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S4-172: Part 3, Answering Contract/RFP Listener Questions With Mike and Billy!
1 Playsin 9 hours
The guys welcome back Mike Santolucito of ODP, and Billy Moore of Executive Ground Maintenance to keep going with the contract/RFP topic we have been on the last three weeks. This episode is completely listener questions that we try to answer as best as we can
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Transcript
Introduction and Technical Challenges
00:00:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Here we go again, Snow Jobs Nation. We are back again bringing you episode 172 of the Snow Jobs Podcast main show powered by Top Gun Backblades. As always, I'm Steve. You know who's with me.
00:00:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Jeremy Take-Two Lindstrom is in the house.
00:01:01
RICK JAMES
Take two. Taking two.
00:01:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah What's up, buddy?
00:01:03
RICK JAMES
Doing
00:01:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
How are you?
00:01:07
RICK JAMES
doing pretty good. How about you?
00:01:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, we're good, man. Let's try this again. we got about six minutes into a recording and something just went kaput. So we had to start all over again and try and just duplicate magic.
00:01:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's very hard to do.
00:01:20
RICK JAMES
It was so magical. was so magic. I mean, it was... <unk> You guys don't know what you missed.
00:01:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
The joys of podcasting. we'll have to We'll have to put that five minutes and change out as its own episode.
00:01:28
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:01:31
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:01:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
It was that good.
Weekly Highlights and Humorous Exchanges
00:01:34
RICK JAMES
It was amazing.
00:01:36
RICK JAMES
So good.
00:01:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, man.
00:01:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
How's your week? Good?
00:01:39
RICK JAMES
Week's been busy. Yep. Real busy spraying God's juice, you know, keeping the interstates, you know, dust free.
00:01:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
gotta Gotta be. got I'm glad you're finding finding time to spray in between your tanning sessions. That's good.
00:01:54
RICK JAMES
Yes.
00:01:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's good. good yeah
00:01:55
RICK JAMES
You know, between between between Palm Beach and and ah in the in the semi, we're getting her done.
00:01:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
but
00:02:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, boy.
00:02:02
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Yeah.
00:02:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's great, man. Happy to hear it.
00:02:06
RICK JAMES
Hey, Palm Beach is a great place to go.
00:02:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Happy to hear it.
00:02:09
RICK JAMES
hu
00:02:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go. Did you get a you got to get like a frequent flyer card type deal. They got they gotta to have the packages, right?
00:02:17
RICK JAMES
oh yeah. Yeah, definitely. For sure.
00:02:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
so
00:02:22
RICK JAMES
It's like my car wash pass unlimited man. You just go.
00:02:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go. There you go. Just go full baked potato, baby. Awesome.
00:02:29
RICK JAMES
Yeah. What's wrong with that?
00:02:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
good for you i see you're wearing our uh our uh f canada shirt but
00:02:32
RICK JAMES
It's all good.
00:02:37
RICK JAMES
Yeah, I had worry. Yep. had worry. I was up there the other night chasing myself. We were up and right on the border, Canadian border, spraying a fire line, trying to keep those fires out of the great US of A, you know, we don't want any of that shit down here.
00:02:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
keep us safe keep us safe spray that fire line down don't let the flames cross without tariffs
00:02:55
RICK JAMES
Hey, it's not going to happen. Not going to happen on our watch. It's a,
00:03:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah I love that shirt, man. I wore both of mine. So, you know, around here, laundry is on like a three month cycle. So I'll see that shit again by June. i think July.
00:03:10
RICK JAMES
Three months cycle.
00:03:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah Like she won't do another load of laundry until she gets out of school. So it's ah if it's more than a third of the way down the mountain of laundry in the hall, then I, you know, it's usually about a month and a half before I can get to it.
00:03:16
RICK JAMES
Oh boy.
00:03:26
RICK JAMES
Oh boy.
00:03:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
So yeah. Good times.
00:03:28
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Sounds like it.
Mike and Billy's Q&A on Contracts
00:03:30
RICK JAMES
Sounds like
00:03:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, I'm working.
00:03:31
RICK JAMES
What's been going on in the great red state of New York?
00:03:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
Working, working, hockey, working, podcast, working, hockey, podcast, working. That's ah the literally the last week. Not much else.
00:03:44
RICK JAMES
Sounds like a lot of fucking off.
00:03:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
that's That's it, man. just I mowed my own lawn today, which was great. I had ah a little bit of time to do that.
00:03:51
RICK JAMES
I thought you people for that.
00:03:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm doing it myself this year because we're not mowing anymore. um so we we have an abundance of mowers. So I just told the boys, like, throw a mower set at my house and I'll take care of my own my own property.
00:04:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
So it's nice to be able to get out there and get that done. And at least I know it'll be striped the way I like it because they just never seem to stripe it the way I would. it's It's aggravating.
00:04:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah. You do zigzags or what do you do?
00:04:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
I do everything. I do diamonds. I do the S patterns. It depends how I feel.
00:04:22
RICK JAMES
Diamonds? Oh, wow. Well, let's take some pictures.
00:04:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
how I feel.
00:04:25
RICK JAMES
i want to see this.
00:04:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. Yeah. No, I'm a stripe master, bro. I don't mess around with that stuff. I can do patterns.
00:04:32
RICK JAMES
Huh.
00:04:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm pretty good with it. Pretty good with it.
00:04:34
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:04:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
But it's...
00:04:34
RICK JAMES
We use the skags, right?
00:04:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
the
00:04:36
RICK JAMES
Skagmar?
00:04:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
I use Skaggs, but even the Skaggs, the turf Tigers stripe differently than the V-Rides because they're a different stance.
00:04:37
RICK JAMES
Is that what you're using? Yeah.
00:04:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
So you got to constantly, like, if you if you start with a V-Ride, you got to end with a V-Ride because if you use a Tiger, it looks different. It's a different stance because the the tire widths are different.
00:04:51
RICK JAMES
Wow.
00:04:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
But, the yeah, we have some fun.
00:04:54
RICK JAMES
Hmm.
00:04:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
But, yeah, doing my own lawn, it's a good time.
00:04:57
RICK JAMES
That's good.
00:04:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
I love doing it. And it's, ah you know, I do it better anyway. That's it. got to talk to Turbo Todd today.
00:05:06
RICK JAMES
Oh, really?
00:05:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:05:07
RICK JAMES
Turbo Todd? I talked to him last week. Sounds like he's setting up a God's juice truck, too. so
00:05:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Turbo Todd. ah Turbo melt is moving east. Thank God after the debacle we had with the the magic last year, not being so magical at times.
00:05:16
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:05:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
it's It's nice to see we're going to have a ah treated alternative for granular. So I'm going to do more research on the the Turbo Melt stuff. I know Putsy loves it. So be it's exciting exciting news to hear that that's coming to the Northeast.
00:05:33
RICK JAMES
Yeah, but his
00:05:38
RICK JAMES
that's pretty cool. I think he secured a rail spot or something. I think he was telling me or.
00:05:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
He says he's all set. He's he's ready to roll. So we're going to see how it goes. That'd be great.
00:05:48
RICK JAMES
Cool. Good for him. Yeah. He's hes <unk> got a good product. Works well. So it should really work out there.
00:05:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:05:54
RICK JAMES
I
00:05:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, Putsy says it's great, and everybody you've you've said loves it. So that'll be great.
00:05:58
RICK JAMES
think Macintosh, I think CJ and Matt from Plowride, they used the last year, some, a few loads of it and I think they really liked it.
00:05:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Do they?
00:06:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
do they
00:06:06
RICK JAMES
So yeah,
00:06:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
they'll take any salt they can get right they i just they were desperate for salt whatever
00:06:12
RICK JAMES
I think I think everybody's bins are everybody's filling bins right now. I've seen a lot of snaps and yeah.
00:06:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
i'm sure that's what i was going when i was on the phone with you the other day going down the road with all those tractor trailers at four in the morning that's what they're all hauling salt
00:06:20
RICK JAMES
So
00:06:27
RICK JAMES
I was, I was, that's what was flying out at you.
00:06:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep. That's what was hitting my windshield. Yeah, that was what hit.
00:06:30
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:06:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
When I got to work, I had a lot of salt kernels in the windshield below the wipers.
00:06:31
RICK JAMES
Nice.
00:06:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
So I'm like, okay, that's what was tapping on the windshield the whole time.
00:06:37
RICK JAMES
ah
00:06:40
RICK JAMES
Brian in the hop, the highway.
00:06:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep, absolutely.
Podcast Review and Listener Engagement
00:06:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
So we are tonight, we are continuing with Mike and Billy. After the last two episodes we did with them on contracts and RFPs, we had an abundance of questions coming from Facebook, coming from DMs on Instagram, coming off our website email, comments on the website. We had a ah ton of stuff come in that you guys ask questions about. and And honestly, that's why we were doing those episodes, just to get everybody's take on how they,
00:07:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
what they feel they have to have in the rfps and the contracts getting as many perspectives as possible because you you don't if you don't know you don't know and if you don't think of it on your own chances are it's not in your ah rfp or contract so it's good to get a bunch of guys and i'll just see how different everybody is and and what they have in there and i've picked up a couple things from these guys and i'm sure everybody else has picked up things from them So we're going to continue with that tonight. We're going answer your questions. I do apologize. There were probably in total about 35 questions. um
00:07:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
We're going to probably do more than one of these episodes because I looking at the timeline here, what it normally takes to answer these. We're looking at about five questions maybe tonight that we can answer in detail.
00:08:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
So we'll see how far we get and we'll we'll keep going if that's what guys want. But from how many how much engagement we had and how many people were asking questions, it seems like guys want want to hear this stuff. So we will keep going.
00:08:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
So that's what we're doing tonight. We got Mike and Billy back for round three. But before we do that, we're going to, as always, we're going to go hear from Team Top Gun. Come back and quick review.
00:08:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. Thank you, Top Gun. We are back. Quick week in review. We're going to go through some stuff here. As we've been saying, Storm Chasing Season 2 is out. Episode 2 is live. We got Clintar for Episode 2. I want to see all 30,000 of those Clintar employees tuning into YouTube and and checking out that episode.
00:09:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
So let's get on that Clint are Simon 2026 is in Schitts and Addy, as we've been saying, it's going to be running from June 23rd to the 26th storm field day is next up after that.
00:09:18
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:09:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
That is July 29th and 30th
Snow Events and Promotions Discussion
00:09:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
this year. Tickets are currently on sale on the storm website. September 16th and 17th. That is our double Pennsylvania days.
00:09:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
We got Wednesday. Is it Wednesday? Yeah, I guess it must be Wednesday. Wednesday the 16th would be Storks Plow Tech School, and that's in Leesport, Pennsylvania. If you have not attended that, that is definitely, definitely worth going to to to to be able to work on and fix and diagnose your own problems with all your Douglas Dynamics stuff.
