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Unveiling the Secrets of Le Normand with Hazel of Hex Tarot
464 Plays1 month ago
Welcome to The Bell Witch Podcast- "Witching in the 21st Century"
Happy New Year!
In this 49th episode of The Bell Witch Podcast, the host Swailes welcomes Hazel, also known as Hex Tarot, a professional astrologer, tarot reader, and palm reader. They discuss Hazel's background in the occult, her experiences living in a caravan, and her creation of an oracle deck based on the historical "Le Normand" system. The conversation covers the differences between tarot and Le Normand readings, the importance of connecting with nature, and the use of multiple tarot decks to avoid repetitive messages. The host encourages listener engagement through ratings and reviews, and Hazel shares where listeners can find her work.
Check out HEX tarot at- https://hextarot.bigcartel.com/
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Transcript
Introduction to Beyond the Rainbow Podcast
00:00:08
Speaker
Whoa, there's Sparkle Farts, my trusty unicorn. I've gotta tell these good people about our show. Hey there, I'm CJ, host of Beyond the Rainbow, true crimes of the LGBTQ+.
Diversity in True Crime Stories
00:00:22
Speaker
While I do have episodes on some of the more well-known cases from the LGBTQ community, such as Matthew Shepard, Brandon Tina, and the Orlando Pulse nightclub massacre,
00:00:34
Speaker
I cover world cases, like the London nail bombing murders, Australia's Snowtown murders, in South Africa's corrective rape and murder of lesbians. I cover lesser-known cases, like the murder of 21-year-old trans man, Alex Van Dahlsen in Indiana.
00:00:53
Speaker
Police called his death a suicide.
Inclusivity and Community
00:00:56
Speaker
Spoiler alert, it wasn't. I tell you about wrongful conviction cases, serial killers, and school shooters. My unicorn and I cover all sorts of crimes against the LGBTQ and crimes by members of the LGBTQ. You don't have to be part of the community to listen.
00:01:16
Speaker
All walks of life are welcome to become Rainbow Warriors. Because you matter. And remember, it's not a crime to be gay. Unless you're a murderer.
Introduction to Belle Witch Podcast
00:01:34
Speaker
dark cast network bringing our indie podcasts out of the shadows
00:02:11
Speaker
Now then, witches are beautiful souls. Y'all listen to the Belle Witch podcast with me, Swales of Friendly Green Witch, the first official episode of 2025.
Creating Snow Magic on TikTok
00:02:24
Speaker
How awesome is it that we made it here? And life's getting nicely back to normal. I am desperate to get my kids back to school.
00:02:33
Speaker
The snow though, oh my gosh, the snow was harsh wasn't it? We can't function in this country when the snow comes down. Blighty just loses its mind I tell ya. So we had an extra day today chilling in the snow and I did a little bit of snow magic and I did a little snow magic video on the old TikTok.
00:02:53
Speaker
And I realised I should totally do a snow episode. All about snow related witchcraft, magic and all that jazz. Alice, I didn't get round to it and the day's nearly gone so I laughed at shelf that for next time it snows.
Growing the Podcast Audience
00:03:10
Speaker
It's funny on the old TikTok, I'm learning loads, but I did a video recently and it went about dealing with a candle in a spell, you know, that takes blooming ages and you end up just waiting for it to burn down. So I thought, oh, I'll just make a bit of a pillock video. And it did really well. It got over 4000 views. I guess a lot of you out there can absolutely relate.
00:03:33
Speaker
big ass hashtag witch problems. But yeah, if you're on the old TikTok thingy Bob, do give me a little follow and a cheeky little like won't you? I hope you enjoyed the last meditation of the elemental series. It's taken me just over a year to get all four out and as I was quite surprised by the first earth meditation and how well that did.
00:03:56
Speaker
Spared me on, really, to do a little set of four. So I hope you enjoy that and I hope it helped in the chaos of the festive season. And I just want to do a load more now. So if you have any ideas, please give me an email on the Belle Witch podcast at yahoo dot.com. It is a bit tumbleweed at the moment, but I'm putting that down to the festive season.
00:04:20
Speaker
Also looking for love through ratings and reviews especially on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. It's really stagnant over there, it'd be so great if I could get some reviews and ratings. Thank you please, help me grow by sharing, blogging, rating, reviewing, tweeting, reposting, all that really does.
00:04:44
Speaker
help not only the show to grow but for me to not lose confidence and keep on keeping on every single mention, every single review I get means so much to me and I'm so thankful for you listening right now.
London's Magical Market
00:05:00
Speaker
Have you heard about the Whimsy Gough Market in London? A brand spanking new market for the weird and magical. Held at Cecile Sharp House in Camden. A space created where individuality is celebrated and small businesses are supported. Where all subcultures can come together, feel safe, welcome and included.
