times. It's like, show what you want to shoot and take away the things that no longer speak to who you are as an artist.
00:15:26
Speaker
I think photographers, when you're first starting out, they will show everything they shoot, everything under the sun. It's like a mishmash of photos. I think it's also a mishmash of their representation. So what happens is that your ideal client
00:15:45
Speaker
gets confused, right? They don't know who you are. And I think as an artist, you know, we're all artists here hopefully, you have to really hone in on who you are and what you want to do with your life and your career. And I feel that honing in on your craft and your style and your aesthetic, which we've kind of been talking about like my journey to finding who I was as an artist,
00:16:10
Speaker
then your ideal client will find you. So once I really dialed down into that and knowing who I was as a photographer, who I was aesthetically, my ideal client literally just would find me on Instagram, they go to your website, they check you out, and then they contact you if they really love you. And that kind of has been my formula for years. Easy peasy, right?
00:16:37
Speaker
Yeah, it's easy once you know it. If you don't know it, if you're just putting everything out there, throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing what sticks, you're lost. You're a master of none. You have to talk to your one person, your one client, very specifically. And I've really learned that.
00:17:01
Speaker
then when I Book my ideal client. It's like I'm we're we're best friends. You know what I mean? Like it's just yeah, we're on the same level Every you know what matters to them matters to me and it's just a great day a great relationship I mean, I don't know about you, but like I've never had a bridezilla Even like my second tutors that have never shot with me. They're like day you get all the chill brides like why are they so cool?
00:17:32
Speaker
Because you are. They take your vibe, you know? Yeah, I think my ideal client's like super like fun and quirky and they just like to have a good time and they're not like so, you know, I have to be perfect, you know, my hair has to be perfect. They're just like, let's party.
00:17:49
Speaker
Right. Yeah, which is not a lot of other photographers ideal client, but it's mine. Yeah, right. And which was talking about before is that it's so great that you know that because now you can attract your ideal client and repel the people that aren't like that. And I think, you know, you can't be everything to everybody. And once you figure that part out, you'll you'll really like go far. Yeah. Okay, tell me about your
00:18:14
Speaker
you as a coach and it's going to segue into our hot topic about submissions and because I know you have a submission service. So tell me all about that. Yeah. Yeah.
The Purpose Behind 'Tea with Janae' Podcast
00:18:23
Speaker
So, you know, I think about in 2018, which feels like forever ago now, right? Cause we really lost a year. 2020 didn't happen. I think
00:18:34
Speaker
You know, I had been feeling this pull in myself to start teaching, but I had been playing small for a really long time. I didn't think that anyone would want to hear from me or learn from me. Like, who am I? And Instagram Stories just came out. So it was like a lot of things happening. So I started using Instagram Stories to ask my audience, to ask my followers, like, hey, if I shared how I style stuff, would you care?
00:19:04
Speaker
hey, if I show you my gear, you know, would you be interested? And, you know, shockingly, it was like 100%. Yes. So I was like, Oh, okay. Yeah, I literally was like starting this journey into coaching on Instagram. So I would do Instagram stories. And then I would do Instagram lot not lives. But what were they IG TVs? Like that's no longer here anymore. But I was totally didn't even realize it disappeared.
00:19:31
Speaker
Yeah, it's gone. Now it's just Instagram. Now it's just Instagram video so they don't even have IGTVs. So I was starting that way into coaching and the reason I started doing this, really the main reason was that my friends were being taken advantage of or new photographers were being taken advantage of and it was driving me crazy.
00:19:57
Speaker
I was just so mad at other people being taken a bit because look, you work, you save, you go to a workshop and you literally have nothing except some pretty pictures. They would come home and they would tell me, I didn't learn anything. Everything that this person told me, I already knew. Meanwhile, it was like a $5,000 workshop.
00:20:21
Speaker
Wow. So I started getting mad because what am I going to do about it? Because I didn't want other new photographers to be taken advantage of. So I started Tea with Janae. And then we started that, we meeting me. And I started doing free education. I have a newsletter. I would do free education with IGTVs. And then I read this book called Crushing It by Gary Vaynerchuk.