00:10:04
RICK JAMES
you.
00:10:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
plow spreaders uh we went last year it was phenomenal uh thanks to gene and his team for going above and beyond you're basically full-blown uh plow tech by the end of the day and they give you that little cheat manual that's worth its weight in gold um out of respect for storks is the only reason i haven't photocopied that whole thing and started selling it on ebay or the website because it's got it's got every diagram of wiring every hydraulic diagram it's awesome it's really cool stuff so that's the 16th of september and once you're done there you head on over the scranton wilkes bar area of pennsylvania the 17th thursday sns snow and ice solutions
00:10:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
sixth annual snow show uh they're going big this year it was great last year a uh had a great panel discussion on liquids um what else they had some outdated videos of some plows not scraping too well that's i remember that that was pretty funny um but uh janet uh janet does a tremendous job
00:11:04
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:11:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. ah She she runs that whole event. You know, to we give Tony credit, but, you know, it's got to be Janet that runs most of it. But all kidding aside, the two of them put on a phenomenal event. The whole team at S&S treats everybody like royalty. And you definitely want to go check that out. It's a great day of networking. And then we wrap it up October 1st.
00:11:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
October 1st in Uxbridge, Massachusetts is the third annual Northeast De-Icing Solutions De-Icing Day. Patty Salmon and company built an entire building just for this show now.
00:11:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
So they are not messing around.
00:11:44
RICK JAMES
Yeah. I think it's going to have a live band. don't know who it is.
00:11:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
Live band.
00:11:49
RICK JAMES
I think im morgan with it Morgan's going to be there.
00:11:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
morgan Morgan Wallen's going to be there.
00:11:53
RICK JAMES
Morgan Wallace. Yeah.
00:11:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
mor Morgan Wallace.
00:11:55
RICK JAMES
No, Wallace. Morgan Wallace. Not Wallen.
00:11:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
I
00:11:59
RICK JAMES
He's getting Morgan Wallace.
00:12:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
love that. Oh, man. That's funny. That's funny shit. But, yeah, the yeah patty Patty has... outdone himself both years he the first year was great we we thought it was great the second year was tremendously better so we can't wait for year three in the brand new building to house the event uh so that that tells you they're serious if they're building a building for it
00:12:24
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:12:27
RICK JAMES
I thought door prize is giving away a semi-lob of Brian or something. not are at all
00:12:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
a what ah semi-load of brine that's useless for me oh man that's great
00:12:38
RICK JAMES
Oh, Patty's going to be calling me. Patty's going calling me.
00:12:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
there you go there you go uh as always snow jobs nation store.com for all your snow jobs apparel needs uh we got some new items in there jeremy is anxiously getting them out and uh we are going to put together a little giveaway for some snow jobs luggage it's a very high quality stuff what who made it again is it osio again
00:12:43
RICK JAMES
I'm just giving you shit.
00:13:02
RICK JAMES
OGL, yeah.
00:13:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, OGO is awesome. Awesome. I actually got to use it going to Starks. Phenomenal carry on, very heavy duty. So we're going to be doing a giveaway for for one of those.
00:13:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Keep an eye on ah on Instagram for the next couple days. We'll get it out to you. Keep hitting, like, and subscribe. All the five-star reviews you want on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Keep leaving us comments and stuff.
00:13:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
on there keep listening every little bit helps us bring you keep bringing you what you guys need so anything else buddy 321s with no store no not 321s right 344s with no speed sensor issues get them while they're hot and double armrests
00:13:39
RICK JAMES
No, just, ah well, like i said, I'm still trying to sell a couple loaders. So if anybody's interested, reach out. so so No, three forty four s
00:13:52
RICK JAMES
And two armrests
00:13:57
RICK JAMES
installed by me.
00:13:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
but uh will you autograph both machines if they sell there you go there you go you will have a jeremy lindstrom autograph on the dashboard of each machine oh shit anything else all right cool all right so let's hear from our partners then we'll come right back we'll get into it with bill and mikey
00:14:03
RICK JAMES
Oh, hell yeah, I will.
00:14:13
RICK JAMES
i think that's it for now.
Listener Q&A: Pain Points and Budgets
00:16:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, gang, we are back. Mike and Billy, welcome back. How we doing, boys? Everybody good?
00:16:40
Mikey Santolucito
Good to be back.
00:16:42
Billy
to be back for the three.
00:16:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
Been a while.
00:16:43
RICK JAMES
The voice.
00:16:43
Billy
Who wrote
00:16:44
RICK JAMES
don't
00:16:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Been a while.
00:16:45
Mikey Santolucito
don't know, it's been a whole four days.
00:16:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
know, right?
00:16:48
RICK JAMES
Did he miss me?
00:16:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
we
00:16:49
Mikey Santolucito
did a lot.
00:16:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
We got to get right into this.
00:16:51
Billy
that Angela?
00:16:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
we got We got a question for Bill right out of the gate.
00:16:52
RICK JAMES
Seems.
00:16:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
What can we do to get Billy to be a little more candid and open when answering questions?
00:16:56
RICK JAMES
Uh-oh.
00:17:02
RICK JAMES
ah
00:17:02
Mikey Santolucito
Angela needs to be in the room.
00:17:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah i said that was a good one that was a good one um so you guys what's that god
00:17:05
Billy
wrote that angela
00:17:11
RICK JAMES
Who's that from... ah Who was that from?
00:17:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
uh i don't know i didn't write down the name on that one because i wasn't gonna take it too seriously but uh i can find it um
00:17:18
RICK JAMES
go ahead.
00:17:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
we got a lot of We got a lot of good questions from guys, a lot of good questions from guys, as we said. We narrowed it down to the the top five i that I saw that I thought we could answer very well tonight. So why don't we just get right into this?
00:17:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mike, is that Mike? We're going to read Mike's first. You know what? Let's start with RJ's. So ah RJ Stanky, he asks, what are the big questions you ask a potential customer when you're first contacted for a bid?
00:17:59
RICK JAMES
Why are they looking for another bid? mean, is it a kind contractor issue or is it just a price issue?
00:18:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mm-hmm.
00:18:02
Mikey Santolucito
Well, that's the number one question.
00:18:05
RICK JAMES
Yeah. if it a price issue or is it a contractor? What is it? you know
00:18:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, generally...
00:18:10
Mikey Santolucito
Or are they just forced to do it in every three-year, two-year, one-year cycle?
00:18:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yup.
00:18:15
RICK JAMES
True.
00:18:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
And generally, uh, if they tell you the name, i always ask who was your previous contractor.
00:18:16
Billy
I always ask her.
00:18:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
Cause then you'll know if it was a service issue or a pricing issue or both.
00:18:26
RICK JAMES
True. True.
00:18:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
Generally, if you know your area, you can pretty much figure that out. Um, why are you shopping?
00:18:31
Mikey Santolucito
That's fair.
00:18:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Like Mike said, like, do you have to do this every year or, you know, was just a, is this a problem? Hmm.
00:18:40
Mikey Santolucito
I always ask what their pain point was with their last vendor. If it's not something that, uh, is a cycle type thing where they have to go out to bid. Um, sometimes they're honest about it.
00:18:51
Mikey Santolucito
Sometimes they're a little vague, but you can usually coax it out of them after, uh, some candid, you know, natural conversations, you know try and get, uh, get friendly with them, try and get their guard down a little bit and they'll open up to you a little bit more, a little bit more, but.
00:18:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep. Yep.
00:19:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
in the interest of not wasting each other's time, uh, if they're contacting me, uh, I do ask them, what is your budget range? What are you looking for? um cause you know, the first question is usually if I don't know the property, I'll ask them, do you know offhand, you know, how many acres we're talking about here? And, you know, usually, you know, the property or you can look it up real quick and get a, you know, get the square footage from the overhead. But yeah,
00:19:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, what what's your budget range? Because if if you're if you're looking at a property saying this is six figures all day and they're saying $40,000, we're probably not going to be what you're looking for. So maybe let's not waste each other's time. Yeah.
00:19:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
that's that's kind of a big because there's nothing worse than putting together a bid and then having fucking five mouths drop open because you're you know three and a half times what they've ever paid before because they've had you know sal the 80 year old plow guy that's been plowing there for 30 years and has never raised them so that's kind of a big one for us um
00:20:08
RICK JAMES
So,
00:20:12
Mikey Santolucito
I haven't done this before, but if you get the address, obviously you get it ahead of time. If you can create some kind of a square footage base of what it would take for your team to do it with a package that you think is fair for it, you could you could go into that meeting for either a variable or a seasonal or a tiered seasonal saying, Hey, this is what I'm thinking for my firm for a budget.
00:20:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mm-hmm.
00:20:33
Mikey Santolucito
How does this sound to you? And you can gauge their temperature that way. And if they seem a little skittish and it seems a little high, then, you know, they're probably going to price shop it a little bit and it's not going to be worth your time or not worth your time, but they're tire kicking at that point.
00:20:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Yep. And if they've answered all those, all all those questions affirmatively, like, okay, we're in their price range where, you know, ah yeah we've, asked we've asked who their contractor was, we you know, they're, they're shopping cause they want more, better service or, or what.
00:21:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
And the final question we're asking before we're agreeing to prepare a bid is will you allow a bid presentation meeting? Because if they're not open to letting us explain our bid and and compare apples to apples, then it's not worth our time because we're going to be on the higher end of pricing.
00:21:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
So we got to be able to get in the room and actually open up the open up the packets that we give them and say, look at all the line items. Here's what we need to do your property the way you want it.
00:21:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
And that's that.
00:21:36
Billy
I also like to throw in there to level of service. I mean, if you're looking at level of service is high and then I'm pretty antsy person.
00:21:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mm-hmm.
00:21:44
Billy
So when are we looking at a decision being made, am I going to have to follow up with 19 emails and then just piss myself off because you can't respond.
00:21:53
Mikey Santolucito
Yep. yep
00:21:54
Billy
We're legitimately wanting make a change and we're legitimately wanting to spend money in that. and the And the conversation is progressing. When can we expect a decision to be made? If it's two weeks, great.
00:22:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Thousand percent.
00:22:05
Billy
But is that a hard two week timeline or is it 42 board meetings? And I don't know. And let me call you again. And we're going to take off this part. Seriously. What, you know, I'm not here to waste anybody's time.
00:22:17
Billy
And they seem to respond well to that. Not everybody does, but that you know, wow, this guy means business. This is you're, you're corralling them because nobody wants to wait. And like Mike said, nobody wants waste their time on, or, you know, that, Hey,
00:22:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:22:32
Billy
we're just looking for price and we don't even want to meet you. Just measure it out yourself. But those are meetings I won't even go to.
00:22:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I got head faked like two two or three years ago.
00:22:40
Mikey Santolucito
Yep.
00:22:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
I got head faked. Guy called in June and said, hey, we're looking for a new snow contract. It was a site in our wheelhouse that we would love to have. And he's like, yeah.
