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“You Don’t Spend Enough Time With Me!!”
6.3k Plays4 months ago
In this episode, Jess and Scott discuss a recent incident in which their child told them that she doesn’t feel like they spend enough time with her. Jess unpacks her feelings of guilt around being a working mom, and Scott helps her understand the deeper reasons behind this guilt.
They explore the struggles of dividing time and attention between sick kids and their other children who still crave connection. Jess opens up about her fears, as a parenting expert, of not being a good enough parent herself and the challenges of transitioning from being a stay-at-home mom to working outside the home more.
Through the conversation, they realize the importance of validating their children's feelings while also helping them build resilience in handling disappointment. Jess and Scott provide an honest look at the guilt many parents face and share insights on navigating these complex emotions.
Get 10% OFF parenting courses and kids' printable activities at Nurtured First using the code ROBOTUNICORN.
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Transcript
Opening & Parental Guilt
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Robot Unicorn. We are so glad that you are here. As always, let's start the show with a question from Scott.
00:00:17
Speaker
Alright Jess, today I want to ask you about something I've noticed in you, and also I feel it often too, but often I feel like we're both feeling kind of guilty about not spending enough time with each of our three girls. Even though, like outside of work, we try to be done at a good time, we try and be 100% with them when we're done work until they're in bed. And on weekends, we often try not to make too many plans so that we can really spend time with them, but yet it sometimes doesn't seem like it's enough for them. So I don't know, bridging the gap is the right word or right phrase, but how do we bridge the gap between we spend all this time with them, but yet we feel guilty and it doesn't seem like that's a necessary feeling.
Balancing Attention Among Children
00:01:03
Speaker
No, it's tough. I feel like I want to start the conversation off by just talking as a mom. And then maybe I can switch to trying to talk about it as a therapist partway through. Yeah. I mean, that's a real experience for us, right? I feel like it's something that if a client was coming to me with this, I would respond one way. But then of course, as the parent going through it, it feels a little bit different. So I'll give an example. So this is what I've been struggling with this week. Our youngest daughter has had strep throat this week and strep throat is terrible if you've ever had it. I've had it so many times in my life and it always really puts me out. So our youngest has had strep throat. So basically she's just been really upset, crying. She's wanted to be sitting on me. Like I think there's one day this week, she sat on me for like five straight hours just basically crying. yeah It was awful. That was before the antibiotics really kicked in. Really struggling with that. Yeah, and she's feeling better now, thankfully. So there's one day this week where she's sitting on me for five hours, and I'm doing my very best to also talk with the other girls, but it's not feeling like enough to them. Anytime you would get off, or you would try and get the youngest off your lap and do something for the other, she would have a very hard time. She was crying. She was crying, yeah. Which makes sense. She was in a ton of pain. She was in so much pain, and so in that moment, I knew of my three kids, her physical need to be close to me, to be on me, was the greatest. Like, she had to be with me.
00:02:26
Speaker
So we did our best to also still be with our older two kids. But then, of course, after two days of the one child being on mom, their jealousy starts to creep up in the older two. Then all of a sudden you start to hear because our kids are very emotionally aware, which is great, but you start to hear, mom, you know, I'm feeling really frustrated because you're only hanging out with my sister and you're not playing with me. And so then all of a sudden you start hearing that and you do start feeling guilty. You're like, ah, you just started summer holidays and this is the start of your break and I can't spend any time with you. And our daughters are expressing that to us and we're trying our best,
Methods for Connecting with Children
00:03:04
Speaker
right? But anytime we try and get off the couch or do anything, then our youngest also starts crying and having a really hard time, which reminded me of like when she was a newborn and we had the similar kind of thing, right? So it's not just when they're sick. It's like, if you have a new baby, now you're, yeah, you can't hang out with your older kids.
