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Episode 44 - Carmen Lincolne, Founder of Ivy Tech
19 Plays22 days ago
In this episode, Sade is joined by Carmen, the Founder of Ivy Tech, who is on a mission to help companies build borderless tech teams for startups and scale-ups globally.
Carmen shares her entrepreneurial journey, from transitioning from events management to founding her own tech company. She reflects on pivotal moments, including embracing the role of CEO, navigating cultural differences, and overcoming unexpected challenges.
Carmen also discusses the resilience required in the early days of Ivy Tech and the key lessons she’s learned as a founder. If you're looking to embark on your own entrepreneurial journey, this episode is packed with valuable insights and essential skills for success.
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Transcript
Carmen's Journey in Building Borderless Tech Teams
00:00:13
Speaker
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of Women Talk Tech. Today we're joined by Carmen, founder of Ivy Tech, a company building borderless tech teams to start up and scale up around the world.
Pivotal Moments and CEO Journey
00:00:25
Speaker
Her journey into entrepreneurship was shaped by pivotal moments, including embracing the role of CEO, navigating cultural differences and overcoming various unexpected challenges.
00:00:34
Speaker
In this episode, we discuss her transition from events management to founding her own tech company and the initial spark of inspiration behind the business idea, the lessons she's learned about resilience when looking back at the early days of founding Ivy Tech. She also shares some of the most important lessons she has learned since becoming a founder and the skills we feel are essential for anyone looking to embark on a similar journey.
Life Transition from Germany to Australia
00:00:55
Speaker
Amazing. So thanks for joining me, Carmen. I'm really, really excited for this conversation. Yeah, let's kind of kick things off. Tell me a little bit more about yourself.
00:01:03
Speaker
Yes, thank you so much for inviting me today. It's such an honor to talk about my story and about remote teams and more. So my name is Carmen. I'm originally from Germany. um I left Germany in my early 20s.
00:01:20
Speaker
to move to Australia where I lived for seven years. And then for the last six years, I have lived in the beautiful city of London. um I'm a wife to my wonderful husband, Rob, who's also an entrepreneur and a founder. And we have two little boys who are almost two and four and keep us very busy. Amazing, amazing.
00:01:41
Speaker
And, um, yeah, I think, I guess the reason why I'm on this talk as well is that I am a woman in tech.
Vision for Flexible Tech Hiring
00:01:48
Speaker
So I'm the founder of a company called Ivy tech. And our mission is to make basically tech hiring for startups more flexible and a little bit easier. So we build borderless tech teams and usually match them with startup companies in New York, London, Berlin, Sydney, wherever they may be.
Realization of Diversity and Inclusion
00:02:08
Speaker
wow wow incredible yeah excited to kind of dive deeper into that topic throughout the episode um i guess you know just very briefly what does dni mean to you and kind of why is it important i think it's always good to kind of start off with that question because i find that everyone has a different personal story and and kind of viewpoint of what it means but we all kind of come together to really work on it so yeah what does it mean to you Yeah, diversity and inclusion is something I must honestly say I hadn't been thinking about until my late 20s, which made me realize um I think how privileged and sheltered I grew up. I think I had a really wonderful upbringing in Northern Germany, um but it was very kind of white small town living. So I don't know, I thought we all have the same opportunities. So it was only when I started traveling
00:02:55
Speaker
moving to Australia, rubbing shoulders with lots of immigrant communities and then eventually setting up my business in Ukraine that I realized opportunity wasn't equal at all. And you know the workplace isn't diverse and it isn't inclusive or not as much as it could be. So I think there's one standout story, which if it's okay, I would love to share where I think the penny dropped for me.
Inspiration from Ukraine for Economic Opportunities
00:03:19
Speaker
It was when um on my first trip to Ukraine where I kind of started getting involved with Ukrainian software developers, which we'll talk about my company later, but which is where our roots lie. um And my husband was with me and we met some older Australian businessmen there who, I don't know, we met him through some connection. So we said, let's have dinner together. And I think he would be it would have been at least mid 60s, late 60s doing business in Ukraine.