00:22:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
He goes, can you put a bid together? I have an ah RFP. The RFP wasn't great, but it was you know it was adequate to to get pricing together. And ah he sends he sends over the email, all bids.
00:23:02
Billy
Yeah.
00:23:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
we We want to have all bids in for review by November 15th.
00:23:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm like, June.
00:23:11
RICK JAMES
It was June.
00:23:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm like, I was excited. Like, hey, here's a guy. He's making a decision. he He wants it done now. Yeah, have all bids back by November fifteenth I'm like, are you freaking kidding me? Like, we're not waiting to hear till the end of November if we got this property or not.
00:23:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
So I got head faked. They fooled me. They fooled me good.
00:23:31
Mikey Santolucito
all right. Fool me once.
00:23:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's it. And Brian Coburn was asking about if Billy would open up a little more and be more candid. That's that's who asked that question.
00:23:39
Billy
Brian.
00:23:41
RICK JAMES
this this Oh, yeah.
00:23:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, shit. um So anything else on that as far as. As far as questions for a potential customer there when they're contacting you.
00:23:54
Billy
If it's a big client too, I also like to ask if we're allowed to stage equipment there.
00:23:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay.
00:23:59
Mikey Santolucito
Yep.
00:24:00
Billy
We have a particular client that asked not to be plowed with loaders. So I've never one.
00:24:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Really?
00:24:06
RICK JAMES
Not to be plowed with loaders?
00:24:07
Billy
Yes.
00:24:08
RICK JAMES
What are they going to be plowed with? Ventrax?
00:24:10
Billy
pay more.
00:24:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
They'll pay more to be plowed by trucks.
00:24:13
Billy
I am dead serious.
00:24:18
Mikey Santolucito
i think I think my brain just shut down.
00:24:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
Are they...
00:24:19
Mikey Santolucito
So what's the reasoning behind that?
00:24:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:24:23
Billy
They won't give me one. I said why that's just what we want.
00:24:25
Mikey Santolucito
Okay.
00:24:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
They're loader phobic.
00:24:29
Billy
Yeah.
00:24:29
Mikey Santolucito
Hmm.
00:24:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's...
00:24:29
Billy
Or they don't like Caterpillar. i don't know. It's weird, isn't it?
00:24:32
RICK JAMES
ah
00:24:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:24:35
RICK JAMES
That's crazy.
00:24:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
that's it I've never heard of such a thing.
00:24:36
RICK JAMES
I never heard that one before.
00:24:36
Billy
there I'm a great customer.
00:24:39
RICK JAMES
Whatever you do, don't be efficient.
00:24:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah yes yeah
00:24:42
Billy
Exactly. want you to go slow.
00:24:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Is this a government site?
00:24:47
RICK JAMES
Is this, oh, you're in Detroit.
00:24:48
Mikey Santolucito
Oh, you know what?
00:24:49
RICK JAMES
Is it is is this f Ford?
00:24:49
Mikey Santolucito
You know what? It must be hourly.
00:24:50
RICK JAMES
They just want Ford pickups. They just want a Ford pickup there.
00:24:52
Billy
Right.
00:24:53
RICK JAMES
Is this a Ford place?
00:24:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's funny. Oh, man. All right. I haven't heard that. That's a new one. See, just when you thought you've heard it all. Man.
00:25:07
Mikey Santolucito
Are we allowed to keep de-icing materials on site in a bin covered or uncovered?
00:25:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
I knew that was coming. I knew it. So Mike is going to go into the the i the icing material restrictions of for the site.
00:25:18
Mikey Santolucito
May I keep 20,000 gallons of brine on your site in these ugly ass tanks?
00:25:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
They're not ugly.
00:25:24
Billy
please.
00:25:25
Mikey Santolucito
They can be.
00:25:28
RICK JAMES
definitely can be.
00:25:29
Mikey Santolucito
We have a client that's asking us to get them off site for more for a conservation reason. They had a visit from conservation and apparently they were too close to the wetlands. So now I get to offload 15,000 gallons of brine and get the tanks off site because the whole campus is surrounded by wetlands.
00:25:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Tell them they're water. They're water tanks.
00:25:49
RICK JAMES
What's conversation?
00:25:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:25:51
Mikey Santolucito
yeah I don't know man, but it's also surrounded by highways and we know how those guys echo salt.
00:25:56
RICK JAMES
Is that an East Coast thing? that an East Coast thing?
00:26:00
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah, it is.
00:26:00
RICK JAMES
ah Conservation?
00:26:01
Mikey Santolucito
don't know.
00:26:01
RICK JAMES
Never heard of it.
00:26:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
They just say, yeah, they'll they'll make Mike move his tanks. But yet the the interstate that runs 40 feet behind the area is salted 4000 pounds per lane mile.
00:26:10
Mikey Santolucito
Uh huh.
00:26:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, my God. And because they don't treat it at the spinner, 90% of it bounces off the shoulder into the wetland.
00:26:18
RICK JAMES
Thank you.
00:26:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
So that's that's what that little orange fungus is on the edges of the water, by the way. ah All right. So we got that one. um Let's see what.
00:26:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
OK, so Mike Mose asks, what do you guys feel is the best way to approach a potential client that has a semi detailed property but has no ah RFP?
Service Scope and Client Understanding
00:26:47
Mikey Santolucito
What is semi detailed?
00:26:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
Meaning it's got some work to it.
00:26:50
Billy
islands, slopes.
00:26:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's not just a yeah, it's got decisions to be made about how to attack it, I would guess.
00:26:57
Billy
It's more of a rhombus instead of a rectangle.
00:26:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah Basically, yeah.
00:27:00
Billy
Parallelogram.
00:27:00
Mikey Santolucito
Ah, okay.
00:27:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Maybe a lot of islands, a lot of loading docks.
00:27:02
Mikey Santolucito
All right. There's a couple 90s and some curves in there. It's not all straight.
00:27:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, yeah.
00:27:06
Billy
Yeah.
00:27:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
it's It's not all like looking at it.
00:27:07
Mikey Santolucito
Okay.
00:27:07
Billy
Call this act.
00:27:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
um'm I'm thinking it's not all just... ah
00:27:11
Mikey Santolucito
There's 50 islands and like 20 light poles you can hit.
00:27:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, no...
00:27:17
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah, it's a great question.
00:27:18
The SnowJobs Podcast
no
00:27:19
Mikey Santolucito
i think if they have no ah RFP, that's a little concerning because usually those sites, they have a pretty high risk aversion to safety.
00:27:30
Mikey Santolucito
And I feel like sites like that ask you what your score is like insurance wise, your mod score. yeah,
00:27:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
Look at it this way. It could be an HOA with 30 units that has no ah RFP.
00:27:40
Billy
Well, it could be question.
00:27:40
Mikey Santolucito
yeah
00:27:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
And they got 250 driveways all sorts of parking areas and roadways.
00:27:42
Mikey Santolucito
sure
00:27:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Nothing saying what gets done when, what's responsible while it's still snowing versus when it's over. It could be something as simple as that. but Because some of most of these places don't have an RFP.
00:28:00
Billy
could be a
00:28:00
Mikey Santolucito
Billy, would ah would you send like a blank contract to them with your terms in it, no pricing, just like, Hey, read through this. Does this, does any of this stand out to you as something that would be a concern of yours?
00:28:13
Billy
Yeah, I would send them page four through 500 and say, look, it's not actually four through 500. But that's kind of where I was going with like, like, I'll help you. And that could be a selling point.
00:28:23
Billy
But this is the way I see it, and how we would do it. And then if if you're good with that, then we'll put a number down on it.
00:28:33
Billy
And it could be a good selling point.
00:28:33
Mikey Santolucito
I think it's the easiest thing to do.
00:28:35
Billy
Because if you're gonna help the customer, what's that?
00:28:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh. Oh.
00:28:38
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:28:38
Mikey Santolucito
It's the easiest thing to do.
00:28:40
Billy
Yeah, I mean, you're out do it anyway for other customers.
00:28:40
RICK JAMES
yeah
00:28:42
Billy
So, hey, this is kind what was thinking and what we should do.
00:28:43
Mikey Santolucito
Right.
00:28:45
Billy
And here's snow relocation. Here's this and this. And, you know, maybe don't put 100% effort into it, but you might not get it and all that work. But you still have it. You still know what you're doing. I mean, if you're a professional. So this is what it is.
00:29:00
Billy
yeah ah Is that fair? Let's price it.
00:29:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. If they have no RFP or a very shoddy ah RFP with basically nothing in it that needs to be there, I use that to my advantage. Now, I don't make them feel stupid, but at the same time, I'll be like, wait a minute, I can't give you like... I'm a professional. I can't give you at ah accurate pricing based off this. This is like, this is nothing. I need marching orders. I need, you know, I need to be told, you know, the level of service, the scope of work. That all has to be laid out in here. You don't have any of that.
00:29:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
How about... Can I come to a meeting? Can we sit down with your whoever your decision makers are? And I will help you write this up. So that way it's not just for me. It's for the other contractors you're going to send it to. Because at the end of the day, if you don't have an ah RFP here, you're going to get, if you ask three guys, you're going to get three ridiculously different prices.
00:29:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
And you don't know what they're, who's basing it off of what level of service or what scope of work.
00:29:56
RICK JAMES
Mm-hmm.
00:30:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like you want to have three prices from three quality contractors that are within 10% of each other. That's, that's your ideal game. And then, then you can take, you know, who you want out of that. But if you don't have an ah RFP, your pricing is going to be all over the place and who knows what level of service you're getting for that pricing. So, Why don't we sit down and will you will tell me what you want and we will write it up so that every contractor knows across the board what you're expecting and that way you get apples to apples and not fucking apples to you know grapefruits.
00:30:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
so like it It can be crazy.
00:30:36
RICK JAMES
Huh.
00:30:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
you know i mean It can be absolutely wild if if there's nothing spelled out. But I use that and I will sit down. I have done it and um I'm about to do it again. We have a board that we're going to help out develop their ah RFP for the future.
00:30:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
um You know, so we're going to, we're going to help them out, but yeah, use that to your advantage. Don't make, they don't have to feel stupid, but as soon as you ask them for an RFP, if you get a blank stare or they say, what is an ah RFP?
00:31:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
Use that to get your foot in the door.
00:31:07
Billy
part of the education.
00:31:07
Mikey Santolucito
Danger, Will Robinson.
00:31:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, What's it going to take you two hours of your time to develop, to sit down in a meeting and and not even, yeah, to develop it. And now you got your foot in the door. Now you're the company that went above and beyond helping them develop this thing that they didn't have and possibly didn't even know they needed.
00:31:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
And, you know, you're the you're the guy. So I use that. I will definitely use that.
00:31:32
Billy
There's a couple of them we did last year that were kind of intricate and it doesn't take very long. Like Angela or myself will do a ah quick site map and it doesn't have to be exactly perfect, but a site map will throw a little color coordination, a little snow relocation staging, mark their drains.
