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Episode 36 - Andrea Berten, CEO at Carepath Technologies
99 Plays6 months ago
In this episode, Sade is joined by Andrea Berten. They dive into the concept of modern leadership, and Andrea shares her experiences and insights as a contemporary leader. Andrea offers valuable advice for those beginning their leadership journey in this evolving landscape.
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Transcript
Introduction and Insights from Andrea, CEO of Care Path Technologies
00:00:13
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to a new episode of Women Talk Tech. Today I'm joined by Andrea, CEO at Care Path Technologies. In this episode, we chatted all about the concept of new leadership and what this actually means, where Andrea shares her experience as a modern or new year, should I say. She also shares her advice for those embarking on their leadership journey in this new era. I hope you enjoy this conversation.
Andrea's Passion for Digital Health and Educational Background
00:00:37
Speaker
So Andrea, tell me a little bit more about yourself. Sure, thank you for having me and I'm happy to do that. um I think the most important thing that you need to know about myself is that I'm very, very passionate about digital health and user-centric medical solutions and um that I really want to you know drive things and change something in our healthcare system. And this is also why I studied something like that already in university. So I specialized in medical engineering and business administration.
00:01:09
Speaker
because I felt already this need of you know contributing something to to society. And after that, I kind of dove in right away in a job where I was responsible for um several products as a product expert in in respiratory health. And I took care of lung implants and a couple of other you know equipment and um that is used to do lung interventions, basically.
Transition from Traditional Medicine to Digital Health
00:01:35
Speaker
And I worked very, very closely with with doctors. But at a certain time, I felt like I really would like to be more in touch with the actual beneficiaries, so the patients. And I think I wanted to do the switch you know from the very mechanical of world of of medicine more towards the digital world, because I thought it was absolutely necessary. And that was two months before COVID. So I think that was a good time. yeah
00:02:00
Speaker
And um this is how i how how I found CarePath or how they found me, actually, because they were looking for a product expert um that builds the product early on and makes sure that it actually meets the needs of the different stakeholders, the doctors and and the patients.
Rise to CEO at Care Path Technologies
00:02:17
Speaker
And so I joined them. um And sometime after the one of the managing directors left and I followed up in his footsteps and I took over the the leadership of the team and the company. And so now I'm the CEO of CarePath Technologies, which is the digital health company in Berlin. Wow, wow, wow, amazing. And I'm sure we'll kind of dive into that in a bit more detail
Andrea's Perspective on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion
00:02:38
Speaker
in the episode. But I guess on the topic of DEI, what does it mean to you and kind of why is it important? um As a female CEO, I'm sure that's incredible. And I'm sure that's quite important to you. But yeah, what does it mean to you? um It's an interesting question, because I really don't think about that a lot. um For me, it's kind of normal because it's
00:02:57
Speaker
goes along with being interested in in people and different types of people and don't really consider if they're and from they have a different gender or a different background and so on. For me, it just means that I look for people that are capable and that I like working with. And it turns out that we have a really diverse team. We have several ladies in our team. um We have several countries like or several cultural backgrounds, really, really diverse. We have someone who is a patient himself because I wanted to have a patient actually involved in our team. So we build a product.
00:03:30
Speaker
for them so they should have a voice for sure. And um so that that is kind of diversity for me and inclusion, being curious and being open towards other people. Yeah, I love that. And I'm glad you didn't just say, yeah, we've got this amount of females in our team. Because I think we're now past the stage where DEI is just hiring females. It's so much more than that. It's age, it's culture, it's race, it's educational background. And like you said, right, having a patient ah working with you gives you that aspect which you couldn't normally get. For sure. um Yeah, and and it worked out very well, actually. In the end, um it's it's for me a chance to learn. um And it obviously comes with challenges, especially when it comes to
00:04:12
Speaker
communication and, um you know, having this common baseline, I would say where, you know, and when you live in the same country, I mean, you might not even have that as well with other Germans for sure. But, but in general, and it's like you need to communicate more, you need to understand more, you need to be open, and you need to kind of put yourself in the shoes of the others, right? And then that understand, okay, where are they coming from? What are their challenges? And that is the most important topic. Yeah, wow. And you know I'm actually really excited for the core topic of today's episode because I think it's one which I'm learning about as well. But I think it's one which we're talking about, but not actually you know labeling it as such. And I think to have the term actually you set in stone is pretty cool. So yeah, I'm really excited to to kind of discuss the topic of new leadership. So yeah, what does it mean to you? and And I guess, actually, let's start with the obvious.