Welcoming Patreon Supporters
00:05:22
Speaker
For more information on this magical event, visit
00:05:35
Speaker
Patreon is still there in the background. Add another little flurry of followers, which is brilliant. Big welcome to Anna Miller and Sayaban McKenna. Thank you so much for joining my tiered members. Also, welcome to Candice, the professional widow, Kathy Francis, Sarah LaMacabre, Sarah Wilder, Angela Izak.
00:06:00
Speaker
and Anna Howard. I apologise if I have butchered those names, you know, what my dyslexic bumps is like. Thank you so much for joining me here on the Belwich Podcast Patreon. Check out the recent subscriber only podcast episode which is audio omen days that I've just completed. If you're interested you can join for as little as £1.50 a month.
00:06:24
Speaker
All funds are ploughed straight back in to the show, mostly to subscription fees, but it just really helps with confidence to know that you value this podcast enough to throw me a little bit of ah coinage. So thank you very much.
Meet Hazel, Astrologer and Tarot Reader
00:06:39
Speaker
Without any further ado, I shall hit play on this first moot loot of 2025 with Hazel aka Hex Tarot.
00:06:49
Speaker
She's a fantastic astrologer, card reader and palm reader and has designed and published her very own oracle deck. Not a traditional oracle deck, an actual quite historic divination system that I can't say the name of. lam Lemonade is it? Lemonade. Lemonade.
00:07:12
Speaker
la norman
00:07:17
Speaker
Hello, Hazel. Welcome
Living Close to Nature
00:07:19
Speaker
to my little witchy podcast. Oh, this is amazing. Thank you for inviting me on. It's exciting. So happy to have you. I think a listener or two might have said you need to get hex on, you need to get hex on and talk about Tyrone Oracle and stuff. So I was like, oh yeah, but we're such busy witches. It takes a while.
00:07:36
Speaker
Yeah, it's true, we are, it's life, life in. Thank you to the listeners who suggested me. I always find it really funny that people actually listen to me rambling. Yeah, so that's cool. And I know, yeah, yeah I mean, your podcast is amazing, so it's cool to be here. Thanks, Whit. Do you want to tell us a little bit about yourself and what you do and your skills and all that jazz?
00:07:59
Speaker
Yeah, so I am a professional astrologer and tarot reader and I guess I've been in the occult field for about 20 years. I've been practicing magic forever since childhood. I've been cast in spells for about 30 years and in 2021 I brought out um my magical folklore Norman's deck.
00:08:25
Speaker
which if you're watching you can see me holding it up. So that's an oracle deck based on ah a divination system using cards and I'm a palm reader. Yeah and I guess a practitioner of magic. I am a witch but it's not my identity if you know what I mean. I'm a spiritual teacher.
00:08:44
Speaker
like a mentor. Yeah, I want people to go away feeling fired up with their own critical dialogue, confident in their own practice, inspired and excited. And that's my aim for everything that I do in terms of my teaching and my readings, the tools of empowerment. Ooh, nice, I like that.
00:09:06
Speaker
And you live in a caravan, do you? I do live in a caravan. I'm in my bedroom now because it's the it's got the most amount of furnishings. As you can maybe see, I'm a maximalist, so like a lot of things around me. And yeah, so I'm here to sit in my bedroom with my heart with my horse, the skull behind me, which I brought back from Greece. Found it found it in a field in Greece, which was fun. I just think that's so cool that you you live in a caravan. That's ace. Living the witchy dream life. Yeah, I mean I can tell you a bit about that and like how that's informed my practice because it definitely has. It's definitely changed my practice and my relationship with the land and healed me in a huge way which has been great.
00:09:52
Speaker
So I moved up here six years ago with the intention of it being a stopgap and I just loved it. I'd moved from a city to another city. A lot of my twenties I was studying a lot of occult practice and you know involved in a lot of different groups and go into a lot of lectures and I was practicing tarot professionally along with another job that I had and when I say professionally I mean I was taking paid clients okay so that's the notion of being a professional whatever it was part of my job and I was just like in discord constant discord with myself and my environment and the people in my life and I just
00:10:36
Speaker
felt deeply dissatisfied and that's because I was living in a state of disharmony for my true self because I mean I'm a country bumpkin really. I like the country life and I like the sky fundamentally. I like to be near to a place where I'm high up and I can see the sunset and I can see the sunrise and that has always been a huge part of my practice is the um cycles of the planets and I guess that's why I'm an astrologer now a professional astrologer. So moving up to the caravan was like suddenly I was at the full force of the elements and the interdimensional beings and the ghosts and the fog and the weather and
00:11:25
Speaker
the rhythm of the moon and the sun.
Evolving Witch Identity
00:11:29
Speaker
It's just magical you know on a morning sometimes I get the the moon setting during a full moon and the sunrise and they're like parallel in the sky and it's just so beautiful and humbling for the kind of hedge witchcraft and folk magic that I practice now.
