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ABLE Voices Ep 71: Kemal Gorey
21 Plays11 months ago
We are inviting disabled artists and arts educators to be guests and guest hosts on ABLE Voices. Today's guest host is Rivky Grossman.
Rivky’s musical career took off last year, with the writing and recording of her first Album-EP, Angel Sings the Blues. Raised in Brooklyn, New York, Rivky's music combines unique beat structure, a folksy blues style, and the influence of her Hassidic culture upbringing. Rivky's work has been compared to Jacques Brel, Laura Nyro, Billy Joel, Sara McLachlan, and early Regina Spektor. A self-taught musician, Rivky lives with Schizo-affective disorder, which, she says, plays like a fuzzy, backdrop hum in her day to day routine and ignites her creative spark. Today, Rivky will be speaking with Kemal Gorey.
Kemal Gorey is Istanbul-born, classically trained film and TV composer and accessibility advocate identifies as blind. Kemal's early career included session, live, and arranging work, but 2020 marked a turning point. After winning the Able Artist Foundation's Song Contest, he began composing for media, notably co-scoring the feature film "Love and Taxes" with Stephen Letnes. Kemal's music has been featured on major networks like Discovery and Comedy Central, and even accompanied the world's first blind Barbie doll campaign. He's a project lead for groundbreaking library music albums by disabled composers released by Able Artist Foundation and MPATH Tracks, and currently serves as secretary for the Recording Artists and Music Professionals with Disabilities (RAMPD) organization.
The ABLE Voices podcast is produced and edited by BIAAE Operations Coordinator, Daniel Martinez del Campo. The introduction music was written by Kai Levin and the ending song was written by Sebastian Batista. Kai and Sebastian are students in the Arts Education Programs at the Berklee Institute for Accessible Arts Education.
For more information about our programs visit us at https://college.berklee.edu/BIAAE
Follow us for more weekly updates at:
Instagram: @BIAAE
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/BIAAE
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Transcript
Introduction to Able Voices Podcast
00:00:07
Speaker
Hello everyone and welcome to the Able Voices Podcast.
00:00:17
Speaker
I'm Dr. Rhoda Bernard, founding managing director of the Berklee Institute for Accessible Arts Education and the assistant chair of the Music Education Department at Berklee College of Music.
00:00:28
Speaker
And I am proud to present this podcast featuring disabled artists and arts educators.
Meet Rivki Grossman
00:00:34
Speaker
We are inviting artists with disabilities to be guest hosts for the Able Voices podcast.
00:00:39
Speaker
Today's guest host is Rivki Grossman.
00:00:42
Speaker
Rivki is a New York City based singer songwriter, recipient of the New York Arts Grant,
00:00:48
Speaker
has been nominated for the IMEA Awards and has been selected for the New York Musical Theater's top female finalists in 2022.
00:00:58
Speaker
Her song, Hear Me Honey, was produced by Grammy-winning Amy Lee of Evanescence.
00:01:05
Speaker
Rivki's music has appeared on PBS's Mysteries of Mental Illness.
Career Highlights of Rivki Grossman
00:01:10
Speaker
Her career jump-started composing for Off-Broadway, meeting her friend and cellist Brian Saunders, releasing their first album, inviting them to the Kennedy Center, and stages featuring Suzanne Vega.
00:01:24
Speaker
Other projects include co-creating a musical currently in development with playwright Vincent Grappelli.
00:01:30
Speaker
Rivki currently hosts Melody Left Behind, celebrating performers living with schizophrenia, psychosis,
00:01:38
Speaker
autism and those who experience the stage just a little differently, pushing the boundary to welcome more neurodiverse inclusion on mainstream music stages, which often doesn't exist for a unique artist.
Introducing Kemal Gore
00:01:56
Speaker
Hi there everyone and welcome to the Able Voices Podcast.
00:01:59
Speaker
I'm your guest host today and my name is Rivki.
00:02:02
Speaker
My pronouns are she, they, I'm queer, non-binary, light-skinned with auburn short hair, and beautifully flabby around my tummy and hips.
00:02:10
Speaker
Thanks so much for joining us as we continue to celebrate and spotlight disabled artists.
00:02:16
Speaker
I'm a disabled artist myself, and I'll be speaking with disabled artists.
00:02:20
Speaker
And today on our segment, I'll be introducing you to Kemal Gore.
00:02:24
Speaker
Born in Istanbul in 1989, Kemal Gore is visually impaired, and his childhood dream was to score music for films, TV, and video games.
Kemal's Musical Journey
00:02:33
Speaker
And now he's a professional composer and disability activist collaborating with organizations like the AAF, which is Able Artists Foundation, and RAMPT.
00:02:41
Speaker
He started musical training with piano lessons at the age of six, continued piano until his university years, performed in polyphonic choirs at primary school, and decided to go to a fine arts high school at the age of 14 with the dedication to be a professional musician since his childhood years.
00:02:58
Speaker
Kemal studied on cello in the fine arts high school and also continued piano training.
00:03:04
Speaker
and performed in the school polyphonic choir and school orchestra, and also conducted many seminars for younger music students.
00:03:10
Speaker
And in 2013, he completed his undergraduate at Kukali University Fine Arts Faculty Music Department, performed in numerous concerts as a pianist and soloist during his university education, and also studied on vocal training.
00:03:24
Speaker
And between 2014 and 2019, he worked as an arranger, session musician, ghostwriter, and right after graduation,
00:03:32
Speaker
He composed and arranged different tracks for films, commercials during these five years.