00:31:48
Billy
It takes what? 20 minutes, depending on the site, obviously, but let's have 30 minutes to do a nice detailed map with legend, send them the link to it.
00:31:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
Doesn't take long.
00:31:57
Billy
And they're like, wow, You put a lot of effort into this. Actually, we didn't, but at least you can see what I'm seeing. This is how we do your snow.
00:32:04
RICK JAMES
Great.
00:32:06
Billy
So that that also helps too. A lot of people are visual. They don't really know the property if it's that large. They say, okay, well, snow gets pushed over here. I don't know where the loader goes. We have sidewalks. Like, you know, if you're labeling these things, wow, I didn't realize maybe that's why you're 30% higher than the next guy.
00:32:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
You tell them that this is executive. This ain't secretary. This ain't mailroom. This is executive snow. All right? We do things differently here. Oh, man.
00:32:35
RICK JAMES
the
00:32:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's good, dude. I mean, that's that's a no-brainer. that's That's what you should do, and that's the difference. That's what separates guys.
00:32:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, we keep getting... We get that all the time. Like, they're blown away by the packet. We hand them with their map, with their literally their their snow operations plan of how it's going to be done at what times what's going to get done.
00:33:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
Everything is right in there for them, along with their contract, along with their. um What else is in there? They got the maps. They got the they got the literature on on what they should be asking question-wise of every contractor. And they open these folders, and they start pulling this stuff out, and they're like, holy shit. like this is you know The last guy came in with a price on a mustard-stained napkin.
00:33:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
you like these guys are These guys are fucking legit. but And like Billy said, it doesn't take much. It doesn't take a lot of time to to make it look really good, be professional.
00:33:35
Billy
We did this one day, right?
00:33:36
Mikey Santolucito
Oh, most of it's generated by AI anyways.
00:33:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah i haven't used that yet i gotta start though because that could help me save a lot of time i don't really see i gotta i gotta try that
00:33:39
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:33:39
Billy
Whoa.
00:33:44
Mikey Santolucito
Oh, it's so nice. I get a map back in like less than 24 hours.
00:33:51
Mikey Santolucito
You tell it what you want to map out, it's in your inbox.
00:33:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
i haven't haven't started dabbling in the ai thing yet
00:33:58
RICK JAMES
What do use it? Which one are you using, Mike?
00:33:59
Mikey Santolucito
Well, you gotta customize it after, right? Like you gotta do the pile placement, the staging area, all that, but It gives you at least the nuts and bolts of the site, the square footage, whatever it is that you're looking for, sidewalks, ah run drive lanes, loading docks, all that fun stuff. You can add your landscape stuff in there so you can make it a one size fits all for both green and snow season.
00:34:23
RICK JAMES
Which one are you using, Mike? Which AI?
00:34:25
Mikey Santolucito
Property intel.
00:34:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Interesting.
00:34:30
RICK JAMES
Cool.
00:34:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hmm. Anything else on that one?
00:34:36
RICK JAMES
No?
00:34:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
think we pretty well covered that.
00:34:39
Mikey Santolucito
Well, let's go over the legality stuff.
00:34:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:34:41
Mikey Santolucito
I mean, you
00:34:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, here here, now we're going to get into some dicey shit, which...
00:34:45
RICK JAMES
Huh.
00:34:46
Mikey Santolucito
it's, you're not going to have that conversation with them. That's going to be between two lawyers, you know, yours and theirs on what the liability obviously needs to be, what the, uh, the triggers need to be and how the verbiage is set up so that, you know, the, whether it's an HOA or commercial properties protected, you're protected.
00:35:06
Mikey Santolucito
know You want to make sure if they have no RFP, whatever their requirement is for insurance carriages or you know ah damage liability, it all needs to be spelled out so that it's A, fair, but B, it's all agreed upon beforehand.
00:35:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:35:20
Mikey Santolucito
So at the end of the season, there's no gray area that you're you're fighting with them or they're fighting with you on.
00:35:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
And here's a great question from Matt Herbert because he asks that. He says, what do you do to transfer liability and ownership of slip falls when the customer is dictating the timing and use of salt in their RFP?
Contractual Language and Liability
00:35:40
Mikey Santolucito
I fucking hate this.
00:35:41
Billy
That's a headache.
00:35:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
First of all, you shouldn't let them.
00:35:42
RICK JAMES
this this
00:35:44
Mikey Santolucito
No, you shouldn't. Some of us do here's what
00:35:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Better served by others for me.
00:35:49
Mikey Santolucito
It's better served by others, but we do also have a sheet that we asked them to sign that waives us of all liability for...
00:35:55
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:35:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
is worth jack shit in court.
00:36:00
RICK JAMES
What are you talking about?
00:36:03
Mikey Santolucito
We haven't had to eat use it yet.
00:36:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
Dude, here's what my lawyer said. He goes, I can write everything up as airtight as possible. Bottom line, you're in New York. Something happens, you're going to get sued, and they're going to entertain it.
00:36:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
The biggest political lobby in New York is the personal injury attorneys. like They're going to entertain it.
00:36:21
Mikey Santolucito
Right.
00:36:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
So it doesn't matter what you do. you can't you know you're still You can still be on the hook, even if they've signed away that they accept all the liability. they They can still command. That's just New York.
00:36:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
But, I mean, we're we're living in that kind of society now. If somebody wants to sue you, somebody's there to take it. And all their they don't even care if it goes far.
00:36:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
They just want to squeeze 50 grand out of you so they can get you know their 10% legal fee. and and you know But I don't think there is a way to completely shield yourself from that shit.
00:37:01
Mikey Santolucito
No, not yet.
00:37:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
you know We're in a litigious society.
00:37:07
Billy
Well, the second part of that or that statement of dictates timing and use of salt. I don't allow that. So like that's I it, but I was actually printed one of my contracts and it's basically it's there's a section called judgment of snow plowing shoveling and deicing.
00:37:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Neither do I.
00:37:25
Billy
Client understands and authorizes us as a professional and we use our professional judgment and discretion determine when snow icing or snow plowing, deicing and services commence at our discretion.
00:37:37
Billy
Not by theirs.
00:37:38
Billy
Because Super Bowl Sunday, that manager don't give a shit about that building. But we do. You know? you you can't You can't tell me how to do I can't tell you how to fight a fire.
00:37:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
100%,
00:37:49
RICK JAMES
Thank you.
00:37:51
Billy
You know what I'm saying?
00:37:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:37:53
Billy
So, that's kind of how.
00:37:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Dude, I agree. i'm I'm on Team Billy with this one. like Nobody's going to tell me, yeah, no, ah we won't take it.
00:37:57
Billy
I won't allow it.
00:38:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
We'll walk. if the If it comes down to that and they're going to be that kind of stickler about it, it's not worth it because that's when you're going to have problems.
00:38:10
Billy
That goes back to the last episode when we, you know, we discussed, well, I'll call you if we need salting. That's not going to happen.
00:38:19
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:38:19
Mikey Santolucito
Oh yeah.
00:38:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:38:19
Billy
then have
00:38:20
RICK JAMES
no
00:38:20
Billy
Can't have that. You either don't.
00:38:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
Nope.
00:38:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's what you play him, Billy. That's exactly what you play him when they call you.
00:38:30
Billy
Yep.
00:38:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'll call you. Oh, yeah? You could shut the fuck up.
00:38:37
Mikey Santolucito
ah
00:38:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
Dude, I'm with you, Billy. We won't touch it. If they're adamant that they're going to dictate when we salt and how often we salt, not going happen. We're the professionals. You're you're hiring us.
00:38:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
If you don't trust our judgment, you know, tough shit. We don't need you.
00:38:55
Billy
And that's just like, you know, essentially controlling the house and controlling what they want to spend. And I understand that. But at the end of the day, how much is an average lawsuit?
00:39:07
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
00:39:07
Billy
I don't know. 80 grand, 200 grand, depending on markets, or you maybe more.
00:39:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think it honestly depends if it's an accident
00:39:12
Billy
It's cheaper to pay us to salt at our discussion.
00:39:13
RICK JAMES
Thank you.
00:39:15
Billy
No.
00:39:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I think it depends on ah if if you can prove right off the bat that there was no negligence involved. If you got all the the shit that we do to document and, you know, if we can provide all that stuff and it shows that beyond a shadow of a doubt, this is just a bullshit accident.
00:39:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
This has nothing to do with us or it happened in freaking dry pavement conditions, you know, and you can prove that. I think it's a lot cheaper than if they have to keep going back and forth.
00:39:45
Billy
Hear, hear.
00:39:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
But I don't know. Knock on wood. We've we've never gone through it. We've never had it. But yeah, i I'm with Billy, though.
00:39:53
Mikey Santolucito
And pray we never will.
00:39:56
RICK JAMES
Right.
00:39:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, if if your customer, like, that actually happens where a customer tells you when when were you're going to salt? Like, get fucked.
00:40:06
RICK JAMES
Yeah,
00:40:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, that's not, we're in a dangerous game here. Like, that's not, you can't do that. we would not We would not be able to do that at all. I can't think of one property we have where I'd feel comfortable with the customer dictating.
00:40:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
when like Half our customers last year, when we had the flash freeze of the frozen fog, half them didn't even know that that could happen. Like, you're going to wait until 6 in the morning when your first wave of people leave their houses to or leave their condos to go fucking ah to work, and half of them fucking end up on their ass to call us to salt?
00:40:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, that doesn't shield us from those 10 people that fell.
00:40:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm out.
00:40:53
Mikey Santolucito
They also tell you when they don't want you to salt at all.
00:40:57
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:40:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
Again, get fucked.
00:40:57
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:40:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Not happening.
00:40:59
RICK JAMES
yep
00:41:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
Not for me, anyway. I want Billy on that one.
00:41:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
But yeah, I don't think there is, honestly, don't think there is a way to complete to answer your question, Matt, to completely transfer the liability. I think if you're the one servicing the site, even though the customer didn't you know call for salt or whatever, they're technically controlling that.
00:41:19
Billy
It's a
00:41:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
I still think because you're the contractor there, I don't know that there's any way to completely shield yourself from it.
00:41:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
but i could be wrong um that'd be a question for the attorneys we should probably get an attorney on here a snow lawyer like one of the real shysters yeah one of the real shysters like let's get one of the yes yeah let's get a good let's get one that's successfully fought a bunch of these bullshit lawsuits
00:41:45
RICK JAMES
yeah well Yeah.
00:41:46
Mikey Santolucito
Snow lawyer, that's one.
00:41:48
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:41:50
Mikey Santolucito
Somebody that's got a good win streak.
00:41:52
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:41:54
Billy
get the link there.
00:42:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
go to binder and binder once
00:42:02
Mikey Santolucito
want the Mike Ross of snow lawyers.
