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Drawn to Comic Con! A Conversation with Grant Pllu Illustrations
10 Playsin 1 hour
In this episode, Satsunami talks to the one and only Grant Pllu Illustrations about the wonderful world of comic conventions as well as what it is like to be an artist there. But what have been Grant's most memorable moments? What are his thoughts on Star Wars? And how has gaming influenced his work? All of this and more in our latest episode of Chatsunami!
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Transcript
Introduction to Chatsunami Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami, a Scottish variety podcast that discusses topics from gaming and films to anime in general interest. Join me, your host, Satsunami, as well as the rest of our Chatsunami team for our takes on these very important pop culture topics. Sir, it's clearly a trap. I accept copyright! That happens three times in the film. Every time that general goes, don't do this one thing, he goes, do you know what I'ma do? That's the exact thing.
00:00:27
Speaker
Does it well? She had the pointy teeth? What was that about? She looked like Bilbo when he wants the ring back. ah She turned into it. I just want the lightsaber one more time. Parasite says, no, you will get back into your office and work. No, says the man in Zoom. yeah Trousers are for the working man. You're bursting into your hotel room. Honey, we need to go.
00:00:50
Speaker
Leave the kids. We can milk an odysh. Oh.
00:00:58
Speaker
That's the worst thing you've ever said on any of the
Guest Introduction: Grant from Grant Blue Illustrations
00:01:01
Speaker
episodes. If that sounds like your cup of tea, then you can check us out at our website, chattsunami.com, as well as all good podcast apps. As always, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated.
00:01:14
Speaker
Stay classy and have a... This has been chattsunami. I'm sorry.
00:01:25
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Chatsunami. My name's Chatsunami and joining me today is none other than one of the great artists of Comic Con. It is Grant from Grant Blue Illustrations. Grant, welcome to Chatsunami. Thank you, thank you for having me. How are you doing tonight? Not too bad, not too bad. Sweating as you can imagine in this kind of heat, but doing not too bad, not too
Scottish Weather and Daily Life
00:01:48
Speaker
bad. I mean, hopefully when this episode comes out that it'll be torrential rain again and scoffed. or you know that kind of yeah it'll be that Derrick kind of weather but yeah you're completely right it is absolutely sweltering out there because you and I of course were discussing that before we came on there and I was out with a dog slash my podducer who hopefully will not bark in this episode but Yeah, it was just absolutely roasting. was talking to one of my, think it was one of work colleagues who said that they went away on holiday and it was like absolutely torrential rain and then they came back and they were like, oh, what did I miss? And they missed the summer weather, I suppose. The three days that we usually get. Isn't it? It's Taps-Aff weather, isn't it? It absolutely is, yeah. Oh, God. I don't know why, but every time I get a Scottish guest on, I always somehow pivot towards Taps Half Weather because I'm like, it's absolutely roasting. Genuinely is. I've been going out on mental health walks and all that sort of stuff.
00:02:44
Speaker
And I'm in shorts and stuff like that. And I think I was talking to my husband's dad and he was like, I don't understand why people are walking about in shorts. And I'm going, I'm absolutely melting here. i don't know how no one else isn't in
Grant's Journey as an Illustrator
00:02:55
Speaker
shorts. you know it's just that kind of weather though that i run hot anyway i just have to expel as much layers as possible in this kind of weather oh no totally it's one of those things that you know when you hear from other countries like america or you know ones with a better climate let's just say and it's like oh yeah we can handle 40 degree heat we can handle 30 degrees why can't you handle you know 18 to 20 degrees and it's like it's very muggy i'm
00:03:20
Speaker
I'm not gonna lie, it's that kind of, it lingers. Great for your washing, mind you. haven't been in America twice in June. It's absolutely horrid. I was in New York, we actually get married in New York. Oh, lovely. It was 40 degree weather and I was walking about a three-piece suit. And i don't know if you've ever been in the New York subway, but it is like a tin can. It's like so hot down there and it's just all the heat just kind of sinks into the ground. And you're just going in and out of shops to get aircon and that kind of thing. It's just, it's absolutely impossible.
00:03:47
Speaker
I mean, granted, not New York, but I always remember my partner and I went down to London and it was like this weather down south. But I always remember coming out at Euston Station. I don't know what it was. It's just the heat hit us both. You know, like, yeah what is going on here? It's absolutely always roasting. I mean, it's great for a tan, but then again, it's Scots, do we tan? I burn. I definitely burn. Yeah. Same, same. Yeah. Try to limit my UV exposure at all times if I can't help it. Oh no, absolutely same. Because I mean, my partner, she always tans when she goes out and then she turns to me and I look like a lobster or something. Yeah, which will probably be the next character for the podcast, the Chatsunami lobster. Yeah, absolutely. I've got Irish blood, so I just cook.
00:04:31
Speaker
It's terrible, isn't it? But yeah, as I was saying, you, of course, run the illustrations channel. I'm quite curious, how did that all begin? Because am I right in saying you started as far back as 2017? Or was it further back? Yeah, no, 2017 is about that time. So at the time, I was at college doing social sciences. And I was thinking about going into something like history teaching or politics teaching or something like that. And then I did have this interest in creative personality and art, animation, video games. And basically it got to a point where I realized that kind of rigid structures of the job that i was thinking of it going into just didn't really suit me.
00:05:10
Speaker
And I looked into what i would need to do and always had an interest in illustration and artwork and comics and that kind of thing. And I basically had a big, long conversation with my now current husband at the time, very early boyfriend and then my parents and they were like, no, just go for it, like try it. So i ended up finishing social sciences. A friend of mine was like, post some of the work that you're doing on Instagram. And then the ball started rolling from there. Yeah, because, i mean, you can definitely see, I mean, that's in the best way possible, but you can see the progress that you've made throughout it, and it is absolutely fantastic to see. But out of curiosity, what inspired you to see to go from posting all your work to actually going to Comic-Con? I was genuinely trying to rack my brains, because you and I, and when I say meet, I mean on the briefest of terms, but you and I have actually met at one of the Comic-Cons, and Must have been one of your Feathers McGraw stickers that I bought from you. Because I remember that just immediately caught my I thought, oh, that is so cool. I have to buy that and everything. We chatted and you were absolutely lovely. And after that, I saw you kept posting and everything and you were going to all these different cons. And it's absolutely fantastic to see. But what made you go from just posting your artwork online to going to cons and things and selling it? It's a bit of a long-winded story, which is great for this kind of long format. But essentially, I was going to, once I had finished social sciences, I had that as like a kind of buffer if this didn't work out or I wanted to go back and do it. And then I moved on to do an illustration at college. And that ran from about 2018 until 2021. So was going to college through the kind of heart of the pandemic, doing it distance. and that kind of thing and then there was a point where i had finished and i was still struggling with imposter syndrome and working out whether i was ready yet and funnily enough the answer is is that you're never ready until you just do it so it got to a point where i was like this isn't working for me just posting and trying to see if like a job will just appear out of nowhere like that just doesn't work so I ended up doing markets at Cormarnock train station. They were doing this kind of community run thing and the people there were like super lovely and they gave me a table essentially for free. I was doing work for them in terms of they were running a tabletop Warhammer shop and I was doing like their menus and a bit of social media and a bit of artwork and then I was getting the kind kickback of doing the tables and that kind of got me the confidence and some of the inventory to get into doing cons and I think my first one was... AcmeCon Autumn in 2023. That's when I officially started. That was my first con. And then just building up from there. I think we met for the first time at FantasyCon in Paisley Town Hall, if I'm not mistaken, because my husband and I have the stickers, the wee kind of pouch that you made up with the pins and that. We still got them. But yeah, so I kind of built up from there. It's really hard to describe. It almost feels like a natural progression in terms of going from posting and saying, look, this is my work to then going, no, my work is all this other stuff. It's social media, it's designing, making the prints, selling them physically to people, charming them with my endearing personality as well. Of course, yeah. You know, that kind of thing. And so it ends up being like seven jobs in one, but the main one obviously being creating the artwork and making sure that people appreciate it some way. Oh no, absolutely. And I think you're right, because thinking back to when you said we met at the Paisley Fantasy Con, I was trying to think of if it was that con or Acme, because yeah, I'd seen you'd been to Acme, and that's another one that my friend Martin McAllister and I, we had gone to, i think he was wrestling at that show, I had gone to support him, and I thought it was kind of the first time that we had decided to create content for the podcast, but it wasn't official until we applied for the, i think it's now epic on and and frontiers. We applied for that and they said, yeah, sure. Bring your microphone and camera. And we went and we discussed all the different
Experiences at Comic-Cons
00:09:07
Speaker
ones. And yeah, I do remember fantasy. That one actually really surprised me at how passionate everyone was at that one. especially the way they had laid everything out and that's another funny one i don't know if you've heard the story of that the tartan tabletop were there did you go see them i had an amazing view of the stage from where i was it because i was at the back wall so i could basically just see the stage from where i was yeah they were great it was a phenomenal show i think the combination of the scottish elements and then having the tabletop stuff be basically what shines through it's phenomenal oh yeah no they're fantastic
00:09:39
Speaker
I remember I had interviewed, I think it was Josh, and it's one of those cases where I talked to them, but that was the only time I talked to them over Zencaster and for the podcast. And I felt like, you know, in a thriller film where it's like someone's performing on stage, but there's that guy in the trench coat and everything in the back being like, I know who you are, but you know who I am? I was like, oh, God. So was like, when I went up at the end and, you know, bought t-shirt and things, was like, oh, hi there. Yeah, this is odd. yeah that kind of weird parasocial thing where you know more about someone than they know about you and you have to be like i know who you are because of what you do not because i'm stalking you or whatever you have a good social media presence i swear yeah exactly you're doing the job well i'm just an appreciator and yeah it is odd i've had interactions like that before especially at conventions where think it was actually at power con just there in march and someone had came up to me and they were basically like something i've seen a few times and they like to buy a few star wars things they're like yeah there's someone who does eight bit rpg rpg parties and stuff like that as like reprints the other night's republic one was like oh my god like absolutely have to find that there's an artist called rachel's ham phenomenal kind of stuff but i went up and i was like oh like i've seen this before blah blah blah somebody told about this and it's really odd because they were like uh-huh But I was like, no, no, no, you've been referred. Like, it's a really good thing. And I've been on the receiving end of that and gone, how do you know this? It's just, it's so bizarre when somebody comes up to you and they know more than a stranger should know. It's like when you work in a shop you've got a name tag and somebody uses your name and like, you're not allowed to do that. Wait a minute, that's illegal.
