Transcript
The Jobs Podcast: Hey folks, thanks for joining me on the jobs podcast. Today's guest was a police officer, law enforcement specialist for 25 years and now he is the US Director of Security and Safety for the Convoy of Hope, phenomenal organization. So welcome David, thanks for joining me today.
David: Hey, thanks for having me. I appreciate it.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, so let's just start off by giving us a little history about David and where you were born and and just kinda go from there.
David: Where I was born. Well, it's going back a while. So I was born in Brooklyn, New York. I spent most of my childhood on Long Island.
The Jobs Podcast: Oh.
David: I grew up on Long Island and on the eastern part of Long Island in the Shirley Mastic Beach area. And went to, after I graduated high school, I went to what we used to call the 13th grade. It was our community, our local community college. And so I went there for a year and then transferred to Evangel, then College Now University, which is here in Springfield, Springfield, Missouri.
The Jobs Podcast: What brought you all the way from from out there all the way to Springfield?
David: Yeah, I get that. I get asked that question a lot.
The Jobs Podcast: I bet.
David: there There was a connection. So my older sister to Evangel from there as well, but there was a connection between the church I was going to at the time and Evangel.
David: And so there was a lot of people that went to Evangel from my area. And so it made sense. I knew I wanted to get into law enforcement since high school. And I knew that, and I started taking criminal justice classes early on, but came to Evangel. And when I came to Evangel, they didn't have a criminal justice major my first year. They were working on building one. So my first year at Evangel, I was a sociology major.
David: And so, but I switched that over to my minor in my sophomore year. Well, it would actually, yeah, it would have been my sophomore year. They developed a criminal justice major.
David: So my class was like the first graduating criminal justice degree majors at Evangel.
The Jobs Podcast: Hmm. What was the early influence you said you wanted to be in law enforcement from an early age 12 or 13? I think you said, and what did you have relatives that were in that line of work? Or did you have a mentor or something?
David: No, it's funny. I didn't have any relatives in law enforcement that I was close to, no mentors, no nothing. When I was in high school, I took elective and it was a criminal justice class, a basic criminal justice 101 class.
The Jobs Podcast: Hmm.
David: And I was really interested in it. And so it's funny, but that was my that light bulb
David: I took that class and I was like, I think I want to do this.
The Jobs Podcast: Right. Hmm.
David: And then I went to Suffolk County Community College and took some more criminal justice classes, a couple of more. and never lost interest in it. I thought it was the greatest thing. I never had any police contacts. I think maybe I was pulled over one time with some friends when we were teenagers, but that's really it. I mean, I never had any know contacts with law enforcement, didn't really know any. Yeah, it's kind of crazy, isn't it?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, it is. A lot of times you hear about my dad was a cop or my, you know, my grandpa and my dad were cops or my brother. And so there's always, it seems like in fire and police specifically, there's a lot of generational pull into that line of work, but I'm similar to you.
David: Yeah, it used to be that...
The Jobs Podcast: Well, I was just saying, I'm similar to you.
David: Go ahead.
The Jobs Podcast: My dad, I don't have any family members that were in the fire service. It's just when I was younger, I must've watched some TV show emergency 911 or something and just wanted to do it. So.
David: Yeah, it's funny. and call them legacy, legacy cops firemen or something like that, where it's like the blue bloods thing, you handed down from generation to
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: You're finding that's that's way more rare now than than it is just because people that are in law enforcement are
The Jobs Podcast: Hmm.
David: So I have three teenage boys and I'm not pushing any of them to get into law enforcement.
The Jobs Podcast: Hmm.
David: it's what they want to do and they come to me and they say, dad, I want to be a cop, I'll support them fully.
The Jobs Podcast: Sure.
David: And I'll have a lot of good guidance for them, but not pushing them towards the job at all.
The Jobs Podcast: Right. So you came out here you went to evangel. What was how did that process how did that work out and then how did you end up getting into your first job in law enforcement?
David: So when I was at Evangel, my advisor there was Robert Certain, and he he's the one who developed the criminal justice program there. And he kind of guided me along.
David: a path I needed to be on. I did some internships. I did an internship with the the Mayor's Commission on Human Rights and Community Relations. And then I did internship with Springfield Police Department.
David: And during the internship, I got to do some ride -alongs and some different things like that, which if anybody's wanting to be a police officer, I strongly encourage they do, just because you see the job on TV, you may think you know what the job is, but a ride -along really gives good perspective on what the day -to -day looks like. And so I did a ride -along, and did some internships in some different areas of the PD.
David: and knew that I just knew without a doubt that's what I wanted to do so when I graduated I waited till after I graduated to apply so I applied in January of 97 there was law enforcement was a lot more competitive back then than it is now
David: And there was a large number of people that took the test for Springfield. I also took the test for Suffolk County, Long Island, but like 50 ,000 people took the test at that time for like 1800 jobs off the top.
The Jobs Podcast: My goodness.
The Jobs Podcast: my
David: so I kind of, I know, right? I kind of knew I wasn't gonna get, I think it was in the top 25%, but I still knew I wasn't gonna get a call. so, uh, Springfield seemed more, feasible, but I think there was still six or 700 that took the test with, with me in 97.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And, and they, so they formed the, the 42nd police academy out of that testing group. And I was not a part of it. And so what I should say is in the meantime,
David: So I graduated, I was working at a car wash, and then I got a job as an assistant manager in the shoe store. Finish line, if you remember.
The Jobs Podcast: Oh, yeah.
David: I don't know if they still i have stores nationwide.
David: They don't have one in Springfield anymore.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, I don't know.
David: But they had one in the battlefield mall, and I i was an assistant manager there. And you got a letter that I didn't get the job, and I was going to apply again.
David: Well, about Several months later, they realized that there was more than 25 good applicants from 700.
David: So they created the 43rd Academy class out of that same testing group. So I didn't have to test again.
The Jobs Podcast: That's good.
David: And I was part of that group.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: And so I started the Police Academy in March of 1998.
The Jobs Podcast: How long is your Academy?
The Jobs Podcast: Okay. Now, if someone just to do a little rabbit hole for a second, if somebody wants to get into if they want to become a police officer,
The Jobs Podcast: Is it, is the requirement typically that they have, or is it beneficial to have a two or a four year criminal justice degree, or is it military time can take the place of some of that?
