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#37 Zack Height | Handstands, Gymnastics and Mobility
13 Plays1 year ago
A captivating conversation about gymnastics, calisthenics, mobility, stretching, training, fitness, mindset, CrossFit, programming and simplicity. How is it possible to be so incredibly fit and well rounded like Zack when all he does is handstands? We get into this as well as tips, tricks, training methods and his training philosophy.
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ZACK HEIGHT:
⚡️ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/zackheight/?next=%2F
⚡️ Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@heightperformance
⚡️ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/zack.height
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SEBASTIAN ENGSTROM
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Transcript
The Meditative and Frustrating Nature of Training
00:00:00
Speaker
Some days when training is going well, like it's super quiet in the mind and almost meditative, kind of like the ideal of what you might think if you watch someone doing handstands and they're moving really smoothly, you just must like think that, oh, they're so calm. But then other days, because I'm always trying to push my limits,
00:00:18
Speaker
I'm throwing my handstand blocks across the gym, across the parking lot, outside of the gym, and throwing a temper tantrum. And you don't get to see that, because that's not the type of stuff we post on the internet for people to see as we encourage them to train with us. Today, Zach Hite joins me. He is a master coach, I would call him that, in calisthenics, gymnastics, body weight movement, stretching. He sometimes refers to as the guy that does handstands, a handstand man.
00:00:47
Speaker
what he only does for training is hand stance, which is darn fascinating. Talk about simplicity. Talk about focusing on the one thing. We get into his training philosophy, why he does what he does. Him and I have crossed paths quite a few times before we collaborated. He's probably one of the, if not the most knowledgeable person within training that I know.
00:01:11
Speaker
I take a lot of knowledge and inspiration from him. He got me challenged during the podcast. And that takes quite a bit to do training wise. And I think you will love this if you're into training, if you're into calisthenics, especially body weight, gymnastics, we go deep.
Welcoming Zach Hite and His Training Philosophy
00:01:32
Speaker
And Zach is phenomenal at it, even CrossFit. I mean, that's both for our foundation to some degree.
00:01:38
Speaker
So enjoy this podcast with Zach Kite, number 37. Zach.
00:01:44
Speaker
amazing to have you on it's been a long time coming finally the what should I say if the gift is out to be revealed to the world in my opinion in my eyes I call you a master trainer you're more humble yourself Zach who are you and what do you do like what what change are you making in this world in a short summary we'll kick it off from there
00:02:09
Speaker
Sebastian, it's good to be here. First, let me say that I know you've been trying to get me on here forever. So I'm excited to be here and excited to do this podcast with you. Who I am. Gosh, I'm just like a regular guy who really likes training and exercise and just like physical movement.
00:02:28
Speaker
Right now, what I do is I coach online, so I help people kind of build their bodies up or build their bodies back, build mobility, learn handstands, learn coordinated type movements, whether that be like juggling or spine waves or more traditional types of exercise like squats, lunges, deadlifts, and my handstands, like I mentioned. So that's kind of the short version of what I do.
00:02:56
Speaker
So the way we got connected was, I don't know how many years ago now, but this is back in Palo Alto, CrossFit, Amity. And the amount of care and lack, or lack, I should say, the detail, the attention to detail you had is something that I haven't witnessed before, and I'm pretty hard
Zach's Coaching Approach and Philosophy
00:03:18
Speaker
-headed.
00:03:18
Speaker
But you pointed things out and that humbled me pretty greatly. And in my opinion that takes a great coach. And you've evolved since then quite a bit. It's been an interesting journey. But still to this day it's fascinating to see in your profession
00:03:37
Speaker
for you to change and shift and grow the way you have because it's easy to okay claim that alright I've made it fairly high and across it community I'm good at what I do and let's continue there's way more to you and what I'm fascinated about is that to to a regular person I don't like you don't strike me or maybe maybe not someone else as a spiritual person but to me
00:04:06
Speaker
As I'm observing you more and your movements like there's there's great Just presence and presence is one of the things that why I started calisthenics and body movement myself is that the extreme presence of the moment the extreme connection to the body to the now and going to any type of you can say especially like Buddhism like being right here right now is essential into that and
00:04:32
Speaker
I might be taking it in a different direction. I'm curious as a lead question into that. When you are doing what you're doing, what does that feel like? That's an interesting question because it changes so much day-to-day.
00:04:51
Speaker
I guess from a similar side how you got into cow stinks for kind of like a deeper meaning. I always liked like the technical aspects of movement. I grew up playing baseball and I would love to just sit in the batting cages after practice. The coach would leave us a key for the people who wanted to work extra and just literally hit until the sun went down, whether it was off a tee or if I could talk someone who was staying with me. And I was never like the best baseball player but
00:05:16
Speaker
I think that I was probably with the knowledge that I had probably the best baseball player I was going to become even though there's plenty of people way more talented and Way smarter about how they were able to train than me so it was a natural evolution like going through CrossFit and CrossFit having the
Zach's Background and Training Challenges
00:05:34
Speaker
technical elements of Olympic weightlifting combined with
00:05:37
Speaker
semi gymnastic stuff like muscle ups where if you were a skilled athlete who was maybe a little skinnier like myself you could compete well against some of the bigger stronger guys and of course they would have the advantage on some things and in the middle right there'd be more
00:05:52
Speaker
cardiovascular stuff that was, unless there was a big size difference, you were pretty even on. And so with that kind of perspective, I was naturally drawn to some of the more technical elements of gymnastics and handstands in particular, really became something that I just wanted to get quite good at. And as I got more into handstands,
00:06:13
Speaker
I realized like my flexibility was poor. I had a lot of imbalances from left to right. Um, most likely from playing baseball because I batted through right handed. So I was really good at turning left, but turning right and bending, right. Um, just doesn't really happen at all for me. So by getting into this more technical style of training, where it's more about how you do it than what you do.
00:06:37
Speaker
really gave me something to just dive deep into and completely occupy my mind. And so kind of like getting to your question of what it's like to train, how I said it's different depending on the day. Some days when training is going well, like it's super quiet in the mind and almost meditative.
00:06:54
Speaker
Kind of like the ideal of what you might think if you watch someone doing handstands and they're moving really smoothly Usually must like think that oh, they're so calm. But then other days because I'm always trying to push my limits You know, I'm like throwing my handstand blocks across the gym across the parking lot outside of the gym and like throwing a temper tantrum and you know, you don't get to see that because that's not the type of stuff we post on on the internet for See as we encourage them to train with us
00:07:21
Speaker
But it can be incredibly frustrating. And that's also a big element of what I wanted to do with my gymnastics training is because I was coaching so many people for so many years in movements that I was so familiar with that conceptually I knew that it's frustrating to learn.
00:07:42
Speaker
But I'd forgotten the feeling of what it's like to actually struggle and fight and like not be able to physically do something that the coach is telling you to do. So by embracing the one arm handstand journey, I have found plenty of frustration and remember very clearly what it's like to to be a beginner again. Where are you currently at in that journey with the one hand on hands? I've been working on it for about two and a half years. I got started seriously on the one arm handstand journey and
00:08:13
Speaker
June 2020, when the gyms kind of closed for COVID, I was like, all right, now it's time to get serious. I had some weights at home, but it just wasn't as fun lifting. Without my buddies, I got like a weight training partner, my buddy Ken, who's super strong. We normally would train together. But with the COVID stuff, you know, I'm working out in the park alone.
00:08:31
Speaker
and started to take on the one arm hand stance. So it's been two and a half years. My best on the left side is 10 seconds. My best on the right is 13 seconds. That might sound pretty good, but for like the level that I'd like to get at, I would still say that I'm very much on like the front end of the journey. I'd love to, if I can stay healthy and you know, everything stays
00:08:53
Speaker
Smooth and according to plan, you know train handstands for the next 20 years and just keep you know gradual improvement along the way It's pretty low impact. You have to train frequently. So there's good opportunities to hurt yourself but in general like the training of the handstands itself and then the preparation for mobility and moving well and being very efficient is very conducive to just a long-term training plan and
00:09:16
Speaker
Yeah, that's been one of the greatest challenges that I've started realizing is I started
Functional Strength vs. Traditional Weight Lifting
00:09:25
Speaker
when I was younger it was all I mean for so many people it's all about lifting the most weight and getting the biggest muscles.
