Transcript
Speaker: Let's make sure they take ownership of it because it is an important growth opportunity for them. And it's like the developmental step they need before they actually go to college. I'm so glad you said that. And it's so true. It's like parents a lot of times think that the admission or the acceptance is the finish line when really i'm the child still has to go there and thrive for four years without you supervising, hopefully. Right.
Speaker: Hello and welcome to the Positively Healthy Mom podcast where positive parenting meets wellbeing. I'm your host, Laura Olinger, teen and young adult life coach and founder of Positively Healthy Coaching. And today I'm very excited to introduce you to my guest, Lisa Goldstein, who is a college consultant and founder of Your College Process.
Speaker: So welcome to the show, Lisa. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here. I'm excited to be here. I feel like our timing is great. You know, we're recording this in October. You know, whoever you know if you listen to this in the future, like, you know, that feeling of, you know, the back to school stress and the pressure and everybody getting on schedule.
Speaker: But for seniors, there's pressure. They're just, they're doing their applications or they're doing their essays or whatever that might be. For the juniors, it's like, oh, have you done any tours yet? Have you taken the SAT or ACT yet? Like, have you done your tutoring? Have you done this? Have you done that?
Speaker: For sophomore moms and freshman moms, right, they're hearing the noise. They're hearing the stress. They're hearing the pressure. They're even seeing it on social media. um Inevitably, they have friends or family who have kids who are either already in college or looking into college.
Speaker: Then we've got the middle school audience who knows that's coming someday. They don't know exactly what it looks like, but they know there's something to it. And so just, Lisa, as you and I were prepping for the show, we were just coming up with this idea of like,
Speaker: stress and pressure and FOMO. Like, do you have this tutor? Do you have this score? do you When have you done that? Right. And it just becomes so overwhelming. So just kind of starting off, like, how do you address parents and the kids? But let's start with the parents who are just so stressed out about this process.
Speaker: Yeah, such a good question. it is there There is noise coming at them from all sides. Like you said, social media is a big one and I can talk about forever. That's another podcast probably, but there's just so much messaging. When you go to a soccer game, you're at a barbecue, you're at a school event, you are hearing people talk about it constantly. And inevitably it makes you feel like, oh my gosh, are we not doing enough? Am I not doing the right thing? Are we too behind in the process? Is my kid going to be okay? So starting off with the process, and it doesn't matter what age your child is, this can this goes for middle school kids through high school. What I always say to parents is you have to remember your child is an individual.
Speaker: So you have to put blinders on in a way because all of the noise we're hearing about everyone else's kids... really have nothing to do with ours. Yes, there are certain things, you know, everyone's going to do. We want to visit schools. We're going to have to take the s SAT. um Those are sort of like part of this process. But the the thing that parents really can do that makes a difference is try to filter out the noise. When people are talking about, oh, well, my neighbor went so-and-so and he got an early decision, he did this. That's so wonderful for your neighbor. That has nothing to do with your child because
Speaker: They are totally different people. So pay attention. You know, what what are your child's strengths? What are their interests? What are their hobbies? What's their personality? What are their goals? Where someone thrives is not where your child thrives necessarily. So we really have to like get in touch with who our child is so that we can find the path for them. And remember that all of this noise we're hearing has really nothing to do with our child. And that is what I would say both to the kids and to the parents is like the biggest thing starting off.
Speaker: I love that you're saying that. And this is a message i give my own clients a lot of times where I just I say this over and over again, stay in your lane, stay in your lane, stay in your lane. Like I literally say it three times in a row when I say it. ah because We need that as reminders. And I have a client who he's a college kid and he was at the gym the other day and he says, I noticed myself just like looking around and looking at other people. And I'm like, okay, tell me more about that. You know, is it you're being curious? Like, who are these people? Should I be friends with them? Or is it a comparison way? Are you stacking yourself in this social hierarchy some way? And he's like, no, I think it's more the second one. I think it's more the negative one. um ah And I'm like, stay in your lane. Right. And so there's that.
