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00:00:01
4 John Kuiphoff
79 Plays7 months ago
John Kuiphoff is a guy who makes things with computers and glue. He talks about his herd of lasers and using his ShopBot to do the alphabet.
https://www.instagram.com/johnkuiphoff/
https://www.youtube.com/user/kuiphoff
https://glowforgeforbeginners.com/
Things of the week:
John: Learning about skateboard construction
Al: Feeds and Speeds
Jeff: Onefinity 4th Axis Rotary https://www.onefinitycnc.com/product-page/onefinity-4th-axis-rotary-the-revolution-elite-masso
Patreon: http://patreon.com/digifabricators
Discord: https://discord.gg/hHp8Sv7vt4
Recommended
Transcript
00:00:12
Speaker
damn Hello and welcome to Digifabricators, the show where we learn how makers and artists use their computer-driven tools for fun art and profit. I'm your host, Jeff Stein, aka a weird guy, and with me is my talented but humble co-host, Al Schultz of New York Woodworks. How you doing, man?
00:00:35
Speaker
I'm pretty good, Jeff. How are you doing this evening? Oh, not bad. Keeping keeping alive, keeping warm. Yeah, fighting the colds and flu seasons. Yeah, well, it's coming on to Christmas. And that brings the flu, right? Yeah. What do we got going on tonight? ah Well, let's throw in the disclaimer and we'll get started. So Even though we pretend to be experts on the internet, I would like to point out that neither of us have any actual training and are just guys winging it in our shops and learning as we go. All advice provided is based on our personal experience and possibly inaccurate assumptions and is worth exactly what you pay for it.
00:01:18
Speaker
If listening to this show causes you to take out a loan to buy new and expensive digital tools, you may tell your spouse that it was our fault, but do so at your own risk. So tonight we are talking to a guy who makes things with computers and glue. He will teach you Glowforge for bri beginners, as well as the ABCs of CNC. So a huge welcome to John Kipoff.
00:01:47
Speaker
How you doing tonight? I'm doing awesome. Thank you. Yep. Appreciate it. Well, why don't you, uh, give us a quick intro of, uh, you know, who you are, what kind of things you do and what kind of tools you have and.
00:02:05
Speaker
What kind of fun you have? Sure. I'll give you the the three minute story. So for, uh, went to school for graphic design, but that was a time when the web was getting big. And so, um, I got into computer programming because you could breathe life into art. And I was like, that's amazing. So for 12 years, I typed like a machine gun, just coding apps and and, and websites and software. And then it was one particular project, one freelance project from, uh, like it was a big name and we had put so much work into it. My colleague and I that.
00:02:34
Speaker
at the end of it well he had he had a tough time and i said well i need to get away from the computer for a little while so that night i have bought a bunch of woodworking equipment i bought all the wrong stuff and then in the morning i remembered. I bought all a bunch of woodwork equipment so i cleared out the garage and.
00:02:52
Speaker
when it came, I loved it and I never made ah another web app again after that. And that was probably eight eight years ago, I had stopped counting. So I'm building all this stuff and doing woodworking and then eventually the computers come back in, but this time they're more creative tools. So while I still do code,
00:03:11
Speaker
I'll code for more creative purposes. So I do a lot of woodworking, CNCing, 3D printing. ah ton I have more laser cutters than I can even count at this point. I got a full wood shop. I make a lot of videos. I do Arduino projection mapping. So I think my my superpower, if there is one, is like I like to mix all that stuff together. What happens when you mix an Arduino with a CNC machine or a UV printer with you know a laser or something like that?
00:03:41
Speaker
um I also teach i now part-time. I was a full-time professor. um I now teach part-time so I could spend more time with my daughter and also build my business. So I teach digital fabrication and product design and sometimes coding and video. And I also teach at NYU in the summertime at a class called Making Data Tangible, where we use data to create um sculptures that are inspired by that data. So I mix a lot of things together.
00:04:08
Speaker
I think that's the general maker superpower is that we've all got different backgrounds and we've all tried out random different hobbies and maker crafts along the way, but we've all accumulated little tiny skills of useless stuff here, there, and the other where. And the that's the maker mentality is you just pull pool all those together and then mix them up. And that why that' that's why everybody's stuff makes is is different. It's because everybody's tried a bunch of different stuff. I mean, some people have done leather and some people have done CNC and then some people decide to do leather with their CNC. You just don't know what they're going to do, but it's all based on the, you know,
00:04:53
Speaker
where you've been and what you've done. But the contributing information like that is ah is the a tide raises all boats, you know, because to your point, Jeff, talking about, you know, some people do leather, some people do metal, some people do wood, and then the people with leather work with the people with wood or figure it out. And I and i love, John, that you that you called a computer or the tech side of the house a creative tool. You know, we we laymen, if you will, I'll call my put myself in there with using digital tools kind of have to, we don't have to, but the the old argument of, you know, is CNC woodworking, you know, kind of thing. And
00:05:40
Speaker
Trying to explain to somebody that yes, it's woodworking It's just a different tool or a different approach to the same project and I never thought of it as a creative tool ah digital Digital fabrication and I guess that's kind of what this Podcast is about right Jeff is to enlighten people that these are just tools no different than a chisel or a file exactly, but and it's all about your creativity and And what you decide you want to do with the tool. And the fact is that the digital tools, they give you so many more options of things that you would never be able to do all of these different things by hand. I mean, sure. If you want to be an expert at doing hand inlays, you can focus on doing nothing but hand inlays for two years and you'll be a master at it. But if you've got a CNC.
00:06:33
Speaker
You can be a master at inlay in a week of practice and then you can be on to the next thing and then you can come back and combine those. But I mean, if you had to do those things by hand, you'd have to spend a year working on each one of those skills, not a week. Another thing, I wish i wish we were doing video. I'm a little bummed out at how clean this shop behind you is here, John. ah Tell us about your toys there. on I know people can't see it, but give us a quick, what do you got in the shop?
00:07:03
Speaker
Sure. So I can imagine I started in one car garage and I made it look super nice. And, and I'll tell you a really super sad story, but pick things up. Well, my dog was like the the shop dog, right? He worked with me all the time. And so in the shop, he was always with me. Well, eventually he died. And I kept stepping over him, but he wasn't there anymore. And I was like, Oh, man, I don't I don't need to stay at the shop anymore. I didn't want to get a ah ah big commercial space because I didn't want to leave him home alone. So when he died, I was like, I started searching for space. So I found this gorgeous commercial space with windows and it's just like it's like 12 square feet in the New Jersey that rents um right now. My rent is 750. But for a space like this with electrical and it's got everything right. um That changed everything. So all of a sudden, all the new tools came in.
00:07:52
Speaker
So right now I have um five lasers, so three glow forges, a huge monstrous thunder, um and an ohm tech fiber laser. And I've got a ShopBot CNC, pretty much any woodworking tool, um you know, like the saw stops, all the all the things you would I got like a hammer, you know, joiner and planer. I got a full film studio now with like three mirrorless cameras and the lights and an electronic suite and all that. And I just, I think I'm done for a while. There's one tool I want, but I know you tend to ask that at the end. There's one tool I'm trying so hard to get, but I don't quite have a way to get it yet. um So I'm very lucky. When I walk into this space, it feels like home. Like yeah I walk in here, I'm like,
00:08:41
Speaker
I'm home. But then the stress starts, they got like the client projects, the video deadlines and all the things. But like this is everything I could have ever dreamed it to be. Yeah. Yeah. Do you do you have This is a problem I have. I have a fiber and a CO2 laser, but it's literally eight feet from my CNC in a very small shop. So cleanliness is like, I'm just constantly cleaning and I run ridiculous amounts of filters and stuff like that. Someday I hope to have like a a clean section, which it looks like you're setting it now. quite it's It's deceiving. I don't know if I'm going to try to put the camera out. I'm talking things. um It's just the space.
00:09:22
Speaker
where you can't see the other side of the wall. Um, it's a big enough space where all the clean computer stuff is here, but I just, I do a lot of dusting. That's kind of like my therapy. I just kind of, like I was going to say, do you, do you find, uh, that's probably, we've never really talked to anybody. What is, what is maintenance on lasers and and things like that? What does that look like li a third closed? Honestly, it's very little, like it's, it's very little. It's really enough. It's like,
00:09:45
Speaker
the desktop printers that need to be cleaned. its just like ah And that's my 3D printer. My poor proofs of 3D printers is like covered in just not really. I'm like, someday I'm going to make a ah good enclosure. But I don't, but it's because it's such a good printer. It just keeps going. It doesn't care. yeah Now this building is really cool. It was an old chicken coop. And there's a really dark story, depending on how how things go. I'll tell you about the dark thing that happened in this room. um But it's ah this is a huge building. It used to be like a chicken hatchery. And they filled it in. and after the dark thing happened. It was a laugh art studio for a very, very long time. So there was these laugh artists. There was basically like wooden art that you kind of like.
00:10:24
Speaker
stapled to a thing and they made up a bajillion dollars in here. But now it's full of other people who make things. So on this side of the wall, there's a company, it's a father and son. They've been making picture frames for 25 years. So if you go to any museum that has a fancy picture frame, um it was probably made by them. They're actually historians before they are woodworkers. So they know the styles and the story and all the history. So when they make that picture frame, um it's it's amazing.
00:10:53
Speaker
Um, and he's a veteran on the other veteran. There's a lot of veterans in this. And I think a lot of veterans do. Thank you for your service. I read that on your thing. Um, a lot of veterans turned to woodworking for some sort of therapy, right? Um, the other, winner my shop landlord is one of the most amazing people I've ever met. He's like a general contractor, but he you know, he's like, he's 77 now. And when I came in, he looked at all these fancy tools and he'd be like, really?