00:20:49
Speaker
If you haven't read it, I highly recommend it. Okay, it's a little dated now because like a lot of the stuff isn't there anymore But it but it talks about I mean it came out in 2018 and like there's no I think he barely talks about tick-tock, you know what I mean? Like it's a whole new world. I
00:21:06
Speaker
Oh my God. And he basically talked about sharing your knowledge in a platform that is going to grow. And he said, podcasting is going to be the way of the future. There's Alexa, there's Siri, people are listening on their devices all the time now. So I hopped in, I created the podcast, Tea with Janae, and I begged every person I knew to be on it.
00:21:34
Speaker
In the beginning, I'm like, please come on, talk to me. What do you want to talk about? Basically, I was like, pitch me an idea, and we're going to talk about it. So now we just have, we've surpassed 100 episodes, which is crazy. Congratulations. Thank you. And we've got, now people pitch me to come on. I have PR companies coming to me, pitching their clients to share what they want to talk about.
00:22:01
Speaker
And then I do the coaching. So the coaching is also like a news arm. So I had to refocus what T Wijune was about, and I did that in 2020 where we were going to be about the podcast. We went full throttle podcasting, then we went coaching, and then we now do submission curations.
00:22:23
Speaker
So these three arms allow me to directly help people, one for free on the podcast. You can listen to any podcast. I'm educating people on subjects that I know about and subjects I don't know about, which is the point. I am my listener. I want to help them. I ask these questions because I want to know. And I always want every episode to leave people with actionable tips and advice and to make them more money.
00:22:51
Speaker
I love your podcast. Oh, thank you. Yeah. I mean, that's our mission is really to empower photographers with actionable advice and make more money. I want you to have a profitable business and these are the people that I think are going to help you do that.
00:23:05
Speaker
then I do one-on-one coaching which is really rewarding and I love it. So I have a couple students now and they're on six month programs. One has signed on for a full year and she's probably never gonna leave which I love because it's so good to see her grow and she when she started you know I think she was charging maybe like $1,500
00:23:28
Speaker
for her photography and she's good, right? Like she's good. And now she's up to like almost 5,000. Oh my God. If not higher. So she's like tripling her income just from working together, which is so awesome. So she like will DM me like a score, like she's just, I love it. So yeah, that's awesome. And then the curations
00:23:50
Speaker
again, came out of people needing help. So I did a story on Instagram. I think I was sharing that. I got featured and I just asked like, do you guys need help with submissions? And it was like a hundred percent yes. And I said, well, if I were to help you pick out your images, would you want, is that a service you're looking for? And it was like, people would DM me like, yes, please, me, me, me.
00:24:14
Speaker
And that's what that's how this started so i three yeah three tears of that so i do. Done for you submission and curation where else i'll curate your wedding for you in my best practices you know i never promise anything like it's up to the it's up to the editor it's not up to me.
00:24:33
Speaker
And I'll submit on your behalf and then I have one where it's a one-on-one so it's like a third I'll curate your wedding We do a 30-minute zoom. I'll give you feedback things to improve some like editing You know like suggestions and then and then they submit on their own and then the lowest one Is called done for you where you send me your gallery. I'll curate it for you I send you I send you a
00:24:59
Speaker
quick 10 minute video You know on I use what do I use? I don't know. It's like loom or something like that And then they get some the same sort of thing with a one-on-one But just really short and then they submit on their own. So it's been really successful I think I think we have over like a 50% success rate where people get picked up and they get featured and my clients have been featured in brides style me pretty
00:25:25
Speaker
We just got carrots and, yeah, carrots and cake, hey wedding lady. Oh, the knot is coming out soon with a couple. So yeah, it's been great. I, you know, I've been featured a lot. So like, that's where this comes from. Yeah, all this happened since a lot happened since 2018. I listening to your audience on Instagram. That's so crazy. Yeah, yeah, power, you know, take it to the people see what they want.
00:25:52
Speaker
Oh my God. Okay. So take it a tiny step back, but tell the audience what a submission is. Yeah. So a submission, I was thinking about this before, you know, why do you submit your weddings?