What is New Leadership?
00:05:00
Speaker
What is new leadership, for those who are not too sure about the term? And then, of course, what does it mean to you?
00:05:06
Speaker
Sure. um So new leadership basically means that you also adapt the leadership style to the kind of new society we live in, lots of lots of changes, lots of flexibility and so on. and that you trust your um employees or team members, um you kind of shift away from these very stiff hierarchies and that you base your your leadership style more on kind of like a coaching principle and you involve your team members and they get kind of, um you know, a voice and they can participate, they can, you know, self-organize their work a lot more and they can really take all ownership and and also take decisions in the end.
00:05:45
Speaker
um Yeah, I think those are the most important aspects of it. Yeah, and I guess from your experience, how how's it been as it as a new leader, quote unquote, give me a bit of insight into it into how you found it. And and I guess you could even compare it to maybe your experience with, you know, traditional leaderships when you know when you were working, et cetera, and versus now you as a new leader.
Enjoyment and Challenges of New Leadership
00:06:08
Speaker
Sure. I mean, first of all, it's a lot of fun um because I think my personality type is also, it it goes very well along with this new new leadership style because I like to give, you know, others the chance to shape something, to create something. and
00:06:25
Speaker
to be involved, to to actually tell me what they think because I never thought, okay, I know how everything is done and that you know you just need to follow my lead. That's not how I you approach things because usually, I mean, obviously there's a limit to that, but usually The more opinions you have, the better is the outcome, right? And then especially if you have a diverse team, you have more perspectives and and more angles so you can ah really have a good result in the end. um So it's a lot of fun, but it obviously also is is challenging because
00:06:56
Speaker
um you need to trust and you need to be able to trust. um I don't really have an issue with that but it also means you can be at a certain point vulnerable because obviously this trust can be misused. andm I'm not saying that it happens all the time but it could happen so it's something where you need to you need to deal with that or you need to be able to deal with that for sure um and um you need to communicate a lot, you need to be very transparent, you need to be you know open, you need to be Um, you know, you need to see like, what are the different needs of your team members? And the team members are very different. And that's something also like a core of this new leadership style is to really see the person and their need in the daily work, um, and try to adapt to that. I think that that is the probably for me, the most challenging part because I also have to do my work yeah that's on yeah balance act between, you know, spending time with my team members, being there for them.
00:07:54
Speaker
not being too controlling because they need the space, but at the same time and understand. I mean, there are certain team members that are also maybe not used to have that much freedom or are not capable of taking decisions or don't want to take that much responsibility. so This is kind of this fine-tuning process with every single person in the team to see how does it work out for them. So it's it's a lot of you know work in progress. There is not one fixed style that you have for everyone. It's more like something you know to try to adapt to the personal needs and and see how it goes. And that is a constant process. It never ends. I was about to say, because you know how have you found that aspect? Because I can imagine that could be quite time-consuming. Even if you have a team of 10, that's, you let's say, 10 different ways of being a leader for them.
00:08:38
Speaker
You know, how have you found that aspect? Because I can imagine that being quite tricky as well as kind of juggling your day to day role as a CEO. How have you found that side of things? For sure. I mean, first of all, I think you need a strong management team, other leaders in the team that have the same understanding of this and and leadership. style and values so they can transport the same message message in the end. um And then I think it really fluctuates. So there are times where I'm really, really busy. I need to go to conferences. I'm not that much you in the office or not that much working on on the laptop, um but other times where I really kind of try to take more time. And i there's kind of I have this feeling when it's time you know to spend more time with that. time I feel detached and I have the impression, okay, no, I think I need to be more involved now.