00:11:17
Speaker
You need all this stuff, but he has such an appreciation and he's in here every single day. Like we just, he's like, it's like my work wife right now, basically. like um yeah he's He's always in here and he's just amazed by these new tools. Like oh he was amazed. I could cut him out of perfect circle instantly. Cause he was like,
00:11:34
Speaker
I guess I got to set up the band. soing I'm like, Hey, you know, just what size is it? So he's like enamored with like the shape or origin using it. And then like the fiber, he's just like, he's in here every single day. And so, and there's skip who's 86. He's an led artist. Um, and he's in here and there's a bunch of old guys all waddling in looking at all the fancy tools, you know, and he's like, this is amazing. So they stopped making fun of me because they see some of the work that comes out of here.
00:11:57
Speaker
You're like, this is a this is fantastic. I wish we had this, you know, 50 years ago when we got into all this. It's just a magical time. I really do think this is like the most expressive time in human history, you know, because I came go here as a programmer and and eight years later, I can make anything in the shop. yeah Yeah. And like if it was 20 years before that, that wouldn't be the case. I'd still be making birdhouses.
00:12:19
Speaker
Yeah, I think and poses to people yeah it's it's something the way that the the older people who just did normal woodworking for so many years, they just see people on the internet just creating this massive, amazing stuff and with basically no effort. And that's that's where they come up with the CNC and laser isn't woodworking thing. but if they actually get up close to one and they'd like, well, I really wish I had a way to make a perfect circle. Well, Hey, watch this. I'll make you one. And boom, yeah you draw an inlay. He saw how much time it took just to program. It's like, you can't get a better inlay. Like it's just that you can't do it any other way. So he has a, he now has an appreciation for, for all digital fabric. And he he teaches me everything. He's like, like, why are you cutting towards you? You're going to cut your fingers. You know, he's always, he's like Mickey from ah the Rocky Balboa.
00:13:12
Speaker
Yeah. He's always telling me everything that I'm doing wrong, um much but in a nice way, you know, and he's like, he's like a grandfather figure. He's like, I don't know. He's like, no one ever taught you how to use this tool. Did they? I'm like, no, I learned everything from Jimmy to rest. I I have a graduate of YouTube university. He just learned it by but playing around and figuring it out on his own. So.
00:13:36
Speaker
How many, how many of those letters are you up to now? I've seen you've been making, uh, what is it? One letter every week. Yeah. Is that a shop bot thing? Isn't it? It is. Yeah. That's sponsored by shop bot. Um, they've been very good at giving me almost free creative license. And right now I am working on the letter T, which is, this is a black Corian and, um, I'm cutting out little pieces of mother of Pearl, which will be inlaid. That'll be hopefully done.
00:14:06
Speaker
Friday so they and then the edit takes me like a full day. um I love the editing part but it takes longer way longer than the project. So A to Z, um like letter A was like resonatory branches and then metal and then foam and we made our own plywood and then we worked with leather and then there was like a printmaking one and um I mean it just goes built circuit boards. like So I'm trying to make, my goal in this was to make the best CNC video on the internet.
00:14:33
Speaker
um and i've i've had to take out some personal loans to subsidize this project because ah Because you can only charge so much, you know what I mean? like They don't want to spend $50,000 on a video. um But it's it's it's amazing. Yeah, like this has been the most creative project. And it's taken a lot of perseverance because it's hard to work. I've been working on this for a long time. And it doesn't slow down because like Wednesday is the next drop. like This Wednesday was the easy one. It was just like an HDPE. So occasionally, when I have other client work, I have to... I have to take on an easy one, but right now, uh, yeah, they're, they're just, they're wonderful. The last one's going to be ice. I think, cause it'll be winter. I never carved ice. So, but yeah, it's probably the the coolest product I've ever been able to work on because I have full creative freedom with, with exceptions. Is that, is that going to be a laser project or a CNC? That's a CNC, right? CNC. It's all CNC. Cause it's shop bought. Okay. So I said, they're a really great company. he mess
00:15:33
Speaker
I recommend turning off the heater that day, open the doors. I might just take the shop on outside because it's, this thing is such a tank. It doesn't get cold in here. Like it'll never get below freezing. So I think I got a desktop. So it's, it's easy enough to bring outside. Yeah. Well, I sort i think for the amount of math that's going to make.
00:15:55
Speaker
that's going to throw chips into the far corner of everywhere where they're going to turn wet and everything's going to start rusting. So maybe maybe that would be best outside. That'd be an awesome project, though. I hope you can pull it off. Yeah. Yeah. They're they're wonderful to work with. um Yeah. I want to go back down to their headquarters. I haven't been down there yet. But they're just like, they really are like a family company.
00:16:17
Speaker
And they're just, yeah, they're they're wonderful. And yeah, it's coolest project I've ever worked on. With that said, the YouTube videos, I've been doing all these letters. I got like a hundred new followers on Instagram. So it's not gaining a lot of traction number wise, but I'm hoping the last video we can do something to like make some kind of campaign so that more people can see it. Right. Hopefully that'll get pushed out more, especially once you've got it all combined into the full alphabet.
00:16:46
Speaker
Like it's funny when Jimmy Dorester like chairs one, we'll get like thousands and thousands and thousands of views. If he doesn't share it, I mean, it still gets a couple grant. It's a couple thousand views, but not much. But on YouTube, we're only getting a couple hundred and I'm like, Oh, that's that's that. We're all working up to that last video. So I got to figure out a better way. And I see maybe you guys have some insight. So they want to, they want to put it on their channel, obviously, right? They own the rights to all this stuff.
00:17:12
Speaker
Right. but At the same time, I think a lot of company websites don't get a lot of views. Like, like how many people watch Walmart's YouTube channel? Probably not too many, right? That's why they have the market. Yeah. But at the same time, a lot of my channels geared for lasers. Cause I, you know, this is what I've been posting. So I don't know the right answer, like how to get the the best bang for your buck at the end. Cause we want people to see it, but, uh, it's something we're discussing now.
00:17:38
Speaker
I really liked the way Instagram has solved that problem where you can now invite a collaborator. and yeah Yeah. Right. And then it goes on both of your channel feeds simultaneously and YouTube apparently needs a function similar to that where yeah i would and channels collaborate and it goes on both of your feeds. That would be something you can't do right now, isn't it?
00:18:06
Speaker
No, yeah, you get knocked. They'll just kill both channels or whatever. Yeah, upload the same thing to both. Exactly the same middle. Yeah, somebody will get knocked as copyright, but you can't you can't just tell YouTube that this is a collaboration and put both channels on it.
00:18:22
Speaker
Which is a shame because a lot of, even when I work with other people, um there's your room for collaboration, right? like There's a lot of projects I don't work on by myself. So one of the things I was thinking is like, well, they get the straight through video. Maybe I'll do it behind the scenes. It's like an hour long, but I don't know if there's, I'll play like the full sequence in the front, but then have a half an hour behind the scenes.
00:18:43
Speaker
stuff That maybe is not so CNC related, right? But I don't know if that's too much I need to find somebody at YouTube or maybe someone in the who's listening to the show to tell me if that's if that's kosher Can you do that? I'm I'm not a YouTube guy at all in any way shape or form but I have heard people talking about I listen to the self-made podcasts with my coffee and the and the moose crew and DIY huntress and they have, they talk about the algorithms and and things. I was like, Oh, that I'm sorry. True. Complete blank. I got off on the subject. Um,
00:19:23
Speaker
Wow. They have a course, don't they? Like, I know that there's some kind of course. I've been wanting to take it like the YouTube course. and know Oh, oh huntres i yeah. Yes. yours That might, that might be her. Yes. yeah I would definitely check, but don't, don't hold me to that. Oh, they were, they've been talking about the collaboration videos. Like they've been fighting trying to get traction on eight, 10, 15 minute videos, which has always been the, what do we do? What do we do? You know, what's the algorithm going to push?
00:19:51
Speaker
And now for some reason, the 45 minute hour long videos of collaborations of like, this was a summer project was, which was six other videos, but it's all hammered together. So I only mentioned that to say that, you know, maybe your 15, 20 minute video that's clean, your straight through video, you called it with 30 or 40 minutes of behind the scenes might be gangbusters, you know, cause apparently people are leaning towards more time consumption, you know rather than shorts. That's about 15 minutes myself. I don't like people like shorts. I don't watch a lot of shorts, like on YouTube, ever. no And even Instagram reels. like like i like I'll flirt with them, but i'm not like it's not my... like i ah just you know There's like three or four creators that if they post a video, I drop everything and watch. like A band nice dad video comes out, I'm not... I'll watch the whole thing.
00:20:46
Speaker
but I don't like the short form. Like I just don't consume it. Yeah. So it's, I don't care. I don't care for it either. I think, uh, black tail studio is probably one of the best video producers out there. Like he's, he's doing a video, but he's talking about something else. Kinda. So you're just like, you're just engaged through the entire entire thing and it's not bang, bang, bang, bang, you know, in your face, edit, stop, you know, stop short edits and.
00:21:12
Speaker
It's just a network. And he's the exactly the same person. He is in the video. Is he really? It looks like the guy from tool looks like Maynard, but you always wonder if you always wonder if the person's yeah he's a thing du he's like, yeah, he's like Jimmy DiResta. And like, if you met him, you know, he's like oh he's up but the same person. He's not a character. Yeah, I actually live about 20 minutes from Jimmy DiResta. Are you really? Maybe i could prop I'm going to see him in early just January, we're doing one of the letters together. We're doing a letter X. We don't know what we're doing because we keep changing. Oh, yeah. If you've got time, please. I mean, it's a, it's a humble little home shop here, but I'd love to visit with you or you should come up with us for the day. That's why you embedded. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We could do that. Yeah. Cause you do some amazing CNC work. I was looking on your channel. I'm like, Oh, he's good. Yeah. He's good. I think I'm a super novice. it was i Going into this, like to stop. I know about lasers a lot more than I know about CNC, but I'm going to learn real quick.
00:22:10
Speaker
Yeah. Well, I, my, my CNC is that, that four by eight is my first CNC. Like people are like, Oh, just, did you start with the next car? Nope. I just dove off the pier. I hope they make it. Yeah. Yeah. I just started with a little shape Oco and I'm still using the little shape Oco. Yeah. But you've done cool stuff with it too. Some of your stuff is just like.
