Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
S2 E6: Moving Beyond the Silence: Advocacy, Funding, and the Future of Loss Support
142 Plays13 days ago
In this vital episode, the host speaks with two pillars of the Pink Elephants Support Network—Chairperson Katrina Groshinsky and Board Director Emma Costello—to discuss the organization's journey from breaking the silence to achieving systemic change.
Katrina and Emma reflect on how Pink Elephants has shifted its focus from simply talking about miscarriage to ensuring every woman in Australia who suffers loss, along with her family, receives evidence-based support and acknowledgement.
Emma details the hard-fought advocacy work, noting that a key challenge was cutting through government noise to make the message heard. The breakthrough came with the federal government's announcement of a $9.5 million miscarriage package in 2025—a phenomenal success that represents overdue recognition for the community. She emphasizes that the system needs to change so that any woman experiencing loss—whether with a GP, in an ED, or a hospital—is met with the right information, resources, and, crucially, the right tone.
Katrina highlights the critical win of Leave for Loss legislation (September 2021), which granted women and their partners the right to take time to grieve, acknowledging the devastating mental health and productivity issues caused by returning to work too quickly.
While the government funding is "very welcome and needed," it is tied to specific programs (tailored digital support, peer support, and advocacy). Both leaders stress that it doesn't cover the broader advocacy work, noting an 85% oversubscription to services, which tragically forces them to turn women away.
The conversation concludes with a shared vision of hope for the future. Their goals include:
- A "virtual circle of support" around every woman experiencing loss.
- Achieving better data collection through a question on the census, believing that "what gets counted, gets funded."
- Ensuring universal support and referral for all women, regardless of location or cultural background, affirming that support is a fundamental human right.
EARLY PREGNANCY LOSS SUPPORT
If you or someone you know has experienced miscarriage or early pregnancy loss, please know you are not alone.
- For crisis support, please call Lifeline - 13 11 14.
- Access all our support
- Connect through Live Chat with Peer Support
- Join Online Communities
- Call out Pregnancy Loss helpline delivered by PANDA
- Join the Circle of support
- Follow @pinkelephantssupport on instagram.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Miscarriage Rebellion Podcast
00:00:04
Speaker
Welcome to the miscarriage rebellion. I am Stacey June Lewis, lead of the Pink Elephant Support Network group counseling program Grief and Grace and along with Pink Elephant's co-founder and CEO Sam Payne through this podcast we will share the stories of many Australians who have lost their babies to early pregnancy loss.
00:00:21
Speaker
With evidence and empathy, we unpack the shame, blame and stigma and lack of support that they may face. This is a loss that has been silenced for far too long and we deserve better. We are here to normalise the conversation and to make lasting change.
00:00:36
Speaker
In
Pink Elephant Support Network's Growth and Advocacy
00:00:37
Speaker
this important episode, we're joined by two pillars of the Pink Elephant Support Network. Our Chairperson, Katrina, and a Board Director, Emma, joins us to discuss the organisation's incredible journey from breaking the silence to achieving systematic change.
00:00:52
Speaker
Emma breaks down the hard-fought advocacy that led to the Federal Government's $9.5 million miscarriage package. While Katrina gives us some more insight and highlights the critical success of Leave for Lost legislation.
00:01:06
Speaker
While celebrating these victories in the episode, both leaders stress that the work is far from over. This is a fascinating
Moving Beyond Silence to Advocacy
00:01:12
Speaker
episode and gives us a real behind the scenes view of how Pink Elephants has grown across the course of a decade.
00:01:19
Speaker
Today's episode, ah very beautifully titled Moving Beyond the Silence Toward Advocacy, Education and Systematic Change, really does ask us what do we want to look forward with? What do we want to perhaps reflect on where we've come from and what is the view and hope for the future. And, and you know, really I couldn't think of two more prominent people to speak to about this topic.
00:01:45
Speaker
We have the incredible two pillars, two pillars of many of the Pink Elephant Support Network. Katrina, our esteemed chairperson, and Emma Costello, vital board director, join us here today. Welcome to the podcast, ladies. Hi. Hi. Thank you. Welcome. Great to be here.
00:02:02
Speaker
When I talk about those words and talk about systematic change in the context particularly of the mission here at Pink Elephants and and the work that you've particularly focused on in your time here, what ah what does it mean to you beyond the silence, what we're doing here, what we're trying to do here?