David: So it's a combination that criteria has lessened over time.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So didn't need a four -year degree, but I think when when I was hired, I needed like 60 college hours to get on.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay. Okay.
David: So I think it's a little less right now.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So basically, if you did a year or two at OTC, which is our community college here in Springfield, you could qualify or military service. And I think maybe four years of military service. I can't remember the exact numbers. It's been a minute since I was a part of that process. But somebody is looking to get into law enforcement now, I would say that you need to get the minimum amount of schooling before you apply.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: if the question somebody's asking me is, do I need a four year degree? You need a four year degree, this is Springfield specific.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: I'm sure a lot of agencies are kind of mimicking each other at this point, but because they're all fighting for the same people, you know, but in Springfield, you need a four year degree to promote past the rank of sergeant.
David: So if you ever wanted to be a lieutenant,
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: You would you would need a four year degree. But the thing about Springfield is they also have a tuition reimbursement program. So if you've got your minimum number of hours, started your career, you could finish your four year degree while you were doing the job and and a park.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: You could get Springfield to pay for it.
The Jobs Podcast: There you go. Do you have to be 21 years of age to be in law enforcement? Is that kind of an industry standard?
David: You need to be 21 by the time you complete the academy.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay, all right.
David: So I think there's guys that start and they're actually, they don't hit, they hit their 21st birthday when they're in the academy. But as long as you're 21 by the time you complete it, you're good to go.
David: I was 23 when I started, so I didn't have to have to deal with that.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
The Jobs Podcast: So you got hired in the academy straight from finish line. They had a different academy or a second academy out of that testing group. You're in the academy. You said it takes about six months to finish. Is that correct?
David: Yeah, so it's about six months. So from March 1998 to August, I think we graduated in August, you're in the academy.
David: It's classroom, it's scenarios, it's physical training, shooting, everything you think it would be is incorporated into that six months.
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: And you have to meet standards on everything. So they grade you on your driving. They grade you on your geography. They grade you on your shooting. They grade you on your defensive tactics, your classroom. You have to take written tests like you're in college. And the entire time you're in the academy, you're being paid.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So that's a great draw for Springfield is they have their own academy and and you're being paid as you're learning how to be a policeman.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay. Well, that makes it better. Yeah. So let's go ahead.
David: And so
The Jobs Podcast: Sorry.
David: so in August, when you graduate, then you begin what we call the field training process.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So that is that FTO for short and you start So So yeah you're in uniform, you're a sworn police officer at that time and you're what we would call a probationary officer.
David: So you have to ride, you're paired with a veteran officer for 52 shifts.
The Jobs Podcast: Hmm.
David: So 52 times you ride with another policeman and he's grading you. And so you wanna talk about stressful. I mean, it's like, you're driving and he's sitting there and he's grade new on everything you're doing from how do you use the radio, what you say on the radio, the path that, did you take the best route to the call you're on? How did you handle the call when you got there? Did you have good officer safety? was your communication with the victim or suspect?
David: Did you use appropriate force when necessary? You name it, you're graded on it. You're graded on it. So it is a pretty stressful time. But I will say that college prepared me for the police academy.
David: and what what I was going to expect there. So from the educational side of things, I did really well because of college on the educational side of the police academy.
David: But prior to going to the academy, I'd never shot a gun, which they say, if you've never shot a gun, that's who they want because they get to teach you from the ground up.
The Jobs Podcast: Sure.
David: You don't have bad habits and everything else like that, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
David: So, you know, I had to learn those things. So college really prepared me for the classroom side of the academy, but the academy really prepares you of what you're going to expect on the street. And there is sometimes a disconnect, like people can pass the academy, but then cannot translate
David: the skills they've learned in the academy to actual every day being a police officer. And so it's a small percentage, but it is that reason why they have the field training process to make sure that you're not gonna get yourself hurt or somebody else hurt and that you're doing all the things that you learned appropriately.
The Jobs Podcast: What type of person would be able to take what they've learned in the academy and then successfully apply it when they're now in the field being observed?
David: somebody that typically policemen or type A personalities, you know, you you you you yeah you have to be able to, you have to be able to command or take control of a situation.
The Jobs Podcast: What?
The Jobs Podcast: Mm hmm.
David: remember a disturbance I went on probably my, it was my first week. And I was with my field training officer and we went to a convenience store. And in the front of this convenience store, there was a group of people yelling at each other. And, you know, in my mind, I guess I thought when I showed up out there, everybody would stop yelling at each other. They would listen to the things that I said.
David: they would, I gave them commands, they would listen to those commands. if You know what I'm saying? And it was not like that at all.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: so I remember my field training officer writing in in my report for that day that David needs to realize he's now the police. And that resonated with me throughout the course of my field training process.
David: And still to this day, I remember that because it was, Again that that light bulb moment that hey when you show up out here You need to take control of it because nobody else is like you're that's why they're calling you is you got to get you got to gain control of this situation and A lot of times you could just use your words To do that and sometimes you can sometimes people just don't listen to what you're saying and you you have to use physical force
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
David: in order to gain good control. And so the people, there's a parallel between military and police. Policing is a paramilitary organization in and of itself, the command structure, like everything else like that. But there's a lot of similarities. So a lot of former military people do well in law enforcement just because they're used to the stress. They're used to lot being expected of them. They're used to making tough decisions in split seconds. And so there's a lot of similarities there.
David: I wasn't military. I didn't go through military. I didn't have that experience. So there was there a ah learning curve for me and I had to learn those things. I'm grateful that I did and I had good teachers back then and really showed me how to be a policeman.
David: And I'm grateful for that. And so, because it is it is a really good career. If you do it properly, you can do it safely. But it's not for everyone.
The Jobs Podcast: Do you find that in scenarios like the example that you just shared, when you get to a scene like that, even people that normally would be quite reasonable and you could explain and discuss things with them, their emotions are just pegged at an 11 and they can't hear you even when you're screaming in their ear?
David: Yeah, and I try not to scream.
The Jobs Podcast: Well, yeah.
David: i You never want to elevate and get to that level because you've lost control if you do.