00:03:49
Speaker
And he came with his Ukrainian wife, and I think she was, I mean, she wasn't even 30. It was um like, i'm I'm not saying this from a judgmental point of view. For me, it was kind of a marriage I hadn't seen in that before. He didn't speak Ukrainian. She barely spoke English. So it was more of an, I guess, more of a practical marriage. So he got, you know, they both got something out of it. And, you know, he took her family on holidays. He seemed to have treated her really nicely.
00:04:16
Speaker
But it was fairly obvious it wasn't a marriage that I guess neither of them have made um out of love and I found that really confronting. I hadn't seen that kind of marriage before and I remember coming home to my hotel and with my husband I just cried because I felt this woman didn't have the same opportunity as me and and um I don't know, maybe she was happy, you know, I probably asked all the questions I wanted, but I just was wondering, I'm like, what if she would have had a different opportunity in terms of work and her family? So that's where, for me, the penny dropped. And that's where I got really engaged with Ukraine and providing a kind of ah yeah basically economical opportunities through employment to young Ukrainian men and women in tech.
00:05:05
Speaker
Wow that's such a such a kind of heartwarming story and it's interesting because like I said everyone's got a different viewpoint and everyone's got a different personal connection with this whether it's for your own story or kind of seeing it you know first time through someone else and it's always quite you know interesting to kind of hear how everyone got involved in the mission. Yeah.
00:05:24
Speaker
Yeah, wow, wow,
Transition to Ivy Tech and Leveraging Skills
00:05:25
Speaker
wow. And you know, I'd love to kind of take us back to the beginning of your journey, right? Because I think that's, I love kind of hearing like how you got to, I mean, I love hearing about all the success, don't get me wrong, but I love kind of hearing like how you got to where you are now. So yeah, can you kind of tell us a bit more about your background and kind of what led you to kind of start Ivy Tech?
00:05:43
Speaker
Yeah, of course. So my background is in events management, which is something I trained in in Germany. And I remember when I finished my training and the company I kind of trained with, I did like a study and the work at the same time.
00:05:59
Speaker
My boss, he said to me, I just don't know where you fit. I just don't know what kind of role to give you in our company because it was quite common that the trainees would then get a long-term job with the company. And I felt so demotivated by this because I'm like, oh, I'm not really an expert in sales or in marketing or in this. So I got a bit of a hybrid role and I felt i felt it was a real shock to my system. I felt like professionally, I don't fit into anywhere.
00:06:27
Speaker
So it wasn't until I moved to Australia where I kind of did a few different jobs that I realized I'm a generalist and I'm very good at it. And I'm actually good at a lot of things at the same time. And I still wouldn't say I'm an absolute expert at XYZ.
00:06:44
Speaker
But I'm pretty good at most things that involve running a company. So in Australia, I learned how to run a small business through a lovely family there who gave me the opportunity to run a couple of their co-working spaces in Sydney. So that's why I learned all the ins and outs about bookkeeping, sales, clients, account management, managing teams, hiring, firing strategy. It was wonderful.
00:07:06
Speaker
And then when I met my husband, who's a serial entrepreneur, is when I really caught fire and I'm like, I think I can do this. I think as a generalist, I can run my own company. I've got the skills. I fell in love with Ukraine, with the people. I fell in love with startups. So together with my husband, we kind of laid the foundations of building what is now Ivy Tech. So we've set up a company in Ukraine. We've ended up hiring startups. They were sitting on our books, but they were working for companies.
00:07:35
Speaker
in the US and in the UK and Australia. So I feel like I fell into the whole founder journey. I never set out. I didn't grow up in a business family. My dad is a doctor. My mom works as a teacher. So I never learned about business or about stepping out on your own. So it was really my husband, I would say, who gave me a vision and a passion for it.
