Transcript
Speaker: I'm JC Stoner and this is the Swakuho Podcast.
Speaker: This month's episode focuses on an unfortunate cornerstone of the housing profession, email management.
Speaker: I know it doesn't sound like the most glamorous of topics, but trust me, this episode is going to be packed with tangible takeaways regardless of if your inbox has less than 10 or more than 10,000 emails.
Speaker: Along the way, we're going to talk about default sign-offs and salutations, so-called email etiquette, copying other people's bosses on emails, and plenty of other nuances associated with grinding away at the keyboard.
Speaker: Before we begin, I do have to forewarn listeners that just like in episode three,
Speaker: We did have some technical difficulties when doing the original recording such that we had to re-record the first 20 to 30 minutes.
Speaker: So I apologize in advance if there were some repeat comments or disjointed moments.
Speaker: I'm also excited to announce the podcast has its first volunteer.
Speaker: Christian Robinson from the University of Arkansas provided some production responsibilities for this episode, including editing the track you are now listening to.
Speaker: Christian didn't know that honing his editing skills was going to involve joining together two different recordings.
Speaker: but he stuck with it through thick and thin.
Speaker: Thank you, Christian, for stepping up and providing service to your association and your region.
Speaker: Our first guest is Monique Berkeley, Residence Director at the University of Texas at Arlington.
Speaker: Monique is originally from Dallas, Texas, and is a first-generation graduate who received her Bachelor of Science in Kinesiology and Sports Studies from Texas A&M University Commerce.
Speaker: She obtained her Master's of Education in Higher Education Administration at the University of Texas at San Antonio.
Speaker: She enjoys hiking, painting, crafting, socializing, and spending time with family and friends.
Speaker: She is also a dog mom to her pug, Rosemary.
Speaker: Monique, welcome to the show.
Speaker: Hi, thanks for having me, and thanks for joining us today.
Speaker: Our second guest is Maggie Guzman, who is the Assistant Director for Risk Management at Texas A&M University.
Speaker: In this role, Maggie oversees risk management, staff training, and respect and engagement initiatives.
Speaker: She has been involved with Swakuho for 20 years and considers this her professional home.
Speaker: When not driving her two kids to their various activities, she enjoys watching historical dramas, all things Marvel, and reading historical fiction.
Speaker: Maggie, welcome to the show.
Speaker: Thanks, JC.
Speaker: It's good to be here.
Speaker: So first things first, how many emails do you have in your inbox right now?
Speaker: Not in folders, just in your inbox.
Speaker: Okay, JC, are you ready?
Speaker: I have 50,153 in my inbox, and 23 of those are unread.
Speaker: And just to be clear, that was 50,000, not 15,000.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: Five zero.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I mean, once we hit orders of magnitude, I don't think an additional zero really matters.
Speaker: But okay, there we go.
Speaker: Thanks, Maggie.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Monique?
Speaker: I have 6,384 emails in my inbox and only two are unread.
Speaker: Ooh.
Speaker: That's pretty impressive.
Speaker: And since I asked you two to share, I of course have to share mine.
Speaker: I have 12,386 total, of which 4,679 of them are unread.
Speaker: Oh, that's great, Jason.
Speaker: And yet here I am still employed.
Speaker: So I'm sure all of those are on purpose.
Speaker: So you go back.
Speaker: It's like your to do list, right?
Speaker: Is that what you're right?
Speaker: I've gotten really good at reading subject lines and knowing whether or not they need my attention or not.
Speaker: Look, that is a real skill.
Speaker: That is an undervalued skill for sure.
Speaker: Or I just think I have enough capital that if one of those comes back to haunt me, I can be like, well, it happens to the best of us.
Speaker: Missed an email.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It was closing.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But for listeners out there, it's a pretty simple thing.
Speaker: If you didn't know how to toggle into it, you can toggle between these numbers.
Speaker: If you use Outlook, just right click your inbox and select properties, then toggle between show number of unread items, which I think is the default, and then show total number of items.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: If you want to know how many total you got, you can join the club.
Speaker: So obviously the three of us have a fairly high number, which I would consider society might judge us based on those.
Speaker: But do either of you ever get anxiety with your email volume?
Speaker: I do not.
Speaker: My email does not bother me at all.
Speaker: I've always been a high volume email kind of girl, I guess.
Speaker: Higher now, obviously, than I was whenever I was a new professional.
Speaker: But no, I do not lose any sleep or have any anxiety over my email.
Speaker: I'm like the opposite.
Speaker: Yes, I like to have my inbox on zero because I typically keep it in the unread view and not on the total number.
Speaker: Just because that lowest number will freak me out.
Speaker: But I use the inbox alert number to help me sort through my day.
Speaker: So I know if I have four in-action items, I know I have four things to do.
Speaker: So I like to keep that down at zero because that tells me that I have nothing to do.
Speaker: So it has to be low or I'm going to be freaking out about what I need to do or what I missed.
Speaker: And Maggie, did you experience anxiety earlier on in your career?
Speaker: Is that something that you've become accustomed to?
Speaker: You know, I honestly don't remember, but I don't think so.
Speaker: I am a pretty chill person, I guess, and don't really experience a lot of anxiety over many things.
Speaker: So no, I don't remember that.
Speaker: I do remember when I first started at A&M being very overwhelmed with the volume of email.
Speaker: It was very different from when I was at Sam Houston.
Speaker: But in a large department, it's just kind of par for the course, I think, when you've got a bunch of different units and a bunch of people spread out everywhere.
Speaker: So it was something that I remember being warned about when I applied to work there.
Speaker: Like, we have a lot of email.
Speaker: You need to make sure that you're administratively savvy.
Speaker: And we try to kind of warn people about that, too, as we're hiring them.
Speaker: But no, I don't distinctly remember experiencing a lot of anxiety over it.
Speaker: Well, I imagine with your position also with risk management, you probably get copied on a lot of emails just from a need-to-know basis.
Speaker: I do.
Speaker: I do.
Speaker: I counted one time and I was on an email thread that I'm not even joking you, was 32 messages long.
Speaker: Jeez.
Speaker: Just back and forth and so many people were contributing to the conversation.
Speaker: And, you know, like...
Speaker: I could have deleted all of them and just saved the last one with the whole thread, but I didn't.
Speaker: So yeah, that does happen quite a bit for me.
Speaker: I'm just imagining the moment in your day and what must have been going on where you were like, I'm going to count how many emails are on this thread.
Speaker: I think that I was probably having a conversation with someone else on the thread about how absurd it had gotten and how there's a point where you stop emailing and you just call a meeting, right?
Speaker: I think that was probably what some of that conversation was about.
Speaker: But yeah, just to see, I did.
Speaker: I counted 32.
Speaker: Well, and I also love the fact that how many times have we heard people say, why did we meet about this?
Speaker: It could have been an email.
Speaker: And now here Maggie Guzman is saying, why are we emailing?
Speaker: We should have a meeting.
Speaker: Yes, because some things could be just so much faster with a phone call or just a quick hallway meeting.
Speaker: You know what I mean?
Speaker: Particularly if it's like if you and I are going to sit here and email back and forth, JC, I know that you're available to some extent.
Speaker: I may as well just pick up the phone and call you at that point.
Speaker: Well, unless I'm emailing while I'm in a meeting with somebody else.
Speaker: True, true, which these days does happen.
Speaker: So Monique, do you anticipate the anxiety you expressed going down as you advance in your career?
Speaker: Because you're a fairly young professional.