00:03:37
Speaker
In 2020, he was named as the grand prize winner of the AAF Song Contest 2020 for musicians with disabilities.
00:03:45
Speaker
And in 2021,
00:03:46
Speaker
invited to the contest jury of the AAF 2021 Song Contest for Musicians with Disabilities.
00:03:53
Speaker
And in 2022, he worked as a composer, assistant, and additional music writer with Steven Lettness in the documentary project called Surpassing Sight.
00:04:03
Speaker
I think we're going to let Kamal fill in the rest.
00:04:06
Speaker
So hello, Kamal.
00:04:07
Speaker
Welcome to our show.
00:04:09
Speaker
We're so glad to have you here today.
00:04:11
Speaker
Oh, it's my privilege.
00:04:12
Speaker
Thank you so much for the invitation.
00:04:13
Speaker
Yeah, so tell us a little bit about how you got your start.
00:04:18
Speaker
How did you get to where you are today?
00:04:20
Speaker
Of course, with a little bit of audio description.
00:04:22
Speaker
My name is Kemal Gure.
00:04:23
Speaker
He, him, brown hairs with grays in it.
00:04:26
Speaker
And I have fancy glasses.
00:04:28
Speaker
I identify as blind and a professional video composer, as you mentioned in your brilliant introduction.
00:04:35
Speaker
So being a musician, as you know, it's always a passion.
00:04:40
Speaker
You can't run away.
00:04:42
Speaker
So if you fell in love with this...
00:04:46
Speaker
a chaotic, nightmare-style profession.
00:04:49
Speaker
There's no way out.
00:04:53
Speaker
And chaotic is a perfect word for it.
00:04:56
Speaker
Yeah, it's like a toxic relationship, right?
00:04:59
Speaker
You always feel into... You always want to play with your instruments, always work harder and harder, keep writing music, and there's nothing else you want to do, and you feel really, how can I say...
00:05:14
Speaker
tired and even more tired but there's no way out it's yes it's it's all being musicians so everybody knows about that i don't know if in istanbul they use the phrase burnout but i don't know if you're familiar with the word burnout but that's pretty much describes the yes the tired aspect of it we are the term burnout so but anyway please continue yeah yeah of course
00:05:39
Speaker
So, you know, I have a classical training, so classical training can be really limiting time
Challenges in Music Education
00:05:47
Speaker
to time.
00:05:47
Speaker
In my country, our school, our educational, when it comes to music, still follows the 19th century traditions, the conservatory traditions.
00:05:59
Speaker
which I found quite limiting.
00:06:00
Speaker
So I've always wanted to be a media composer.
00:06:04
Speaker
I want to always score music for films because the music as a visually impaired individual, music has always been my trusted guy because, you know, it was 90s when I was a child.
00:06:17
Speaker
I'm a little bit old, 35.
00:06:18
Speaker
I don't know.
00:06:22
Speaker
35 is young, but go ahead.
00:06:23
Speaker
Yes, it's all perspective.
00:06:24
Speaker
Thank you.
00:06:25
Speaker
Thank you.
00:06:26
Speaker
It's very kind of you.
00:06:27
Speaker
In the 90s, TV screens are not that big and the resolution was like a joke.
00:06:33
Speaker
You know, we don't have the Blu-ray players and 4K screens in that time.
00:06:38
Speaker
And it was hard to catch all micro gestures, mimics.
00:06:43
Speaker
So maybe there's something going on, background, that foreshadows the upcoming thing in this story.
00:06:49
Speaker
But it's hard to see from a 15-inch CRT screen.
00:06:55
Speaker
So sorry, I'm a nerd.
00:06:57
Speaker
Music were always there for me to...
00:07:02
Speaker
make me understand what will happen next because score can tell you that micro gestures, that transitions, that's the importance of the score.
00:07:15
Speaker
It translates the story with music in a sonic way.
00:07:20
Speaker
So those childhood years, I decided that I want to be a film composer because I want to do that by myself.
00:07:28
Speaker
I want to be one who translates that story to the sonic area.
00:07:34
Speaker
It's really interesting for me.
00:07:35
Speaker
So it was really interesting for me and I want to make it my career.
00:07:38
Speaker
But, you know, life is life.
00:07:40
Speaker
We always find something else to do until we find the thing that we always want to do.
00:07:49
Speaker
It took a while for me, but yeah, actually...
00:07:53
Speaker
Let's skip the ghostwriting part because it's another story for a rainy day, let's say.
00:07:59
Speaker
But I can say that as a media composer, my real professional journey in the American territory started with Table Artists Foundation in 2020 with that award.
00:08:12
Speaker
Because I was sitting in my studio, just like I always do, searching different softwares, plugins, as a respected nerd.
00:08:23
Speaker
I have to do those stuff on a daily basis.
Community and Breakthroughs
00:08:25
Speaker
And I found a video on YouTube recorded and published by Steven Lettness, who is the founder and executive director of the Abel Artists Foundation.
00:08:34
Speaker
And he basically said, and I quote, Hello, my name is Steven Lettness.
00:08:39
Speaker
I'm a media composer and I have a visual disability called retinitis pigmentosa.
00:08:43
Speaker
It was a real watershed moment.
00:08:47
Speaker
for me because now i realize that a guy in istanbul i realize that there are some media composers in the united states who has similar conditions that i have i'm not alone so i'm not the only instance of my species so right and i so it's the first time you realized yeah somebody else was relating to you and you were relating to them and you had that connection
00:09:11
Speaker
That was really important because until that, I was thinking to be a library music composer.
