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Bonus Episode: Top 5 Non-Sword Wielding RPG Protagonists
70 Plays1 year ago
Come listen to Poly & Kj discuss what is probably the most difficult top 5 they've done to this point!
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Transcript
Introduction and Challenge: Non-Sword RPG Characters
00:00:00
Speaker
All right, so we are back with another episode of Turn Based Tangents. It's another bonus episode, so if you are listening, this is extra content. Today we're going to be covering main characters in RPGs that
00:00:20
Speaker
don't use a sword or any sword-like weapon as their primary weapon. So shout out to Roy Brewer, because Roy's actually the one that brought this up. Yes, yes. Shout out to Roy, because this was a challenge. Oh, this was fun. I had a good time with this one. It was fun thinking about it, yeah, because there's just so many RPGs that have so many main characters with the stereotypical sword.
00:00:45
Speaker
And I actually put a slightly bigger restriction on myself because I went with.
00:00:52
Speaker
also no silent protagonists. So I went with like no swords, no dual swords, no swords attached at the knives or anything like that. I went, yeah, no knives, no daggers, no, no sword like things. Yeah. I had to reach, I had to reach into, into my tactics roots to, uh, to pull out a character. I will not even gonna lie. So
00:01:17
Speaker
I didn't have to go too crazy and do it. But I think this order might change a little bit as I progress in certain things. But no, this was a lot of fun to think of. And I like that we're doing this episode. Thanks again for Roy for the
Character Spotlight: Yuna from Final Fantasy X-2
00:01:33
Speaker
idea. But I'm super excited to see your list, to see if we have any. I think we're going to have at least two
00:01:41
Speaker
My guess is we're going to have three the same. Not in the same spots, but I think there's going to be overlap on three of them. You know four of the five characters on my list. So you know. Three four ish. OK, yeah, so you definitely know, like I said, you definitely know four of the characters on my list. One of them, I don't think you know, but. I would actually be really surprised if you knew this character on my list, so.
00:02:10
Speaker
Shall we get started? Yeah, let's do it. I'll kick us off because I think you started the last one. Yeah, I think I started the last one and that was a mind. That was a mind fuck.
00:02:25
Speaker
Number five on my list is actually number four and five were tough. Like I feel like they're they're kind of close. But the reason this character is number five is because the reason I feel as though they're such a good protagonist in this game is because they are a like secondary protagonist sort of in another game. Oh, OK.
00:02:53
Speaker
So, number five on Melissa's Yuna, Final Fantasy 10-2. Yuna's primary weapon is... Oh, that's such a good... She dual-willed pistols. Dual-willed pistols, yep. And you can sort of massage it a little bit just because you can say, oh, well, she could wield the sword if you gave her the warrior class or whatever, but her primary class in this game is good.
00:03:22
Speaker
So that's why I went with that. And you can even maybe argue a little bit the songstress, but either way. Exactly. Either way, she's not man willing. It's not sort. Yeah. So I.
00:03:36
Speaker
One with Yuna because, again, I think she is a very strong lead in Final Fantasy X2, but also her growth from X to X2 is absolutely incredible. She grows as a character so much, and she goes from a very quiet, very shut-in character that
00:04:00
Speaker
doesn't really look at the world in ways that aren't very black and white to kind of doing things her own way and operating in a way where it's like, I don't care. Like I want to know more about this sphere that I found and I need
Innovative Combat Systems in RPGs
00:04:20
Speaker
to know more. And so the entire game is
00:04:24
Speaker
for the most part centered around her journey of trying to find answers. And I think that level of
00:04:31
Speaker
taking initiative and being like, hey, this is what we're doing. This is what I want to know. But then also kind of realizing there is bigger problems in the world and bigger things that they kind of have to solve and going from going from there and still being able to pivot to that. I think that's that's pretty massive. So Yuna is my number five on this list. And like I said, this is a tough one, I think.
00:04:56
Speaker
If it wasn't the case that some of the reason why I feel strongly about Yuna as a protagonist wasn't because of the fact that she was in Final Fantasy X, I think she would be higher up on the list.
00:05:15
Speaker
Fair enough. And like, I like, I like, that was such a, this is just such a great person in that. I'm sad. I didn't think about it. And like, it's funny. My brain goes to final fantasy 10, where everybody points it as Titus is the main character, right? And I keep going, no, 10, two Yuda is.
00:05:36
Speaker
and technically she's kind of like a co-lead with Final Fantasy 10 too you can argue because like a lot are original 10 because like a lot of what goes on in the game she's also a big influence in it um so you can like kind of argue that too but like oh i didn't think about that but yeah she she comes into more of herself and like her whole growth of that but like yeah she wields guns she does she doesn't like you can make her wield a sword but her default is guns or i mic a dancing and singing
00:06:05
Speaker
It's also really funny because we were, we were hanging out in a stream yesterday where we were talking about like what the podcast episodes were going to be. And somebody mentioned that, that person mentioned the person we were watching. We were both there. And I was just like, I was just like, Oh, they did too. And I just, I didn't even dawn on me because I had already like my list figured out for that. She's already on the list. So.