Speaker: I can already see the improvement in my email management skills.
Speaker: And now I've learned to let things lie and like, oh, that can wait.
Speaker: So I'm not as anxious with email number as I was when I started back in July.
Speaker: So now I'm like,
Speaker: I've adopted like if they really need me, if it's an emergency, I'm sure someone will call me and they wouldn't wait for me to see an email, especially if it doesn't have like the high important notification, like the little red exclamation point.
Speaker: So I can see myself in like even next year, just not even caring.
Speaker: I mean, I agree with that because something that I kind of talk, have been talking a lot to people about recently is expectations management.
Speaker: And so I feel like the people, and I know many of them,
Speaker: who are compelled to reply to the email within two minutes of receiving it are not always managing the other people's expectations of them very well, because we, we train people on what to expect from us.
Speaker: And so, you know, if you are the person who's constantly on the phone, on the email, replying to things within two minutes, people come to expect that.
Speaker: And then when you don't do that and you reply within two hours or heaven forbid a whole business day, you're,
Speaker: People are like, what's wrong with you?
Speaker: You know what I mean?
Speaker: So some of that is I think we bring some of that stress on ourselves by not managing that expectation very well.
Speaker: Yeah, I sometimes actually, even if I can immediately respond, I will sometimes sit on it for a few hours just to like, not, I'm like, you don't deserve an email from me right away.
Speaker: I'm ready to go.
Speaker: And I'll delay send emails all the time, like for a little bit later, just because I don't want to train people that I know from my perception, how they will feel that it is, oh, good.
Speaker: He's always responding.
Speaker: Like, no, I've got other priorities than you.
Speaker: I do not trust the delay feature.
Speaker: I'm the type of person, if I set a time, so if I set it for 3 p.m., I'm going to check at 3 p.m.
Speaker: just to make sure it's sent.
Speaker: So I just send mine immediately because I just don't trust the delay button.
Speaker: Oh, I've been hosed by it so many times, like where emails I send out at 3 a.m.
Speaker: instead of 3 p.m.
Speaker: And so it has wronged me a few times, but I find more benefit than the cost of those problems occasionally.
Speaker: So approximately how much of each of your days is spent on average managing email?
Speaker: Honestly, I'd say it really depends on the day.
Speaker: So in the last, well, since COVID started, I would say, um,
Speaker: I'm in a lot more meetings now than I used to be.
Speaker: So that makes it difficult for me to have time at my desk to actually do work, which includes checking email.
Speaker: So if it's a meeting heavy day, I don't spend very much time at all because I don't feel compelled to stay there late to check the email.
Speaker: If it's a regular day, though, I would say probably...
Speaker: oh gosh, I don't know, 20, 25% of my time, I guess.
Speaker: And that's not necessarily all in one chunk.
Speaker: Obviously, I will say I used to be one of those people who had the email up all the time and would constantly be like going back and forth between the email and whatever I was working on.
Speaker: And I've had to kind of train myself not to do that anymore, because it was difficult for me to like focus on a task because I kept getting distracted by the email.
Speaker: So now I kind of
Speaker: Sometimes I kind of use checking the email as kind of a brain break from whatever it is that I'm working on.
Speaker: You know, like I'll get to a stopping point on a project or something that I'm writing or whatever and kind of go spend some time with email and then come back to it.
Speaker: And it kind of helps me stay a little bit more focused on both of those things, both the email and whatever project it is I'm working on.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I probably spend an average of, I would say hour and 30 minutes each day.
Speaker: Not very long.
Speaker: I feel like the morning, my morning and my evening is consumed by emails.
Speaker: Mostly the afternoon is me sending emails to kind of prep for the next workday.
Speaker: But during closing, I've spent like almost half my day looking at some form of email communication, whether it was residents trying to coordinate a move out or, you know, just needing an extension or things like that.
Speaker: So these past couple of weeks,
Speaker: With move outs happening on campus, I could say at least half my day was responding to emails and residents that I ended up having to call because they started sending back to back emails.
Speaker: And I'm like, OK, let's get on the phone call because this is too many email responses.
Speaker: Well, those numbers are actually less than I thought they were going to be.
Speaker: And sometimes I wonder, you know, with as much time as we spend responding to emails, when do we actually ever get anything actually done?
Speaker: Agree.
Speaker: Can you all imagine what the industry looked like 30 years ago before there was email?
Speaker: Like, that's a fun thought experiment right there.
Speaker: Maggie's just shaking her head.
Speaker: Glazing off and wondering.
Speaker: I couldn't even imagine.
Speaker: Like, I'm so used to, like, very, like,
Speaker: messages coming from phone to phone or just, you know, so quickly or instantly.
Speaker: I can just imagine like you have to go tell someone in another department, you got to spend 30 minutes to an hour to go walk over there and let them know something and then coming back.
Speaker: I don't really know how that would work.
Speaker: But Monique, you probably don't even know what a world looked like without email.
Speaker: Like Maggie and I. Or text messages, cell phones.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like Maggie, when I went to college, like email was kind of like it existed, but not really.
Speaker: It was like a thing, but people still didn't use it.
Speaker: It's like when I went to college and cell phones, it's like everyone had cell phones, but we still called each other's landlines.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Not just email, but really doing everything online.
Speaker: Like I can remember being a freshman.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Sam and having like during registration having to call like be on the phone and call in and register for my classes with like through my landline phone and if it was if the line was busy you just had to like hang up and keep trying right so yeah it was a very different time for sure yeah
Speaker: I just imagine a pile of memos on like some director's desk of like people dropping memos off.
Speaker: It's like my desk is a disaster right now with papers and nobody's dropping memos off.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: In some ways though, I feel like maybe people were more productive and I think people probably had better, better critical thinking skills because they had to maybe figure things out on their own because they didn't have someone so quickly at hand to ask questions of and stuff.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Well, unless accountability, it's like everyone feels like they got to follow up in writing on every little thing.
Speaker: Yes, true.
Speaker: I often hear people talk about how many emails they have in their inbox, almost as if bragging, like, look how important and busy I am.
Speaker: Does volume of email demonstrate professional importance?
Speaker: And is this a problem?
Speaker: I do not think that it demonstrates the importance level a person has.
Speaker: I just believe that some of the stuff that you're like a CC'd in or BCC'd on,
Speaker: has nothing to do with you directly.
Speaker: Someone just wants you into the loop while they handle a situation.
Speaker: So sometimes they might not even need your reply.
Speaker: So I don't necessarily think someone having more emails equates to them being more important than another person.
Speaker: It just depends on what is needed in the context of those emails.
Speaker: I feel like makes you important, I guess, if that explains it.
Speaker: But yeah.
Speaker: a number doesn't matter is what's inside the email.
Speaker: What are people requesting from you needing from you?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What is the situation involving?
Speaker: I would agree with that as the person who has the most email and this little call, I don't think that my inbox size makes me any more important.
Speaker: And honestly, I don't really share very often.
Speaker: Like it's,
Speaker: I would say the people who are close to me at work know that my email is kind of ridiculous, but like some of our other staff members, if they're listening are probably going to be like, Holy crap.
Speaker: I had no idea that she was that kind of email hoarder.
Speaker: And I will tell you, my supervisor gets way more emails than I do, but he is really good about saving things and deleting.
Speaker: So, and he's clearly more important than me because he's my supervisor, right?
Speaker: And it's evaluation season.
Speaker: So, um, yeah,
Speaker: But so, yeah, no, I don't think that I don't think that it matters.