00:02:18
Speaker
When Sam founded Pink Elephants all those years the breaking the silence, was sort of the main focus because nobody spoke about miscarriage. And then one of the great things that Pink Elephants done and Sam and Gabby did founding Pink Elephants was to actually talk about miscarriage out loud and to say that women and their families had suffered miscarriage deserved support and acknowledgement. And acknowledgement means talking about it.
00:02:45
Speaker
Beyond the silence now, you know, 10 years later, people do talk about miscarriage. But it's really now about that support. And what does that mean? How do we truly, when Pink Elephant's core mission always for me is that every single woman in Australia who suffers miscarriage should be supported and so should her family.
00:03:07
Speaker
Support in a way that acknowledges what has happened and then with evidence-based help is able to grieve and if she and her family want to go on it try and conceive again to do that, to do whatever is right for them.
00:03:22
Speaker
But we're still a long way from that.
Government Collaboration and Challenges
00:03:26
Speaker
And Emma, with your role, particularly being so connected with government relations and and more of a strategic view of people having understanding of the message, and I think we've spoken before about you talking about that real resonance with what people are saying, not just kind of hearing the message and it being a bit of lip service, like really understanding what the needs of the community and our community are.
00:03:53
Speaker
What has been it'd like to watch from the beginning of starting to work with Pink Elephants to obviously as we will continue to talk about achieving such success in the last 12 months?
00:04:05
Speaker
I think it's really been about cutting through. I think with governments, you know, governments have a thousand issues to deal with in a day.
00:04:16
Speaker
and it's really about making sure that your message is heard. And that message that our CEO, Sam, has spoken out loud for nine years, um it's it's it's finally getting that that recognition and that listening, actually, from government and and being able to cut through And I think the phenomenal thing about last year in 2025, when the federal government announced a nine and a half million dollar miscarriage package, that really represented recognition for our community that miscarriage is a real problem that needs to be supported. And these women deserve real resources and support from the government.
00:05:00
Speaker
And that was a huge milestone for us. And a lot of the narrative as we've spoken about really was more corrective narrative, right? So that ah there was a lot of misinformation out there about this.
00:05:11
Speaker
um What do you think will change once that narrative becomes almost corrected? What do you what do you kind of preempt we will see happen? So I think...
00:05:23
Speaker
There's still a long way to go to to achieve systemic change. We've come really far. um But, and and i I guess just just go going back to some of those, my there's real messages that cut through.
00:05:38
Speaker
um you know, the first time i sat in a meeting with an MP and said, you know, did you know that one in four pregnancies ends in loss? And actually a third of those women will go on to experience depression, PTSD and anxiety, not for months, but some for years.
00:05:56
Speaker
And when you pause and reflect, especially if you're hearing that for the first time, it's shocking. People still don't know. you know Most people are not aware of that, including politicians. So I think really, really, you know there there's still a job to do.
00:06:13
Speaker
from from the community, from from leaders, from politicians, to make sure that that message is heard and to make sure that support is actually there for
Support Programs and Legislation
00:06:23
Speaker
those women. In a perfect world,
00:06:25
Speaker
um a woman who is experiencing a miscarriage, no matter where she is on that journey, if she's going into a medical centre, if she's she's going to a hospital, if she, you know, she's to her gp um her there is ah complete system around her of support from the very moment that she's that she's in there, if she's she's you know hearing for the first time that her baby sadly doesn't have a heartbeat, that those doctors, those GPs, those those those nurses and staff are armed with the right information to, and have the right tone um is used with those women from the very beginning, so that they start at them what is a very sad journey, but they are as supported as possible along that journey.
00:07:14
Speaker
I think tone's such ah under ah an underrated word that you've used in that answer because it unfortunately isn't something that is always able to be known.
00:07:26
Speaker
You know, I think it's one of those things that does require new information and teaching and education just as many other medical situations do ask for in this particular instance.
00:07:39
Speaker
And think it's really interesting when you say about the onset effects of a miscarriage for women and the mental health issues and as you know, you you mentioned the systematic affects what happens on the system when we do have to then start looking after women in this way particularly not supported.
00:07:56
Speaker
But I think what I see as well in private practice and in the groups with Pink Elephant is um a lot of women don't even know it about themselves. So you know you can start to in my private practice will start to talk about people's anxiety, people's depression and then it will take six sessions before they've even realized it has come from ah miscarriage and I hadn't even known that those things would happen. so you know, when we do talk about communicating around and and clarifying that that message and for people to recognise, it's also about the woman being able to recognise what her experience is, not just the government, but it starts often at those government messages, right?