00:42:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
who's the guy with the cowboy hat i want that guy
00:42:05
RICK JAMES
yeah yeah yeah
00:42:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
oh shit all right we got another legal question here um i don't i don't have the name of this one i forgot to write the name of who wrote it down uh what verbiage do you use in your contracts to make it legally acceptable to stop or this is in reference to what billy said last last week about stopping service when you have non-payment or late payments What verbiage do you use in your contracts to make it legally acceptable to stop performing services for either non-payment or late payment?
00:42:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
And will this alleviate liability should an incident occur after you suspended services? Bill?
00:42:51
RICK JAMES
Bill's the man.
00:42:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I think that's on you.
00:42:53
Billy
I mean, attorney read this over. this is the language we use.
00:42:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay.
00:42:57
Billy
I haven't had it go the distance on any of it for suspension and, you know, lack of payment or, you know, balance paid in full situations.
00:43:08
Billy
But yeah,
00:43:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, just to be clear to everybody before Billy starts in, we are in no way giving anybody legal advice. Like, go talk to your attorney.
00:43:15
Billy
yeah I'm not in it.
00:43:16
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, none of this shit might work in court, you know?
00:43:20
Mikey Santolucito
yeah
00:43:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
So go talk to your attorney.
00:43:24
Mikey Santolucito
There should be a disclaimer before this show even starts.
00:43:26
Billy
neighbor
00:43:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, I mean, when it's in the, like, we can talk snow all day, but once it gets into legal fucking shit, you know, we we have no fucking clue. We're not lawyers. We don't know what they do except they get $1,000 an hour.
00:43:40
Billy
and Exactly.
00:43:40
RICK JAMES
Every state's different, obviously, and all that.
00:43:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
Every state's different.
00:43:43
RICK JAMES
so
00:43:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
Exactly. Every state's tolerance is a bullshitter different in the court system. You know, it depends. There's not much that will that will not be entertained in New York. I can tell you that right now, though.
00:43:54
Mikey Santolucito
or Massachusetts.
00:43:55
Billy
Our Michigan.
00:43:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, that's true. you might You actually might be worse right now, Mike.
00:43:59
Mikey Santolucito
We're always worse.
00:44:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
But yeah, I mean, Billy, that's a direct question to to what you said last week about how you have it in there that you can you can suspend services for payments.
00:44:00
Mikey Santolucito
and It's just getting worse.
00:44:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
So, you know, if you want to answer that one.
00:44:10
Billy
Yeah, mean, basically, client agrees to defend and hold harmless from all liability, including attorney fees that may accrue during and after lack of nonpayment and suspended services.
00:44:23
Billy
there's There's more. And I'd be happy if you sent me this guy's email. out I can send him this.
00:44:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay.
00:44:27
Billy
It's not like it's a secret.
00:44:28
The SnowJobs Podcast
I can do that.
00:44:29
Billy
ah
00:44:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I can do that.
00:44:30
Billy
There's a whole blurb about and NSF fees, late fees, but then basically the liability of you release all, you you assume it basically, but there's language in there.
00:44:41
Billy
But basically what I just read was agrees to hold harmless and release us from all liability because you don't pay your fucking bills.
00:44:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
no Yeah, there's torts and shit
00:44:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
and shit. And you have a clear thing in there? Like if the bill is over so many days late, you suspend service?
00:44:53
Billy
Yep. Yep. So like what I'm reading now is ah like a template, you know, but it was a client and, you Mike and I agreed or Jeremy and I agreed that, hey, we're net 30.
00:44:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
Love it.
00:44:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sure. Sure.
00:45:05
Billy
Obviously, here's the grace period, blah, blah, blah, but you're into me for two or three months. I ain't fucking coming. I'll just be honest.
00:45:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
00:45:12
Billy
not coming.
00:45:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
00:45:14
Billy
That gets right off the route real quick. And something else, too, I wanted to add that has nothing to do with the liability, ah but something that should be in RFPs from, the I think, our first of the three-peat podcast trilogy here was damages.
00:45:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
I guess trilogy.
00:45:31
Billy
I don't know if have that in there too, but we have a little blurb in here. Any claims of damages need to be reported, you know, because I love getting blamed for things at the end of the season that you know damn well you didn't do.
00:45:42
Billy
Like, for instance, years ago we were doing an HOA, and they said, hey, it must have been you guys used blue plows and you you damaged our garage door.
00:45:43
RICK JAMES
Oh, yeah.
00:45:52
Billy
I don't have blue plows.
00:45:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Must have.
00:45:53
Billy
It must have been.
00:45:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
Must have been us.
00:45:55
RICK JAMES
must have been in the Must have been the small guy
00:45:55
Billy
It looks like it has been blamed.
00:45:57
Mikey Santolucito
It's always the plow guy.
00:45:59
Billy
Gretzky hockey against the the garage door for the last 25 years with an actual puck, but blamed us. And we don't have blue plows. You see them saying? So like it claims the damages I think need to be in all contracts.
00:46:12
Billy
Like if you got report them, you can't just make the shit up 10 months later.
00:46:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
and I love that.
00:46:16
Billy
So I forgot to add that last time.
00:46:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, i love I like that.
00:46:21
Mikey Santolucito
good.
00:46:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
I mean, I would say, actually, that was that was Aaron Rodman asked that question.
00:46:31
Billy
Yeah, I'll be happy to send this like what a template of what we use.
00:46:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay. Okay.
00:46:34
Billy
I mean, it's no secret. I think that the more we can protect ourselves and protect the customer. i mean, it is a balance here. But the customer can't say how we're going to do our job.
00:46:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's got to be like like everything else in this.
00:46:44
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
00:46:45
Billy
Yeah.
00:46:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
it It has to be a partnership. You want it to be a partnership. Like, they don't want any problems on their property, and we sure as hell don't want them to have any problems on their property. But that requires a lot of give and take and a lot of, you know, mutual consent on things.
00:47:00
Billy
Thank you.
00:47:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I just like customers that are more than happy to say, We would like it done this way, but you're the professional. you know Tell us why that won't work.
00:47:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I'm very lucky, I guess, in that regard, where most of my customers are very willing to listen if we tell them, this is not going to work. I know this is what you've done, but this is why you've had these problems.
00:47:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
This is not going to work this way. And they actually listen. Yeah.
00:47:28
Billy
And this could be a be a reason why we don't grow in exponential rates is because I won't take on every Tom, Dick and Harry. I don't work with brokers.
00:47:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
100%, 100%.
00:47:35
Billy
I play well in that space.
00:47:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
I agree, Bill. I'm right there with you, bud.
00:47:39
Billy
My space is similar to your space, except I don't do a lot of HOA or condos. I'm business to business. I want to talk to the decision maker.
00:47:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
00:47:46
Billy
I don't want to talk to a third-party broker out of New Mexico that's just a placeholder. I want meet the guy on site.
00:47:53
The SnowJobs Podcast
I agree.
00:47:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
I agree. I mean, I think that's that's important, especially in this day and age for the smaller guys. You want to have relationships. You want to develop those relationships with with your customers.
00:48:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, they should have your phone number. I firmly agree, or i firmly so have always said that, that every customer I have has, they don't call the office.
00:48:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
They call the business phone. you know And they're all in there. So I know, you know okay, if if this guy's calling, he doesn't cry wolf. If he's calling, you answer the phone, and you always answer the phone when they call.
00:48:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
That's the other thing. you know It's not hard. But, yeah, the ver the the verbiage stuff, the legal stuff, I would tell everybody, you know find a good lawyer you know and and have him tell him what you want to do. Most of the time, if you talk to your attorney and say, hey, this is what I this is what i need to do How do we write this up?
00:48:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
He will know right off the bat what statutes he has to be within, how how he needs to approach it, what torts need to be in there, and he'll he'll write it up. You just need to tell him how it applies to your business.
00:49:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, okay, you're doing what? All right, because not everybody is familiar with snow management practices and stuff. So, you know, but they're very familiar with liability and and, you know, accidents and shit like that and at what point liability transfers. So get get your attorney. It'll, you know, if you don't have an attorney and you're in snow, that's one huge red flag. Like, you need you need an attorney.
00:49:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
You need somebody to to go over contracts with to, you know, you need you need attorney for a lot of things. So, Sit down. It's worth the $250 or $300 for the consultation and have them write up like what Billy said that's your that will work in your state.
00:49:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
Because every every every state's different.
00:49:53
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:49:55
Mikey Santolucito
Right.
00:49:57
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:50:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
Everybody want to get a drink?
00:50:02
RICK JAMES
Sure.
00:50:02
Mikey Santolucito
Got one.
00:50:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, let's hit some commercials. We'll be right back.
00:51:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right, we're back. We are back. We got a couple more questions here for the group. um And before i before I go any further, Dino Tedesca, I wanted to use your question here tonight.
00:51:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
But if you don't mind, send me the question again and explain to me what exactly you were talking about, ah because I don't want to get it wrong. There was a lot of information in there you were asking about, and I just want to make sure I get it all right. So I DM'd you, but make sure you get back to me, because it was good information you had there.
00:51:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
So let's go, Evan.
Client Contract Negotiation Strategies
00:51:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
How do you handle prospects that want to use their contract, not yours? Well, if you were at Starks, you know my answer already about that.
00:51:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
But let's hear what you guys have to say.
00:51:58
Mikey Santolucito
I like this question. I just haven't seen many contracts that dictate what and how you do your your service to the site.
00:52:09
Mikey Santolucito
And I think that's what Evan's trying to ask here. But if we do have any of those, we do try and push back as much as we can. If they insist we sign theirs, obviously run it by the legal team, make sure that you're not exposed to too much risk and you take it from that point.
00:52:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay, Bill.
00:52:30
Mikey Santolucito
Bill.
00:52:34
Billy
I'm pretty adamant about using my own and I, you know, I think one time they maybe won this year last year, but I also put my own contract that my contract supersedes.
00:52:47
Billy
And I said, that's just the way it is if you really want it on that. But this right here supersedes your contract, which then kind of what is the point, you know,
00:52:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I was going to ask that.
00:52:58
Billy
You know, there's A's, there's B's, and it's like, you know, okay, all this shit.
00:52:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
What's different?
00:53:02
Billy
Mine's very simple. It explains what we do Here's your pricing. hits If it's a seasonal, you know, all that good stuff, the dates. I think it's well written, and I'll be happy to share it with anybody.
00:53:14
Billy
Why do we need yours then? Because yours is kind of detailed. The font's kind of weird. You know, maybe it's in script or Times Roman. That could irritate me. You know what i mean? And I'm only...
00:53:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
Helvetica only.
00:53:25
Billy
I really, really am adamant, like, of not...
00:53:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
00:53:28
Billy
not screwing around with somebody else's because typically manager and there's, there's a lot of holes in that Swiss cheese.
00:53:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, I agree.