Speaker: But I will agree with what Monique said, because I have been asked before for things from years ago.
Speaker: I mean, hey, do you remember why we are doing this this way?
Speaker: And I don't.
Speaker: But I have been able to find emails from from several years prior that kind of explains that.
Speaker: And in fact, recently, one of our associate vice presidents, we were in a meeting and he said something about not deleting email and going on a treasure hunt for an email from 2013 and being really excited when he found it and was able to provide the information to the person.
Speaker: I was like, yes, that is yes.
Speaker: You're speaking my language, Tom.
Speaker: So, you know, I, yeah, I think that sometimes we, speaking for myself, I will intentionally hang on to emails because I know at some point somebody is going to ask me about something and I'm going to have to go on that treasure hunt to find it.
Speaker: So, but I don't think that makes me important.
Speaker: I think you're very important.
Speaker: Both of you.
Speaker: But it's sometimes like when coordinators or hall directors or whatever the position title is, is like, we'll sit around talking about how crappy their on-call was, like trying to one-up each other with who had the worst on-call.
Speaker: And it's like bragging in a sense.
Speaker: I kind of feel that way of sometimes with who has the most emails.
Speaker: It's a little misguided, in my opinion.
Speaker: But, you know, every housing professional worth their salt has missed something from time to time or dropped the ball.
Speaker: So is saying you have too many emails a good excuse for missing something?
Speaker: I don't think so.
Speaker: I mean, we all have the same number of hours in the day.
Speaker: We all have to choose how to spend those hours in the day and how to prioritize the work that we're doing and all of that.
Speaker: So no, I don't think saying I have too many emails and I missed it, maybe saying I had two full days of meetings and haven't gotten to it yet.
Speaker: Now that I think is a little bit different.
Speaker: But no, I don't think saying that you have a full inbox is really an excuse for missing an email.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Because that just kind of comes down to prioritizing.
Speaker: Like in some way you have to, well, you always should be managing your email and kind of being aware of what things are being asked of you and just kind of monitoring what needs to be done.
Speaker: So within your role, you have to assess, is this email something I need to respond to or take action on now?
Speaker: And so if you just have 100 emails that you got and you not even like checking the, like you said, the title of the email or if it was labeled as important, I feel like that's on you and that doesn't, that's not really an excuse.
Speaker: Like I said, you can have 100 emails and about 80 of them are just already submitting on call logs.
Speaker: It could be divisional newsletters.
Speaker: It could be things that are not like task related.
Speaker: So I don't think that is a good excuse for not,
Speaker: getting something done or missing a deadline.
Speaker: Now I have been received numerous emails, but I wasn't attached to the original one.
Speaker: So when I missed a deadline, that was not because I didn't read my emails because I wouldn't email included an email that had the information on it.
Speaker: So I feel like that could be something I discussed with like a supervisor or something like that.
Speaker: But
Speaker: still not an excuse for missing a deadline.
Speaker: Well, maybe the person who was supposed to send you that deadline had too many emails and that's why they missed it.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But Monique, I think you're absolutely right when you talk about prioritization.
Speaker: And I don't remember when it was, but I always remember one time I was like, what happened here?
Speaker: What got missed?
Speaker: And it's like, there's so many excuses that we made, but it's also just like, I didn't prioritize correctly.
Speaker: And that's what happened.
Speaker: And it's like, okay, now we can talk about that.
Speaker: And how do we identify priorities?
Speaker: So Monique, I think you're spot on about that.
Speaker: I personally think like it happens once or twice.
Speaker: Okay, fine, maybe.
Speaker: But, you know, we should really talk about, like we just said, prioritization.
Speaker: But it's a pattern, in my opinion, that quickly tires of like, okay, I'm going to give you that once, maybe twice.
Speaker: And now it's no longer good.
Speaker: Excuse.
Speaker: Now, I will say I have failed to do something because I was emailed about a particular task along with other people or another person.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And kind of just assume that someone else was going to do it, maybe because it was more in line with what their job was and didn't actually confirm with anyone, hey, who's doing this?
Speaker: So there have been times that great example, my admin and I both do a lot of the key management for our department.
Speaker: And so folks, a lot of times will email both of us because they don't know for sure if one or either of us is in the office.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so there have been times when we've just both assumed the other one was taking care of something and then it didn't happen.
Speaker: So that's something I've had to kind of consciously be a little bit better about, like either following up and saying, OK, I've taken care of this or, OK, I'll take care of this or specifically asking, hey, do you have time to do this?
Speaker: Because I'm kind of, you know, under some other things right now.
Speaker: So I will own that I have missed emails because of that.
Speaker: No, I love that.
Speaker: I think that's so pertinent too, because you think about sending emails to like hall directors or coordinators or whatever, and just saying this broad thing needs to get done.
Speaker: And if you don't tag anyone as the recipient or like, okay, Monique, you need to do this.
Speaker: Maggie, you need to do this.
Speaker: It's so easy to just assume somebody else is going to do it.
Speaker: We talk about that in our department a lot about, you know, make sure you tag people or put somebody in charge of things.
Speaker: Well, and I think too, you know, the two line and the CC line in my mind designate different things, right?
Speaker: Like if I'm CC'd, it's just that to me, that's just an FYI.
Speaker: That doesn't mean that I need to do something.
Speaker: So I really try to be mindful when I send things of how I'm using those designations to try to kind of make it clear again, what expectations are and really who needs to do whatever it is I'm asking people to do.
Speaker: Yeah, I think that's important too, because in my department, everyone gets copied on everything.
Speaker: And I think that having clear expectations about what that means would be helpful.
Speaker: And I don't pay enough attention to that.
Speaker: So even if that was clear out there, I probably would need to pay more attention.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So in the world of the pandemic, there have been additional platforms introduced to share information like Teams or other chat functions.
Speaker: How has this changed email usage in your professional lives?
Speaker: I think it's made it better.
Speaker: I'm someone that kind of dreads sending an email, especially when it's something super formal because I'm going to read it a few times.
Speaker: And so I like to utilize teams more often because it's more like instant messaging.
Speaker: I don't have to be so formal.
Speaker: I can get straight to the point, say some formality.
Speaker: So I think it's improved, but I'm also someone that grew up in tech-heavy generation.
Speaker: So I just appreciate
Speaker: the effort or the lack of effort it takes to use Teams versus sending like a formal email.
Speaker: And then it's also a helpful feature because on Teams, it shows you like pictures.
Speaker: So when I'm working with someone that has the same name or I'm confused on exactly who I'm talking to, I can look at their Teams and it has like the department they work for, their supervisor, and also a picture if they upload it.
Speaker: So I find that feature very helpful.
Speaker: So I prefer Team over email.
Speaker: I don't mind teams, but it's so ironic that you asked this because just today, one of our community directors emailed me and said, Hey, I sent somebody this and asked them to help me with it through teams, but it hasn't been done yet.
Speaker: Can you help me with it?
Speaker: And I was like, Oh yeah, sure.
Speaker: So I did it.
Speaker: And then she replied with a, by the way, do you prefer I send this kind of thing through teams or through email?
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: And in this instance, because I am a part of so many teams and teams or channels or whatever you call them, I'm not really team savvy that unless someone directly messages me,
Speaker: the tags get lost in the chatter, right?
Speaker: Because so many other people are using that platform for various and assorted things.
Speaker: So I agree with you, Monique.
Speaker: If it's just a quick, hey, I want to ask you a question, I think that's great.