00:11:18
Speaker
yeah it's a weird kind of fear how do you know my name and i'm like oh wait i'm wearing it as a badge i do have a weird anecdote actually about the whole surname thing we were talking about it before we started a woman came up and she was like oh i'm related to people with that surname and obviously it's like a surname that if you have it you are 100 blood relation there's just no getting around it and knew who she was she couldn't figure out who i was it was a very strange thing she's only like pictures of my dad and i'm like yes that's my dad she's like right so who are you and i'm like hold on a minute how do we not get this and it was just the most bizarre thing she also didn't buy anything so i was like hold on a second but it was just such an odd thing where someone can identify you in such an odd way yeah and they obviously have family history and stuff like that and they know people that you know but you don't know who they are really it's such an odd i don't like it I mean not to the same extent but I remember at the fantasy con I was talking to I can't remember who it was because there was a couple of indie authors that i talked to they're absolutely lovely people and it was looking through one of their books and i remember this woman was also looking at them beside me and she turned around to me and it was one of the kind of weirdest things she turned around and she saw my hoodie and I've said this before I genuinely just wear the same hoodie to comic-con and people must just look at me going oh that's a shame he's not getting the other clothes and i'm like i swear this is the only time i wear this hoodie it's like a uniform i'm like please and i think that's literally the only identifier to be like yep chat tsunami only hoodie you go yeah i remember she turned around and maybe it was she just saw the microphone on the red panda and everything but she went oh chat tsunami oh that's a nice logo and everything and i was like oh thank you she's like yeah is that podcast thing and you know that way and initially i was like yeah yeah and then i was like yeah how do you know chat tsunami Yeah. She just disappeared. never saw her after that. was like, excuse me, ma'am, where are you going? Definitely the person in the trench coat coming to you and going, hold I know you've got a podcast. Like, how do you know this? Oh, wait, I put out on the internet. I think I would be more worried if people came up to me and they were like, yeah, I know you've got a podcast. By the way, don't take those oranges. They're not good. And then they just disappear into the aisles of like Morrisons or Tesco or whatever. And you're like, I beg your pardon? Excuse you? Yeah, it's very bizarre. I've had very many bizarre kind of things where, have you ever heard that thing where somebody says, oh, you've got one of those faces?
00:13:36
Speaker
Yes. I've been told that so many times. They're just like, you've just got one of those faces. Like, do I know you? And I'm like, no, you don't know me. I would remember. It's just like, this was well before I had done any kind of online illustration stuff. People would just come up to and be like, you would work here? And like, no, I don't. What you talking about? Please go away from me. Yeah, I've had people who have come up and they're like, oh, are you related to so-and-so? And like, nah. Oh, what about so-and-so? It's like, again, hitting a miss. No, no. It's like, oh, but what about this? I'm like, listen, I'm going to stop you right there. This isn't 20 questions. I'm sorry. Exactly. Fortunately, not at Comic-Con or anything like that. But outside of that, where I'm just trying to live my life and people are coming up and like, how do I attract these people? people yeah it's the kind of weird people with too much confidence in society who are like hold on i know who you are and you're like no you don't i mean do you find that a comic on though do you get a lot of again i'm not saying terrible comments but odd comments beyond that or do you find as if it's relatively tame As a person who's very odd themselves, yeah, I do get quite a lot of odd people. I can be quite socially awkward, and so the socially awkward people that come up to me, I can't help you, and they can't help me, and we're just both standing there really awkward, trying not to make eye contact with each other, and trying to start up some kind of small talk, even we're both weird. really bad at small talk it can be quite challenging sometimes and that's not their fault and that's not my fault it's just who we are as people weirdly enough it's actually the more quote-unquote normal people that actually annoy me more and i think it's because you get your kind of average guy come up and they'll make a kind comment had a guy that was like i was just kind of staring at his face and he walked up and he said smile it hasn't happened yet oh And like, what are you even talking about? And then I had another guy come up. This was last year. And he looked at, I don't know if you've seen the flyer that I've got.
00:15:23
Speaker
And it's basically like all the characters in that. And there's like my self-portrait kind of plastered at the front. And he goes, it's quite flattering. And was like, hold on a second. I was about to throw hands. I was like, you can't just walk up to me and basically insult my face. It's just, it's so bizarre. Whereas actually lot of I don't want to say odd people, but the nerd people, the people who are there because they love it, the people who are passionate and in cosplay and all that are always the loveliest. They're always ready to chat about whatever makes them passionate. And I think, I'm someone who also wants talk about what I'm passionate about. It's really important for me that the stuff that I'm showing at a con is something that I adore. And it's something that when someone comes up and says, I like this thing, I also like it as well. And we can have a nice little interaction about I've had people say, oh, you should do this or you should do that. And like, well, don't like that. And I don't want to attract people that do like that. Not because there's anything wrong with that, but because I don't want someone to come up to me and say, I really love, insert fandom here, and I go, I don't know anything about that, sorry. And it comes off as really disingenuous, whereas someone's talking about World of Warcraft, Resident Evil, Star Wars, whatever, we can have this really nice chat. And if they buy something, that's also a bonus, but just having the interaction...
00:16:34
Speaker
is great and I think that the kind of people that go to Comic Cons and who are passionate and who are interesting they are the best kind of people you want to come up you want people that want to show their passion you don't want people who I suppose just kind of want to make a comment or not really interested they just there with their son or whatever and I've had plenty of people that have I'm not saying being mean, but they've certainly not had the kind of spirit. Like, you can see a kid that just walks up and sees a friend and just say, I want that so much. He can tell the parents, like, I don't care, basically. Which I understand. It's hard to be interested in things that you're not interested in, but at the same time, passion is why we do it, you know?
00:17:08
Speaker
Because I remember, and this was years and years ago, it was one of these model conventions. I think this was actually pre-Covid, Jesus, that makes me feel old. But it was one of these because my friend got me into Warhammer 40k and it's been years since I've touched a paper, so I really need to get back into it. But I always remember going to one of them and I was so shocked at how not only friendly everyone was, and that's not a slight against the Warhammer community or anything, but Genuinely, all the people who were selling second-hand models and things, those particular people were some of the loveliest and most passionate people I think I've ever met in that space where they were saying, oh, this is how I paint or this is how I use this terrain and things. Honestly, it was such a great experience. And I totally know what you mean. You can tell the difference between that and whether was that any other convention you get. Some people who you go up to and you chat and I get some people, you know, they've been sitting there for ages, so they'll be tired and everything, but
00:18:10
Speaker
There's been some that I've gone up to and, you know, you talk to them and they are really, again, it's not because they're low energy, but it's because they're not really giving you anything to work off of. To be like, you say, oh, how's your day? Oh, fine. And then that's like the end of conversation. And you're like, you need to give me a bit more than that.
