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#13 Kyle Kingsbury - Rising Above Darkness
4 Plays3 years ago
Kyle is the host of the Kyle Kingsbury Show, Former MMA Fighter, Spiritual and Bio-Hacking Master, Father, Husband and Fit For Service Coach (Aubrey Marcus Mastermind). Kyle is a powerhouse of knowledge and insight. We discuss topics ranging from bio hacking, spirituality, parenting, dark thoughts, plant medicine/psychedelics, personal development, meditation and much more in the self help world. This episode will blow your socks off as Kyle brings multi-dimensional deep insights!
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SEBASTIAN ENGSTROM
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Transcript
Introduction
00:00:06
Speaker
Welcome to episode number 13. I am your host Sebastian Engstrom. And today Kyle Kingsbury joins us. He is a former MMA fighter. He is the host of the Kyle Kingsbury show, which you might have checked out. He is also a former very high up human optimization director at Onnit. He's now doing his own thing. He is a coach at Fit for Service with Aubrey Marcus.
00:00:32
Speaker
And he is just one spiritual awakened badass. I think you'll have one phenomenal time listening to
Exploring Self-Help and Human Experiences
00:00:42
Speaker
this episode. We go deep in multiple aspects from self-help, meditation, psychedelics, to just how we work in our core. Darkness, light and everything to it. So buckle up. This is a wild ride. Aside performers,
00:01:02
Speaker
We really get after it. And this is taxing our nervous system. We would charge forward with such intensity. This is a time and a moment for you to connect back to yourself. To what matters. To your heart. To your soul. To give you signs of space. To let go. So.
00:01:26
Speaker
You're gonna close your eyes. I'm gonna do a breathing exercise. Please don't do this if you're in your heart. So I'm gonna breathe in. And as you do this, can I love you in your name quietly? And I'm gonna say I love you in your name quietly. I'm gonna start this in three, two, one. Oh, I love you in your name. In.
00:02:16
Speaker
I'll forgive you in your name.
00:02:25
Speaker
in
00:02:50
Speaker
and now you're gonna picture one person in front of you. And when it comes to mind, this person is gonna have the biggest smile on their face. They are radiating low because they are filled to the very room. Anything and everything they've ever wanted is coming their way. They're just on cloud nine because they've realized the secret to living
00:03:20
Speaker
is giving. They're helping people. They're giving back. And everything in their past is not forgiven. Anything that they've ever done is no longer. Because they're right here. They're right now. And they're feeling the presence of just being alive in other people.
00:03:41
Speaker
and other people around. We're giving back to them. We're sharing with them. We're sending them out. It's their little day. We don't need much. The biggest thing is just that we have each other and they recognize they're just like me and I'm just like you. It's anyone.
00:04:11
Speaker
You come and see and meet today. Say something nice. Give something. Be of service. And feel how you come alive.
00:04:31
Speaker
I am deeply moved to have you on here and to do this exercise with you right now brought me back to one of my
00:04:44
Speaker
most vulnerable, but also darkest moments. That was me. It was during the sharing circle in Malibu, where Aubrey shared to write down 10 things that you will never forgive yourself for. Then he asked us to pick the one that you think is unforgivable. And now I want you to share it.
00:05:12
Speaker
and the amount of emotion I came up and what people shared. I've never been part of anything like it. It ranged from suicide attempts to the most, I can say, fearful things that people ever experienced and people cried.
00:05:37
Speaker
It came to me and I said something that it didn't feel fully right. We then finished and Aubrey started saying a few words. And the biggest guy in the entire circle, probably 250 pounds, standing 6'5", ex-Canadian military special forces.
00:06:00
Speaker
Sheridan, I once killed an entire family during a operation.
00:06:08
Speaker
And as he did this, he was sobbing and broken down. I started really welling up and then something happened. In that moment, you, the two of you were the two, most alpha, you can say masculine from a size perspective, men in that circle. You were in tears at that point too. You said when I had my son there, I,
00:06:39
Speaker
thought about committing suicide and you just broke down. And at that point, I'm like, holy shit, like I need to share what I'm experiencing too. I had put so much emphasis on who I was through my performance and I pushed myself to the very edge that when I had my daughter and when things got really fricking intense, I didn't know who I was and all the love
00:07:09
Speaker
that I got from Sophia. My wife was now all directed towards Thena, our daughter, and it was just a very angry situation. Thoughts of just taking, every time I was cooking, it's taking a knife and then sticking it in my stomach and then it started for
00:07:29
Speaker
my wife and then my daughter. Cause I was in, I don't know, such a dark place. And it was not like I was going to do it. It was just such darkness. And we later spoke to it and I just, we, we, we embraced each other and we spoke about what was that experience like. And you brought it up. It was, it's recognizing that the ego sometimes wants
Kyle's Personal Journey and Dark Moments
00:07:56
Speaker
to take you places.
00:07:59
Speaker
And if you can't, if it can't take you those places, it'd rather just end at all. What comes up for you when I, when I start talking about this? Oh, a lot comes up and that's how I remembered it as well, brother. Um, you know, Rhonda speaks to that dark thoughts. He actually did a track with our buddy East forest, you know, getting into that, how we all, we all have dark thoughts and one of the teachings, whether it's from the East or from.
00:08:23
Speaker
somebody like Eckhart Tolle is that you're the awareness behind those thoughts. You might not even be the one generating the thoughts. Obviously, if we're tuning into something and we're focusing our mind on a particular thing, we're gonna think in that arena. And certainly we're generating thoughts then, but what happens when those thoughts just pop into our head? And whether we create them or not, we are the awareness behind that. And if we come to that place, we have the ability to let it move through us.
00:08:51
Speaker
But we all have those fucking thoughts. It's not that everybody listening is like, most people listening to this are likely going to say, I've never thought of killing my family and shit like that. And that's fine. But we've all had dark thoughts. And to the degree that we've had, that's up for people to admit or not. The point is that they exist. And at that time, I mean,
00:09:15
Speaker
You talked about the first solo cast that I ever did, episode 12 of the Kyle Kingsbury podcast, where I talked about attempting suicide. I think it was in my early 20s after college at ASU. And when I think back to that, there's no light at the end of the tunnel when you're that depressed and when you have that kind of weight on your shoulders. And that's a whole podcast in and of itself. So I don't need to dive into the whys behind that,
00:09:45
Speaker
what you're looking for is a way out and oftentimes the only way out is to push the end button you know it's the control delete of whatever physicalness this is and if it goes black great if it goes to something else great but just get me the fuck out of here and oftentimes we can look to
00:10:07
Speaker
you know, people we love as a part of that problem as well, because having kids is incredibly hard and contrary to popular belief, this is not how it was done and it's not the best way to do it. This is not the best way to raise kids in singular nuclear families that are tied into a box. Multigenerational families are great, but that still is not the way it was done for the bulk of human history.
00:10:35
Speaker
You know, when you think back to that, there's whole tribes, Native American tribes that really the grandparents raised the kids and that allowed the parents to still go out and do their daily work to go fish, to go hunt, to go gather. And then when they returned, the education portion of the day was over with and the parents could simply be there to play. Almost like in how we view aunties and uncles now, you know, it's not their job to parent.
00:11:02
Speaker
or how we view our grandparents now. I mean, if my parents try to parent, I'm like, look, that's my job. Y'all get to just have fun and feed them shit food and spoil them. You know what I'm saying? Like, tell me if they're not paying attention to you. That's my job to discipline all that stuff.
00:11:16
Speaker
But that's not the way that these tribes and cultures set it up. They set it up understanding having a greater level of awareness of how difficult that is. So I get it. You know, I think a lot of parents get it. Maybe they don't take it that far in terms of where the thinking goes. But the last thing you want to do when you have those thoughts is blame yourself or guilt yourself or shame yourself into why am I having these thoughts because that just perpetuates the problem. I've had a
00:11:43
Speaker
You know, I know I can, I can lead into this much further, but I want to keep, I want to let you direct this podcast as I got, I got a lot more to say on darkness as a reason. So please do. Okay. All right. So I recently had, and I'm going to do a solo podcast on this probably in the next six weeks. I'm not sure when this is, this is coming out, but you know,
00:12:04
Speaker
I had an initiation dose with 5MEO DMT, the Sonoran Desert Toad, and it was after my first two frog medicine, the combo, the poisonous combo frog that is more purgative than psychedelic and very cleansing, and I had a day off after those two, and then I had this initiation dose with 5MEO DMT.