00:53:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
I agree. I don't, I just don't understand. Like we've never done it. We won't do it. um And I don't know what their contract would have that ours wouldn't because ours is pretty thorough it lays out the scope of work the level of service the timing uh it has everything in it the dates the the pricing how the how the ceiling works how the floor works it's got literally everything in there i don't know what having their contract i don't know what it could possibly cover that mine doesn't
00:54:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I think once they read it, I think that's probably why we don't have a problem getting them to sign ours. And that's it. Because there's really nothing that they could have in theirs.
00:54:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
I mean, we we flat out say, you know, the liability is on us for, you know, for for the stuff that that should be. And that kind of shit. I don't know why they would want their own contract other than their lawyer telling them they need to have their own, but like I said, we don't have the problem.
00:54:42
Billy
I'll add to before before somebody would walk away though, you know I would have a conversation of what's what makes your contract more attractive to mine? Is it a language issue?
00:54:53
Billy
And then let's say there is some weird language that they don't like in mine, but like in ours, take it back with your team and your attorney and say, okay, I don't really wanna lose this opportunity with client A,
00:54:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sure.
00:55:05
Billy
They have something about, you know, acid rain turning into ice that only happens in the Northern hemisphere at 2 a.m. m Then throw it in there. I mean, how let let's not lose a contract over something dumb.
00:55:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah
00:55:20
Billy
Negotiate it.
00:55:20
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
00:55:20
Billy
and it's If it's fair for both parties, back to that. If it's fair for both parties, then you're going to find a way to make it work. But if it's not, and then that's when you got to say, okay, thanks, but no thanks.
00:55:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
I agree
00:55:31
Billy
And, you know, we don't play well in that sandbox.
00:55:36
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
00:55:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
Jeremy are you you guys what's what's the deal in Fargo like is it ah are you mostly having them sign yours you sign theirs a mix of both yeah
00:55:37
RICK JAMES
Great points.
00:55:46
RICK JAMES
Mix of both, honestly. We have a few that we they have us sign theirs. I mean, we have our own contract. We obviously send everybody as well. But is there's a few few guys that for some reason want us to sign theirs, you know.
00:56:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
The only time I could see, like and i don't do the I don't do those sites, but the only time I could see that, okay, we have to sign their contract is the unicorn sites, where they already have a pre-made 500-page. It's got every fucking thought you could possibly have for that six months already in there.
00:56:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
And then it's just a question of reviewing it with your attorney. But we don't have those. That's not you know what we do. But the second part of that question, as Billy touched on, was ah what if the prospect insists on using only their contract? At what point should you walk away?
00:56:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
um For me... How valuable is the, like, do I want this property really bad? ah Is it really, really, really good money?
00:56:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
And is it easy for us to do so it's not going to become a headache? And at that point, if I answer yes to all those questions, I've never done this yet. But if I really wanted that freaking property, I would take the contract to my attorney and say,
00:57:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
all right, what are we looking at here? This is what I don't like. I don't like this. And I would, so if there were things my attorney had a problem with, or I had a problem with, I'd get them to change it. And if they wouldn't change it to where it was, I would be comfortable signing their contract. then okay, well, um I don't care how bad I want it. I'm not going to take it in the ass.
00:57:38
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah, i mean, it is it tied to other properties that you have and you risk losing those as well? Or is it tied to other properties that you want
00:57:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, I mean, that's what it comes down to. How bad do you want it? And, you know, that always need always necessitates action. So if you don't need it, you don't really you're not going to be tempted to make a mistake or what could be a possible mistake.
00:57:59
Billy
Bye.
00:58:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
I don't know. At the end of the day, I just always see where the professionals and if your contract is professionally done, they should not have a problem signing your contract. As long as it's fair.
00:58:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm not saying go out there and you know write a bullshit contract up. If you've done a professional job at clearly spelling out every all the responsibilities and all the liabilities and who shares what, I don't see why they wouldn't sign yours. I don't see why you have to sign theirs and just get everything convoluted like that.
00:58:42
The SnowJobs Podcast
But that's just me.
00:58:44
Billy
I agree.
00:58:46
Mikey Santolucito
Agreed.
00:58:49
RICK JAMES
Yep.
00:58:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
But, Mike, you you, like, Outdoor Pride, your portfolio is huge, and you do a lot of, like, the the unicorn stuff.
00:58:49
RICK JAMES
yep
00:58:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
I would imagine you're signing their contract. Like, at university, I'd imagine you're signing their contract.
00:59:00
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah.
00:59:03
Mikey Santolucito
Ours is on top of theirs though. So when I get their RFP back saying, Hey, you guys won
00:59:06
The SnowJobs Podcast
So yours supersedes theirs?
00:59:09
Mikey Santolucito
Usually yes.
00:59:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay. Okay.
00:59:12
Mikey Santolucito
Ours is more operationally based and theirs is more liability based, insurance based, payment terms, areas of focus. And ours is strictly just the operations, the cost and the payment terms.
00:59:28
Mikey Santolucito
So when I get their RFP back, ours is usually page eight, nine and 10 with my signature on that page. And then I sign page four and five, which is in their RFP section.
00:59:38
Billy
they allow you to sign.
00:59:39
The SnowJobs Podcast
Got it.
00:59:41
Mikey Santolucito
ah do, yeah.
00:59:41
Billy
That was
00:59:43
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah, account managers can sign renewals. Business developers can sign new contracts.
00:59:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
Nice.
00:59:54
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah.
00:59:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
Hmm. What else? What else? What else? what else What else you guys got? Anything else you can think of along these lines?
Industry Collaboration and Knowledge Sharing
01:00:10
Mikey Santolucito
Now these covered some pretty good questions.
01:00:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
they're They're great questions The you know the the listenership never fails you know Everybody's got We're on the same boat That's that's why It's great um
01:00:22
RICK JAMES
Like I said earlier, I had a few guys reach out and we talked about earlier anyway, Steve, about if if there's like a contract template or something, then I'm like, we don't have one, but obviously everything, your legal things are different in every state.
01:00:40
RICK JAMES
So I don't think there is like a, that maybe there is, i don't know.
01:00:43
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Well, it's not that there's been a couple, there's a couple templates out there for contracts because Jeremy was asked by somebody, you know, why don't you guys put together like a generic, you know, commercial snow contract.
01:00:56
Billy
Thank
01:00:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
And I've, I've had a couple of them that I've brought to my attorney just for shits and giggles to say, Hey, I can buy this for 150 bucks on the internet.
01:01:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
are like is this protecting us at all from anything and he basically like said i wouldn't wipe my ass with the paper that's printed on uh that's just you just you just got hustled for 150 bucks he goes that's not gonna work um that and that's a problem because every state is different like it's so hard to make a template for a contract that would work in different states um
01:01:16
Mikey Santolucito
ah
01:01:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know what might work in Michigan will not work in New York. um You have states that have, like, different liability laws. um Who just got the reduced liability ship passed?
01:01:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Was it New Hampshire?
01:01:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
couple states in the last couple years have gotten, like, reduced liability, like common sense liability. Like, if you're walking around during a snowstorm in six-inch stilettos and you go down, it's on you.
01:02:01
RICK JAMES
Wasn't Michigan one?
01:02:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's not...
01:02:02
RICK JAMES
No, wasn't Michigan.
01:02:02
Billy
Yeah, that's called open and obvious here.
01:02:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
There you go.
01:02:05
Billy
and They reversed it, what, 18 months ago, last year?
01:02:05
RICK JAMES
Okay.
01:02:08
Billy
yeah
01:02:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
They what? They reversed it?
01:02:11
Billy
Oh, yeah. So that's why. and as soon as that happened, you drive down any freeway. Flip and fall, call Sam. paul
01:02:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
Are you serious? I didn't hear they they already did away with it.
01:02:23
Billy
Oh, yeah. It was it was now I could be off.
01:02:25
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh.
01:02:26
Billy
But I mean, I have it somewhere in this office. ah I think that was in place for like 30 years.
01:02:32
RICK JAMES
Thank you.
01:02:33
Billy
And then about i think it was about 18 months ago. It got reversed. So then then you see all the radio ads on news radio. It's call Mike if you have a slip and fall because your contractor, Farrell LaSalle, there's all these jingles about how to fuck your snow contractor.
01:02:46
Mikey Santolucito
Don't call me.
01:02:52
The SnowJobs Podcast
dude we had a hockey tournament in connecticut we had a hockey tournament connecticut last weekend we're on interstate 84 the three miles leading into the state of new york is nothing but personal injury billboard personal injury billboard after personal it's got to be eight in a row nine in a row of all personal injury stuff going into the state of new york i'm i was laughing my ass off i'm like this is ridiculous
01:02:53
Billy
Relative state.
01:03:11
Billy
Absolutely.
01:03:14
RICK JAMES
Thank you.
01:03:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
But, hey, they're they're a powerful lobby. That's why it's so hard to get liability shit changed because if you just put common sense shit in there, you're going to dry up half their business, if not if not more.
01:03:32
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
01:03:33
Billy
absolutely
01:03:36
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know, accidents happen, and and when when accidents happen, I definitely feel people need to be taken care of. But the amount of people that are just fucking, hey, it's a Tuesday, and I need $20,000 next month. I'm just going to fucking find a parking lot to take a dive in. Walmart looks good. Let's go.
01:03:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
that That happens more than you think.
01:03:57
Billy
alt.
01:03:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
There are people that make whole careers out of three to four lawsuits a year.
01:04:01
Mikey Santolucito
No, I think it happens more than I think.
01:04:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
They don't even and get a job.
01:04:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
It does. It definitely happens more than you think. You know, it's it's it's crazy. so But that's those guys, that's that's their livelihood. You know, they they they need that stuff. So they're going to fight that. And when they have money to be able to lobby, it's tough to get those liability laws changed for normal people.
01:04:28
Billy
Back to your the the statement on the templates, you know, and our trilogy here that we have going, I think we all four of us have touched almost every the nuts and bolts of things.
01:04:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
01:04:40
Billy
It's the legalities that maybe need to be honed in by a that particular area or market attorney.
01:04:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, the torch.
01:04:48
Billy
So
01:04:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yep.
01:04:49
Billy
I mean, any listeners that are listening like, hey, is there a template like, you know, have snow relocation, have a site inspection or ah what is mountain free, all the things that we touched upon. and And there's your basic contract right there.
01:05:03
Billy
And where do I mean, nothing's perfect.
01:05:04
RICK JAMES
Yep.
01:05:06
Billy
And then take it council and say, look, Matlock, is it good or is it not?
01:05:07
RICK JAMES
No.
01:05:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Amen.
01:05:13
RICK JAMES
Yep.
01:05:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
I love that.
01:05:15
Billy
You know, and
01:05:15
Mikey Santolucito
Public service announcement, please don't result to using AI to try and generate a template.
01:05:22
The SnowJobs Podcast
No. yeah no.