00:18:28
Speaker
ah Again, I'm not expecting people to jump through hoops to say, make way, the podcasters, you know, kind of thing. But the amount of people you're just like, yeah, you can tell who's really into being there, as you said, versus who's just kind of there because of, as you said, whether they're taking their chills. or whether they've been invited by friends and things, would you say the energy is, and I don't want to say better because I don't want you pitting conventions against one another, but would you say there's a lot more energy seeing smaller conventions versus the bigger ones or would you say it's much
Balancing Trends and Personal Interests in Art
00:19:03
Speaker
on a par? It really depends. I've had smaller cons that It can come down to organizer problems, maybe not problems is the right word, but organizing constraints. They have to work with the space that they're in and that might not always work out for everyone in terms of table layouts. And so you might not get good footfall. There's so many factors that come down to whether or not you get good conversation sales, e etc. that's completely outwith your control but it's also at some case outside their organizers control because they've been given x-minute space and they have to do whatever they can with it other times i've been to conventions that have been smaller and logically before you go you think right well this is smaller than say something like power con or epic on and then it's like totally bigger than you could possibly imagine the example that i would give is decon i was at decon and at the start of april there and it was absolutely phenomenal i had a great time there was so many passionate not just cosplayers but artists and just punters in general that were just having a great time and they wanted to chat it was weird the resident evil crew was absolutely out that day i can absolutely guarantee that lots of people in the fluffy leather jackets and i'm like that's a leon red dress that's an ada there was a couple that came up to me i don't know if they were a couple couple or they were just friends but one of them was claire and one of them was like a femme leon and the kind of black leather jacket and they say that they were at the night market beforehand and they were like yeah nobody recognized us and i was like that is i crime that's an absolute crime and then the day of the con they put on a bit of blood and stuff like that and suddenly i was like the sixth person or seventh person that recognized them and i was just like this is phenomenal it's just when you get those types of people that are part of the fandom and they want to be passionate and they want to engage that's when the magic happens and that can happen at big and small cons it just depends on it's I suppose it's where you're seated or how they lay it out or the weather or whatever. There's so many factors that go down to it. I would say that I've never had a con that's surprised me as much as D-Con, but at the same time, I've never felt that the bigger cons have been weird or different or it's a very odd thing. I would say different, but not necessarily better or worse. No, that's absolutely valid. Because the amount of ones I've been to, whether they're bigger or smaller, you're right, it always comes down to how it's been organised and everything, how it's been laid out. And I have to say, I've not ever been to a con yet where, you know how you see in Reddit and things like that, where people post... oh, I had a terrible position for, because I saw one the other day, and it was like an artist who was an artist ally, but for some reason they put, think it was like the wrestling ring and for this particular con right beside her. So all the people who were watching it were surrounding her table, but it meant that nobody was going to them to actually buy stuff. Yeah, I've never had anything like that, I have to say. I think that, at least for now in terms of organisers and things, that Scotland does organise a good con.
00:21:57
Speaker
no i would have to agree i've heard those horror stories before don't get me wrong i think people with sensory sensitivities mass myself included i have been at events and fantasy con being one of them this has nothing to do with the organization itself but having the live music on the stage was one phenomenal don't get me wrong it was great but it did make things a little bit challenging in terms of chatting to people and you know you're trying not to shout but you're also trying to make sure that you can hear everything and that's a challenge in itself footfall as well think it was one of the epic cons or acme cons but i was at corner for the aisle and lot of cosplayers were like congregating and chatting and i get it these are busy events and people have to find wee kind of shelters of space where they can kind of catch up with their friends and i totally understand that but at the same time they're totally blocking my entire table and i've tried to do the move of like walking front of the table and fixing the prints and kind of push them in the opposite direction and they never get it spatial awareness or whatever it is so those kind of challenges can and do happen but again it's another thing that's out of your control and if you can get the most out of the event in a way that makes sure that you have a good time the customers who do come to have a good time and then you're doing your due diligence afterwards to be like thank you to all the people that were are kind building that community around it i've certainly had repeat customers and people that really engage social media wise yourself being one of them that it does make you feel like even if you go and it's like oh i didn't have a great time whatever there is that lingering sense of community and there's that lingering sense of camaraderie with other creators that means that you do build a network and i don't think any event can really be called a failure or a miss if you do walk away with some connection or no i Absolutely. And I mean, that is partly why I absolutely, other than the art, of course, but that is why I love going to see the artist's alleys and things like that. Because don't get me wrong, the vendors and things, they're all writing things, but, you know, usually it's like companies or people who have like a big backing and everything and you think you're going to buy something from them and then they're just going to disappear. They're not really going to, again, I'm not saying you should buy stuff in order to say, oh, yeah, network work with me because I bought something. That's not the case at all. But, you know, it's so good to be able to go through Artist Alley especially and see all these independent creators and things and be able to chat to them, get their interests. And that's why I give out the packs as well, because I'm like, I really want to support them and things and obviously there's always a mixed response to that sometimes people will say oh that's great and they'll either follow me or we'll talk after you know it's absolutely fantastic and then there's one or two again this is very rare but there's one or two that kind of looked at me and went what's this like it's just you know it's a sticker it's a business card I'm a podcaster and I'm wearing the big chat tsunami hoodie with the big red panda and the microphone and they're like all right so Fair enough. Into the bin it goes. No, obviously, you know, jokes aside, I'm not saying that everybody has to be like, oh, yeah, have to follow. But yeah, it is so cool seeing the work that everybody produces. And especially when you get to see the work online and everything as well and cross promote them as well. Because I mean, I keep seeing your artwork pop up and everything. And it's fantastic. like Speaking of your artwork. is something i want to touch on because you mentioned Resident Evil which is something that I think you said there that you are a fan of see for certain cons that come up because I know you do things like Star Wars especially and as you said you've got World of Warcraft and Resident Evil do you just sell what you want to or do you try and gear your content towards like for example because Resident Evil Requiem came out oh I think a couple of months ago it was do you try and get more resident evil style illustrations out in the forefront or do you just keep to the same types of illustrations you usually do i think it comes down to a mix of both i can't yeah firmly put myself in either camp purely because i make the stuff that i want to make and that's the good thing about basically being in and this kind of job i don't have to fill out any contracts or anything like that it's all self-generated that's a curse
00:26:06
Speaker
and a benefit because trying to come up with self-generated content can be quite tough. But if it's something you're passionate about and something you're interested in and it's in the zeitgeist at the same time, that's kind of the perfect marriage of both. I do try to kind of think about what's in the zeitgeist at that time, what's popular, but at the same time, I feel that having stuff that I'm passionate about and I like multiple times at different conventions means that you kind of build up a sort of brand, if that makes sense. Yeah, I'm more than happy to be called the guy that has the Warcraft Prince. That doesn't bother me at all because that means that it's being seen and people are coming up and that's becoming an identifying characteristic. And I have had people say, oh, I was told that someone did Warcraft Prince, etc. That can help a lot when you've got something that's not necessarily niche because it's the biggest MMO of all time. But you don't typically see a lot of it. I would say that something like Baldur's Gate or stuff like Hasbun Hotel or Good Omens or stuff like that, something you see much more often. And that's not a dig on anyone who does do that kind of content. It's absolutely what people are passionate about. But finding a niche is also something that you can do. Mixing the Star Wars, there's the Mandalorian and Grogu coming out soon. That's obviously going have a fan base that people are going to be interested in. But also Resident Evil, which did have a game that came out recently. And I think they're doing a free DLC next month. And so that's going have like a bit of an uptick in players and that kind of thing. And doing that means that I can show people what I'm interested in. They can come up to me and say, oh, I'm interested in that. And we can have that connection. So in a very long winded way answer your question, It is a mix of both. You have to do stuff that you're passionate about, but you can't be deaf to demand. Oh no, absolutely. And maybe it was because I was there on the last day, but I was really surprised that although there were a lot of Resident Evil cosplayers, there wasn't as many as I thought there would be. Although then again, they would probably have gone home by that point. but They had bought all the stickers and they're like, yeah, no, we're going. But that totally makes sense, though, because when I was going round, what I was surprised at was there was a lot of people who seemed to share the same ethos there that although they had a few popular things like, the resident evil stuff and everything else that's come out just now that a lot of them did still try to sell their own things whether that was you know sonic stuff or i'm trying to think there was honestly just so many it'd be hard to think off the top my head but there was a lot of retro stuff as well like as you were saying all this kind of of pixel art and one of the stalls i cannot remember for the life of me because i meant to go back and i don't think i got time to go back and get one of the stickers but i just remember seeing it and it was like oh that's so cool that's awesome and it's honestly interesting to see how diverse it seems in terms of the content that you're getting personal do you think there's been a shift you see when you started going to conventions versus now doing them do you think there's a shift in the way artists are approaching it and everything or do you feel as if it's kind of much of the same It's an interesting interesting
Evolving Approaches at Conventions
00:29:10
Speaker