00:09:33
Speaker
And then I realized there are certain movements. I'm able to lift a weight exactly how I lift the weight. But if I need to balance something slightly off, like let's say in real world, I am almost fairly weak, like not that much stronger than other people. I'm like,
00:09:53
Speaker
shit this is embarrassing like i have all these muscles i can lift whatever how many pounds in a deadlift or a squat or a bench but when it comes to ordinary barbell shape and everything yeah exactly yeah but but then when you're doing the regular type of day stuff um or like i remember being wrestled down by one of my best friends because he sized me up when i came back from the u.s one year
00:10:18
Speaker
He's like, oh you think you're so big. He just took me down. I'm like fuck man like how how I think that's one of the greatest things that I think the path that I'm on right now, how do you make your your strength functional in ordinary life like you you can if anything were to happen like I would take such great pride in like let's say if we're hiking my wife and I on a trail and
00:10:43
Speaker
And there's a tree that's falling down. I'm like, oh yeah, time to get to action and moving that tree. And no one else is able to move that tree. And I'm like, okay, thank you deadlifts. But then when it comes to moving a person or moving my own body weight, I couldn't do it. And that's how I started more on the kinosthenics route based in combination with the meditative.
00:11:06
Speaker
Because I realize if I'm able to just bang out the reps and get the adrenaline rushing, I'm in the zone. But then it's not so applicable to anything else in my life. I'm like, okay, this is becoming a crutch that I'm using, but I'm not a holistic person.
00:11:26
Speaker
So I feel like there's so much of the mind in the same time that you train when you're when you're doing calisthenics And it's it's also I mean there's there's been several studies. I remember especially one talk that His name is Ben Greenfield. He was he's considering himself fairly fit and he was at this Expo and there was this fitness competition and he thought okay I'll beat this guy like any guy who shows up and
00:11:53
Speaker
and the guy who won the competition ahead of Ben Greenfield only did a very advanced version of yoga with a lot of long static holds and this is what I'm realizing now having done this for over two years is
00:12:10
Speaker
What I what I needed to do with barbells and heavy weights I'm able to accomplish at least for upper-bodied and lower body that there's there's no getting away from in my opinion Sometimes every weights, but but the upper body static holds is freaking king So I'm going off a bit of a tangent here, but it's it's to it's to it's to highlight the I think the
00:12:36
Speaker
what what i used to see what a lot of people might see as that calisthenics is all it's only for for people have done things for a long time all i will get skinny a week if i do it uh... maybe you can share your journey what it's been like for you because you can still put up some pretty heavy heavy weights even though you only do handstands as you call yourself the handstand guy
00:12:56
Speaker
Yeah, semi-respected hand balancer on Instagram. Maybe I'm semi-respected now, I don't know yet. I'm working towards semi-respected, hopefully one day. You brought up some really good points, just about a variety of training. And so, kind of going back to what you were talking about, lifting with a bar, I felt very similar.
00:13:16
Speaker
through my journey with Olympic weightlifting, right? If I nailed a snatch or a clean, perfectly, it's like my body didn't even feel it, right? Like stretch reflex, everything is lined up, bones are stacked, stand up, no problem. But just like a little bit off and it's like ice picks in the knees, back is tweaked for three weeks, can't tie my shoes. And like a lift where if you watched in the video, like you wouldn't even say that I did anything wrong.
00:13:42
Speaker
So like that kind of feeling of like this can't be good for me, right? Like I'm not even 30 years old. I'm already feeling like this, like this can't be good. And so that.
00:13:54
Speaker
really led me to wanting to kind of make that change into something different. Can you kind of refresh me on the end part of the question? I was kind of latched onto that part and just wanted to bring that up. Yeah. When you're in your training,
Redefining Health Beyond Traditional Metrics
00:14:14
Speaker
I guess it's okay to jump off a different tangent. I guess my question is, yeah, is
00:14:23
Speaker
actually let's let's bring it back to your post of of that i referred to on instagram when you said in in 2019 you went into uh you started realizing what you were saying right now with weight lifting like you you you were not healthy anymore like to yeah or you realize you're not healthy to any regular person they're like you're freaking insane like look at you zach like you look like a beast you lift a bunch of weights
00:14:48
Speaker
How are you not healthy? Like, can you tell us about why you consider yourself not being healthy and the realizations that you made back then?
00:14:56
Speaker
Yeah, so how do you define health, right? Like our health is health, the markers on a test that the doctor gives you, or is health your ability to move in the environment, is health how you feel, right? Is it a combination of all of these things? And I think it's a combination of many factors. And so for me, when I was saying that I wasn't healthy, it was basically like I could do these very specific tasks
00:15:25
Speaker
But like, you know, it took me an hour to get warmed up. And then afterwards, when I cooled back down, I felt terrible. And like, you know, I'm not a scientist or a biologist or anything like that. But I know enough about the human body to understand like, how the wear and tear builds up and how over long periods of time, if you just keep
00:15:45
Speaker
Hammering something and keeping joints inflamed They're gonna become arthritic. They're gonna become stiff and tight and as you get older, you're gonna be hollowing around Like someone who's been in a ton of motorcycle crashes but all I've all I would have done was just like lift weights like a bonehead and so like I Guess just like a part of getting older, right? You start thinking about time in a different way and what's important to you? Today
00:16:15
Speaker
changes very much compared to like what's important to you today when you're you know 22 years old right what's important to you today when you're 22 is probably like something that's going to happen 15 minutes from now whereas like now i'm 38 years old so what's important to me today it's like i'm plotting out like 5 10 15 20 years in the future and even further um what do i want to do what do i want to accomplish how do i want to feel when i do it
00:16:40
Speaker
And so thinking about being unhealthy was just that concept of being in constant pain and understanding that I knew what I was doing and still just like banging my head against the wall anyway, just because I had these arbitrary goals of wanting to squat 400 pounds. And my best back squat ever was 180 kilos, which is 396 pounds back around 2014 or 15.
00:17:05
Speaker
And you know like four years later. I'm still like struggling to like try to make this happen And it's just like what's what's the point right like no one cares? No, like though like if I tell someone I squatted 396 versus 400 like are they not gonna be my friend anymore like it was completely irrational and I Don't know if you've trained a lot before like this what I'm saying might make sense
00:17:30
Speaker
And if not, you may be like, was this guy even talking about? Why would you ever care what your numbers are? Wouldn't you just want to feel good? They probably wouldn't be listening too long into this podcast, regardless. So beak out. Yeah, that's true. So if you're still here, you kind of get what I'm talking about.
00:17:47
Speaker
But yeah, it just came down to like, the reason I got into CrossFit in the first place is because like, I wanted to be healthy and fit. And so I started to really analyze like, what is healthy? What is fit? And so for me, like, that's feeling good. That's being in a position where your mind is open and you're learning. It's
00:18:11
Speaker
all those blood markers and all that stuff, right? So you're sleeping well, eating healthy, and you're not about to have a heart attack and all that stuff. But mainly for me, it's just about learning and teaching my body to do things in the most efficient way possible so that I'm always growing.
00:18:33
Speaker
rather than just like a spearhead fired in one direction. I'm like this growing, expanding bubble that's like constantly expanding into like a wider birth of knowledge and capacity. So you made it to regionals.
00:18:54
Speaker
Do you mind telling us a little bit about the fuel, the motivation you had back then to make it as far as possible in
Zach's CrossFit Journey
00:19:02
Speaker
CrossFit? And what was that journey like and why did you stop competing? Yeah, so in 2011 I made it to the regionals for the first time and
00:19:17
Speaker
It was fun and exciting training for it at the time. I was pretty new to CrossFit. I started in 2009 and had been semi-aware of the sectionals and the process for going to the CrossFit Games in 2010, but even then I was still pretty much so new.