Benefits of Photography Submission
00:26:04
Speaker
Like let's talk about the why, right? So why do you submit your weddings? So you
00:26:09
Speaker
What your work to be featured outside of your own network outside of your own bubble right see why be featured on a platform in a publication that has a really good audience you want more eyes on your work because then you want more increase in your inbox and hopefully.
00:26:27
Speaker
weddings on your calendar so it has like this you know nice sort of cyclical you know circle of submissions it's like you do a great wedding you hope it gets featured you submit it it gets featured a new client finds you from that you know blog post they inquire they want their wedding featured you know it's like this whole like little cycle
00:26:48
Speaker
So you definitely want to, you know, like that's like a submission. So a submission and like a basic term is you, you're putting together a hundred or so images from a wedding of your best work to send to an online publication for them to consider if they will feature your work on their platform. Yes. Does that make sense? Yes, of course. Okay. Yeah.
00:27:13
Speaker
So that's like what you're submitting your work to be featured so that they could call it a submission. Yeah, what is a publication? So the publication would be a magazine. There aren't that many around anymore, but especially for weddings, but you know, there's The Knot, which does one year, one publication a year now. I don't know, sorry, that's Martha Stewart. The Knot went to quarterly and only national.
00:27:38
Speaker
Oh wow. Yeah. So a publication can be a printed publication like a magazine or you can have it be an online publication like a wedding blog such as StyleMePretty, Martha Stewart Weddings, Brides are very popular. So there are benefits and pros and cons of each one.
00:28:00
Speaker
I think being featured in print is always exciting because you get to see your work printed. I think when I got printed the first time, it was so exciting. But also having your work featured online has a lot of benefits because you get that good Google juice, you get that good SEO. Love it. Yeah.
00:28:20
Speaker
So, you know, I think there are a lot of benefits and then you also another good why is, you know, brand alignment, you know, if you want to be featured or published in the right location, the right outlet that aligns with you and your business, you know, because that is where your clients are, right? Where are they looking for inspiration? You want to be featured there.
00:28:45
Speaker
Yeah, I got published on a hundred layer cake. Um, and it was kind of one of those moments where I just was like jumping up and down kind of like when you get like a dog or you go to interview and you land that job. It felt like that. And I haven't felt like that for a long time. Yeah, no, it's so, it's so much fun and you get to share it. It's good, great social proof. You know, it's can be a badge for your website. You can put it in your bio.
00:29:14
Speaker
Totally. There are a lot of good things that come out of it. Your couples are usually really excited. It's like a nice, I call it the icing or like the cherry on top, right? You've worked really hard. You have worked with this couple probably for a year or less or a little bit more. And then you've delivered their gallery maybe, depending on your own process. And then you get their work featured and it's just a nice little
00:29:44
Speaker
you know, cherry on top of working with them. And you're like, Hey, I just want you to know you got featured. And I'm so excited for you guys. That's so cool. Okay, let's go into maybe like three tips for how to get published for our audience. I got in the last like two or three days 18 inquiries.
Carissa's Coaching Journey
00:30:06
Speaker
What the heck? Hey guys, you all know me. I'm Carissa Wu and I'm a coach for wedding photographers. I've also been a wedding photographer for over a decade so I've been through it all. I was a shy, awkward girl and I've come so far. I'm now beyond passionate about helping wedding photographers not struggle how I did for so many years.
00:30:27
Speaker
It was six years into my business and I was so tired of being ghosted, nickel undimed, and hearing the dreaded words, we went a different direction. I also knew I needed to find a way to not rely on referrals or paying $350 a month for the knot to get my leads.
00:30:43
Speaker
I didn't want to have anxiety about when my next payday was going to come and I wanted to scale my business. Fast forward to now, I created my very own stack system to help wedding photographers get constant leads and master the dreaded sales call and get a heck yes in 24 hours or less.
00:31:00
Speaker
and charge more than $4K or $5K or $5K. No more waiting around, guys. This is our livelihood, our artistry, and our passion, and we deserve to be respected, valued, and paid for what we are worth. I've helped so many wedding photographers. Watch my 20-minute masterclass all about lead generation and closing the sale. The link is in the bio. You don't want to miss out on the wedding boom, and you don't want to miss out on booking your calendar for 2022.