Speaker: But if it's a, this really needs your attention, I'm sending you an attachment, I need you to do something, then personally, I prefer an email because that's more on my radar than the teams are.
Speaker: Yeah, I totally agree with all of that.
Speaker: It's so frustrating when it's like, because I've got staff who aren't at computers.
Speaker: And so I'm getting text messages, but I'm getting Teams messages.
Speaker: I'm getting emails.
Speaker: I'm getting phone calls.
Speaker: It's like, I wish I could go back two years and like lay out, here's what we use for what.
Speaker: And I think that would have made my life a lot better.
Speaker: We've actually been having that conversation as we've gotten ready for our summer conference operations because we have some folks in our department who have really
Speaker: been the early adopters for our department of teams who are all about the teams.
Speaker: And I'm like, okay, but some of this communication might get really confusing if, you know, so I've been trying to kind of, I don't know, mitigate some of that for my own, I guess, mental health, because I think there are some times that people just pay more attention to one or the other and things get lost if you're not using it consistently.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And working on the operations side and so closely with maintenance, it's like some conversations start in a phone call and then go through text message.
Speaker: And then we're back at computers.
Speaker: It's now in an email, but there's Teams follow-up.
Speaker: So it's like, if somebody ever asked me what's going on with a room, I have to start searching four different places and they all have different room formats of how they're put together.
Speaker: Like, it's just unbelievable.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I utilize Teams only for like those personal interactions.
Speaker: So I'm a residence director.
Speaker: So I have like my RAs.
Speaker: I direct message them, especially when it's things that are personal in nature, but it's not necessarily super, I'm not going to say professional, but like specifically work RA related.
Speaker: It might be something going on with them personally.
Speaker: So I use that as like my texting like thing.
Speaker: So they know like if it's something non-formal, not a request, or it's just something you generally just want to know instantly to use Teams.
Speaker: But if it's anything like requesting to go somewhere for an extended period of time or missing a mandatory event, they know to send that an email because I like to attach it and file it in their personal folder.
Speaker: So I have documentation.
Speaker: So it's easy to find when someone asks me, oh, why this person missed this event?
Speaker: I'm like, oh, actually, I approved it.
Speaker: And here goes my documentation.
Speaker: So I kind of like to use that.
Speaker: And they kind of know.
Speaker: And they know not to call me on my personal phone because I would ignore, unless it's an emergency.
Speaker: Good for you.
Speaker: It's good to set boundaries.
Speaker: And it's hard being one year in the job and having set such a strong boundary.
Speaker: That's good for you.
Speaker: I'm proud of you.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: I think it's easier and it needed to be done because we're so close in age that I feel like I needed to be more of that.
Speaker: And if anything, lack up after we, you know, form that good boundary and bond.
Speaker: But
Speaker: For now, I had to, you know, kind of hit it kind of firm because if not, they'll be texting me all day.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Most new professionals will go the other direction and be too available and then have a hard time walking back from it.
Speaker: So I know there's departments out there that have expectations for a reply to everything.
Speaker: And even if it's just like, thanks for acknowledgement.
Speaker: What do we think about that?
Speaker: Hate it.
Speaker: Hate it.
Speaker: Do not need another email.
Speaker: But I do understand and will acknowledge that some people need that.
Speaker: Some people need the affirmation that comes with getting the obligatory thanks message.
Speaker: I definitely don't.
Speaker: I don't think it's an expectation in my department.
Speaker: It's also something I feel is not needed.
Speaker: But I do think that depending on the content and the email, so like when I first started my role,
Speaker: I would say, yeah, thanks, or I got it, or those little small replies just so they knew I received the message, I understand what needs to be done.
Speaker: But that was earlier on.
Speaker: But now that I've built that reputation and that rapport with people, they kind of already know.
Speaker: If I don't respond, it's a good thing.
Speaker: It's understood.
Speaker: It's done.
Speaker: So I feel like maybe early on when you first start working with someone, just kind of giving them that thanks as the affirmation like you said.
Speaker: It could be helpful, but it just depends on if they need it.
Speaker: But I don't think it's necessary.
Speaker: I don't want I wouldn't want to put that in someone's inbox and I wouldn't want people putting it in mine.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: I've been in an environment that sort of had some level of expectation depending on who was sending it.
Speaker: And I ended up creating one of those quick step like auto buttons.
Speaker: So like any email that it was like, I have no action to take here, but I must acknowledge it.
Speaker: I would push the button.
Speaker: It would automatically pop up an email that said thanks and delete the other email.
Speaker: And that was one way I was like, oh, boom, everything's done at once and it's not in my inbox anymore.
Speaker: But I have acknowledged it like it's expected of me.
Speaker: That's smart.
Speaker: I think those quick steps are such a valuable tool that it's one of those you spend a little bit of time on the front end and it creates a whole lot of time saving and efficiency.
Speaker: I do daily emails to our pest control provider of here's our callback for service.
Speaker: It's like I've got a quick step that auto populates that email to begin with and I just paste in the service, send.
Speaker: Instead of typing the same message five days a week, four weeks a month, 12 months a year.
Speaker: I didn't even look into that.
Speaker: I didn't know about that feature.
Speaker: Oh, it's great.
Speaker: And it's one of those that I know I could use so much more effectively, but I just need to like invest a little bit of time
Speaker: I'm dropping down to see what all ones.
Speaker: It's like I had one for like quarantine, like turning quarantine units for cleaning that would be like populate for housekeeping.
Speaker: It's like here's the rooms to clean.
Speaker: And our daily do not enter list is one of those.
Speaker: It's just done.
Speaker: Yeah, that's a great idea.
Speaker: So how do we feel about copying other people's bosses on email requests or even instructions?
Speaker: You know, I think this is cultural.
Speaker: I will say in our department,
Speaker: Um, we, I feel like we do have some units where that's kind of the expectation.
Speaker: If you're going to,
Speaker: You know, like I just know with some of our people, if I'm going to email them to do something or, you know, ask them for something, I'm going to I'm just going to copy their supervisor because I know that's the expectation.
Speaker: Other people, not so much.
Speaker: I also think that sometimes it's an unfortunate necessity, right?
Speaker: If you are emailing someone who, you know, is kind of got a reputation for being slow to respond or, you
Speaker: maybe not respond at all.
Speaker: I mean, copying their supervisor kind of can prompt some action, right?
Speaker: So it kind of feels like a jerky thing to do, but sometimes you just have to, you know, but I don't get, personally, I don't get offended if somebody copies my supervisor on something.
Speaker: It just means that that's maybe one less thing that I have to loop him in on, you know, so yeah.
Speaker: I think it just depends on the situation and why you're doing it.
Speaker: But, you know, I don't do it with every email I send by any means.
Speaker: And I think that's a tough one.
Speaker: It just depends on when you introduce the supervisor, if that makes sense, or their boss.
Speaker: Because I can, sometimes it can be viewed as a power move.
Speaker: And I used to always see it as a power move.
Speaker: But now I understand it as a sense of accountability.
Speaker: Similar to what Maggie was saying, sometimes you just need to
Speaker: Either if you're like, you know, pushing it along to make sure it's getting done or maybe they would need their supervisor approval anyway.
Speaker: So why not loop them in?
Speaker: I think it's OK, especially for me, like if my supervisor is included, sometimes I BCC my supervisor in things because I want her in the loop.
Speaker: But I don't want anyone to know she's on the email.
Speaker: So sometimes I use that feature.
Speaker: But it also saves me the trouble of having to update her in our one on ones because she already knows what's going on.