00:09:18
Speaker
I've been thinking to send my music to the publishing companies.
00:09:22
Speaker
They don't have to meet with me.
00:09:23
Speaker
They don't have to judge me anyway because prejudism is a real thing and ableism as we both know.
00:09:30
Speaker
Right, right, right.
00:09:32
Speaker
At that very moment, I realized that, okay, I don't have to hide anymore because as an individual with disability in early ages of our lives, we...
00:09:41
Speaker
First thing that we learn how to hide ourselves.
00:09:44
Speaker
And we spend a lifetime to get rid of that behavior, that attitude, that talent, that skill set from ourselves.
00:09:55
Speaker
And at that very moment, I realized that, okay, I'm not alone, so I don't have to hide anymore because there are some well-established, successful composers out there who are even running foundations in the States.
00:10:07
Speaker
So I've done two things that I have never done in my life.
00:10:12
Speaker
I applied to a foundation to be a member and two, I submit my track for the first time to a competition.
00:10:20
Speaker
That's, I have never done that before.
00:10:22
Speaker
As a perfectionist, as a classical trained musician, we never be able to finish our works because they are never perfect.
00:10:29
Speaker
So that's another wrong attitude that we have to get rid of.
00:10:33
Speaker
So a couple of months later, I named as a grand prize winner.
00:10:37
Speaker
I met with Steve.
00:10:39
Speaker
And the Able Artist Foundation maintains some connections with the publishers.
00:10:44
Speaker
was able to connect with a publishing company called Hitless Music.
00:10:48
Speaker
I released a couple of music packs with them.
00:10:50
Speaker
I participated projects with Able Artist Foundation in next years.
00:10:56
Speaker
And then Steve offered me a job in the documentary called Surpassing Side, as you said, but it was the first project that I was able to work with Steve.
00:11:06
Speaker
And hopefully, and I would like to think that way, I wasn't a train wreck for him.
00:11:12
Speaker
Say that again.
00:11:15
Speaker
I wasn't a train wreck for him, hopefully.
00:11:18
Speaker
I'll owe you that you weren't.
00:11:20
Speaker
Always I'm not.
00:11:22
Speaker
So we worked more projects.
00:11:25
Speaker
I worked as a project lead for different Able Artists Foundation projects.
00:11:29
Speaker
So Kamal, I think that, sorry to, I hope it's okay.
00:11:33
Speaker
Of course.
00:11:34
Speaker
So it sounds like in 2020, that's when things kind of shifted for you.
00:11:39
Speaker
And I think I remember reading something about, what was it you said?
00:11:43
Speaker
It was really, it was touching for me.
00:11:45
Speaker
It really struck a chord, as I say.
00:11:48
Speaker
It was after, I think I was listening to a short clip of you speaking and, you know, you were talking about this specific win, you know, you said I was the grand prize winner of the AAF and
00:11:57
Speaker
And you described it afterward as, you know, that it was a magic moment.
00:12:02
Speaker
You said, oh, it was a magic moment for me.
00:12:04
Speaker
And I remember that I thought, now the color of things has changed for my career.
00:12:10
Speaker
And that made me smile with you, you know, because I understand that sense of achievement, you know, especially as a disabled composer.
00:12:17
Speaker
And I was imagining that this moment led for you now in 2020, you know, more doors opened for you, right?
00:12:24
Speaker
And then I realized, oh, that's when you also became the, what was it?
00:12:30
Speaker
You were on the board of an organization called Ramped, right?
00:12:33
Speaker
Which is a disability organization for professional music and entertainment professionals.
00:12:38
Speaker
Do you want to...
00:12:40
Speaker
share a little bit about... Of course.
00:12:42
Speaker
Of course.
Advocacy and Accessibility Issues
00:12:44
Speaker
RAMPT is recording artists and music professionals with disabilities.
00:12:48
Speaker
That organization is the only organization in American territory that works for the payment equality, visibility equality and inclusivity equality for the disabled musicians and the music industry professionals with disabilities also.
00:13:01
Speaker
And I became a professional member last year.
00:13:04
Speaker
There are a couple of tiers in the ramped territory.
00:13:08
Speaker
You can be a community member, anybody can.
00:13:11
Speaker
But if you want to be a pro member, you basically...
00:13:15
Speaker
submit an application you create a profile in our website then our membership committee review your application and if you there are a couple of criterias that i am really don't want to get in to that right now because i'm not in the membership committee but if they if they likes what they see then you become a pro member and i became a pro member last year and um i when you become a pro member you have a couple of
00:13:42
Speaker
things that you can, for example, you can be a part of subcommittees.
00:13:45
Speaker
Like I jumped into a PR committee.
00:13:48
Speaker
Oh, subcommittees, right.
00:13:50
Speaker
Yeah, committees.
00:13:50
Speaker
Sorry for my accent.
00:13:52
Speaker
Be merciful!
00:13:53
Speaker
It's perfect.
00:13:54
Speaker
It's perfect.
00:13:55
Speaker
Thank you.
00:13:57
Speaker
I jumped into PR committee.
00:13:58
Speaker
We developed many projects at RAMP to increase the visibility of music professionals with disabilities.
00:14:06
Speaker
And this September, I became one of the members of the leadership.
00:14:14
Speaker
Now I'm the secretary at RAND, which is quite a big honor and privilege for me because now I'm speaking up for my community, for my fellow musicians with disabilities, fellow composers with disabilities.
00:14:27
Speaker
And I'm in the decision-making process and it's really important.