00:22:36
Speaker
Yeah, rotary attachment and everything. Well, that's that's a different machine actually right um Yeah, that's a that's a weird one because it's it's got a fixed gantry. It's it's a rotary only So it has that make sense it has no y-axis. The gantry is just fixed to the base It just goes left right up down and spins. So that's a separate thing I use for rotary But you know the the shape oko meets my needs because I've found ways to make it do things, you know, like fixturing, which is what I consider my superpower is fixturing because I can get a piece to fixture anywhere on the CNC. I don't care what shape. I don't care what size. I don't care what it is. I can get it on the CNC and I can get it to the 10th of a millimeter of exactly where I think it's going to be no matter what it is.
00:23:31
Speaker
I bought the Shopbot because I was using the X-Carve. And then the Air Force called me and said, OK, man, can you do a bunch of like a huge order of things? And it's got to be good, right? I'm like, I need a real CNC. And the only thing I knew was Shopbox. I remember at NextFab it was huge Maker Space. I was like, Jimmy, I was like, all right, I need one of the end. So I bought it. I had used one previously that I completely destroyed because I didn't know what I was doing. So when I got my Shopbot Desktop Max, it's probably overkill for what I need it for.
00:23:58
Speaker
Like you can get a step craft or you can get like any other brand that's like, okay for most things, but the shop bought is, is, is solid. Yeah. Um, and at the time, but at that time they were the hobby, they were like the hobby CNC. Now there's so many competitors that are taking over that market. i think Well, they're.
00:24:18
Speaker
They're high-end hobby or low-end professional because I mean, a lot of those machines are what, eight to 10,000 for a shop bot. Whereas if you want to. 10 or 11. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. well nice And then they're big ones, you know, in the thirties and you get a shop Sabre, which is, you know, has a couple of other features for it's more money, but yeah, I think you're right. Yeah. Whereas a lot of the hobby or things are done in the,
00:24:46
Speaker
one finities and the shape Oco's and you can get those for, you know, two, three, $4,000, you know, CNC sharks are pretty nice. They're in the what six to eight range, I think for most of those. So shop bots at the, I'd say it's at the, the, the high end of.
00:25:07
Speaker
You know, what there's a word for something that's almost professional, but almost still kind of hobby. I don't remember what it is, but yeah, they're right in there. It's accessible. Yeah. I love the machine. It's built like a tank and the cost is more than I ever need. And so like that feels good. Yep. I see a few people online with those and they do a really good work. They seem to be super strong powerhouses.
00:25:34
Speaker
But the letter series, the first time like, Oh good. I finally used it to most of its capabilities. I feel better about the purchase now. You know what I mean? yeah I got this fancy thunder machine and I'm like, I should really be pushing this thing. And I don't, you know what I mean? But the shop bought finally. i Yeah. Yeah.
00:25:48
Speaker
Does your CNC have the rollers? Have you seen those things like the hold down rollers? um Not not the rotary indexers. Is that something? No, no, no. This is a I thought it was a shop. They're coming out with them now. There's two rubber rollers and the spindle is between them. So the rollers are actually holding material down. It rolls with the gantry forward and backwards.
00:26:11
Speaker
I'm not quite. Oh, yeah, yeah the the whole bed moves kind of like some 3D printers. Is that what you're talking about? No, no, this is there's a roller in front of the gantry and a roller behind the gantry and they're they're pressured. Oh, that's so cool. So yeah they lift up with the with the spindle and then you slide your material in and then the rollers will roll over so you don't get that kick up. If you're I would imagine you could probably lighten up on the on the tabs, you know. Yeah. because the role The rollers are only, you know, six inches away from the bit. So you have down pressure six inches away from the bit. I'll ask them. They may never do it all. They have like all kinds of new dot stuff. I don't know. I'm still like, I'm just need your next letter. One thing that I i started working with recently is air weights. I don't know if he played with their, um, portable vacuum system.
00:27:00
Speaker
But it's it's so well designed. I'm like, I can't believe I didn't have like it. You just put it on your your machine and then like yeah you screw it attach it to your your spoil board. But just like they're set up for like the way the gas gets working. like It's just like it's ingenious. like it's like If I was doing a production run, it's it's an amazing, amazing vacuum system.
00:27:21
Speaker
Yeah, and those are expensive. Yeah, it's like a thousand. It's like a thousand. I don't remember what the number was, but it's like, yeah, depending on the vacuum pump that you get and all that kind of stuff. But it's relatively inexpensive. And that changes the pilot, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You can add them. Yeah. Yeah. adam and they I think they have bigger versions now or something like that. But it's ah like just having that. I'm like, oh, wait, now I can do all these other materials but without the tabs, without the, you know, and it's yeah. easy I'm like, how did I not have one of these before?
00:27:50
Speaker
Yeah, and you know what, I've never used one, but I think I've seen the what you're talking about and they do look really, really good. And they're, I'm generating the term pinpoint vacuum, ah which I think is more beneficial. I have two, two and a half force vacuums on my table. yeah And it's great. It's great for sheet goods, but anything, you know, I can't hold a, I can hardly hold like an 18 inch circle.
00:28:16
Speaker
you know, down on the table. My first test was even this guy, like the first real test. There's no way I could hold that. And I it worked perfectly. And this they didn't need any gaskets. I just like put it on the thing. with And I was like, oh, that's it. Yeah. Wow. think And they have a thing where you could like, there's different attachments for the top. And you can, like, if you're doing production runs, they make it super easy to do all kinds of interesting things. And I'm just like, I still have to like work with it. But it's like, oh, wow. Yeah. Well, that's not my life.
00:28:44
Speaker
It sounds so that um like it's a really nice no, no, no, no, no, I'm like, I'm excited. Like I'm thinking I could use my vacuum to hold down a smaller one of those vacuums to hold down a small piece. Right, right. I have a I have a um Oh,
00:29:04
Speaker
Oh my god. T-track table like a two foot by four foot T-track table for small pieces that I hold down with the vacuum and then T-track. I got into I was doing a lot of like ah beer tap handles so they're long and thin so they're really hard to hang on to you know with a bigger machine. So I just made this T-track thing. Suck it down with the vacuum and then clamp the piece to cut the yeah and Hey, you make it work. It's a figure it out. Got to figure it out. it's It's kind of a jig. Everybody needs jigs for everything. Absolutely. Anything repeatable needs a jig and everything digital is repeatable. Theoretically. Theoretically. Yes. Exactly. Depending. Well, it's repeatable. Yeah. Depending on how expensive your materials are and whether you've got more.
00:30:00
Speaker
Yeah. So, so out of all that stuff you've been playing with, what was, what's the most expensive materials or what, what's what's the been the hardest to work with? I saw, I didn't, I see you playing with slate. Uh, no, this is actually a video. This is soapstone. Oh, see, it was soapstone. That was it. Yeah. Now's the, this is the letter R, but what I'm, when I'm planning to do one of my next videos, I want to make ah an entire moon table.
00:30:27
Speaker
So, um you know, like bent lamination legs and I got a welder who is next to me also like just a few units down. um He's going to make the Apollo 11 legs as part of the legs and metal things and the glass top. But the cool part of the video, the only reason I'm making the video is that ah the last shot is when you put like your your coffee on the table. Well, it's going to float away because there's no gravity on the moon, right? it's good Right.
00:30:53
Speaker
So I got all kinds of video tricks. I wanted i wanted to play with that video with anti-gravity and things like that. Oh, I'm really here i'm here for this. and that that Soapstone, was that pretty easy? Yeah, yeah, totally easy. he Makes a lot of dust. I was wearing a mask because I was like, is this bad? It's probably not worse than Corian or half the other stuff I use, but it's dusty. But no, I carved like wood. It's easy. I mean, I've seen like people I can sculpt it. It works almost like wood. Your bits take a beating.
00:31:26
Speaker
How come I've never seen anybody do that with the, you know, I don't know. I just like, I throw a stone on there. Let me find, you know, like, and it's like, Oh, that one didn't wear this one works. Like it's it's funny how little research I do. I just like the thing I love about what I do now is the, is that the tinkering and the exploration and the discovery. It's why I became professor. I love to like research all the stuff, put that information out there, and then you're onto the next thing.
00:31:53
Speaker
That's why I'm also a terrible business person, because I just want to experiment. We're gonna be friends, John. yeah and That's in trouble. Yeah. Yeah. My newest obsession is UV printing. So what can a UV printer prints on wood, metal, glass, like anything, you know, print nine like that's gonna be the next craze after laser is gonna be UV printing. They're just slightly out of reach now. They're still too, but I get back to my original story. um I was teaching programming at this college full time. and I was like, I don't want to do that.
00:32:25
Speaker
I was like, I want to teach this other stuff. And I go, we don't have a maker space and we don't really want to make, like, it's not something that's in the cards. And I'm like, I'll just get grants of donations. How hard could that be? And so we generated a couple of hundred grand and donations, even though I can't do that for my own business somehow and and and grants, and we built this amazing maker space. And the the biggest new tool is the, uh, is the UV printer. And so it's like, it's game changing because if you're a graphic designer, you could do package design. Like it's like.
00:32:52
Speaker
and 800 other things. We have our maker space at that college, which is self-funded. It's got every tool you could ever imagine in a tiny little space, though.
00:33:03
Speaker
Like that's the one problem, like getting space in it, because they don't want to give us more space. They don't have space to give, but we have every tool you could have, like embroidery machines, resin print, like anything. We got it. We got it. We got it all, but I don't work in there. Like that's a teaching space. It's a different mindset to, you know, I'm i in a different headspace when I'm in there. I'm serving other people or I'm in my own shop. Well, then it's a completely different thing. I'm like in business mode and creative mode. So it's.
00:33:30
Speaker
I kind of, you kind of need both. You always need a personal studio or a place where you can tinker, I think. Yeah. I want to hear about this UV printer though. Yeah. I was going to say my buddy Tom has a UV printer for commercial. He's a signed guy. Yeah. What kind of, do you know what kind?