00:12:27
Speaker
I've probably had that level of medicine before with various medicines, and I've had it once or twice with that medicine in particular with the Sonoran Desert Toad. But for those that don't know, it's possibly the strongest psychedelic animal medicine that's on the planet.
00:12:47
Speaker
It's a total evisceration of ego. It doesn't last. Like Paul Chek taught me, you simply wouldn't know how to tie your shoes or where to take a piss or to stop on red and to go on green without an ego. That part of conditioning and programming is necessary for us to operate in 3D. But you do come to a place momentarily where that is no longer there and then re-emerges. And 15, maybe 20 times that I had done this medicine before,
00:13:15
Speaker
It was just a complete immersion into God's love. I always thought if you had an atheist, just give them the Sonoran Desert Toad and they would understand. They've been tricked. They've been duped.
00:13:34
Speaker
you know, picture 1000 hits of Mali or MDMA, something like that, just like a full dissolve into a star and pure warmth, pure unconditional love through every cell of my body. So in this experience, it was the polar opposite of that. And really, it wasn't even on my radar. I mean, I didn't even think that was possible. I had had dark experiences on ayahuasca and certainly on the larger doses with psilocybin.
00:13:59
Speaker
But this kind of came out of left field and it started with this infinite loop where I was stuck. And when you're operating there on medicine that deep, there's no concept of time. So as it loops, it loops for eternity and it progressively got worse and worse. And the beautiful part about hell or true darkness is that it will find every corner of your personal experience and everything you've held onto as an anchor
00:14:28
Speaker
and invert that. So this wasn't unity in love. This was polarity and stuck in the darkness. Not any glimmer of light, any shred of hope or thoughts that I had had that were spiritual teachings that I had leaned on throughout my life were completely turned on their head. And it was brutal. And I'm going to dive into that further on my own podcast, but just to give people an idea and truly
00:14:58
Speaker
You know, I, I bared it, but unbearable was the first word that I thought of just absolutely unbearable. I would wish that upon nobody. And one of the things that the maestro who worked with the sherry tribe in Northern Mexico and the Sonoran desert talked to me about was the fact that this can reactivate in you. And I was reminded of a, you know, Norm McDonald skit where he's going to buy acid and he's like, so you're telling me I can spend five bucks on drugs now, I get high and 20 years from now I get high for free.
00:15:27
Speaker
And I'm like, fuck it, let's reactivate God's love, you know, like, that's all pre pre ceremony. And now I'm like, holy shit, I do not want this to reactivate and you know, dead sober make my way home and right as I hit the sheets.
00:15:44
Speaker
my hands and feet start to vibrate. And I'm like, Oh, interesting. Uh, you know, I feel grounded. I feel like I'm back, but it feels like the medicine's picking up. This is hours after the fact. I've never had reactivations before. And as I nod off, either right after I sleep or right after I, right before sleep, it feels like I'm holding the first hit of five MEO DMT in my lungs, full body vibrations. Um,
00:16:10
Speaker
full fractal visual start and I recognize on the other side of this portal is hell. That's what awaits me. And the darkness is there and I'm like, fuck no, I'm not surrendering to this alone. And I remember yelling at myself, wake up. And I like yank out of bed and my heart's just racing, pounding. Didn't sleep at all the first night. This continued for 16 days.
00:16:34
Speaker
16 days and sometimes I'd wake up at 1 a.m Sometimes I wake up at 3 a.m And I wouldn't be able to go back to sleep And if I did surrender I would go into a visionary state that was completely dark All my fears like this is game theory. It's just ai knowing itself. It's not god trying to know thyself. It's just a fucking computer game and there is no such thing as soul and just any anything that I would that I would hold on to as like a
00:17:02
Speaker
of reason and meaning behind life was just shut down in a heartbeat. And because of the lack of sleep, this started to blur the lines between raking reality and the visionary state. And by far... On top of having a baby as well. Having a baby, having a five-year-old, having the external world look the way that it is right now with the fucking shenanigans and politics and everything going on externally as well.
00:17:32
Speaker
And so yeah, I mean, as above, so below, as within, as without, so without, you know, like just, just everything all at once and no real safety net. Like there was no way that I could, that I could ground it. And finally my wife was like, you got to call Paul check. He's the only guy that's been through this. And so Christmas Eve, I call him and I think we're going to talk for 15 minutes.
00:17:56
Speaker
We end up talking for two hours. He gives me a protocol on how to ground it, to speak out loud what I've learned from the darkness, but to close the loop, and to ask humbly ask if there's any more lessons that come through the dream state without fear so I can sleep through the night and begin to rebuild myself. And that's what happened Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, ever since I've slept like a baby.
Lessons from Darkness and Growth
00:18:15
Speaker
And, uh, I had a friend of mine, uh, you know him, he was in fit for service, Wyatt and Wyatt, Wyatt told me about this book. He goes, yeah, man, I just went through this darkness myself, Eric Godsey, a lot of people who dropped into, you know, any type of decent dose of medicine around solstice in 2020.
00:18:33
Speaker
experience this in their own way. That's the thing. This darkness is highly personal. It's not some guy, creepy guy with a tail running around poking you in the ass with a pitchfork. It's fucking personal. And it knows your fears. It knows every corner of your imagination and we'll find it. And so this book by Paul Levy is called Dispelling with Tico. With Tico was the Native American word among many cultures for the devil, Satan, darkness, whatever you want to call that.
00:19:03
Speaker
and how it acts as this non-local virus that is within us all. You know, something I've spoken to people about at many of the fit for service events, you know, with relation to what's happening in the world right now is Nazi Germany happened yesterday. It was that fast when you look at recorded history and not even just recorded history, you look at the total history of humanity and the total history of the earth. I mean, you fucking blink your eye.
00:19:27
Speaker
That we have not evolved past that. We're not different people. We're the same people that said yes to that. And even though it's easy to turn away from that and say, no, that's not me. I'd never do that. Fucking we did it. We did it. And we did it yesterday.
00:19:43
Speaker
This concept of Wetiko, it is elusive. One of the things Paul Levy mentions is the old saying that the greatest trick the devil ever did was to convince the world he didn't exist. But that still looks through the lens of an outside character. It objectifies the darkness as something that lives outside of us.
00:20:05
Speaker
You know, the church says he was possessed by the devil or possessed by a demon and we have to exercise that being away from him. And I'm not opposed to external beings, you know, obviously in ayahuasca and things like that, like that's, that's a very real threat and good cudenderos work with the medicine to prevent those things from happening, but
00:20:24
Speaker
As this is a fractal universe, and as we have been made in God's image, all that exists, as Paul Selig states, all is of or nothing is. Either all is God or nothing is. And if all is God, one of the hardest pieces to chew on is that so is the darkness. Whether that's there to serve the light or the light's there to serve the dark or both are equal, I don't know yet. But in a spelling with Tico, he really gets into that, that this is within you.
00:20:50
Speaker
And it is a virus that can take over. I mean, I felt fucking, I have complete compassion for people that have lost their minds because I felt the grips of that. And I think this book, for anybody that's resonating with a fraction of what this conversation has been about, battling darkness at any point in their life and uncertainty,
00:21:14
Speaker
This book really can iron that out because it's a pathway and Paul Levy understands the metaphysical and the spiritual world as good as anybody. He wrote another book called The Quantum Revelation and he's absolutely brilliant, but I just offer that.
00:21:31
Speaker
You know, these things can come to us through the most brilliant medicine that's brought us the most joy, the most peace, the most downloads. They can come at any point in time. And it's not a matter of pushing that away. It's a matter of actually sitting with it, looking at it and learning how to work with it. Carl Jung talked about this quite a bit in the red books, the red book and the black books as well.
00:21:52
Speaker
In his understanding of alchemy that we are to witness this, you know, Caroline may spoke about that Christ spending 40 days and 40 nights in the desert to alchemize the darkness. The Buddha spending 40 days under the Bodhi tree to alchemize the darkness so they could step in to their highest level of being. And I think that's
00:22:12
Speaker
That's what I was calling in. I just didn't understand how much I was fucking asking for. Wow. So your reality has changed quite a bit this year and you're doing some very exciting things. Um, both from, you can say journeys, experiences that you are part of and even offering to other people, but also you welcomed in a new being into your family. Do you mind speaking to what has your year been like this year?