00:06:35
Speaker
That's hilarious. That's hilarious that they guessed that. Yeah.
00:06:40
Speaker
So that's your number five. My number five is just, I find this game super unique in the way that it doesn't clutch on like stereotypical like JRPG, like sword, bow, sort of stuff. And so I had to put this main character on it because they're growing on me a lot. And that's Rindo from Neo The World Ends With You. Ooh, okay.
00:07:07
Speaker
I love how the world ends with you. The whole thing is like you get pins that you can equip that lets you do different moves. But Neo took that to a whole other level where you can make any of your characters be whatever you wanted.
00:07:23
Speaker
While there is like a kind of like a slashing move, there's also like long range shooting moves, there's charge and magic moves, there's like gravitational moves where it brings everybody together. Like you can literally put Rindo on whatever you want. And I find I'm switching between like three different movesets for him, finding that perfect sweet spot for him.
00:07:47
Speaker
of whether he's like pulling everybody together, he's shooting from afar, or he's going in for close range attacks. But it's all based on these pins. They're not actual like weapons, which I think is really freaking cool. It's a unique system. Yeah, it's such a unique system that I was like, and I like him as a main character a little bit more than the original Neku from the world that's with you, OG Neku. And so, and Neku, I felt like they kind of like
00:08:17
Speaker
pushed a little to more like yeah it's still pins but like it's a little more obvious that it's like he's got a little bit more of a slashy move slashy slashy move okay um but uh but with rindo um with neo the world ends with you and stuff and you start off with the pins and you can put whatever you want on him right at the start to use
00:08:36
Speaker
Um, and, uh, his development in the game somewhere, I haven't even beaten the game and he's on my list because I think, I think he balances with his, the second, like the, the, the party really well. And like the other characters, like he starts off with his best friend and one of his best friends.
00:08:54
Speaker
Fret. And Fret's kind of like head empty positivity. And Rindo's more like, hold back wanting to decide, plan things out sort of thing. They balance each other really well. So Rindo's very familiar.
00:09:11
Speaker
Just my a little bit. So Rindo, Rindo just has like a lot of the characteristics I like in other people and try to aspire to myself, but not necessarily achieve. But and so I, I, I see a lot of like people I care about qualities in him. And I'm just like, I really like him as a main character. I like how his development goes. And like and his time traveling abilities, but also just
00:09:40
Speaker
that you can make them whatever you want and the pin system is so cool because it's like you know they're not weapons they're like magic abilities and that is pretty cool it's just such a cool game and like it's such a cool mechanic that i'm like i was like i'd be shooting myself with a foot if i didn't put like something there and i'm like i i as main characters it was neku rindo and i like rindo better than
00:10:03
Speaker
the Neku was very like closed off of the world kind of character and Rindo is more like I'm gonna analyze and figure this out and like plan this out sort of character and like a little bit more like I got my two friends and I'm happy kind of thing.
00:10:21
Speaker
Whereas Neku, you know, there's a whole reason for his stuff or whatever, and he evolves as it goes. But I like, like, I think out of the two, I really like Rindomar, and yeah, he does not have a sword. He has a pin. So I was like, yes! And I just wanted to mention the cool battle mechanics, because I think a lot of people should play Justifa for the battle mechanics.
Unique Characters in RPGs: Shadow Hearts & Fire Emblem
00:10:47
Speaker
It's very unique.
00:10:51
Speaker
All right. So number four. Yeah, let's do it. All right. You want to do number four? I thought you were going to go. OK, you want me to go. OK. All right. So my number four is a character. KJ doesn't know. Oh, OK. And I'm more specifically referencing the second game over the first game. But it's Yuri from Shadow Hearts.
00:11:19
Speaker
Ooh, okay. I am very interested to learn more about this character, but also I hate them already, so. Yeah, so.
00:11:31
Speaker
So Yuri does not use weapons. He uses his fists. And so I'm going to try very hard not to spoil anything. But Shadow Hearts 1, they were going for a more darker theme. And they definitely pushed Yuri's, especially in the translation more than in the OG Japanese version.
00:11:54
Speaker
uh the translation more of it uh he says some questionable things and you're like okay um but playing both games and revealing all the story you've you get it by it um in the second game he is um
00:12:14
Speaker
less that. And they went for a little slightly younger audience. So they so Shadow Hearts one is a horror game mixed with RPG elements. So our RPG game that has sorry, mixed with horror elements. Sorry, I should say it the other way around because it's more RPG than horror game. But it has a lot of dark themes. It has a lot of mature stuff, blood gore, things like that. So it is a team plus sort of game. In the second game, it is actually team.