00:33:48
Speaker
It's blue blueing cream. It might be a mock ease what they say, but this is ah one of the first prints. I had to do something for the college. I know you guys can't see this, but that's printed on stainless steel. Yeah. Yeah. It's amazing what they print off. It's, it's, it's incredible. This machine, but you need like a PhD in like It's not your Epson region, it's like a file print. No, there's like a whole science behind different ink and you got to run it every day. It's like, it's more maintenance than having a dog. Oh yeah, the inks are volatable. They only last so long. You have to use them within a certain time. And we didn't know all that. Cause I'm like, we need to UV printer. Cause that would be, and then all of a sudden it's like, this is, this is a job.
00:34:30
Speaker
His printer is big enough. It does this. It cycles like you can hear the colors. to to to because It's constantly cycling and war keeps them at a certain temperature. I got into UB printing. I didn't even know what it was, but there was a Grand Central terminal needed. They were doing a rebrand. So they asked me, hey, can can you help out? And so I was doing the laser and this other guy was doing the UV. And I was like, oh, that's perfect. um So I formed a relationship with them for a while for that UB printing company. And we did drum badges for like Imagine Dragons and 21. We did all these crazy projects.
00:35:03
Speaker
Well, COVID kind of like killed that company as they did many others. And and since then I was like, I need to figure out how to get my hands on a UV printer. So when in time came, I was like, and they actually, Roland sells one for like 10 grand now, but it's a really small print bed. I don't know if it's like eight by.
00:35:19
Speaker
six I don't even know what the bed size is, but it's super tiny. Um, but I would love that machine because you can, you can still produce things with it. They sell a much larger one as well for like 20 or 30 grand, but like they sell a desktop one. They can't do gloss inks apparently, which is a big deal. with And then the thing we're using at the college though, the reason we were able to justify is the college are spending like a hundred thousand dollars or whatever, getting signs made like overseas.
00:35:44
Speaker
um For like all the things right? Well now we can do them in-house like we 3d print the my friend Brett Ratner He 3d prints the the signed parts and then we like laser cut apart and then we can Print on the 3d print and then we can even print Braille because Braille has to be it and it's like to smack so that these printers can print Braille and different textures and ah my mind's like Exploding I'm like why can't someone make a $5,000 version yet?
00:36:12
Speaker
Yeah. I think Tom's is two foot by two foot. Give it a couple of years. these I know. Just think, 10 years ago, what did it cost you to get a diode laser? Right. right and They weren't very good either. yeah Or a ah a badly assembled belt run CNC. But compare that to what you got today. 90 inch TVs at Walmart for $350. In a way.
00:36:42
Speaker
Right. And yeah do they have a warranty? Who cares? They're disposable. Yeah. That's how I feel with the 3D printers. They're disposable after like three years. Just like, man, like all those. Yeah. So I feel like every three years I'm getting a new 3D printer set up. I've got to get my first.
00:37:00
Speaker
well we'll we'll talk into one of those soon enough but i think i i think i got rid of my i mean i got rid of my resin printer i got bored with it after about two years i let it sit here for about a year and then and once i bought a bamboo i passed it off on somebody that didn't have anything yet and they're nice machines i have proofust only that's what i started with but ah They're nice machines, but the bamboo, they're doing some killer stuff. Like even their software is cool. Yep. They got some cool stuff in their, like their labs area. they can make did Any water jet or plasma stuff? Um, I've worked with one. So the the college actually has like $130,000 water jet.
00:37:42
Speaker
And, but you have to be like, I don't know. You have to be like cleared by the government or whatever to use it. Like now they're actually they're pretty good about it, but I can't just like play with it. Obviously. Um, now for metal, like I, right now I'm just using send cut send for everything. Cause they're, I just, because I, um, everybody's talking about it. Yeah. It's like you almost can't. Because I got the the fiber laser. So I did a ton of stuff over the last two years with them Panic! at the Disco, the drummer Dan. um He's doing all these custom drum parts. And so I was working with Works by Solo Burnie on that project too. But yeah, like I just get everything cut, send, cut, send, send to my fiber laser to let that burn marinate for two hours, and then throw it through it like a stand black. And it looks amazing, like some of the stuff you can do. So I you know and i can't, yeah, I think eventually we'll be able to have
00:38:31
Speaker
fiber laser that cut through metal. but it's just not the cards. And I'm not a metal worker. I can weld. I've been looking at the laser welders. I don't know if you've seen some of those. oh They're expensive. They're not as good. ah But they just look so easy. Yeah, it's like calling it a crayon. You know, these things are all going to be commonplace in our shops in, you know, five, six years, I'm guessing, you know, whether it's yeah fibers that cut right through metal or whether it's
00:39:02
Speaker
the UV printers and you know every everything that's new and shiny and super, super overpriced is going to be every day commonplace in five years. you know Hopefully they'll start coming out with everything else that's affordable. We could use an EDM that's affordable.
00:39:22
Speaker
I was going to say here, let's let's start a business here. we'll We'll revive the Shopsmith. It'll be the digital Shopsmith with a diode laser, a CNC head, a fiber laser, a water jet pump.
00:39:34
Speaker
And then I got their dust collector now and it's it's pretty good. Yeah, I like it a lot. Yeah, but it's funny. That'd be hilarious. But you know, it's gonna change a lot. It's like the AI stuff. I don't know if you guys how close do you follow the stuff that like I was a programmer. So obviously I have like superpowers. Oh, I can make AI do more than most people can I can write code. And then I can even write the code that I feed back to it. But I wonder what the future of digital fabrication will be with AI in terms of not even just like tool pathing and file creation, but even like the Tesla bots that are coming out now that will be in your shop all night. While you're not there like making all your widgets on the CNC like they're already working in factories. I do wonder what's gonna happen in five years.
00:40:17
Speaker
as the robots and the AI start to infiltrate the shop. Hold up, hold up. Are you telling me it's AI thing is not just a fad? It's not normal. I use it for everything now. It's like, the more I use it, I'm like, oh, wait, oh wait, wait. I thought like the shop stuff was safe. I'm like, you know what, no one they're never gonna be able to build things with their hands. No, they got like eight, they're gonna have like, they're only gonna be like octopus. They're gonna have like eight tentacles. They could just i operate every machine at once and and look at the market and figure out what's selling. and yeah thats That's been done and Spider-Man had a hell of a time putting him down.
00:40:51
Speaker
yeah ah yeah yeah no i've enjoying a lot last yeah You get a gold coin for that reference quick Well, he had eight robotic arms helping him that sounds like I've something I've seen before Yeah, yeah, I mean, hi and that's the future, though. I mean, why not? I mean, but they except he wouldn't have those things attached to his back directly. He would just be able to communicate with those arms that would just move around and do things for him. You know, he didn't even have to attach them to his spine. Right. It's so much effort. They would just be arms on every wall space. your orange Yeah. Your shop, instead of like tools, it's going to be arms everywhere.
00:41:35
Speaker
Yeah, sure. Why not? So, so what's a day in the digital life look like? Like, what's your like, give us a, not a big project day or a deadline day, but like, what are your, what do you like to, are you an early riser? You know, get a workout in and then on a computer, like, what's what's your basic schedule? So basic schedule. how do you And how do you stay motivated to do it?
00:41:59
Speaker
I am more motivated than anybody. like i'm just this I'm just so thankful to be able to do this. So my life changed quite a bit, because i i I have a three-year-old daughter. And um so that changes a lot. yeah there's oh Yeah. There's things that you get to do, and there's things that you have to do. and there's So my date right now is this. She goes to this Montessori daycare right next to the shop. So I have two and a half hours in the shop. And I'm manic in here. like That's when I'm like producing. like I'm on fire.
00:42:29
Speaker
I pick her up and then for most of the day, um just enjoying life. We're going to the playgrounds, we're eating good. I find you mentioned working out. I never worked out a day in my life, but four weeks ago I started working out 20 minutes a day. I'm like, why didn't I do this before?
00:42:44
Speaker
like I feel so much better. I have so much more energy. I feel I look different. Like I just feel good. I'm like 20 minutes a day. So she does the workout with me. It's like some we have like a little yoga mat thing or whatever you call it. I didn't know there's no weights or anything. I have nothing sophisticated. You know, um but it still tires you out. um And then when my wife gets home,
00:43:05
Speaker
at like 430, I go back to the shop or I teach. And so that's another three, four hours of manic working. It's like when I'm in here, it's like, I am so time efficient now. I'm like, okay, I already have because I had five hours to think about what I'm going to do as soon as I get to the shop. So but did did did mean I have eight machines go and I got I got all this stuff going and then and I just edit any time that I have time to edit like editing takes so that's the biggest What do you call it? Not the time suck. It's the, what do you call that thing? It's like the bottleneck. It's the bottleneck of my day. Yeah. Because um i don't know if if you've seen any of the letters, like they look simple, but it's easy to make a two minute video. It's really hard to make a one minute video. Like what else can I throw out? It's like when I was a graphic designer making logos. The hard thing about making logos is what else can I take out of this graphic to still communicate the same message that it needs to communicate in the most efficient possible way?
00:43:59
Speaker
And how can I have that done by tomorrow? So like when I'm making the, especially the ABC videos. It's hard, so I'm like, oh no, i it's important. I need that three seconds, but how else can I tell that story? You know, and I don't want to do like a time lapse because that's cheating, but sometimes I do it. Like, what's the coolest way to do it? And ah the video also needs time to breathe. So I think a lot about like storytelling in terms of video. um So when you're making a video, you're not actually making a thing. You're making a video about making a thing. And so that mindset for me was the hardest to learn. So oftentimes when I'm making a letter, there's actually two of these letters.
00:44:35
Speaker
because one set up quickly where I get to throw it on the thing and and and I destroy it and there's the one that looks nice. So like I get a lot of my inspiration from the garage. I don't know that you can know that guy who makes like food commercials and stuff like that.
00:44:48
Speaker
Um, he, he's this amazing guy based in Brooklyn. He makes food commercials and he uses like Arduinos and robots and the, and stuff like that to make it happen. So the answer to your question, I front load everything into the beginning of the day. I live my life with my kid because she's only little ones or her in the shop at night. And then at around eight o'clock, we go to bed.