Speaker: But I also want to like throw out like, this idea of the more experienced moms in kind of getting advice from them, right? And so what I find personally is that it is a balance of we want to hear, well, who did you use or how did you do it or or what is your advice? like How does your child like that school? Can you tell us about it? So it's like you do want to talk to them and you do want to have these conversations as long as not negatively either comparing your child, i think, right or yourself feeling caught up in that rat race feeling. Like we all know that feeling of like, oh, they have this, they have that. And it makes you feel bad. So it's kind of like, I would say just like pay attention to how it's making you feel. Like, is this information that you can use or is it something that you're comparing and it's making you feel bad? What are your that? Exactly. Yes. No, that's such a that's such a good um way of putting it. I mean, yes, there's so much to be learned from somebody who's gone through the process already. They've already done it. So, of course, we can learn from that. What I would say with that is, like, focus on the bigger thing. So, yes, maybe they had an SAT tutor that was super helpful. Great.
Speaker: We can get that information. What we don't need is your child's scores, and we don't need to share our child's scores. You know, we don't need to know what your kid's GPA was, and we don't need to share what our child's GPA is. That's where it gets... really, i think, toxic because then we're directly comparing that we're starting to feel bad about ourselves when people are talking about, well, my child's doing 10 activities and the captain of this and all of these things. Again, our kids are totally different. So it's that direct side-by-side comparison that is unhealthy. But overall advice, sure. Like, was there a tutor? You highly recommend it. Was there
Speaker: You know, a certain ah kind of tour, like ah a campus that um you really enjoy that you think might be a nice fit. Sure, those things are very helpful. But I think when it gets to like the nitty gritty details of our children and their children, that's where we overshare a little bit. And I think it gets to be...
Speaker: um You know, really hard on the kids, too, when that's happening, because the kids will get their scores and and or their acceptances or whatever it is, and they're posting it right on social media. And it's like, why do we need to do this? Why do we feel the need to make everything public? Like, it is OK. I say to my clients, like, if somebody asks you what your score was or your GPA or ranking or where you're applying even, it's you are totally allowed to say, I'm not sharing that information. I'm just going to kind of keep it private. And, you know, when I decide where I'm going, I'll share it. That's fine. And I think that that then shows people, oh, wait, maybe I don't need to share all of my private information either. Maybe we don't need to do this. Maybe that's not helpful. So I think we just have to watch what we're asking for and make sure it's sort of general information and not very specific details about your child that we're sharing.
Speaker: That's so interesting because I wonder if there's like a cultural component to that as far as where we are in the country. So I was sharing with you earlier, i used to live in the East Coast. I lived there for nine years and I did not have children at at the time, but I had some older friends and, you know, i got to learn about, you know, life raising your child ah in the Boston, Massachusetts area, which is, as you know, extremely academically competitive because of all the IVs in that, um you know, within driving distance.
Speaker: I found the pressure there was more academic. What's interesting is I'm in Texas. It's not that we don't care about academics. We absolutely do. But there is this huge emphasis on sports and sports competitiveness. And so, like, I'm wondering if to, like, different parts of the country, there are different things. Because I don't think, ah like, where I am, people are doing the score sharing as much, although the kids do. don't think the moments are as much. Right. The moms do absolutely love to share everything. yeah Their kids scored the little inch on the this and the tech touchdown and the goal. And so the theme though here is just like having this awareness about like, what is private family information versus like white other people's information? Like, where's your boundary on that? And sometimes we need to tell ourselves like, oh, wait, I don't have to say that. Right. I don't have to Right. Like, it's like, is that helpful? I try to think like, is this helpful in any way? Or is this just me either A, wanting to brag about my child or is this the other person wanting to do that? And it may not just be that. I think some people are so caught up and so stressed. They're just, they're desperate for information. They're desperate for help. So they go about it in ways that maybe aren't the most productive. And I don't, I don't think that there's bad intent. All of this is coming from well-intentioned parents. We all just want the best for our kids. You know, it all is coming from a good place.
Speaker: And that's kind of what I talk about a lot in my book is like, Oh, whatever we're doing for our kids through this process, we're just trying to help them. It's just, it isn't always helping them because sometimes what we are doing is increasing the anxiety level on our kids because we're so anxious. um You know, when we hear all this messaging, when we're walking, like I'm telling you, I'm on the East Coast, I'm in Connecticut. I go to walk the dog in my neighborhood and some of my friends have kids going through this process.
Speaker: They are talking about where their kids are applying this year. I hear scores, I hear GPAs and I'm thinking like, you don't need to be sharing this information with each other. You know, it's not necessary. And it's not that they are trying to do anything wrong. They're just trying to do the best for their kid and find out information.