00:19:34
Speaker
that like I only heard people talking about it and didn't really realize what the process was or what the CrossFit games were or any of that stuff in detail. But then in 2011 was the first year that they did the CrossFit games open, which is an online qualifier. So you could compete at home, film your workouts for review. So when you made it to the games, actually, I don't even think 2011, you maybe didn't even have to film them for review. Maybe you just submitted so long ago.
00:20:05
Speaker
I definitely filmed my last one. It was the Thruster and Chester bar ladder. That one was still on one of my YouTube channels from back in the day. You can see how skinny I was back then. But it was exciting, right?
00:20:21
Speaker
these like barbell movements that I had done in college playing baseball. So I was somewhat familiar with some like power cleans and squats what have you but not necessarily like to full range of motion or anything like that. So CrossFit kind of putting an emphasis on moving well full range of motion. 2011 the
00:20:41
Speaker
good movement that CrossFit was a proponent of was not the best movement by anyone's standards who was involved in the specific sports and not even like to the standards that would probably just be taught in a CrossFit class today but
00:20:56
Speaker
it was fun and exciting and then they had the girls the workouts that were these specific named workouts so that you know you could do the workouts over and over and try to improve at them then compare them with your buddies and see who had the faster times and what have you and kind of how i mentioned earlier some of these workouts were more skill intensive so being like 160 pounds at the time my workout partner was probably 230 pounds and he didn't have the best cardio but on some of like the short heavy workouts
00:21:24
Speaker
He was good at those and he was willing to put himself through the ringer to be able to beat me. So as I learned technique, it was really cool to see that I could beat him in these exercises. And I had no idea how I compared to other really fit people because I was just working out with him and myself. And so when the open came about and I started putting my scores in and finding myself up near the top of the leaderboard for Northern California,
00:21:51
Speaker
is like every feeling imaginable. I was excited, posture syndrome. I was nervous about like what the workouts would be in the regionals if I qualified, all the feelings. And then like, just like the training and training two, three times a day at that point to try to prepare myself. So what was it like when you actually made it there? How would you summarize that experience?
00:22:17
Speaker
Um, so fortunately i've played played plenty of sports and I think that helped me a ton because at the first workout, um We're standing on the starting line and You know i'm standing shoulder to shoulder with neil maddox Jason kalipa and gabe subri people who've just like gone to the crossfit games over and over and over again who i've watched on youtube um, you know for that year and a half for whatever that I had been doing in crossfit and rather than being
00:22:47
Speaker
intimidated and kind of getting in the back of the group, I walked right up to the front of the start line and just stood right beside these guys like, fuck it, I'm going to get my best start position.
00:22:56
Speaker
And I ended up beating Jason Kalipa by one second in that workout, which was really cool. Um, it's like the highlight of my CrossFit career. Um, but yeah, it was exciting. And the weekend was tough. Like we had some like epic rain and like we were competing on like a gravel surface. So we ended up with these like giant divoted holes because of the rain and the gravel with the deadlifts. Um, it was a fun experience. It was really taxing on the body. And, uh,
00:23:21
Speaker
Yeah. Some, some of the moments I can remember just like as clear as day for sure. So, so looking back, well, I mean, as there are a lot of people who can attribute, I think quite a bit of their development to CrossFit. I mean, I'm one of them myself and has led me into gymnastics, calisthenics and Olympic weightlifting that I mainly focus on today.
00:23:47
Speaker
If it wouldn't have been for that, I mean there's some of that lifting in college, but there's so much I mean it's brought so much to the world like what what What would you attribute like if you were to give a few shoutouts because I think they deserve it cross it like what what are things you'd like to highlight and if you're doing cross it today, maybe you can give a few pointers tips of advice things to keep in mind and
00:24:11
Speaker
So the most important thing from CrossFit for me, and I think they've always harped on it as a community. I've made some really great friends that are just people that I can go to for advice or that can come to me for advice, places to train when I'm out of town.
00:24:33
Speaker
And then just like cool friends to hang out with, right? Like go places you have stuff to do. So the community aspect I think is probably the absolute.
00:24:44
Speaker
biggest benefit that I've experienced from CrossFit and especially owning a CrossFit gym for a period of time, the variety like we're on this podcast together because of CrossFit, the variety of people that I've been able to meet from various business owners or entrepreneurs, like brilliant software engineers that I was able to interact with and like people that maybe I would have seen as
00:25:15
Speaker
you know better than me or like celebrity kind of level like why would these people want to talk to me understanding just people right it was an opportunity it's so many different people from so many different walks of life and really just experience that you know whatever our backgrounds are wherever we come from however far we've achieved up to this point or however far we're yet to achieve we're all much more similar than different and so maybe that's not anything to do with
00:25:45
Speaker
the specific fitness of CrossFit or anything like that, but I think that's what stands out most to me about my memories and positive experiences with CrossFit for sure.
00:25:57
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. I mean, anytime I travel anywhere, that's my go to is is if I'm staying at least a night or if there's a workout day, then I'm finding the cross the gym wherever I'm at. And it pains me whenever there's not one available.
00:26:16
Speaker
or if I'm in the bay area and the freaking prizes are $250 for a month and I cheap bay man you're going to yeah I um I was in Denmark I've been there several times here over the last few over the year and I think they charged was it 50 or 60 bucks a month
00:26:39
Speaker
I'm like, how are you able to be so cheap? I think it's one of the bigger CrossFit gyms in Denmark. I think it's called CrossFit Butcher Box. Shout out to you. Cool gym. And they're like, actually, we're one of the most expensive CrossFit gyms here in Denmark. I'm like, what the fuck? How is this possible?
00:27:03
Speaker
So maybe I should, I don't know if it's giving him a tip or not, but it's interesting to see the massive range, the differences that there can be in price. I went to Oslo a few weeks later and the prices are up there, like probably 150 bucks. Sweden is 150, something like that a month.
00:27:20
Speaker
Um, man, so why are we charging so much here? That's that's gnarly cost of living. Yeah, that's for that's for damn sure yeah Yeah, uh, but I mean but in that what i'm saying is the community aspect is just massive like I feel okay I come home like I I can
00:27:36
Speaker
Feel at ease I feel like I can it just machines bother me to be honest a lot of machines I feel like they take up space and and it's like press pressing the easy button and people check out They're not you leave the awareness at the door. You just go in and do mindless stuff and and I think that's a great transition point to to going into programming and
00:28:01
Speaker
Programming is something I realized at a very early age that if I don't follow a program I get easily hurt because I'm biased for what I like or what I think works and I don't have a coach's eye for myself. I might have some for someone else but not myself. And I keep telling people whoever I come across
00:28:21
Speaker
If they ever ask me, oh, what do you think I should do? I always tell them, follow a program. Like, don't take exercises here and there. For some people it might work, but my main recommendation is always find someone else's program who's really good at what they do. I mean, that's why I gave it a shot myself and I actually teamed up. I mean, you wrote the programming and that's what we did for a while. Like, what's your opinion on programming overall and kind of winging it?
Debunking Training Myths and Setting Goals
00:28:51
Speaker
Oh man, that's such a big question. Um, because there's so many like sides of programming and depending on what you're programming for, um, the, the types of sports, um, there's just like different, different ways that you can think about it. Um, but some of the, to just keep things on like the calisthenics and body weights track. Um,
00:29:15
Speaker
some of the most important things I've seen is like that whole muscle confusion idea that gets perpetuated in magazines and do people read magazines anymore that gets perpetuated online now I suppose would be where that stuff shows up in advertisements wherever the advertisements may be is probably like the biggest lie and the biggest
00:29:41
Speaker
false statement that you're going to see in marketing because if you're constantly changing exercises, you never get good at anything. And I've never really done any research on where this like muscle confusion stuff comes from, but I would have to imagine it came from working with like well-trained athletes.