one. I can definitely tell you that my way of approaching it has changed. Having gone from zero experience to now coming up for three years, your interpretation of how the events goes is going to be different purely because when I started, I had like a folder and two stands and that was it. And then building that up over a number of years to kind of not necessarily match what other people are doing, but certainly looking at other stalls and going, oh, well I could use that and that's pretty cool. And then you make friends with people and they say, oh, well, that worked for me, that didn't work for me, etc. That ends up being an invaluable resource. But at the same time, i think that finding a niche is something that's becoming much more prevalent. I've made a lot of friends that, for example, I know someone called Icewreath who does these kind of really intricate sword designs. They're almost like kind of... emblems, I think I would call them, and they do these enamel pins and prints and coat bags. And I said to him, actually, i was like, I wish I had thought of that to do the sword thing, because that is just such a cool idea and you can pull from anything that has a sword. You've got Game of Thrones, you've got Lord the Rings, you've got Lord of Warcraft, you've got whatever video games of any variety. And it becomes such an iconic buildup. grand thing and I think that that's something that I think many more people are starting to feed into of going I have a skill that I share with all these people because all of us can draw all of us can render and we all do it in a different way we've all got our own processes but at the same time figuring out what ideas that you have that people can resonate with does seem to be something I'm seeing a lot more as opposed to the kind of going with a thought and a prayer which is what I did initially and just going look this is the stuff that I've got take it or leave it kind of thing I think there is a little bit of business management that does have to come into that unfortunately for those of us that are really poor at that I try to think of things business like but then it becomes too impartial and then I try to be really passionate about it and then you kind of get that oh well nobody they really bought that thing that I was really interested at the moment and it's finding that middle ground 100% no I can imagine because I mean even when I'm looking at things at the podcast and i'll look at topics so that I think oh I really we want to talk about that and then you look at the analytics and you think oh why here are people not interested and then it was actually something that one of my friends brought up when we did I think it was Bioshock month And a couple of weeks before then, we had done an episode on K-pop Demon Hunters. That is genuinely the outlier of the show because it blew up in popularity. No episode has come close to it. And the reason I think was because we did it so close to then. But then my friend, when we were doing the last episode for it, I was kind of joking, saying, oh, wonder why people aren't as interested. And they said, well, maybe because it's a 20-year-old game here. talking about and I was like do you know what I think you have a point and you're completely right yeah it is that as you say trying to find your niche but then marrying it with something you enjoy that also is going to appeal to everyone else because I mean to be honest i think Star Wars is always going to be hit with everyone because you know it's recognizable and it doesn't really matter whether you're a fan of the sequels prequels or the original trilogy or whatever you're always going to find something within Star Wars that you know you're going to gravitate towards I mean same world of Warcraft as well you know you're always going to find your thing within that property and That is always amazing when you do find that. Out of curiosity though, and not to pit you against your own creations here, but is there any one particular franchise that you prefer working on compared to the others? I think World of Warcraft does have my heart at the moment, just because you're right in saying that there are so many characters that people can kind of insert themselves in. And not only that, but people create their own. And that has huge...
00:32:48
Speaker
huge potential for your own personality shining through. I met a Death Knight cosplayer who was super lovely. if She had done this foam. It was actually a particular gear set from The War Within where it was a blue Arathi plate set, but they had done it as their death knight character and they had their weapons that they were using and all that sort of stuff and and that is the community that comes through on that front and everybody has their own favourite character and it can be almost impossible to have whatever any one particular person is looking for but at the same time when it's something as dear as that people can go I like this character okay, you don't have that character, but I know that you like this thing and there's stuff about that that we can talk about. And I might have a friend who does like that character. And so it leads to this sort of communal sense of people do remember and rally around the thing that you're interested in and you have common ground. But with Star Wars as well. So recently, Darth Revan has probably been my most popular character that people do pick up.
00:33:49
Speaker
that's just the power of that character and how it's endured and as you say Bioshock being a 20 year old game Knights Republic being exactly the same but that staying power people go I don't see Darth Revan that often the two big sellers I had at Deacon were my Darth Revan keychain and my Leon keychain and that was just you know one of them's in Zeitgeist one of them um hasn't had any pr in a long time but there's that franchise staying power and then i had another person come up i had recently done a darth nihilist from rights republic 2 and recently i found a darth trea thing i'm now getting this darth nihilist thing off you i'm just looking for a darth scion to finish the sith trambrick and i was like that is such a cool thing and it speaks to people investment because this isn't something that's know people collect like Darth Vader and the Emperor and and whatever and that's fine but this person has gone out of their way to be like this one particular game that came out in 2005 that nobody's really talking about but still has this huge popularity and he's like that's the thing that I'm collecting that's the thing that I want to get and had I not had that print visible he would resort by and so it ends up having this I don't know have what you call it this kind of sense of you don't know what people are going to show up on the day so for me star wars has been my lifelong love apart from my husband yeah star wars has been my lifelong love that i'll always fall in and out of in terms of my hyper focus on it but while the work has been there since the beginning as well and so for me they are the two things that just fuels the fire so to speak and makes it so much easier to go i want to do this line of characters and i want to do this series of prints and i want to take this idea that i've seen here and apply it to this and it ends up just being this ultimately super creative thing that has all this versatility where you can endlessly create around this thing and people will understand it's not too niche it's not too weird it's not too people will go i see exactly what you're doing and i think that just allows it to have so much more legs not to say that i haven't done things purely for yeah out of it pokemon being one of them like my husband loves pokemon my nephews love pokemon i get it it's just not in my top 10 like i've been playing pocopia and that but did do loads of pokemon badges because i'm like let's just do a bunch of pokemon let's go for it and see how it goes so it is that as we were talking about earlier do you do it for popularity or do you do it for passion I was trying to think of what caught my eye when I was going by your stall.
00:36:07
Speaker
As I was saying, it was that Feathers McGraw sticker. And again, it's that idea of you look at it and I know it sounds so silly to say, oh look, it's the thing from the thing I loved years and years ago. But you look at it and catches your eye. You're completely right. And you're like, wow, this is really cool. This is really well done and everything. You're completely right. It's that ah power of, I mean, nostalgia as well. but that kind of recognisable aspect as well, because it's not like, I don't think there'd be many people doing complete background characters that nobody would know from Star Wars or things. I mean, some stills have, but as you said, for Darth Revan, he is still popular enough. Again, Jesus, 20 years ago, that is a punch to the thinking um but yeah he's still really popular and i know there's been talks about the old republic because the i think it's the high republic is kind of taken over that just now until they bring out the new game and everything well it is the new game yeah they did a elder scroll 6 thing where they were like oh yeah we're working on but i don't know when
00:37:11
Speaker
Was it the Star Wars Eclipse one? Oh yeah, that too. Was that the Quote Dream or something? Yeah, that was supposed to be set during the High Republic era. I read a lot of the first phase of the High Republic, the novels. This is where it gets really annoying because there's so many levels of interaction with this thing because there's adult books then there's young adult books then there's kids books then they started doing middle grade books and then there's the comics as well the adult books were like the avenger style here's all the different characters coming together and fighting the big thing then the young adult books were centered during this one character called wreath silas who was going on all these adventures and then i never read the children's books because they were just pictures and three sentences in a page which is fair enough it's just not for me and then the comics followed this character called keith shenis who was becoming a jedi knight and then They would all kind of cross and interlink with each other. Obviously the Acolyte coming kind of closer to the Phantom Menace at that point. But the Quantic Dream thing, they were just like, yeah, this is Setchum, the High Republic. And I'm like, you know what? I was never a huge fan of Quantic Dream's style of game only because I had burnt myself out on the Telltale games. Oh, yeah. And it's because they were doing two a year or something like that. Because I played The Walking Dead, Wolf Among Us, and there was another one, I can't remember, Guardians Galaxy, I think. there was two batman seasons and i played both of those i get so burnt out on that format that when i think i got destroyed become human and i was like this is cool but i'm not really wanting to sit and watch cut scenes and press buttons and that kind of thing that's just i had done that that's not to say that there's anything wrong with that i know a lot of people really love connor from that game and obviously clancy brown was in it he's phenomenal and everything that he's in but at the same time the idea of quantum dream doing a star wars game i was like oh look okay that's really interesting and to me it's like where does this go and then doing a Knights Republic remake and just showing the kind of Darth Revan thing like I absolutely lost my mind at the time going I hope this comes out relatively soon and here we are like five years later you know you've got articles coming out every other week going it's still alive and I'm like I'll believe it when I see it so I think Star Wars at the moment is at this weird junction where they're not really sure what's going on I suppose that makes it a bit hard to create stuff about it I mean I don't know if you've been watching Maul at the moment yeah It's been really good so
Star Wars and Gaming Industry Trends
00:39:20
Speaker
far. Part of me goes, oh, it's because Darth Maul was such an iconic character that it's almost impossible to not enjoy it because it's got everything that makes Darth Maul cool and everything that makes Clone Wars cool. But at the same time, you know, how many Star Wars games can get cancelled before I go, I don't really know if I'm wanting to continue investing in this long term. But I think that's a games industry industry thing in general. it's not just Star Wars. Yeah, Star Wars games, they are in a funny place right now because you know you have the Jedi Survivor series which seems to be doing really well, that seems to be the new mainstream one that everybody seems to gravitate towards. But as you said, for Star Wars Eclipse, I remember I had to double take when I heard Quantic Dream was attached to that because I was like, excuse you, David Cage Quantic Dream? Because my friend Jules and I from Bad Games Jules, we did a whole month dedicated to Quantic Dream. And trust me, I know what you mean about getting burned out. Because I played, with the exception of Heavy Rain, because I played that so many darn times. But I played Fahrenheit, Indigo Prophecy. I played Beyond Two Souls. That was terrible. I would not recommend that to my worst enemy. Yeah. Yeah. oh, that's cool. And yeah, it seems to be like a AAA issue for a lot of these gaming companies because the elder grow sex with 6, where there's a lot of 6s because GTA 6, which seems to be getting pushed back further further. mean, there used to be the joke with Silksong, but they released it, yeah. I'm not allowed to joke about it for legal reasons. I'm not allowed to about it. Yeah, it seems to be an issue where they'll get ahead of the hype and they'll announce it. I mean, Mass Effect 5, that was another one that still breaks my heart when you released that trailer and it was the person with the daft punk helmet and the big jack and everything. And they're like, oh, we're selling the jacket now. And it's like, that's great when you're selling the game.