00:45:15
Speaker
And I watch YouTube for about an hour and a half just to learn. Like right now, um I'm learning everything there is possibly to know about making skateboards, because I'm going to be doing some in-person skateboarding ah building workshops for kids, because they're building a skate park in town. And I'm like, oh, I could teach classes in this shop.
00:45:33
Speaker
And so I'm like learning everything there is to know about skateboards, like how to make the molds on the ShopBot and how to like get the basic shape and how do you even do the round over? And then how do you put graphics? Is it like a heat thing or is it screen printing? So like that's my research time for an hour and a half. And then I try to get- UV printer, UV printer. I know, but you need a big one. They're like 50 grand or something. I know, but also the UV printer, skateboards are curved.
00:45:59
Speaker
And that that's kind of a problem because it's like a three inch curve. So like you'd be printer when it's printing on a surface. It's only a few millimeters from the surface. it's brain Yeah, it's tight yeah so like something like a curved surface. I don't know how they you need to invent. You need to invent a ah or a topographical clamp that can turn the board. Go back to the vinyl. Yeah. Got to go with vinyl and put a sticker on there.
00:46:28
Speaker
Yeah, or find a, find a really good classic classically trained pin striper. There's some really beautiful, I wish I could draw, I have two art degrees. I can't draw worth a damn. but um Like I can't, like I have no art skills. I have design skills, but that's not the same. Yeah. So when I draw something, it's like my, like it's me versus a three year old, you know, with the, like, I just can't like, we're the same skill level. Like I just can't, I don't know why, but I wish I could.
00:46:55
Speaker
Yeah, actually now that you mentioned it, it wouldn't keep like email me after the show and let me know when you're going to be up at Jimmy's and I'll bring Tom with me. He's the guy with the, with the UV printer and he's a pinch striper. So you guys will hit it off. You guys need to meet. One of the things I want to do with the UV printer. So like, I'm going to tell you a fail story. So I started, I thought I was going to make a million dollars making my own plywood business.
00:47:21
Speaker
I made all this plywood, got a big fancy logo done, all the things. I haven't sold a single sheet yet. and But one of the ones I was selling was plaid wood, right? and know So you just make like a simple square, and then you just you know use some skateboard veneers to do that. And I was like, oh, cool. I'm going to make end grain plywood for lasers. And I'm glad no one bought it, because ah this is one of the sheets. um The end grain is completely warped.
00:47:49
Speaker
So the next version is going to be face, this could be face grain, but instead of making the the stripes with the, you know, like with woodworking techniques, um, you could just print the stripes on and make every version of plaid ever. yeah yeah And then it'll be, that's what, that's like yeah was manual. I have a ton of different kinds of samples of this.
00:48:10
Speaker
and it's very time consuming and basically I make a cutting board and like I'm like the guy at the meat counter in this grocery store I just slice it thin and then flew it on throw it to the drum sander and call it a day throw it on some MDF but the end grain makes the thing warp like a like a taco so it's uh you're telling me that plywood's not supposed to be warped it's not. but this Yeah I mean. it's work Where are you buying plywood because. mytro are depot Everything all the time. all of i and load All I get is. I only get my way from those spurs.
00:48:42
Speaker
You know, I just get to choose between, you know, uh, cup left, right, or front to back. You know, those are my options, but some are cool. I got these guys like different patterns you can make with the laser and somebody just find like exotic woods. And then Michael all inspired, like it's really fun to make the plywood. I just, I just love it's like my little side project. So you're, you're So you're veneering, basically, you're making a, I don't mean it. I'm not belittling this. I'm trying to simply, I'm trying to simplify the understanding for me. So you're, you're veneering. That's really, really cool lasers. Like you can get maple, walnut and cherry, which I just call vanilla, chocolate and strawberry. Right. Right.
00:49:28
Speaker
like Why aren't there more interesting samples out there? That's it. It's that simple. so I use ah the vacuum bag system and it's it's fun. you know it's It's easy. so but i used to go here Maybe the veneer industry is just fans of Neapolitan.
00:49:47
Speaker
yeah
00:49:50
Speaker
so So when does a when does a three year old ah approach the age when you need to bring her into the shop and start showing her how to do some of these things?
00:50:04
Speaker
is four too early. I mean, she's already three. She's used power drills and um she's in here a lot. Not that I get any work done, but it's it's important that she just knows how to make things, I think. And so like this is one of her favorite places because there's more than enough scrap wood. The shop is more than double the size of our house. You can make a mess. I could put paper on the floor and we can draw and we can paint and we can make sculptures. She put tape on the wall. So she oftentimes lasts to go to the shop to play. Not that I get anything done at all, because she's at the level now where every cast iron table is in like farhead height. So like, you know, so let's just be decapitated instantly if I blink. Yeah. you know You just can't put a bumper on every corner in a shop. Just maybe, uh,
00:50:55
Speaker
maybe maybe wrap a pool noodle around her forehead and that'll just protect her from everything.
00:51:02
Speaker
it But now it's because you get so excited. Like we make the, like we made holiday ornaments and the 3d printers is a machine that prints toys. Like she's so easily explainable. I'm like, my students are like, yeah, whatever. Like they don't care. Yeah. We need to, we need to, we, we might just start, have to start a billion dollar company here. The Fisher price CNC laser company. Well, it's great. So all these little tiny Fisher price toys.
00:51:29
Speaker
in all seriousness, like so my wife's really big into like the love every which is these Montessori toys, they're CNC cut toys that would a little bit of UV printing on them. And they're just wooden toys, but from printing on them. And she'll spend like $100 on this little tiny whatever. And I'm like, spend $100 on that. Like in the shop. That's so easy. Like that's like it's a backpack. And you know, I can do that, right? like We can do all these we can personalize this stuff even So it's, uh, yeah, there is a market for, for that. But then if you're working with kids, you got to make sure that the finishes you're using isn't going to poison them. They don't lie instantly. Like there's all these things you got to do. Yeah. Can't use red number three anymore now. Yeah. Yeah. And then insurance on that. It's like, so yeah. Put lead in the paint, put it on really thick. So it'll chip off when they chew on it. I mean, you got to toughen them up with that stuff. Right.
00:52:25
Speaker
yeah but Yeah. She enjoys it, you know, she's, and it's, it's, it makes it fun for me too. Cause like anything that I make for like, for example, I don't know, they're over there. I made all these monsters for glow for all these colorful cool monsters. Of course you wanted them all. So now she's like, got more toys, even more toys and she, you know, it's fun. It's fun. Yeah. That's, yeah that's probably 50% of what I've done with my bamboo in the last six months is.
00:52:52
Speaker
The just ah little flexible toys and anything else I see on the internet that the kids want. Cause there's a, there's a toddler and a teenager in the house. And between the two, there's just so many little toys I've printed. It's just amazing. But it's it's so much fun to bring either one of them in to sit down at the computer and say, Hey.
00:53:16
Speaker
What, what kind of thing do you want to make today and say, Oh, well, you know, I want, I want an Olaf from, uh, I want an Olaf from frozen or something and say, okay, well, let's go find a, let's go find an Olaf. And whether we find a 3d model and print one, or whether you can find an outline and laser it on something.
00:53:40
Speaker
You know, it's always cool to say, well, what do you want to do? Well, I want to make this. Well, let's go find one and let's make the machine do it for us. And that's, that's just so much fun. I think that making things, so it's funny. I'm not like, I don't own anything. Like if my house burned down, I own a guitar and now a yoga mat. That's it. I own anything. Yeah. I'm not a things guy. So the stuff I make, it doesn't actually have a lot of value.
00:54:03
Speaker
um Which is which is strange, right? Like you think somebody who makes things loves things I don't I like tools and the potential but more than that the reason I make things and the reason I teach is Really to empower people to get out of the cubicle and start like living life like and that sounds so cliche and cheesy Leaving like a mic in the glow fortune beginners class like all those people work jobs. They hate it They will start an Etsy store and you might be you can quit that job So for me, it's like the making part and the teaching part is really just to empower people so that they don't have to do jobs that they hate because, you know, I grew up with people that hated their jobs and were stuck at their jobs. And we have these tools now um that allow people to basically create their own future.
00:54:46
Speaker
And it's never been easier. And so like that's really my mission when I make things. So if like I'm making skateboards with a bunch of teenagers, it's really not about the skateboards. It's about planning that season. Hey, man, someday maybe you can start a business. Maybe you don't need to be a nine to five employee. Maybe you can build things on your own, or maybe you can fix your own house. like For me, that's the exciting part about making, and besides the research. But it's not the stuff at all. like Like, I can throw this in the garbage. Like, it ah it it doesn't matter anymore. Like, it's done. Like, its usefulness is is over. But it's not going to garbage. I got to send it to Shopbot when they're done. But but yeah like I don't know why you guys, why do you guys make stuff?
00:55:24
Speaker
Well, hang on a second, Jeff, the last 45 seconds is the short for this week. that That was most, the most eloquent way of putting making I've heard in a long time. I appreciate that. i appreciate Yeah. And I kind of make, I kind of make for the same similar reasons. Like I, like I got figure it figured out. I grew up on a dairy farm right up the street here. My family's we, when something broke, we had to figure out how to fix it. It wasn't, you know, we didn't.
00:55:52
Speaker
We didn't have the money or the time to go, you know, back to the dealership and same here. Yeah. So, you know, my grandfather was a tinker. I took things apart. I got in trouble for taking things apart so much as a kid, you know, eight figuring out how to, and then eventually I got, was able to take them apart, fix them and put them back together and have them work, you know, which was pretty interesting, but yeah, just to like, can I take a square piece of wood and make it into.
00:56:22
Speaker
whatever is, is pretty cool. And now the digital has really opened up because I don't have the patience to become ah an actual master woodworker with, you know, I see, I see all these people buying, you know, five hundred five million dollar plane and planes. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no. What grit do I need to take that off faster? you know But so the creative part is more intriguing than the actual. Yeah.