00:31:27
Speaker
It's engagement season, guys. So you don't want to miss this. See you guys soon. Definitely. Yeah. So these are my my best practices, right? Like these are things that I would I recommend to everyone. I have also like a free guide. If you guys don't want to write it down, you can grab it at T. Wijane. But the number one tip I can give you to already having a good foot in the door with your submission is to research the publications.
00:31:55
Speaker
and match your style to that publication. So if you are a light and bright and airy photographer, look at publications that already showcase your style or type of photography. If you are dark and moody, you know, research those publications to see where your work would make sense. You know, I think of the June bugs of the world.
00:32:19
Speaker
Exactly. Just like you're a niche photographer or you know your client, there are publications that are out there just for you and you just have to find them. I think researching is really, really important. And then once you figure it out, like where your home is going to be and where you're going to aim for and what's your goal, look at their details of what their submission consists of. Yes.
00:32:46
Speaker
Just about every online location for sure has a page dedicated to submissions, and they'll tell you what they want. They're like, we like detail shots. We like black and white. We want 100 images in a Dropbox folder. So they lay it out there for you. You just have to make sure you're reading it. Yeah, you have to be detail oriented.
00:33:09
Speaker
It's kind of funny, but like, it's the same practice as a second shooter shooting for like a new main photographer. It's like kind of like you should study their work and see what they put out there and what type of shots that they're getting and kind of just study their work. Yeah. Oh, I love that. I've never thought of it that way. But yeah, that's 100% right. Yeah, it's like, like, say like, you just kind of submit and then you forget a detail and you send it through two bright lights instead of
00:33:36
Speaker
you know, we transfer a Dropbox, they're going to be like, dude, she didn't even follow our protocol. So she doesn't care. Yeah, totally. I mean, if you're emailing the head of Martha Stewart, you know, Sarah, and you're like, here's my submission, but then you send her a password protected gallery.
00:33:55
Speaker
She's not even gonna look at it, you know what I mean? She gets hundreds of submissions probably a week, if not a day, who knows. But make it as easy and painless as possible for at least to get the first round of people to look at your work and be like, oh, well, yeah, let's look at that a little bit closer. So make it as easy as possible for sure. Cool, I love that tip.
00:34:22
Speaker
Yeah, I think my second tip is to choose your color palette, right? And what do I mean by that?
00:34:29
Speaker
I mean that if you're working with a planner or ask your client in advance of their wedding what their colors are going to be because this is very important when you as a photographer are going to style and photograph their details because blogs love details, publications love details, and they love a well-styled, thoughtful detail shot. And if you have coordinated it in advance
00:34:58
Speaker
to the colors of the wedding, you have to think of it as being a story on a page, right? So if everything is like navy stripes and white, and then you have a pink background that there's no pink in the wedding at all, I have a pink background for their details. Well, how are they going to lay that out on a page? Because it doesn't make sense.
00:35:22
Speaker
Right. So you want to coordinate your backgrounds to the detail shots in advance. And then you show up and you know what you're going to do. Editors love this. They can tell a great story from start to finish. And being aware of this will actually put you ahead of other photographers. You'll be ahead of the game if it coordinates. Are you talking about maybe the flat lays that you bring?
00:35:50
Speaker
like do you actually bring other details like the ring box and you want it to kind of match what their color palette is already gonna be?
00:35:57
Speaker
Yeah, that's a good question. So I'm definitely talking about the backgrounds. Oh, is it like the backgrounds of when you're shooting? Yeah, the surfaces, like a locust collection or chasing stone. Yeah, I think that kind of is what I'm really focusing on. And I think if you're bringing props, like a ring box or a jewelry dish, I would also coordinate those things. But also, as like a side caveat note, like a asterisk here,
00:36:27
Speaker
Don't bring too much stuff. Don't please don't junk up the photo Yeah, don't junk up the photo with the ribbon that you bought or you know This little key that you bought at some prop store that makes absolutely no sense the couple like You know, I would really truly only use the things that are in your environment. I
00:36:55
Speaker
If you're inserting yourself so much into the photo that it's not about them anymore, it's more about you. You need to rethink that process. You bring like your baby pictures. Yeah, I mean, it's just like, if it's more of your items than the couple's items, who's that picture for?