00:03:19
Speaker
And then they start to feel upset. And it's like, I would try and connect with them. You know, hey, why don't we sit and watch a show together or read a book while I'm sitting here? Or even the one day I said to our oldest, why don't we pretend to be characters? Like I'll be a prince and you be my mom, the queen, and let's pretend to be a prince and a queen. And she was like, yeah, but it's not playing horsies outside. I'm like, oh, I'm trying here. I'm trying to be a good parent. So I think this conversation is kind of stemming from that, right? So then at the end of the day, you get them all to bed and you just kind of feel like, have I done enough for them today? But yeah at the very same time, I've done everything I possibly can for them today. Well, what I find interesting too is even though, let's say I'm playing with them that whole time, I'm hanging out with them. They still seem to need both of our attention. yeah It's not enough to just have one of us.
00:04:12
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. So I'm with the baby and you've been hanging out with the older kids, yeah but then it's still, well, mom, you didn't play with me today. Well, I noticed that anytime you've traveled too, they will afterwards or anytime I've traveled afterwards, they gravitate to the one that's been away because they feel like they've been missing out on that time and attention from that parent. Yeah. And I am so grateful. I think something that's amazing about our children, is they're so emotionally aware. So they realize that they haven't had the connection time that they need. And so instead of having really challenging behaviors at this point with our four and seven year old, they will actually just tell us. That's been kind of nice. That's been really nice. So I will say that the work that we've done to help them understand their emotions and what's going on inside of their body, for the most part, they're able to yeah communicate that with us, which is nice. A four year old is getting better, but I wouldn't say she's, she's fully there. She's not fully there. She will tell us often, but not always. not always. So I'm just going to switch into education mode for a minute. There's like between the ages of five to seven, we typically start to see that shift of being able to express your emotions, being able to think a little bit more logically during like these difficult times. So since our oldest is seven, she started to have that shift happen where she can express her emotions and see, well,
00:05:29
Speaker
mom's with the toddler who's
Children's Expression of Emotions
00:05:31
Speaker
sick, right? So she might not have as much time with me, but she still struggles with it. So she'll still let us know that it's hard, which is fair and valid. Whereas our four year old, she's just on the cusp of that shift. So sometimes she can say, mommy, play with me or mommy, I want to snuggle or a mommy, I miss you. She'll say that, but then other times she'll be like, I don't like mommy. Mommy's yucky and mommy's the worst. And so other times she'll express that she needs that time with me by trying to push me away. by calling me Yucky. Yeah. Just trying to protect he yourself. Saying I don't like mommy. So her defenses will be really high. So that's the other way she'll show us that she doesn't have the time with us that she needs.
Spending Quality Time with Children
00:06:09
Speaker
So I guess we're just expressing all of that. How do you feel when the kids are, are like that with you? Like, do they say the same kind of thing to you? Like daddy didn't play enough with me today.
00:06:18
Speaker
ah Yeah, of course. Yeah, I mean it's I think we're experiencing the exact same thing just in different ways because I would say like I was gonna call her the baby but our toddler Yeah, one thing about us is, and we know that this is not the healthiest thing, but we, they always call our toddler the baby just because she's our third baby. Yeah, the girls do too. We all just call her our baby. Anyway. She tends to still gravitate more towards you. Yeah. So then the older two, I'm often doing things with them and I've kind of made it a bit of a,
00:06:49
Speaker
I don't know if habit is the right word but I try and spend extra time with them so some mornings. I'll take her middle daughter and I'll have a coffee. She has a donut or we share a donut together. I would say I do a lot with our oldest daughter. So she and I do lots of different things together. I am the one that takes her to karate twice a week. I mean we do lots of stuff. We do little projects together constantly. and Yeah, you guys are really connected. And I truly believe we're both very connected to our kids. And that's why we have these feelings. I was saying before too, there's a few of our team members here. I was expressing to them. So yesterday we came off of a couple of days to start up throw. It was really hard. So yesterday was actually my birthday. And I said to the kids first thing in the morning, because I knew I hadn't spent a ton of time with the older two.