00:56:51
Speaker
skill acquisitions. you know i mean i i absolutely I was apprentice to a master cabinet maker right up the road. He's been past a few years now, but so glad that i I learned how to do this the correct way and then learned how to do it better and more efficiently with digital tools.
00:57:10
Speaker
Yeah, same sentiment like I discovered this it changed my life I'm much happier person and I just want to want to pass it on to as many people as I can Yeah, and it it didn't take me very long to realize that I just wasn't super interested in the woodworking part of things I mean, I mean that's where I started this out, you know, I mean I started this by you know having a a saw and then a you know, a welder and some other little stuff that I didn't use a whole lot or do very well at. But I mean, I poked around and played with them, but they were sort of fun. But really, once I found the digital side of things that that's really, really, I found that's what I really, really like the most is because the the digital problems that there's so many
00:58:04
Speaker
options, that it's, it's super complicated. And it makes me, it gives me something super complicated to try to figure out, you know, I'll just invent a problem, then try to find a solution for it. um I've got a friend, Dave Bauer, who's got a show that's called yeah he's making problems to solve. And that is absolutely it that is absolutely it for me is I just make a problem and then figure out how to solve it because it's fun. You know, some reason some people do puzzles and brain teasers and I try to figure out how to do work holding on a, you know, rounded object and get it. Does anybody else hear vanilla ice? Do you hear vanilla ice?
00:58:58
Speaker
If Jeff fine Stein finds a problem, he'll solve it. a problem yeah i'll solve it check out the There you go. 1990, baby.
00:59:09
Speaker
ah And so I wonder this too, when I think back like to when you were 12 years old, a lot of the stuff that I was doing at 12 is now reserved. I'm 43 now. like I'm basically 12 years old again. right And when I was 12 years old, one of my friends would be at the beach because we lived in a lake community. like I'd be more interested in building these sand castles, maybe off swimming, off the diving boards. or like um And, you know, another example is like the one class I was good in school was shop class. And I actually brought my mom in to like, dude, this kid's got something with shop. um And I loved it. But then shop class ended because the shop teacher, it was winter, um so was snowblowing his driveway. And the snow somehow got compacted in his snowblower.
00:59:56
Speaker
And he put his hand in to unlock the snow and it tore the alarm off. And so like that was the end of shop class. And they replaced that shop with a computer lab. And so we didn't have shop class anymore. um And eventually you found but you find your way back. Because there's like a lot of things that, when I was 12, I'm like, oh, I'm into the same stuff now. I just, you know what I mean? Yeah, I did a bunch of other stuff. But now I'm back to being 12 again with that same enthusiasm and excitement for things.
01:00:25
Speaker
Yeah. I'm not sure I ever really stopped being, well, not 12, but. Maybe 16. We built tree forts all over the place. We built tree forts everywhere. We'd go into the dump and we'd find like old mattresses and plywood and we'd make like three story tree houses with, and that was like, that was the thing, you know? like that's why There was always new construction in the neighborhood and off cuts and scraps and nails laying around were all just picked up, dragged off into the woods and, uh, hauled up the tree somewhere. I.
01:01:00
Speaker
Yeah, did a handful of those with friends as well at booby traps so the girls couldn't get in like in all the things, you know what I mean? Yeah. i built I built the fanciest tree house I've ever built right here. me Yeah. I had to let the girls in though. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. When you're a certain age. Yep. Yeah. You get past the little rascal stage and then you realize that sometimes you want the girls in the tree house.
01:01:28
Speaker
But she she has asked regularly. Are you 12? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. kinda Yeah. We are. It yeah turns out that growing old is required. Growing up is not. I can absolutely. Yeah. You know, attest to the fact that I'm, ah you know, 53 and I've got the maturity of a 16 year old. So we're all 16 until we look in the mirror and like, who is that guy? yep Yeah.
01:02:02
Speaker
ah That reminds me, you know, I, I never thought of a digital toy. Like I was trying to think of like when I was 12, like what kind of digital other, other than the bright, the, the football game with the, you were the brighter of the dots on the screen. I love those games. But yeah, I think it was a, or noro it might've been Norelco even. Norelco was a shaver. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
01:02:28
Speaker
and But Coleco, yep, could be, you know, who would know. yeah i Um, but I had, I think I was exactly 12. It's funny you say that. It was like a dream toy. You know, we didn't grow up, my family didn't grow up with money. So I asked my great grandmother who I was her favorite. So, and I was told not to, I got a lot of trouble, but she got me a toy. It was called a big track.
01:02:54
Speaker
Okay. And it was a six wheeled thing and it had like a phone keypad on it with, Oh, I know it. And you literally, you, you programmed it. Go, go forward five feet, turn 15 degrees, go forward five feet, turn left 15 and you could like program this thing to You know, it'd take an hour and a half to program it and it would drive around the couch. yeah yeah But it was, yeah I was literally mapping. I was literally manual Roomba, you know, yeah yeah and uh, I was 12. So that was 50.
01:03:30
Speaker
The other thing, too, when I was 12, we had a computer that was the size of ah my CNC machine, like a screen, like an iPhone screen, but green. and And my mom worked at a diner, so like we had to go with her some some of the weekends. So we would lug this huge computer, and I'd put it on the countertop of the diner, and I would code, like, I don't even know what language it was like, but go to, line 10. And that was like the name. And we had to get your name in the scroll bars.
01:03:58
Speaker
And then we couldn't even save the program, but like these little seeds that you can plant in young people's brains, they sometimes might take... two decades to finally germinate. So part of what I want to do is plant some of those seeds that happened that allowed me to do what I do today. But it's important to get to some of those people pretty young, I think, before they just become scrolling machines and just look at memes all day. Because I think the phones kill all young people's boredom. If you're bored, you just scroll through memes. And then you actually learn to hobby or get to do any kind of critical thinking or deep thinking
01:04:34
Speaker
You know what I mean? So like the, the, if we can get kids from like stop scrolling and just learn how to play guitar or learn how to like do some woodworking, um, that will serve them much better later in life. There's so many things you can do when you're bored, just because you got bored and you went and found something to do that could turn into anything versus sitting there with your eyes down, just turning your brain off.
01:05:04
Speaker
You know, no that's when your brain should be lit up like a Christmas tree. You know what I mean? Like coming up with your new ideas, having goals and and finding the people that are your mentors that you look up to. But like a lot of the youth is just these scrolling machines. It's just it's just basically like digital alcohol. You know what I mean? It's just not.
01:05:19
Speaker
um But they're on it all day. I did a little, in one of my classes, I forget what class it was, we were doing like data analysis on something. I said, guys, they're always on the phone. I said, can we just chart? Look in your phones, because it tells you how much you've been on the phone than the previous week, right? So I said, let's just chart it. So I had 20 students, the lowest number of hours, scrolling on the phone was 37 hours. The highest was 82.
01:05:42
Speaker
I said, guys, you're not in a week, in a week. And that's, that's average. And the average was something like 50 or something like that. Like, guys, that's like a full time job. Like the reason you're not progressing in your craft.
01:05:53
Speaker
is because you're on TikTok. like It's just like, you gotta like find another outlet. like You're not getting stuff. Isn't it isn't it interesting that like we all make our livelihoods and our passions are steeped in this digital and and digital capabilities and we are trying to figure out how to keep our children off of it.
01:06:14
Speaker
So here's the difference. So like the youth is are using these as consumption devices. I only use, I mainly use these as production and ah devices, like as tools. And that's I think the big difference. Except yeah, I want to watch, I want to learn.
01:06:28
Speaker
and binge for an hour and a half a day. And I think that's empty, right? well yeah like Not 88 hours a week, though. Yeah, yeah not 50 hours a week. I was going to think about some funny memes that are out right now. but You have to compartmentalize that to some point so that you've got some times that you're going to do consumption and you're going to sit down and whether you're scrolling TikTok and just wasting your life for an hour or whether you're doing YouTube and educational It doesn't matter is you've designated an hour to waste on the electronics. And then, then when it's time to get to the shop and be creative, that's, there there's no phone, there's no playing, there's no distraction. There's just, I'm going to be creative in this time.
01:07:19
Speaker
And then in this other time that's like in the morning during breakfast, I'm going to scroll TikTok for 20 minutes or in the evening, I'm going to play on YouTube for an hour, whether it's educational or not. It's being able to compartmentalize that into sections where when it's time to be creative, there's no bone distraction. it's not It's when you try to say, oh, but let me look at one more TikTok, then you'll never get anything done because you can't keep that. You can't just can't take out TikTok during creative time or you'll never make anything.
01:07:56
Speaker
you know I mean, and it's easy. it's It's so easy to fall into. Like you want to own your own time, but you don't want this owning you. And that's like, that's the hard thing. It's like any other addiction. I think, I think some, there are a lot of people out there that are seriously addicted. I mean, our, our videos are meant to hook people. The games are meant to hook people. Like this is no different than any other, any addictive substance really. And then when, so when you're dealing with a younger group, yeah, of course they're going to fall into it. Well, the,
01:08:26
Speaker
The one reason why it's very different from all of the other horrible addictions is that there's no societal urge to say that this is bad, whereas If you're a teenager and you're starting to get into drinking and if you're starting to get into gambling or if you're starting to get into drugs, everybody got us as a society jumps up and says, Hey, you can't go overboard on these things. That's bad. That's bad. That's a problem. These are bad addictions. Nobody is really making a huge deal about how bad of an addiction the electronics and the phones and the distractions are. And so potential.
01:09:11
Speaker
There's, there's no more, there's there's no pushback to it. I mean, sometimes you got parents going, Hey, you got to limit your time. And I mean, that's responsible, but I mean, as society in general, most of the adults are walking around the world crossing the sidewalk with their eyes on their phone and not looking left and right before they step off the curb. And this is what the teenagers are seeing. And, and it's not.
01:09:36
Speaker
the the The worst part about parenting is that kids don't learn what you tell them. They learn what they see you do. They learn from you and you your life and how you live it. And that kind of bothers me that I spend too much time.