The Jobs Podcast: Right. Yeah.
David: But you have to think about policing in this perspective. When you show up on a call for service, you're typically dealing with somebody on their worst day.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: They've been a victim of a crime. They've been involved in a traffic accident. You're pulling them over on the way somewhere and they're getting a speeding ticket. They've just and been involved in a domestic type situation where their loved one has betrayed them.
David: I mean, think of all the scenarios in which the police are called and hardly any of them are good, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Sure. Hmm.
David: That's why everybody likes you guys better. um I mean, you guys are showing up and getting the cats out of the trees and all that kind of stuff, but we're showing up their very worst day.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And so you have to be able, you have to look at that and keep that in perspective when you show up and have that in your mind that they're not their self, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: They're not their normal self. Their emotions are heightened. And you're trying to bring a control, but you're also trying to bring a calmness to that situation.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
The Jobs Podcast: So you have spent time with your FTO, you've gotten past your initial training. Now you are do they still call them a beat cop or I don't even know what the term is, but you're out on patrol, I guess.
David: Yeah, patrol officer.
The Jobs Podcast: Oh, patrol officer.
David: You're a patrol officer, yeah, but like you are a beat cop because you're driving, I don't know, I think they might call them districts now, but like you're driving a beat.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: You're assigned an area, especially right out of the academy when you get off of field training, you're on your own. And suddenly there's that revelation, I'm it, it's me.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: and you're not riding with another person. We don't have partners here. So you're in a car by yourself and it's the best feeling and the worst feeling at the same time because it's the best feeling because there's that now that freedom.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah. Sure.
David: Now I go in service and I can go do whatever I want, right? But it's also the worst feeling because it's like How do I do this? How do I do that? If you think you can learn everything about being a policeman in a six months Academy and 52 ships, you got another thing coming. It is a it daily learning process for years. I would say a patrolman really doesn't have the job mastered until year two or three, maybe.
The Jobs Podcast: Hm.
David: And so, because it's hard. And you know, you may, there may be, there may be sergeants out there that they're, one of their officers is calling them about something and they've never dealt with it.
David: because it's not like your normal job where it's like, okay, we can expect A, B, C or D to happen. It's a million different things, a million different avenues that could go down.
David: And so the you sergeants are having to try to muddle through situations and go, okay, this is what we know, let's do this, right?
David: But it might be something in a 10, 12 year career they've never dealt with before.
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
The Jobs Podcast: Huh?
David: So which is actually why the job is so fascinating because you every single day and if you ask policemen why they like to do the job, you're going to get ah ah a wide variety of answers, but you're going to get this answer from a lot of them.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Every single day is different.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, variety.
David: I I'm not going and job is is is pretty similar to, you know, there's a lot of like correlation there.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: You know, we go out and you may show up on something and, man, this is crazy. I've never seen anything like this before. And as long as you can, you know, as long as you've got a tough stomach and and some common sense, you you can get through a career in policing.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah. So you're now on the beat, you're. working in patrol, how long did you do that before you decided this area in law enforcement is of interest to me or this promotional process or kind of how did you walk through the next few steps of your promotional journey in law enforcement?
David: Sure. So I, I, I found that I like to be proactive right away. I wanted, I wanted to chase bad guys.
David: Right. And I know that sounds cliche and maybe a little cheesy, but that's, that was my thing. And I wanted to put bad guys in jail.
David: Right. And so I got pretty proactive right away and started making traffic stops, starting learning what cars to stop, what to do.
David: That's not an easy skill to learn and they don't teach it in a class.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: You have to have a nose for criminal activity and some guys really have it and some guys, you know They they they get it or they acquire it over years or or you know, they they do something different but I really had a nose for criminal activity and and wanted to wanted to succeed and uh, you know in in uh making cases and drug getting drugs off the street those kind of things so
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: I worked hard and I got noticed by our so back then we had a special investigations unit and I got I got noticed by their sergeant and put in for an opening there and three and a half years as a patrolman I got I got the job which is really hard now because it's tough.
David: It's probably those China jobs are a lot more competitive than maybe back then. So I got this job, this sergeant took a chance on me. And so here I am as a three and a half year cop in the special investigations unit as a detective.
David: So when I say detective, I don't mean was promoted. It's a promotion and stature, not in pay, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: I got to wear jeans and a t -shirt to work and drive an unmarked police car and operated out of a covert office. It's pretty cool.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah. What, when you say what exactly, I mean, I don't know how much you can elaborate, but what types of crimes did you typically focus on?
David: So I did.
David: Sure, so we, you know, there was a, we shared an office with the narcotics unit.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So there was some drug aspects to what we did. We had a lot of gang responsibilities, gangs in Springfield, my area of specialty was motorcycle gangs, so I investigated them.
David: We did we did vice crimes, we did some prostitution. The reason why we had such a generic name as Special Investigations Unit is because we did such a wide variety of different things, which is what I really liked about it.
The Jobs Podcast: Hm.
David: We could be on one day working on a federal drug conspiracy case, and then the next week we're doing murder for higher surveillance, and then the next week we're running a prostitution sting. So there's like ah such a wide variety of different things we did, but it was probably the most fun that I had as police officer my career. It was run and gun,
David: And you you're not answering calls for service, so you're 100 % proactive. And you have to justify your existence, right?
David: So we had to do monthly reports that showed how many arrests we made, how much drugs we seized, how much stolen property we seized.
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
David: so it was but it wasn't stressful because once you once you start getting the hang of it over there it is it's it's really fun it's really fun so I did that from 2001 to 2006 and I decided to test for corporal at that time and
The Jobs Podcast: How long did you do that for?
David: I ended up getting promoted to corporal in 2006. Now, typically,
David: officers that are promoted to corporal will typically go back to the street and become a corporal on a patrol squad. But at the time, I think because of where I just had spent the last five years, I was asked to go to criminal investigations as a detective.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So criminal investigations is where you are investigating a crime that, you know, so a detective has assigned a case that of a crime that was already committed.
David: So it's I went from 100 % proactive to 100 % reactive. Now I'm being assigned cases and have to follow up on them. And so my first, I was immediately assigned to, so I was given a choice, ah crimes against children or adult sex crimes. And neither one really Like I didn't want to do either one of them honestly, but I especially I especially didn't really want to work kid crimes I never did I've had some friends that have done them and kudos to them.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah I wouldn't. Sure.