00:12:44
Speaker
So they changed the rating by reducing it a little bit because they realized they kinda went a little extreme with the first one. And they pushed it a little bit too far with everything. So in the second game, they dial it back a little bit. And honestly, you start to see a lot more of his personality and stuff. So he comes out and he's just a really cool character. In terms of like, there's like,
00:13:11
Speaker
Ryu, for me, if he didn't use swords, would maybe replace Yuri if he was less of a silent protagonist. But Yuri has a whole plot development and a lot of character development and stuff, but also has transformation abilities, which is just really fucking cool. And the gameplay and the mechanics and everything and everything around Yuri as a character
00:13:35
Speaker
While yes, there are some things that what KJ is referencing is, especially right at the start of the first game, there's some questionable stuff. Once you play through the both games, while it's still like, you have the whole story.
00:13:50
Speaker
complete and you get it, if that makes sense. And so for him, like I I I love the development between the two games. I loved his relationship with other characters in the game. I love how he he started handling things and everything. As you go throughout the game, I'm being as vague as possible because KJ may play these games. I do have to play these games. I'm going to play them.
00:14:19
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I know I put the first game on your blog. I'm going to at least play through. Yeah.
00:14:25
Speaker
Yeah. And like, and like the third one, he, like, like the third one is it's kind of, it's like own standalone thing. So like a lot of people can play that without playing one and two. Um, but with one and two, they, they directly connect to each other. And because you've played Koudelka, you'll see the little bits in there too, that Koudelka led into them. And, uh, yeah, it's the whole journey between the two games of this character makes you really feel for them.
00:14:52
Speaker
as you go through it and like they they do a really good job from going from one extreme emotion of this character to the other and so yeah and i found myself i was like beginning i was like who the fuck is this asshole and then we go through and i'm like okay all right all right get that so yeah uh he's really interesting protagonist uh very interesting game
00:15:18
Speaker
entirely mixing the horror elements into an RPG game. CodeDelca did that too, but they fell short on a lot of ways with it. So they were more of a horror game with RPG elements. Shadow Hearts is more of a RPG game with horror elements. Which I think is the better combination if you're doing those two. Because of, like, many, many reasons.
00:15:43
Speaker
Anyway, yeah, the game is really interesting. The character is really interesting. I love that he just he has no weapon. He's just like, I'm just going to beat shit up. And he starts out with that, too, because it's like, oh, and then and then your other character has a Bible. So
00:15:59
Speaker
It's just, it's a very interesting, like, huh, where it's just a while, no sword character. Anyway, but yeah, right at the beginning anyway. So that, that game progresses really well and he has a lot of development throughout the two games. So yeah, Yuri's my number four. Okay. Very unique.
00:16:18
Speaker
I can't wait till you play it. It'll be very interesting if you feel the same way I do or if I had young Polly Blinders on. We'll see. I want to see how your opinion goes when you play these games. So it's interesting. When I was thinking about this list, it was kind of tough for me, right? Because I think I was going through and I was actually going through a lot of the Fire Emblem games because
00:16:48
Speaker
A lot of the Fire Emblem games have main characters that don't wield swords. It's funny. Everybody always talks about how in Smash there's all these characters that wield swords because you have Marth, and you have Roy, and you have Ike, and you have Corrin, and you have Krom, which Krom is borderline there.
00:17:12
Speaker
And by the way, they talk about all these characters that wield swords, but if you look at specifically Fire Emblem Blazing Blade, Fire Emblem Sacred Stones, and Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn, which I've not played Radiant Dawn all the way through, so I can't really use the protagonist there, you start to see that there's actually, like,
00:17:40
Speaker
There are characters that wield swords, but there's also sort of other main characters. It's almost kind of similar to like a Star Wars 2.
00:17:52
Speaker
where you have two main characters and you can kind of go either path. That's kind of how some of these Fire Emblem games are done. So I'm going to I'm not going to use Fire Emblem Three Houses because I I truly do believe that Byleth is the main character of that game, not that not the house leaders. But I'm actually going to use Ephraim from Fire Emblem Sacred Stones now. OK.
00:18:18
Speaker
The reason I chose Ephraim, so Ephraim is one of two siblings. So him and his sister, Erica, both royalty. So he's he's the prince. She's a princess. And he's very much sort of like the what you want in a night character. Right. So he is a very like sort of battle tested stoic, like
00:18:47
Speaker
good leader from a standpoint of sort of battle and what to do and all these different things. But one of the things that, and this is gonna be spoiler, this is gonna be spoilers for anybody that's gonna play Fire Emblem, Sacred Stones.