00:30:01
Speaker
who had built up years and thousands of reps of skilled movement, and then they were able to, you know, change exercises every week and a half, and execute those exercises as well, and make progress because if you
00:30:17
Speaker
movements are similar enough if you Have a good base of training, right? You can do like 12 different types of bench rest in 12 weeks and and make really good progress But if you are a beginner who is like the type of person who's going to see those advertisements and like think they need this muscle confusion stuff You probably can't even do a dumbbell bench rest, right? So like constantly changing this
00:30:42
Speaker
motor pattern, so you just never learn, is going to just be like the biggest waste of time, in my opinion. So that's like, I guess like the first thing that I would want to say about programming. Yeah.
00:31:02
Speaker
What do you think is essential if someone were to be looking for a program? What is essential to look at? What are what are things that you'd pay attention to? So if they're looking for like a template or if they're looking to like work with a coach who's going to program for them.
00:31:21
Speaker
Let's say both. Okay, so I think like step one is to just be clear on your goals. And if you're not clear on your goals, then working with the coach who can like talk to you and kind of understand the things that you're interested in and guide you in directions to help you kind of figure out what your goals are would be super important. Because basically, if you're doing programming, as a coach, if you're writing programming, you need to know
00:31:47
Speaker
at the very least is like two things is like where's the athlete at right now and where do they want to get to in the future right and then like bonus information is how much have they been training how old are they what what is their skill and experience their flexibility when do they need to be to this specific point in their training right if you if you have a what then you need to win also
00:32:09
Speaker
So then you can kind of place all these elements together and then as you go through the programming process you can monitor how fast that they progress through training cycle to training cycle and then you can legitimately plan in like a limbic style four-year training cycles to progress these athletes to specific points so that they can be competitive or skilled and whatever it is that they're
00:32:33
Speaker
Competing it and you can do the same thing. You should do the same thing if you just have regular clients Assume that you're going to have them long term and treat them Like they're an actual athlete right take care of them plan D load cycles plan transition periods work around their schedules so that they can actually make progress without Burning out right I think the common thing with programming is a
00:33:02
Speaker
need to show the athlete or to show the client really fast progress. Cause you think that they might quit if they don't see progress right away. Um, so then you like blast out of the gates and you may get some really good progress early on. But typically that progress is either going to stall or it's going to lead to injuries over the next like six to six to 12 months after that. So I think having a program that has
00:33:31
Speaker
a clear progression that even as
00:33:35
Speaker
someone who's may not know anything about programming that you can see, whether it's just like the way it goes up every week, or you're doing one more set every week, or you started doing 45 pound dumbbell bench press for 10 reps. And at the end of the cycle, you do it for 15 reps, like sort of as simple as that, right? Should be apparent to you, even as a beginner and then deload periods, there should be definitely deload periods in the training. So if you're looking at, at a training plan and you're not really sure
00:34:06
Speaker
what you're looking at, just look for some form of progression and then deload periods. And there's one comment I want to make that I'll hold off on that until I ask you.
00:34:25
Speaker
about there's there's comments you made before about being very specific about your goals not just all right i want to lift heavier in x y and c exercises or i want to get a heavier clean and jerk i want to get a heavier snatch and so forth or i want to get a handstand and i want to get a muscle up and i want to do pistol squats and all
00:34:46
Speaker
let's say the whole so many different goals I've fallen victim to that several times I've still have a few exercises that I like to get better at to keep some type of variety I'm still in that yeah I guess that's a personal question I'll ask you too because if if
00:35:05
Speaker
I'm currently working on handstands. I'm doing quite a bit of muscle ups just because I wanted to get a strict bar muscle up, working on planche, working on front levers. So those are four different exercises to you and then I do Olympic weightlifting on top of that because if I don't get
00:35:29
Speaker
If I don't stimulate my nervous system, I feel like to a degree, with my lower body as well, and don't get compression on my spine, I get very skinny quickly.
00:35:44
Speaker
My question to you is, you have one exercise, more or less, handstands, or one focus area. How are you able to keep a balanced physique? Because as people who have been in the industry for quite some time,
00:36:01
Speaker
there's that general rule of pull double the amount that you push. But there's a whole lot of damn pushing you're doing with handstands. How are you able to keep a balanced physique with so much emphasis on handstands?
00:36:16
Speaker
Um, I would imagine a large part of it must be genetics because I don't put any focus on physique type stuff I just do my training and all my training I call it like skill-based training or quality focus training. It's all about the movement That's the only focus like I don't I don't care what I look like I shouldn't say physique, but I should say Muscle balance like that. They're not imbalances. I
00:36:44
Speaker
Oh, I mean, I'm imbalanced. So if I were to like take my shirt off and do a handstand with my back square to the camera, you would see that like one shoulder is higher than the other. I'm slightly shifted off to the side, especially like in my side bending.
00:36:59
Speaker
you would see that there's a lot of twisting one direction and then the other way there's like also twisting but twisting in a different way. So like I have tons of imbalances still. And the handstand actually, because it's so symmetrical, right, you're just like legit holding yourself up as square as possible. Training the handstand itself is a really good way to work on imbalances.
00:37:23
Speaker
And typically like we're going to be tight with our hands down this way and not tight with our hands up over our head. So unless you're like a lifetime hand balancer who's never done a pull up, it's going to take a long time doing handstands before you do so many handstands that you are in balance from not doing enough pulling, if that makes sense. Hmm. Okay.
00:37:46
Speaker
Interesting so you because usually when I feel like I mean the classic if I did For me bench pressing was a big thing if I start doing bench pressing I tied up like the extended bicep tendon and just Everything starts like the gorilla type of chest like starts happening and I'm super super imbalanced and I get pain very quickly and
00:38:10
Speaker
Do you want to experience anything like that? No, not at all. Yeah, the overhead position is very, very different. And especially for me, because I grew up doing a lot of bench press as well, like you've mentioned. And I'm notoriously just super tight through my chest and my upper back. So all of the handstand work I do and all of like the prep work that I do,
00:38:31
Speaker
is just like a really good emphasis on mobility right so the more handstands I do the more flexible I get and I would imagine like with how tight I am like
00:38:42
Speaker
It's just going to be like, for the next 10 years, I'm just going to keep gradually getting more and more mobile in my upper body as I continue to train these handstands. And I think something else that's important to mention with the handstands is that it's a lot more than just holding a handstand, right? Just like any training program, if you know that your body has deficiencies, you're going to do extra work.
00:39:04
Speaker
to kind of balance and to bring those things to the forefront. So like for me, I know that I have the tight thoracic spine, the tight chest, the tight shoulders. So in my warm up, in my additional mobility training that I do during the day, I'm working on my bridge, I'm working on my thoracic extension, I'm working on opening my chest, I'm working on my external rotators with small dumbbells.
00:39:26
Speaker
And that is part of handstand training. So like when people think of like handstand training, like, oh, that must get boring doing handstand training all the time. Maybe the specific handstand drills will stay the same, especially for myself. Like some of the very specific intricacies of the drills have changed over the past year and a half. But like for all intents and purposes, I've been doing like the exact same handstand drills for the past like 18 months.
00:39:53
Speaker
the exact same ones but flexibility work that i'm doing is changing like the support work for shoulder health always changes the additional strength work and conditioning like working straight arm strength for the planche or front levers pull-ups that's always changing with variety so there happens to be a lot of variety in the training even though like i do an hour of mobility five days a week in the morning and then my handstand workouts like three hours
00:40:22
Speaker
five days a week. So that's like four hours a day. Yeah. So that's like four hours of training that's dedicated to handstands, right? But one of those hours was completely flexibility. And I don't do a single handstand during that time, but I would still consider that like part of my handstand training because if I wasn't
00:40:42
Speaker
doing handstands and didn't need this mobility for these specific skills. It's painful. I have to wake up early, I wake up at four in the morning so I can do my training and then get work done and then go to the gym and have time to fit it all into my day without that overarching desire to be really good at handstands.