01:09:59
Speaker
looking at my phone when the kids are watching me and wondering how come they're not allowed to have electronics time. And I'm sitting there wasting a half an hour looking at shit instead of doing something useful. You know, I mean, so that that's the worst part about parenting is they learn from what you do, not from what you say.
01:10:21
Speaker
And it's hard. Yeah. I leave my computer at the shop, which is so hard because there's stuff that needs to be done. But, um, I'm like, it's just the investments worth it. Yeah. Cause I see what it does to like, you know, college-age students and it's not good. Yeah. Like you just need to model. And I see it all the time. Kids, I'm at the park with my kids and all the parents are on phones and I'm like, dude, this period lasts for like this long. Like that's it. Like when your phone's in the pocket for three years and like at least, but they can't do it.
01:10:50
Speaker
So anyhow, i'm just now I'm on a totally non-woodworking rant. It's just ah my other thing. I'm like an old curmudgeon. I'm like, put away your technology, even though I was a phone developer, an iPhone developer for 12 years. you're You're the youngest of the three. I don't think you need to worry about it. Yeah. So speaking of technology, what what do you use? Like your your video, I know where we're audio podcasts, but your video is amazing. It's super crisp, super clear.
01:11:18
Speaker
Like what do you, I guess I should say do's and don'ts. What do you find through all your experience? Like what works for you? Like a lot of people say I do all my filming with an iPhone or other people say I only use a DSLR. What's what's your opinion and what's your, what works for you?
01:11:32
Speaker
So there's there's two types. So if I'm making videos that are not live, um I have three mirrorless cameras with the Holy Trinity lens. I got the macro, I got like the normal lens and the wide angle. There's also like, I have like a probe lens and a GoPro and other things. like but Between those three lenses, you can get most of your shots and oftentimes will have more than one running at one time. um i have I do have very nice lighting. I don't use it well because I don't know anything about lighting, but I just put the light on and it looks better. It's like a big expensive aperture light. I have a couple of those.
01:12:05
Speaker
um Now, if I'm doing live, I use Ecamm software with Stream Deck, and I have like multiple webcams. So if I'm doing live streams, i got it's it looks like a 7-Eleven. There's like there's this cameras everywhere. And i just and i can pinpoint I can just pick what camera is going to be live and add my video feeds in. So like there's like two different mentalities. So I'm not like, I know, speaking of young, because Twitch streamers know this better than I do.
01:12:32
Speaker
But it depends on on what you're doing. So if i'm doing like if I'm doing workshops, I'm almost always live. But you almost can't tell, because there's some preloaded content. And sometimes I'll even play a video that I preloaded like of like Shotbot doing something or whatever. And while that's running, I'm rushing around getting the camera shot. So when I'm live again, I'm like a news anchor that like everything is like on the table. And all that's got to be planned. um But the weird thing about video is so when I started with video,
01:12:59
Speaker
like I just thought it would come instantly, like everything else. Or not like everything else. like like I just thought like video was easy, because everyone makes videos. But I didn't realize it was going to be just as hard to learn as it took me to learn how to program, how to use a CNC, or how to do graphic design. So it's taken years of not looking like an overseas hostage, like saying, yeah, I'm fine on camera, like being more personable. And that's like something I didn't expect. And I'm running said the same thing with business. I had to read all these business books lately, because I'm like,
01:13:29
Speaker
your account numbers are in the negatives, buddy. And you're working too hard. And you're too talented to be like, this poor. Yeah. um So like, you got to learn some business like right away. So I've been like binge reading and watching and everything about business realizing that's a skill set. Because K to 12 are taught how to be employees. We're not taught how to be entrepreneurs. And a lot of us in the woodworking community, I kind of like dip our toes into that. But now that I'm like,
01:13:54
Speaker
Relying on the income and like you don't know anybody like you're you're you're new when it comes to business And that's a very dangerous place to be right now. So yeah, so it's like it's just like another skill I'm like trying to learn and it's it's hard like my 43 year old brain still like defaults back to employee mode pretty quickly It doesn't take much. Yeah 55 It doesn't get smoother I promise Yeah It's funny thing about your way your brain, like my students who are 20, you know, they're just 21 years old, they can learn things like super fast, like, believable. And my 43 year old brain can think a lot deeper. Like, and there's like, yeah, yeah, yeah if you work with the younger people that can work, learn fast, and you have to be the deep thinker, like the center. That's why they can, that's why they can doom scroll so fast. Yeah. it's you did did today because they They take it in, but there's there's no depth in what they're taking in.
01:14:46
Speaker
Yeah, it's all empty calories. And that's, and that's not the empty calories. Nice. Um, and that's not to, you know, I'm not shitting on a generation. No, not me either. now Yeah. And then more than have to like ah COVID and all the things, like whatever. Yeah. Yeah. Some slack. But so John, did you bring a thing of the week for us?
01:15:10
Speaker
You got something? of the Honestly, I thought about your question for the way I work. And I don't know, like it's one of my students said I have ADHD and I'm like, are you sure? And I'm like, Oh no, she might be right. Um, so I get really into things and then like obsess over them until I master it. And then it's like, okay, I'm moving on to the next thing. So, um, there's two things I'm working on right now. I'm making a CNC summit, an online CNC summit.
01:15:34
Speaker
So I'm learning everything I can learn about making online summits. you No, interesting that is, it's not. But it's, ah but it's interesting that I can see the event in my head. And I'm like, so excited for the CNC summit that'll be probably ended summer early fall. So I'm learning like,
01:15:51
Speaker
all of this software that helps online summits happen. And I'm also learning everything there is to possibly know about skateboards. So how to make skateboards, different kinds of trucks, what the different bushings do. um So like I'm obsessing over that now until I build a skateboard class. So I've just been watching skateboard videos nonstop.
01:16:11
Speaker
Um, and that's probably not the answer you wanted, but like I'm more topic related. There's not a creator necessarily. Like I have my staple creators. Like when making it comes on, I watch it. If there's a David Picciuto out that David Picciuto video out, I watch it. A van Neistat. I watch it, but everything else is like, Oh, we're going to make skateboards for the next two weeks. And we're not going to think about anything but skateboards. And then two weeks after that, it might be something on the fiber and something that it's like some weird video editing technique.
01:16:39
Speaker
So it's, so right now I'm all about skateboards and learning about how to run an online CNC summit. Oh, that sounds perfect. I mean, I'm interested in that CNC summit yeah and I want to, I'm going to do some research on your CNC classes too. Cause I need, I'm a figure it out as I go thing, you know, and like.
01:16:59
Speaker
Hang on, let me go to YouTube and find out how to do this. At least you said YouTube. I'm just like, let me just turn the dials and see what happens. Oh, send it. Yeah. Most of my CNC sounds like the beginning beginning and the beginning of the podcast. So I'm going to be laughing at feeds and speeds. Like um this is a horrible thing. I'm going to put wood settings and if it's bad, I tweak. Like I don't and' think about, I'm like, eh, chips look fine. And if they don't, if it's screaming, I know what dial to turn to make it not scream. Yep.
01:17:26
Speaker
But I'm not an engineer by any stretch of the imagination. you know I thought maybe that you might be the kind the guest we have that actually understands what a chip load is and how to calculate that. I can get halfway through the description from my eyes glaze over. I'm like, can we just run it and see what happens? Yeah, that is exactly what happened with me. Just as necessary. I watched a lot of videos about how to calculate a chip load and how to set to set your speeds and your rotations. And then I actually got the machine set up and running and I'm like, I don't, I, I, I'm not doing that math. You just tell it to start with your default numbers. And if it sounds like it's running rough, you push the speed down button and the RPMs up button. And if it sounds like it's not working, well, you bump it up a notch. Like every tool, I just, I have like a bat. I can hear everything. I'm like, Oh, the lasers, that's not, doesn't sound good. Let me go check that out. Like, I know what every single tool sounds like in my sleep. I could have a hum of all the different motors. yeah You know what your 3D printer sounds like. And you're like, Oh, I don't know. So you just, it's all auditory.
01:18:38
Speaker
Well, that's the, that's the professor teacher kind of thing is, you know, the teachers are up there at the chalkboard and they hear a little shuffle in the background and they know it's Johnny in row four over there doing some dumb shit. He knows who to turn around and throw the eraser at. And it's just your students at this point are now the machines you're listening to in the back. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now you're right.
01:19:03
Speaker
Yeah, and you're and you're saying the week was perfect. It doesn't have to be another maker backr only endeded Yeah, yeah yeah ye it's it's really whatever you're excited about right now and it really doesn't matter what the hell that is. Yeah How about you out? well interestingly enough and this is not because we just talked about it three seconds ago and ah yeah I've been gearing up for a very large CNC project order. I got a repeat order from a big client. So I ordered a bunch of tooling from my favorite tooling company, which was also my first thing of the week, Vortex Tool Company. And ah they are really, really good about like, you can literally call them and somebody will answer the phone and tell you the chip load and feeds and speeds that they recommend for their bit. But
01:19:54
Speaker
I have been doing it for the since 2016 by ear, you know, and I've recently upgraded the horsepower, doubled the horsepower on my machine. and um I've kind of committed to, all right, let's, now that I have a machine capable of doing what the manufacturer says it can do, because that was a problem. I was only three horsepower and I couldn't get, I couldn't, they're like, we think you should run this at 400 inches a minute. I'm like, I, my machine won't go 400. You know, so now I've upgraded everything and the machine is faster and more powerful and, you know, very Steve Austin ish. And, uh,
01:20:32
Speaker
he or he yeah he my buddy at at uh vortex said let's go through and just start making a list and we're gonna do without all the glaze over numbers and he's just gonna say this deep this fast this deep this fast fast and i'll have kind of an abbreviated feeds and speeds but i want to use these tools are getting expensive i want to yeah i want to be able to utilize them to get all the goody out of them, you know, cause breaking them sucks. And because I send it and most of the time, but as the tooling gets bigger, cause now the horsepower is bigger, the prices go up and the mistakes aren't as, aren't as easy anymore. You know, I don't mind breaking a $30 bit, but when you break a $300 bit, you're like, all right, I gotta do some math. I don't care how much it costs.