00:41:28
Speaker
ah like no The thing for me is that, say you look at something like Crash Bandicoot or Spyro, right, games that were coming out when I was a kid. It was like a nine to ten month turnaround, maybe 18 months at a push. Like Somniac released the Spyro trilogy, was it something like 96, 98, 99, something like that? And that was it done. That's three games in four years, something like that.
00:41:48
Speaker
Now, as an example, Fallout 4 came out 11 years ago. The only other Fallout game we've had in that time is Fallout 76, which would have been, you know, in the bygone era of the 2000s, a kind of standalone DLC type thing. And that's been the quote-unquote Fallout be-all and end-all gaming-wise since 2018. I think that's when that came out. And so, you know, we're looking at Elder Scrolls VI coming out and you're saying, okay, so it's been 50. years since Skyrim and then you get Elder Scrolls 6 and then you're looking at whenever a Fallout 5 or whatever form that I might take will come out eventually and that would be 20 years to get two games and a single franchise out and so obviously they're pivoting to remakes and remasters and re-releases I mean who does it better than Bethesda but um I think yeah it gets to point where you go you kind of have to play what's ah available and not get too caught up on what should be coming out because things are getting cancelled left right and center and then you've got someone saying oh well this was cancelled and then someone else comes out and says no it's not cancelled and then it is cancelled but then it comes back and then it's in development hell and it's impossible to keep up with because I think for the average consumer think i call us like outliers in terms of who keeps up with the news to the extent of not everyone hears about the fact that it was cancelled and then it is cancelled again and then it's coming back and then another studio's picked up and etc the average person just waits for the trailer and then it's on the playstation front page or steam or or whatever and then they're like right well i'll get that for my myself or my son or daughter or whatever for christmas The average consumer doesn't care about quarterly reviews. I mean, I don't care about quarterly reviews for these big companies, but I think the problem is that there's that dissonance between, say, for example, how Cyberpunk released. You would think a company like CD Projekt Red, who has its own publishing company, would understand that the developers need more time to finish the game. And then they go, no, we need to out this quarter. And then it comes out, and obviously it's broken because they haven't had enough time to work on it. And you play Cyberpunk now after, like, Phantom Liberty and the DLC, not the DLC, the free updates that were done after that. And it's great. It's maybe not exactly what they were advertising, it's still great. But at the same time, you go, that shouldn't have come out in the state that's in, and it could have done irreparable damage to the brand. That's a story that hear several times a year, I think. I mean, that Crimson Desert, I think, got quite a bad rap, but there's quite a lot of a fan base around it, and I've played a bit of it, and it's been enjoyable. But I get what people say. oh It's a lot, and it's trying to do a million different things at once. And then you've got people like Larian going, oh, i was it the publishing guy? Larian was like, yeah, it's trying to do a million different things, but none of it's good. and then, you know, it becomes this kind of name-calling thing. It's just, yeah, it's not great space to be in gaming-wise at the moment. Because, I mean, don't get me wrong, you still got games that came out and they were a mess and everything, but usually they would fall to the wayside, whereas maybe it was just because it was the pressure of that they had to actually make the game good because they couldn't update it, whereas nowadays, especially with, as you said, Cyberpunk, that was a blooming nightmare. Yeah.
00:44:42
Speaker
When it came out, I remember No Man's Sky as well. That was another one totally infamous. yeah And now there's a massive community behind it that people play it constantly. They say, oh, it's getting updates and everything. i mean, it's great to see that bounce back, but I think that and I don't know again if it's just a change in the demographic of people who are consuming the content but there seems to be a lot more negativity in the gaming space that some people as silly as it sounds they want these games to fail just so that they can have something to complain about There's a big difference between, you know, critiquing it rightfully, like with Fallout 76 when it first came out, or No Man's Sky, or Cyberpunk, versus nowadays it's all fixed and everything, it's happy, people are holding hands singing kumbaya.
00:45:29
Speaker
yeah or I like to think so but people will still come and complain about it and be like oh that's awful although I remember last year or the year before I tried playing it my PC and I got a terrible glitch in one of the I think it was one of the cutscenes in Cyberpunk where it was you're walking with I think it's Jackie and you're chatting away only my character for some reason decided oh I don't need a head and started T-posing and floating through and I was like Oh my god, what the hell is
Negativity in Gaming and Fandoms
00:45:58
Speaker
going on? But again, that is a terrible glitch and everything. But I wouldn't take that glitch and then start going to everybody who loves cyberpunk and being like, look at this, it's awful, here you should be enjoying it. You can't enjoy this, this is terrible. Yeah, it does seem to be the overriding thing. The example that I would give is a Star Wars Outlaws. Oh yes, uh-huh. That had a lot of flack. And I played it and I was like, this is fine. If you want to do the smuggler fantasy and you're going through the different syndicates like the Pikes or the Hutt Cartel and you're wanting to do the reputation thing and do jobs for them. And it was a fantastic game from that perspective. Obviously, there was things that... as with any of these kind of games community feedback ends up creating something better than initially it released specifically i think there was you could pick up weapons but when you went to a ladder she would drop the weapon or you were going to cover and she would drop the weapon and it was like doesn't it make sense to just kind of put the weapon on the back and then it's got like a limited ammo and then when you run out of ammo that's when you put it down that did come in an update and there's genuine things that can improve an experience after launch but half the flack that it got was, I don't know if it was just people who were angry because they were told to be angry by a bunch of hate YouTubers or whatever.