00:08:34
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. I think it it definitely starts with the person and and then it needs to... there's There's a whole wide system, isn't there, of of healthcare, care of government that needs...
00:08:45
Speaker
that that they that needs systemic change. um But they I guess the journey to get to here at nine years has been you know extraordinary. very It's been long and tough, particularly for the CEO of Sam Payne.
00:09:00
Speaker
um And I think Getting to a place where we have $4 million dollars from the federal government is incredible. And you know we're really proud as as as board members to be to be part of that and to be able to finally give the woman that we represent the support that they need. Yeah, absolutely. Hear, hear.
00:09:19
Speaker
um i want to talk, Katrina, a little bit about Leave for Loss and the work that you've done specifically with that program. Could you tell us about you know where essentially that need came from without stating the obvious, but just to give us a little bit of a picture of that.
00:09:32
Speaker
And also, yeah what your view is on that that kind of involvement and change that that can make on the greater sphere of our community. Leave for Loss actually came out of hearing from women in our community. Often one of the hardest things for them to do was to go back to work.
00:09:53
Speaker
And some of them were going back to work really quickly. So, um you know, we would have people tell us, I went and sat in the car, I drove back to work.
00:10:05
Speaker
ah cried and then I got out and went into the end of the day like just over and over again and um I knew myself from when I'd suffered miscarriages but being at work afterwards was one of the hardest things where you just keep going and in a way you think it helps you but at the same time you you can feel very disconnected um and of course I was lucky enough to be able to take leave The one thing about Leave to Loss is that before that legislation came in, there wasn't any right for women to take leave.
00:10:39
Speaker
And so not having that space to grieve um meant that they were far more likely to actually have longer term problems with respect to this.
00:10:51
Speaker
and And in terms of acknowledgement, I think it's really important to say that Leave for Lost came in in September 2021 after a really concerted campaign during COVID all times.
00:11:02
Speaker
But there was an MP, Julian Simmons, who in his maiden speech in July 2019 got up and talked about the devastating impact that miscarriage had had on him and his wife, Maddie.
00:11:14
Speaker
And that really sort of set the scene in a parliamentary sense for that. discussion about what could be done to be had. And then basically it became an opportunity to be honest because there was MP in Parliament who was passionate about the issue and really willing to put it forward and um Sam had been working on it, a number of unions had been working on it for some years and took the opportunity to really engage with the government and say This is a mental health issue for women. This is a productivity issue as well.
00:11:50
Speaker
Women need, and their families, need this acknowledgement and they need this time to grieve. And importantly, that legislation, because I don't think everybody still knows about it, is not just for the woman who suffers the miscarriage, but also for their spouse or de facto partner as well, which is very important too.
00:12:08
Speaker
Because of course, it's and as Julian Simmons made the point, it's devastating for everybody in the family. And what do you see, what's the importance of organisations getting behind this in terms of destigmatising and really contributing to what this experience is like for us as women and humans?
00:12:26
Speaker
i I think it's hugely important. I think think you can never underestimate like actually something happening in Parliament and the government's the same thing with the funding in a way which is practical but it's the acknowledgement that that it happens okay but i just think workplaces are so important they such a vital role to play, just in basically supporting women, any families who've had this, giving them time and space to be able to breathe, heal a little bit and also most people do want to get pregnant again and try again and one of the communities who have really specific needs within
00:13:08
Speaker
pink elephants is our pregnancy after loss. Because once you've had a miscarriage, and then it's just completely different. It it is, again, people often feel very anxious, and i'm sure you see this in your practice, Stacey, but we hear that from people all the time. And again, most women are working.
00:13:26
Speaker
So, and that you're spending a lot of time there and workplaces can make a real difference and it's just, again, saying the word out loud, getting that it's a thing. Lots of workplaces now have specific policies, many of which provide more leave than the two mandated days um or have specialist resources available as well.
00:13:51
Speaker
Yeah, it's interesting when we talk about government and we talk about workplaces and they sound so clinical and somewhat cold, but they have so much power. They really do. And I think its it's not to kind of blame or start to point the fingers, in some ways as it can be, but I think it's important to understand those power roles and and how it can really then...