00:11:48
Speaker
it's been really healing for my ego as well. You know as soon as you remove yourself from the close bustle of consumption which comes with living in a city and other people's energy and the expression of identity, as soon as you remove yourself from that and it becomes less important you you heal yeah You heal yourself like I've massively healed so much to do with my ego and it's changed my practice enormously from being essentially ego based occult practice into more gratitude based folk magic.
00:12:29
Speaker
She's why I am a witch. I definitely am a witch, but I don't have that as my identity anymore because my identity as a witch was ego driven. um I don't want to be ego driven anymore. I want to help people to live a better life. That's fundamentally why I'm a tarot reader. It's to help people make better choices. Yeah, living close to the land has helped me to prioritise that as a form of self-expression.
00:12:56
Speaker
I like it. I'm happy now. It's similar to camping a little bit because when I camp I feel so much more plugged in to the earth and you wake up with the sun straight away and outside, aren't you? And it yeah makes such a difference to your wellbeing. And we're all hiding as houses in winter with as blackout curtains and I find it so hard to get up. That's why because I still think it's night.
00:13:19
Speaker
The way I live is very different to ah how a lot of people live and it's not easy and it's not something that I will probably continue to do forever like it would be lovely to have a big Victorian house to put on my art prints and things in that biome you know warmth and stuff. I think everyone's just got their own circumstances that they're living through. What I realised at some point during my occult practice was that I like ordeals. I really, I love a good ordeal. I love to put myself through the ringers. um As I've become more mature with my practice and older, I've realised that intentionality is really important in magic and it's really important in witchcraft and any sort of spiritual practice. And so I like living here
00:14:12
Speaker
and experiencing the weather and experiencing the land because the ordeals which link me back to my ancestors, the ordeals which link me to the earth. So, you know, rather than the ordeals of modernity and, okay, let's say, you know, like when you're a teenager and you're... the politics of friendships or whatever. Rather than those kind of things it's really nice to like choose to be cold sometimes because that's the nature of how I live. It's not self-flagellating, it's just being able to experience things and I love that about being a physical being. I think it's so nice to like have that link between
00:14:58
Speaker
physicality and spirituality and it's something that that we do get that does get lost in translation and practice in Western culture because we do have this luxurious lifestyles of like high consumption and we aren't so much in rhythm with the land that sometimes we do we get bogged down in things that to other cultures, to other people in places where they are close to land, they don't matter so much. You know, like stress at work, for example. If your main stress is I'm freezing cold, it becomes much less of an issue if there's someone at work that you find annoying. I guess that's good for me.
00:15:41
Speaker
because I do fret sometimes so like having that, having the reality of the physical state of living in a caravan is great for my mental health and my practice as a witch as well. Is it a static card? Do you move it?
00:15:55
Speaker
No, it's static. But I do ah do move around a lot. So all right with my business as a tarot reader, very national. So I have got a trailer, actually. I've got a little shepherd's hook roundback trailer, and which I'm currently doing up. And that's going to be touring with me. So I do tour. But having been a single mum as well means that you can't I can't move as much as I'd like to. But one day, yeah, I'll probably just hit the road, not look back. That's an ambition. Oh, I love that. There's nothing better than cooking outside. I mean, that probably should get on to talking about something to do with witchcraft and the occult. But it's, I mean, it's called the Bell Witch podcast because I love to camp in a bell tent, so we're all right. Yeah, that's amazing. Set my tent up outside my caravan and often do, you know, from around sort of May
00:16:50
Speaker
until September. i'm I'm sleeping outside a lot of the time and it's awesome. sam And it it really aligned me with the stars.
Creating Lenormand Cards
00:16:59
Speaker
You know, I say obviously, but I guess not everyone's into astrology, but I've always been massively into astrology. But you know, over the last sort of six years, when I did my professional course, it was just being able to see the stars and see the cycles in the sky was profound for me. It was humbling. No, it's nice to see witches thrive. What would you like to know? What would your viewers like to know? I mean, I could talk a little bit about my Lenormand cards, if you like. They're very folk based. Yeah, because that's very exciting, isn't it?
00:17:33
Speaker
Yeah, it's lovely. So I employed a designer to make these cards to me called Romame and her company is called Romame Designs. She's an incredible, folky, magical artist.
00:17:48
Speaker
I actually did six years of art school, but I'm lazy. So I employed her because she was going to help me to get the job done. And she did such a lovely job of interpreting the briefs for me and everything. The thing about this stack of cards is it has visual links to my caravan and to the environment and the more which I live on.