00:47:09
Speaker
I don't know, but I thought it was good. As a person who enjoys Star Wars, I am like a Jedi and Sith man. I played Knights Republic and the Jedi Knight games and Force Unleashed, Battlefront, those kind of things. And obviously you get the hero thing and it's like well i'm going to earth mollet obviously like other people have the boba fett fantasy they've wanted 1313 people have the smuggler fantasy the han solo or cruising around with lando cal risdian all that sort of stuff and people should have the length and breadth to kind of go this is the thing that i want to play to me it always felt like outlaws was trying to be this shadows of the empire canon spiritual successor replacement thing because it's the first thing that basically anything that they've done outside the comics that's set between five and six and so people rightfully enjoyed what it was i think the people that didn't either didn't understand what the project was supposed to be or they were just told by whoever that they had to hate it because it was Ubisoft because it was a woman or because whatever and it just becomes so tiring to be in a space like that where you want to be critical of these companies to the extent of you have to one take care of your employees and to deliver a high quality product at the same time you can't just be hating on it just because you've decided that that's the case doesn't mean you have to play it and enjoy it it just means that you move on no absolutely because you're completely right the amount of youtubers nowadays and let's face it think the reason they do it is because it's profitable just to turn around to be quite hateful and say oh you have to hate it because of xyz when we did star wars month i think it was two years ago god that makes me feel old but we went through the prequel trilogy the originals the sequels they also talked about battlefront and i think we did a trivia quiz I can't remember but when we were doing the sequel trilogy that was I mean we just did a complete deep dive into that where were like oh boy I can't wait to see what people said about this trilogy and don't get me wrong I'm one of those people that I do have genuine issues with it but not to the same extent as some of the absolute crazies online I'm just gonna call as is because the amount of people who genuinely were frothing at the mouth for certain things and I get being passionate and everything i get people wanting to say this isn't what i thought it would be and that is perfectly fine to criticize it but there's a fine line between criticizing it versus just straight up throwing all that vitriol and hate at something yeah sending death threats to people essentially yeah that's not ideal either
00:49:36
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you haven't made it unless you've got a death threat in your DMs. Yeah, true. One day. I'm joking. One day. I'm joking. For legal reasons, no, don't send me a death threat. Please don't. Yeah, it wouldn't be ideal. It'd spoil my day. Come on. But you know, it poisons the well for everything else that comes after. to it because for example with maul or the ahsoka series for example or the acolyte you know don't get me wrong i like certain bits of it and other bits i think oh they could have done that better but at the end of the day although i'm big star wars fan i wouldn't say it rules over my kind of critical thinking i were and i don't want to sound as if i'm on like a high horse here but genuinely it's like at the end of the day it's a multi-million pound or dollar or company well sorry billion not million But, yeah you know, it's so profitable. It's by Disney. You know, they're not always going to get a hit. They're always going to get misses and everything. And that's fine because it actually reminded me of, and I don't know if you're a Doctor Who fan, are you? Yeah. Yeah, right. Okay. So I'm in safe territory to here. So... yeah i don't know how you felt but i had problems with you know the last season and just that it was more to do with the writing and things but what i didn't like in terms of the discourse around that was just how vile that a lot of people were becoming and it was getting to the point where i was like i'm not sure that the people who are complaining about this are actually fans of the show you know they're like oh it was so much better back this time and that time. You're like, really? When there were cardboard box monsters? I mean, come on, have a word with yourself. ah I could see the frustrations, but when they were kind of gearing it towards, oh yeah, but you should be outraged because of this character or that. And would you say that is quite, and I hate to say it, but it seems to be quite common with a lot a sci-fi franchises nowadays. I wouldn't even say just sci-fi franchises. I mean, look at the response to the Rings of Power. Oh, yeah. I think it's something that I could go on about, and it is a bit kind of on the negative side. Yeah, yeah. that thing about inside me, there are two wolves. There's the wolf that likes fantasy and sci-fi series, and then there's the one that likes good writing and and yeah interesting concepts. Mm-hmm. and yes they're fighting for dominance and whatever but at the same time like I can watch something like say the Acolyte or the latest series Doctor Who and go there's lots of things that I would have done differently but at the same time I don't know what it's like to run a TV show I don't know what it's like to write for a TV show I don't know what it's like to direct on a day to day basis and get up every morning and have to go right well we need get this thing done today and whatever I totally get that it's very easy for me to sit with my keyboard and kind go I didn't like X, Y, at the same token you can still be critical of this stuff it's just why you're critical of this problem if i say i didn't like this last year's of doctor who because i don't think it served the characters that it was showing like omega as this weird skull thing or the ranny doing the bi-generation thing and then anita dobson's version kind of getting sideline yeah
00:52:32
Speaker
so many weird decisions that kind of came out nowhere as opposed to somebody going, I don't like Dog 2 because it's quote unquote woke or it's, you know, the Doctor shouldn't be a black guy or it shouldn't be a woman or shouldn't be whatever. And that is the thing that I immediately, like any criticism that you try to throw my way at that point, I just go, no, because that is not a criticism. That is a complete, completely subjective and also very hateful opinion that i don't want to you can tell me i didn't like it because you know the writing didn't serve the characters as i've said but once it goes into that territory i know that it's not going to be a constructive conversation i mean the worst one for that i think is star trek as well because don't get me wrong i love deep space 9 tng tls i can take it or leave it i know it's the iconic one and that's you know heresy but i think it's probably the same opinion as have on classic who mean classic classic who i can see why it was so pioneering at the time but watching it through a modern lens you're like yes i think gonna be dated, I'm not gonna lie. Watching things like Discovery, I mean I really didn't like Discovery, but again the reasons I didn't like it was more to do with it's not how I would have envisioned that kind of direction that they were taking. That it was just the fact that everyone swore and it didn't really feel like Star Trek. It just felt like another sci-fi show, which is all fine and good. If that was the show that we're going for, fine. But again, yeah the reasons that some people were going at it, I was like, yeah, no, no, no, no. as you said it's not worth engaging with that kind of bad faith argument especially i can't remember the person but i wouldn't name them anyway but there was one guy i remember who was for some reason he was making these ai thumbnails of the characters and it was women in particular that they were it was just very sexist and misogynist and then it would be a bunch of these random guys they'd be round a podcast mike i know the irony but into podcasting and they'd be like, oh, I hate it, oh, back in the day. And, you know, it's so tiring to hear the same thing over and over. And again, if you're going to, you know, critique it and say, I don't like this, I think they should have done that. That is absolutely valid. I'm not in
00:54:45
Speaker
a toxic positive way saying oh you can't criticize anything but if you're doing it in such a hateful way that even when people are listening to it they kind of think well are you fan of the show because it sounds as if you do nothing but hate on it you know yeah i've seen a lot of conversations about people moving away from a franchise and that is exactly what you should do if you do not feel like this serves you anymore if this is not what you envision for this walk away because it's not going to change or get any better and nobody's going to be taking on your specific criticism because there's hundreds and thousands of millions of people who will be engaging with this in and both a positive and a negative way and there's only so much that they can do to please everyone. Specifically something like, just to throw out an example, Resident Evil, right? Resident Evil 7 being this huge departure from what the previous titles were but also this weird kind of return to roots survival horror house thing So it being both a departure and a return to form is very odd and it's obviously going to be polarising to some hardcore fans but obviously it's also critically acclaimed with a lot of fans and that's a positive example of someone saying this isn't for me but whatever as someone who was the first
00:55:54
Speaker
game that they played
Resident Evil and Game Preservation
00:55:55
Speaker
all the way through. I absolutely love it. I think the inspiration of a lot of the characters, for example, like Jack Baker being a lot like Jack Fornce from The Shining, Lucas being a lot like kind of Jigsaw in a lot ways. Obviously, The Ring, Samara, Allegories with Evelyn. think That's all great stuff and whatever. But at the same time, if that's a direction that you don't like, fair enough.
00:56:14
Speaker
Obviously, there was a reason why they did the remakes and then made it a toggleable FPS versus third person for Requiem because there's fans of both. And that's a good way to cater to fans of both because you can now play them both either first person or you can play them all third person, which what I did. I think that's a totally reasonable way to kind of engage with it if you're not enjoying it.