00:14:14
Speaker
you know exacerbate someone's experience in those types of day-to-day
Strategic Advocacy for Government Funding
00:14:19
Speaker
interactions. It can seem simple to someone but really profound ah for the person going through it a lot of the time silently still.
00:14:27
Speaker
um Emma, as you mentioned, there was such a huge, huge win for the organisation and for our community as a whole across the last 12 months. Can you tell us a little bit about what what that was like for you? because you know And maybe even a little bit of the journey of what it looked like to get there, really. I'm sure our listeners would love to know.
00:14:48
Speaker
just kind of the ins and outs of what it really does take to to be able to shift shift the needle the way that it has and then achieve funding really for for the organisation and for the entire community. Yeah, um absolutely. Look, I think it was it's been ah it's been a long and a pretty hard journey to get to where we are um Reflecting back, I think it was 2021 when...
00:15:17
Speaker
I started working with Pink Elephants and we we really- Probably no. Yeah, and I say those things because people don't want to say them about themselves, but I think it's an important part of the picture. I really do.
00:15:30
Speaker
Yeah, i was I was very happy to do so. But yeah, there was a huge task at hand and ah we really focused our government kind of strategy around international early pregnancy loss in October.
00:15:44
Speaker
And we targeted that year every single New South Wales MP. so that meant really developing a comprehensive communications collateral um package, which included in a fact sheets infographics, case studies, letters, excerpts for MPs to use really, to to really try and educate each individual MP as well as the ministers and and shadow ministers um and and empower them to be able to speak out about this in parliament of course where you know it goes on the record and and advocate for Pink Elephants and for the women in their communities but also importantly to use um the social media tiles and and and the collateral that we've given them within their own social media, within their own media to speak to their individual communities about miscarriage and to try and
00:16:40
Speaker
end the shame and stigma around it and to start conversations importantly. um we By doing so, we we then followed that with a but the morning tea in Victoria and we had some really good, a really really good event there where um it was highly emotional. a lot of the politicians that came were sharing their own stories for the first time It was powerful. um it was yeah it was It was really sad for for for a lot, but also um just an incredible event where we were literally shattering the stigma and the shame for for politicians themselves.
00:17:18
Speaker
um And um you know out of that we had we we we found, I guess, some and we call them some champions for miscarriage, which is Sarah Mitchell in New South Wales, um Mary Ann Thomas, the the health minister in Victoria,
00:17:32
Speaker
And then of course, later on, we, you know, I guess we we did an annual government, a really big government push. We expanded that, not just in New South Wales, to Victoria, and then we we're looking at federally, which really meant reaching out to every single federal MP with communications collateral, which is a huge task. It's huge. a huge task. And I'm just hoping that people were going to listen and that, you know, really just pushing out that message. And they and they did, and they have.
00:18:03
Speaker
um But it took, um yeah, a lot of a lot of work and... it's a lot of That's a few governments in eight years, isn't it? it's it's ah It's a few governments. And then, of course, out of after 2023, we had the this then Assistant Health Minister, Jed Carney, who was incredible in listening to us, in listening to the needs of our community and being so proactive in going back to her colleagues, talking to them about what was really needed and then securing that funding package that we saw announced in 2024.
00:18:35
Speaker
It's incredible. I think it's it's really what I kept hearing when you were saying all that is that it was, it's kind of quiet, loud work. Like you were trying to, you know, really put forward a loud message, but you're doing it ah behind the scenes, you know, it takes a long time for it to actually start to come. To resonate. Exactly, yeah. And so it's such a credit to the work, you know, that everyone has been doing for this long period of time.
00:18:59
Speaker
So, there's money. What happens? tell us Talk us through how was it sculpted where money goes? Does it mean that now we have all the money in the world?
00:19:11
Speaker
What does it look like for moving forward? Just to give a picture because when I mention pro bono, do that with intention. It really important that people understand that when an organisation is running and looks to be perhaps the only organisation in the country that's doing the kind of work it's doing, um that it is funded or it is covered.
00:19:33
Speaker
And that really wasn't the case for a very long time for many of us um and continues to be such a new thing for many of us. um Tell us about what that means from a program perspective and offering but also maybe what it still doesn't mean as well.
00:19:50
Speaker
Yeah, sure. I mean, um obviously the government funding is specifically tied to specific programs. So part of that, um I was going to say more in sexy part of it, um in addition to persuading the government was actually saying what we were going to do with the money.