00:19:07
Speaker
So it's going to be a while before I'd be able to play it. So I'll probably yeah, you'll probably forget this. And it is kind of obvious like they they lay it out kind of kind of obviously. But so Efra has a hard time with communication, which is something that it's like, OK, he whether that's like communicating his feelings or anything like and you kind of see that in his interactions with.
00:19:32
Speaker
people that aren't necessarily close to him and even with people that are close to him. But one of the things that is really, really interesting is seeing his interactions with who ends up being the final boss of the game, pretty much because they were like childhood best friends.
00:19:56
Speaker
So I think later on in the game, because like I went with Ephraim's route and honestly, it's kind of there's not too much of a difference. Like you basically play through and then it diverges in the middle and then it comes back together and you have the whole party. But I played through Ephraim's route and you kind of see how he grows with the party.
00:20:21
Speaker
And then you also get to see this interaction with again, what ended up being like his childhood best friend, which there's a whole story behind sort of why he became evil and it's really interesting to see. And I think it's definitely one of those games that I enjoyed Fire Emblem Sacred Stones for
00:20:44
Speaker
a lot of the characters, honestly, and the fact that it is just a good game. But there are other reasons why it's lower on my list of Fire Emblem games and stuff like that. But in terms of thinking about protagonists that have a. That don't have a sword, rather Ephraim was definitely the one that came to mind because.
00:21:09
Speaker
It is actually, it is a good amount of it is his, a good amount of the game is his story. Whereas like I look at other names and like, even though I like characters like Lynn and Hector from Fire Emblem 7 more, I still don't think it's as much of their story as the story in Sacred Stones is Ephraim. So that's why I decided.
00:21:32
Speaker
to put Ephraim on the list. And yeah, I thought I knew you were going to get some way of a Fire Emblem character on the list. Oh, yeah, of course, definitely. Honestly, if if I didn't have any other. Characters like if I didn't pull into the depths of some games that I've played, I probably would have had more Fire Emblem characters, but Ephraim, I feel like fit what
00:21:58
Speaker
Uh, like fit the criteria and also of all of the non sword wielding, uh, non sword wielding Lord characters. They call them like the main characters. Ephraim was the one that I thought was the story was more of his than anybody else's. So, um, fair.
00:22:22
Speaker
So yeah, so I think you did four, so now I have to start with three? Yeah, you do. Okay. I knew it was like, I mostly was just like, yeah, because I, audience knows I've played one Fire Emblem and I was told that was one of the bad ones. So I have no experience with the Fire Emblem series, but I was like, I knew in my head, I'm like, KJ's going to have a Fire Emblem character on it. I just didn't know which one it was going to be from, which game.
00:22:50
Speaker
Oh, yeah. I thought a lot of the characters do have like a lot of swords. So I was like, okay. Yeah, it's interesting because there's actually a good amount that don't. So I mean, more do than don't, but there are still, but there's still a good chunk that don't. Okay. Yeah. There's still quite a few Lord characters that don't like.
00:23:10
Speaker
So, yeah. So what's your number three? You've played this game. I don't know if the character is going to be on your list, but you've played this game and I got you to play this game. OK, OK. So three for me is actually Setsuna from I am Setsuna. Oh, she's so wonderful.
00:23:38
Speaker
She's just such a good character and it's The best way I can explain it is She is effectively Yuna but is Has the resolve to say no, we're going to do things this way and
00:24:05
Speaker
This is a game, like, I love this game so much, I can't even really talk too much about Setsuna because I don't want to give it away, I just want people to play the game. Yeah, yeah, that's the... Her main weapon is like a chakram.
00:24:27
Speaker
And yeah, like I said, she is just she's a very good character. She does a great job of. She does a great job of being a. Good party member, pushing dialogue and like.
00:24:50
Speaker
When I say pushing dialogue, I mean specifically keeping the tone of the game where it is supposed to be.
00:25:00
Speaker
Like she just fits into the story and the cast so well. And even though she's not necessarily the character that you're controlling, the story is about her. She is the main character. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was definitely the first. Like that was the one that recently came to mind. Oh, my goodness. Yeah, that game. You were expecting that, were you?
00:25:30
Speaker
What's that? You weren't expecting that. That's one of the ones I guessed. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, one of the ones I guessed. Interesting. That wasn't on my list. Setsuna was not on my list until I'm actually surprised because you got me to play that game and you were emotionally involved in my play through of that as when you first play. Oh, yeah. And the thing was, I like I said, I thought there's been a lot of games. Yeah, I get it.
00:25:59
Speaker
I totally forgot and I was just sitting here looking at my Switch games and I was like, oh, wait, I am Setsuna.
Estelle from Trails in the Sky: A Relatable Protagonist
00:26:06
Speaker
Yes. So. OK, so number three for you, I think. I think I know one character that's going to be here, but.