01:05:24
Mikey Santolucito
Use your local attorney who knows the law in your area.
01:05:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'll do that.
01:05:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes, sir. um I'm digging.
01:05:32
Mikey Santolucito
Sorry, Billy, let me interrupt you.
01:05:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
Let's go.
01:05:34
Billy
Oh, no, I was just saying like, you know, we have resources now that 20 years ago we didn't, you know, I mean, we have this podcast.
01:05:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm.
01:05:41
Mikey Santolucito
10 years ago, we didn't.
01:05:42
Billy
Exactly. So by all of us talking about it and, you know, you know, we're learning, we're going to trade shows, we're doing these things. We can formulate a hopefully a better industry in the future. I mean, that sounds like a politician right there. Build back better.
01:05:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
I love it. No, I mean, you're not wrong.
01:05:58
RICK JAMES
yeah
01:05:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
I mean, you're not wrong. The, just the amount of snow guys that are now talking and reaching out to other snow guys and communicating that we've broken down the, the veil of silence that we all grew up ah in snow under.
01:06:14
RICK JAMES
Contractor or silence, yeah.
01:06:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Like, Oh, Oh, it's top secret way.
01:06:17
Billy
they'll report them
01:06:18
RICK JAMES
we're all doing We're all doing secret stuff over here.
01:06:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
Exactly. Well,
01:06:21
RICK JAMES
we're using a secret plow.
01:06:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
I don't know if you know this, but the way I drop my Western plow is totally different than the way that guy drops his to the ground. So I'm not letting him in on the secret.
01:06:30
RICK JAMES
I stack it. Yeah.
01:06:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Fucking idiots. I don't know what we were thinking. Like,
01:06:36
RICK JAMES
I can't tell anybody I do this lot while they'll see you when you're doing the lot.
01:06:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah, we only do it in the dark though. We don't turn our lights on. ah So stupid.
01:06:47
Mikey Santolucito
That's sad.
01:06:47
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:06:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh my God.
01:06:48
Billy
on the next mysteries.
01:06:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, it's so rude. But, you know, it is. There's more information available to the younger generation of snow guy than has ever been available.
01:06:59
RICK JAMES
yeah
01:06:59
The SnowJobs Podcast
I mean, they it's so easy for them. Like, literally so easy. Like, you don't have to learn the hard way if you don't want to.
01:07:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like things we had the things we took financial hits to learn on everybody on this show right now, things we literally took financial shots in the ass to learn the hard way.
01:07:09
Billy
Well,
01:07:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
You do not have to learn the hard way. If you're new to snow, there's plenty of information out there.
01:07:24
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:07:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
There's plenty of guys that are willing to share it and, you know, just be open to it. Just be careful who you listen to. That's all. That's the other thing. i One more question that should be kind of simple, I think.
01:07:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
um Nathaniel Juleseth wants to know um if we spell out staking needs and expectations in the contract.
Staking Agreements and Drone Incident
01:07:50
Billy
That's a good question.
01:07:51
The SnowJobs Podcast
Mm-hmm.
01:07:52
Mikey Santolucito
No, but we should.
01:07:54
Billy
We should. But I'm actually writing it down.
01:07:56
The SnowJobs Podcast
we don't yeah well i mean We don't tell them how many, but we do say that we were like we... I don't know how we actually have it said. It's not we reserve the right... um something like we have the right to stake anything we feel will be damaged by us not staking because some places don't want a lot of stake a lot of stakes and they'll fight you on it so you have to have it the contract that you can stake like for us we we stake how everything's color-coded uh so hydrants are in blue we stake the hydrants in blue we stake um
01:08:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
any in ground electrical boxes or or fiber optic boxes, which the complexes have a ton of that are literally below lawn height hidden until you stack until you go to stack snow on them and then you rip them right out of the ground. Those are those are done in orange.
01:08:50
The SnowJobs Podcast
um You know, any other hazards are yellow um so that like we have a whole color coding system for our for how we stake stuff.
01:08:57
Billy
You got a kaleidoscope of colors over there, huh?
01:09:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
You what?
01:09:03
RICK JAMES
Jesus, that sounds awesome. But we just kind of grab a steak and put her on the ground.
01:09:07
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, we're not doing 400 properties either.
01:09:08
RICK JAMES
That's how we do
01:09:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Dude, listen, if I did not color code shit for fucking a bunch of firemen and machines after 14 hours, no, like if I didn't do that, if I didn't do that, they would take up all the stakes.
01:09:13
Billy
I'll make sense.
01:09:17
RICK JAMES
it. I'm saying this great. I'm saying this is great.
01:09:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like they would just plow them like they were green.
01:09:27
RICK JAMES
Our guys wouldn't even, they couldn't even figure that out if I, all right, guys, staking a lot.
01:09:31
Billy
the map.
01:09:33
Mikey Santolucito
I'm pretty sure them the brighter they are, the more frequently they get hit.
01:09:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, we just like to answer Nate's question there, though, we just put it in the contract that we have the right to put stakes wherever.
01:09:39
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:09:46
The SnowJobs Podcast
And we do have it in there that if the stakes are removed by anyone other than us or without our permission, we are not liable for damages done to the stakes.
01:09:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
But it's so hard to prove. Like, I remember two years ago, we took out a fucking railroad tie that was, like, half embedded and half recessed into the ground, denoting a parking a parking area, side of a parking area.
01:10:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
And the woman didn't like the stake being there because when she opened her door, I guess it must have hit the stake. So she took the stakes out. and she moved but But what was worse is she moved them two feet onto her lawn.
01:10:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
So when the guys went to plow it, they're looking at the stakes. There's four inches, five inches. They can't see that there's the recessed railroad tie, and they crushed it with an Arctic. And let me tell you, Arctic will scrape up railroad tie just as easy as snow and ice.
01:10:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
It peeled the top four inches of that railroad tie right back. I'm like, you didn't hear you didn't have any resistance? I guess it was old and rotted, and it just did it. and we We fought it and won. We said she moved the stakes onto her lawn, took pictures right away.
01:11:00
The SnowJobs Podcast
This ain't on us. We ain't replacing this. And the the complex said, absolutely not. You're right.
01:11:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
So just have it have it in there that you you can put stakes where you need to.
01:11:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
Anything else, boys?
01:11:16
Billy
You have a thing in there. I know this is kind of dumb, but there is some weird high profile sites and our site inspections that we are allowed to take photography and video.
01:11:20
The SnowJobs Podcast
No such thing.
01:11:29
Billy
I know 99% of the world that won't matter, but we do have some.
01:11:29
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah that It's a great thing to have in there. You're you're not wrong.
01:11:35
Billy
And it says we reserve the right to take and hold
01:11:35
RICK JAMES
Yep. yep
01:11:39
Billy
obviously not for marketing use or anything but we'll ah hold that in you know a secure document for site inspections for post and pre-storm events so you're allowing it
01:11:48
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think you have to have that in there now, Bill. Yeah, I think you're 100% onto that. Like, that's something I've never thought of. And just like we just said, i yeah, I think you have to have that in there. Because especially with stuff going on in certain areas of the country, people don't want fucking photographs being taken, even though they're taking 100,000 of them a day.
01:12:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
But God forbid you video, you know,
01:12:11
RICK JAMES
you're You're on video all day long, wherever you go.
01:12:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
every from the time you leave the house, absolutely.
01:12:13
Mikey Santolucito
Yep.
01:12:17
Billy
We were,
01:12:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
Sometimes in your house.
01:12:21
Billy
that's a private matter, but we were, a we went to one of our sites and the guys threw some really wicked stripes on this property last Sunday, or not on Sunday, but a couple days before.
01:12:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
01:12:34
Billy
And I had some free time on Sunday. So I threw a drone in the air. Holy shit. I swear this lady was coming in for her shift. It wasn't a manager. I've had the site for 20 years. I know it's not an issue flipping the F out. I think she had a warrant maybe.
01:12:49
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh. Oh.
01:12:50
Billy
I don't think it was more, she's just like, what are you doing? I said, I'm actually, you know, shooting footage of the the property. Cause it's pretty neat aerial view. And what the fuck are you doing? you know, she starts screaming at me and like, I mean, really paranoid. And I'm like, you have a warrant.
01:13:10
Billy
You just need to go inside the building and it to work, but.
01:13:10
The SnowJobs Podcast
ah
01:13:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think that's absolutely smart to do, to to start putting that in there for guys that don't, because you need you need to be able to photograph.
01:13:20
RICK JAMES
Yeah, makes sense.
01:13:23
Billy
Absolutely.
01:13:24
The SnowJobs Podcast
And if they if it's not in, it well, it's not in your contract that you can photograph. We have that sign over here now that says no no no photography. Okay, well, we have it.
01:13:34
RICK JAMES
we We have medical places, stuff like that.
01:13:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
I'm going to put that in there.
01:13:40
RICK JAMES
We have like medical places that say they don't want, they don't want like view cameras, that was stuff like that for HIPAA.
01:13:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, Jeremy, didn't you?
01:13:44
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:13:46
RICK JAMES
I'm like, we're not, we're we're using it for, we're using it for a weather station and and all your cameras are, where I understand they're yours, but we're using it to point at the ground to see what's going on.
01:13:49
Mikey Santolucito
We're not in the building.
01:14:00
RICK JAMES
So we got it, we got it, we got it by, but it was like, I mean, they, they okayed an area we could put it.
01:14:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
I remember that.
01:14:08
RICK JAMES
So, which is,
01:14:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
Well, yeah, you were getting shit, right? You were getting shit about where you could put the camera.
01:14:12
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:14:13
The SnowJobs Podcast
A couple customers didn't want it.
01:14:13
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:14:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
Flat out did not want them. And that was that was what my argument for the the cameras was back in the day, the sight cameras.
01:14:16
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:14:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
view I was going to get a view, and the two sights I would put it on were like, nope, we don't want them. We don't want it.
01:14:28
RICK JAMES
Like, you can have access to it if you want. I mean, we give them access if they want it too or whatever. it's It's nothing but for us to check the weather and to see your site.
01:14:40
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, they did not care.
01:14:41
RICK JAMES
We're not sitting there watching who's going in and out of the facility. and was not that's I don't have that kind of time.
01:14:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
You know who really didn't want it to kind of shock me that was adamant that it not be there? The church.
01:14:53
Billy
Really?
01:14:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah. Adamant. No surveillance. I don't know how many times I had to say it's not surveillance.
01:15:01
Billy
That's weird.
01:15:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
Literally a weather camera. It shows us when it's snowing. Well, but it could also be used for surveillance. I'm like... Who are we surveilling? well dude Yeah, yeah, I found that crazy.
01:15:11
Billy
Wow.
01:15:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
there They did not want the camera.
01:15:18
RICK JAMES
they they don't want to they want They don't want you watching them carry the money bags out.
01:15:21
The SnowJobs Podcast
No, they did offer, they no, they did offer to allow us to have access to theirs.