David: Somebody has to do them. I just Just didn't I didn't have the stomach for it I thought like if I was sitting across from somebody that hurt kids I don't want to hurt them and and so I I decided to take the adult sex crimes route which was then incorporated things are different now, but then Was incorporated in what was called the violent crimes unit and so um I was a ah ah sex crimes detective for
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: 14 long months and learned a lot. I learned a lot on cases, case management, how to work cases, what cases would be charged, what cases wouldn't be charged. They were not easy cases to work. And so after that, there were some promotions in criminal investigations and a spot opened up in robbery homicide.
David: and I was selected to go to that spot.
The Jobs Podcast: Hmm.
David: So I was in robbery homicide. So now I'm working robberies and or homicides. And so I did that for about two and a half years.
The Jobs Podcast: Did you enjoy that part of it or?
David: And that, yeah, so if I could go back and change one thing
The Jobs Podcast: Mm hmm.
David: about my policing career, I probably would have stayed there longer.
The Jobs Podcast: Why's that?
David: From a detective standpoint, from being a criminal investigator and spending 13 of my 25 years in criminal investigations, I can tell you the pinnacle of a detective's career sitting across from somebody that murdered somebody else, and you're trying to get them to tell you what they did. You know what they did and they know what they did. You're just trying to get them to... I really enjoyed the chess match of interviews and interrogations and trying to get somebody to confess to a crime. And think about pressure on the line of those. you Someone's... This person did this crime and there's these loved ones that
David: really are suffering and want some justice, right? So you're trying to bring some closure to them and you're trying to bring some justice to the person that committed these crimes.
David: So it's kind of for me, and it's not probably the same for everybody, but for me, it was the pinnacle of my career.
The Jobs Podcast: Mm hmm.
David: But I saw an opportunity to promote And I tested for Sargent. And i was promoted to Sargent in 2009.
David: And then I had been off the road, off of patrol for eight years. I'd been in plain clothes for eight years. So I'd spent more time in plain clothes than I had in uniform.
David: But I was going back to patrol. So I went back to patrol as a sergeant and operated or ran a patrol squad. And I did that. I did that for a number of years. I worked almost every shift. I worked, I was a day shift sergeant. I was a second shift sergeant, which was five at nine to three in the morning back then. I was an overnight sergeant.
David: and and And then our chief at the time formed we what we refer to as downtown squads. So they made two patrol squads that were specifically designed to work the downtown Springfield area.
David: And, um, if you ever go downtown Springfield on a Friday, Saturday night, you're going to see police officer standing around. That was us. We were, I was selected as one of the sergeants to run one of those two squads. It was kind of like a pilot, um, uh, pilot type program and we, they're still down there today. So, that was, that was fun, but I, I dealt with enough.
David: drunk college kids and homeless people for two years.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And I put in for a criminal investigations position and I actually had put back in for the special investigation sergeant opening, didn't get it.
David: Then I put in for a property crime sergeant position and got it. So in 2011, I went to the property crimes unit as the supervisor and, and worked as the criminal investigation sergeant in, in crimes against property for five years. So, which is a long time for that position, uh, strictly because of the volume of property crime. I can tell you there's more property crime in Springfield than anything else.
David: And the last year I was there, I think I read 14 ,000 police reports of property crime.
The Jobs Podcast: Good grief.
David: And I had eight detectives. So you think eight detectives are going to work 14 ,000 cases?
David: Of course not.
David: So now I'm having to triage what cases I assigned, what cases I didn't assign. And it's unfortunate. but property crime takes a backseat to crimes against
David: You've got a person, you've got somebody that's killed, stabbed, assaulted, raped.
David: Those take precedent over my car was stolen, right? So you're having to make those big picture.
David: you're having to make those priority shifts of manpower. And so me, i had my eight guys and we would work every case we could and we worked some really big cases and some did some really good things.
David: But there's also a lot of cases we didn't work that I wish we could have because of manpower.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: So then in 2017, 2017, I put in for lieutenant and was promoted to lieutenant and went back to patrol. So then I was a patrol lieutenant for several years prior to my last assignment in my career which was the lieutenant over the special investigations section.
The Jobs Podcast: you've had, as I listened to your story, you've had, I say jump around, not because that's not a negative, you just had a lot of different experiences. Did you ever think that I might want to try and go all the way to the top and become a police chief?
The Jobs Podcast: Or was that level not of interest to you?
David: No, that level was not of interest to me.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: So, I put in for Captain a couple of times and I, last time, I think I put in for Captain twice and the last time I put in for Captain, I was, no, the first time I put in for Captain, I didn't get it and instead was transferred to Special Investigations, which is,
David: to me by far the best lieutenant's job on the department because again, you're back. I was back to my origin. I was jeans in a t -shirt. I drove a covert vehicle. It was now I'm supervising all the guys that were doing the job that I did, you know, 20 years earlier. It was a really cool assignment. And I was really grateful that I could spend my last three years there. But as far as like jumping around,
David: I highly recommend that to any police officer to avoid burnout. Because if you stay in the same role for, think think about it, when I became a sergeant, I had guys on my squad, all they did for 12 years, 15 years was be a ah ah street cop.
The Jobs Podcast: Oh. Hmm.
David: They were still officers, they never promoted, they just drove a beat, same beat, over and over and over again for 12, 13, 15 years. That will burn anybody out.
David: I don't care how much you love the job, doing that same thing over and over and over again.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Now, there are guys, there are unicorns out there that that don't ever get burned out. they They, from day one to day, to to year 25, they are They love it. But for me, I needed those different opportunities to keep me going. to become well -rounded.
David: So if I'm now a lieutenant and I'm in charge of other guys, but I didn't have all the experiences that I had prior to promoting, how am I going to be a good supervisor, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Sure. Yeah.
David: I mean, supervisors are drawing from their experience. Now I was never a SWAT guy. I was never on the SWAT team. And so, you know, when, when we had barricaded type situations or hostage type situations like that's not my forte.
David: I had knowledge to draw from and resources there to call and help me out and and get me through situations. But the end of the day, I pride myself on being well -versed and having a lot of different opportunities to be as well -rounded as I could.