00:56:34
Speaker
Move on. Because funny enough, I remember, and I must honestly have the worst luck when it comes to falling in the middle of an argument for these types of fandoms, but I remember, again, there was that argument of people saying that the Resident Evil 4 remake... is one of the worst things ever it's a war crime it's terrible it made baby jesus cry etc and genuinely you're like oh right okay because they prefer the original again this game for me personally it was the first resident evil game i played from start to finish and it was so good that it genuinely inspired me to go away play all the other games grab a couple of friends and say okay we're doing the resident evil month and we played i say we i played all the way from the first remake through to number eight which I think was the latest game at the time and then I played Revelations 1 and 2 and we did a spin-off episode over for that and that was so much fun going through those games and talking about them with my friends and fellow podcasters and whatnot but when you're looking at people online who are saying no you shouldn't enjoy 4 remake you should be enjoying 4 and everything but has to be in the original hardware and you You have to have the janky controls and things. And it's like, once again, I get how it pioneered that type of action gameplay and how it was so refreshing and whatnot. And and for the remake and the original, they both blend action and horror so seamlessly. As you said, I can see why people maybe don't like the newer ones, especially 5 and 6. They became very much more action oriented. Chris punching the boulder and that kind of thing. it's a bit silly, but at the same time, Resident Evil's always been a little bit silly. Not yeah always, but I mean, the first game ah literally has Chris laughing at Wesker, and that is one of my favourite scenes of all time. Yeah. I mean, how does it work if you get bit by a zombie and then you eat like a plant? That's just inherently silly in itself. I was actually having this conversation with someone the other day about, spoilers for anyone who hasn't played Resident Evil Village, the twist with Ethan with the moulds. yeah because they gamify it to the nth degree where you're like this makes total sense because it's a video game and he gets his hand chopped off and then he puts the first aid thing on it and it attaches itself back on and you're like oh well it's just a video game that makes sense and then there's actually a twist associated with it they totally play into your expectations in that sense it's a silly franchise to some degree because one zombies aren't real i don't know if you don't that two the dialogue and leon's quips at the end of like what is it bingo night you know that stuff is just so as a japanese studio trying to figure out what like american people are actually like and not really getting that culture shift which is i'm assuming the same vice versa like an american studio making a japanese game and it being totally weird to them they're like i don't get what this is that's part of the charm that's what makes it one is i think going to the extreme of saying you know this has to be 100 authentic they've made my game into a mockery because a man punched a rock in resident evil 6 the best move that you can do is like that dive all the time and rolling about and all that sort of stuff it's just part of the vibe you know the artistic direction that they decide to go in and it makes it what is it can't be 100 serious because if it's 100 serious there's no interest in it at that point Because, say for example, when you walk into the kitchen in the care home in Requiem and, can't remember his name, the cook guy, he just turns around and then you're supposed to run around him and all that. By the time you get to a point where you are an expert in the game, you can run absolute rings around him and that is part of the design. At that point, it becomes totally silly because all the zombies just, they behave so oddly and they're still doing their routines a little bit. There's the doctor guy that has the big blade and he's just running about and That's just part of the design ethos that went into those games to make them super arcade-y. I mean, you get a rank for finishing it at a certain time. Like, it's very arcade-y at that point. So I understand why people would be like, oh, I prefer, say, for example, 4, which has a kind of stylised graphics, and then saying that the 4 remake is too realistic. Totally understand. But at the same time, there's space for both, because now we have, like, a Leon trilogy of 2, 4, and 9. that it's all the same actor, it's all the same face model, it all congeals together, it's all one throughline. Especially for horror gamers, I feel as if there is a lot of people who are adamant the original is always going to be the best and everything, and you know there's the other side that say the remakes are perfectly fine, and you know i mean there's a lot to consider there are between the artistic direction the fact that the gaming has come a long way since those games have come out the one that i remember other than resident than evil was silent hill and especially the silent hill 2 remake the amount of hate that some of the developers got over that where it's like oh you changed the lighting for this or oh you did that and you know on the one hand you think okay i can get why people are comp complaining about this and that. And then on the other hand, it's like, yeah, tone it down a little bit. It's a video game. Like, I know it's important to you, but tone it down a wee bit here because, yeah, it's not worth sending. Again, death threats, they've made it big.
01:01:38
Speaker
It's not, absolutely, it's not worth it. And I can't imagine being a fan of a franchise where not only have you got access to the originals, but you've also got access to an absolutely fantastic remake, but then still complaining about it. I think that the point should be that both should be available. And they are, you know, they just recently added the first three to Steam. They've been on GLG without the DRM for a while.
01:02:02
Speaker
Superseding is probably the problem of saying, like, for example, the Warcraft 3 remake didn't have the best reception. And there's a number of reasons for why that is. But one of them being that they totally removed the ability to play the originals. And so people who, as an example, going, right, you don't have to play it. Well, actually I do because I can't access my original. I have the physical discs and I can't play them. think they did a thing where if you put in your key code into battle.net, you would get a digital version of the original games. And then when the remake came out, they just wiped them and you can't play them now. And I think that's the problem. is someone can always play Resident Evil 1 or the director's cut or the remake or eventually when they inevitably do the third person style remake of 1 and 0 and whatever that's probably what's going to happen because it will make a lot of money and I probably will play it as well let's not pretend you know I can't pretend that Assassin's Creed Black Flag Resync isn't on my Steam wishlist at the moment even though it's probably going to be almost the exact same game you know i'm a bit of a sucker for that kind of thing i remember in 2016 i was playing four games and it was batman return to arkham the etio collection and then i think it was the resident evil one remake and i was like i'm not playing the originals of any of these and these are all games that i played like 10 years ago it's the nostalgia and i suppose part of you can say this was a time when games were good and there wasn't as you say like day one updates and patchy six months later to fix all the stuff that they didn't get right to begin with But also, I think that we're at a spot where people can go back and play the original Resident Evil, the original Silent Hills, the original whatever, as long as it's available and maintained, which I'm all in favour for. Yeah, because I know that's like a huge debate as well about game preservation and things. I know you're probably the same but I'm totally for that as long as it's in a playable state and everything and you're able to get access because that's the problem I think I have with a lot of Nintendo games especially the older Pokemon games when they brought out I think it was you yeah it was it was Leaf Green and And FireRed for the Switch. And don't get me wrong, I'm glad that they finally we brought it out. But I also remember in school, there was a lot of people who were, and by school, I mean high school, not primary school, but they were emulating it. And, you know, for legal reasons, I definitely wouldn't recommend emulating it. Otherwise, the Nintendo lawyers would be right after me. But... At the same time, the fact that that technology existed back then to be able to emulate a Game Boy game, yet somehow a multi-billion dollar company can't do the same thing in their hardware that's infinitely more powerful, you know, you're like, yeah. Well, why? It is a moneymaker and there must be a reason behind it, but again, it's up to these companies to try and preserve these and everything. and i know there'll be some games that probably won't be worth doing that, but for the ones that are, I mean, come on, guys. definitely can i don't know if you're familiar with it's a gog website that essentially like a wish list kind of thing for things to be brought back can't remember the name of it i have actually used it but what you do is you go on and you basically search the game that you like and then you vote for that game to be restored in some way and it's a quite a cool way of gog basically going okay we understand that people have an interest Yeah.
01:05:19
Speaker
and writes on our license or however it is and we'll try to bring it to our platform because they once it's on their platform eventually they might bring it to steam or epiic games or whatever they want to do and that just allows more people to play it the big example that i'm thinking of at the moment is the two black and white games i don't know if you ever played them from linehead yeah They are the number one and number two, I believe, on the website at the moment in terms of votes that people want. And then also the 2000s slate of like Marvel games are just not really available anywhere at all because the Activision licenses lapsed. so Those games are just totally unplayable through leg legitimate means, unless you have a PlayStation 2 or a PlayStation 1 or an Xbox or whatever. But even some of these games, if they're online or whatever, they disappear completely and there's just unavoidable about this thing that was part of my childhood doesn't exist anymore. There's lots of things that, examples of that for a multitude of other things that people want to hold on to. because mean the one that was I mean it wasn't a childhood favorite because I would sound like a psycho if I said that but Spec Ops Align when they just removed that completely and I mean I was absolutely horrified because I think I'd got the digital version of it and I thought yeah that's all right I'll play it and everything was absolutely blown away by it by how well maybe not gameplay wise but everything else story wise the way it was crafted i went away and read the writers i think it was his autobiography or something and he spoke about the process behind it it was just so fascinating to me and i thought this is just such an important part of gaming history and then all of a sudden for a company to go yeah we don't have the license boop that's it you can no longer buy this game and i was like what what Why? I mean, obviously not to the same extent, but I remember the controversy when the Deadpool game got pulled, and then i think that's the reason it costs like hundreds of pounds now at a CEX, because you can't physically get a copy anymore without this limited supply. Same with Rule of Rose, I think as well. That's a game I've never played. The only thing I know about it is its price tag, and that's it. It's things like The Simpsons Hit and Run as well, all these childhood classics that, you know, you go to CEX and it's like £25, and you're like, I don't want to play it yeah but people are clamoring come back in some shape or form i mean i know the rumors have been that microsoft is apparently close to like getting a deal with activision and marvel and all that to bring all those games back i don't know if that's getting any credence to it but you know the idea that that could happen is obviously good for one microsoft because people will
01:07:47
Speaker
pay for say for example the raimi trilogy spider-man games all on xbox you know that would be x-men origins wolverine maybe they tie that in just in time for marvel's wolverine coming i mean there's just so many printing money and that they could really do but again the will to do it is less than what we expect it to be but they want to make money they don't want to make gamers happy which i get because they want to fill their bottom line but at same thing I think it's quite sad that nowadays when you hear something positive in the gaming space and it's like, oh, they're reviving this old game that you forgot about. And you're like, oh, oh that's a surprise. yes there was one i sold recently and
Xbox Strategies and Market Shifts
01:08:23
Speaker
i think it was did you ever play the rock rats games when you were younger i played it was it the to deal yeah ahha cora one i think Yeah. Because Yeah, because I played that and I think the other one was the Search for Reptar or something like that. The only reason I bring it up is because i think it's a limited run games, which I know they've got their own host of controversies, but they had a thing where they said, oh, by the way, we are releasing a physical version of all of these games in one collection. And you know the way you're sitting there going, ah, yeah, very funny, April Fool's in And you're like, oh, it's not April Fills, it's actually real. And it does, it takes you off guard when you see something that positive and you're like oh, right, well, take the win, I suppose. But yeah, compared to, as you said, it's companies that want to make money off certain things and...