00:18:12
Speaker
in a way we've sort of created this universe which is very close to our reality as north western dwellers and pagans and it's sort of like got one foot in the real world because it describes so like the the tree which is represents the physical body and the lawn arm and it's a silver birch tree and i live next to a silver birch woodland in my garden which is beautiful and Again, it's that link back to the rhythm of the land, the seasonal changes, living close to the signs and symbols and synchronicities which occur when you are you are living closer to nature. That's really what I wanted to communicate with this oracle deck.
00:18:59
Speaker
and also just in my practice generally, you know, that aspect of of humility that living near to nature gives you. So I could talk a little bit about what Lenormand is and where it came from. It's a bit more of an unknown sort of divination system in a way. As I said I've been practicing tarot for a long time so I've been probably working in professionally since before 2010 and definitely since 2012 is when i started doing big events and tarot has always been like a love for me it's been like a great romance and love affair and in fact i'm gonna i'll tell you how i got into tarot because it's quite funny before i start diving into the la normand i was watching the spy who loved me with my nana when i was about seven or eight and i
00:19:52
Speaker
was in her living room and there was a tarot reader and I was like wow she is sexy she is glamorous she is everything I want to be and she somehow had so much power over James Bond over all these like men like all this like wisdom and knowledge and like overt sexuality and I was like I want to be that woman and I just loved occult things you know I've always been like a witch natural sort of witch and my family a Catholic like you know friendly sort of Irish Catholic get drunk and party kind of people and so it was always like when I was a kid going to church was like really good fun because it was just ostentatious and there was like velvet everywhere and incense and old buildings and it was all very theatrical because I was arty and I like visual things and I'm on
00:20:46
Speaker
became an artist it was always like tarot was always the thing glamorous was so glamorous for me obviously that journey has as humbled somewhat ah you know it has to do with you become a practitioner but how i got into the lenormand was i was working at quite a prestigious occult bookshop as a tarot reader and my good friend and which mama, Karina, she told me about this system and I'd never heard about it before and she showed me how it worked and I don't know if any of you have ever read those books where it says if you want this to happen turn to page whatever and if you want this to happen roll a dice and choose the number and so it sort of takes you on a journey and you get to decide the path
00:21:38
Speaker
and it's a bit of a um it's a bit of a detective sort of idea of like you've got the choice and Lenormans a bit like that so the way you do the spreads is it's sort of like piecing together a story in a way and I just found it fascinating. It's much more literal than Tarot, it has a lot less occult connotations it has a lot less ego attached to it, it's much more say what you see and that was so difficult for me to negotiate at first because I've spent the whole my whole entire life is a as a tarot reader not exactly saying what I see but reinterpreting and
00:22:18
Speaker
multi-layering language and the Lenormand you just have to completely simplify it and I loved that. It was really good fun and really challenging and suddenly it was like a whole new system that I had to adopt. You know like the key in Lenormand literally means a key. So it either means a physical key or it's the key to a situation. It's the key to unlocking the answers. This is very, very literal. There's no other dimensions to it. Because I am a maximalist, however, in my deck,
00:22:51
Speaker
I have incorporated some other layers to it because I had to. The history of Le Normand is also very interesting because it was designed by a prophetess who came from a monastic life. She spent her early years in a monastery in France, in a nunnery in France during the 12th century.
00:23:12
Speaker
Her name was Marianne Lenormand and she was born in 1772. And because she was a prophetess, she didn't want to not align with the practices of the church and her spiritual beliefs, but the nuns recognised that she was gifted. She was a gifted speaker of prophecy and divine truth. And so she developed this system using whatever pictorial images she would pick up and felt relevant. So whether it was a postcard or a beer mat or whatever. And she read very literally and I guess the cards were a way to affirm the truth. So by that what I mean is when you're when you're doing tarot
00:23:57
Speaker
you're incorporating the multi-layered depths of what that particular card means and a lot of it is linked to the more spiritual practice of universal consciousness.
00:24:13
Speaker
but with the Lenormand it keeps everything very concise and very physical and down to earth and I think that's probably, I don't know, this is just me sort of expressing a notion here but that's probably how she got around practicing divination and still being part of her authentic religious practice as well which was probably Christian because otherwise it would have been, she would have probably been done for being a
Lenormand vs. Tarot
00:24:42
Speaker
witch.
00:24:42
Speaker
So yeah, that's why I like Le Normand. I like it because it's literal. I like it because it's simple. And if you start with something like oracle cards as well, or you started with Le Normand, I think it's a lot easier to learn. I found it very difficult to learn because I was so embedded in the idea that everything has to be layered and symbolic. It's almost like undoing years of practice actually, coming to Le Normand.
00:25:12
Speaker
and it's lovely because it feels like you're clearing the deck energetically it's just like a fresh start re remapping certain things in your brain certain symbols and having to be much less poetic and rococo with your like language and just like simplify everything which is sort of a thing. of is ah You know as I've said through this podcast this seems to be like a theme of my life at the moment to just simplify. I remember my mum having a deck actually I might still have it. There were tiny little cards with pictures and they had a little poem on everyone that mentioned what was in the picture and there was a book and it were like this book called Secrets you know you're gonna open it kind of thing.