00:26:21
Speaker
So my number three is incredibly new to the list. The only reason I'm putting them there is because I have a funny feeling they're just going to keep continuing to be somebody I love. And honestly, I think
00:26:38
Speaker
Shut up Kind of yes, I've finally made I met a character that's like me in a game The only reason she is not higher up on my list right now is because I haven't played
00:26:53
Speaker
the three games because you haven't finished the game. I haven't played the, yeah, I haven't finished the game and I just felt like I wanted to put her in this list because like I want to acknowledge that like she has, she bumped out a character that I have loved for a like 20 fucking years out of this list. Um, because
00:27:12
Speaker
because I liked her so much and I enjoy her as a character. Yeah, so mine is Estelle from Trails in the Sky. It's mine and KJ's like our next podcast episode, as many as you probably know. We are doing like a joint session one and two. And so I am, you know, getting towards the end of the first game, but I haven't beaten it quite yet. But because I really like this character a lot, she's in the list. She actually bumped out a character out of
00:27:42
Speaker
fifth spot are out of this like the order shifted with her going kind of like right in the middle and the two characters being above her like I mean I've completed the game so um but yeah for me for Estelle she's she wields a staff
00:27:58
Speaker
no sword. And she is just, she's just me in an RPG game. And it's very uncanny how much that it's like, coming true. Like, there's some things that she says that I'm like, okay, I wouldn't say that. But there's a lot of things where I'm just like,
00:28:17
Speaker
i'll say it and then she'll say it and i'm like this is bonkers in the game and she's just like really motivated and gung-ho and like driven to do the thing even if she doesn't necessarily have like like
00:28:35
Speaker
every like she doesn't have all like the knowledge necessarily to go for it she's like she's still like i'm gonna do this i'm i'm gonna do this i'm gonna get through this i i'm really driven to do this task and it's like even for me as like an artist uh growing up like while my parents tried to get me like art books and stuff like that a lot of it was self-taught because i didn't have we didn't really have the internet
00:29:01
Speaker
and tutorials and stuff like that that way. And then like the teachers that I would have that was teaching art in elementary school were like, I mean, it was more for like fun. And then even in high school, uh, when we started getting a little access to the internet, I had dial up for most of my high school. I know I'm dating myself right now, but like, but like, but like halfway through my high school years, we had dial up. And so like,
00:29:30
Speaker
my art teachers in high school were like very like let's play flowers and mold stuff out of clay but like not really like teaching you anything they were just getting you to do it if that makes sense and so um so art became like really and like i see that in Estelle with her wanting to be a bracer
00:29:51
Speaker
is that she has the fundamental talent to be it, but she doesn't want to read the books and do the homework of it. She just wants to get up and go and just do it. It works out well that she's with Joshua all the time or whatever, and he balances that out for her a little bit. It reminds me of me a lot where I'm just so driven to do these things. I just don't always know how to do them.
00:30:17
Speaker
I've got great partner and best friend, life partner and then best friend here on the podcast with me who can
00:30:30
Speaker
balance out the stuff I don't. And then I can balance out the stuff that they don't like, it just, I don't know, she's just a great character. And she's well developed into like, such a realistic character. And I don't know, I really like her. I love this still. She's great. Oh, man. I'm so excited to talk about that.
00:30:52
Speaker
Oh my goodness. It's funny. So like, Oh my God. Like there's so, so many similarities that I'm seeing with me. It's like, Oh, look, it's me, but a RPG character. And I went into the trail series and like not expecting that at all. I just, I want to put that out on the table. Like P stone, like, you know, advocating for trails in the sky. Um, you know, um, they really need to hire him.
00:31:21
Speaker
Um, he's gotten so many people to play it. I'm just like, okay, you know, like I, I, I saw some of the art. Uh, I had a friend who did some, um, uh, fan art of it before. So it was like, I knew kind of what some of the characters look like before going into it, but I'm like, Oh yeah. You know, fantasy RPG game got it. You know, but like, it's like creepy how much the big character are similar. Like I'm like, wait.
00:31:49
Speaker
Were you in my life before I knew? Yeah, it's pretty wild. There were plenty of times where I was like, oh, this is Polly. This is wild. And at first when you were saying that, I was like, is this a bad way? And then you're like, I'll keep playing the game. And then as I kept playing, I was like, oh, no, no, no, no, OK. This is like in a good way. Sometimes in a silly way.
00:32:19
Speaker
Oh, yeah. But yeah, that is that is my number three. And yeah, playing Trails has bumped out a character out of this list off off of the list. And it's like, oh, I think I know what character it is, but I'll have to hold off to see. I think it's a character of a game that I played around this time last year, a little earlier than this last year.
00:32:47
Speaker
I already gave my number three, right? Yeah. So you're on it's, I think it's you for number two. So my number two, I can't really talk a whole lot about because you already did. I did.