The Jobs Podcast: The one thing that pops into my head when I hear you talking about those unicorn guys that they do the same beat for 20, 23, 25 years, you know, whenever you're a captain and you're lucky enough to have just a firefighter that's been doing a firefighting job for 20, 22, 23 years.
The Jobs Podcast: the experience and the knowledge, that guy's probably forgotten more than a 10 year captain has learned yet. And so it's a nice resource to have, either if you're sitting next to him, or if you're in charge of them, that's a great place to pull experience and knowledge from.
David: Yeah.
David: I remember my first patrol squad that I took over as a sergeant. These were some older crust, some crusty, some like just like they, I think I would have been seventh on that seniority list, on that squad, if you're looking just time on.
David: And now I'm the boss and and these guys, they've all been on the way longer than me. And so, but the knowledge that was there.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: So like we get in situations and there were four guys on that squad that had been on the full -time SWAT team at some point in their career.
David: So my biggest weakness was their strength. So as a supervisor, I'm like, hey guys, on these types of deals,
David: have the final say, but I'm leaning on you. I'm leaning on your expertise in these types of situations.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And so they knew that I was going to not require their help, but like, I was going to ask, I was going to ask them their opinion.
David: And I think that's good leadership. I mean, you know, to be honest, I think, you know, any, any, any leader, you know, thinks they know it all.
The Jobs Podcast: Oh, sure. Yeah.
David: They're, they're, they're not a good leader, right? So I'm, I'm, I'm going to this squad hat in hand and going, guys, I've been off the street eight years. You guys, you have the most seniority of any squad in the department. So I'm going to sit back and let you do your thing and learn a lot from you. And I did. And and it was, I think that was essential for me helped me jumpstart my supervisor career.
The Jobs Podcast: You're blessed to have guys like that if they're willing to look out for each other. Boy, that's nice to have a deep bench of experience like that. but but So you've moved on.
David: Yeah, it is. It is. Sure.
The Jobs Podcast: Let's say you're getting close to, if I'm following your timeline, right? You're getting close to retirement, 25 years with the Springfield Police Department. Is that correct?
David: Yes. Well, I did. I've retired.
The Jobs Podcast: Right. Yes.
David: So, oh, oh in in my journey in the story. Yeah, that I'm telling here.
The Jobs Podcast: Yes.
David: Yeah.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, yeah.
David: Yeah. So I was I spent my last three years in criminal Criminal investigations it was in the special investigations section which incorporates narcotics ah special investigations unit and organized crime advice and so During that time I went through the the a little bit before I got there and after I got there the
David: Chief wants all of his commanders and still to this day to go through Command College, which is a college for commanders throughout the state. And they convene in Jefferson City, Missouri at the Police Chiefs Association. And it's like a school. And you go there for one week a month for seven months. And they have a program with Lincoln University out of Jefferson City.
David: And each week you go there, you write paper and then you get credit towards a master's degree.
The Jobs Podcast: Wow.
David: So when I graduated from command college, I had maybe two years left a policeman and I needed five classes finish my master's degree.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: So I could do it all online. And so you know I've tried to model for my kids. You should always try to better yourself.
David: Did I want to go get a master's degree at age 48 years old? No, I did not. I think it has benefited me at all to this day? Probably not.
David: I don't know.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, but you're close.
David: But what I will, yeah, yeah. What I will say is that this goes for anybody in any profession. You should always be looking to try to better yourself.
David: How can I better myself?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Even a police chief or somebody that's at the top should always be looking to try to make themselves better. And not only not just at the job, but as a person, like what can I do to make to make myself better. So I tried to model that for my for my boys. And that was one of the motivations to get my master's degree. And so I was able to complete that in 2021.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: So pretty proud of that.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, well, yeah, you should be in. So you've finished up your career with the Springfield Police Department. You have 25 years on the books. You've got your degree.
The Jobs Podcast: You're going into retirement. What's next? Did you have a plan when you were retiring and you just kind of stepped into your current position? Or did you just take a year to offer?
The Jobs Podcast: How did that transition go?
David: So it was kind of seamless, honestly, and in my eyes, a God thing. It was, for me, I did some things when I was...
David: So I did some volunteering when I was a police officer different capacities.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: the the I used to do the basketball team ah with big brothers and big sisters and organize those games against you guys and and and and different things like that.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And it brought me to a place where I did some volunteering. There was a huge event at the fairgrounds and some My name got floated to help them with security. And so it was Convoy of Hope had reached out to me or representative of and asked if I would help them with their site security for their event at the fairgrounds. And so I went to a meeting and I was like, sure, I'll help you with this. So over the course of however many years that was ago, I did several events with Convoy of Hope.
David: on a volunteer basis, helping them with some different site security. At the same time, through the reason why I call it a God thing, it was just a series of events that I met the president of Convoy of Hope. And we developed a relationship and would have lunch together a couple of times a year. He did a ride along with me.
David: And was able to show him the department and some different things like that. And he's a great man. And probably about two years before I was going to retire, we were having lunch.
David: And he was like, hey, when you leave the police department, he knew I was finishing up. And he said, when you leave, I'd like for you to come work at Conboy.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah. Hmm.
David: And I said, I love to. I love your organization. So the last year that I worked there, at the police department, they hired me as a consultant. So I was doing like some, probably 10 to 15 hours a month, I think it was. And I was doing, you know, just some different consulting on they're building a big, they were building that building out in Republic. And so I was doing some different things and I did some protect executive protection on a trip to El Salvador with some donors. And I thought it was great. And that led to them offering me a full time position. So I retired March 31st of 2023.
David: and started work for Convoy of Hope, May 1st of 2023. So I actually took one month off and went to Mexico with my wife for four or five days.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And honestly, by the time the end of April rolled around, I was pretty bored.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, I've heard that a lot from people that retire.
David: I just don't think, I mean, you I'm I'm going to be 51 in a couple of months and I can't see me just sitting at home and I don't know how guys do it, but that, you know, to his own.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Like, I just don't, I just don't, for me, I'm going to work until I have enough money not to work or I can't work.
The Jobs Podcast: Sure.