00:07:33
Speaker
It's like, before I go to work, let's go early and I'm going to go take you out for a donut and a coffee and you guys can get, they like to get peppermint tea. So we did that. The first thing we did in the morning, I went, got donuts, peppermint tea with them. Then I came in, I had to work for a few hours. And then since it was my birthday, I was like, I'll take off a little bit early today. And then I decided to go home and was like, girls, do you want to get your nails done with me? We got our nails done together, then we came home, had some more connected time, we had family over, we spent time together. And then because it was my birthday, they thought I should have the privilege of putting them all three of them to bed, which was really cute and actually does show that they know that I delight in time with them.
00:08:12
Speaker
It's the greatest gift of all, putting your children to bed. Yeah. Like TMI, but I was sitting on the toilet and going pee and the girls come rushing into the bathroom. Like the older two, the four and seven year old, they come rushing in the bathroom. They say, mom, you get to put us to bed tonight. We told daddy that you can put us to bed because it's your birthday. As if it was like the greatest gift that they could have ever given me. And at first I was just joking with them like, no, I don't want to do that. And they were like, you're teasing mom. Of course you want to put us to bed. It's your birthday. So that was, that was a good sign. So my entire birthday, and then I was kind of bugging the girls. I was like, girls, is it your birthdays today or is it my birthday? Cause I feel like on my birthday took you out for donuts. I got your nails done. Now I get to put you to bed. And then they were laughing. They're like, yeah, it kind of feels like our birthday too. Yeah, it was a special day for them too. It was a special day for them too, which was so special to me. And then I put them both to bed. Our middle child, she wanted me to hug her like a koala until she fell asleep. So I laid there hugging her like a koala and then she fell asleep in my arms, which was so precious. And then my oldest daughter, she wanted to chit chat and talk as we talked for about 35 minutes. Then after 35 minutes of talking, it was like, okay, I have to go put your sister to bed, the baby, the toddler to bed. And she was like, Oh, Mom, you never spend enough time with me. And I was just like, I don't know what else to do here, my friend. Like, I feel like I've tried to give you so much time today. I will keep it light and playful when she'll make a comment like that, because she was also kind of realized, I think, that it was a little bit silly. She's like, Mom, you don't spend ever enough time with me. I'm like, I think I spent quite a bit of time with you tonight. And she's like, Mom.
Origins and Management of Parental Guilt
00:10:00
Speaker
Anyway.
00:10:01
Speaker
But even even those comments and maybe that's like the deeper thing here I still feel like they trigger something in me So maybe there's something deeper going on because even though she's just bugging me I always think about my dad used to say, you know behind every joke. There's a little bit of truth. So I I still always think like there's something deeper there for her, even though she's bugging me about and I don't spend enough time with her. There's something about her that feels that that's true. So after that really connected 35 minutes of laying in bed with her and cuddling and talking and then kisses and hugs and all that before I go to
00:10:33
Speaker
put the other daughter to bed. She just makes that little comment, oh, ha haha you don't spend enough time with me. And it just triggers me. And then I feel guilty for the rest of the night. So I don't know what that's about. I'm sure we can get there. Can I ask a question? please Is it ever going to be enough? yeah Like at any point will a child ever say, you know, I've spent too much time with you, mom, or I've spent too much time with you. yeah I want some space. I feel like at their ages, it will never be enough. That's not going to be the case ever. They're always going to want to spend more time with you. Yeah. And I did kind of jokingly say that to her. I said, hun, like you just love spending time with me. Hey. And I love spending time with you too.
00:11:12
Speaker
when do you think it will ever be enough time? And she goes, well, you're my mom. So never. So she literally said that, right? yeah So, and then we were just kind of playfully being with each other. And I was like, never enough time. And then I started joking. Well, what if I did this and what if I did that, like all these things that annoy her? I'm like, would it be enough time then? And she's like, never, it would never be enough time. So wouldn't Dr. Neufeld and Dr. Matei from their books say that that's exactly what you want? Yes. And I know that like theoretically this is right. Like it's, it's the right thing that your seven year old can't get enough of you. But in my heart, it's hard to hear because it's like, but I try so hard to give you enough of me, you know? Is it those people pleasing tendencies coming out even for your children? Interesting. interesting
00:12:06
Speaker
Interesting. I think this might be a revelation.