01:09:10
Speaker
Yeah, I kind of hope that maybe there'll be a shift as of recording this episode. I know Xbox are kind of moving towards the players more than what they used to. I don't know what the hell happened the last couple of years with Xbox where it was quite minimalist and it was very sterile and, oh, we are Microsoft games.
01:09:30
Speaker
Oh, can you play us, please? And you're like, no. It definitely seems to me like a top-down Microsoft decision that has gone extremely poorly because I'm not saying that it's a brain-dead move or whatever, but all this kind of idea of it's not Xbox, like everything's an Xbox, right? So if everything's an Xbox, I don't have to buy an Xbox. And then Xbox sales go down and they go, why did that happen? Shutting down studios and mass layoffs and cancelling games. And people lose faith in the brand and the idea. I remember when the Xbox series was coming out and the PlayStation 5, they were kind of slated for that November 2020. And it seemed like at the time Xbox was doing all the consumer friendly idea, right? You'll get the smart delivery. Whatever game that you've got for Xbox One that has an Xbox Series version, you don't have to do anything. You just put the game in and it will pick the best version if there is one available, right? Whereas PlayStation were doing the... get some of them for free but some of them well you'll have to pay for and some of them will release a new version and some of them won't get one but will kind of do a patch and that's very murky because I think that I suppose Nintendo did it as well with the Switch 2 for like the upgrades and that but I think that Xbox had done the consumer friendly option of saying you'll just get it it doesn't matter what it is you'll just get and that's how we'll do it and then color me surprised when playstation 5 was the higher performing console when the direction that xbox was going in for example like they did their worlds and then it opened up and indiana jones was going on playstation and starfield was going on playstation and that so it's very hard to keep track of that kind of thing but it ended up becoming quite obvious that xbox were no longer interested in supporting the xbox they were supporting microsoft gaming yeah they released Yeah.
01:11:19
Speaker
and xbox and your phones and xbox and your laptops and xboxs it surprised me because obviously i thought that phil spencer having kind of saved the xbox one from its disastrous one yeah thought that he was gonna be this i'm spearheading this for as long as i can and then obviously he's retired now and someone else has taken over but then they've obviously reduced the price of game pass and you know fable looks pretty good if it pays off so i don't know if this is the turning point or whatever but you know it's hard to underestimate people going for what they're comfortable with people maybe go for playstation 5 because they've always been with playstation or they buy call of duty and fifa or should i say ea sports whatever number it is now 26 because that's the one that they buy i don't know but At the same token, it's like, how can you convert gamers to new games when they're still playing the old ones? That's the thing that confused me about Concord and High Guard and any of these kind of hero shooters. I mean, the only one that's really done anything is Marvel Rivals, and I don't know if that's just because of the Marvel branding to pull away from Overwatch. But as we said about the films and TV shows they watch, it's very easy to sit back and go, that was a pretty stupid idea. But then you don't know what other people are saying, like higher ups and you have to get rid of X amount of people so that we have to get this amount of quarterly stuff. And then somebody's left with that horrible decision of going, look, like I don't have a job for you now. And it is weird thinking back, the especially as you were saying with the Xbox One coming out and the worst thing ever was it had to be online all the time. It was the water cooler of game consoles, whatever the hell that meant. And, you know, we went from that thing and that's the worst it could ever get and then we moved on from that to the kind of modern landscape where it's gone from yeah let's create fun games which don't get me wrong you still get fun games but they're more through the indie sphere rather than kind mainstream don't get me wrong you still get really fun mainstream games resident evil for example is the big one but it is definitely a mix between whether you're going to get something that is of that kind of quality versus yeah if it's gonna hold up to like your nostalgic expectations and i mean here's hoping as a kind of final point that here's hoping that they do improve in the future for that absolutely fingers crossed i mean maybe at the next con or that we will see a lot more gamers who are a lot more enthusiastic let's just say going around the stalls and be like yeah i love the game from the thing and it's like oh thank god gaming has healed yes Yeah, I hope so. i hope so. As a final point, speaking of cons, got to ask before we wrap up, is there anything else that you're working towards or looking forward to
Upcoming Conventions and Projects
01:13:58
Speaker
con-wise? Yeah, so I'm at Kaiju Con on the 16th of May. I have acquired a Leon Kennedy RPD cosplay that I'll be wearing that day. Oh, cool. and I'm hoping to have a Resident Evil 2 remake print available. I'm also working on a Daredevil Born Again print. I don't think that will be at KaijuCon unless there's some kind of miracle and it really gets finished quickly. I've also got the Gothic Markets Nocturne Market and the Trade Hall on the 31st of May, and then after that, there's a bit of a gap, and I've got the Unseelie Gathering on the 1st of August, and then can't remember when EpicCon is, but I'm doing a couple of stamps. Is it September think... That is definitely September, because it's always at the period when we usually have a month off between August and October, and it always kind of lands in between, so I'm like, right, okay, I can record for that. Yeah. Yeah, it's towards the end of September. Yeah, you're right. Because I last year it was the start of September, and I was like, what? Yeah. what is happening it's so odd but yeah so I've got two stamp rallies that i'm going to be in it's not concrete yet on who's involved but it's been run by a really friendly guy cop Matthew who does Helensbury Soapy Suds who does like these amazing soaps geeky soaps nerdy soaps bath bombs all that sort of stuff and it It's World of Warcraft one, which I think we've decided the theme is the different expansions. So everybody's going to pick their favourite expansion and make something for the prize in that vein. And then a Critical Role one, which I don't have all the information on yet, but we will be getting involved in that. So that's basically, I think, me up until EpicCon. Wow, you're going to be kept busy then. Tell me about it. And I've got a couple of holidays in June to relax. yeah So that basically means that I can get everything kick-started. in july move on from there and that's going to be awesome and to be honest i'll probably see you kaiju con uh if i go by your table i will say yes this is satsunami from chatsunami i won't be standing like in the background staring be like i'm your best fan are you related to this person
01:15:54
Speaker
waving in the background hello like that 73 yards woman just pointing yeah ff04 that's the table number so get that out there ff04 so there you go yeah i'll definitely keep an eye out for sure because i'll probably be with my friend martin mcallister i don't know if he's wrestling i don't think he is wrestling at that one that's honestly my frame of reference i'm like are you wrestling at this yes or no if not you're coming with me to create content i've not go your ray much But no, honestly, I can't wait for that one. And yeah, I can't wait to see what you do
Closing Remarks and Guest Farewell
01:16:27
Speaker
next. So honestly, Grant, thank you so much for coming on tonight and yeah chatting about all things but sci-fi, gaming. Honestly, it's been an absolute blast having you on. No, thank you very much. I do appreciate it. This is actually the first podcast I've ever been on, so I really appreciate you asking me come on, so thank you very much.
01:16:44
Speaker
And all your kind words about my work, I do really appreciate that as well. Oh, no problem at all. It's genuinely the truth. And if you, Pandaloni, is listening out there, if you haven't checked out Grant's work seriously, go check out. It's well worth checking out. And especially at the cons, if you see the stall, go. Go towards that stall. Tell them Satsunami sent you. For legal reasons, don't say that because it sounds like a mafia boss. going to be sleeping with the fishes. Yeah. Sleeping with the prince, yeah. But yeah, before wrap up, where can the amazing Pandalorians listening at home find your content? So I have a Ko-fi page at slash Grant Plu Illustration. I've got a website, which is gpillustration.com. I've also got Instagram, which is grant underscore 2797. I have a TikTok that I don't really use that's at Grant Plu. I'm trying to think of other things. I think that's about it. But yeah, you can find me on all those places. Yeah. And I just want to reiterate, definitely go check out Grant's work. It absolutely fantastic. And yeah, if you want to check out more content from ourselves, then you can check us out at our website, chatsanami.com, as well as all good podcast apps. I also want to thank our amazing Pandalorian patrons, Robotic Battle Toaster, Ghostie, and cryptic 1991 thank you so much for supporting the show and if you would like early access to episodes as well as a whole bunch of juicy exclusive content then of course you can check us out our patreon page at patreon.com forward slash chat tsunami this podcast is of course a proud member of the pod pack collective for more information check us out our twitter slash x page at pod pack collect but until next time thank you all so so much for listening stay safe stay awesome and most importantly stay hydrated