00:22:41
Speaker
I mean, yeah, you know, you look at everything going on in the world, there's there's a number of ways people have tried to cope with this with with the so called pandemic and everything that's going on out there externally. My wife was pregnant when this all hit in March, you know, we had our little girl, Fourth of July on a full moon. And
00:23:05
Speaker
You know, I mean, I could speak about that for a while. I saw her in an ayahuasca vision in 2016 and I've seen her many times since then at different ceremonies and it took four years for her to come. And so this divine timing was something I couldn't wrap my head around. And then I look now like you're born on one of the most important days of the year for our country, for what it stands for with freedom.
00:23:30
Speaker
and liberty and justice for all. And I'm looking at that like, oh, that's curious, but still not really seeing how things are going to shake out, still scratching my head while we're running from nature. You know, Dr. Zach Bush talked about that on my podcast. When have we ever run from nature? When have we ever decided that we're going to figure out something that can change
00:23:52
Speaker
immediately, and this airborne virus that can travel and encircle the globe has many, many times since March encircled the globe. We had a dust storm from the Saharan Desert comes through the Gulf Coast. In Texas, it changed our sunset and sunrise for two weeks. We had dust, very low air quality. Fucking sand is coming from the Saharan Desert in Africa across the Atlantic and hanging out for two weeks. You bet a virus, which is less than five
00:24:23
Speaker
Five nanoparticles, is that it? I'm forgetting the lingo here, but five microns, less than five microns. Very small size, it's gonna float through the air much easier than sand does. Why are we running from this? And that was like my first real thing and the most, my first real issue with that and starting to talk to more and more medical doctors about their thoughts, it really became quite clear, there's something else going on behind the scenes.
Pandemic Reflections and Socio-Political Awareness
00:24:50
Speaker
There's something else going on here.
00:24:52
Speaker
that, you know, the deeper that rabbit hole goes, the less and less I want to understand, but I can't turn away. I can't stick my head in the sand like an ostrich. And thankfully, you know, it's that one seeds planted many other seeds and I've been introduced to many great people from Mickey Willis to Del Big Tree and Dr. David E. Martin, who we've all had on my podcast that have really helped expose and unfold what's going on.
00:25:16
Speaker
Now bring a newborn into the equation, right smack dab in the middle of all this. And it's like, why now? Why not earlier? Why bring a new life here? And one of the most beautiful reminders for us has been we all chose this. We pick our parents. We choose the exact time and location we come here. And so did she. She chose to come right in the middle of this stuff and for good reason, to spread that light, love, and joy, and to
00:25:45
Speaker
to help be the change in the world. And we have that opportunity now to raise these two amazing little beings at a time where the sky looks like it's falling and really start to shape and reshape culture on the planet.
00:26:02
Speaker
So it's, uh, you know, if, if, or I talked to Del Big tree and he's like, look, man, people go through their entire lives, working mundane, shitty jobs, doing whatever it is they think they're supposed to be doing. But if you're a freedom fighter, if you're somebody who cares about personal liberty and sovereignty, there's never been in a more important time to live than right now. I mean, and, and Robin used to talk about that, like,
00:26:23
Speaker
you lived a thousand years ago, seven generations behind you, seven generations ahead of you, it was the same fucking thing day in and day out. You're a, you know, a blacksmith, you know, pounding metal, making swords, an iron worker, whatever it is, a shoemaker that was held for generations. And you went with the seasons and not much changed.
00:26:45
Speaker
And since we've been alive, shit has changed rapidly. Technologically, information-wise, our access, communications-wise, our ability to communicate. And now we see all this shifting. Seemingly overnight, people are losing their accounts on Facebook and Twitter. Google's shutting down websites. Whole social media apps are being closed down right now, you know, within the last week. We're entering into a police state. We're entering into
00:27:15
Speaker
something that we never thought we'd experience and here we are and it's really it's it's it's fantastic it's fantastic in a way where it's like you gotta fucking eat some popcorn and laugh because there's it's it reminds me the serenity prayer you know where we ask for the wisdom to know the difference between the things we can change and the things we cannot change right like it's that simple you know like that's the guidepost and um
00:27:40
Speaker
One of my favorite lessons from Paul Selig, you know, he talked about this in Malibu. One of my favorite quotes from him was this parable of a pretty big dude, you know, driving his truck down the road asking God, why am I here? Why am I here? Why am I here?
00:27:54
Speaker
And he stops his truck and he sees that this log has fallen over in the middle of the road and he gets out and he's just big enough to pick it up and move it to the side of the road, gets back into his truck and keeps driving. Why am I here? Why am I here? Why am I here? I'm not realizing that every car behind him was able to flow through easily because of the work that he did. And you know, it's no further than the work to be done is the work of the day. Simple as that. You know, I had a,
00:28:22
Speaker
had another guest on the show, and he's really worked with a lot of different Native American elders, as well as Mayans, people from Central and South America. And he's talking about this big shift happening on the earth. And he's like, all the elders say the same thing. At the end of the day, it's chopped wood, carry water. It's very simple. It's the little things. It's every choice that you make that determines where your life and what your trajectory looks like. And while that may seem oversimplified,
00:28:50
Speaker
It really is a beautiful grounding cord that brings it back home from looking externally into everything that's happening and all the hocus pocus bullshit we see. And from mainstream media to social media to then just ground that what's right in front of me. Where can I affect change and how can I operate, right? I always have a choice over anything that comes into my field on what my reaction to that is.
00:29:15
Speaker
That's where I can be unwavering in the storm. Can I sit in the eye of the hurricane and operate at my best? And that's easier said than done. I mean, I've been flying off the fucking handle at different points in time and certainly having a newborn and a five-year-old with tons of energy, balls to the wall all day long has added layers of complexity to that challenge. But at the same time, it's never more than you can chew. Even the darkness wasn't more than I can handle, even though it was on the brink.
00:29:44
Speaker
And just like you were at times early on at the brink of your sanity and what you feel like you can handle, we can look back on those experiences and know that they made us better. And that's firmly where I get to stand right now.
00:30:00
Speaker
The biggest driver and how I found significance was through proving myself through my performance. And speaking of performance, that is something, yeah, you've done a thing or two in your life along those lines. I think one of the big things for me was playing basketball. That's really how I found myself and that led me to the United States and Minnesota. And then I thought, well, I might as well try football.
00:30:23
Speaker
turned out that I had a natural ability for it and long story short I played and college and I the thing there when I Started it really immersing myself with with the strength culture and then the hyper masculinity that became such a just who I am and that became also the biggest hurdle from getting past that when I had a child and
00:30:53
Speaker
is because now I couldn't just focus all my effort on just performing like a madman and I had to soften especially having a girl and especially just and that was the biggest thing that was my battle with my ego of not wanting to let go of my old identity and just surrendering to something new
00:31:12
Speaker
now that you've had a girl yourself and having your ordeals and trials with performance, how has that shifted even from having Bear to now having a baby girl and yeah, speaking to that? Well, it's funny you mentioned that. I think that's a trajectory for a lot of type A people or high performance athletes, especially when you're a man is that the way you're conditioned and women have their own culture and conditioning as well that they need to unpack as they grow older.
00:31:41
Speaker
You know, we, we come to a place in our lives where we say, okay, this might, this program got me so far, but now I think I need to delete that and interested in some new programs because it no longer serves me. And, and there's no judgment there. But we, but we have that point in time where we need to move on from it. It's odd that, you know, I had to soften for bear to be perfectly honest. And the reason for that was when he was young, um,
00:32:09
Speaker
I wasn't a hard ass by any means. I had already gone through those loops. Thanks to plant medicines of, you know, really looking at the suck it up pussy type mentality that I grew up with to soften and be there for him and have compassion for him. But still very, very rough around the edges, wrestling with him hard, you know, when he was young and, and he's so strong and so big for his age. Um, it's been one of those things that I needed to teach him was how to be gentle, how to soften when to calm down.
00:32:37
Speaker
how to have both those approaches, you know, to not lose or favor one over the other, but to really be both. We talk about the bamboo. We have bamboo in our backyard and I was in an altered state of consciousness. We'll just say that since I'm in my backyard. And I'm looking at the bamboo, moving with the wind.