00:12:12
Speaker
Yeah. I think there is a piece of people pleasing with the kids that I struggle with that I am self-aware about. And I wonder if it's like, is it people pleasing with them or is it just like a guilt of being a working yeah mom? Cause I wasn't always a working mom. Yeah, good question. I'm not sure. Like, I can't relate to that, right? I feel like it's normal for men to just work always, right? Yeah, you don't have this underlying feeling like, oh, well, I should be home without you all the time. It's not like I go on Instagram and people are shaming me for working full time and not spending every hour of the day with my kids. So I can't really relate to that feeling. And I mean, that could very well be part of it for you. I don't know.
00:12:54
Speaker
I think it is. I still feel that too though. Like I still feel like I don't spend enough time with the kids, even though honestly we spend, we say no to a lot of things and we talked about that in another episode. We say no to a lot of things specifically because we know our kids need our time and attention. Yeah. And we say no to things that would even involve the kids being with us, but it wouldn't have our undivided time and attention so that we can spend, let's say a Saturday with like tons of friends where there's a million kids there. or we'll just be like, you know what? No, we'll just stay home and hang out just with our own kids. So we prioritize them a lot. So it's funny that I think from anyone looking in, they'd probably be like, man, you guys spend so much time with your kids. How could you feel bad about it? But I do think that there's still that underlying feeling of like, yeah, but is it enough? We struggle with that. We basically feel it's never enough. Yeah, so I guess maybe our kids are feeding off that feeling too, right? Like they probably also feel like they probably get that feeling too. Or maybe it's a chicken and egg situation where maybe we feel that way or maybe they've said it and we don't know which came first, but we all kind of feel like we want to spend all this time together. And is that a wrong feeling? Right.
00:14:01
Speaker
I feel like we make, in general, the most choices to spend the most time with our kids. So like most of what we do is we try and spend time with as just a family, our group of five, our family of five. So yeah, I kind of feel guilty sometimes when we're talking about work after dinner or something like that. But in general, personally, I feel like we do a pretty good job. So I don't feel that much guilt around the subject because I know in general they're going to want to spend as much possible time with us.
00:14:32
Speaker
And as they should, yeah right? So I guess there's that piece, like a child should want to be in relationship with their parent as much as possible. And it's okay for them to tolerate disappointment every once in a while when you have a sick child or, and I think, I don't know if I was talking about this with you or someone else, but like treating your children fairly doesn't mean it's always like equal in that a time with each. Right? So it was fair this week for our youngest to get the most time because she was super sick and she really needed it. She was trying to shove her hands down her mouth because ah she wanted us to take the sore throat away. Right. So she needed that time and maybe another week, like there was another week, our middle child was really struggling a lot. And I really had to pour in with her because I could see her defenses were up with me. Cause she was saying, I don't like you, mommy, you know, you're yucky. And that was a sign for me of, Oh, she needs more closeness with me. yeah And you have to remember last week. I went on a field trip with our oldest and we had a party for our oldest. And last week our oldest was finishing at her school. So that was a tough week for her. So we yeah poured into her, right? So I think that's the other thing I need to remember and and be okay with just validating those feelings in our kids. Like, I know it's really tricky. You're disappointed right now because you wish you could spend so much. Yeah. You wish, you wish I didn't have to take care of your sister and you wish that she wasn't sick. And I get that. but you know today is one of those days where she really needs a little bit of extra time and I wonder what you can do too. I feel like with our oldest you can have that conversation you can say hey let's try and figure out something maybe you can do something with dad instead. Yeah and then what we can do with our oldest is we will often make a plan like she loves to have it in the schedule and know when I will have the undivided time with her.