00:14:32
Speaker
You cannot be a great musician.
00:14:35
Speaker
it's never been enough.
00:14:37
Speaker
If you want to change the industry, it's really important that picking up for ourselves, being in the decision-making processes, be the part of change.
00:14:47
Speaker
And thanks to RAMPT and thanks to Able Artist Foundation, we will come to that again, hopefully, in this conversation.
00:14:53
Speaker
Now I'm in the heart of it, heart of the decision-making process for the music professionals with disabilities.
00:15:01
Speaker
It's really a unique privilege for me and for my career.
00:15:05
Speaker
It sounds so empowering.
00:15:07
Speaker
And I think it's, wow, really just an incredible time, you know, to finally have access to all of these resources for disabled artists.
00:15:14
Speaker
I think it's, it's, you know, finally, finally, I think, you know, we're sort of making, you know, kind of, we're showing our, our light, you know, you had mentioned the word ghost, ghost writing, right?
00:15:24
Speaker
Yeah.
00:15:25
Speaker
Is that, you know, like usually we're kind of in the background and I think it's really, really special that, you know, we're in the forefront.
00:15:31
Speaker
It's beautiful to hear that you've taken that, that position.
00:15:34
Speaker
You know, Kamal, I was reading also that, because you're from Istanbul, right?
00:15:39
Speaker
And I was reading that, you know, disability access there is also like a little bit challenging, maybe due to the results of the long history, maybe of also the city, the topography, right?
00:15:52
Speaker
The cobblestone streets and the current building codes, they haven't been updated.
00:15:57
Speaker
I mean, how is it for you, you know, navigating there?
00:16:02
Speaker
Has it been difficult?
00:16:03
Speaker
Yeah, actually having an ancient city is not an excuse.
00:16:07
Speaker
First of all, I would like to make that statement because London is also pretty old.
00:16:11
Speaker
Paris is also pretty old.
00:16:13
Speaker
I'd never been to Paris actually by myself.
00:16:15
Speaker
But yes, Istanbul is a city that has memories of a couple of thousands of years.
00:16:23
Speaker
So yeah, it's...
00:16:24
Speaker
It's a thing, but it can't be an excuse when it comes to accessibility.
00:16:29
Speaker
So it's all about design.
00:16:31
Speaker
You can find workarounds.
00:16:33
Speaker
However, that's the thing that my good people of my country still should do their homework and they're still lacking to do their homework.
00:16:42
Speaker
But they will do that at some point.
00:16:44
Speaker
Never happen in a night.
00:16:46
Speaker
It's all about a mindset, shifting your mindset and shifting methodology.
00:16:51
Speaker
Because I think when...
00:16:54
Speaker
One of my friends from Germany said that when she sees, when she saw Istanbul for the first time, she told me that, okay, they designed that city without taking under consideration three parts of the society, children, elderly citizens, and the disabled citizens.
00:17:15
Speaker
Wow, wow, wow.
00:17:17
Speaker
They left a huge chunk out.
00:17:19
Speaker
Of course.
00:17:21
Speaker
Because as my dear colleague and friend Lachi, CEO and founder of the Ramped told in her TED talk, I guess,
00:17:33
Speaker
Yes, venues are inaccessible.
00:17:36
Speaker
I'm not superhero.
00:17:37
Speaker
I'm just trying to survive in an inaccessible venue.
00:17:40
Speaker
And I'm not strong.
00:17:42
Speaker
I'm not superhero.
00:17:43
Speaker
But you know what?
00:17:44
Speaker
You become elderly and you have to deal with these inaccessible venues by yourself.
00:17:49
Speaker
Then you become superheroes or really strong people.
00:17:55
Speaker
Because at some point we all need that accessibility.
00:17:59
Speaker
It's not about being disabled, being a child, being elderly, being different, being
00:18:05
Speaker
A or B or C. It's all about accessibility.
00:18:08
Speaker
If we limit access, for example, if we stop translating books or academic papers to different languages, then only people will have access to that papers and books that the people only knows that particular languages.
00:18:26
Speaker
For example, an academician from Germany won't be able to read a paper written in Hong Kong in Mandarin Chinese, let's say.
00:18:36
Speaker
But the German academic can read that essay because someone translating it or the technology helps us to translate that essay.
00:18:46
Speaker
Even the speech, thanks to recent AI improvement.
00:18:50
Speaker
Yes, yes, yes.
00:18:52
Speaker
In that regard,
00:18:58
Speaker
translation is also a matter of accessibility, is also a tool of accessibility.
00:19:03
Speaker
So it's so crucial and it stands, it sits center of our lives.
00:19:09
Speaker
Without accessibility, none of us will able to survive.
00:19:13
Speaker
The thing is, as a disabled, as a people with disabilities, we know how to survive in an unfriendly environment.
00:19:22
Speaker
That makes us different than the others.
00:19:26
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I think what you're trying to say is that disability access, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, disability access isn't just about disability, or access, it's really should be for everybody.
Early Influences and Education Aspirations
00:19:39
Speaker
You know that everybody has, everybody should have access to it.
00:19:42
Speaker
It isn't just about disabled people needing, needing access.
00:19:47
Speaker
Yeah, completely.
00:19:49
Speaker
I just published an article.
00:19:51
Speaker
Right, it's so true.
00:19:52
Speaker
People don't hear it enough.
00:19:54
Speaker
Of course.
00:19:55
Speaker
Sorry, you were saying that you published an article?
00:19:57
Speaker
No worries.
00:19:57
Speaker
I just published an article at RAMP's website.