00:07:59
Speaker
Wow, wow. Do you know what I think? I mean, firstly, that's incredible that you've kind of been able to have a supportive partner throughout that journey, because I think whether you have a co-founder or not, being a founder is quite a lonely journey, especially when you consider doing it, you know, alone. But I think what I love about your story is that you kind of are a generalist. And I think so many people that I've spoken to before have, you know, found someone they're good at and just built on that and kind of found their niche whereas I think you having the kind of generalist background that is even more so important to be a founder right because it means you can do everything you can you've got you can wear all those hats whereas sometimes kind as a founder you've got your one niche and you then have to kind of seek external help to help with the bits you can't do either way is great either way is fine but I think it's really cool that you you are a journalist and you kind of made the most out of being able to do quite a lot
00:08:48
Speaker
Yes, I think it can be also a little bit overwhelming at times because I'm also interested in everything. I think at the beginning it was really difficult not to overdo it and it's like, okay, you can get help in recruitment or in marketing or in client account management just because you theoretically can do it all.
00:09:08
Speaker
You know, there is probably people who are actually experts at these things and do it better and faster than you. So um hiring those people and building a good team has been a challenge that has taken me a long time. And I feel like I've only recently arrived at a place where I've built a really, really good team.
00:09:24
Speaker
Yeah, no, that's incredible. And, you know, what was that initial spark of inspiration for you?
Rebranding Ivy Tech and Ukrainian Talent
00:09:30
Speaker
Because I think, of course, the story that you mentioned earlier, kind of seeing it first, and I'm sure would have been an impact. But what was that kind of pivotal moment that you said, okay, this is this is my idea and kind of here, I'm going to kind of hit the ground running.
00:09:41
Speaker
Yeah. So um again, back to my lovely husband. He was building a fintech company in Australia and I worked with him in there as his operations manager and we were working with these Ukrainian developers. um So he had kind of set up an entity in Ukraine and he was able, basically we were able to hire Ukrainian developers through that, getting an office space and so on. And it became I think Ivy Tech was a bit of a, I call it a neglected pet project that my husband had on the side. And it wasn't super well looked after. There was a bit of a team, but I just felt like there's something here, like there's a real opportunity to match incredible talent in Eastern Europe. You know, people who desperately want to earn good money in an ethical um set up and match them with
00:10:32
Speaker
companies in New York and London who um need incredible talent and just want to basically extend the existing teams they already have you know yeah um with just more cost-effective talent. So Yeah. What was the original, or what was the kind of the moment that got me going? I so i think I just saw the opportunity. I remember I said to myself, I'm like, can I have this business? Can I do it? Can I rename it? and i Can we move office? Can I be the CEO of this company and run it? And he said, yeah, because he basically didn't have anything to do with this setup. He just like
00:11:12
Speaker
set up a company many moons ago and then almost forgot about it. So I think it was a bit of curiosity to see what it would feel like to run the company and to just see how far can we push it. Yeah, wow, wow. And were there any kind of pivotal moments in that, in in your kind of experiences that kind of significantly shaped your your path as a founder and as an entrepreneur?
00:11:35
Speaker
a Yes. And I know we talked about this preparing for this call. ah It may sound very little, but
Challenges of Embracing CEO Role
00:11:43
Speaker
for me, a pivotal moment was giving myself the CEO and founder title on LinkedIn, because I think I fell into the journey a little bit.
00:11:52
Speaker
And I did never seek out to be an entrepreneur or a founder. I had a really hard time owning that. And it took me quite a while to be like, actually, you run the whole company, you named the company, you set up headquarters in London, which we didn't have before, you know, you've got huge client contracts. You are a founder, you are a CEO. So give yourself that bloody title.
00:12:14
Speaker
yeah yeah I had a really difficult time owning that and I think just writing it down and seeing it next to my picture on LinkedIn, um that did a lot for me and I feel like it made me you know ah sit up a little bit straighter and I was able to hold my head a little bit higher.