00:16:17
Speaker
So for example, this week, what I said was, I can't give that to you today because look at what's going on here. But what about Friday night? Dad will put the other girls to bed and we'll do a sleepover together. I didn't tell you that. You did not tell me that. Interesting. So Friday night we have in the schedule that I will do a sleepover with her, which all involves like, she's like, oh, then we can do each other's makeup and we can do a like, there's a whole list of things she wants to do in our sleepover, but there was something about having that on the calendar that made her feel at peace. Like, okay, I know we'll get that time. Now with our four year old, that's a bit trickier when she wants that time with us because it's not as like, she doesn't understand that. Yeah. She's more like, I need it right now when I need it. So I feel like some of the things, and this is things that you can do, whether you have a child that's sick or you just had a new baby,
00:17:05
Speaker
Like, how can we create those little bridges,
Balancing Work and Parenting Commitments
00:17:07
Speaker
those little tiny moments, we call them, of interaction and connection that can help get them through? So with our middle daughter, maybe it's like sitting and reading a couple books together. Well, she loves getting that donut too sometimes. so Yeah. If you can, I try to do that before going to work with her. Yeah, we'll just take her to a local cafe and we'll just get a donut. It takes like 30 minutes. We'll sit down with her, eat the donut together. But that means the world to her, like that intentional quality time. So doing something like that. The quality interactions don't have to be big in order for them to be meaningful for them. And I find with our middle child who gets very defensive and like I don't like you. Like your inkling as a parent is going to be to pull away or say, Hey, you can't talk to me like that. That's rude. But what I know is when that defensiveness comes up, it's like, it's a pour in. Like we have to actually lean so much closer in and not let those little comments get to us, which can be tricky. And then our toddler, like she has, she has moments too. Like I think last week she had a hard week because her big sisters were having tough weeks. So we were actually spending a lot more time with the two of them.
00:18:15
Speaker
And she's a pretty happy-go-lucky toddler, but she was definitely missing that connection time too. Yeah. What's the moral of the story, Jess? There's actually, there's, okay. I told you I was going to come back to my therapist lens. Yeah. And I think when you feel guilt as a parent, I think sometimes we're too dismissive. Like, oh, you should never feel guilt as a parent. Like I'll see stuff like that on Instagram, you know, just like release yourself from all guilt or whatever. Is that realistic? Yeah, I don't think that's realistic. And I think when you feel guilt about something, you should tune in with that feeling and then tune in with your value system and try and understand where that guilty feeling is coming from, which is kind of what I had said to you at the top of the conversation. Like I want to understand why I'm feeling guilty. And one of the things that you were saying before is like, well, maybe is there a conflict between your values and what's actually happening? Maybe there's some people pleaser tendencies where you're like, you don't want your children to be disappointed in you. But what is like the guilt? I feel bad because I can't give all my love and attention to all my kids all the time.
00:19:14
Speaker
that's probably not actually what's going on here. There's something like behind that that's a value of ours that I think that's what we really need to figure out. And then you can figure out how you can release yourself from the guilt. But I think sometimes we oversimplify mom guilt or dad guilt, parent guilt and just say, well, you know, don't feel guilty. It's okay that you're a working parent or it's okay that you can't give your kids all the time and love and attention. But I think it's actually better to go, well, what's the value that you're feeling in conflict with and why is that coming out in guilt? So, what without words have that been spoken what value do you think I may conflict with? What value? Or we, because I think it could be our guilty feelings around this. I think we've identified that we actually do our very best to live within our values. Yeah. To be honest, I feel like I don't feel the same level of guilt that you feel. And maybe this is just in general how I do things. I realize that there's maybe a desire from the kids to want to spend more time. So then I try and figure out when we can spend more time.
00:20:16
Speaker
And I'm not necessarily feeling like overly guilty about the few hours that we spend with them at the end of every day, the hour and a half that we spend at the beginning of the like in the morning, and then all weekend. Like that's just the reality of our lives. So we spend as much time as we possibly can. I would say we live within our values for the most part. Sometimes we get distracted by work stuff and where we have to talk and that takes up some of that quality time. And then we, I feel like we readjust, we realize that and we've talked about that before where we say, okay, it's time for us to. Just stop. Yep. Let's be with the kids. Let's table this until after once all the kids are in bed, then we can continue having this discussion.