00:20:00
Speaker
I basically argued that what if, we all know Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart, the genius composer of the Western art music of the 18th century.
00:20:11
Speaker
He is a game changer.
00:20:13
Speaker
He died when he was 38 and he composed his first music when he was five.
00:20:22
Speaker
In these 33 years, he composed 696 pieces of music in his catalogue.
00:20:31
Speaker
operas, symphonies, concertos and more.
00:20:34
Speaker
But what if Mozart's father was not a musician, but a soldier or blacksmith?
00:20:40
Speaker
Then do you think Mozart will be able to be a successful composer in 18th century?
00:20:48
Speaker
I don't think so.
00:20:49
Speaker
Because he accomplished to be a composer, he had access.
00:20:55
Speaker
to the correct networks, to the instruments, to the tools that he needed and a supportive family who also are musicians.
00:21:03
Speaker
So that accessibility, that accessible environment made Amadeus Mozart.
00:21:13
Speaker
Speaking of classical music, do you have any particular early musical influences that helped shape your music taste today?
00:21:23
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:24
Speaker
Is there anything now that, you know, sort of really warms your heart or inspires you when you're writing film score?
00:21:32
Speaker
Yeah, well, it depends.
00:21:33
Speaker
For example, if I'm writing down something, not music, but like, let's say an article or something, Mozart is my guy, let's say Mozart.
00:21:43
Speaker
It's a scientific matter that Mozart's music can help you focus your concentration, really.
00:21:51
Speaker
The music of Mozart...
00:21:53
Speaker
really helps to elevate your level of your concentration.
00:21:57
Speaker
It's a scientific fact that proved in different examinations, I guess.
00:22:02
Speaker
Are you saying it's sort of like you also use it for meditative purposes to help you focus?
00:22:08
Speaker
Of course, but when it comes to music, it really depends what I'm scoring at that particular moment.
00:22:13
Speaker
But I can say that I'm in love with Tchaikovsky, of course, Beethoven in the classical, Gustav Holst, as all film composers do,
00:22:22
Speaker
And there's no way out to be fell in love with Dvorak.
00:22:27
Speaker
I think it's Dvorak, Dvorak in American accent, George Finn, and also my personal favorite, Rimsky, Korsakov.
00:22:35
Speaker
I'm really in love with the late romantic Russian composers from Tchaikovsky to the Korsakov.
00:22:45
Speaker
And yeah, I've been...
00:22:47
Speaker
And I forgot one of the names, sorry.
00:22:49
Speaker
I'm struggling with the name.
00:22:50
Speaker
Oh, no, no, no, it's okay.
00:22:51
Speaker
Maybe it'll come back to you as, you know, we can come back around to it.
00:22:54
Speaker
But it sounds like, yeah, for the most part, you really do stay deeply connected to more of the classical pieces.
00:23:02
Speaker
But, you know, I was listening to some of your beautiful, beautiful pieces.
00:23:07
Speaker
One of them had many string sounds and I loved the tempo and the sort of increments of some of the tempos that I was listening to.
00:23:14
Speaker
And, you know, it reminded me also of maybe some more, um,
00:23:17
Speaker
I don't know, like contemporary, like maybe I forget the names myself, but maybe am I saying it right?
00:23:24
Speaker
Danny?
00:23:25
Speaker
Is it Danny Elfman or Philip Glass?
00:23:28
Speaker
You know, the sort of a little bit of those elements and some of the I forget that one of the pieces, maybe the ancient was an ancient dance.
00:23:35
Speaker
But anyway, it was really, yeah, really beautiful.
00:23:38
Speaker
I mean, you know, maybe I should say maybe would you like to share a clip?
00:23:42
Speaker
And if you would like to share a clip, you know, which one would it would it be?
00:23:46
Speaker
Ah, actually, please, please accept my apologies.
00:23:52
Speaker
As a composer, I always forgot names of my tracks.
00:23:56
Speaker
That's right.
00:23:57
Speaker
Yeah, because it's always start like 1M01 and ends like 2M50, version 15, conform to something.
00:24:05
Speaker
Oh my gosh, right, right.
00:24:06
Speaker
It's a bit dizzying.
00:24:07
Speaker
Yeah, or for example, you put a name for a track and the publisher changed the entire names of the album and all the tracks in it.
00:24:16
Speaker
So practically, I always keep forgetting the names of the tracks.
00:24:22
Speaker
I always check back my database or my BMI account catalog.
00:24:27
Speaker
But I think I understand which song you're talking about.
00:24:31
Speaker
Maybe we can put a clip.
00:24:33
Speaker
But as a composer, I always in love with the old famous film composers like Danny Elfman, of course, John Williams, Harry Gregson Williams, Hans Zimmer, to Bear McCroney, my personal favorite, because they are all very brilliant, extremely talented, extraordinary, remarkable composers that...
00:24:55
Speaker
There's no way out.
00:24:55
Speaker
You always, when you start listening to any of those composers' music, you basically fell in love with those.
00:25:01
Speaker
Yeah.
00:25:03
Speaker
So we're going to listen to a clip from one of your songs.
00:25:06
Speaker
So here's a clip.
00:26:34
Speaker
I know that our listeners would like to hear about the arts education that you received.
00:26:39
Speaker
Would you like to share a little bit about, you know, where you got your training?
00:26:43
Speaker
Yeah, of course.
00:26:44
Speaker
I trained in Istanbul, Turkey.
00:26:47
Speaker
As a side note, I always wondering to be a student in Berkeley School of Medicine.