00:25:54
Speaker
I remember she used to lay them down and then there's one that that represents you and the cards around it are the closest issues to you and then it goes out another ring. Is that how yours works? Is that how they generally work?
00:26:10
Speaker
Yeah absolutely. So they have the very ascribed meanings and they have a formula and you don't break from the formula basically. So ah the woman represents a woman or that energy, a physical person, the man represents a physical person, the child represents a physical person or something that requires taking care of. If you were reading for yourself or i was reading for me i would have like the woman card would represent me and then everything that's above is things which you've already experienced everything that's below is things which you need to deal with everything that's to the left is the past everything that's to the right is the future yeah it is incredibly literal the thing to do is to not overthink it if you have like say the ship
00:26:59
Speaker
a woman and the clover clovers represent good luck most of us know that it's sort of ingrained in our psyche and the ship a journey so you would have the woman would be going on a fortunate journey a journey of good luck you know so if you're planning the holiday that would be a green light like Yeah, it's lovely the way the the language is so simple. It's really effective. It's really accurate. um And the best way to use Lenormand is when you want an answer to a situation.
00:27:33
Speaker
so When I read for clients using tarot sometimes that I go in completely blind, I have no idea, they don't have a question, they just want to see, they just want to know something. And so through using the tarot, even the first card, I will know what the theme is and what the most important message they need to hear is the way I put it. And then we sort of read outwards from that. It will go from say practical to emotional to spiritual and it all interferes back into each other. Le Normand is very good at giving you a direct answer, similar to the way that people use the pendulum or the runes. It's much more direct, it's much less metaphysical.
00:28:21
Speaker
So I'll tell you a little bit about my hedge witch practice. So I am really into like quantum physics, I'm really into like interdimensional multiverse and creating universes. So like I love Tolkien because he's created a lu universe and RR, Martin, Game of Thrones and even like history, like I'm a massive history nerd. I love the Tudors and also Roman history. I love Roman and Greek mythology, Norse mythology.
00:28:54
Speaker
Because they're like their own mini-versus, they have like such quality of their own reality within them. And when I was creating my deck, that's fundamentally what I wanted. I wanted somewhere that was its own little metaverse and people could step into that through either reading the cards in a form of divination or through meditation or just through like visually enjoying the images which is also why I chose Roma May for the illustrator because her work feels like a world it's like each image is like very cushioned within itself it's rich you know the quality is rich it feels
00:29:39
Speaker
abundant and let you want to step into it and so weave in my life and my location through the cards and some of her life as well because of course she illustrated the deck it's its own universe and it's given it this rich tapestry to step into which is fun for me. And that's what I wanted.
Growth in Divination Practices
00:30:00
Speaker
And it sounds like a good starter deck, you know, if you want to learn about Divination and Oracle and Tarot and stuff, maybe a good port of call to start with this kind of deck. Absolutely. And you're making me want to get my mums out now. I'm going to root for all my stuff and try and find my mums because I haven't thought about it for years, actually. I do do Tarot a little bit for myself, but it it scares me because it is huge and I've got a terrible memory. I can't really do it that well.
00:30:27
Speaker
Much fur oracle. Yeah, I mean, oracles. I never ever thought that I would. I'm not an angel, angelic sort of person, reiki person. I mean, I'm all earth and water in my astrology. So I'm like, I'm a bug dweller, like a Hobbit-y bug dweller.
00:30:45
Speaker
um You know so the angels are like somewhere away they're way out of reach for me but I have to say like one of the best oracle decks that I've ever had is like some terrible tacky angel deck because the messages are just so obvious and they're so clear and you don't have to philosophize about it. The first ever professional tarot deck I got was the Arthurian tarot and I didn't really know anything about the King Arthur myths I think I was only like 13 when I got this deck. I did have a deck before that, which was from Sugar magazine. I don't know if you remember that magazine, but it's like a tea mix. Yes! Oh my god! I've still got the deck and you know they're worth a fortune now and they are so beautiful. I love it, it's just so 90s and like such a gorgeous deck. But yeah, the first proper deck I got was the Arthurian Tyrone, it was so confusing to learn, you had to learn all the mythology and I mean, it's a beautiful deck and I can use it very effectively now. But the numerology, the colours, the suits, the elements, when you first starting out, all of that stuff takes a lot of time to remember and learn and
00:31:57
Speaker
understand. So oracle decks are definitely the best decks to start out with if you're starting wanting to learn divination or just practicing for yourself. They're the easiest ones because they're the most literal and you can't really get it wrong you know with oracle decks.