00:41:02
Speaker
I don't think that I would really care about the flexibility that much, right? When I did CrossFit and I did Olympic weightlifting, I did enough flexibility to get into an overhead squat, and then I didn't do any more. For me, it's a really good motivator to pursue these other elements of fitness as they relate to the handstand that also
00:41:26
Speaker
has more broad reaching effect, right? And kind of the ideas that I've talked about earlier in this podcast about growing in like a circumferential or spherical way where we're growing out instead of just in one direction has come from seeing the benefits
00:41:41
Speaker
outside of just the handstands from doing this mobility work, where I don't have the back pain that was so common before or the knee pain or any of the little tweaks and stuff are just so, so much more seldom and so much less severe now that at this point, I probably would do the mobility work, but I definitely never would have gotten into it in the first place without that initial just like burning desire for the one arm handstand. With
00:42:17
Speaker
Hmm What has changed then since You were weightlifting like back in 2019 like how how has your and now we're strictly going into your physique Like how has your physique changed since back legs are skinny Yeah, I think um
00:42:42
Speaker
gosh we could just like scroll through my instagram and look but i don't really i don't know like i i mentioned like i just like don't care what i look like and that that's easy for me to say because i have pretty good genetics right like
00:42:57
Speaker
My body fat is like a negative percentage, probably no matter how much I try to try to eat. Um, when I was doing CrossFit, I actually did the go mat, which is gallon of milk a day. Where you drink an entire gallon of milk every single day for, you know, as long as you want to. And I think I did it for three or six months or something like that. And ended up weighing about 190 pounds when I was competing at the regionals in the 2012 Northern California CrossFit regional.
00:43:24
Speaker
And still like just as shredded with no extra body fat. Just muscles, just grew bigger. So like...
00:43:38
Speaker
I like to be like realistic and like open about perceptions around training, right? Like I could say like, I don't do cardio. All I do is handstand that I'm Jack to look, you should train this way. You're going to be Jack too. But I think that a large part of it is, um, that I just kind of have the genetics to look this way. So whatever type of training I do, how I look is going to be much more dependent on how much I eat than the specific type of training.
00:44:06
Speaker
so would you say the like your core of course your shoulders are probably going to be stronger and
00:44:16
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, the shoulder is an obvious point for for for handstands But what what let's say get into the core like what is your core like right now? Comparison to before my core strong my core strong, but only in certain movements So like in a deadlift I can still pull recently I think I pulled over 400 pounds which for me is quite good. My best ever is 455 so you know pulling over 400 as someone who will touch a barbell once every three weeks at the most and
00:44:45
Speaker
is quite good, but at the same time, if I were to squat, I don't even think I could squat 300 pounds right now, just because I'm not used to the spinal compression. And right now, because of the one-arm handstand, being able to control the legs and keep everything consistent in your shape is so important that I stopped squatting heavy probably six or seven months ago.
00:45:15
Speaker
So like the type of leg training I'll do now will just be sissy squats, pistol squats, um, some deadlifts, um, some like glute work, you know, just standard, standard glute stuff that you might see on Instagram doing like leg raises with a band around my knees or, um,
00:45:31
Speaker
back extensions on the gluteal machine, something like that. Legs are still pretty strong, I think, but just like the spinal compression in the squat, I would be very hesitant to try to push that. I just wouldn't want to smash my back without going through like a four or six week training cycle to kind of get used to the movement again.
00:45:53
Speaker
so why am i asking all these questions because i'm trying to gauge how realistic would it be for me to attempt something to me to sound scary like oh shit doing one moment only what will happen to my physique what will happen to my oh no no no i think you have a very similar experience to me right because you have the athletic background um i think that you would find that
00:46:19
Speaker
the additional mobility work and especially loaded mobility work did provide like a very like an extremely potent strengthening effect for your body and that it was very intensive that you and you would have that like completely fried like legs are shaking um like you're like dropping cups and breaking them in the kitchen after training um after completing um like the mobility work and the handstand training so I think that you would
00:46:47
Speaker
I think you would be surprised at like the potency of it as you got more and more into it and your workouts became longer and more of like a true full handstand training experience. And then also I think that or a long period of time before you needed the specificity of.
00:47:05
Speaker
one arm handstand type type coordination levels that you would be able to you know squat once a week or deadlift or power clean once a week completely fine you know maybe just spend 10 minutes um warming up you know build to a quick double on a power clean and then do your handstand workout without interrupting any any of the progression that you would see in the first probably year of handstand training
00:47:32
Speaker
because we we've talked about this before i see the ultimate warm-up to have your lifting is calisthenics it's for me it's been phenomenal because i don't warm up calisthenics is my warm-up before olympic weight lift every every single time uh... of course i do a few warm-up exercises which is the barbell uh... that being said
00:47:58
Speaker
if anyone is listening for me who has been in the game and been lifting for quite some time for me this is radical like for me this is extremist like one fucking exercise like that's some that's some dedication right there and that's that's but it's almost like it's that's a madman approach but what what
00:48:20
Speaker
What was the, how did you come to that conclusion? Like, that's it. Like, I'm not going to have anything else. Like this, this is, this is enough. Like this is, cause you, you, you, that is, that is a thing. And then we, whenever we talk, that's a big focus of yours. You can see it in your post as well as, as you keep harping on simplifying things.
The Importance of Focus and Enjoyment in Training
00:48:42
Speaker
Like what is the one thing like you want to focus on? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like.
00:48:50
Speaker
The more things you focus on, the less good you're going to be at any of them. Right? Like Lance Armstrong is not winning any like weightlifting competitions and he's not losing sleep about it at night.
00:49:04
Speaker
whatever you think about him as a person right like his dedication to cycling is clear right and he's the best so if you want to be very good at something you have to focus on it and you can choose how good you want to be at something right you're going to have a combination of like the amount of time that you have based upon like your family and work and external factors and then your genetic potential but
00:49:29
Speaker
in terms of getting to your genetic potential, whether that be in studying mathematics or becoming a great artist or becoming physically capable, you have to spend all your time in that specific endeavor, or you're not going to get to where you can. It's really that simple. And, you know, if that's too boring for you, then that's too boring for you. So you'll, you know, you choose your own level of involvement. And if you want to be
00:49:56
Speaker
Relatively average at 25 different things and you're happy with that then that's awesome. But if you want to be good at 25 different things and you're losing sleep over it at night and you're hurting yourself to do all these types of training Then I would say that you need to kind of take a look at why why so many things are so important to you and and maybe you if you looked at it close enough you might realize that
00:50:25
Speaker
some of those goals are more important and some of that stuff you might be willing to put aside. And then you would start to really see progress in a way that you hadn't before. Yeah, it's the, it's just like the shiny and new, right? Like you see this thing on Instagram, like, hey, I wanna do this thing, I wanna do this thing, I wanna do this thing. And it's like, I mean, you just can't do all those things.
00:50:55
Speaker
I mean, even look at CrossFit, like CrossFit, the best athletes in the world, right? All they have to do is throw one new movement in the CrossFit Games and they all fail at it. They all fail at it. And then Dave Castro gets to laugh and say, you know, you guys should be prepared for anything, right? And these people, right?
00:51:17
Speaker
10 years ago in CrossFit, when I was doing it, it was easy to make fun of CrossFit and say, oh, these are just stupid people doing these dumb things. But the guys now doing CrossFit are as legitimate athletes as any other sport in the Olympics or professional athletes in the world. And when it's that easy to throw a curve ball into the system of athletes of that level,
00:51:40
Speaker
To me, I mean, that just shows like a very clear example of like, there's only so much that you can do, right? And these athletes are 25 years old, dedicating their lives to this training. Most of them don't have families, don't have kids. Many of them have been able to figure out either moving back in with their parents or getting good sponsors or finding ways that they don't have to even have a job outside of maybe coaching a few classes at a CrossFit gym.
00:52:07
Speaker
And they're still limited on how much that they can train and how much they can work towards. So as just like a regular person who has a full-time job, who has a wife, who has kids, who has a husband, like you got to choose.