00:12:31
Speaker
um So that was pivotal ah for me. And then another moment was I had two very senior people in my company at different points in time who weren't really working out. And I had a pretty hard time ah accepting that, you know, there wasn't probably a future for them in my company and finding a way to part ways with them. But doing that had afterwards allowed my company to breathe again and see that a really brave decision, which I found very difficult at that time to make. And I was very, very scared because these people told me the company would basically collapse if I would fire them. Wow. but It didn't actually the absolute opposite happened in both instances. And just being doing that, sticking to what I believed was true, even if though it took me a while, was something that gave me a real confidence boost.
00:13:23
Speaker
And I think the team also respected me a lot more for it because they saw it coming and I think they were waiting for me to make a move. And when I finally did, it's yeah, I just made everything better.
00:13:35
Speaker
Yeah and going back to the kind of you know giving yourself that CEO title because I think that also links into you know feeling like you had the courage to get rid of those senior people. How like what was it about that CEO title that that was kind of not quite daunting I don't want to use that word and put it on you but what was it because yeah like I've had the same thing I spoke with to a lovely lady before and she was a doctor and she just didn't want to put doctor in front of her title and I was like why like you've earned it?
00:14:02
Speaker
um What was it about that CEO title that made you feel like you you all you were a bit reserved or or kind of didn't want to put it on LinkedIn? yeah I had certain associations with what a good CEO is and I didn't feel I was that and I was was worried people would look at me and match the person that they knew I was with that title and think, oh, but she's not really living up to that. She's not know delivering that.
00:14:29
Speaker
um So my my personal journey has been probably for the last 12 months to stop kind of comparing myself and stop thinking so much about what other people think about me. It's my journey, it's my truth and um that's what I'm here for.
00:14:47
Speaker
Wow, wow. Honestly, it's incredible, right? Because I think we always do that. We always compare ourselves to others. And that kind of CEO title feels like it's a hell of a lot of, you know, big shoes to kind of fill and kind of live up to. But really, we are doing that. You are a CEO. And that, you know, I find it so weird that, you know, when men start their own company, that's the first thing they do. They put you everywhere. Yes, for women, we we don't want to because we don't know if we can live up to it. I'd love to kind of touch upon the challenges you face because I think that's always, you know, interesting to kind of share this. So what was some of the biggest challenges you faced maybe in the kind of early days of of of the kind of startup days of Ivy Tech? Yeah.
Trust Issues in Ukrainian Developer Teams
00:15:26
Speaker
concept We're now a global company, so we hire developers anywhere in the world, but we did start in Ukraine and that's where we had our very original hub and it was our exclusive hiring market for many years. And the biggest challenge was for me to break into that community and build trust. I think the you know the software developers and even our local HR and recruitment team there was really suspicious of me and Rob and I would often travel together and both of us for a long time, they're like,
00:15:55
Speaker
you know, what are you really doing here? Why do you need us? Why are you setting up this company? So that was a huge challenge, just gaining the trust and getting people to accept us as ethical ah employers that wanted good for these people. And yeah, that was a huge challenge.
00:16:16
Speaker
I might say. And how did you kind of overcome that? Because trust takes a while to be built and and you know especially going into a country like Ukraine and and and and and other countries like on that sort of level. How did you overcome that? Because I can imagine that would have been quite tricky.
00:16:30
Speaker
Yeah. And you're absolutely right. It just took a long time. So we would travel there two to four times per year. I would take my um first Sunday multiple times, just really show up with the family, show my commitment. I would, you know, bring people presents from Australia or London. We would go to people's houses to meet their families. And it's just continuously showing up in person.
00:16:57
Speaker
Yeah and I guess building that kind of relationship first approach because I think sometimes when building a company we tend to get caught up in all the the the kind of sales money all of that and that is very very much important but in light of what you guys were doing it was that kind of people first approach and showing that you are a person and that that relationship is is equally as important to all the other pros that you get from doing what you're doing.