01:21:22
Speaker
So feeds and speeds are my is my thing of the week. All right. Well, you got to, you got to keep track of it at least a little bit. At least it's a starting point. It's definitely a starting point, but I'm, I'm a lot further into that category of machine is not capable of doing what the specs say. I'm way further into that. I mean, most of my work is done on a trim router on the shape Oco. So it absolutely cannot do.
01:21:50
Speaker
whatever the feeds and speeds. I mean, i'm I'm still pulling things with belts, so. Yeah, yeah. what What's your thing of the week though? Well, my thing of the week is I saw a product released from a company called Onefinity. Everybody knows Onefinity. They're the new hot thing in the, you know, ah yeah Hobbies level the hobby level CNCs, you know, they've got all the the the sturdy rails and everything and it's a nice reasonable priced machine It's got a decent amount of power and they seem to be very loved by everyone who's got one So it's it's the new hot thing for the people in the the hobby level of the CNC now they just released a product which is a rotary indexer machine and They've got a rotary indexer that they just released that is a plug and play machine where you just slap it down. It apparently fits on it any of the Onefinity models. They've got a couple of different sizes, I think, for depending on what size machine you've got. But they will sell you a rotary indexer for about $700.
01:23:16
Speaker
And you can add that on to a, about a $3,000 CNC. yeah And that will, as far as I know, and that will be the cheapest and easiest way that has ever been a production model that you can get rotary for. That is a plug and play without having to come up with a,
01:23:44
Speaker
I mean, sure, you can go buy your own rotary parts and assemble your own shit and hack it into your system somehow. But this is a plug and play put out on a production run by a full scale company where you can add a rotary to a CNC and you're in it for under four grand, probably.
01:24:06
Speaker
three That's pretty cool. Maybe between three to four grand you can have a CNC with a rotary on it and for all the people that are already have one finities and there's a shit ton of people out there that have them now they can just $700 upgrade and you're doing a rotary it plugs right in and just works. So yeah that is my recommendation is that if you're interested in the rotary work, the bar has just made it down another few thousand dollars. um Yeah, as I mean, and that's a that's a really I saw a video on that day. I'm glad you mentioned that because and that's a full headstock tail stock.
01:24:49
Speaker
That's not just a, that's not just a claw spinning space. That's a full headstock. I mean, it's not the fancy tail stock or anything, but yeah, I mean, it's got, you know, the, the, the spinning point on the right end to push into it. yeah but I mean, you had your shop bots, but I mean, you're going to pay, you know, 12, $15,000 to get that going, uh, up until now.
01:25:16
Speaker
the The real competitor in the market was the CNC shark, which you can get for, you know, five, six, $7,000. And then it was probably another grand or something to throw on the rotary.
01:25:31
Speaker
A rotary from my machine is four grand. but yeah just the Just the rotary. The rotary for yours is four grand, but the CNC shark, you could get yourself a decent CNC with a rotary put on it for probably seven or eight grand, but one finity finally coming out.
01:25:51
Speaker
at the, at the hobby end with a rotary is a game changing for people with a reasonable budget, smaller machines in the basement. So I think that's something everybody should check out. If you're interested in it, there's a new opportunity to make things, uh, you know, as it is, things get cheaper and easier, you know? Yeah.
01:26:16
Speaker
And they mount them on the wall sideways. You can, you can mount those things to the wall, but God, it gives you a headache because I think they go up sideways. And not, not, okay. So I think yeah when, when you're trying to think about your CNC project, you don't like lean back and look straight up at it. if You have to stand off to the left and turn your head right. 90 degrees to figure out which way is X, Y and because everything is, you know, sideways.
01:26:53
Speaker
It's, it's, it's vertical, but it's also 90 degrees sideways from the way they have you mounted. But that's some of the technologies that lasers now have. Like for instance, a camera, like we all come custom to lasers in a camera. They have at the CNC, like ah there's this things, there's so many things in the laser world that I wish would be ported over to the CNC right now, but we just don't, they just, it's an older school technology for the most part.
01:27:20
Speaker
Well, we'll have to put that out there and hopefully somebody will pick up and run with it. So you mentioned you had an answer for this earlier. So I'm going to go ahead and ask you what that dream tool is that if you could have any one tool delivered to your shop for free, just anything with any accessories, which one would be that and what, what are you going to do with it?
01:27:47
Speaker
everything with it. it's i We talked about it, they want the UV printer. Like I really think it's the next craze because it's the thing, it's like the big Lebowski, it's like the rug ties everything together. I really think the UV printer can work with lasers, can work with CNCs, you can print on 3D prints, you can print on anything. And I just think it it it would open up an entire new realm of products. And I want that printer. I just, yeah, it's not in the cards. I want a UV printer.
01:28:14
Speaker
Um, but I would need a cleaner space for it. I would have to like, yeah, I would need to like expand. Um, but that, that's, that's the only tool that I think I would need right now. I don't need a bigger CNC, which would be nice. I don't definitely don't need any more lasers. My thunder and my glow forges hum along perfectly. I'm even cool with the 3d printers that I have, but a UV printer would change a whole lot, but.
01:28:40
Speaker
That's it. yeah yeah it's just it's yeah it's still yeah Until they come down in price, though, um there's just not going to be a possibility. Unless there's a sponsor out there, and like Roland or McKeena that wants the partner. And i've I've tried to reach out to some of them, but they're impossible. they're not like They're other companies. They're like these big corporate entities that you can't get to a normal person. So you can't be like, hey, who could I talk to in your marketing department? There's like no way to to enter these embassies. yeah um They're just like in a they're in a different world than the rest of the maker tools.
01:29:16
Speaker
Yeah, they're not they're not selling to makers as a rule. They're selling to print shops. Yeah, big time stuff. It wouldn't want to work with somebody like me but uh, but I think I could I could make their tools thing if they if I could get there Yeah, I was gonna say and I don't understand why marketers don't understand that like marketing. I'm local graduate, you know, nothing fancy, no crazy college or anything.
01:29:38
Speaker
ah And I just, I look at like some of the marketing stuff that's going on these days and sponsors and it's like, why are you sponsoring that person? Like, yeah. Why don't you sponsor somebody that's going to make your machine like the center of attention? You know, um, I've seen several people get large, you know, I'm not talking about a star bond, you know, we'll send you some blue glue samples. I'm talking a company that put a major CNC in another person's shop and they, you know,
01:30:09
Speaker
they did a 20 minute video and then put three other, yeah, other branded CNCs in front of it and has never shown it again. And the worst like the unboxing and no, I don't care about your unbox. I want to hear a year in how many year in you're right? Yeah, like tell me where all the moles are. Yeah, like tell me all the things. Yeah.
01:30:28
Speaker
They don't want you to do that. That, that, that's too honest. What if it's authentic? I think people won't read it as an ad, like, as i like i yeah like I do a ton of stuff with the Glowforge still, but I know where all the moles are on the Glowforge.
01:30:43
Speaker
There's a lot of them, but I think people are appreciate hearing that because some people don't, you know what I mean? Like it's, you need to tell the true story. Yeah. And to your point, all, all equipment and all manufacturers have moles too. Yeah. They all do. Yeah. You know, what is it? Nobody gets out of this. It's this new beautiful iMac that I'm using right now, except it's got no moles. I've never, I haven't had a desktop computer in 20 years. I'm like, gosh, I can see without glasses.
01:31:13
Speaker
Oh, is that why your camera is so clear? No, yes it's got like this, all this feature and all this smart, whatever. i There's too much computer in here for for me to even understand. Yeah, no, it's editing on a desktop. It's like, versus a laptop. I was like, wow, I can see the video that I'm making at the same time of editing it. This is amazing. Yeah. Yeah.
01:31:37
Speaker
All right. Well, I think we've covered about everything here, haven't we? I believe so. Let's see. thirty in We have not had any listener questions to answer, so we will not answer any. But if you've got any questions you'd like us to answer with our hosts or their guests in the future, feel free to send us a message.
01:32:05
Speaker
So I would absolutely like to thank John for coming on the show. And everybody who enjoyed the show should go follow him. And where can they find you? ah The best place, probably Instagram, just at JohnKyfoff.com. You'll probably put that in the show notes because it's an impossible thing to spell. But but that that's yeah, mostly on Instagram, but also on YouTube.
01:32:31
Speaker
And this has been the highlight of my week. This was the most fun I've had since probably like 1993. So I appreciate that. Glad to give you a good one. Buddy, you got to get out more. I know, I I talk to a toddler all day or I talk to a camera. I don't get to talk to normal people ever. So this is good. Well, you're still not.
01:32:53
Speaker
Yeah, i don't I don't know if we qualify as normal under anybody. Yeah, the weird guy, maybe. You're not the normal guy. Yep. i don't I'm not even sure what normal is other than normal. is bor I see it. I don't like it. Yeah. Yeah.
01:33:11
Speaker
Okay, so I need to thank Al for taking the time to hang out and keep things interesting. And I need to thank all the listeners for tuning in. And of course we need to have a huge thank you to our current patrons for their support. So many thanks to Adam from BKR Customs for the support.
01:33:33
Speaker
And if you have enjoyed listening and would like to help support our show, you can do that in a few ways. You can share this with your friends, you can leave a review, or you can join our Patreon.
01:33:47
Speaker
You can find the Patreon at patreon dot.com slash digifabricators. You can leave podcast reviews on Apple podcasts, iTunes, Podchaser, Spotify podcast, Addict, Audible, and Good Pods. And I don't know where to find your friends, but I hope you have some.
01:34:07
Speaker
So we do have a discord server. It's open to all listeners patrons get access to an exclusive patreon supported channel in our server So direct links to the discord server and the patreon page are on the digifabricators instagram bio, which you should also be following us at digi-fabricators and If you or someone you know does cool things with their digital tools Please let us know because we've only got so many friends to invite and then we're gonna need some suggestions to keep the show going So I can be found most places as a weird guy and Al can be found under New York woodworks, which is NY woodworks with an axe So thanks again to everyone and we will catch you on the next episode
01:35:07
Speaker
Sweet, nailed it.