00:26:54
Speaker
If anyone's listening out there, Dr. Rhoda, Daniel, you know.
00:26:59
Speaker
Yeah, you know, it was a child.
00:27:01
Speaker
Berkeley, one of the world's famous music schools, and it's really famous in Turkey.
00:27:05
Speaker
I never managed to submit an application to Berkeley when I find an opportunity to be part of a podcast in Berkeley school.
00:27:14
Speaker
So I jumped to that idea because... That's fantastic.
00:27:17
Speaker
You never know.
00:27:18
Speaker
It's never too late.
00:27:19
Speaker
Yeah, never too late.
00:27:21
Speaker
I was really close in high school years, but life has other plans for me, unfortunately, but I still have plans because there's a lot of now there's postgraduate programs.
00:27:31
Speaker
Some of them are online and who knows?
00:27:35
Speaker
Yeah, yeah.
00:27:35
Speaker
You know, it's really incredible.
00:27:37
Speaker
I find also, you know, after, during COVID, you know, ever since the whole virtual classes and the programs and fellowships, it seems that we have more accessibility, especially for...
00:27:50
Speaker
people with disabilities.
00:27:52
Speaker
And I've found that this has helped me too, you know, to be on virtual even right now.
00:27:56
Speaker
So I do see that there's hope, you know, and it inspires me to know that there are much more programs that we can access at any age, you know, whether it be academics or podcasts like this.
00:28:08
Speaker
So it's really, it's really incredible.
00:28:09
Speaker
Yeah.
00:28:10
Speaker
What you say is really important because, because you asked the question about my training in Turkey and
00:28:16
Speaker
Having a level of education in Turkey with disabilities is a really unique challenge.
00:28:24
Speaker
A decade ago, it was even more challenging because, for example, some respected schools
00:28:33
Speaker
weren't accepting or not accepting students with disabilities.
00:28:38
Speaker
They can't do normally, it's against the law, but in the fine art faculties or school of music, because they can accept or deny you with an interview, they use that power to deny each student with disabilities, and I was one of those decades ago.
00:28:57
Speaker
So
00:28:59
Speaker
Even though I was able to be accepted by the most respected, most famous schools in Turkey, I had to go to a mid-level school in the other side of my country because their policy is suitable.
00:29:13
Speaker
But for example, when I want to arrange some one-on-ones with the different academics from different schools in like in United Kingdom or United States, I've learned that the, that way I've learned that the accessibility in training is taken more seriously by those countries and institutes.
00:29:33
Speaker
So online technologies, internet technologies are really important to provide that accessibility.
00:29:39
Speaker
But at some point, all schools have to also shift their attitudes and make their campuses accessible.
00:29:46
Speaker
I know that in American territory, the campuses are already way accessible than I used to, but I know there's
00:29:55
Speaker
It's not like 100% perfect, but it can be.
00:29:58
Speaker
And it really warms my heart that schools, institutes, universities are willing to
00:30:06
Speaker
Be accommodating.
00:30:07
Speaker
Be accommodating and be more accessible, be improved.
00:30:10
Speaker
It really warms my heart.
00:30:12
Speaker
I met many friends and colleagues who graduated from Berkeley from different universities, post-grad, post-grad programs.
00:30:21
Speaker
With disabilities, it's really important.
00:30:23
Speaker
Also, it's kind of democratic, you know, because coming to another, traveling to another country with a disability, let's say if you're a wheelchair user, if you have a guide dog like me, like I have,
00:30:35
Speaker
can be challenging not that challenging but it has all challenges an online option can provide something else because now we with that option we can have more talented musicians more talented professionals in different areas because because they don't have to travel they can decide to apply that program online so they can
00:30:59
Speaker
educate themselves, they can get their degree and they can be a more productive and respectful member of the society.
00:31:06
Speaker
It's really important.
00:31:07
Speaker
It's all access to education here.
00:31:11
Speaker
Providing options.
00:31:13
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's incredible.
00:31:15
Speaker
You know, like you said, the work that you're doing, you're really at the forefront of, you know, and also witnessing the changes happening.
00:31:23
Speaker
And, you know, you're so such a huge, a huge part of that is really it's inspiring.
00:31:30
Speaker
Sorry, hold on one second.
00:31:32
Speaker
I just lost my spot.
00:31:33
Speaker
And I wanted to ask you something because you had mentioned something about your, oh, that you have a guide dog.
00:31:38
Speaker
Yeah.
00:31:39
Speaker
And I thought, oh, wow, you know, how long have you had your guide dog?
00:31:44
Speaker
And does your dog listen to some of the music you compose?
00:31:48
Speaker
You know, does he have any input?
00:31:51
Speaker
Let's share some of his opinions with you.
00:31:54
Speaker
Actually, first, she's a lady.
00:31:56
Speaker
Oh, she?
00:31:57
Speaker
Oh, pardon me.
00:32:00
Speaker
She's name is Bulut.
00:32:01
Speaker
Bulut means cloud in English.
00:32:04
Speaker
So because she looks like a cloud.
00:32:10
Speaker
And she's a real drama queen, by the way.
00:32:14
Speaker
She's a Scorpio.
00:32:15
Speaker
I think she tells a lot.
00:32:19
Speaker
Just kidding.
00:32:22
Speaker
She is the seventh guide dog in DUTU in Turkey.
00:32:28
Speaker
The program is pretty new in Turkey.
00:32:30
Speaker
I'm sorry.
00:32:31
Speaker
Wait, did you say the seventh, only the seventh guide dog in Turkey?