00:32:59
Speaker
It's Satsuna. Oh shit. Wait, I did not expect that. That's actually really funny. That's why I, that's honestly, oh, such a good girl. Like when I said that, cause I'm like, yeah, she was number two for me. Um, I I'm, I'm certain like, once I get through more trails and stuff, Estelle will move up. Um, so we might have that order a little bit more similar. That means I might pull the rug from underneath you on your number one. Oh no.
00:33:29
Speaker
Oh no. So Satsuda, yeah. So Satsuda, you've already said a lot about her. I consider her the main character too. She's literally the game's named after her. I thought it was really cool, her little tracker things. Like they were her hair piece and they were her weapons. I thought that was really fucking cool.
00:33:45
Speaker
Um, and yeah, they've kind of got like a circular bladed in it, but I was like, that's a real stretch if somebody's going to be after me, that that's a sword. Cause I'm like, yes, it has a blade in it, but like, you could say that you could say that with spears. I'm like, nah, nah, nah. These are like chakrams, like circular.
00:34:01
Speaker
um curved blades and stuff like that and i'm like no this is this is a very different weapon uh but yeah she she is the combined of and the funny thing is is you you said Yuna and i was like shit the funny thing is is like Setsuna has a lot of Yuna qualities in her um that i find like
00:34:24
Speaker
I am Setsuna is very like Chrono Trigger Final Fantasy 10 vibes for me and so like the funny thing is as I remembered Setsuna because you got me to play that game and it's one of my like more fonder ones that I've screamed that I was really excited that you got me to play because I was like this game is fucking amazing and I want people to go play it.
00:34:44
Speaker
And like you, I'm not going to say a whole lot about it, but, uh, yeah, I, I had her as number two. So that's why I laughed because you had her as number three. And I was like, nice, but I didn't think of Yuda. I did think of Yuda, but I thought of Satsuda. That's kind of wild. It's wild. Yeah. How they're so like closely related in my head that like.
00:35:15
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I was when I was doing the playthroughs saying that she gave me univives, but like, I don't know. There's just.
00:35:24
Speaker
I just, it didn't, maybe it's because like Final Fantasy 10 too, I'm also a little frustrated with, and I've told a lot of people this is a lot of secret. Where like when I was, when I first came out, I played it and I, I worked really, really hard to get a hundred percent and I missed the hundred percent perfect ending by like point something of a percent. I missed one stupid scene on the gull wind or whatever.
00:35:48
Speaker
the ship or whatever it was between brother and Yuna or brother talking about Yuna in a weird freaking way. I missed that entire scene. And so I didn't get the perfect ending and I was so mad. And then when I looked it up on YouTube to see what the perfect ending was, I was even more mad because I felt like the grind wasn't worth it.
00:36:12
Speaker
So it was just so frustrating. I think Deep Down 10-2 still has that in it as much as I liked it. I liked the Una in it, I liked the story, I liked the character, I liked the combat a lot. The combat was great. One of the main reasons why I put a lot of hours into that game. But I've not gone back to it to play the remaster yet because I'm still a little bit salty.
00:36:35
Speaker
makes sense i don't know about happening so it's so funny because i kept comparing satsuda when i was playing the factor to yuda i did not think of satsuda i did not think of yuda but i thought of satsuda it could also be because she's on my like in the immediate future to cosplay her so i'd also put a little bit that i'm like but i also have a half put together ten two yuda outfit
00:36:57
Speaker
So it's like oh, I have it half finished.
Complex RPG Characters: Fay from Xenogears
00:37:00
Speaker
I just have to make the top Like I have the wig. I have the skirt thingy. I have the guns modeled out like I Just have to print them and paint them. I'm like, I literally have this almost done and I didn't think of it anyway But yeah, so as soon as my number two Was in year number two
00:37:22
Speaker
My number two is a very, very complex character. And I'm going to say this. I'm going to say that this is very this is probably spoilery. My number two is Fay from Xenogears. The silence makes me think I might have just pulled the rug from underneath you and I'm sorry.
00:37:54
Speaker
He's number two for you. Faye is number two for me. Interesting. Okay, I think I know you're number one then. Because, so, did you think Faye was number one? I did, yeah. Faye is number two for me. And the reason why is because, so, going through that game,
00:38:21
Speaker
all of the things that like Faye is. A very, very unique character he has. Part of part of it is like. He's part of a line of like and again, this is super spoilery, so if you don't want to hear Xenogear spoilers, please fast forward. I'll give you a second to do so, but yeah.
00:38:48
Speaker
So the thing about Fay is that he is basically part of a line of like reincarnations of something very important. So that alone is really fucking cool. And with that comes ties to a lot of crazy people that are trying to use him for various different things.