David: And so that's, you know, and don't know that the whole future will, for me, will be a conflict.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: I don't know. whatever God tells me to do. But ah for me, it's like I feel like I belong there right now. And it's been a very, very unique transition. So imagine going from the the ah structure at the police department and working for city government with the policies and the procedures in place and the red tape and and all that.
David: to corporate security. Now, Convoy of Hope is a 30 -year organization. 28 and a half years, they didn't have security. So they hired me and another guy who's a retired Fed to kind of build the security program up at Convoy. And so now I'm going from policing and structure and command structure and of command and all that stuff to no structure.
David: Hardly. And going to corporate security, but not just corporate security, faith -based corporate security. So a lot of people that work, it's viewed as a ministry. And so a lot of people that work there have been in the ministry before. They've been pastors, they've been missionaries. So I say that to say, I mean, I love the people of the organization, but they see things through a pretty different lens than I do.
The Jobs Podcast: Was that a hard shift to make to go from the surrounded by type A's and everything and structure and, you know, go, go, go to a diff, like a 180 as far as your work environment.
David: It was and still is.
David: I love the organization. I love what they do.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: do a lot of disaster. A lot of people think of Convoy of Hope. They think of, oh, there's a tornado. They're going to be on the ground. Oh, there's a hurricane in the US.
David: They're going to be on the ground. But they do a lot more than that, the depth of that organization. I don't even think I knew until I started working there. It's a global organization. They got 650 employees.
David: 250 of which are global. They're in other countries. We have program in 37 other countries. We feed 620 ,000 kids one meal a day every school day, five days a week.
The Jobs Podcast: Wow.
David: And they're wanting to get to a million kids by 2030. So while the transition has been interesting and difficult at times,
David: The mission is why I'm there and it's just it's an unbelievable organization and I love what they do and I it's not perfect by any means but no places and I truly.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: the heart of everyone there, I said, the mission. You could go and visit building and look at the food in the warehouse and and go, wow, that's a lot of boxes, a lot of food, and this is huge. But then when you see the food on a plate in some kids' hands in Africa or Guatemala Nicaragua or one of the places we have program, it's life -changing.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And it's where I know I'm supposed to be at this point in time.
The Jobs Podcast: I was talking with a retired fireman just a couple of weeks ago and he's out in California with all the fires out there and he was he shares a lot of the same sentiments that you do about just the the size and scope of convoy of hope is a little bit misunderstood and when you get involved in it and you see it from the inside out, it takes on a whole different viewpoint.
David: Yeah, it really does. It's just it's pretty dynamic. And think of all the logistics that have to go in, you know, into not only, you know, we've shipped truckload after truckload to people, supplies in the wildfires in California, we're still in in North Carolina, working with churches for Hurricane Helene.
The Jobs Podcast: Oh yeah.
David: And at the same time, We're feeding kids around the world. It's just, it's, it's unbelievable. It's unbelievable.
The Jobs Podcast: That's got to be satisfying. And I think you've had two careers that give you some satisfaction that you're actually making a difference, even if it's just in one person's life, you're planting that seed kind of a thing.
David: Yeah, I do. I do feel pretty blessed in that regard. It's, it's a, it's a, it, you know, being a police officer is serving your community.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And I feel like I've transitioned to a different type of service, if that makes any sense.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, it does. As far as career goes, if someone wanted to get into law enforcement, do you have any little tidbits of information that maybe isn't in the brochure or maybe that don't realize going into the academy or when you start? Is there some guiding principle or a phrase or just a method of doing or being?
The Jobs Podcast: that allowed you to be successful in your different departments that you were in and your promotional opportunities and stuff like that.
David: That's a great question, Tim. And I'm glad you asked me because yes, there is. So for years, I sat on the panel to interview new hires. So people that wanted to be policemen, they you have to sit on an interview with with three people that were police officers and one from human resources.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: And I sat on that panel for a number of years as ah as officer. And what helps you or guides you to a successful career in policing prior to it, you know, we'll teach, we could teach anybody how to be a policeman, but, but I had my, so I recommend, I highly recommend
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Uh, doing a ride along first. I mentioned that earlier, but I also recommend. Try to get into the customer service field, whether it's waiting tables or places that you have to deal with people and, and, and people are difficult.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: There's difficult people. Just think about it. that Just think about it. that Think about the last time you had a restaurant when you you overheard somebody giving a waitress or a waiter difficulty, right? it It happens all the time.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And so you have to learn how to deal with difficult people. When I was a college student, I was, during the summers, my parents moved back to the city, to New York City. They were living in Brooklyn and working for a Christian organization called Teen Challenge. It's a drug rehabilitation program. And so I was going back to Brooklyn during the summers and I was working at Teen Challenge. And that was huge for me because I was, you know, a lot of the people there were court ordered.
David: So I was dealing with a lot of the personality types and a lot of the different things that I would see later on in a policing career, if that makes sense.
David: Also, the internships that I did with the Mayor's Commission on Human Rights and internship with Springfield really prepared me for investigations.
David: It really prepared me for what I was going to see. I didn't have any surprises. So there's sometimes, you sit on an interview panel and I'm like, how did you apply for a job as a police officer?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: They really didn't have that.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: You can look at me and go, well, he took class in high school, then he took criminal justice classes in college, and then he did A, B, and C internships, and he worked here and he did this.
David: It's kind of like a path to that job, right?
David: There's some people that just, I was a window washer and then I did this for a little while and now I wanna be a policeman. And you're like, do you even know what this, like, do you know anything about this job?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
The Jobs Podcast: It can't be an impulse.
David: And they're, no, it's not, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And so like I said, it's not for everybody.
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
David: So I would like several times on that panel, I would be like, have you ever done a ride along? And they would be like, well, no, no, I go, I'm gonna set you up with a guy after you're done with this interview.
David: And and then, you know, because we can't afford to hire someone and then them two months later realize, man, this isn't for me.
David: We wanna know that on the front end, right? We want those guys that they know what they're getting into and nothing's a surprise for them.
David: when they when they start the job. My advice would be seek out those things that are going to best prepare you for a career of policing, which could include customer service type jobs.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: And like I said, it could be waiting tables at a restaurant.
The Jobs Podcast: Sure.