00:32:59
Speaker
And the wind can pick up pretty strong here. And this, this bamboo can fold over at 90 degrees and it doesn't break and it just pops back up. So it's incredibly strong and it is really incredibly strong fiber, but it's also incredibly flexible and it has this ability to move and go with the ebb and flow of life. And it really hit me like that. That is where I need to be. I need to be the embodiment of that bamboo.
00:33:25
Speaker
So that way I can move and be like water as Bruce Lee says, but also incredibly strong to bend, but not break under any circumstance and to be able to show that to my kids, you know, it's so much of what we understand as parents is like.
00:33:41
Speaker
word vomit means nothing to them. It really doesn't. There's no language barrier. It's not like, hey, when he's 15, he's going to get this with words. No, fucking be the change you wish to see. And all of that, the beauty of it, when we look at our kids as our gurus and our teachers, is that anything that's fucked up inside of you is going to be mirrored by them.
00:34:06
Speaker
anything that you're not doing that's out of or anything you are doing that's out of alignment, you're going to get to witness it in those little mirrors. And that's a tough pill to swallow. You know, it's a really tough pill to swallow. But if we recognize that, oh, I'm seeing this in you because it's in me, and you're learning that from me, there's no better way to get a kick in the ass or to jumpstart the fire of change than to witness that and say, Oh, okay, I can be better.
00:34:32
Speaker
me try, you know, and so I had to soften with Bear. Certainly with her, you know, she gave me her name and I and I was guy met this being in the void and darkness, I could feel the presence of, of a, you know, non gendered being. And the being said, My name is wolf and I'm going to be your daughter, four years ahead of time, just as I had met bear.
00:34:55
Speaker
who said, my name's gonna be Bear and I'm gonna be a boy. And he came a month after that vision. So you can see why I had a little trouble with the timeline of having to wait four years. But looking at that,
00:35:08
Speaker
Tash tuned into her while she was in the womb and just felt so much joy. And she looked up the Sanskrit word for that and it's Ananda. And we have a close friend who's on our spirit council, one of our mentors, Anahata Ananda. And so that we played a little homage to her and did a blessing with her and a water blessing. And she's been just that. You know, it doesn't mean she's not going to have fire or her own fits of rage or she's not going to be a kid and go through every stage and phase that kids go through.
00:35:35
Speaker
of course she is, it'd be an idiot not to think that but at the same time she's been the easiest kid ever especially in contrast to bear like she is just a pure ball of joy you know she's crawling and getting into stuff and she cries from time to time but she's huge she's strong um and she is she's such a beautiful being you know i got it when when she was i'll give you an example when she was first born
00:36:00
Speaker
in the first six weeks, I almost recreated what I tried to recreate what I'd done with bear, where I lived on modafinil and high amounts of caffeine for a year and a half. Like I'm going to fucking grind my way through this. I'm going to bust my ass. I'm going to get shit done. And with her, you know,
00:36:16
Speaker
there was like this deep understanding in the back of my mind, like, no, no, no, now you need to do it different. That was five years ago. Now you got to do it different with her. And I was, I would still, I'd have, you know, a hundred, 200 big Saboondafino and a big thing of coffee. And my heart's racing. I don't feel like now I'm in the zone. I feel just cracked out and I would hold her to my chest. And I remember thinking as I'm holding her outside by the bamboo,
00:36:41
Speaker
I don't want her to feel this shitty energy, this racing heart, this nervousness, this anxiety. Am I doing it right? No, I fucked up. There's a little bit of guilt there, you know, it's like, Hey, I know better, but I'm still saying yes to this every fucking morning. And, um, she would have the ability just to bring me into her resonance. I mean,
00:37:05
Speaker
Man, within moments, within moments of being with her outside, I would drop and my heart would drop and I would feel this drop, at least 20 beats per minute. If I was looking at the fucking heart rate monitor, I would feel a palpable drop in my adrenaline and just sink down into her level and feel that joy.
00:37:29
Speaker
You know, I haven't needed modafinil and I've come off, you know, large amounts of caffeine and I'm down to, you know, my one cup in the morning. And it's the recognition of that, that we do influence each other. You know, all of these mirrors around me aren't just my ego at Kyle Kingsbury mirror. I'm their mirror as well. And I can't tune into other people if I allow that. I can tune into the trees, the plants, all of nature if I allow that.
00:37:53
Speaker
And that's been a beautiful way to soften and acquiesce to those things that I wish to be in the right frequency with. And that frequency of the innocent child is such a beautiful frequency to tune into, especially when it's that of the feminine capacity. What a balancing, beautiful energy to have in the home that is completely balanced out our home. We have this little rocket ship of masculine energy. And then there's little Wolf, who's just so calm and joyful.
00:38:22
Speaker
and that's been a beautiful thing to experience. Speaking to softening and last time we spoke you had released the obsession of weights and you were deep into yoga and you were all about yoga and you released caffeine and it was not an easy
00:38:44
Speaker
easy task. How is that softening journey been? And what is it like right now? What do you what do you feel like that experience and transformation was like this year? Because I experienced sure my own softening and now it's been slightly different. Yeah, it's it's um, it's finding that balance. You know, Jen Prue was my wife's yoga teacher from yoga teacher training, Ram Dass was her mentor. And
00:39:08
Speaker
She teaches at Breathe, Los Gatos, you know, up in the Bay Area. And she's also featured on yogaanytime.com. And that's really where we stay in touch with her and follow a lot of her classes. But in one of her classes, she talks about this, this old teaching that we often push ourselves to the extreme in one direction and then the other direction just so we can find our center. Yeah. And I love that quote. And
00:39:31
Speaker
For a long time, my body just was full of inflammation. And Paul Czech talks about this. When you look at everything holistically and globally, you understand that all stress equals stress. And all chronic stress will equal inflammation, pain, and then disease in the body if it goes unchecked. So when March hit, I had back pain that I'd never had before. I couldn't lift, even if I wanted to. And the more I tried to lift through that, the more of an issue it became. And that's what got me into doing yoga regularly.
00:40:01
Speaker
And that would alleviate the pain. It also alleviate the stress. And I started to learn things and ways to expand within how to create spaciousness and openness from within. And that led me back to meditation, which is now a much better practice because of the fact that I've created that openness within and created space. So I don't sit down frantically. I actually sit already from my quiet center. And then when I'm able to meditate, I can go pretty, pretty fucking deep. But, um,
00:40:29
Speaker
know, for the last probably three months of the year, I didn't touch any weights at all. And this, no doubt in hindsight was leading me to this ceremony, you know, it was like I was in Dietta unknowingly, you know, like I've really I wouldn't lift if I had 17 days straight of ayahuasca, I'm not going to lift in and around that probably in those six weeks leading up to it, I'm not going to touch a weight. And that's really how it panned out. And now you know, I've
00:40:55
Speaker
I've gone back to weights maybe once a week, you know, just because it's fun. It's something that I've always enjoyed. I enjoy that, but I don't give a shit what those numbers look like. It's just because it, it, it tunes me in. And if my body's a tuning fork, um, I like things and activities that bring me into resonance that lift me for everything from the neuro chemistry to the feelings that I have. And when done in right relation at the right dose, lifting weights can be, you know, one of my favorite activities at the same time.
00:41:25
Speaker
That might be 30 minutes from once a week. And I'll drop into yoga, even if I don't have an hour to give. I'll do five minutes here, five minutes there all throughout the day. I'll just get my sun salutations. I'll get into different positions and consistently open up my body. And that's been a real blessing to have those tools, thanks to Jen.
00:41:45
Speaker
One thing that I've done ravenously is meditate every morning at 5.30 a.m. I'll meditate for 20 to 30 minutes and then again in the early afternoon and that's prevented me from needing a second cup of coffee. It's prevented me from needing a nap. I learned that from a lady named Emily Fletcher who studied
00:42:01
Speaker
under the Vedic tradition. She's been a guest on my podcast. And that lineage goes back 6,000 years to the Himalayan mountains in India. So the fact that that's preserved from teacher to teacher for 6,000 years is a really beautiful thing. But working with her style, she calls it Ziva meditation.