00:32:35
Speaker
Yeah, we have nine guide dogs in total right now.
00:32:39
Speaker
And she is the seventh.
00:32:40
Speaker
The program is a decade long because the program is pretty young, pretty new, but they're working hard.
00:32:47
Speaker
That's incredible.
00:32:49
Speaker
Yeah, we have been together for three years.
00:32:53
Speaker
Having a guide dog in Turkey has its own challenges.
00:32:56
Speaker
We all are acting like ambassadors in Turkey because...
Life with a Guide Dog
00:33:01
Speaker
We are the ones who are telling what a guide dog is, what a service animal is to the Turkish fellows, let's say.
00:33:07
Speaker
Last year, we traveled to the United States for a couple of months.
00:33:10
Speaker
It was a great relief for my guide dog.
00:33:14
Speaker
It was her vacation, not mine.
00:33:16
Speaker
You know, everybody has a fundamental understanding and
00:33:21
Speaker
awareness about service animals we were in Los Angeles for four months last year and it was a great experience we went to concerts and everywhere with my lovely guy Bluth so it was fun we're educating people we're introducing the service animal concept to them and they're learning not that bad somehow it can be harsh but they are learning I'm glad that we're making progress there
00:33:48
Speaker
Yeah, no, that's really wonderful.
00:33:51
Speaker
I didn't know that there were such a limited amount of guide dogs and that's such a new concept, only a decade long.
00:33:57
Speaker
So that's really, really, really beautiful.
00:34:01
Speaker
And finally, might you have some advice you'd like to share with some of our younger disabled artists out there who might just be starting out?
Advice for Young Disabled Artists
00:34:10
Speaker
Ah, yeah.
00:34:12
Speaker
Let me try to combine with what I am doing at this very moment in late 2024.
00:34:17
Speaker
First and most important piece of advice that I can give my fellow future colleagues, let's say, or my fellow colleagues with disabilities, stop hiding.
00:34:29
Speaker
It's the most important, most crucial, and I know the hardest part.
00:34:33
Speaker
It's a hell of a task.
00:34:35
Speaker
to achieve.
00:34:36
Speaker
I know that.
00:34:37
Speaker
It's really hard to stop hiding, standing up and show yourself to the world, who you are, with your disability, with your amazing talent.
00:34:47
Speaker
But it's the most important part.
00:34:50
Speaker
Why?
00:34:50
Speaker
Because we all, on the face of the world, as a human being, although we always care, terrified from the unknown,
00:34:59
Speaker
Terrified by the unknown.
00:35:01
Speaker
We always need the colors, need the uniqueness.
00:35:05
Speaker
Otherwise, we all be same and there's no, there won't be a room for creativity, innovation, invention, anything.
00:35:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:35:14
Speaker
There was no room, there won't be any room for poetry, for novels or anything without colors, uniqueness, different challenges.
00:35:23
Speaker
These things make life interesting.
00:35:26
Speaker
So a disability is not a medical model, is not a charity model.
00:35:33
Speaker
It's a social model.
00:35:34
Speaker
It's our color.
00:35:35
Speaker
It's our uniqueness.
00:35:36
Speaker
So we have to show it.
00:35:38
Speaker
Like we all want to say,
00:35:40
Speaker
We all like to say at RAMT, we recognize this ability with the capital D. So it's your uniqueness.
00:35:47
Speaker
It's your way.
00:35:48
Speaker
Think Michael Petrogiani.
00:35:53
Speaker
Think Andrea Bocelli.
00:35:54
Speaker
Think Ludwig von Beethoven, who is the composer of the Ninth Symphony with hard of hearing.
00:36:03
Speaker
In the beginning of the 19th century,
00:36:08
Speaker
And they had accessibility instruments.
00:36:11
Speaker
He had accessibility instruments designed for himself to be able to continue his works after he composed Third Symphony.
00:36:24
Speaker
Also, there are many talents in jazz era, in EDM era, in all genres, in all different art forms.
00:36:34
Speaker
You will find creators with different disabilities, either visible or invisible.
00:36:40
Speaker
So please stop hiding.
00:36:42
Speaker
Then stop being shy about your accessibility needs.
00:36:47
Speaker
We have accessibility needs and we deserve them.
00:36:51
Speaker
So companies, schools, clients are obliged to provide that tools, that instruments to us.
00:37:01
Speaker
It's how we work.
00:37:03
Speaker
It's those tools are make us productive, make, make us, um, how can I say, uh, make productive and efficient.
00:37:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:37:14
Speaker
And that way we can show our talent that way we can create some brilliant stuff.
00:37:20
Speaker
No matter.
00:37:21
Speaker
I think.
00:37:22
Speaker
Sorry, sorry to interrupt.
00:37:24
Speaker
I just think it's so incredible what you're saying.
00:37:27
Speaker
And, um,
00:37:28
Speaker
Part two, I think, in asking what you need, asking for accommodations, I think, oh, it's such an important part to the part one of what you were saying in Stop Hiding.
00:37:44
Speaker
And I think those two parts, I see them slowly working together, as you say, in 2024 years.
00:37:52
Speaker
And, you know, soon to be 2025.
00:37:53
Speaker
And I feel like this is the shift, you know, even this podcast itself, right?
00:37:58
Speaker
That Berkeley.
00:37:59
Speaker
is allowing and, you know, I mean, offering is the word in such an incredible way to the mainstream right now, I think is so pivotal.
Innovation in Composition
00:38:11
Speaker
I have friends that who are giving lectures about how to use Logic Pro X without touching mouse or looking screen.