David: It doesn't have to be I worked as probation and parole officer.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: It doesn't have to be something that specific related to criminal justice. It has to be very customer service related and then look at those things will those educational opportunities if you are in college like an internship that will help you to to navigate that job.
The Jobs Podcast: When people would come in and the panel that you were just describing that you sit on for the interview process, are you usually able to tell within the first couple of minutes, this person has what we're looking for. This person is, we might be able to help develop them, turn them into what we want. And this person is not a good fit for you and you need to make a 180 and go elsewhere. Is it usually pretty obvious early on?
David: sometimes, uh, sometimes you, you're like, yep, you know, right away, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah. Yeah.
David: You're like, they're good. They're going to be fine. Sometimes you're like, man, I don't know, but I don't know to be honest with you. I don't know what they thought about me. I went through.
David: Now, I had done those things. Like I said, I checked those boxes, but I was pretty green.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: I was not in the military. I had never shot a gun before. you Fighting was very limited for me. But I did 25 years there. And there were guys that We're gung -ho and we're cadets and like, you're like, man, this guy, this guy's a cop for life.
David: And then, you know, three years later, they find another job and go somewhere else and do something else completely different. Right. So you never know.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: You never know. But I would say, you know, I pride myself being a pretty good. judgment of people. And so, yeah, a lot of times you can go, man, I don't know.
David: I don't know if this is for you. I wouldn't say that. But but then, you know, sometimes, you know, be on a shadow of a doubt.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: You're like, this guy's gonna be squared away.
The Jobs Podcast: Do you find that most cops, and they're probably gonna get upset if you share any locker room secrets, but are they mostly extroverts? are you have a lot of introverts that when they take off their job persona that they portray to the public, do do you typically find one personality style that is in law enforcement or is pretty much anybody?
David: I think there's, I would say that if anything, and I say, you know, there's a lot of different personality types that could be good police officers.
David: There's guys that are introverted and quiet to guys that, you know, would be an excellent car salesman because they, you know, they're, they're very outspoken, very friendly, you know, you know, so there's, there's every
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: different personality trait under the sun, but i I will say is that what the job does to somebody over the years, in my experience, kind of turns them a little introverted. Cops don't like to be in big crowds. They don't like to be around a lot of people. They have a circle of friends that are usually other cops, and I tried to not do that. I was told that early on, and and remember that, so I try to always keep a circle of friends that are both police and not police if that makes sense and so but but there's a lot of like traits like that that I think happen to policeman over time because the job will change you as a person you become very cynical you know the you see you're seeing the evil of the world every single day right so it's not that's why it's not for everybody uh but
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, it does.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: the people of this world need protectors and they need people to step in and protect them from the wolves, right? And so that's what policemen do. And it's not for everybody, but at the end of the day, it does take its toll. So I would say as far as personality, any personality can do it, but it does change you over time as a person.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, there's some similarities there to fire, ambulance, things of that nature, any type of a first responder that's out kind of in the middle of some of the disasters.
David: Absolutely.
The Jobs Podcast: just, ah ah you see things that unfortunately is just part of the job and nobody should have to see. And it can't help but change you. It's how you process it, how you deal with it, finding a healthy outlet for that as opposed to turning to alcohol or drugs or any other unhealthy behaviors.
David: Right.
The Jobs Podcast: That's usually a big part of it.
David: Right.
The Jobs Podcast: But
David: Yeah, they say that like we Most people deal with a critical incident about 10 times in their life. And they say policemen are dealing with critical critical incidents about 150 times during a career.
David: And I would say that, you know, you had mentioned fire and paramedics is about the same. I mean, it's this first responders, know, generally speaking, have to deal with way more things than people have to deal with in a lifetime.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Or should deal with.
The Jobs Podcast: What's your best advice to deal with failure? Everybody makes mistakes in their career. Everybody makes the wrong decision. Sometimes even with the best information, look back and go, that was not the right decision to make.
The Jobs Podcast: But how you handle it after you make a mistake is usually a big chunk of it.
David: Sure.
The Jobs Podcast: What would you advise someone who, you know, either in law enforcement or in your current occupation? How do you deal with failure?
David: Well, you know, for me, advice would be for a younger officer, excuse me, a younger officer is make sure that you learn from your mistakes.
David: And so when I was a field training officer, or when I was a probationary officer and I told you about that story, I'll go back to that story again where they said, Dave needs to really realize he's the police, right?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: The key for me there is, okay, he's right. I did that wrong. I don't want to make that mistake again. The people that don't succeed off of field training are the ones that make mistakes repeatedly. They consistently are doing the wrong thing. Even they don't learn from them. And so I guess at what I'm trying to say is.
David: Always be trying to learn from your mistakes because everybody makes them. No one is perfect.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Everybody is going to the wrong call. And you need to own your stuff. And if you make a bad decision, say, yep, that was my decision.
David: It was the wrong one. And then learn from it, but don't repeat it. And so that's that's that would be my advice, you know, for for really anyone in any field is, you know, be prepared for failure.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Failure is what builds character, what's built, what builds you up, which builds people. But it also makes you like stronger in the fact that, OK, now I have to overcome this, but I don't want to feel like that again.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah. Sure.
David: I don't want to. I'm not going to make that mistake again. Now, will you make? Could you make another mistake down the road? Something completely different? Yes. But you make mistakes in life, and I tell this to my kids, you're gonna make mistakes, but learn from them and become better for it and move on.
The Jobs Podcast: That's, there's a general theme with my interviews that I've noticed when I ask folks that have a solid career behind them like you do, that There's that one phrase, everybody makes mistakes, you have to own it. That own it part, I think, it sometimes goes against our human nature. We just want a knee jerk reaction is to defend ourselves and deflect and, you know, not try and look as bad as we look right now. We've got to go over our face and it's embarrassing and you just want to, you know, explain it away. Sometimes it's best to just stand there with the egg on your face and go, yep, I made it. This is my mess.
The Jobs Podcast: I'm sorry. How can I move forward?
David: Yep.
David: I would agree with that. I think everybody's worked for a supervisor that doesn't and ships blame and blames you and it's their mistake.
The Jobs Podcast: Yes. Yep.
David: And and one wants that. You know, if you know, if you make the mistake, you need to own it for sure.