00:42:21
Speaker
has been a complete game changer. I mean, I put it as valuable as my first ayahuasca experience, without question, one of the most valuable things gifts that I've ever been given one of the most valuable tools I've ever learned. And that's the thing that I'm into every day twice a day, no matter what. So my I think at the very beginning,
00:42:43
Speaker
Yeah, that's when I decided, okay, I need a change.
Ego, Identity, and True Masculinity
00:42:48
Speaker
And then part of that was our call that influenced it, like letting go of the old and really not being a slave to the money, a slave to the corporate job that I had. And my shift was to shave off my hair. That was a new change. And the biggest part was the ego. It was my physique is I am not my appearance. I am not what I do.
00:43:12
Speaker
I am not what I can show for. I am not my money. I'm not my title. I am not anything that you can see. And that was difficult, but significant. I sold all my barbell, all my heavyweights. I mean, doing a lot of powerlifting in my days and Olympic lifting and even completely like, no, I'm done with that.
00:43:33
Speaker
I did not take it as far as doing yoga. I still feel like that is a way for me to process emotions, events and feelings by just getting myself in such an uncomfortable state because I'm pushing myself so hard with weights that my mind just lets go because it's too difficult. I need to focus on exactly what I do in that moment and I have a very challenging time going there even with meditation.
00:43:59
Speaker
So what happened next is caffeine. I started doing that last we've been doing a protocol my entire family with Chris Kresser and It's been a lot of freaking testing. I'll tell you that and one of the things that that have come up was coffee and and It escapes me now
00:44:20
Speaker
It is called inflammatory thing. It's in food. I'll get back to it. But it's coffee. I realized that was one of the things and it came to me in a dream here recently, that when I take it, I was having a dream and I was dreaming that I was doing cocaine and I got incredibly high and then crashed and completely blew up.
00:44:43
Speaker
And I woke up and I'm realizing that's coffee. It's coffee that's doing that to me. And it's not, I only have one cup a day. I do it butter coffee, bulletproof style. But it still, it took me to such a, had such a high, but it masked how I really was feeling. And at the end of the day, all of those things would come back and I would feel like shit. I would feel anxious. And I would carry that through into my work and into my night.
00:45:11
Speaker
And yeah, it was really I never realized how much of caffeine or even coffee could be a drug to that sort of even realized the roasting process I've gotten to that state of being so highly tuned at the smallest things like you were saying with your grill at one point that even the the process of how the coffee has been roasted had an effect.
00:45:33
Speaker
And that has been my journey in this year is being so highly and finely tuned that I needed to renounce so much of the masculine to really go deep to understand where am I at emotionally.
00:45:47
Speaker
and to now dig my way back up to now feeling, okay, now it's time to get shit done. Now it's time to make a difference. Now it's time to act on all the things that came up during this year and also softening with we're not worrying about the finances of just trusting, okay, well, something higher will come from this. Meditations like the Joe Dispencer Meditations have gotten me back even to feeling my emotions. There's one of reconditioning the body.
00:46:16
Speaker
and to the mind and the seva meditations the m-word has been been part of that too is freaking phenomenal because that is speaking to the hyper masculinity again that is one of the things that I've is so deeply ingrained but also damaged me in a way that I a part of me does not want to feel feelings because it's a sign of weakness and
00:46:40
Speaker
Well, let me jump in there because this is important and you're still on the West Coast. So I want to be clear. I was born and raised in Silicon Valley and I think there's some misnomers. You know, true masculinity is a lot different than what we hear in mainstream media and social media. And King Warren Magician Lover will really elaborate that for people. It's one of the books that absolutely changed my life. It's in my top five of anything I've ever read and I've read a lot of fucking books.
00:47:07
Speaker
One of the key differences is in what the shadow versus the divine light of a particular archetype is. And if we look at just masculinity as a whole, the shadow of masculinity is what we've experienced. It's what we witness in the world. That's not divine masculinity. To throw the baby out with the bathwater and say that masculinity taught me this to avoid emotion and things like that, that's simply not the case.
00:47:33
Speaker
The divine masculine is in touch with all of that and the divine masculine is so comfortable in its own skin that it allows the feminine to speak and the feminine speaks through emotions, through all of the emotions. It's not masculine, anger is not a masculine thing. Thought is the way the masculine speaks, thought and words and vocabulary. Emotion and feeling are the way the feminine speaks.
00:47:57
Speaker
And that includes every fucking emotion from rage all the way down the line to unclean anger, clean anger and everything in between. And all of the other beautiful emotions that we feel.
00:48:08
Speaker
That's the way the feminine speaks. And we can access that when our masculine's in a state of surrender, when it understands that it has a certain degree of understanding. One of the archetypes is the warrior and the warrior is very clear on how to face life frontally. There's a greater sense of clarity and it serves in higher ideal. That higher ideal is what the king sets out for the kingdom. That starts with self.
00:48:35
Speaker
The Kyle Kingsbury self, the self of family, what my family is the self that operates at work that kingdom and beyond to the kingdom of the planet how I interact and interwork and interweave within the kingdom of all life on earth, and honestly that self can go well beyond that to the self of the all.
00:48:56
Speaker
It's in those understandings that we reimagine that. It doesn't mean that we look at these things as the things that happened as something we don't want to change or we give a free pass. Like, no, there's plenty to change. There's plenty to reimagine. But the language around masculinity needs to change first. And that's something that really is spoken to in a greater degree. In the first opening pages of the book, King Wearing Magician Lover, they really dive into that. Another thing I'll offer people
00:49:24
Speaker
that really helps unpack conditioning and what's happening in the modern world is a book by Douglas Murray called The Madness of Crowds. And he's a gay man from,
00:49:35
Speaker
England from the UK. He has a brilliant voice for everybody who loves listening to the English people. He does his own audible, but it's just fantastic. And it really unpacks, you know, everything from gender to race to everything that's going on in the world right now that we would look outside of ourselves and say, oh, that's fucked up. That's not right. We point fingers and cancel culture, this guy and all that shit. And it's like, is that really the way we want to behave?
00:49:58
Speaker
or are we going to start to forgive ourselves and forgive others? Are we gonna soften and understand maybe there's a better way if we can come and meet somewhere in the middle? Is there middle ground to stand on? How do we communicate to others is mirrored by the fact of how we communicate to ourselves. Every great teaching from Ted Decker to Paul Selleck to anybody that I've read and understood, they talk about these key ingredients to imagine a new earth. And the first one is,
00:50:25
Speaker
Forgiveness and compassion and we can only forgive another as much as we forgive ourselves We can only have as much compassion for another as we have compassion For the self because there's no greater critic and no one is harder on us than our own inner critic and our own inner judge period doesn't matter if you have a wife that's on your ass or a husband that's on your ass or You know a verbally abusive boss What you say to yourself is is
00:50:52
Speaker
by far gonna, you know, how you talk to yourself is by far gonna be the most critical compared to anyone else. And when you come to that understanding and you soften to that and you can begin to understand and look in hindsight, you know, hindsight is one of the greatest teachers because hindsight can become foresight, something that Aubrey's taught us all to really look at the fact that every challenging experience we've been through has made us better, hopefully, right? And if we're no longer in victim mode, we begin to understand that.
00:51:20
Speaker
Every hardship we've gone through has changed us in a way that's allowed us to gain more from life and allowed us to look at ourselves and understand ourselves better. We come to know thyself better. And it's only with those challenging experiences that we begin to experience that. Paul Levy talks about that in Dispelling Wetiko.
00:51:37
Speaker
Paradoxically, what's held within that evil is the fucking medicine. It's the oddest fucking thing to come to realize, but that's the truth. And there are an infinite number of paradoxes within that experience of darkness, but that is true. The wellspring of wellness that we search for, the medicine that we need sometimes is looking at the shit that's within us. And we have that mirrored externally, so why not take a deeper dive inward to understand that?
00:52:07
Speaker
So you spoke to Jennifer Prue and taking it to the extremes and going back and forth. There are a few things that are triggering and especially challenging to that. When you go for me, well, I know from many, you just go outside of your home.
00:52:23
Speaker
or when you go back to your family, you know, when you come to your home area. Like this is a very different place energetically, like the San Jose area, Silicon Valley, how you go about life, even environmentally. And that's something we realized that our environmental toxins and the load that my wife and my daughter has is nuts. Like we're not going to stay around and we're now starting to realize more and more like having it seen it on test results. It's like, whoa.