00:32:13
Speaker
But like they are good fun, I mean the the thing that I like about the Normand is it's very real, like it doesn't sugarcoat anything, it just says it exactly how it is. A little bit like the Thoth deck, if anyone out there is into like Aleister Crowley and they do read Taram, the Thoth deck is a really amazing deck and it is very complex um and it is multi-layered.
00:32:37
Speaker
But it's quite brutalistic with the way it will communicate with giving you the answers. So it's it's like, it doesn't mince its words. It does not mince its words. But again, that's that's more of an advanced deck for people to be using for the tarot. But yeah, La Normand's lovely. La Normand is... It's interesting how the La Normand works for me as someone who has been practising for so long as a tarot reader. I'm just using the cards to like back up the themes of what I'm already perceiving. Sometimes I don't even really need the cards and I've found that when I've been reading with La Normand lately.
00:33:17
Speaker
The like Normans sometimes are, for me, they're like a source of channeling, could be other the pete you know people who've passed or universal messages to the clients. Again, they're always framed in a very practical way, but they are very direct.
00:33:36
Speaker
messages, which I think is probably how Marianne Lenormand would have done it, because she was a prophetess, that's why she developed this system. So she already had psychic abilities, you know, maybe she spoke to interdimensional beings, or, you know, people who've passed or whatever. So I guess that's how she would have done it. And I think that's how I'm using the deck at the moment as well.
00:33:59
Speaker
It's helping me to sift out all the occult stuff into just a that simple direct message that I'm channeling from someone else or something else, which is lovely. And do you combine it with your astrology knowledge as well?
00:34:16
Speaker
always so with tarot and the normand or any form of divination that i do i bring forward all of my knowledge and read holistically for everyone so sometimes when i'm doing astrology readings i will impart some knowledge about plant medicines i've spiritually worked with or herbalism or astrology you know or tarot so i often when i'm talking about tarot when i'm doing my youtube videos i will link certain astrological events to certain tarot cards to help anchor people. And it's not that people have to like follow my advice to like the degree or anything, but it's hard not to be holistic when you've been doing it for this long and incorporate yeah astrology into Ludlow Norman and the tarot as well. and
00:35:05
Speaker
events matter you know the weather matters and astrology is just like the weather time but bigger it's just energy but further away so on a bigger scale on a grander more theatrical scale so So if I was reading for you I would definitely be mentioning things about upcoming astrological events and sometimes I might ask or guess your astrology. It gives my clients more tools because that's what divination is, it's just a tool. When you first start out when you're a baby witch, I don't really like that term because it's degrading isn't it, but you know when you're new to occult practice
00:35:44
Speaker
What I found was divination for me was like the thirst for knowing and the thirst for power, and in some ways the thirst to satisfy my own ego, which is how I came to it through wanting power.
00:35:59
Speaker
to wanting to appear a certain way and be a certain way and identify as a certain thing which is cool you know that it's cool to have that at the beginning of doing anything you want to be fired up and you want to feel your ego raising and and feel that you know lust for it otherwise you're not going to continue on the journey with anything that you do so it's important to have that at the beginning but fundamentally As you get to know it better, anything that you do becomes more of a tool. And it's a tool that just should either make your life better or other people's lives better.
Astrology and Personal Empowerment
00:36:31
Speaker
That's how I how i really use tarot now. its It's a tool. It's just there. It's like the contrast between the fates and the gods. It's like the fates are like your birth chart and the gods are the transits. And within and among that you have free will. You know, when I give a reading,
00:36:50
Speaker
It's like, that's just what the fates are telling us and then we've got a total free will to move around that and to interpret that and to do that, what we will with that. Astrology is such a massive topic. It kind of scares me a little bit. I do sort of look into it and go, oh no, it's just too big. It's it's too big for my brain. I can't handle it.
00:37:11
Speaker
yeah it's massive so since like 2008 to probably when i had my son tarot was like my main focus of understanding and study it was my main focus of study in and among that there was other things but yeah i've really started getting into astrology in a big way and you never stop learning i mean i do professional courses yearly on astrology with very prestigious teachers and I like ah really work hard to like seek out teachers who are really well-knowledge and well-versed because I also teach things about astrology and so I want to give people the best knowledge and there's so much misunderstanding about all forms of divination and
00:37:57
Speaker
astrology that it's fatalistic in some way and that what you get is what you have and especially with palm reading people think that the lines on your hands once have read for you that's it and your lot's done and they fixate on having a short lifeline which actually could make your lifeline shorter because you know worry adheres on your hands, worry is visible on your hands. And it's the same with astrology, like it's just a tool to help us to be better people. That's primarily what all this stuff is. For me, it's what witchcraft is, it's what the occult should be, but it's not.