00:17:19
Speaker
yeah Exactly. And then I think as time goes on, we also put better structures in place. Like we have regular all hands meetings now, um obviously don't really visit Ukraine at the moment. And we've still got quite a few developers there, but we've got monthly all hands where all the developers come on a call and um our COO Cameron and I give an update on exactly what is happening in the company, what we're working on, you know, what our initiatives are. So I think the transparent leadership was really important yeah as well in building that trust.
00:17:50
Speaker
Yeah. And was there a moment in your, in the early days that you kind of felt like giving up or, you know, cause I can imagine, you know, it is quite a hard journey, right? And how did you kind of push through that? Yeah.
Handling HR Issues During Maternity Leave
00:18:02
Speaker
Well, there was one particularly moment where I had um a senior HR person on the ground there for a number of years and she went behind my back. I'm not going to go into the story, but she did something unethical.
00:18:17
Speaker
And that was at a time where I had my first baby. I was four months into my maternity leave. I wanted to take at least six months off, probably a little bit more. And I had a cover and my friend who covered me called me and said, Carmen, I hope you're sitting down. I was probably breastfeeding or something. Then I'm like, yes. And then she told me that this person did something pretty bad and it needed immediate action. So within, you know, we did a bit of ah an action plan and within a few weeks,
00:18:44
Speaker
I was on a plane with my I think then five months old son and I had to deal with that person in that whole situation and it rattled the company quite a bit so I just had to stand there and I was the first time mum and you know I felt quite vulnerable but at the same time I also felt really strong because I had just birthed a baby and I'm getting it right.
00:19:04
Speaker
So it was a really, ah it was a really wild time. But I think again, the team really appreciate like they had to learn what had happened, why this person is no longer with us. And, you know, obviously, these things always have um something it was interesting, because some people left as a consequence, but other people who had left previously came back to us and asked for jobs again. So it was a really crazy time. And that was a time where I just being at home, I'm like, why am I doing this? I can't even take six months off.
00:19:33
Speaker
with my first baby. um But in the end, when I was there and I had this Ukrainian nanny and she was in the office with my baby and we just dealt with the whole HR situation and I would, you know, pop in and out to feed him or go for walks. And it was actually a really precious time. Yeah. Looking back now, I feel like I forgot all the negative feelings we just pushed through, but that was a time where I thought, you've got to be kidding me why am I doing this?
00:20:00
Speaker
I could imagine that that feeling right but equally quite empowering right because like you said you've just birthed your baby like you're on the plane thinking like i can do this i'm gonna absolutely kill this but equally you're on the plane with me maybe thinking what the hell am i doing why am i doing this
00:20:15
Speaker
Yeah. Wow. Wow. Wow. Cool. And I guess learning and growth, right? Because I think going through the challenges like that, uh, only would have made you stronger both personally in a career professionally, all of that. So I guess from your side, what are maybe some of the most important lessons you've learned since starting your business and since maybe the challenges that you've overcome?
Financial Insights and Hiring Practices
00:20:34
Speaker
Yeah. Um,
00:20:37
Speaker
I'll do something boring first, but I think understanding your finances is incredibly important. Having a good financial model that you as the business owner really understand. I don't have you know i don't have a financial background, and but I know by now how to actually build financial models and how to read them and how to understand my P&L. I think that is if you don't understand your finances, you can't make good decisions.
00:21:03
Speaker
So that's just a very boring fact that I've learned and um that has given me real empowerment just knowing what's the future looking like. And then if I get a bit more to the fluffy stuff, um what has really important lessons I've learned is, I think back to what I said earlier, it's about finding my truth.
00:21:25
Speaker
like I really think especially female founders need to stop comparing themselves to others and looking you know how far have other companies come or their website so much better you know this leader has already been on five panels I've been on none this kind of thinking is something I want to stop and I hope a lot of other female leaders will stop because I think it's it's probably a waste of our energy and time it's our journey it's our truth we've got a our own thing we stand for And then one last thing I've learned is always reference check people you're hiring. am I didn't do reference checks. I regretted it. And vice versa. Every time I did do reference checks and the checks came back really positive, I was so excited to make that person an offer. I mean, if you talk, you know, if you hire, especially for key roles, if you hire for them and you speak to one or two previous employers and they tell you on a call, I would hire this person again tomorrow and you get to make them an offer and work with them.