00:09:24
Speaker
um So it's it's it's a balancing act, but I also have this kind of agreement with everyone that whenever they need something, they should reach out and they do that. It's like also a learning process that we did that when someone new comes on board, it's usually you have this you know one, two, three months and then you try to collaborate and see how you can work together. um And that works out quite well, but obviously also there, especially with different cultural backgrounds and maybe also gender, not everyone is the one, you know, that really demands time. with That's where I need to be a bit more cautious. And I think that's and that's a trick. Yeah, yeah.
Key Traits of New Leaders
00:09:59
Speaker
And what are some of the key traits of a modern or new leader? And how would you kind of say they differ from say traditional leadership? Because I think there may be some people saying and thinking like, what is it? Like, it sounds like this, but what what what actually is the difference? And what are some of these key traits?
00:10:14
Speaker
Well, I think um it's very important that you, I mentioned this before, that you are capable of trusting and that you're capable of um delegating and kind of giving away some control. yeah So that that's something you you need to allow, right? it's it's If you have the feeling you need control of everything, then it I think it will be more difficult. And you need to be a very, very good and open communicator. Try to be transparent. Try to be also um kind of self-reflected when you talk. um You need to have a good um kind of culture when it comes to mistakes and and, you know, this kind of failure culture all around it. So um obviously it doesn't help if you if you have like this approach of, okay, mistakes.
00:11:01
Speaker
never should happen, or some mistakes should never happen. But still, you need to be you need to be open and flexible about it, reflect it, and then move on from it. And um you have and for me, that's something really important. um I think you need to be very self-conscious or self-reflective. You need to work on yourself. um It's a lot of personal work that you need to do um because I sometimes feel like it's you know like parenting work. yes
00:11:31
Speaker
one Not in the sense of you're actually a parent to them but in the sense of you you get triggered as well by certain behaviors and you need to be aware of that and you need to work on that because obviously you shouldn't allow this to kind of come through and then actually act on it. So that's why I'm saying it's a lot of personal work and it's a lot of self-reflection on a day-to-day basis and see how you can develop yourself And that also requires this kind of growth mindset, right? So you need to be able to actually um to work on yourself and to improve.
00:12:03
Speaker
Yeah and I guess it relates back to what you said right in in adapting to different leadership styles right it it it is it's a lot of growth for you but it's also growing with the person that you're working with right because people change all the time so what works for this person today hopefully it still works tomorrow but it may not work for that person in in a year's time so it has to be you have to be willing to grow and adapt to that person and and their changes and and their life changes and everything else that goes on to that I mean, could you give maybe a few examples of that successful ah adaptation to people and their changes and that growth mindset you mentioned? Sure. um I would say I have like two examples um which I saw on my team. um
00:12:46
Speaker
that like to two people that did a big change in in kind of their behavior and also there in their career. um One is my COO. She joined actually as a product owner um and was from the very first moment really hands-on and drove things and was you know so much involved or committed and I saw this potential of her shifting more towards operations um because she's someone, she gets things done. Yeah. I love that. So, and and kind of, if I would have, you know, just considered her, no, she's the typical product owner. She needs to do this and that. um She would have been stuck there and she wouldn't have run and in the same way. And now I see her, um now she's our COO. So she shifted, she transformed.
00:13:34
Speaker
And um she took over more and more responsibility and she's growing also in her personality. now You see that um she's really taking over. um this this leadership vision, she wants to be there, she wants to be a role model and so on. And that's a completely shift in not just her work, but also in her personality because she's growing with it. So that's really, really cool to see. you um Also from my perspective, right? So to see that I saw her as trans, I tried to fill facilitate that and to empower her. And now she is becoming a super cool COO.
00:14:09
Speaker
ah And a very similar, um yes, something very similar that happened to one of our product managers who joined who was kind of like was his first job and um it was a bit insecure and and slowly, slowly got more confident and now he's just driving our product management. wow the development So it's, it's, it can work out. But I also have the opposite examples where people are kind of overwhelmed with the freedom and you know, the responsibility. So you that's why I'm saying you need to be um able and open to actually work in a setting.