00:20:56
Speaker
So you feel like you don't have like this feeling of guilt. Like, I don't give the kids enough of me. I mean, I always feel like I would love to give them more, but again, realistically speaking, can we? No, like I don't think we can. Yeah. And I mean, I even take Fridays off so that I can spend the entire day with them on that day too, which is a privilege, right? I think there's like two different things that are going on for me. So the one thing that always plays through my mind, and I don't know if I've told you about this, is years ago, like I don't, this might even be before I ran or transferred to our mama village or anything like that. I was a therapist working with kids and I came across someone who was actually the daughter of one of my professors that I really looked up to. Oh yeah, right. Did I tell you this story? Yeah, I remember you telling me about this. Yeah, and the professor was incredible. The professor taught parenting.
00:21:47
Speaker
Like, so in my undergraduate degree, a lot of my courses were actually on child development and parenting makes sense given my profession now. And I really looked up to this professor. They were a leading expert in parenting and child development. And her daughter said to me, I said, Oh, that's your mom. Like, Oh, I love her. She's so smart. And she's taught me everything, you know? And the daughter was like, yeah, she's great at teaching parenting, but she was a terrible parent. And it like, ah It hurt my heart because it was like, wait, all this guidance and information I took from this person and she actually was a terrible parent. And so I think as someone who teaches parenting for a living, my absolute worst fear of for my own children to grow up and be like, oh yeah, she helped millions of people around the world be a better parent, but she actually sucked at being a parent. Right.
00:22:35
Speaker
So I think that's fair enough I have that fear and that is in the back of my mind sometimes. I know if I really think about it that I am a good parent. And I mean, this is coming from me. So, you know, it's hard. It's hard to take it, but I truly practice everything I preach with our girls. and I want them to feel so safe and loved. And those are my values, like I truly do. And if I wasn't running nurtured first, I would parent the same way I parent now, right? Like I don't parent this way be because I run this business. I parent this way because I truly believe it's the most important way to parent our kids. And I believe in helping our kids grow up in safe and loving homes. Like that is a value of mine.
00:23:23
Speaker
It just so happens that it's also my work to teach everybody this.
Openness About Parental Mistakes
00:23:27
Speaker
So I think that's one fear that I have is like, I just don't want the girls to ever grow up and be like, yeah, she spent so much time teaching other people that she didn't actually spend time with me. So it's just a fear. Do you think you're putting extra unneeded pressure on yourself? Because I feel like no matter how good your childhood is, when a child grows and becomes a parent themselves, or maybe not even a parent, but just grows up, there will be things that I think, regardless of how well you parented, there's gonna be like, I don't think they did this right. 100%. I already know that there's going to be things that they come to me and say, Oh, why would you have done this? Or why would you have said that? yeah And they're going to want their own therapy for stuff. And I think that that will also be a sign of a job well done that they're like willing to communicate those stuff with me. And I'm already ready. Like I'm already ready to have those conversations and potentially be hurt by what they have to say.
00:24:22
Speaker
when they're adults and they're like, Hey, I didn't like how you did this and this when I was a kid or, you know, I wish you wouldn't have said this or I wish you wouldn't have done that. Like I'm already ready to have those conversations and be an open and willing participant in them. Do you think those will hurt? Do I think that those conversations will hurt? Yeah, yeah probably, but that'll be okay. Just cause it's me. like You don't think it would hurt you if the kids grew up and all of a sudden were like, hey, dad, you screwed up in this, in this area. And now I'm going to go to therapy for it. I'm just letting you know. In no way am I under the impression that I have not done things incorrectly. Yeah. So it will be important for.
00:25:00
Speaker
We've talked about this before. It's important for me that the kids know that we are not perfect. And that a lot of the things that we do and we say now, they may not love in the future. Like we're not by any means perfect, because that's we're humans. so So if they were to come back to us in the future and say, hey, this really affected me and it's affected me to this day, that's not going to surprise me. I mean, yeah, I'll wish maybe had I had done things better potentially, but that's but I would love to have a relationship with them where they feel comfortable telling us that, and they know that we can handle it. I would love that. I think maybe the difference is, for me, because of how I grew up, I realized that that messed me up a whole bunch.