00:22:24
Speaker
confidence as well. Yeah I mean I know that first time right because I think you know when I do it myself because we normally will carry a reference check for the companies we work with um but I think yeah you're right it's kind of like I know this person's great but I need someone else to tell me this person's great so I can like really really know it in myself but I think you know especially when hiring for your own company I look at it as like finding a babysitter or finding a nanny right you want this person to come into your company with you know if not the exact same interest in the company is what you would because of like when you hire a nanny for your own child you wouldn't let anyone look after your baby very similar to your starter right you wouldn't just let anyone come in and kind of do what they want um women reason right but i think yeah that reference check is really important it is because your whole company like your co
00:23:11
Speaker
Everything is built on the people and hiring the wrong people, it can be really, really damaging to companies. And, you know, there's a million stories out there where this unfortunately has been the case. If you've got a cancer in the company, it's going to leak through everything or a low performer. They've got to pull the whole team down or something like I had someone who did actually something unethical.
00:23:31
Speaker
It can be like, I'm so glad my company is alive after that. So um yeah, big, big like lesson for me that I will happily pass on because I think it's an easy one to avoid. It's like, just ask for a reference. Yeah. Yeah. And I think also I find as well when people don't want to give a reference, it's not a bad thing, but it also raises a few red flags as to why they don't want to.
00:23:53
Speaker
um and then that will make you rethink what you're doing not literally right you're not going to not hire someone because of that one thing but it does give you a bit of like a if you didn't have any concerns that could raise a few and then that could raise more and more more and it it it it protects you in the long run for sure yeah yeah yeah and I guess for yourself right what's the best piece of advice you perceived as a founder as an entrepreneur
00:24:19
Speaker
It wasn't direct advice, but I went to a really wonderful event in Munich last year, the bits and pretzels.
Balancing Ambition with Personal Life
00:24:27
Speaker
Maybe you know it, because now you've got a lot to do with Germany. And Michelle Obama was speaking, and I do vibe her, and she said, like, obsessed.
00:24:37
Speaker
but She's so fantastic. And she was speaking a lot about, you know, being an ambitious um female entrepreneur, but also a mother. And she said, as ah especially as a mother and in business or a very ambitious mother, you can have it all, but not at the same time. And that's been a bit of my mantra because I do find myself like I'm almost chasing myself most days. Like yeah I want to be the perfect present mom. I want to be a super driven,
00:25:06
Speaker
um you know, business owner and leader, but I'm also doing a bit of study on the side because I want to educate myself and hey, I also want to be super fit and healthy.
00:25:17
Speaker
what do i and always It's like Michelle just sits in my head and she's like, Carmen, you can have it all, but not at the same time. This is not the year where you need to be doing triathlons and winning 10 awards with your company.
00:25:32
Speaker
ah but like like And she was so encouraging because she was, I think, 60, about to turn 60 when she gave the talk. And she's like, and another chapter in my life is just starting. I'm like, yeah, still got so much time, you know, God willing. And that made me really excited. And i'm I'm learning to slow down a little bit.
00:25:52
Speaker
Yeah I do think though that is such a as a founder more importantly but even just as people in life right we always think we can I think also we we kind of have these high expectations and don't live up to them or we kind of fall short elsewhere and that's purely because we're trying to have it all at exactly the same time but I think especially the founder and a mother and a wife and everything else right and trying to be healthy all of those things you can have but like you said not at the same time there will be things that have to give and you will have to put your energy elsewhere for this meantime. Yeah, absolutely. And have your views changed on being a founder since you've kind of become one? um and And maybe as a CEO and kind of all of the above, have you have your viewpoints changed on it?