00:38:33
Speaker
really, you know, is to just, it's just knowledge that makes us nicer, that makes us kinder, that makes us more in tune with the earth. And that's what astrology is. So when we're having a difficult time and we know that is because it's been raining for eight months, you know, imagine what it's like when the solar flares, you know, that's interacting with our energy and the moon cycles are interacting with our energy. And it's like if we know that we can empower ourselves to make better choices, we can hibernate, we can be fundamentally just be kinder to ourselves by having more knowledge. That's the beauty of paganism, primarily. That's what pagans generally we try and do.
00:39:16
Speaker
try and be like better people hopefully to each other and to the earth yeah exactly the best thing you can do is if you are confused about it is to go and do a course or you know listen to an acclaimed broadcaster astrological or source your information get a foundation for it before you jump ahead and try and do your own research too much because it can get really muddy so a lot of people don't know but the best thing to do when you are looking at your star signs if you know if you're on youtube and you're you know you're you're wanting to know
00:39:54
Speaker
what's coming up for the next moon is to look at your ascendant sign that will be the most accurate and then your sun sign and then your moon sign and then any other placements you want to look for. Most people when they're looking at their zodiac or in the papers or whatever they look at the sun sign and the sun sign is your soul's expression. It's not necessarily the most practical that you're going to get with the astrological forecasts which I think is interesting.
00:40:21
Speaker
Yeah, it's vast. It is really vast, and but it's definitely a passion of mine. It's something which I will never stop learning now. I will always be evolving and developing through understanding, getting my head round it, learning about new things as well.
00:40:37
Speaker
astronomy moods on and grows and we learn more, we re-identify planets as asteroids and asteroids as planets and understand more about how the universe works. It's it's a fascinating subject. I mean even if you're getting back into like Hellenistic astrology which is like the original European astrology, they only used the like main heavenly bodies the closest to us so Jupiter, Mars, Venus,
00:41:06
Speaker
Saturn, Earth, the Sun and the Moon. and we didn't use that We didn't know about any of the outer planets and um it's proven. That's another reason I like it. There's thousands and thousands of years to back up our understanding of how Venus interacts with us in the Western Hemisphere. Same with palmistry, there's like thousands of years of research to ascribe the meanings that we do to certain lines on the hands and energetically and through our nervous system why that is applicable.
Astrology's Influence on Identity
00:41:40
Speaker
I asked what I love about it and that's what I love about Lilla Norman as well. It was developed by an expert and she knew what she was doing and she did it really effectively and the same with Taro. Taro's evolved through many facets and
00:41:54
Speaker
It's had many reincarnations but the fact that it's so multi-layered does give it some weight, it gives it some force behind it and I think that's lovely. And they're great things to learn when we are pagans or whatever mono or non-mono beliefs you have. Having that framework behind something is a great way to do things.
00:42:19
Speaker
It's like being an artist. You know, you can't really truly paint the way you want to paint until you know how you don't want to paint, until you know how to do the process. You know, as soon as you know the process, you can then step outside the box. I don't know when I was born like the time. So I always go, oh, I should get this graph done. And then they go, what time were you born? And I'm like, I don't know.
00:42:43
Speaker
Oh, that's an interesting one. So I can never get it done, no. Well, so the time gives you your ascendant and the ascendant is the most easterly constellation rising on the horizon at the point that you were born and the ascendant changes every two hours.
00:43:02
Speaker
There is ways that you can find out your Ascendant, that I as an astrologer could help you work that out. Because your Ascendant describes your initial personality. It's like the flame. It's the wrapping. It's... your sense of identity, your sense of self, how you dress, your personal tastes, how you want to be seen out in the world in many ways. So you can work it out you can work it out through the way people dress, through their vibe, through some somewhat their music tastes, whether they're a bit like me, indecisive and a bit dixie and a bit sort of like ah wing and everything, which is very Libra.
00:43:47
Speaker
some Libra Ascendant or whether you know you know you're like you're a Capricorn Ascendant and so you're super practical and you know you probably work with your hands and you're very grounded. and So there's there's ways you can work it out and also there's things which happen in your life. So key dates and times like say becoming a parent or moving cities or education, there's certain things that happen in our lives.
00:44:13
Speaker
which are key markers, which we can use as astrologers. The way we might work out your Ascendant is through things like eclipse cycles. So that's generally when big changes happen for people. So we would look at the rest of your chart and we would say, right, well, that thing happened to you, but the rest of the chart isn't describing that. So then we think about the Ascendant and which sign and which planets in your chart would be given an indicator that that could be your Ascendant.
00:44:42
Speaker
So there's like the long way around. Yeah, literally. Yeah. The same with Lenormand. Like you have to sort of track and work things out like an interpreter, you know, have to sort of be an interpreter and be a detective. And that's partly what astrology is. It's about being a detective. I'm Virgo Moon. Can you tell?