00:25:43
Speaker
So my concern is that I do not want to pass on even a portion of that messed up-ness to them. Yeah. And that's why I've said to you recently, like, at what point should we potentially even send them to a therapist just so they can work through anything that maybe I have done inadvertently? Yeah. Just because I don't want them to experience anything like what I experienced. And this is two perfectionists raising kids. Like I'm just thinking to myself, like we... i Two perfectionists, but also we know we're not perfect. Yeah, that know that they aren't perfect. We try and do the best that we can, but we know that there's room for error. And I do think like from my therapist lens, like the beautiful thing that we are doing with the kids is we're pouring so much into this relationship with them and like we're really trying to show them, hey, like we want you to come to us.
00:26:35
Speaker
Even when they already are saying things like are old to say, you know, you didn't spend enough time with me today. I really wanted to play horses, but you know, you didn't have time to do that. And that was disappointing. Like even already they're able to tell that to us and I'm not getting her in trouble. Like, how dare you say that? We're just like, yeah, I get it. Like it's hard when you can't have us in the way that you want us to. Like, so we're already validating those feelings, even if we can't fix the way that they feel in the
Transition from Stay-at-Home to Working Parent
00:27:01
Speaker
moment. So I do think that that's one of the really important things that parents can do when they feel stretched thin. Right. The other thing, so I told you that the one guilty feeling I have is like, I don't want to be a teacher of this information and then not actually do it. Which I know logically that is not what's happening. So that's okay. As you would say, sometimes when I get anxious about things, I'll just go check.
00:27:22
Speaker
So that's the one thing. And then the other piece is, you know, I was raised by a stay at home mom and I really valued that experience as a child. And I have been a stay at home mom for several years, even though I was working is it true on the side. yeah I mean, I was still working, but I was with the kids. Like yeah true during the pandemic, like almost like three years of pretty much being home, mostly full time. And now is the first time that I've ever been working, like truly working outside of the home four days a week. So this is just different for me. And yeah right I think that's where we differ. You've always worked five days a week outside of the home.
00:28:04
Speaker
I've always been mostly home and then, oh, maybe I'll get a babysitter here and there so I can get some work done. And then that feels like a nice break for me to get work done now that our kids are a little bit older. It's the first time I'm actually like going to an office four days a week since before having kids. Yeah, that's a big increase. Seven years. That's true. So I think that that's probably where my more of a guilty feeling comes out because I'm like, well, I actually used to be the one that was with you four days a week. And now I mean, our oldest is even in school. So it's like, even if I was a stay-at-home mom, she wouldn't even be home with me, right? But I think that's where I am currently working through some of these feelings myself transitioning. Now I know the truth is that I could be a stay-at-home mom and be incredibly overwhelmed or feel more triggered, which I totally was when I was a stay-at-home mom because there was a lot of things that
00:28:56
Speaker
were really, really difficult for me about that. Like all the things like doing all the laundry and the cooking and the cleaning and the mess and the overstimulation and all of that. Like now I feel like for me personally, this is not for everybody, but when I go to work and I come home, I have a lot more to past capacity to be fully present than I did when I was home full time. So I actually feel like there's a piece of me that is a better parent in terms of like the capacity that I have to give and pour into them than I was when I was there all the time and I was overwhelmed and trying to do all the things that I wasn't very good at and overstimulated.
Defining Quality Time & Conclusion
00:29:32
Speaker
So there is that piece too, but I think that that's what I'm working through right now. And I think a lot of parents probably are in the same boat, like going back to work after having almost seven years of raising babies at home. Like it's, it's a big adjustment.