01:15:22
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
01:15:22
RICK JAMES
They're stealing from all them
01:15:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
But they did not want our own camera that they didn't have any control over, I guess.
01:15:30
Mikey Santolucito
So they can surveil.
01:15:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
I don't know.
01:15:30
RICK JAMES
them. Okay.
01:15:32
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yes, ah apparently.
01:15:32
Billy
but,
01:15:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, they have their own cameras.
01:15:34
Mikey Santolucito
Okay. All right. Rules for me, not for thee.
01:15:38
The SnowJobs Podcast
yeah it was just a weird situation i don't know but it's not a problem anymore um what else anything i think that's great though bill i i think you have to have if you don't if you don't currently have it in your contract that you have the right to photograph and video i think you got to put it in especially in this day and age going forward
01:16:01
RICK JAMES
I agree.
01:16:01
The SnowJobs Podcast
what else
01:16:01
RICK JAMES
i agree
Small Business Challenges and Fuel Costs
01:16:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
anything else boys
01:16:05
Mikey Santolucito
No, think we hit lot of good stuff tonight.
01:16:08
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:16:09
Billy
feel surcharge real well.
01:16:09
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, we got a good, we got a good dent. We got a good dent. We'll see how many more questions come in after this one. cause it's It was a busy week. it was like I said, I think we're in the 30s. 35, 36 questions total between Facebook, Instagram, and the the website.
01:16:33
The SnowJobs Podcast
Busy week.
01:16:35
Mikey Santolucito
Busy week.
01:16:35
The SnowJobs Podcast
Okay.
01:16:35
Billy
Yeah.
01:16:37
The SnowJobs Podcast
that's good man i'm glad you know it's fucking memorial day weekend and uh and guys are uh guys are still thinking that much snow so good for them i mean shake some places are still getting snow wild right
01:16:48
Mikey Santolucito
Oh, that's what PTSD does to you.
01:16:48
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:16:52
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Yeah.
01:16:53
Billy
One
01:16:53
RICK JAMES
True story.
01:16:57
The SnowJobs Podcast
all right anybody got anything else yeah good
01:17:01
Billy
my field surcharges went pretty decently.
01:17:04
RICK JAMES
yeah.
01:17:05
Billy
Yeah, so most of them, not all. I called the office and talked to my niece as if she was, it's it was not good.
01:17:08
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
01:17:15
Billy
And it kind of really irritated me. I said, you don't you don't fucking speak to people like that. Like, we're talking like 12 hours.
01:17:19
The SnowJobs Podcast
Drop them. This is one of the 200 lawns.
01:17:22
Billy
on a fucking Starbucks today and didn't negotiate with Starbucks out of the other evil corporations of the world, but you're going to take down a whole $11 of a small business trying to be an enterprise, like your local guy. Like it's it's just the mentality confuses me.
01:17:39
Billy
You know what i mean?
01:17:41
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:17:41
Billy
so
01:17:41
The SnowJobs Podcast
Make an example out of them.
01:17:42
RICK JAMES
Because they think they can walk over the little guy, you know, that's why. so
01:17:45
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm. here
01:17:45
Billy
it is. And there's just, one and I, and I use this a lot to tell people, ah There's a place that if we fall behind, you know, or my mechanic falls behind, we'll take a mower to the local local guy.
01:17:58
Billy
And in his shop, and i've and I've known this guy for 25 years, your business doesn't help support my third vacation home or yacht. It helps me put my kid through school, helps us put food on the table, take a family vacation. So thank you because of you, you know?
01:18:15
Billy
And it always resonated because people like all of us in this room, we're essentially a small business. But you don't negotiate Starbucks, you don't negotiate Walmart, but you want to treat me like a piece of shit over $11.
01:18:28
Billy
It's kind of weird, right?
01:18:30
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't make sense.
01:18:32
Billy
It doesn't.
01:18:33
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:18:34
Billy
Because you want people like us to survive.
01:18:35
RICK JAMES
yeah
01:18:36
Mikey Santolucito
But they're going to notice when we're not there.
01:18:38
Billy
Exactly. When that grass gets four and a half inches instead of four and two quarters, you know whatever.
01:18:45
The SnowJobs Podcast
So you had the two out of the 200 lawns that you had on contract, how many people call back with a problem?
01:18:51
Billy
Five.
01:18:54
The SnowJobs Podcast
I will.
01:18:54
Billy
It is what it is. I was actually pleased with that.
01:18:55
The SnowJobs Podcast
I love that.
01:18:56
Billy
Most people didn't even give a shit. They're like, no, I, you know, and I want, you know, what's interesting is that my bigger clientele, you know, but their estate, are like real estate homes and their businesses were, Hey, we get it.
01:18:58
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:19:10
Billy
I understand. Like, I'm surprised you didn't do this and in April. You know, I mean, they were kind of disappointed that I didn't jump on it in April. And that was kind of the feedback from a lot of people and yeah and then the rest of people just didn't care.
01:19:22
Billy
And then the five people with a, you could feel a little saltiness in the email a little bit.
01:19:27
The SnowJobs Podcast
yep yep
01:19:27
Billy
So we might have to generate the nice response because maybe mine aren't so nice.
01:19:27
RICK JAMES
Yeah. Yeah.
01:19:33
Billy
So are you doing that Mike?
01:19:33
Mikey Santolucito
so
01:19:37
Billy
Because you guys mow lawns too, no?
01:19:42
Billy
Is it Mike or Mikey? Both.
01:19:47
Mikey Santolucito
mike Mikey's kind of a ah name that's just stuck over the years. Uh, we do it it when we absolutely need to. And for the winter, we do do it when it spikes heavily in the green season. We're discussing doing it now because diesel is just so ungodly high, even switching out of the diesel trucks and doing gas dumps and gas single axle trucks. Now it's, it's still a huge nut to swallow every time that, you know, a thousand gallon tank gets filled every day, every two days, whatever it is. So we,
01:20:20
Mikey Santolucito
We know the clients that will understand it and take it. And we know the ones that we have to kind of spoon feed it to. And we just, we see how the the dice come up at the end.
01:20:33
Billy
So I'm doing it on a month by month basis evaluation. Obviously it might not be permanent. It could be permanent.
01:20:39
Mikey Santolucito
Yeah, you have to, I mean, it's up and down like crazy.
01:20:41
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:20:43
Billy
Yeah, it's just too much.
01:20:44
RICK JAMES
Would you change your percentage or your percentage staying the same? Depends on.
01:20:49
Billy
That's a good question. that's the its See, that's the issue. There's so many variables, you know.
01:20:53
RICK JAMES
Yeah, exactly.
01:20:53
Billy
So it's like, I tried to be fair. It's not like like we're getting rich on this. It's just to kind of cover down.
01:20:58
RICK JAMES
No, you're just trying to.
01:21:00
Billy
But, you know, see, this is your fuel price for a week, you know, because we have a truck yeah just like it sounds like you guys do.
01:21:01
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:21:04
The SnowJobs Podcast
It's overhead.
01:21:07
Billy
And then here's our new invoices.
01:21:07
Mikey Santolucito
Mm-hmm.
01:21:09
Billy
and I'm like, did i just buy a Rolls Royce?
01:21:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:21:14
The SnowJobs Podcast
Dude, literally did that the other day where I said, man, how much money I am saving this year not filling up all those mowers every day.
01:21:15
Billy
I was drinking it.
01:21:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
Like, it's incredible how much money is not on the credit card bill every month. especially with this with the prices of fuel now forget it's wild
01:21:37
Billy
Oh yeah, to fill a 550 rig, ah you know three mowers, you know two cycle cans and whatever else God have you.
01:21:37
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:21:46
Billy
yeah
01:21:47
The SnowJobs Podcast
dude my wife's car was at a third of a tank and i filled it up and it was 90 something dollars so jesus christ
01:21:56
Mikey Santolucito
We've got 20 gallon fuel caddies in every trailer on top of the the mix cans and a few five gallons in case the oh shit moment happens and something dies in the middle of a yard.
01:22:09
Mikey Santolucito
That's a lot of gas.
01:22:11
Billy
Yeah.
01:22:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah.
01:22:11
Billy
Yeah.
01:22:11
The SnowJobs Podcast
Oh, it's insane.
01:22:12
RICK JAMES
Oh,
01:22:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
And you can't be, you can't possibly be expected to absorb that. You know, we're not talking a 10 cent increase, you know, it's up over $2, you know, from what it was January.
01:22:24
RICK JAMES
it's crazy.
01:22:26
Billy
yeah
01:22:26
The SnowJobs Podcast
So you can't absorb that. That's overhead. That's increased overhead.
01:22:30
RICK JAMES
I was...
01:22:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
So customers got to, ah they got to increase their price.
01:22:35
RICK JAMES
I was just yesterday. i was trucking just west of town here about 50 miles. And the head town was two truck stops. One was our, like a local, local company where we usually in our fuel there.
01:22:49
RICK JAMES
Our diesel is like 530 right now. And right across the street, love truck stop. I mean, literally across street. Theirs was 560. I'm like, how the fuck are you 30 cents higher than that guy right fucking there?
01:23:01
RICK JAMES
It's like,
01:23:02
The SnowJobs Podcast
is it It's a chain, right?
01:23:04
RICK JAMES
Yeah, Love's is a huge change.
01:23:05
The SnowJobs Podcast
Yeah, so they set their price. um Yeah, it's over $6.
01:23:09
RICK JAMES
I'm like, god why the fuck would you drive on there?
01:23:12
The SnowJobs Podcast
I think $6.09 diesel right now here.
01:23:17
The SnowJobs Podcast
So wild, but it is, but it'll get better.
01:23:18
RICK JAMES
Yeah.
01:23:19
Mikey Santolucito
It's only getting worse.
01:23:23
The SnowJobs Podcast
Anybody got anything else we got to talk about? All
01:23:29
RICK JAMES
Nope.
01:23:30
Mikey Santolucito
Good.
01:23:30
The SnowJobs Podcast
right,
Conclusion and Memorial Day Reminder
01:23:31
The SnowJobs Podcast
want to wrap it up?
01:23:34
RICK JAMES
It's her.
01:23:34
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. Well, before we wrap it up, just want to say it is B, this is dropping on Memorial day. So enjoy the time with your families, celebrate responsibly. And please remember what Memorial day is actually about. Please keep those who made the ultra the, I'm sorry, please keep those who made the ultimate sacrifice for our freedom and their families in your thoughts and prayers ah while you're doing whatever you're doing with your own families.
01:24:03
The SnowJobs Podcast
All right. ah That is it. We'll wrap it there. Episode 172. 172 of the Snow Jaws podcast main show is in the books.
01:24:15
The SnowJobs Podcast
As I said, have a great weekend. Have an enjoyable Memorial Day, whatever you're doing with your families. Be safe, celebrate responsibly, and keep pushing.