Speaker: And I'm pretty confident she knows I'm doing my job.
Speaker: So typically they'll try to, you know, include my supervisor when they feel like I didn't give them the answer that they wanted.
Speaker: Or maybe it's incorrect information, especially being like newer in the role.
Speaker: But my supervisor is pretty great at letting me handle things and like entrusting me to know that I'm doing what she would do or what she would advise.
Speaker: So I don't take offense to it.
Speaker: I think it's like, hey, you saved me a conversation.
Speaker: I hate it when I get BCC'd on things because my default button on any email now is just reply all.
Speaker: And I do not pay attention close enough usually to like where my status is on the email of like, was it to me?
Speaker: Was I on the copy line?
Speaker: And that's what that just brings me fear.
Speaker: It's like, I get why you did it, but I really don't want that to happen because I can create a negative situation.
Speaker: So I feel like JC, and maybe it's different in the Microsoft 360 because I, Monique, that happens to me too.
Speaker: I will be BCC'd on things either by my staff or my supervisor.
Speaker: And I feel like when I have also replied all in past, it just sends the reply to the sender if you've been BCC'd.
Speaker: Maybe I'm wrong about that.
Speaker: Maybe test it next time and see who pops up in that two field.
Speaker: But I think it kind of...
Speaker: smartly covers you from doing that, I guess, maybe.
Speaker: So I'm trying to think if I've got, I don't know, I'm not going to go back through and look at what I've BCC'd on to test it.
Speaker: But next time you're BCC'd on something, JC, hear reply all and see what it does, because I'm pretty sure it'll just go back to the sender.
Speaker: Maybe tomorrow on our action item list, I'm going to have my staff generate this fake email with BCCs.
Speaker: But then the problem, some of these things is like, I can do a little bit of testing, but I need to involve other people.
Speaker: It's like, but in doing so, now I'm really demonstrating my idiosyncrasies that I kind of keep in check.
Speaker: And I don't know if I'm quite there yet to do this.
Speaker: I don't want people to know how deep down the rabbit hole I go sometimes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, we can test it.
Speaker: I'll email Monique tomorrow and BCCUJC, and you can reply all and see what happens.
Speaker: How about that?
Speaker: Done.
Speaker: Done.
Speaker: I will send it tomorrow morning.
Speaker: Are there any in either of your departments or are you aware of in other departments?
Speaker: Are there any general expectations given to new staff in their onboarding about email etiquette or email culture?
Speaker: I would say we definitely warn people about the volume of email.
Speaker: It's a big department.
Speaker: We're spread out over a lot of different offices.
Speaker: So I feel like that always comes up, even in the interview process, whenever they're like, you know, Oh, what skills do I need?
Speaker: We, we always talk about the volume of email and how that we're such like an email heavy department.
Speaker: So I would say, you know, we, we,
Speaker: For me, I try to tell my staff, okay, if you see emails from these people, you need to make sure you're paying attention, right?
Speaker: Like those are important people that you probably need to answer or at least acknowledge that you've received the message and that you're working on an answer.
Speaker: But I don't think we give specific, you know, etiquette, um...
Speaker: like etiquette instructions, there is a particular like a way that we're supposed to set up our signature line, right?
Speaker: With university branding guidelines and all of that.
Speaker: So we tend to make sure that that's done correctly.
Speaker: But other than just the heads up of, if you're not good at email management, you better get good quick.
Speaker: Sink or swim.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: For real.
Speaker: We don't really talk about any specific etiquette like as a department.
Speaker: Supervisors may do that on their own with their staff members, but departmentally, it's not something that we address.
Speaker: Yeah, I agree.
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: I was recently onboarded.
Speaker: Well, not too recently.
Speaker: I'm almost a bit of it.
Speaker: But when I was onboarding, they really just talked about setting up your email, making it look nice, you know, encouraging us to use the cut, like, you know, the UTA colors and things like that.
Speaker: I feel like they set an expectation for out of office messages early on.
Speaker: That was something they said, oh, you make sure you have a template.
Speaker: Be sure to always do that when you're out of office.
Speaker: And of course, like everything else just came from my supervisors, just like tips and tricks or, you know, what to include, for example, like it'll save time if you include everything so they won't have to reply back and you have to reply again.
Speaker: So it was just more so tips and tricks, but no like set expectations were established or given to me.
Speaker: It's a part of like our onboarding with new staff.
Speaker: I have talked very directly with them about the environment of like,
Speaker: I don't know what kind of environment you're coming from, but here everybody gets copied on everything and it's not, do not take it as a, your supervisor got copied.
Speaker: So you're doing something wrong.
Speaker: And to be very clear about that, because that was quite a culture shock.
Speaker: And again, I'm not like a self-conscious person or like insecure about that kind of stuff, but it still was a culture shock of like, whoa, this is until you get in a ways and understand and get the feel of it.
Speaker: And so I try and address that on the front end of like,
Speaker: Depending on where you're coming from, this might be a little bit of a shock.
Speaker: And then it's funny when like new staff will then immediately like copy everybody on something.
Speaker: It's like, okay, I didn't mean that literally on this little knucklehead request does not need everybody on, but better to be safe than sorry.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Especially when you're new.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: You know, give it a little bit more as opposed to a little bit less.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What about subject lines?
Speaker: This is one I was talking about earlier today that nondescript subject lines drive me crazy.
Speaker: I agree with that.
Speaker: I will also say...
Speaker: I'm not a huge fan of the subject line being the message.
Speaker: Um, I, I on occasion get emails like that and I understand why, right.
Speaker: If it's literally just like a quick, to me, if your subject line is going to be your message, send me a teams.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Um, but yes, the nondescript subject line is,
Speaker: That is definitely frustrating.
Speaker: Need help.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And for me, it's because a lot of times I will search for something by subject, right?
Speaker: So if it's not a specific subject, then that makes it challenging.
Speaker: The subject is also sometimes how I prioritize the emails.
Speaker: So we've kind of talked about prioritizing by sender.
Speaker: all senders equal the subject line and that little red, you know, exclamation point signifying that it's urgent or whatever.
Speaker: Although sometimes that's overused too, but the subject line is what helps me really figure out, okay, what do I need to answer first?
Speaker: What really needs my attention here?
Speaker: So a detailed subject line doesn't have to be long, but a detailed subject line is definitely appreciated.
Speaker: The subject line is very important.
Speaker: That's how I
Speaker: Search for things.
Speaker: It's the way to easily find things.
Speaker: I know I use different ones when I'm emailing my residents.
Speaker: I use something fun like free pizza.
Speaker: And I'm like, hopefully that'll grab their attention to open the email and hopefully read it.
Speaker: But professionally, it's more so like this is pertaining to room 1111.
Speaker: So people know exactly what we're talking about.
Speaker: They'll open it based off that, of course, by priority.
Speaker: But yeah, it just depends on who I'm emailing.
Speaker: So residents always catch you something fun.
Speaker: in something free.
Speaker: It makes me so annoyed when somebody will switch topic mid email stream, right?
Speaker: Like they'll reply to this subject with something completely different, or it's like a, okay, I'm going to address what's in the subject line.
Speaker: And then I'm gonna ask another question.
Speaker: And it kind of
Speaker: steers the conversation in a different way or the correspondence in a different way.
Speaker: That again, because I search and organize sometimes by subject line.
Speaker: Oh my gosh, that is so super annoying.