00:39:18
Speaker
And also, because of that, he experienced some trauma that put him in a state of basically internally building different personalities. And those different personalities shine through in the game in various different places and manifest themselves in different ways. And you get to see a lot of
00:39:47
Speaker
the inner workings of Faye's mind.
00:39:51
Speaker
throughout the entirety of the game. And I find that to be super interesting. I see the different personalities of Faye, and I think, wow, that is really cool. That is really cool that that is that way. And I think that they do a very, very good job of painting that full picture of Faye and really, really
00:40:18
Speaker
sort of pushing him as a character, which then pushes the narrative and tying him into the story, even though the way that they do it is kind of backloaded, like they tell a lot of the story late. I think everything that is like they is one of the centers of everything. And I think the way that his story is told and the story itself and how he interacts throughout the entire game is just a work of art.
00:40:48
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. I'm surprised that you thought he was going to be number one. I I thought he was going to be number one. I did. I you just you bamboozled me. Nice. Well, I can talk about number one. All right. Yeah, we did both our our twos. Yeah, I can talk about number one and number one was already mentioned.
00:41:14
Speaker
and I can go into a little bit more depth because I have beaten both of the games that number one stars in. Number one for me is Estelle. Estelle is such a good character and without giving
00:41:40
Speaker
too much background like just to add on a little bit more like the progression that she goes through to like within in the second game and like her motivation like her the fact that she's like dead set on what she's which is going through her motivations and the fact that she is very persistent and
00:42:10
Speaker
strives to get to a point that she's happy about, and all while upholding her morals and upholding what she believes, I think is just so fucking good. And again, I just think she has everything, every, just every quality that you want in a, like,
00:42:36
Speaker
main character leader, like she grows into that role so well. And so, yeah, I think. I really do think that. In terms of of this, like, had this been before I played Trails in the Sky, they would have been number one, even if it if before I played Trails in the Sky, second chapter, they would have been number one. But second chapter is like
00:43:06
Speaker
First chapter is a lot of world building and things. Second chapter is very much focused on Estelle and her journey. So without giving up, I'm being very vague intentionally, but yeah, I definitely would say that that is why I would say Estelle is number one for me.
00:43:37
Speaker
That makes me very excited. Honestly, that makes me very excited because like I she's building up. She's already a number three for me. Yeah. And I've only partway done the first game. Yeah, you're like sixty five percent done with the first game, sixty five, seventy percent done. Yeah. So like so it makes me really excited that she like bumped up to number one for you when you played the second one because like that that also drives me forward to a little bit.
00:44:06
Speaker
um but yeah that is that also makes me really happy because you guys keep saying it's me so i'm i'm at the top of your list the poly the poly
Reflecting on RPG Character Influence and Development
00:44:19
Speaker
character is at the top of kj's lips i love it okay um yeah my number one is what i thought your number one was of course it is
00:44:30
Speaker
And it's so funny because I think Estelle's gonna beat out that number one spot once I play the second game. I think we're gonna have the same opinion over number one. But yeah, mine is favorite Zito Gears. Everything that KJ said is the same with me. Like he has a lot of, he has so much character development in that game. It is wild.
00:44:51
Speaker
And from like, as opposed to like Yuri having a lot of character development between the two games and like, and everything, Yuri kind of starts out as like, you're like, yeah. Whereas Fei, I started out like enjoying him from right at the start. Like right at the start, I enjoyed him as a big character right away. And so, and he has a lot of layers and a lot of development.
00:45:16
Speaker
and his relationship with other characters and stuff like that. It was phenomenal the way they painted him as a main character. And that whole game's gameplay mechanics of doing the combos and the death blows and things like that, it's just so wildly unique. It's funny that I have two punchy characters on my list, just characters who use their fists.
00:45:46
Speaker
And yeah, Faye is number one. I loved him as a main character in Zito Gears. I just recently played Zito Gears. And I'm just playing Neo right now. So the funny thing is I have my two most recent stream games as characters on this list. Makes sense. Three out of the five characters are my stream games. And then one of them is our podcast game.
00:46:15
Speaker
And like I said, they pushed off Rina. They did. Thank you. Yes, they pushed off Rina. Rina would have been on this list, but Estelle pushed the list around, made the list a little bit more round. And like, as much as I love, I love Star Ocean 2 and the split between you could play Claude or Rina. And I love that and stuff like that. I love her as a character. For me, Setsuna just stood out as a little bit more of a stronger character for me.
00:46:45
Speaker
and Estelle I'm really enjoying too and stuff like Rita had been in my top five for like would have been in my top five for like most of my RPG history up until the last few years of like playing new RPG games because I love Star Ocean 2 and
00:47:04
Speaker
I've played it many times. I've gotten all the endings, which is ridiculous, by the way. I've played that game like 15 times. It's insane. But it was like one of my comfort games as a kid growing up. And Reno would have been on that thing, but like, no, I'll sit soon. Estelle moved things around, and then I was like, I put Rindo on because I was like, it's just, I really wanted to not only highlight him as a character, but also just the really unique combat.