00:14:43
Speaker
Yeah, but I guess the benefit to to kind of this new way of leading is that you're, I guess you're allowing the people to lead you in in a way, right? Because I think traditionally, right, you'd have a person in a role, they'd be in that role for five years, they'd probably be good at other aspects, but because of their job title, or because of the know the way of the work, they'd never really get a chance to exercise those skills, which they do have. Whereas now I feel like, you know, we're confident enough to say, hey, I can do this, I think I'd be better off in this role. But I think leaders now are more open to those changes happening. And they're not as rigid to say, no, that's not your job. You know, that's not what you came here to do. And I think that's a really cool thing about this new way of leading. We're
Flexibility and Challenges of New Leadership
00:15:23
Speaker
allowing people to lead us, but still having control of what they're doing. It's not like, you know, everyone's in control, you know? No, for sure. And I think that's also one of the benefits when you work in a
00:15:33
Speaker
in a startup. But again, I think you also need to be aware that it might not work for everyone, right? So I also had the situation someone started as a more like a team assistant, then shifted more to to something else, to more the operations team and now that Like the the person wasn't really sure, is it the right thing or not? was Is the startup the right thing for me or not? Which is fine. If you try out, that's kind of what I'm trying to say. You try out even in leadership. um And if it doesn't work, it's fine for everyone. Just be transparent and try to constantly reflect on that. Share feedback. Feedback is also something that is super important in this whole new leadership. um That constructive feedback, of course. Yeah.
00:16:15
Speaker
You constantly also encourage everyone to speak up and to talk about things that don't really work. And that's where I see coming back to the first question of, you know, diversity and and inclusion. That's where I see sometimes um challenges or struggles, because um if you're coming from different cultures, it's not so obvious to speak up and to be so direct. We Germans do things, for example. Yeah, yeah. And how would you say this, this has affected
Impact of New Leadership on Company Culture
00:16:41
Speaker
the culture? Or how would you say, maybe, you know, talking about your company in general, but how do you think this new way of leading has affected culture in general? Because I see it having amazing impact, but I also could see it also doing the opposite, right? And, and, and it could be a bit of chaos, right? But how have you found this to affect the culture in your situation, but also in general?
00:17:02
Speaker
Um, I think it has a very positive impact. Um, everyone feels more involved, feels more committed, um, has the, the feeling of, you know, um, they can participate. Um, they can really have an impact. And I think this kind of having an impact and having, or doing something with purpose is super important nowadays. Like yeah for me, when I recruit people, um, then usually something that is, that is sad is like, yeah, I love your purpose. I want to do something with purpose with the, you know, with something really good you know and that does good for the society. um So I would say it it has a very positive impact. and But again, I think you need the right people for that. So not everyone is ready for it. And then maybe that's also a generational you know question. So I saw that some people, I'm not sure, I wouldn't generalize because obviously I haven't ah worked with so many of them, but I saw that people that are, let's let's say in their 50s,
00:17:59
Speaker
um They are used to this very hierarchical leadership style. They're used to someone else telling them, if you need to do this, you need to do that. And when I give them more freedom, it's it's like they don't really know how to yeah get a bit over once. So that's also something that you know you need to be careful who really fits to your culture, but that's in general. It's not just leadership or new leadership setting. Yeah I was about to say that that doesn't just link to to new leadership it links to culture in general but I think you're right I think when you have certain people who are used to working in a certain way it's the opposite it could take them a while to adapt versus you know say new leadership it could take those a while to adapt to the traditional way.
00:18:37
Speaker
I guess, you know, on that note, what are some of the common pitfalls you've seen when it comes to this kind of new way of leadership and
Pitfalls of New Leadership
00:18:44
Speaker
mistakes? And I think we've talked about all the to meat the amazing things and I think it's great, but what other some of what are the the kind of downsides to this new way of leading? Yeah, that's a that's a very good question. Obviously there are a lot.