00:52:21
Speaker
And if you, if you won't choose, right, then all you're going to do is just run into a wall over and over again. And I think my journey with calisthenics and body movement gymnastics has been the more I practice that, that has probably been the, the best training style out of any training style, because it transfers into almost every single movement. Um, you won't really get the compound or the Olympic weightlifting type of power or spinal compression we've talked about, but
00:52:51
Speaker
For all other, you can say, movements, it's been so game-changing of the body awareness, the strength that I have, the ability to control my body in space is so much better than anything I've ever
00:53:09
Speaker
imagine before and in what i've realized is now we've we've talked about this before um what's his name matt frazier is a big he always talks about it like like why don't you guys understand this like to be good at cross it you don't train cross it that's like ludicrous that's freaking nuts it's a bit it's not logical i mean why wouldn't you practice something that you want to get better at but it's the movements
00:53:36
Speaker
that's what's going to make you really better at it. I've looked at Matt Frazier's programming and he's saying that it's just a secret sauce and it's progression and so forth. It's not a bunch of random workouts, which is usually thrown into a lot of crossfit programming. But I still think it's too randomized, in my opinion. I'll give an example. As I only train
00:53:58
Speaker
calisthenic gymnastics and and on pink weightlifting I don't do crossfit but I thought okay I'm in London I missed open gym
00:54:10
Speaker
There's a crossfit class. These people are trying to talk me into it. I'm like, oh, Katie, I've told myself I don't do crossfit. I don't do crossfit classes. Let me go ahead and try it. It was chest to bar pull ups. It was wild balls and it was 400 meter runs. And I can't remember how, I think how certain amount of either get to a X amount of rounds or there's a time cap of 25 minutes.
00:54:31
Speaker
I'm like okay I'll be alright at it end up fucking smoking everyone I'm like how the hell did this happen and
00:54:43
Speaker
Excuse me and and what I realized is is exactly what we're speaking to it's it's I've gone better at CrossFit by not doing CrossFit, but specifically only focusing on skills And and this that's the whole I mean, that's what Matt Frazier preaches to if you only focus on the skill You keep a certain I mean if you wait, of course if you go into competition start working on the engine But then that's I mean you can be a freaking killer doing that
00:55:13
Speaker
and the revelation that i had with that too like you say you don't train cardio if you have a base if you've been an athlete earlier like the cardio is probably the easiest thing to build up like that's not hard but it's the hardest thing to really build up and i'll give you the most bang for your buck if you want to evolve i'd say as a
00:55:34
Speaker
With your mind with your body like who you are as a individual even spiritually I would say calisthenics that's that's up there and and while you're right now you're proposing to me to elevate my game to just I Stop stop messing around with all these different exercises. Just go to one which is that's a challenge for me and and and with that that's a that's a that's a lot of additional comments to my question that is
00:56:02
Speaker
If you, calisthenics is cool, right? So if you look at anyone who's doing it, let's say on Instagram, let's say any person that does all these variety of movements, like I want to do it all. I can imagine all these other people like, oh, like the human flag, everyone wants to do human flag.
00:56:21
Speaker
everyone wants to I don't know do the planche I don't know maybe not so many maybe front lever and all that stuff but there's a wide variety but it takes such a long time to getting good at this stuff what would you what do you recommend to these people who want to get into calisthenics like where do you even start off
00:56:42
Speaker
Well, gosh, there's so many things, um, that, that you talked about there. Um, so like the, like the idea of training one thing is, um,
00:56:59
Speaker
It sounds like one thing, but it's not one thing, right? Like, because like I keep mentioning, like the mobility is like separate training from it, even though it's like directly related to benefiting it. Um, so, so the training training has a significant amount of variety. And when you're getting into calisthenics, it's going to be a long journey.
00:57:16
Speaker
So like if you're if you're looking to work towards a planche like you likely have a three to five year journey ahead of you, right like you'll you might find some some YouTube videos where someone got it in a year, but you don't necessarily know how much that person weighs how old that person is if they may be.
00:57:32
Speaker
Did progressive gymnastics until they were like nine years old and then moved and had to stop for some reason. And now they're like 14 years old and decided to pick it up again. Right. And they have this incredible training background that they just didn't mention in their little YouTube highlight reel. So.
00:57:51
Speaker
In terms of like looking at progress and what to expect, I think the important thing for people getting into any type of training is to just respect the movement and focus on the quality and try to learn how to do every exercise you're doing as well as possible.
00:58:07
Speaker
And if you do those exercises as well as possible, you're going to get the benefits of the progression, right? Because the progressions for exercises, right? People have come up with all of these different progressions, whether it's running intervals or whether it's like band assisted exercises for planche and pull-ups. They've come up with them and used them and they've become popular because of they work.
00:58:29
Speaker
Right, but if you're doing say you want to get your first strict pull-up and you have a giant band on the pull-up bar And you're just bouncing up and down you're not gonna grow any stronger, right? But if you do like a nice clean strict pull-up control the negative and have the band truly assist you rather than do the pull-up for you You're gonna get stronger. So like my advice would just be to try to learn and
00:58:53
Speaker
how to do the exercise, whether that's asking coach, whether that's finding the exercise and then Googling it and learning what different people have to say about it or seeing different variations of it and kind of understanding the leverage that's produced because so much of gymnastics and calisthenics is just simple leverage, right? You just have to be strong enough to support in these positions and then you'll either balance, you'll tip, you'll press the handstand once you hit these different loading scenarios in the proper positions.
00:59:25
Speaker
And kind of to address the idea about focusing on one thing. Like if you were to do my handstand workouts right now for three hours, the only thing that would happen is you would get hurt. So as a beginner, you're going to be able to handle more variety. So maybe as a beginner, if you wanted to train six days a week, maybe you would have an hour long handstand workout one day. The next day you might do
00:59:52
Speaker
an hour and 20 minutes of some strength-related stuff, maybe half of that hour and 20 minutes. You start off with straight arm strength where you're working on your planche leans, some arch hangs for your scaps, and then you finish it off with some bent arm stuff, whether it's ring tips, handstand push-up variations, and some pull-ups.
01:00:10
Speaker
And then the third day you might do a leg session and then finish that leg session rather than doing traditional accessory work like lunges and stiff leg deadlifts. You might finish it off with hip mobility, hamstring mobility stretching, right? And then you could repeat those workouts again for the fourth, fifth, sixth day of the week. And then just kind of rinse, wash, repeat that progressing time on your hold or reps or a number of sets to increase your training volume.
01:00:36
Speaker
to build up a training response and grow stronger over the next four to six weeks. And then after six weeks, you can make a slight change to the program to either change the exercises, reduce the assistance, add weight to exercises that are appropriate to do so, what have you.
01:00:53
Speaker
I think I'll give some shout outs here. What I would say is it's probably fine if you're completely new. I think CrossFit has a good approach to it, to have variety. Because I think that's one of the main things is kind of trying out to see what you like. Because some of these movements you probably like more than others. And if you're going to stick with it, it's important that you like it.
01:01:20
Speaker
there is one what's his name dusty remind me of his name highland yeah he has a he has a cool program on train heroic that you can check out and that's that's a good intro if you haven't if you haven't dabbled with gymnastics or calisthenics before there are are there any other people that you think that they're interesting
01:01:44
Speaker
Um, I mean obviously you should check out my stuff and if you want coaching I do one-to-one coaching and that's that's going to be whether you choose me or someone else one-to-one coaching is going to be the best opportunity because they're going to be able to assess you and identify what you actually need and by understanding what you need and explaining it to you why they program the way they do whether they program a lot of variety or they program a lot of consistent training whatever they think is appropriate for you
01:02:10
Speaker
you're going to have an explanation to why that is and understanding why something is happening in my experience for myself and for the clients that I work with gives it a lot of buy-in. It makes you much less worried about whether something is boring or exciting because you're much more focused on like the process and how it's going to work.