Speaker: Again, I understand why people do it because it seems stupid to start a whole new like email thread whenever I'm already in the midst of typing to like, you know, typing to somebody, but yeah,
Speaker: That is sometimes not helpful, especially if I've already got it in my brain.
Speaker: Okay, here was the email subject that we were using to talk about this particular situation, and then it changes.
Speaker: That I'm not a fan of.
Speaker: That is one of my email pet peeves, I would say.
Speaker: Maggie, I don't think it's stupid at all to start a new email.
Speaker: Unless the subject line is like...
Speaker: items needing addressing, which means there's lots of items in there.
Speaker: But if it is like roommate conflict in 223, and then all of a sudden you talk about that and then it's like, oh, and by the way, this air conditioner is not working also.
Speaker: I would much rather have a follow-up that says, by the way, this is going on also, or something like that.
Speaker: Because yes, searching, that is such a key thing.
Speaker: And
Speaker: Well, thank you for validating that because I'm glad I'm not the only one that is.
Speaker: Maybe we should come up with like, just here's the quote unquote best practices for email etiquette in the KUHOI standards.
Speaker: Yeah, maybe we should.
Speaker: Maybe we should.
Speaker: It would be an interesting roundtable, I think.
Speaker: It sure would.
Speaker: If we could expand this conversation to more.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Kuhoai in 2022.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We got it.
Speaker: If you were the ruler of all the world and all of email, what rules would you establish for your department about email usage or subject lines or anything else?
Speaker: My number one rule would be you have three strikes with the reply all.
Speaker: And after you have abused it, misused it, whatever, three times it is taken off.
Speaker: You are, you no longer have the option to use it.
Speaker: Sorry, not sorry.
Speaker: Love that.
Speaker: Y'all know what I'm talking about?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I'm sure that y'all have sometimes intentionally not replied all and just replied to one person so you don't become that person.
Speaker: To me, the reply all is like being trapped in a text thread that you can't get out of.
Speaker: That would probably be my number one thing.
Speaker: A stiff penalty for the abuse of the reply all button.
Speaker: Well, and the problem with that is it's so embarrassing when you do it that then you feel obligated to be like, oh my gosh, I'm replying all again.
Speaker: Sorry, everyone.
Speaker: Oops.
Speaker: And then you do it again and it perpetuates, but it's like, I don't want to sit here and everyone think I'm an idiot and not know that I replied all to this thing.
Speaker: Like, thanks.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Show some personality.
Speaker: The only reason why I say this, because people, I might know them personally.
Speaker: And then an email, not saying if it's not like anything that could be pulled for any type of record.
Speaker: I'm like, why are you formally introducing yourself?
Speaker: I met you 50 times.
Speaker: I'm like, you can show some personality, loosen up.
Speaker: I know you're nothing like this.
Speaker: in person.
Speaker: So just please be yourself.
Speaker: But one that's really important as well is if you send the email and I didn't respond in an hour, do not send the same exact email again because that is not going to make me respond to you any faster.
Speaker: But I've had that a few times.
Speaker: There's someone, they'll wait 24 hours and every 24 hours, I'm like, I'm still having it in my inbox.
Speaker: It's still unread.
Speaker: Now I just have three unread messages from you instead of one.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yes, listeners, you couldn't see the video, but Maggie did the biggest eye roll, look to the sky, like exasperated look as Monique was talking.
Speaker: I threw up the preach hands on that one.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Oh, my gosh.
Speaker: If it is that critical, pick up your phone and call me.
Speaker: That is probably my other pet peeve is I will get, again, because I'm not one of these.
Speaker: My inbox has to be at zero.
Speaker: I'm checking my email until 10 o'clock at night.
Speaker: I have two kids.
Speaker: I have two dogs.
Speaker: I'm
Speaker: if I'm not on call or specifically needing to check email because of COVID or whatever, I'm not checking it after five as a general habit.
Speaker: So I,
Speaker: There is nothing worse to me than getting an email the next day and thinking to myself, why didn't they just call me?
Speaker: Like this was urgent enough to warrant a phone call.
Speaker: And now it's been, you know, 12, 16, 18 hours later and the issue still hasn't been addressed.
Speaker: Why didn't somebody pick up the phone?
Speaker: That's like students who put in work orders for their toilet overflowing and not calling it in and then being mad at
Speaker: but they do it after hours and then being mad.
Speaker: It's like nobody addressed this from 5 p.m.
Speaker: to 8 a.m.
Speaker: last night.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Make a phone call.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Ooh, another pet peeve while we're on them.
Speaker: Emo pet peeves.
Speaker: Someone will say, urgent, I really need your attention.
Speaker: It really needs your attention.
Speaker: And I'm like, can you include what is involving?
Speaker: Like if you're saying, hey, I really need to talk to you.
Speaker: My life is in danger.
Speaker: I would respond to that versus you saying, urgent, I need you.
Speaker: Include some content.
Speaker: some context so I know what is needing my attention so urgently.
Speaker: But sometimes people put nothing in the email that says, I just need you.
Speaker: And I'm like, I don't know what you need.
Speaker: And it's just hard.
Speaker: Like now I'm guessing.
Speaker: Well, speaking of urgency, what do you all define as warranting the exclamation mark high priority flag on your emails?
Speaker: I would say I use that if I have something that has a deadline, right?
Speaker: So if it's a, if it's like a quick deadline, if it's more than,
Speaker: 48 hours probably then I'm going to call or I'm going to teams, but something that needs a debt that has a deadline, I'm usually going to put that little, um, you know, urgent thing.
Speaker: Um, I'm trying to think of specific situations when I've actually used it, but honestly, I have a tendency instead of using the little red arrow, I will put in the subject line action needed.
Speaker: And then, you know, like,
Speaker: whatever the topic is, because I feel like that is going to be more attention grabbing sometimes than even the little red arrow.
Speaker: So I have a tendency to do that more than the arrow.
Speaker: I don't really use that feature that often, but I think I've used it like once or twice within my role.
Speaker: And it's typically, like you said, a quick turnaround or a quick deadline or something that was a quick change.
Speaker: Like say if I'm emailing a group and say,
Speaker: Well, typically I use a calendar invite, but sometimes I follow up in an email and I'm like, location change.
Speaker: The event happened in an hour, location was changed.
Speaker: I use something important like that.
Speaker: But other than that, I try not to overuse it because if you do, then I feel like when people see your name and that exclamation point, they won't read it because they're like, oh, they don't need anything.
Speaker: They're just using it so I'll answer them first.
Speaker: Monique's such a drama queen with all of her exclamation points.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If everything's a priority, nothing is one of those moments.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think going back, I think one thing I just thought of another thing that drives me crazy is like somebody will send something at like four 55 and then follow up the next morning at like eight, 10, like just wanted to make sure you saw my email.
Speaker: And I'm like, yes.
Speaker: And then I went home because I couldn't resolve whatever you needed in five minutes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it wasn't an emergency.
Speaker: And I got to work and now I'm getting to it.
Speaker: And then they love to say, I emailed you yesterday and it's been 24 hours.
Speaker: No, it might've been Monday you emailed me and now it's Tuesday, but that is not 24 hours.
Speaker: And you can wait.
Speaker: Or I emailed you last week on Friday at 4.30 and it's got all these people on it.
Speaker: And how then do you respond to be like,
Speaker: Yes, you did email me at the end of the week.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So let's not elevate the excitement level here and try and make people look bad.
Speaker: So let's talk some more strategies.
Speaker: I heard somewhere that, you know, how do we best automate the busy work?
Speaker: And I think email is often busy work.