Organizational Skills in a Caravan
00:45:00
Speaker
You tell I've got a strong Virgo energy. Virgos are very analytical and like research, we're natural researchers, we like to compartmentalise things and put things in boxes and that's a really comfortable energy for me. I'm a massive Virgo. Are you really? So, you know, the struggle is real. Being a Virgo with ADHD is quite, and well, I'm only Virgo Moon, but being a Virgo Moon and Capital and some with ADHD is quite interesting because so the struggle to get things done and to compartmentalise.
00:45:33
Speaker
The other nice thing that's actually really good about living in a caravan is and order. You have to keep things very ordered living in a small space and that's really nice. there' that There's a place for every one of my hundred tarot decks to live, which is lovely. Yeah, yeah.
Choosing the Right Tarot Deck
00:45:52
Speaker
What's your favourite tarot deck? Out of your hundred.
00:45:58
Speaker
So at the moment, my favourite deck for everyday use is probably Pagan Otherworlds. Pagan Otherworlds deck is very simple, it's very muted, it's very beautiful, but Honestly, really, one of the best decks that will ever be ever is the Rider Waite, which is the Pamela Coleman Smith Inventor. We all know that deck. We recognise it. It's in popular culture. So it's just so well done. The Thoth deck, I love. There's just so many.
00:46:32
Speaker
too many to count. The thing that I like about when I'm out doing tarot readings, like when I'm doing big events, I often bring 10 decks with me and just have them out. Don't let people touch them. I used to let people shuffle them and choose their own cards and it was just a mess and a nightmare. You know, if you read them for 50 people on a Saturday, the last thing you want to do is to have everyone touching your deck of cards. It's not good.
00:46:58
Speaker
What I've found works for me is if i i get I like someone I'll sit down and then I'll get a vibe about what they're like and I'll pick a deck of cards which I feel would suit their energy because there's no point in reading for someone with a Rider Waite deck if they've got a preconception about that they're really afraid of getting the death card or that they think they know all about tarot and so they're trying to read the deck for you and that creates confusion and it stops me from being able to channel the information that I need to give to them so I use multiple decks that's why I've got so many but also obviously I just love having lots of decks
00:47:37
Speaker
original reason why I did start to use multiple decks when I do big events is because I had one deck of cards that I would use and by the end of the day everybody would have the same cards coming up. It didn't just happen one weekend, it happened at every event. The only explanation that I could give for that was energetically the cards were getting sticky. They were either messages from me, and it was something that I was meant to be hearing, or it was just quantum physics, you know, the string theory, that energy was just
00:48:20
Speaker
gravitating towards these several cards over and over and over again and so I started to use multiple decks in order for people to have cleaner energetic readings and that works really well so it's important or maybe I just tell myself it's important that I have a hundred decks or more. so But, you know, it's functional. It really is functional.
Engaging with Hazel's Work
00:48:43
Speaker
You know, you need the very variety because different decks of cards, they just have different ways of talking to you. They have different languages. They have different communication styles. They're a bit like people. Can you give yourself a little plug and tell us where we can find you and get this amazing new deck and all that jazz?
00:49:03
Speaker
Yeah, so I am hextarot.bigcartel.com and that's where you can buy all your readings from me. You can pre-order the second edition of my Le Normand deck. You can book your workshops with me and everything else. I'm also hex underscore tarot on Instagram and that's where I do post most of my content and you will get like weekly tarot forecasts and occult knowledge and things like that for me and insights into my life and you can communicate most easily with me at that point. I also have a YouTube channel called Astrology Talk and Tarot and I post all my astrology stuff so you will get your monthly forecasts, your moon forecasts, things like that so
00:49:54
Speaker
Yeah, I'm all over the place and I'm now I'm on here which is so cool. And when are we gonna get the podcast? and Because you sound like you could easily do one. I'm a technophobe. Oh yeah, oh it's dead good. When you get going it's like you're off. I love it but I could just see you doing your own podcast. I think it'd be amazing. Oh, well maybe I could have you on my show. It'd be great. Yeah, it'd be lovely.
00:50:26
Speaker
You have been listening to the Belle Witch Podcast. Witching in the 21st Century. Created with love and magic by me, Swales, the friendly green witch.
00:50:39
Speaker
Official podcast photographer is Beverly Thornton. Intro Music is by Jeff Harvey of Pixabay. The podcast is made on Wave Padmaster and distributed via Zencaster. If you have your own little witchy, spooky podcast, feel free to message me for a trailer swap. Fancy being a guest on the show? Or have you got a desired topic you'd like me to cover? Then please email me.
00:51:09
Speaker
on thebellwitchpodcastatyahoo.com. If you are enjoying the show, please leave me a review or a rating and follow The Bell Witch Podcast wherever you listen. It really does help the podcast to survive. Thank you so much for listening. Have a great day and stay magical, witches!
00:51:32
Speaker
and