01:02:32
Speaker
Yeah. I was going to get to that point. Yeah. So I can say like people that I follow online that I just like, I just really like how either how they explain stuff or their personalities. So like one person who I've never worked with, but I would love to work with one day to have her coach me.
01:02:59
Speaker
Akro Megan is her is her handle on Instagram and she comes up with just like really cool drills like she'll just make up a drill like have a client who's you know trying trying to learn something and she'll just legit like make up a drill and she's like hey here's this drill that I made up to help my client and like to me that just shows that she's not
01:03:19
Speaker
I don't know this person at all, anything like that, but just from being an outside observer that shows me that she has an understanding of training in a way that she can truly adapt.
01:03:32
Speaker
the skills that she's trying to teach to the client in question, rather than just saying like, all right, I have these six exercises. You're going to get five reps of this one. You're going to get 10 reps of this one. You're going to get 12 reps of this one. And that's going to make you ready for the fourth progression in this series. Um, that's a template, right? That might work for some people. It's probably not going to work for most people. So.
01:03:53
Speaker
coaches that can legitimately tailor their programming and their skills and their progressions in a way that meets the athlete's needs. That's much more of something I'm interested in. Sure. Yeah, I mean, over our conversations, we know you're all about the customized approach, and I love that too.
01:04:19
Speaker
I'm saying there are quite a few people who are not ready sometimes to dive head first. And they just want to dip their toes. And that's what I was saying, like the Dusty Highland program on train heroic. I think it can be a good intro. Yeah, but what I'm saying is, because this is what I was going to make a transition into, this is what we talked about and that I've been trying to
01:04:43
Speaker
Encourage you put out there. Maybe you're it's in the works and ongoing continuous Calisthenics program where maybe there's hey that there's there's intro workouts on train heroic still waiting for that to come out and maybe there's gonna be one train maybe there's gonna be one handstand specific one that you're gonna be releasing and
01:05:02
Speaker
Because you have at least one customer here that you're speaking to right now But then that is that is a good like hands-off approach if you don't want the one-on-one coaching but if you really want it like if you what if you want like Really get Results and really right, you know what you want. I mean Zach it's phenomenal and we've done that work and
01:05:27
Speaker
together and some and I'll just I'll put a I'll put a good word in for your programming here because and that this is what we collaborated is is the amount of nuances you put into the programming is very subtle but it shifts and it makes for great progress like it doesn't have to be a massive amount of variety like we spoke to tying it back into earlier in and
01:05:49
Speaker
Our conversation doesn't have to be all these different exercises But it can be nuances of that exercise and it keeps you still fresh engaged Not bored sometimes which I feel like I get because I do the same exercises all the time But they're these slight nuances and sometimes that the wave effect they've had for the programming of something like you start with a
01:06:11
Speaker
two sets one week and then there's three sets the next week we're like I think what was it three sets them four sets and then back to three sets like there's the wave type of program depending on the exercises you might go six eight ten or eight ten twelve and then de-load or yeah if you're doing like a six-week cycle rather than a four-week cycle you may do like four or five two four or five two
01:06:34
Speaker
And I think that's that's that's fascinating. It's a fascinating approach that I haven't seen any other program or coach take But uh, yeah, but back to the question of will we be seeing some more we've seen that the the mobility program that you released will will there be any Any body weight calisthenics programs gymnastic
Zach's Influence and Outreach
01:06:53
Speaker
programs? Yeah, so like a lot of that stuff that you talked about I have a ton of ideas around I would love to create a progressive program that
01:07:02
Speaker
people can kind of get on board with and follow gradually and get feedback in the process. So I'm kind of weighing in my head, how exactly do I create this program? Do some marking around it so that there's a good base of people who start when it starts, right? Because if you come on into the middle of like a year-long program, you come in a week or month five.
01:07:24
Speaker
your experience is going to be a lot different than the person who started in the beginning of it. So there's a lot of logistical hurdles from that respect. And then just based upon my personality, I'm going to want to be able to give feedback, whether it's creating a forum, like a Facebook group or something within train heroic specifically where I can communicate with the people and find out what they're struggling with, and then make
01:07:50
Speaker
some type of content to supply the needs of those clients, whether that means adjusting programming for the future as we progress. If people are progressing really quickly, maybe providing more options for faster progression. If people are struggling with stuff, maybe providing more options for
01:08:10
Speaker
Different lateral progressions right where we're coming at the same skills from a different angle But not necessarily like a harder more intense angle So there's a lot of a lot of stuff like that And that stuff's pretty easy to manage as you go through because you're just like oh, they're not getting the skill Let's try it a different way. That's pretty simple but just
01:08:29
Speaker
Putting it all together, that's something I've been thinking about a lot. And I do have some templates now, which I was pretty resistant towards, just because I feel like templates can't possibly supply the needs of everyone. But like you mentioned, a lot of people aren't ready to make that commitment to one-to-one coaching, whether it's the just accountability of it purely, or like the financial cost is quite a bit higher than any templates.
01:08:52
Speaker
you're going to have to deal with when you're working one-to-one with somebody. So trying to create those templates to give people opportunities to train with good programming that's functional, even if it's not quite as good as if someone was one-to-one watching your videos and giving you direct feedback is something that I'm starting to embrace. I've gotten some pretty good feedback from a lot of people who've bought the programs and experienced some good progressions with their mobility and handstands and what have you.
01:09:20
Speaker
In terms of a calisthenics program Yeah, I think Honestly, like You know, I got that like imposter syndrome So I see so many people out there who are much more advanced than me with their programs. I'm like, why wouldn't why would people want to buy mine? Why wouldn't they just go by like Simon stress strength program that dudes a beast right? like why would they come to me and so like I
01:09:45
Speaker
You know, at some point I'll get around to it and I'll probably start with just like some like introductory skills, like people who want to get their first push up, people who want to get their first pull up and try to really embrace that audience because I think that training is very simple and probably doesn't need one-to-one coaching.
01:10:03
Speaker
but it does need solid progression so if you just every now and then try to do some pull-ups and three weeks go by then you try again and you're not consistent with it you're gonna have a really hard time building that strength but like you know if you just do some like pull-up and push-up variations three times a week for six months like you're gonna be way stronger so in terms of calisthenics like you might be on the lookout if you're interested in really just getting started with it
01:10:28
Speaker
for some stuff like that. And depending on how people react to it, maybe down the road, we'll get some more progressions towards some more serious movements, some more challenging stuff. But definitely I got some good handstand stuff on there. I just released a program for Preston handstand for flexible people. So like anybody who's got a background in like yoga or who, you know, it just generally isn't very strong, but you could just fold in half and like put your palms flat on the ground with no trouble at all. If you're interested in Preston handstand, like definitely check that out.
01:10:58
Speaker
Do you how would you describe that experience? What's the user experience like if you do? Yeah, exactly
01:11:07
Speaker
Um, you know, I've never used it as an athlete, um, but I don't get any complaints, which is, which is interesting from, from the people who, who, who use a program who give me feedback, haven't had anybody complain about the interface or anything like that. Um, I guess, um, I'll give my perspective as I've used it, um, quite extensively. So, so the, the beauty of it, instead of having Excel sheets or printing out paperwork and so forth. Oh, you mean as a, as a coach.
01:11:33
Speaker
Well, no, I'm actually as an athlete. So you open up the app, you see the entire, well, you click in into the day that you're going to do and you get all the exercises, you get the sets, you get the reps, but you can also type in your score and then it'll also track it so you don't have to keep track of what's your personal record or so forth. You'll always have that and it will show you that and based off of
01:12:00
Speaker
let's say if you have percentages and so forth it'll always calculate that you'll do your own calculator or it will calculate for you so you don't have to use your calculator it will always have a video so you because that is one of the pains that always had oh let's let's check out youtube whatever to find the right exercise and then i have to scroll through whatever two minute long video i only want to look at 10 seconds but i have to find that 10 seconds in a two minute video
01:12:23
Speaker
Instead you just have that right in that app in that exercise you click on it makes it very smooth Saves you time and I'm all about saving time and not holding having to click around This is also something that Zach has access to so he could probably give comments if depending on his workflow and the relationship and and and the type of
01:12:48
Speaker
Yeah, you can definitely like go in and ask questions and it actually it goes to like this group place So like all the people's questions are there so if you were to like scroll back through the questions You can see the questions that people have asked throughout the training cycles, which is really nice All the demo videos I use are my demos. So like whatever I'm programming The demo shows exactly how I expect it to be done It's not just some random templated video that I just like yanked off YouTube because like everything I program like
01:13:17
Speaker
There's a very specific reason why I programmed it. I want you to do it exactly this way. And that's how you're going to get the progression for it. And so I accompany the videos with little written explanations with the most common cues, sometimes highlighting the common mistakes. And then even within the workout, if there's extra common mistakes that people make, I'll add it even within the workout, just the event that people don't click the button to read the extra written description along with the demo.