00:37:19
Speaker
Yeah, you. Yeah, it's for you. And that's fine. But then you've got to take all that stuff out and shoot it for the couple. And I think it's also really good to know how to style stuff without flowers, how to make paper look good on its own. These are skills that you will have forever. And there are so many good courses out there to help you really excel at that. Yeah, I was going to ask you about courses. But I kind of would study Pinterest or other
00:37:48
Speaker
photos that I really like and I'm just like, what makes it good? So it's interesting. It's like this balance, but it's really hard in the beginning because you just don't really get it until you do it a lot of times.
00:38:00
Speaker
Yeah, and I think the two courses that I highly recommend are Rebecca Yale's, and now I think it's called Wedding 101, but she has this whole styling sequence in there, had us style flat lays and paper, and I took that when it first came out, and she talks about the psychology of why an image works and why things make sense, and that for me is a game changer, and then
00:38:27
Speaker
In 2020, I took Corbin Gherkin's class. She has her own online course and that's like elevating your styling for like the luxury market. And I love that one too. So I highly recommend either one of those. I love how you're always educating yourself.
00:38:44
Speaker
Yeah, well you have to. That's awesome. Okay, so tip number three. Yeah, number three. So I think people forget about this is to tell a story from start to finish. When you're selecting your images, it's a good rule of thumb to have about 25% of the couple and 75% of the details. The flatways, table settings, the venue, environmental shots,
00:39:11
Speaker
But you wanna make sure that when you look at your gallery or your edit as a whole, your submission, you're telling a story from start to finish so that when the viewer, i.e. the editor, looks at your submission, they know what happened on that wedding day.
00:39:27
Speaker
You know what I mean? They can tell that it was emotional or they can tell it was sentimental or they can tell they had a kick-ass time on the dance floor. Don't forget dancing photos. Don't forget reception photos. Cake cutting is a must for me. If your couple has cakes, a lot of couples don't do that anymore. But I think you want to tell a story and you want to make sure you've got a good sense of what happened. So that's definitely my number three tip.
00:39:55
Speaker
Yeah, I my blog was my baby for like 10 years after reals came out and I just kind of stopped and they have no time with two kids. But I really was focused on like telling the story from start to finish like from the dress and the details and the getting ready and the romantics and all the way to the dance scene. And I just told people like, well, kind of like you get what you see type of thing. Yeah.
00:40:20
Speaker
So I'm like, look at my blog. That's kind of what you're going to get as a beautiful story told from start to finish. Yeah, I think you could even look at blog posts that, you know, aren't too lengthy as like a good sort of, um, you know, what a submission will look like. And also, you know, like I said before, and see, you know, in my tip number one, look what the publication is showing, you know, and model your submission around what they're already featuring and include images just like that.
00:40:49
Speaker
Okay, I'm gonna recap real fast. So number one, do your research for the publication.
Tips for Photography Submission
00:40:55
Speaker
You mentioned some good ones, but I would say like, I like 100 layer cake, green wedding shoes, Junebug, what is called? Cakes and carrots. Carrots and cake. Carrots and cakes match your style, their editing style. Really, really look at what they're asking for. Number two, choose your color palette or ask the
00:41:17
Speaker
the couple what their palette is. So you can actually make educated decisions on what details you're going to choose with like the flat lays and the details. And yeah, and the number three, tell a beautiful story from start to finish. So I would say like the eye is very powerful. Like people are just so smart. So when they're looking at the blog and it's cohesive,
00:41:44
Speaker
You're just like, oh, wow, like they really see themselves in that and then they want to book you. Exactly. Yeah. Showing what you want to shoot for sure. Cool. Any other tips before we go into rapid fire?
00:41:58
Speaker
Those are pretty good. I think you guys, you know, I think the other tip don't forget is don't junk up your photos. Let's keep your stuff out of it as much as possible. Oh, and then the last, I think the biggest bonus tip is don't put the shoes with the invitations. Just stop it. Just stop. Keep the shoes and the jewelry separate, please.