Speaker: um But at the end of the day, it's like, is this helpful? Is this productive? Is this meaningful? Is this going to change anything in our process? You know? And so what I really like to tell the parents is like, watch your own anxiety levels because you I mean, you work with teens. like Teens pick up on it. Even if we're not saying, I'm so anxious about the college process, they pick up on our body language. They pick up on the energy in the home. They pick on on the fact that you are telling them what you know your boss's son got into. like They're hearing all of this messaging. And so now they're thinking, oh, I need to do that. Or my mom thinks, if I don't do that, I'm not doing the best that I can. you know like they They pick up on that. So
Speaker: A big thing for me is like helping the parents work through their own anxiety and finding those coping strategies so that they're modeling that for their kids and they're not passing on the anxiety about the process on to their kids. Yes, yes. And I just have one more point on this little piece before we move on. But kind of also you said like, is this helpful, right? But like my little litmus test that I use is if it's a social media post about your child, is this a celebration? Like, are we celebrating my child got the touchdown? Got him to the school, right.
Speaker: Right. Like, is this a celebration or is it bragging? Yeah. And so that's the thing. It's like, I don't want to stop people from celebrating. We're not the, you know, we're not the no fun police or whatever. Like we just want to be mindful and intentional about what is the really purpose of me sharing this information. And is it just like, I'm proud of my child. I want to share.
Speaker: Or is it like trying to make other people feel intimidated or bad or or whatever, like something negative? Exactly. Yes, I know. It's hard because I know so much of life is lived on social media these days, and that's just kind of how it is. And and I have feelings about it, clearly. um But yes, when people are posting those like I got in videos, it is amazing for you. And that is great.
Speaker: I try to, you know, talk to my students about like, let's think about the other kids in your high school and maybe they didn't get. great news and that's really hard like a lot of schools here i again i'm on the northeast they'll have like a facebook page just for their high school and the seniors as they're getting their decisions in they're posting it on that group great for the kids that got in for the kids that didn't it is so brutal and they still have to pretend to be happy for the other kids who did get in it's just so hard you know so i feel like sometimes celebrations can be more um
Speaker: can be quieter and more intimate. And it's just with your family, like, does it need to be announced all over the world? i don't know. I mean, that's, you know, for families to make that decision. But just so much of this, everything being on social media now, I do think can be problematic. And I think it does increase the the comparison culture with this whole process.
Speaker: Yes. Well, you led me right into the next piece here. So just this idea of um what can you do as far as like when you're working with a family and you are, you know, you're supporting them through the college decision and college application process, which in itself is kind of a...
Speaker: linear process. Like it's a, it's a left brain activity, let's say, like, it's just kind of just getting some things done. However, you're also providing this like emotional support. And um so share about that because I know you have, tell us about the book, like that can help families like really just take to heart in a positive way, like what their process is.
Speaker: Yes, yes. So basically, I started as a school counselor and then um started working privately with students through my private practice. And what I, so a lot of it, like you said, it is linear. You know, we are literally meeting deadlines. We're writing essays. we' We're filling out applications.
Speaker: And the students need help with that. You know, they need that help with organization and and and timelines and all of that. But what I was noticing and and having a counseling background is that The mental health of these kids has been declining greatly over the last, I want to say, at least five years, if not more, because the pressure on getting into schools has gotten so much greater. um It might be because of social media. It might be the process has changed. It's harder than it was when I applied to college. There's just more that goes into it. So the emotional support, like you're saying, is what I was finding they needed the most of. i would have kids like,
Speaker: hysterically crying over for their applications or like not feeling well, feeling physically ill, not being able to go to school. I mean, like the stress was really getting to them. And so that inspired me to write this book. It's called The Compassionate College Process. So it has everything in there about the college process itself. That is there. However, what is different about it from other college books, I would say, is that it is helping the parents navigate the process in a way for their kids where they are really finding joy, they're finding connection with them, and they're putting less stress and pressure. And a lot of it is the messaging the parents give. It can even be like simple statements. One of the things I love to talk about is
Speaker: um Should statements. So there's that saying, um you know, don't should on yourself. It comes from a a psychologist. And it's a funny play on words, but it's actually really meaningful because if we think about all the things that people are shitting all the time on us, right? Like for the students, you should get a 1500 year SAT. You should get all age junior year. You should try out for that team and be the president of student council and join 50 things, right? Right. They're hearing a lot of those statements, but it takes away from like, what do they truly want? You know, what are, what actually brings them joy? What is authentic for them?