00:20:06
Speaker
And obviously we're very aware how accountable we are having public money. But part of that really is to have and um a number of programs, including to make sure that our online offering, because we are digital first, um that we can offer the most tailored support possible.
00:20:28
Speaker
um Secondly, with respect to actual peer support, so you know one of the real strengths of Pink Elephants is actually peer support, so women that can talk to other women who've suffered as well, which I think has been just one of the massive strengths and we're actually partnering with Panda and delivering some of those services.
00:20:51
Speaker
um And then thirdly, there's the advocacy piece, including the podcast, reaching more women as well. But
00:21:02
Speaker
really is the broader advocacy work and that's why we still obviously want to engage with community as much as we can there are so many things that we'd like to do particularly we're aware of how we can more support people's partners and the specific needs that they have I just a text message about that five minutes ago actually just you know these requests come in every hour, yeah and they're moving all the time, yeah, with how much demand there is for support.
00:21:31
Speaker
Count our babies is one of the things that I'm really passionate about, that which is basically, and we have, this is again a really good example, Stacey, of where you're doing a long-term advocacy plan of trying to get a question in the census. um because the best data we have is the one in four pregnancies, one in three women, but we don't know because we don't count, as as we don't with a lot of things about women's health. And we think it's so important to have that question in the census.
00:22:00
Speaker
We missed out being the special question last time, but we have a campaign to try and
Community Support and Systemic Change Goals
00:22:07
Speaker
and get that. and then Again, that's the acknowledgement of that this is important, but also data drives decisions. yeah drama Data attracts more funding and data will tell us more about about the community as well.
00:22:21
Speaker
so Yeah, another example. And you know, it's interesting, without the question, sometimes someone hasn't thought about the answer. Yeah, that's right. And back to your person, the you know, the woman you were talking about who are dealing with anxiety and depression and then sometime in...
00:22:38
Speaker
Well, yeah. I mean, miscarriage, the recur and miscarriage clinic often i it has changed now, but from my experience, it was four losses before you got asked the questions. And when you go through that question, that experience, I realised I had more than I realised. And not because I don't care, but because it's just one of those experiences that is incredibly difficult and nuanced.
00:22:59
Speaker
um And not only do we need to know the information for funding to be able to support... But women deserve to have inquiry and consideration and and guidance around something that is often very new, unfamiliar, and as we've mentioned so much on this podcast and continue to in our work, silenced.
00:23:21
Speaker
And the feeling of failure, I think, I i mean, don't know if that's, you know, but it's it's really a... And that's something that ah that I personally had. It was just, you do feel... You so you feel like you've failed in some way. And guilt.
00:23:33
Speaker
And guilt, yeah. You feel guilt and and and all of those things which you just really shouldn't feel. So, yeah, I think... Acknowledging that and and yes, absolutely what gets when we say what gets counted, gets funded, gets researched, gets acknowledgement from from those that are making the decisions around allocation of resources.
00:23:55
Speaker
um And the other the other point, I guess, to make about $4 million over four years is is is fantastic. It is tied funds and for specific programs. um But we we still have 85% over subscription to to services. So we we are we are actually having to tragically turn women away um that there are that are in need, that have come to us because we don't have the funds to to do that. so there is still a great need and we we you know we we have independently sourced our own funding up until now and we continue to do that alongside the the very welcome and needed um government support. Yes and appreciated of course.
00:24:39
Speaker
But yeah, as you say there's obviously particulars around that funding and there's lots of other things and elements that need to be addressed. And look, one of the big ones I think is like referrals.
00:24:51
Speaker
So and I said at the beginning, you know, we want every woman to be supported. We want every woman who experiences miscarriage to get a referral to support. So whether you're an ED or in GP, you know, the federal government is responsible for hospitals generally, you know, that's,
00:25:08
Speaker
So engaging with them to make sure that people in emergency departments know the kind of support that is available like Pinker Valence and that people get a referral and know how to access it. You need those two things.
00:25:21
Speaker
GPs, you know, similarly. um And then you've got all the other ways that, you know, women interact through their, you know, health centres or communities and through friends and family as well and workplaces.
00:25:35
Speaker
Yeah. And and the... Federal government and state governments of course are really significant employers as well. I mean, we should give a call out to the New South Wales government, um who are the one and the first to have bereavement leave for miscarriage and a policy plan around it as well.