00:52:48
Speaker
like all right we need to make a change but realizing that but also energetically or when you have um let's say you do a a journey uh with plant medicine so you go to a very you go into a very very masculine converse or very you said yeah you can say masculine conversation with someone who is let's say a power lifter how do you
00:53:11
Speaker
How do you find your homeostasis? How do you go back to you when you're in an environment that is so, you can say, triggering to you? Right. So I think the best example is the, you know, if you think you've been enlightened, spend a week with your family. Right. The old Rhonda's quote. And I've had, I don't, it's like, there are no mistakes. Right. And, and much of when we move into resonance, we begin to find more and more synchronicities than coincidences, as Carl Jung talked about.
00:53:40
Speaker
But I've had the fortune and challenge of spending a week with my family many times after ceremonies, many times after a week in the jungle, working with Ayahuasca. And it surely is a test. But remember, what we're trying to do is navigate from our quiet center.
00:53:58
Speaker
And we want to come to a place where we're unwavering from the external. It doesn't mean we stick our head in the sands like an ostrich. It means that we're able to see, to look, to hear, but to not be affected by the external circumstances.
Intuition vs. Analysis
00:54:13
Speaker
And part of that requires a great degree of letting go and surrender, letting go of the need to be right, letting go of the need to be heard, letting go of the need to
00:54:23
Speaker
to find some common ground with everyone we've known and loved. And it's always more triggering when it's people that we know. But what Don Miguel Ruiz has said is that anytime you're triggered, it is not because of the other person. It's up to you to solve that trigger, right? He talks about this in mastery of love as well as the four agreements. Own the fucking trigger, it's yours. It is my thing to own. And from that place, if I can come to understand that, oh, I'm triggered, I gotta solve this, I gotta sort it. And then when I come back from a place of calm,
00:54:53
Speaker
and collected, then I can work for resolution so that maybe the person I'm with who I perceived or projected to be triggering me, I can communicate in a way where there is some resolution around that and we can start to see communication change, habit change. The thing that bothers me can be spoken about in a way that's not triggering to the other person because this beautiful analogy that he uses, I think, in four agreements or maybe his mastery of love,
00:55:22
Speaker
In any regard, it's worth reading both books. He says, imagine that we all have these scabs on our bodies. Every inch, every square inch of our skin is covered in a scab. And the ones who are closest to us, our primary partners, our parents, whoever that is, we all know the scab that hurts the worst, the freshest one. And we walk right up and we just pick it right off of their body.
00:55:47
Speaker
And how they respond is not to heal themselves, it's to turn to you and to pick off a scab. And this goes back and forth in the way we communicate and the way we interact with one another. And, you know, just like when he talked about the domestication of man,
00:56:04
Speaker
the beginning of his book and the first time I read that I was like that is some dark shit man isn't domesticated and then years later I reread it and I'm like oh god he's spot on we are fucking domesticated um I had the same reaction to that analogy with the scabs it's like that's not how people interact with one another it's certainly not how people the people you love the most interact with one another
00:56:25
Speaker
And it's entirely true. It can be entirely true. It doesn't mean there's not joy and fucking peak experiences and sex and awesome dancing at Burning Man and all the things that bring us joy, these ecstatic experiences. But most of those interactions do occur that way unless we recognize it and start to work with nonviolent communication and start to soften and not need to be right, but work to come to a place of equanimity so that we can communicate better
00:56:52
Speaker
Something that Mary Margrave talked about with me was a great teacher. She's at the website soul-attumance.com. Highly recommend people check her out. She's an intuitive out of Sedona, but she spoke to me about this feminine archetype coming through emotion. She talked about these layers of anger, right? So in a state of rage, rage aims to destroy.
00:57:14
Speaker
As that shifts down to unclean anger, unclean anger contains blame and resentment, and it aims to hurt the other. This is where most people operate when communicating, certainly online. This is where people are operating. Blame and resentment that aims to hurt another. And if we're able to drop down one final layer into a place of peace and equanimity, not shoving anger away, but actually staying with it because it's a signal. This is the way the feminine from within is communicating to us, something's off.
00:57:44
Speaker
When we come to clean anger, we aim for resolution without blame, without resentment, without trying to destroy. And as we work with anger, which is inherent in all of us, we're not getting rid of it. It's there for a reason. It's one of our gifts as human beings to have that emotion. As we work with that correctly, we can begin to communicate more effectively. We can begin to find some common ground.
00:58:08
Speaker
And we can let go of all the other shit, you know, it's still a work in progress. I'm not flawless with my parents, not by any means, especially when I have them here. It's like, this fucking my roof now, you know, like, don't talk to my kids that way. Don't give my kid candy. Don't do, don't unravel this, this beautiful system I've created. You know, it's my, don't fuck up what I've got going on. Um,
00:58:31
Speaker
But the point being that we always have this beautiful work in progress. We always have this ability to circle back to the things from a greater level of awareness. They talk about this with the ever unfolding spiral as we evolve and our consciousness and awareness expands. We get to circle back to past trauma at different intervals of our life.
00:58:55
Speaker
And this came up for me in my 25th ayahuasca ceremony where I really spent the whole night unpacking more stuff with the way that I was raised. And I was like, why is that still there? I mean, I've done ayahuasca with both my parents. Why am I fucking revisiting this right now? And it was this idea that I could come back to it
00:59:13
Speaker
later on and there would be more to uncover, not more weeds to pull out of the garden, but that the weeds were actually seeds within me. And as I discovered them, I could water them, I could nurture them, I could give them light, I could give them love, I could give them nutrients. And with that, that would help my consciousness continue to flower. So these are always opportunities. When you're around your parents and you have this unsolved riddle of how to operate with them and they are a little older and maybe a little more stuck in their ways,
00:59:42
Speaker
Can we offer them compassion? Can we meet them where they're at? Can we let go of the need to be right? And can we find ways to enjoy our time with them? Can we find ways to enjoy our time with anybody really? We have to find that. We have to find ways to coexist with one another. And these little microcosms of the macrocosm, they're fucking there every single day. That is the log that's in the center of the road that we get to get out and move.
01:00:11
Speaker
Are we gonna get out of the truck and move that thing and get back in and just go about our day? Or are we gonna get out of the truck and motherfuck this and I don't wanna move this log and it's too heavy? Eckhart totally talked about that, this line of polarity that exists from resistance to what is moving into acceptance. And from there, moving into enjoyment, to be in joy. And from there, moving into enthusiasm, which translates into being in God, right? Inspired in spirit.
01:00:40
Speaker
And we only get to that place when we climb that ladder. And he uses the example of it's pouring rain and you get a blowout tire. You got to get outside and fucking change the tire.
01:00:51
Speaker
You can go about that with curse words like I'm throwing out and kick the car and say, I'm not doing it. I'm calling AAA and just be heated about it. And it can ruin your day. Or you can say, no, this is what I have to do right now. I have a flat tire. I gotta change the tire. I gotta go to the tire shop and get a new one. And it changes your day. But how you respond to that is entirely up to you.
01:01:13
Speaker
So you're not gonna be an enjoyment when that happens. You're not gonna be an enthusiasm when that happens, but can I accept this? Well, yeah, that's my choice. That's the free will. That's the beauty of my own inner sovereignty is to say yes to what it is. And if I say yes to what is, I've already had a prerequisite to letting go of what is. I've already had a prerequisite to letting go of the thing that I would normally say, man, this sucks, but it's okay, and I can do it.
01:01:39
Speaker
And if I can let go of that, this shouldn't be like Ted Decker says stop shooting on yourself, right? This is, this is. And if we come to that place of what is, and we say yes to it and accept it, that makes it much easier than to move maneuver up the ladder to enjoyment and enthusiasm.
01:01:56
Speaker
So, I mean, incredible wisdom, truly, and going into those states and those readings, the philosophy, the listening, the feeling has been, I mean, such an amazing journey the last year and a half for me. But also doing it, I found myself becoming
01:02:22
Speaker
very slow in taking action, very contemplative. It triggered things from my past of being very analytical and not doing something if I did not feel like doing it because I thought it was intuition. There's still a fine line of understanding what do I feel, what is right for me and what is my body telling me versus what is me being lazy. It's just a human lazy and also what is my intuition.