Speaker: So I talk to parents about listening to their messaging, like what they're telling their kids, rephrasing, like even shifting the should statement to something simple like, hey, why don't we talk about you know your game plan for junior year, what classes you might want to take, and have it be like a conversation, something that they they do together. like It's a team. It's not me against you. It's not me nagging you. It's like, how can we go about this process together where I can help you and really try to find some like connection through it? you know It can actually be a really fun process. I know you said your your daughter's a freshman. I mean, when you're visiting schools and kind of learning about different schools, it can be very enjoyable if we let it you what mean? If we let there be levity and fun. um So a lot of times there's the messaging that parents give. I talk to them about that. One big thing i I mentioned for parents to do is like before you even start the college process, make a document about your child. I call it like a strengths document. You can call it whatever. And just write down...
Speaker: things you love about your child. It doesn't have to be academic. Like they they got an A in this course. Mostly i want it to not be academic. Like they're really great with checking in on their grandparents. They will take the trash out of our elderly neighbor when the weather's not nice. You know, they're great at um picking up their younger sibling, whatever it is. Just these things that you recognize about your child, because it's nice to keep those in mind. The the process is stressful. I'm not going to just say, like, you can remove all stress from the college process. That's not the case. And you will get annoyed with your kids. And that's also normal, right? Like, if they're not doing everything the way you want, you will get annoyed with them. But if you have this thing to come back to of like, these are all the wonderful things about my kid, and keep that in mind. It's a nice way to start the process. Like you're starting from ah a positive point rather than an anxious point, if that makes sense.
Speaker: And I love that idea because it it keeps um us from getting that tunnel vision. um yeah i i had a friend who recently was saying, like, I feel like all I do is talk to my son about college and this and that. And so what she did was take him on. This was right before school started, but she took him on a short trip, like a weekend trip. It wasn't a college visit. It was like a little vacation. Right. in a way She's like, nice need to, like, reconnect with my son because I realized that. This tunnel vision. And so I love the idea of the strengths document because it does give you that broader view. And it's like, they're not just this little thing of like a i a cog in a wheel of this process. Right. It's like they're a whole different thing. They have this whole other life. There's all these other thing parts to them. Exactly. And it starts to become like everything your child does becomes part of their college process. Like if they decide they want to stop, you know, doing swim team and their parents are like, well, what is that going to look like to colleges? Or their grades dipped a little. Well, what is that going to look like to college? Like everything's but about college. And it's like they're more than that. They're a person. You know, there's all of these other parts. And then we have to keep that in mind. And what you were saying, like finding that its connection with them um is so important. What I also recommend is set aside a certain time each week for college talk. So whatever works for your family. Sunday evening, we have an hour. We're going to, you know, talk about college, see where you are with things and just get that done. And all of the other time has to be protected time so that your kids do not come home or get into the car immediately.
Speaker: And worry about being bombarded with like, did you do that essay? Did you talk to that teacher? did All those questions. It gets to be like an emotional minefield for them. So this way they know, okay, college talk on Sunday. Other than that, I know that like we're just going to be eating dinner together and talking about other things. And that can protect the relationship too. I absolutely love that idea. And I'm going to and take it upon myself to do that with my own kids because, you know, it's like you just randomly think of things or you're in the car and you're like, oh, have you thought about this school or did have you have to. Right. And it just like it. Yeah, you're right. Like it feels like, oh, they never know when it's coming. And not that it's always negative for them because they're thinking about it, too. yeah But more that it is this concentrated like this is our work hour to to to address these things. But then they feel right.
Speaker: seen and heard in the other areas of their life. Like they are this whole other person. Because the thing is, they care about the here and now for the most part. And so if they're having friend drama or something going on at school, like they need that to be taken care of. They need that to be talked about and not just this college piece. So, um man, you're giving great tips. Like what are your other ideas that you share um as far as parents just like really connecting with their child and protecting that um that piece? Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, so one thing I love is, and I tell the parents, like, you have to have your own coping strategies for anxiety going into this. And a lot of times as parents, we don't have those until we have been in some kind of like health crisis or whatever it is, you know, like where, okay, I need to realize i have to figure out how to get healthier and and find coping mechanisms. So finding what works for you and modeling for your kids and then, if possible, and it's not always possible, but trying to do them together. So for example, maybe hiking is like therapeutic to you. Doing that with your child so that that way you're both getting that kind of therapeutic outdoor time. You're getting physical exercise, but you're also together connecting, if that makes sense. Doing, um you know, walking the dog together is another one. If it's just going to grab a Starbucks together, like positive reinforcement is very helpful for teenagers.