00:38:20
Speaker
I have friends who...
00:38:22
Speaker
giving lectures about, giving lessons about, teaching how to use, for example, it's a really film scoring or virtual composition nitty-gritty about how to use native instruments, complete control with accessibility features without using the computer screen.
00:38:41
Speaker
I have friends who are mixing engineers completely blind, or I know violin players, professional violin players with limb differences.
00:38:52
Speaker
So there's no way that things can stop us because if there's a problem, we can find, as human beings, we can find solutions.
00:39:02
Speaker
We can't fly.
00:39:02
Speaker
It's an obvious fact.
00:39:04
Speaker
It's a funny fact that we can't fly.
00:39:06
Speaker
Yeah, obviously we can't fly.
00:39:08
Speaker
So we invented something called aircraft.
00:39:12
Speaker
So we can fly around using a device.
00:39:15
Speaker
Aircrafts are some kind of accessibility device, accessibility instruments to solve a problem of ourselves, which is lack of flying by ourselves.
00:39:27
Speaker
Right.
00:39:28
Speaker
Yeah, it's so incredible the way you are also conveying the message to the public by
00:39:35
Speaker
You know, saying it's so simple, it's real, it should be so simplified, right?
00:39:40
Speaker
And yet it still isn't, but it should be so simplified in the way in which we should just be asking for what we need, right?
00:39:47
Speaker
It's really, really beautifully said.
00:39:50
Speaker
Of course.
00:39:51
Speaker
Of course, and the third part is the most important part.
00:39:54
Speaker
Because yes, we want to ask.
00:39:57
Speaker
And yes, it's simple, but we have to tell the people because we are the specialists.
00:40:04
Speaker
We are the architects of the future, of the future that we want to live in.
00:40:08
Speaker
We want to live.
00:40:08
Speaker
So we are the ones who are obliged to tell the story, express themselves and the
00:40:17
Speaker
increase the awareness of the society about the importance of accessibility.
Conclusion and Invitation to Follow Kemal's Work
00:40:24
Speaker
Because that way, I was a guy, a trained musician, a former ghostwriter, sitting in his home studio.
00:40:34
Speaker
Hiding.
00:40:35
Speaker
Hiding in his home studio, yeah.
00:40:39
Speaker
But now become a media composer who synced music tracks with the toy company Mattel,
00:40:48
Speaker
I sang music with the TV networks like Discovery and Cometa Central.
00:40:54
Speaker
I worked as an additional music writer in a documentary called Possibilities, directed by Bill Serene.
00:41:00
Speaker
Another feature movie that I can't share the name at this very moment because it's not completed yet.
00:41:07
Speaker
But it's all accomplished with two things.
00:41:13
Speaker
A foundation from 10,000 miles away
00:41:17
Speaker
And a gift from a dearest friend that made me compose a piece of music and submit to that competition organized by Able Artists Foundation four years ago.
00:41:29
Speaker
And this month I became the board member
00:41:34
Speaker
of the board of directors at Able Artists Foundation, because I decided to stand up myself.
00:41:41
Speaker
I decided to jump into each opportunity, each adventure that I can find a place for myself and share my music and my personality, my brand as a blind media composer to the rest of the world.
00:41:59
Speaker
Oh, wow.
00:42:00
Speaker
Kamal, you know, it's really been such a pleasure having you on our show.
00:42:06
Speaker
And, you know, you are a gift.
00:42:08
Speaker
You are a gift.
00:42:10
Speaker
And congratulations, you know, congratulations on being honored and being the grand prize winner in the Artist Able Foundation.
00:42:19
Speaker
Yeah.
00:42:21
Speaker
Thank you so much for making the time today to speak with us.
00:42:25
Speaker
Yeah, the pleasure is mine, Rifki.
00:42:27
Speaker
Thank you so much for inviting me to this brilliant podcast series.
00:42:31
Speaker
I really want to thank you to Berkeley for producing this brilliant podcast series.
00:42:37
Speaker
We need these places to communicate with each other, with the industry, with the world, with the fellow of talents who are not started to build their careers, their lives yet, but they are our future colleagues, future collaborators,
00:42:55
Speaker
Only thing that we need to do to connect with them.
00:42:59
Speaker
And thank you so much.
00:43:00
Speaker
Thank you.
00:43:01
Speaker
Thank you, Kamal.
00:43:02
Speaker
To follow more of Kamal's work, you can find them at www.KemalKemalGorey.com.
00:43:14
Speaker
Thank you all for tuning into the Able Voices podcast.
00:43:17
Speaker
Please do join us next time to hear the latest on these wonderful up and coming artists living with disabilities who are currently making incredible change and impact right now in the creative industry.
00:43:28
Speaker
And here is to looking towards a future where disability and arts culture is simply just part of the norm.
00:43:35
Speaker
My name is Rivki and we'll see you next time.
00:43:46
Speaker
Able Voices is a production of the Berkeley Institute for Accessible Arts Education, led by me, Dr. Rhoda Bernard, the founding managing director.
00:43:55
Speaker
It is produced by Daniel Martinez del Campo.
00:43:58
Speaker
The intro music is by Kai Levin, and our closing song is by Sebastian Batista.
00:44:03
Speaker
Kai and Sebastian are students in the arts education programs at the Berkeley Institute for Accessible Arts Education.
00:44:11
Speaker
If you would like to learn more about our work, find us online at berkeley.edu slash B-I-A-A-E or email us at B-I-A-A-E at berkeley, that's L-E-E dot E-D-U.