00:25:52
Speaker
And so thinking about all of those elements in terms of what you've witnessed, what you're currently working on and what you foresee in the future.
00:26:03
Speaker
I wanted to really hone in on, i guess, season two and what we're trying to focus on. is this idea of hope. It's a delicate one because as a counsellor I certainly am often saying to people that we don't need to cling at hope for the sake of it. It's not something that you must find at any particular time but it is an offering and it is helpful in this space.
00:26:25
Speaker
So if I asked each of you, I'll start with you Emma, around this idea of hope, not just from necessarily the money but where we stand at this point of time with this funding but also with all of these ideas and kind of plans for what's required for the future. What do you hope for the woman that is going through at this experience moving forward?
Future Support Systems and Inclusivity
00:26:48
Speaker
What's your hope for her or for her for the people going through this? Look, I think um it it makes me think of of two things. I guess one of the first things, going back to what we are actually called Pink Elephants, um you know, we were called Pink Elephants, Sam came up with this name, because
00:27:08
Speaker
um in Africa when a when a mother elephant loses her baby, the the the other elephants actually form a circle of support around her. And I just find that that vision and that kind of is so powerful. And I think if we can kind of, my hope is that in future every woman that suffers a miscarriage has that kind of virtual circle of that bubble of support around her that she feels um she doesn't walk the journey of pregnancy loss alone and she feels that she's not alone that she feels supported and yeah I think that's that's that's the kind of where I would see us going
00:27:50
Speaker
um And I think, I feel great hope and ah much more positive around that because I think there is systemic change happening. There are far more conversations happening about this than there were four years ago. There's there's legislative change, there's recognition, um and there is moving away from you know that shame stigma kind of kind of feeling. So I think we we yeah we we feel positive and hopeful that that we're in a good place and we will be in an even better place in another four or five years.
00:28:22
Speaker
That made me, yeah. It felt very nice to hear that and also very, I think, affirming because we do that how we can already and and we just want to grow those circles, you know, within the organisation.
00:28:37
Speaker
What about you, Katrina? Yeah, no, I am hopeful. I think, um I going to say, what have I learnt through this? You know, change happens, it it takes a long time and there, i'd say there are opportunities.
00:28:51
Speaker
I think that's the thing and leave for loss was one where there was a particular point in time where it was the right time in dealings with governments. You know there are times when people are going to be more sympathetic to the particular community that you're representing um and I think at the moment too just the conversation around women's health people are talking about issues more. My hope though is that evident one of the big things with pank elephants has always been evidence-based support. And one thing that's always hard for women is that you're often, there's a lot of support and information out there and it's very hard to know
00:29:32
Speaker
what's accurate and what's it inaccurate basically miscarriage we still't know most of the time what causes miscarriage and that's partially what ties into the a lot of the guilt and that so I hope for better data for funding for better data better collection and then research and we want to do really targeted support that's what the circle we're really we've started that journey from the pink elephants website but we want to make it easy for women them so whatever stage the journey they're at haven't
00:30:06
Speaker
yet become pregnant and they had a miscarriage or they're getting pregnant after loss or, you know, a really tragic part of our community is where people have had to have a generation for medical reasons as well and there are different types of grief and they need really specific support as well.
00:30:26
Speaker
And I guess, you know, living in Australia that wherever you live, You know, whatever your first language is whatever your cultural experience your family situation, whether you are single, with a partner, that you are supported and and understood.
00:30:42
Speaker
is It's like a fundamental human right. And we'll keep fighting for that.
00:30:50
Speaker
Is there anything you feel like you haven't shared when you think about these ideas, when you think about the work that you've done, when you think about what you would like our community to hear from,
00:31:00
Speaker
either of you, is there anything you feel like you still would like to share before we we wrap up? I don't think so. Yeah, I think, you know, m I never sort of stop being shocked and sad when I hear from women about their experience when they've had a miscarriage and have felt alone because it's not that it's totally preventable but we can make it so much better. yeah And it's not that hard. yeah It is not that hard. So we all need to keep fighting for it.
Conclusion and Support Resources
00:31:33
Speaker
Today's episode may have brought up some feelings that you need some extra support around. And that's totally okay. Head to pinkhelephants.org.au to access our circle of support.
00:31:43
Speaker
Your space where you can be met with empathy and support through all of your experiences of early pregnancy loss. We're here for you. You're not alone.