00:42:24
Speaker
Let's make a, let's make a shirt. That would be so funny. So funny. So funny. All right. What's this rapid thing? Questions about you. Tell me about your daughter or her name and what she likes to do for fun.
00:42:43
Speaker
Her name is Tilly and she is a beautiful artist. So she loves spending her days crafting and making art. And she just dreams up these amazing crafts. Like last week she took a shoebox and made an ice cream truck, you know, out of the shoebox and old toilet paper rolls. And she did that all on her own and she blows me away every day. She's the best.
00:43:10
Speaker
Yeah, she's so sweet. She's the best. Oh, I have my daughter's gonna be five on while we're celebrating on Valentine's Day. And yeah, she's very artistic. And she says she either wants to be a artist or a swimming instructor.
00:43:28
Speaker
Oh, that's awesome. Five is so fun. You'll love it. Okay. Tell me, I was listening to your podcast this morning, but you're going to engage in New Orleans.
00:43:42
Speaker
Yes, I am. I'm excited. It will be my very first Engage. I've known about Engage forever, but finally got or get the importance of it and being in the room with people I want to work with. So yeah, I'm excited. It's going to be at New Orleans. This is 2022, so I think it's maybe the first one of the year. And I've never been, and I will know a lot of people, so I'll feel very safe.
00:44:10
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh my god. Okay, so I love how you're always learning, but where do you see yourself in three months if you had a magic wand?
00:44:18
Speaker
Oh, in three months, I'm going to be probably needy, busy editing. And my season will be fully started by then. And I feel in three months, I'm hopefully booking clients for 2023. And hopefully I've signed on a client or two for six months coaching. So yeah, that's kind of where I see myself. I love that. And what is your WU factor, your T with DNA factor? What makes you stand out? I know you said a lot of stuff, but just
00:44:49
Speaker
My woo factor I think is that God that's a good question. I think like for my clients or for like just in general I guess for just you
00:45:00
Speaker
Oh, okay. I think for me, I'm like really honest and I'm very straight to the point. I think it's also like my Libra Scorpio part of me. You know, like I have my Libra side, which makes me softer. And then I have the Scorpio side, which can be very direct. I'm also an eight wing seven enneagram, if that makes any sense to any listeners. So I'm like,
00:45:27
Speaker
I'm hard and then I'm soft at the same time. I can see things clearly and help you figure it out really fast, but then I can try to just be a little bit nicer about the way I say it. You're very calm too. Yeah, I've heard that a lot. My brides always say that to me that I'm the zen moment in the room because I'll just come in and people get relaxed and I feel like that's definitely a superpower.
00:45:57
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like there'll be like divorce parents finding you just be like, hey guys. I think also being able to read the room is definitely also a good thing that I've learned to like hone in on. So I've had some clients where their mother-in-law can be a little bit overbearing and I'm just like, okay, well let's just move over here into the other section and you know, try to diffuse it. So yeah, definitely. Yeah, for sure.
00:46:26
Speaker
Cool, okay, you're a podcaster, so do you mind asking me a question because I don't do any personal podcasts? Yeah, sure. What do you want to see? Actually, let's ask you what you asked me. Where do you see yourself? And let's do six months. What's your six month goal? Yeah, so the last three months have been crazy because I started my group slash 101 program. And it was a lot of anxiety to tell you the truth, just trying to make it.
00:46:55
Speaker
So now I have all the systems in place and I have like about four students right now. And I feel like I'm going to hit the ground running with it. I'm so excited for the program. I started a Facebook group and I've been just showing up like very authentically. Like I feel like I stepped into my zone of genius and my power. So I see myself like really doing well with the coaching thing. And you know, it's so hard in the beginning. You're just kind of,
00:47:23
Speaker
you know, like you said, throwing spaghetti at the wall for hoping something sticks. And like, I finally tapped into my power of like who I am as a coach, and it just feels so good.
00:47:32
Speaker
Oh, I love hearing that. Yeah, that's awesome. Your coaching is going to be amazing. You have so much energy and so much knowledge to share that anyone who joins is lucky to have you. So I think what I went through with getting out of my own way and playing small, maybe you had a little bit of that too. It's like imposter syndrome. It comes in a lot. It's like, who wants to learn from me?