Speaker: Like any of you automate any way, even like thought process or, you know, how do you how do we do that?
Speaker: So I don't really do this with my own inbox, but during COVID, a colleague and I kind of jointly managed kind of a general Ask Res Life email that we provided to students who were in quarantine or isolation if they had questions or things like that.
Speaker: So something that we did was we used the out of office as kind of an automated FAQ.
Speaker: And we put in that, you know, thank you for your email.
Speaker: We're experiencing, you know, a high volume of emails.
Speaker: Please read the FAQ below.
Speaker: If your question is still not answered, send it again.
Speaker: Otherwise, we will not reply to you.
Speaker: And so then we could kind of go into the inbox, sort by sender, see who we had duplicates from.
Speaker: And those were the ones that we prioritized answering.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We also use that during break periods as well.
Speaker: When we weren't in the office, we were still checking that email throughout the break, but maybe not as frequently.
Speaker: And I think that proved for us to be a good way to kind of manage that quick response expectation of those students.
Speaker: And also when the volume of that inbox was super high, made it a little bit easier for us to identify, okay, who really needs us to reply because their situation is something outside of the FAQ.
Speaker: So that's one strategy that I would recommend if you.
Speaker: you know, monitor a very high volume box, use that out of office and make it work for you as kind of that quick, immediate response.
Speaker: So they know you've gotten the message and that you're, you know, going to get back to them.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: I think that's a great idea.
Speaker: That's really nice.
Speaker: Have to note that for a
Speaker: A couple of tricks that I'll use in the near future.
Speaker: The only thing that I automate that's really busy for me is billing.
Speaker: So I process billing for like resident lockouts and conduct violation, fines and things like that.
Speaker: So I automate it into one folder.
Speaker: And so what I do is I check that folder daily and then print each one.
Speaker: I have to then submit it to housing operations for them to put the charge in the residence account.
Speaker: So that's the only thing I use that's really automated because I feel like it's easy instead of me putting it in folders myself, that'll take, you know, a few moments out of my time.
Speaker: I can save time doing that as well as I know one place to look for it and it can't get lost in it.
Speaker: My email threads are other emails.
Speaker: So that's the only thing I use that's like on an automated system.
Speaker: Well, and I love that too.
Speaker: That's a, like a great example of a system in place of like,
Speaker: You get 15 billing forms in a day.
Speaker: You can stop and do 15 all at once and like, okay, got a print.
Speaker: Now I got a sign.
Speaker: Now I got to take it over.
Speaker: Or if you just like every day at four o'clock, I'm going to do all the ones for the day, do it all at once.
Speaker: It's much more efficient.
Speaker: It's also less aggravating in my opinion of like, oh, another billing form got to do the knucklehead stuff.
Speaker: So I love that.
Speaker: I think that's great.
Speaker: Yeah, I use rules too, if it's things like that.
Speaker: So we have security that walk around our buildings every night and they send a report to me and multiple other people.
Speaker: For me, it's just an FYI because other people take action on the reports.
Speaker: So I have those just filter into a folder so they don't clog up my inbox.
Speaker: So there are things like that that I also get a copy of every instant report that's written.
Speaker: So those filter straight into a folder, you know, and then if someone says, did you see the incident report about such and such?
Speaker: Then I go look for that one and read it.
Speaker: Otherwise, I don't read them.
Speaker: So, yeah, I use rules there.
Speaker: I also noticed my beloved other folder tab.
Speaker: Sometimes there were messages that would go into that.
Speaker: that I needed to come into my inbox.
Speaker: So as I've noticed those, I've set up rules to make sure those get to my actual focused, the focused part of my inbox instead of going into that other box too.
Speaker: So that has helped me not miss things like my staff's time off requests and things like that, that I discovered were going into that other, that little other box.
Speaker: So yeah.
Speaker: Well, and I think that brings up an important point about the consistency.
Speaker: It's easier to set up rules if there's consistency in how they come to you.
Speaker: And the other, for all listeners out there who are like, oh, I'm going to start doing rules, is the more specific you can be, the better.
Speaker: Because I had one when I was an assistant director at UTA that filtered all the RA program proposals.
Speaker: I got all of them.
Speaker: They automatically got filtered over here.
Speaker: Well, one hall director, our residence director, had submitted professional development activity for their staff that got filtered through there over here, or she had forwarded to me.
Speaker: And so if I had been more specific, it got auto filtered.
Speaker: But if I had been more specific in terms of it's coming from this, do not reply at mock forms.com or whatever, instead of just any subject line that says Casey hall program proposal.
Speaker: And she's like, why haven't you talked to me about this proposal I sent you?
Speaker: And I'm like, I have no idea what you're talking about.
Speaker: And then it's like, Oh, cause I, my, my rule wasn't good enough.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I've run into that issue as well.
Speaker: So I used to filter everything that came from like the housing.
Speaker: So when,
Speaker: residents submit room change requests and move outs.
Speaker: It'll, it'll all filter in one folder, which I don't check often because we had used the online system to have residents sign up for like winter break, uh, checkout times.
Speaker: And now it's so confusing because now everything housing sins go to one folder.
Speaker: And so it's hard for me to organize it when I should have either been more specific early on or just take it in my inbox and I separated myself.
Speaker: So I've learned the hard way.
Speaker: So now I have like a,
Speaker: thousand emails alone is in that one folder.
Speaker: And I'm like, oops.
Speaker: One thing I did, it's not necessarily automation, but in terms of like batching or bulking, I will go back and delete every email from not the last term, but the term before that.
Speaker: And it's like, I think,
Speaker: Reasonably so.
Speaker: If I haven't answered or haven't done anything with it, it doesn't need to be done anymore.
Speaker: And I just so like right before this, I deleted everything from August 1st of last year for the summer term and cleared out, I think, 2000 emails or something like that all in one stroke.
Speaker: And when May 31st hits, it's like, okay, now I'll get around to doing the next term before that.
Speaker: And I heard this story once about a president of a university.
Speaker: I don't know if it's true or not, but every day or every Friday at the end of Friday would take his arm and all the papers on his desk would like push him off into the trash can.
Speaker: And if I haven't dealt with it by now, it doesn't need to be dealt with anymore.
Speaker: So I don't know how true that is, but it always made me smile thinking about like just having that level of power and, you know, authority.
Speaker: I sometimes if I find myself with a little bit of downtime, which doesn't happen often, or if that number in the inbox really starts to creep up, because believe it or not, it has been higher than the number I said at the beginning of this.
Speaker: I will sort by sender and that will help me really quickly identify like, you know, the bulk mails that everybody at the university gets.
Speaker: I'm bad about it.
Speaker: one reading and then deleting those.
Speaker: So, you know, sometimes that will help me quickly clean out things that are junky or that are from people who aren't here anymore.
Speaker: Or, you know, like I've got a lot of stuff still related to COVID from students that sorting by sender has helped me get rid of a lot of that pretty quickly.
Speaker: Well, and I think that that's, if you have a lot of emails, I feel like it's super easy to delete the
Speaker: In my case, it would be super easy to delete 7,000 of them.
Speaker: It gets harder the smaller the number gets because you can bulk.
Speaker: Before this, I was just having some fun and I went back to, we have an emergency management system that sends out notices about rooms that need to be cleaned because of COVID or whatever.
Speaker: Just sorted by all them, deleted them all.
Speaker: It was like, I just deleted 500 emails all at once.
Speaker: It's easy to find big batches, like you said, Maggie, of this person or this conversation.