Speaker: as you know, working with them, their brains aren't fully developed. So they can't always think long game. You know, for them, if they have 12 applications due, we cannot always wait until all 12 are completely done to kind of like reinforce that they're doing a good job. So if they get five questions done, tell them, you don't need to buy them something, but like tell them,
Speaker: I'm really proud of you. You did five questions today. and Like you're really getting there. And then maybe we reward them so it can just be, you know, positive reinforcement like that. Or maybe you do go grab a Starbucks or you watch a show together, whatever it is. Like positive reinforcement along the way helps them to feel like they're accomplishing things and that we're not just focusing on like what else has to get done. What didn't you do? It's more like what you did do because that will keep motivating them. And it again, it keeps that connection. It keeps the relationship intact with the the parents and the teens.
Speaker: Yes, I love that. Because the thing is, I know there are so many moms that turn into the college police. And i think some truly, like, for some reason, enjoy that that identity for themselves. But I think most of us don't enjoy that. We don't want to be that. We don't we don't want to go there. So I'm just absolutely loving this. I'm, like, eating this up. um And what I'm thinking of right now is, like, you know, we're going into the holiday season.
Speaker: And we're going to be around family. so I'm curious if you have any tips about similar to kind of like when you walk by your neighbors, like boundaries as far as like what's shareable, what's not shareable. Because if your child's in the room and grandparents are like, hey, where are you applying to do right? And there's cousins and things like how do you protect your family and the integrity of your privacy? Right.
Speaker: Yes, that's such a good question. And it it yes, it's interesting how a lot of the pressure could come from family. And it's not, again, it's not a bad intent. They're just curious. But if it's like the 20th time your child got asked where they're applying that week, it gets to be a lot. So what I would say is like have conversation but with your kid before and say, what are you comfortable sharing? Do you not want to share where you're applying until everything's said and done? are you okay with it? If they're okay with it, fine. If they'd rather not talk about it, it is totally fine at Thanksgiving or whatever it is to say, um you know what, we're just, there's a lot of pressure on this process. We decided not to really discuss it until he decides, she decides where she wants to go. And if they push you on it, you can say, that's, you know, that's our decision. Sorry, you don't like it, but that's our decision. It's hard. I'm not saying they're not going to roll their eyes or get annoyed with you, but...
Speaker: you're protecting your child. Protecting yourself too, because do we want everyone's opinions about this school and that school and where they think, you know, do we need all of that? Maybe. And that's okay. Depends on the family. right um But if you know that that's not going to be helpful for for your family, you can set that boundary. Again, it is not easy. It might take practice in the car before you get there, but it is something you can do. And I notice when people do it,
Speaker: they it tends to spread this like, okay, we don't need to talk about it all the time. like they that's you know And then it kind of shuts it down and you move on to the next topic. I love that. Yeah, it sets the precedent. Like, okay, this topic is no longer open for discussion. right Case closed.
Speaker: um The other thing I thought of too just now is maybe even prepping, and a depending on the relationship with your family, like even prepping the adults ahead a time. Hey, my kids really stress out about this. um Can you not mention this during Thanksgiving dinner, right? Like, let's just not have that. Exactly. It's like politics and religion. We don't talk about it at the holidays. Exactly. right Politics, religion, and college admissions are off the table. We're adding that to the list. yeah I agree. Yes. I've done that before because i was working with my I've worked with my nieces on their college process. And I've mentioned to extended family, like, hey, it's stressful. Like, especially the holidays are right in the time of like yeah and the applications going in and you're hearing decisions. So it's really hard. And it's like just I know they're just asking out of curiosity. They just care. You know, there's no bad intention. But it's like, let's just not bring it up. Let's give them a holiday where they can just.
Speaker: eat, enjoy their family, have fun, and not have to talk about you know their college applications. And most of the time, people respect that. And if not, they need a gentle reminder. But that's that's OK.