00:47:56
Speaker
But then you realize you have so much knowledge and experience that who wouldn't want to learn from you. You've been through it all. And I also think that just speaking educator to educator, maybe you look at other people who have all the funnels, they have all the top courses, they have all this stuff done. And you think, well, I'm not good enough to do that, or who wants to learn from me? But then you realize that
00:48:24
Speaker
people want to learn from you because you're you. You're not them. Yeah. So it's been really great. It's so good. And I think 2021, I was doing both a lot of weddings and the coaching. So it was so hard on me with the two kids. So now I get to focus on the coaching thing. And it just so feels so good that I could be like, Oh, I'm going to go to the gym and take the kettlebell class and not feel like guilty. You know, exactly. Yeah.
00:48:51
Speaker
Yeah, it's awesome. When you figure out what you want to do, you go full in and then only good things are going to happen from it. I'm excited to see what happens and how your business grows and it's just going to be awesome. I think also a little tip or a little thing is getting those first few coaching clients is the hardest and then once you get them,
00:49:15
Speaker
and you have success with them, they tell their friends and you help them and it's just like this amazing referral.
00:49:25
Speaker
So it takes time when I started out like I did one-on-ones for free and I was you know, just trying to help people and then I realized actually I Need to be with people longer. So then I did like three and six month minimums So, you know and you have to figure it out like what's your style? So you're gonna do great. I'm excited. Oh, I really appreciate that and I really sense like the fact like you are really like I
00:49:51
Speaker
kind of there for all the coaches out there, educators, and I'm the same way. Like, we're all rooting for each other. Totally, yeah. Cool, so tell everyone the lasting advice for wedding photographers and professionals and where to find you and then one more time about your freebie. Sure, yeah. So you guys can find me at twijene.com. And then I'm on Instagram at twijene. If you want to see my photography work, you can go to jenekirschner.com.
00:50:19
Speaker
or follow me at at Janae Kirchner on Instagram. They're all kind of linked together. So if you hit one site, you'll get a link to the other one. On my side, it says for photographers. And then on the TV Janae, it says, you know, visit my wedding work. And then we do one on one coaching. So if you're interested, I'd love to hear from you. You can book a 15 minute discovery call. We get to chat, I get to, you know,
00:50:44
Speaker
Find out your needs and if we'd be a good fit for each other It's very important to me. So I make sure that I can really help you and then I also do my Cure wedding curation. So if submitting weddings is something that you really struggle with I'd love to hear from you. I do about four or five a month, which is our my schedule now so you can just Click on the link to contact me. Tell me which one you're interested in and then we'll chat via email and
00:51:12
Speaker
Um, and then, you know, listen to the podcast. Find me on any platform. You just type in today. Oh, thank you. Yeah. You can just go. We're on apple podcast, which is our most, uh, listen to platform or on Spotify, soundcast, Google podcasts. So you can just type it in whichever one you prefer. And I hope you guys listen and love the show and feel free to DM me. I'd love to hear if you had any aha moments from today. And, uh, yeah, I thank you so much for having me. This has been so amazing.
00:51:41
Speaker
I know, and if you guys could screenshot this podcast and tag me and Janae, and then let's just say what publication you want to get published at and then tag that publication. And yeah, that would help out so much, but this is a beautiful conversation. Thank you so much.
00:51:58
Speaker
You're welcome. Oh, and I forgot to mention the freebie. If you guys, if you could just visit twidgeonnay.com. It's a pop up and it's just my five secrets to wedding submissions. And you guys can grab that. It's like a two page PDF and it goes over two more tips that I didn't talk about today. So I hope you guys grab it. Thank you so much for having me. It's been amazing.
00:52:23
Speaker
Thanks for joining me this week on Get a Heck Yes with Carissa Wu. Make sure to follow, subscribe, leave a review, or tell a friend about the show. Take a screenshot and post to IG. Tag me. Also, don't forget to download my free guide on how to become a lead generating machine. See you next time, wedding pros.