01:13:43
Speaker
Yeah, so anyone listening, I'll tell you a reason why you should check this out. I've seen, I mean, I've been in the game for quite some time, done, I don't know how many different programs. And when I saw, and of course I've trained, I've been trained by Zach too, but when I saw what he did, this is unbiased, because I'm not affiliated, I'm not getting paid by Zach or anyone in his circle.
01:14:11
Speaker
When I saw what he was doing, and I saw the quality of content that he was putting out there on Instagram, I think when we met, or reconnected, you had maybe, you were happy that you broke like a thousand followers. I think it was something like that, back a year and a half or something like that.
01:14:27
Speaker
this is a year and a half ago the dude has 102 000 followers today this this is and this is what i told him hey you're a fucking master trainer it's just it hasn't it hasn't gone viral yet so the guy knows his stuff like he is a very unique and as you might be able to tell opinionated approach to how you train he's very specific and detail oriented but that also means freaking results
01:14:54
Speaker
If you're serious about what you do and you want to get results and you want to have a dedicated path, not just something that's thrown together that it looks decent enough, no, this is the good stuff right here. And if you look and if you want to keep tuned in, check Zach out, especially on Instagram, but maybe you can give a shout out to, where can people find you?
01:15:19
Speaker
Instagram is for sure the best place. Yeah. At Zach height, Z A C K H E I G H T on Instagram. Um, is for sure the best place is where I post stories every single day, almost. And pretty regular, regularly, once or twice a week, I'll get a post up, um, highlighting some of.
01:15:35
Speaker
the exercises that I'm either using with my clients or stuff that's in my program, or sometimes I just share the demo videos that I make. A lot of my posts that have actually gotten me more followers happen to just be like, I'm just filming demo videos that day. I'm like, I'll just put some of these up and then say something about my approach to training and the combination of those exercises. And then I think my philosophical perspective with training really resonates with people.
01:16:03
Speaker
And this is a major differentiator in a world of hype, in a world of chasing the next shiny thing is something that the mechs, in my opinion, Zach stand out. Like he, as you, have you heard early on in the conversation, he takes five, 10, 15, like your approach to his training. It's not about, okay, what is the coolest thing that just popped up in my feed in Instagram? Oh, let me try to recreate that and get as many likes as possible. No.
01:16:31
Speaker
Zach, he knows where he's at, he knows what he's doing, he's dedicated to his path, and he's consistent. He has, and a big part that you don't see too much of, he has integrity. He has integrity when it comes to his method and his approach to it.
01:16:48
Speaker
maybe he has not expressed too much of this but he is he is hardcore when it comes to how to do certain things like that there's not like he's a cool guy he's an approachable guy but it's not one of those like oh coach i'm not feeling this this and that today no okay well let's talk through it and why
01:17:07
Speaker
And let's find a way for you to get it done and still hold you accountable. I think those makes for, in my opinion, master coaches. The people that hold you accountable, they see through the excuses. They won't be an asshole about it, but it will still keep you on track.
01:17:26
Speaker
and make sure that the work is done. And as Aya too, I get part of that shiny syndrome, object syndrome, is get distracted by all these shiny things that I want to pursue. Zach knows where he stands, and he knows why he does what he does, and he won't sway.
01:17:44
Speaker
And I think that's such a key for life, that you have at least one person in your life like that. That will freaking be a pillar. That will be stability. Like no matter what, and especially with fitness, if you have that guy in your corner, like you're freaking set. Like you're solid. Like now you're just, what you do, you'll responsibly get your ass in the training space we're at, get the work done.
01:18:10
Speaker
There's no excuses of, oh, I'm not really sure what I'm gonna do. I'm not feeling it, no. Zach is the guy that you can just flip up the Instagram. All right, he's fucking getting it done. If he's able to do three hours of freaking handstand work, if he's able to do one hour of mobility and wake up that early, it's easy to just flip up, train a row, it can do whatever it is that you're programmed to do.
01:18:35
Speaker
This this is the beauty of it like take away the painful stuff that makes you not want to train and train like a pro Yeah, I think that kind of highlights some points and like the benefit of like Printing down what you're focused on right because when you have so many things that you're focused on I think it's super important as a coach to like
01:18:59
Speaker
Understand what you're doing and believe in it enough where you're really going to push your clients to that direction But then at the same time like you said
01:19:07
Speaker
People are gonna have different things come up in their life. People are gonna have schedules, people are gonna have, they're gonna get sick, they're gonna have car accidents, they're gonna have family members get sick, whatever, just different stuff is gonna happen. And so sometimes you're gonna miss training. And that's not the end of the world. But if you're skipping training because you're working on something else, I don't really have any tolerance for that. And I don't do any contracts with people. I've never fired a client. I've never fired an online client.
01:19:34
Speaker
But if your perspective is such that you think the training is boring or something like that, then you're not on contract, right? We've finished the month out, and best of luck in your journey the way you want to do it. Because I do real training, and I teach real training, and if you want to actually do real training and make progress,
01:19:57
Speaker
That's who I want to work with. And so people who want to work that way, when they have things come up that are personal experiences, 100% of support, support, right? Change their program, give them a week of deload, whatever they need to kind of work through that. But for people who just want to be ADD and do their own thing, like, yeah, I don't have any, any patience at all for that type of stuff.
01:20:21
Speaker
amazing well zach this has been a golden good positive note to end the podcast oh yeah that's that's uh that's the way to go i uh you can see you can see the new ounces of zach i think you've heard it in the podcast you can check them out more on instagram it's like cool
01:20:38
Speaker
Cool YouTube channel as well He did some cool stuff with Marcus Philly recently so you can check it out out as well, but Yeah, Zach freaking awesome having you on finally. Yeah, it was a pleasure pleasure to do it. Thank you for having me I had a lot of fun. I know thanks for finally getting getting me on here. Yeah for sure
01:21:00
Speaker
Oh man, I appreciate Zach. He challenges me. He's one of these people that he elevates me. I feel like there's certain areas of my life where I can help him. He is a true ally. I'm glad I got to share this relationship, this conversation that we got to have, how he challenged me.
01:21:22
Speaker
Now it's on my top of my mind to think about, okay, how can I go down to even fewer exercises in my training? And how can I humble myself further, be more specific about how I do things? It's a great teacher.
01:21:44
Speaker
for sure. And if you want to understand and learn more about Zach and what he's up to on a day to day basis, check out his Instagram, Zach height is his handle. You can find all this in the show notes, his website, his YouTube channel. If you want to be coached by him, I mean, I've been coached by him, the best coaching that I've ever gotten. And that's unbiased. This hands down the best coaching I've ever gotten. He knows his shit.
01:22:15
Speaker
You can also check out his programs. There's a stretching program that I'm just about to start. I've done some pretty advanced stretching with gymnastics bodies. You can also check that out if you want. But this is, this is a new level that I want to try with Zach. He also has a few other programs I believe on train heroic. You can find that on his Instagram as well.
01:22:36
Speaker
And keep a look out for more programs. I'll be keeping a look at myself. Thank you for tuning in. This was a very interesting podcast for me. Hope you enjoyed it as well. And I wish you a blessed day. Much love.