00:29:45
Speaker
Yeah. And if you think too, not that you had it for our last child, but we have a year maternity leave or up to a year and a half yeah in Canada too. Which we're so lucky to have. Yeah. But in other countries, that's a completely different story too. So you have to go back after what, 12 weeks or something like that in the US. And I don't know what it is in other countries, but yeah, it's difficult even though we're set up pretty well here, relatively speaking for raising kids at home and spending enough time with them. Right. Yeah. So I think that's the piece. And then, so it's, if I tune in with those values, it's like, well, why do I feel so triggered when our daughter after me spending almost all day with her says, well, you don't spend enough time. I think it just brings up this memory of like, well, you're not a stay at home mom Jess and your mom was.
00:30:34
Speaker
It's always something deeper and i I knew it was and that's why I wanted to have this conversation with you because I'm like it's not about not spending enough time because I spend so much time with them. And what's the deeper feeling? It's like this feeling of guilt because I'm no longer a stay-at-home mom. Now I've transferred into being a working mom and there's these internalized feelings of does that make me a bad parent? And I know what I would say to any working mom. Like all my friends basically are working moms and they're incredible parents to their children. Like, and I see that. So I would never treat a friend the way I treat myself, but I'm very like hard on myself.
00:31:08
Speaker
Why do you think that is? Because I'm sure there's a deeper reason there too. Why is Jess a perfectionist when it comes to this? That's a whole other podcast episode probably. Why do you think that this is? I don't know. 10 years being married, you haven't figured that one out yet. Well, maybe I do, but I feel like this episode is almost me providing therapy to the therapist. So I want to continue. and I like it. I know. It's kind of nice. Nice change of pace over here. Yeah. And I came into this episode knowing I wanted to be really honest about that. And I know we could have done this episode from a totally different lens where I just like provide my therapist opinion on all the things. But I think it's important to name that even the professionals can struggle with these feelings sometimes. And what I don't want to do is just get stuck in the guilt and be like, OK, well, then I have to quit my job or then. And I don't want to get this frantic energy like that. I just give them more and give them more because I don't even I don't even think that's the answer to this. Right. It's like you said, children will always want more.
00:32:04
Speaker
So it's okay for them. It's not like we provide a small amount of quality time with them. Right. And if we really truly reflect, it's like, no, we actually provide a lot of time with them. yeah If we reflected, like there's been times for sure that I've reflected and been like, let's say the month of May, I went on a trip to Nashville for work. And then we went to Portugal for a 10th anniversary and we were gone a lot that month. yeah right So that month when the kids were saying that and I reflected, it was like, yeah, actually, we haven't spent enough time with them and we really need to. And we really need to prioritize doing that. right So it's not always that we reflect and we're like, we're good. Just this but this time in this season, we're actually like, no, we are okay. So then is it okay for us to help them navigate feelings of disappointment? Is it okay for us to have those conversations and be like, yeah, that's really tricky. Let's journal it out. It's probably an important skill to learn so they build resilience.
00:32:56
Speaker
Yeah. It's part of them building resilience too. Right. And I think the thing that we don't want to do is be like, just get over it. You have tons of time and be dismissive about it yeah right or get angry at them about them asking for time with us. Like I never want to do that. I want them to always know like I love spending time with you I delight in spending time with you and if I could I would spend all the time with you that I could but I can't and that's okay too and you're capable of handling those feelings I'm still alongside you still gonna help you navigate those feelings but it's okay to be disappointed or even upset and help them navigate that so that they know that they can feel those feelings and still feel safe with us in relationship sounds good well I think that's a nice way to end off this episode
00:33:42
Speaker
Yeah, well, once again, a messy conversation, but I hope that you feel a little bit seen if you're in the same boat and maybe you have some of your own thoughts on why this is triggering for you and I'd love to hear about it. Let us know what you think of this episode. Let us know. All right, we'll talk soon.
00:34:02
Speaker
Hey friends, thank you so much for listening to today's episode. We are glad that you are here. If you enjoyed today's episode and found it interesting, we'd really appreciate it if you'd leave a rating and a review. Scott and I actually sit down together and read them all. A five star rating helps us share our podcasts and get these important messages out there. Thank you so much for listening and we can't wait to talk to you again next time.