00:19:00
Speaker
um So what I see is um but i'm I'm not sure if I'm striving with it, but but like at a right now in the company, I see that sometimes it's difficult to find the right balance between involvement and um sharing just the necessary. So people want to be a lot involved. They want to know everything, but at the same time, in this startup particularly, this means, you know, you have a lot of ups and downs and I cannot share everything with everyone because that the feeling of insecurity and
00:19:35
Speaker
um maybe something not being that stable. So that's something that I see, like the right amount of transparency, the right amount of of communication. Then um I had the issue, which it was related to what I said earlier, um that people kind of say they they are open and and share open feedback, but then they don't. And only a certain while you find out, okay, that was you know that didn't go so well, but they tell you three months later and it's like, Thank you for sharing. That's still super important, but now I cannot really act on it. So it's, to yeah, I think it really takes time with everyone um to to get used to these kind of new behaviors, new patterns. Also you have, it feels like there's a lot of expectations towards the the leader or the manager. um It feels like you can't really do it right and because there are so many aspects of it, right? And everyone needs something different. I guess that's the most challenging part.
00:20:35
Speaker
Yeah. And how have you how youre personally adapted to those challenges? Because yeah, there's probably so many different ways you can go about it. But I think what you mentioned is is so important. How have you found adapting to those challenges and and kind of how have you overcome these yourself? Um, I really like to, you know, just reflect and be open, try to talk to everyone, see, um, see what they need, how, what I can actually do, but also not try to everybody styling because that's not my job. I'm still the leader, right? And I still take decisions. And sometimes these decisions are also uncomfortable for everyone. So.
00:21:13
Speaker
um to Yeah, to find this balance is it's something that I try to reflect on. I work with coaches, so also to kind of challenge me and um because I i usually um like to just you know challenge myself or get challenged in the sense of that I wouldn't always think that my approach is the right one. So I ah like to you know um have exchanges with other experts or even even those coaches just to see how others might do it. and um Yeah, I think, I think that's it. I think what you said is key though, right? Because at the end of the day, you are still the leader and you will have to make decisions that may not work for everyone in the company, but it is still your role to do that decision making. So yeah, I can imagine that being hard, but equally you have to kind of own it, right? You have to say, I am the leader. I am in charge. I almost think of it like, you know, I don't know if you've watched in the UK, we have super nanny and it's where the nanny comes in to help the parents who are struggling.
00:22:11
Speaker
And the parents are still the parents, right? The kids may throw attention, but you are still the mum and dad, and it is still your job to make a decision despite what the kids want. So in your case, despite what your team wants, unfortunately, it is all down to you to kind of take that take that decision. Yeah, absolutely. and And it also means that um it's OK, you know, like also that you still have emotions and you feel uncomfortable with with certain decisions or a certain situation. um and And that's fine because a leader doesn't mean you're a superhero and everything is perfect, you know, always not everything. um I think, and you know, you need to be kind to yourself as well because it's it's challenging, you have to deal with a lot of expectations, not just from the inside, also from the outside and be okay with that. um That's tricky and I think maybe also for women it's it's something that is ah
00:23:01
Speaker
a bit trickier because you you're kind of trained in, you know, self-reflecting. You also not be be too confident. So that's something I had to work on a lot. Yeah, yeah.
Advice for New Leaders
00:23:11
Speaker
And you know to end on ah on a really important note, what is what would be the top tip you would give someone embarking on this kind of new new leadership, whether it's you know a new leader in general, someone that's kind of becoming a leader, or someone who has been a leader but is now having to adapt to this new world of leading? What would be the top tip that you wish someone would have told you that you could then share with other people who are also embarking on this on this journey?
00:23:37
Speaker
Well, first of all, I think it's very satisfying, so it's worth it um to do that. um And I think you... I need to think about that. It's a tricky one, I guess, because I guess from your side, it's like, well, why did no one tell me this? Yeah, i I think what I said, kind of in the beginning, it's a process. it's it's nothing that you know First of all, it's not there's no handbook out there for having this perfect new leadership in place for being the new leader. And and also, what are the right steps to get there? I think it's
00:24:15
Speaker
It's related to this personal work that you have to put in. That's something that you really need to be aware of. it It means you need to be okay with yourself, you need to work on yourself, and you need to be open to grow and also to grow with your team. And it's fine that it will take quite some time and quite some years also to get there, depending on how much you know work you put in that or how much yeah how open you are towards that. Yeah, amazing. ah Well, no, honestly, thank you so much for joining me for this conversation. I think I learned so much about the topic in general, about how to go about it, and I'm sure everyone else will as well.