01:02:48
Speaker
That is, yeah, let's start by unpacking that. How do you unpack that yourself within you? Yeah, so I think whether it's meditation, plant medicine, or any of these things that bring us into quiet mind and higher levels of consciousness or deeper levels of awareness of self, they start to strengthen that core. They're building a bridge, right? So you build that bridge to the high self, to the soul, whatever you want to call that, to the demon, to use Jung's words.
01:03:17
Speaker
That is our intuition. That's what speaks to us. And it's a felt experience. It might pop up as a thought, but how it changes how you feel is the recognition, right? It's something Mary told me. She's like, when you recognize something as possible intuition, what is the feeling that is attached to it? If it's just a thought, there will be no feeling.
01:03:42
Speaker
That's not intuition. That's a thought. If you feel with certainty in a sense of knowing and there's a response within the body to that, odds are that's putting you on track. And if it's a feeling of fear, which we've all been living in, fear is what? False evidence appearing real.
01:04:02
Speaker
Right? Danger is real. Tiger chasing you is real shit. You're probably not going to run a tiger. So you're not probably not listening to this podcast. Thankfully, we don't have to deal with that very much with most of the people listening to this podcast. Danger is different than fear. So if we come to recognize we're in a state of fear, we need to sit with it. And then we need to understand there is something different. There is a different way. That's not intuition. But intuition, if I if I feel called to do a plant medicine, or I feel like
01:04:33
Speaker
A conversation is not going the way I know it can, and I can be better about it, and there's a recognition of that. That can be an intuitive gut moment where I'm like, oh shit, you know what, I'm sorry, let me take a step back, I'm doing this wrong. How I'm showing up to this conversation right now is some old patterning. I can feel that welling up inside.
01:04:54
Speaker
And it's not the way I wish to be right now. That's a way that we can work with intuition in real time. But intuition really does come up for us in those quiet moments. It comes up on a walk where we're reflective and then we just clear the mind. We stop thinking when we just start walking and looking at nature. It comes up to us when we're sitting under a tree. It comes up to us when we're meditating. It comes up to us
01:05:16
Speaker
when we've done our reflecting of the day's work prior to laying in bed and in the final moments before we go to sleep. So if I'm, I've talked about this before, if you want to enhance sleep, you know, you talk about all these biohacks and chili pads and shit like that. It's like, cool. But if you don't think about your day and reflect upon it before you lie down, it's the first time you get to think about your day is when you hit the sheets. Good luck falling asleep.
01:05:39
Speaker
You're gonna lie there and you're gonna process, right? We all have to process the day each day. So if you create a little space for that during the day at the end of the day, after your meal, you go for a walk after dinner, things like that, however you wanna cut that up.
01:05:52
Speaker
You give yourself time for contemplation. Now, when you hit the sheets, you're going to have a lot easier time falling asleep. And it's in that pre-dream state where we really can tap in. It's where we get this wonderful muse of creativity that flows in, and we can intuit what the next track is. We can start to imagine what tomorrow looks like and what the next days look like, and we can imagine a better way that we could have lived through today. All of that's there, and it's all accessible.
01:06:21
Speaker
you know, really, you know, for me between meditation and reflection, plant medicines have been one of the greatest teachers in building that bridge for me to understand like, when I say yes, and I listen to this and retroactively looking back in hindsight on any of these, these biggest decisions that I've ever made in my life, I can credit them to the experiences that led me there, all of those occurred with plant medicines.
01:06:45
Speaker
What has come up for me is stoicism and there is a lot to unpack there and that I'm curious to hear your thoughts on the concept of
01:06:59
Speaker
Character is one of the main points that they bring up. And knowing where you stand for your virtues, and having a solid character and not being swayed by situations, circumstances, being in a state of equanimity at all times, the highest state of that being a sage, being unfuckable of circumstances, reasons, people, you know who you are so well that no one can touch you.
01:07:25
Speaker
But there's also a state of indifference. It doesn't matter what happens. I will still be who I am and therefore not truly allowing my feelings because feelings can be deceiving and passion is deceiving.
01:07:40
Speaker
How have you, what are your thoughts on that concept and stoicism? This is brilliant. I agree with a lot of it and I disagree with a lot of it. Feelings are pointers, right? Like one of the first things Eckhart Tolle talks about in the New Earth is that everything he's saying is a pointer. It's not the thing. It's not God itself. It's not spirit itself or consciousness itself. They're just pointers pointing us in the right direction to that discovery for ourselves.
01:08:06
Speaker
Right, and so just as any guru that tells you, you know, when I was 13, this is when I dissolved my ego and I was selected by the 86 dollar, fuck all that noise. It's impossible, right? Like we, you do not exist here in 3D reality without having both a higher level of consciousness and a self. And that self, even though you can dissolve it from time to time, from meditation to plant medicine or anything in between or flow states, right?
01:08:35
Speaker
Another way to dissolve that stealing fire with Jamie Will and Stephen Kotler talks about it. It's meant to be here. We're just meant to work with it differently, right? We're meant to have the ego in the passenger seat, not in the driver's seat. And if we can come to that place, then all of the feelings, they can be beautiful things because they can point us back to our center. They can point us back to when something's off. That helps us be unwavering. Our reaction to things,
01:09:07
Speaker
is something that can be unwavering as well, but that takes mastery. And so, you know, with what you brought up to not have passion or to not have feelings, I think that's a pointless existence. It's not why we chose to come into 3D reality. If we wanted to fucking be there, we'd just hang out in spirit form and not have sex and not have feeling and not have any of this shit, not taste food, not do the thing, right? We're here to do the thing, to experience all of it and to recognize that all of it is a part of the experience.
01:09:35
Speaker
So it's not to discard those things and to say like, ah, I'm gonna come to this noble fucking brick wall. And that's what I'm gonna be. Like, good luck trying. And secondarily, like, that's not why we elected to be here. Can we operate better? Fuck yeah. Is that never ending? Yes, it is. That is the never ending unfolding of what consciousness is. And you can look at that through the negative of like,
01:10:02
Speaker
What's the fucking point then, if it's just a never ending process? Or you can say yes to it. You can say, cool. Because as I do it, I get better. As I lean into that and I learn, I get better. And the thing about all these great Stoic teachers is really circling back to the training for that.
01:10:22
Speaker
You know, how do I step into this place? Aubrey calls it the lens zone, you know, this, this giant structure they had in Chavin in Peru that would ground, you know, the, the fifth dimensional beings to 3d reality, the Christ consciousness, the Buddha level consciousness. And when you went on your journeys with what Chuma or San Pedro, it would be your grounding core to the earth.
01:10:42
Speaker
and as above so below as within so without you would you would have that as a grounding cord this land zone that was unwavering and yes there are times when we can embody that and the goal is to be unwavering to find the eye of the hurricane to sit through all of the storms but that mastery is ever unfolding and what you find is
01:11:04
Speaker
life will serve you whether you're looking for it actively or not whether you're like I'm going to do some shadow work and I'm bringing all my shit to ayahuasca or a bug or any of these harder challenging medicines. That's fine. Even if you say no, I'm good. I'm healed. I'm just going to do my work and I'm just going to be here right now. Life continues to throw curve balls.
01:11:23
Speaker
and we always get these beautiful lessons and we keep getting the same lesson over and over again until we master that lesson and then there's new lessons. We might have peace and equanimity for a while but even the monk that hangs out on the mountain his entire life is still going to face shit. That's the nature of reality while we're here and we can say yes to that.
01:11:45
Speaker
But it's not to say that we're ever going to come to this place where we no longer have to experience curveballs. We always have those curveballs. And I would say if we understand the feminine archetypes, if we understand what feeling is and why it's there and what it's showing us, what a beautiful teacher that can be. You know, think of when stoicism was around. Was the feminine honored?
01:12:08
Speaker
not so much no not at all not not not in the least bit right maybe behind closed doors it was but certainly not on the surface certainly not culturally right and if we can honor the feminine we come to understand that that is there are some serious teachings there there are some there's a lot of value in saying yes to that and softening and feeling into those feelings and that's balance that's that's that's um
01:12:33
Speaker
That's really what wholeness is. All of that exists within us, the masculine and the feminine exists within every single person on this planet. We may choose one or the other from a body standpoint before we arrive. We may choose to lean one direction or another for a while as we push to one extreme or the other. And that's all fine. All of that's helping us find our center.