Speaker: It's 35 long, delete all the others.
Speaker: But then once you get down to like nitty gritty, it's like, oh, these need a little bit more thought and take a little bit more time.
Speaker: Yes, I would agree with that for sure.
Speaker: I think eliminating subscriptions is a good one.
Speaker: If you get any subscriptions in your work email, like just turn them off or auto delete them.
Speaker: That is something I need to do for sure.
Speaker: I just deleted 175 emails from Akuhoi all at once.
Speaker: And I feel a little obligated to share this just because of my number of unread and people judging and my career out there of potentially interview for your job someday.
Speaker: I heard your email's a mess and it's on record.
Speaker: But for example, to illustrate, during the summer when we have our make ready,
Speaker: I get an email every single workday that is a list of carpet replacements, a list of carpet cleanings, plus the vendor confirmation, a list of final cleanings, plus vendor confirmation, tub surfacing, internal make readies, internal cleanings, confirmations, pest control confirmations, and final walks, only two of which actually require action on my part.
Speaker: In that moment.
Speaker: So the rest are just like informational or good reference material later on.
Speaker: So in that exact, there was, I think at least 10 and only two of them were directly relevant.
Speaker: So, you know, that would be an easy place to go and be like, I can delete all these vendor confirmations all at once.
Speaker: Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: So in closing, Monique, do you think the strategies you use now will scale up as you advance your career?
Speaker: Of course, I'm constantly evolving and finding new strategies, whether that's being exposed to different styles through coworkers, mentors, my supervisor.
Speaker: I feel like I'm constantly taking on others' ideas and seeing if it works for me.
Speaker: I like to test a few things out.
Speaker: Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker: That's what got me on the system I use now.
Speaker: And when I was a grad assistant, I could use my sticky notes.
Speaker: I probably rarely even opened my email.
Speaker: Now I constantly open my email.
Speaker: I check my email.
Speaker: So I feel like I can definitely see it changing in the future because I like to switch things up and, you know, this is already getting boring.
Speaker: I mastered my current strategy.
Speaker: So why not, you know, try something new?
Speaker: And Maggie, I know you've talked a little bit about this, but any evolution that you've seen since you were a young professional?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, you know, I think that one, I keep a lot more now than I did back then, just because I'm, I won't say I live in fear, but I do not want to be, you know, put in a situation where I'm asked for something and don't have it.
Speaker: So I definitely keep a lot more now.
Speaker: So it has evolved and I think it will continue to evolve.
Speaker: And
Speaker: You know, I've, there are definitely things that I've had to throw away my, my desire to be a color coder and a, a folder user, for example, like, but I do think that it will continue, you know, to evolve.
Speaker: I may get to a place where I have to use some folders.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: We'll see.
Speaker: Or if they limit the space that I have in my inbox, I may have to start deleting things a little more frequently.
Speaker: And I will tell you, I start every semester, um,
Speaker: with the goal of being better about deleting messages.
Speaker: I have failed every semester in my 18 years as a housing professional.
Speaker: So I'm still holding out hope that, you know, maybe one of these semesters I'll actually do it and it'll be okay.
Speaker: But, um, you know, yeah, it'll, it'll continue to evolve for sure.
Speaker: Maggie, if there's one thing I've learned in my career is that the high value for consistency.
Speaker: And so I just value your consistency in that failure.
Speaker: Well, thanks, JC.
Speaker: I appreciate that.
Speaker: And Maggie, to put you on the spot, is it true that at one point in your career, you may have had 90,000 emails in your inbox?
Speaker: I will neither confirm nor deny that.
Speaker: Oh!
Speaker: I will neither confirm nor deny that.
Speaker: But I will tell you, JC, you may not remember this, but I vividly remember.
Speaker: I'm pretty sure we were at Akuhuai.
Speaker: I can picture the restaurant we were sitting in.
Speaker: We were with Berg and Brandi Bowen.
Speaker: And I don't remember how we got on the topic of email.
Speaker: But when I said how many emails were in my inbox, I will never forget the look on your face was kind of like one of those.
Speaker: I don't know that emoji with like the giant eyes and the mouth hanging open.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Like that's what it looked like.
Speaker: And I'm pretty sure that you referred to me as an email hoarder.
Speaker: So I like to think that this topic was planted in your brain by that conversation with
Speaker: many years ago.
Speaker: I do remember that conversation very well.
Speaker: And it was really more of a shock of like the scale of it is like, you know, 1000 doesn't matter if you've got 10,000, just like one doesn't matter if you've got 100.
Speaker: Like when we're talking orders of magnitude, but it's like 90,000.
Speaker: I was trying to in my head think like, have I even sent 90,000?
Speaker: Have I ever received 90,000 in total?
Speaker: And then once you start scaling, it's like, oh, yeah.
Speaker: Yes, probably.
Speaker: And
Speaker: I mean, yeah, you know, over the course of a long time, that doesn't count how many are like auto archived, you know, like you get to the point where it's like, click here to search more on server.
Speaker: I have done that before because I have gone back as far as like, you know, 2015, 2012 to find the answer to the question that someone has asked me.
Speaker: So yeah, all good.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Well, thank you.
Speaker: Any final thoughts before we close out?
Speaker: I think just, you know, I will say this, particularly to new professionals.
Speaker: Clearly, I think we have shown that it really does not matter how you choose to manage your email.
Speaker: The point is you have to manage it.
Speaker: You have to stay on top of it.
Speaker: You know, it does not matter how many more communication methods come out, what technology brings.
Speaker: As long as there are boomers and Gen Xers in the workplace, you're going to have to email.
Speaker: So if it's something that you...
Speaker: are struggling with, if it's something that you are not good at, or if you are like me and you are fine having a gigantic inbox, even if people make fun of you and that works for you, embrace that.
Speaker: But I think the key takeaway hopefully is that no matter how you do it, you've got to stay on top of your email and you've got to manage it because it's here to stay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And to add to that, I would just say,
Speaker: Thank you, Maggie and JC, for sharing some of the tips and tricks y'all learned along the way.
Speaker: And my advice to the listeners would be to share your methods and how you manage with your supervised, your supervisees and your the people that come into your life as a professional just to kind of help us get some knowledge and find out what works for us.
Speaker: Because someone like myself at first email management, I didn't really know was a thing, but I really feel like I have people.
Speaker: to help me along my career that got me to this style now.
Speaker: Shout out to Jen.
Speaker: She really helped me.
Speaker: So just, you know, be that person for someone else and share, share, share.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Well, I want to thank Maggie and Monique for joining us today to talk, of all things, their email inboxes.
Speaker: Please reach out to them and thank them via their preferred social media contact listed in the show notes.
Speaker: As our guest today demonstrated, there is no one right way to be successful at managing the inbox, and you can be successful with some intentional strategies.
Speaker: Have you ever sat in a meeting and thought, quote, this was a total waste of my time?
Speaker: If so, you'll definitely want to check out next month's episode because I'll be joined by Apefa Cooper to discuss an article she published in the Journal of College and University Student Housing called The Price of Hiring Resident Assistants, an Analysis of Human Capital, Opportunity Costs, and Personnel Wages.
Speaker: You may recognize Apefa from episode three of the podcast, and she will be our first repeat guest.
Speaker: It's going to be a fun time quantifying the actual costs of hiring our student staff, both in terms of personnel hours and their associated wages.
Speaker: The article is linked in the show notes, so I encourage you to get a jump on the article by reading it in advance.
Speaker: And with that, I say to you, good day.
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