00:26:37
Speaker
Well, I feel like I didn't have viewpoints because I kind of fell into it and I came in blind. But now thinking back, especially about my struggles of calling myself a founder and a CEO, is that speaking to other founders and CEOs, and I know a lot of them, no one really has their shit together. You in Germany we say,
00:26:59
Speaker
Oh, what do we say again? and Something like, we all cook our soup with water or something. um It's just, we're all humans. We all only have 24 hours in a day. And um there's always something new. We all have challenges. And I think that's been really grounding. So just having really honest, one-to-one conversations with other founders and business owners has been really grounding and healthy for me.
00:27:25
Speaker
Yeah and I guess just being able to have those conversations right you know whether it's a bad one or a good one we always learn from just speaking with others ah but especially as a founder because you'll find that everyone goes through a similar challenge in their own way so you don't feel so alone you don't feel like you're failing because everyone else is going through the exact same thing if not times 10.
00:27:45
Speaker
yeah And a lot of them, whether men or women, do have self-doubts. I think that's what I found surprising as well. It's not just women who struggle with imposter syndrome or self-doubt. Men do too. Yeah, yeah, totally, totally. And I guess for others aspiring, you know, to to be a founder, what skills or knowledge do you think are essential to to the path which you've had and to the path which, you know, others should maybe embark on as well? Yeah.
Key Entrepreneurial Skills
00:28:12
Speaker
I think being um good at networking is a huge win. I must say I would put the majority of my personal brand and Ivy Tech's. I don't know if you want to call it success or not, but you know, we're here kicking. We've got amazing clients. um So I would call it a success and I would put it down to my networks. It's the going to events, you know, being authentic. um I've just joined a founders network here in London. I'm meeting wonderful people through that. I'm meeting another.
00:28:43
Speaker
mum entrepreneur tonight for a drink after work, this kind of stuff um I think is incredibly um valuable. And I think people ask me a lot because networking is a bit of my thing. How do you do that? And I think it's just show interest in other people and ask good questions and bring your true self.
00:29:01
Speaker
So I think that's a big one. And then resilience, bravery, and empathy. I think there are three really big values that I see most entrepreneurs bring and practice. It's like a muscle they're practicing. Every time you have a challenge and you don't give up, back to one of your questions earlier, you train that muscle and you come a little bit more resilient and then you're ready for the next and the bigger challenge. I mean, I had a war breakout on my company. What the heck? You know, like who can prepare you for that?
00:29:29
Speaker
So, but yeah, it's been another amazing experience. Quite humbling. Yeah, yeah. And then I think just um another skill or knowledge is just keeping an eye on what's going on in the world economy, politics, I think having a rough general understanding of the moving pieces in this world can be really helpful to make good business decisions.
00:29:52
Speaker
Yeah well I couldn't agree more because there's so many aspects of being a founder that you do have to kind of bounce back from right and being resilient in those situations not only helps you but also helps your company because you now will go to the next situation having learned from that situation you've gone through already and are able to kind of hit it you know like with the ground mining because you now have all that knowledge but if you would have given up and kind of thought yeah forget this I don't know how to deal with this I'm going to not deal with it what whatsoever you wouldn't have been able to learn from it what you know at all Yeah, absolutely. yeah And I always like to end with like one piece of advice you'd you'd wish someone would have given to you or you would like to kind of share with other female founders other than what you've just said. know One piece of advice which you'd say to another female founder or kind of women in leadership, what would this be?
00:30:39
Speaker
I think focus on your own journey. Don't get too distracted by what other people do. If you are convinced that, you know, you want to have your own company and that you're solving a real problem that is beneficial to the good of this world and to the good of others and to the good of your family, then do it. Wow. I love that. Love that. Thank you so much for sharing that comment. Really, really, really really insightful. But yeah, again, thanks for joining me. And yeah, I'm i'm i'm sure everyone will love this conversation.
00:31:09
Speaker
Thank you, Said. It was really, really fun to talk about it.