01:12:57
Speaker
So this is my journey back from going from the feminine to more of the healthy masculine and that's diving into first was the Spartan Society and there's more of a you can say reverence of the feminine there but it's very much in a masculine way.
01:13:16
Speaker
of how they were very empowered women, but there are more equal rights. But what was very prominent, and that's why I'm very been going into ancient Greek philosophy a lot, it was how they held physical stature equally high to mental stature as well. And that's something, well, of course,
01:13:37
Speaker
the Spartan society very much, they were heavy on the physical side, but going into the Stoicism is going back to what is right over what's fast, easy or comfortable, like choosing integrity, choosing your character above what things you might pop up because such a hard delineation to make what it is that actually is coming up.
01:13:55
Speaker
That is also going into, now I'm starting to pull back more of the intuitive part, more of the feeling part, and going into, even if you reflect upon, let's say Tony Robbins, so let's say The Secret, or any of those teachings that are similar when you have, okay, manifest, have your goals, and then take massive action.
01:14:18
Speaker
take massive actions and we're such a goal-oriented society and you're speaking to it right now what I call soul lesson I've been about that for a large part of my life obsessively chasing goals next thing to the next thing and barely feeling any joy because there's a constant chase and constantly just measuring myself based off what I can achieve
01:14:41
Speaker
This soul lesson is the biggest part when I had to slow down. And now that I continue to slow down, it's not necessarily always what I want, but what I'm here to learn. What comes up to you in your life when it comes to achieving goals versus even setting an intention? And how do you look at that? And how do you go about new things in your life and what you want to do?
01:15:06
Speaker
Yeah, so all this from Despenza backwards when it comes to how we create in the world, there are some great teachers.
Manifesting Dreams and Goals
01:15:16
Speaker
Despenza learned from guys like Neville Goddard. I forget the name of the guy he wrote as a man. Thinketh, very small book, super easy to read. But it really talks about that. One thing Despenza really bridged in one of his talks for me that helped was
01:15:31
Speaker
You know it's interesting I had Tim Corcoran on the podcast I'll get back to dispense but Tim Corcoran who's an amazing medicine man and has studied under Native American culture for many, many years in his life he's done dozens of video quest no food no water for four days. Brilliant, brilliant dude one of my dear brothers.
01:15:47
Speaker
He said on the podcast that the Institute of Noetic Sciences had studied all transformation from plant medicines to psychology and therapy and anything that seemed to have worked. So whatever the tool was, it had to work. And what they were looking for were any common traits that were used in any of these things that worked. And there was two, there was two of them. Intention and surrender were the two.
01:16:16
Speaker
We've learned about these things. Anybody that's done plant medicines has learned these things either viscerally or through the people that help organize the ceremonies for them. But what Despenza said about these is how you work with these two is it's really important. You set your intention of what you wish to make manifest in the world. What are you creating here as a co-creator on this planet? That is your intention. You can write it down. You can speak it into existence. Both are valuable.
01:16:46
Speaker
What you do with surrender then is you surrender the how and when that comes. What we get so caught up in is the I want it now five-year-old mentality, or I wanted a certain way and I want it now. And it has to be this way. And if we get so narrow in that focus, we don't allow for all the ways that God, the universe, consciousness, whatever you want to call that, can bring this in in a different way that likely will be better than the way you've imagined it.
01:17:16
Speaker
If you leave the door open and you surrender to the how it happens and the when it happens, you allow for something even better than what you would imagine to come in. That's still satisfying what your intention or goal is. And truthfully, this idea of one goal to the next, I think that is,
01:17:40
Speaker
through the seed of comparison. It's through the seed of I know myself through comparison and to a degree that's true, but it's really a cultural thing. It's conditioning we had on, you know, from a very young age in school.
01:17:54
Speaker
to how am I, how do I stand against my peers? You know, it has nothing to do with that. What we dream into as co-creators is the biggest picture of all. And what Paul Czech talks about with Dr. Happiness, you know, he talks about it in Bolton's books, The Last Four Doctors You'll Ever Need, and How to Eat, Move, and Be Healthy. With Dr. Happiness is, is your dream big enough?
01:18:17
Speaker
Jaco willing talked about this in a kid's book, the way the warrior kid, you know, he told his nephew, Mark, he goes, Oh, good, you're bored. boredom only happens when the goal or the dream isn't big enough. How could you be bored if your dream was big enough? Right. And so the dream supersedes any particular goals that you have, that would meet certain stages or levels of that dream, but you have to dream a bigger dream.
01:18:43
Speaker
And with that never-ending dream, you can have these little benchmarks. We call goals where you check off boxes and you continue climbing up the ladder, but there's a celebration point in all of that. Tim Corcoran talked about the Native American spirit wheel, and I know we're running out of time, so I just want to drop this in. It's a compass. It's a guidepost. They've used these from North America to Central America to South America, and they're all different. But the basic synopsis of his is the North equates to the winter time.
01:19:13
Speaker
and equates to the eagle or the condor, this big bird medicine that sees from up high and down low and can look out into the future and deep into the past and has a greater degree of awareness. This is where our responsibility lies.
01:19:25
Speaker
This is fatherhood, motherhood. This is the jobs we have to do. It's getting shit done. In the East, the springtime, the butterfly comes out, we plant seeds, the intention. What is it that I wish to create in the world? It's what I'm drawing in. The South, summertime, harvest, play, celebration of the body. Play, celebration of the body.
01:19:50
Speaker
The west, fall, autumn, that's the shadow work. That's the removing of things that no longer serve me.
01:19:57
Speaker
That compass, very briefly, is a way we can operate. If we get so caught up in doing shit, getting it done, because this is my responsibilities and I gotta do it and I don't have time for anything else. And then we go to the East and we say, oh, I got this goal, this goal, this goal, this goal. But I never remember to play or celebrate the body or to enjoy the harvest of all the fruits and everything that I've planted. What's the fucking point? There's no point to it, right?
01:20:25
Speaker
And if we're so caught up in plumbing, how many kids out there, this is me in college, like it's play all day. I'm fucking smoking weed all day. I'm going out on the weekends and I'm not planting seeds of anything. I'm not looking at my shadow. I'm not doing any of this other work. I have no responsibilities. It's all play. And look, there's different phases of our lives where we might hang out in one of these sectors.
01:20:45
Speaker
but this doesn't need to follow the annual cycle. There's different points when we look back where we'll see, man, I spent a lot of time healing myself or I spent a lot of time getting shit done. But we have to navigate that and we have to look at, it's as simple as a quarter turn, clockwise or counterclockwise. Let me step into a new state of being with a new focus. Where have I neglected myself the most? And for a lot of people right now, that is play.
01:21:11
Speaker
It is the celebration. It is hanging out with loved ones and hugging them and being face to face with them. It's human interaction. And if we can circle back to that, that makes all the other shit better. It gives us a why behind the work. That's it. Without that, there's no reason to live. There's no reason to continue to have goals. And so if we remember that singular piece, as adults,
01:21:38
Speaker
that's an important piece to remember. And if we're younger and we're hanging out in the play zone and it's always summer, just remember it's cool for a little while, but that gets old too if we're not continuing to bring new things in, if we're not looking at the things that no longer serve us, and if we're not getting the stuff done that we need to get done on a daily basis.
Conclusion and Reflections
01:21:57
Speaker
Kyle, I think that's a phenomenal way to wrap it all up. And just having you here, thank you. I come out of every talk we have with at least 10 books to research, look into, and so many different quotes and people. So I know that all the listeners are gonna have a wonderful time. Probably need to really listen a few times just to understand some of the concepts. Thank you, you brought it. Thank you, brother. I love you, Sebastian. Love you, too.
01:22:27
Speaker
every time he freaking brings it Kyle is just a powerhouse of knowledge and the depth that he can go into as well and he experiences it he's not just speaking to it but he has depth in his experiences of feeling what it feels like if you want to learn more
01:22:49
Speaker
Check out the show notes. We have his link to his podcast and we can find him, listen to his podcast and he dropped some very interesting content. So get ready to have your minds blown and thank you for tuning in. Sending you much love.