The Jobs Podcast: No.
The Jobs Podcast: Those supervisors that are quick to throw their people under the bus, usually nobody wants to work for them. And yeah, it just never goes well for their career.
David: It's true.
David: Very true.
The Jobs Podcast: Is there a career, if you look back to when you were a teenager, it seems like you pretty much had law enforcement on your radar from day one, but was there something else, you know, and I'm not talking about like being a rock star or, you know, a professional sports athlete or whatever, but was there another career that you kind of had your eye on that maybe would have been your second choice?
David: Well, I really don't know. It's funny because I look back on it and I don't know what else I would have done.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: I don't, I honestly do not know what else I would do if I wasn't doing this. And it's, I see, because now, because of manpower issues, we have a rehire program and I see guys that are retiring and going back to the police department.
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
David: Why are they doing that? isn't 25 years enough, they're doing that because they don't know what else to do. And it's not easy to do something for that long and then all of a sudden go do something completely different. Now, there's lot of similarities what I was doing and what I am doing now, even though the jobs are completely different, there are some parallel similarities.
David: But as far as like what what I do? I don't know. I think I would like to own a business or like do something for myself if I was be my own boss.
David: And I don't even know what that would look like.
The Jobs Podcast: Mm hmm.
David: I really don't. I don't i have any idea of what that would look like. But it seems like I know guys that are doing that and I know how happy they are.
David: Even though it's probably pretty stressful, you know got to earn your own money and be successful that way.
The Jobs Podcast: Right.
David: But at the end of the day, ah there's got to be some kind of satisfaction with making your business successful and that kind of thing. But I don't know.
David: It's hard. It's a a hard.
The Jobs Podcast: Do you, well, do you find that cops, when they leave law enforcement, you talked about the guys that were retiring and then coming back.
David: That's a tough question.
The Jobs Podcast: Do you think they miss the camaraderie? Because if I look at the fire service, you know, I i don't miss going on calls. I don't, mean I wouldn't miss getting woken up in the middle of the night. I'm sleeping perfectly fine.
The Jobs Podcast: And then I have to get up and go do my job, but that's what I get paid for. But I do enjoy my coworkers, the camaraderie, the fun that we have. and firehouse life is its own unique deal.
The Jobs Podcast: And I can see, you know, when I'm old and grayer, that's the thing that I will miss the most. I can only assume it's the same in law enforcement.
David: Yeah, without a doubt. I mean, what do they say?
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: I'll miss the clowns, but not the circus. I mean, it's it's it's the same for me and i try I have to be better and more intentional about lifelong friends and being in touch with them and talking to them and keeping in touch, you know, because life goes on and then all of a sudden
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, that's a good way to put it. Mm
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: I've gone to a couple of retirement parties this year and some different things like that. and I get to go back and I get to see the the all the people. The the the thing is, our department's pretty good at doing things like every year they have a Christmas lunch. High Street Baptist I think does it for us and all of the retirees come out of the woodwork and you get to go there and see all the current police officers and and then and get to go there and see all the guys that you worked with when you were there as well. And then we have like a ball
David: in the, in the, in the spring and it's kind of like a dress up, you know, suit and tie event, but like you go there and and it's, uh, uh, again, it's the same thing. They, they include the retirees in, in some of the things, which is kind of cool.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: and then you get to have a certification but you have to qualify once a year and they only do it twice in a year but you have to do it once. So like you're going out there with all the retirees and shooting and it's kind of fun. So there's they do a lot of things to kind of still keep us in the loop so to speak but like you know we get because because i don't really care about the job anymore man i'm 25 years i had a gutful but but but i mean i developed so many relationships and i have so many friends you know so many guys uh that that i i respect and and um call a friend and and i you know it's it's hard to keep in touch with them all but like that's
The Jobs Podcast: Mm hmm.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: But that's an important aspect of retiring. I mean, you have to stay in contact with those guys.
The Jobs Podcast: That brotherhood can continue on long past your final paycheck, I'm sure.
David: It can and it does.
The Jobs Podcast: Hey, the Convoy of Hope stuff that you were talking about a little bit ago with the meals, the wildfires, the ah ah hurricane response in North Carolina, is there, I can only assume that the Convoy of Hope has a donation page where folks, if they want to donate to the Convoy of Hope, can they go just to the website and is it pretty easy to find?
David: Yes, absolutely. It's convoy of hope dot org.
The Jobs Podcast: Okay.
David: And we are, you know, um you know, um it's a ah ah nonprofit faith based organization that we're really trying to make a difference in the world.
David: And it's a really good if you're looking for a place, if you're a business looking for a place for to to be a part of, know, we'd love hook up with you, give you a tour of the building and you're not local and and you want to, you know, it's an organization you want to know more about, get behind, just go to convoypoke .org. I appreciate that plug for them. I do.
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah, I mean, in the Springfield area, everybody knows convoy of hope. They're a very well respected organization. I don't have any affiliation with them. I'm not being paid to say this or anything, anything like that.
The Jobs Podcast: it's pretty easy to get on board with helping folks that their houses and everything that they own is burned to the ground or flooding or a hurricane or whatever has wiped everything away.
The Jobs Podcast: Americans are pretty good. We put the political stuff aside. When disaster hits, everybody steps up to the plate to help one another.
David: Yep.
The Jobs Podcast: and that's one thing that I've always liked about our country. So an organization like Con...
David: And when there are disasters,
The Jobs Podcast: Yeah.
David: Yeah, I'm sorry. When there are disasters, they will allow you to donate specifically to those. So unless I'm mistaken, I think I'm not, but you could go on their website and donate specifically to the fires or hurri or hurricane or things like that.
David: So fairly certain. you could always call in and you could do to donations over the phone and things like that as well.
The Jobs Podcast: OK, awesome.
The Jobs Podcast: Hey, thanks for your time today, David. I really appreciate it. That was a lot of awesome information, and hopefully some folks will donate to the convoy.
David: Good.
The Jobs Podcast: I hope that's a worthwhile organization.
David: Yeah, right.
The Jobs Podcast: I support right, have a good day.
David: Well, thanks, Tim. I appreciate you having me. And yeah, it was great. Thank you.
David: You too.