Speaker: Hey, it's Laura. Let me take a quick minute to talk to the moms wondering, is my teen or young adult just going through a phase? Because sometimes what looks like pulling away, people pleasing or caring way too much about what everyone else thinks is really about something deeper.
Speaker: It can sound like, am I enough? Do I matter? Do I belong? And sure, some of it may pass, but your teen or young adult is figuring out who they are right now, and those questions can shape the choices that they make.
Speaker: That's where I come in. I help teens and young adults build the mindset and skillset for confidence, connection, and direction. If you're wondering what your child might need right now, let's talk about it. Book a free 30-minute discovery call at PositivelyHealthyCoaching.com. We'll talk about what you're seeing, what's underneath, and what might help.
Speaker: Okay, back to the show. You know, the thing is, kids are also needing a mental break, not just from the college process, but they've already had their own finals. They're stones like that. That is their actual break from school, regular school. but So I think that's so important. Well, um any last tips before we wind down as far as like what it would be like to work with you, how it's helpful? Like just share a little bit more about your process and how it's helpful.
Speaker: Sure. Thank you. So yes, when I work with a student, I, you know, from the beginning, I really try to just get to know who they are. I'm not just going to say, what's your test score? What's your GPA? yeah um Because there's so much more to a student than those. I'm trying to get to know those interests, those strengths, those goals. We want to figure out like what would be a good environment for them. You know, there is not, it's not a one size fits all situation. And there's not just one school for, you know, one person. That's, I like to try to explain to people this whole dream school thing. While it might sound lovely, there are many schools that you can be happy with. So let's not put all our eggs in one basket. You know, maybe we love this place, but we're also going to find other places we love. And that way, at the end of the day, you have options. So really, one of the major things is being open to places maybe you haven't heard of. Maybe they're not like the top 10 schools that everybody's talking about, but it might be a place that you can thrive at. So what I tell people is like, be open-minded
Speaker: Be aware you're going to learn about yourself on this journey and we're going to come up with some places you never heard of. That might be a great fit for you. You know, so kind of be open minded and try to remember we're we're learning, we're we're researching. We don't need to know everything about the rest of our lives.
Speaker: that when you're 16 years old. And that's okay. It's a journey. It's a process. And another tip for parents, I would say, is as much as we want to help and we are going to help, we cannot do the process for the kids. It is their college process. Often what I see is when parents, again, well-intentioned, they want to help, they want to take things off their kids' plates, they start filling out applications. They start over-editing essays to the point where, like, it's their essay. um They're calling admissions officers pretending to be their kids. I see that a lot. well So, oh, my goodness, yes. Like, a lot. So, reminding to parents, like, if we don't let the kids be the driver of this, you know, they are the ones going off to college the next year. If they weren't the ones doing the application to get in, how do we know they can actually excel at that school? They're the ones going to class and taking the test and writing the paper. So we don't want to take this process away from them. Yes, we want to help keep them organized. We want to check in. We want to proof their papers. Sure, all of that. But let's make sure they take ownership of it because it is an important growth opportunity for them. And it's like the developmental step they need before they actually go to college. I'm so glad you said that. And it's so true. It's like parents a lot of times think that the admission or the acceptance is the finish line when really i'm the child still has to go there and thrive for four years without you supervising, hopefully. Right. I have some friends who just finally stopped tracking their kid on Life360. They're freshmen. They finally gave it up. They're like, OK, I won't do it anymore. And so they have to be responsible for themselves away from home. Right. And so it's like this is like an easing in process and slowly and letting go. And so, yes, it's all about them taking ownership of their own life so that way they can do it once they're there and feel empowered that they're like, I earned this spot here. And so therefore, I'm going to take more responsibility for my own success. Lisa, this has been so awesome. How can people find you going forward?
Speaker: Yes, thank you so much. So my website is yourcollegeprocess.com. The book is The Compassionate College Process. It is on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, anywhere you get books. And there's a link um on the website as well.
Speaker: Thank you. Oh, man, this has been so helpful just personally. And I know my audience is going to eat this up because it's such a hot topic. So thank you so much for sharing your time with us today. Yes, thank you for having me. This was wonderful. Thanks.
Speaker: When you get a chance, please go to the show notes and click on the link ratethispodcast.com slash tphmom to give my podcast a rating and review.
Speaker: And if this episode resonates with you, be sure to share it with your mom friends who are going through the same things. Be sure to tune in for next week's conversation. Until then, keep up the good work.