00:47:34
Speaker
of like the pin structure for attacks and stuff like that, not like the traditional weapons and stuff. But yeah, they, yeah. They, Setsuna, Estelle, Yuri, and Rindo are my five.
00:47:46
Speaker
I'm still really surprised Yuri is there. I need to know more about this character. So Yuri is going to be an interesting thing. I either think you might end up agreeing with me, but I also might think it might not because keep in mind, I played Shadow Hearts in my teens, early teens. So, um,
00:48:13
Speaker
a while ago. And there are some parts that didn't age very well. But at the same time, the whole development of the character is really interesting. And they've got a whole wide range of layers. And that's all I'm going to say, because I don't want to spoil anything. But it'll be very interesting. I think you're going to play the two games, and you're going to be like, oh, OK, I see. Or you're going to play the two games, and go, nah.
00:48:43
Speaker
I have a feeling I already have seen enough of Yuri to think I'm going to hate him, but we'll see. Wow, that actually went different than what I expected. I save your number one to toss me for a loop because when you said Faye is number two, my mind went OK. Did he did Estelle just like jump all the way up to first for him?
00:49:11
Speaker
Or is Estelle just not on this list because he has another first that I just don't know about? I mean, the thing is, it's tough, right? Because so before I thought about Setsuna, the main character of Suikoden 2 was on the list. The problem is Suikoden 2, Legend of Lagaia, Suikoden 1, they all have basically silent protagonists. So it's really hard to like, even though they do have a story,
00:49:41
Speaker
some of it is left up to interpretation so like at least the gameplay wise so it's really hard to kind of do that like they they they're they're not like traditional sort of protagonists so that is that is really tough but i will say like
00:50:04
Speaker
It was tough to leave the main character of Suikoden 2 off just because of all of the things that happened. All the things that happened in that game immediately make you sort of feel for the main character and like the main character. So yeah, I don't know. I definitely think that
00:50:31
Speaker
I'm pretty happy with the way my list went, and I think it'll be interesting because I feel like more Trails characters could end up on the list. There's one other Trails character that the main character of Sky 3 is potentially growing on me. I don't really, I can't really tell, so we'll see. But yeah, it's I didn't expect that to happen, but yeah, the Estelle really grew on me very quickly.
00:51:05
Speaker
That makes me very happy. I'm excited to play board trails. And yeah, in my list, I mean, Yuri was one of the last nostalgia ones on there. Because Rita was there too, originally. And then I kind of debated between her and Yuri. And I think, wow, I think Rita might be the better person.
00:51:29
Speaker
Yuri had way more, like there was more interesting.
00:51:37
Speaker
more interesting development. Rina kind of progressed the way I expected. Yeah, definitely. Rina did not progress the way I expected. Okay. I can get that. So, yeah. So, it was one of those things where it's just like it caught me off guard because like, you know, playing through the first one, I was like, I don't fucking like this guy. I liked the other characters. But after going through both games and going through and seeing the progress, it like changes.
00:52:06
Speaker
So, like, I had the two of them, and I was like, just sitting there thinking about it. And then, Setsuna, I immediately already had in my list because of, we had been talking about it recently, too.
00:52:21
Speaker
There was somebody with the username of the other guy. So it was still kind of fresh in my mind from that. So I had that. And then I put like, I had Fay because I was like, of course, like now that I've played Xenogears, I'm like, of course, he's in there. So then I was just like playing around with the order and everything. But
00:52:41
Speaker
I'm enough into trails that I like Estelle a lot as a character And so I was like I could put her in there It's just I didn't want to put her super high up yet because I was like I'm like a half a game in of like multiple So like I'm like I need I want to at least get through the first it so it'd be really interesting and
00:53:02
Speaker
as we progress through our RPG goodness. And I think this would be really fun for some of these to like revisit them in a year or a couple of years or whatever for the podcast and just like see how much they change. Like a lot of our recordings, some of them like I can see some of them changing, even like our top 10 list. Possibly. Because our top 10 list for you right now, like you're going through trails. It might have a trails game in there. Ah, it's tough.
00:53:34
Speaker
Like. I'm I'm really, really. It's. It's tough because the games are good, but I really struggle with. If. I would say they're like.
00:54:01
Speaker
better than some of these games that are very standalone. Even with Golden Sun, for example, the more RPGs I play, the lower Golden Sun goes down my list. And I think part of that is because even though it'll still always be one of my favorite RPGs, or my favorite RPG, I realize that the fact that you need a second game takes away from it.
00:54:31
Speaker
And I think that's something with Trails in the Sky first and second chapters. As standalone games, they're very good, but if I were to compare Trails in the Sky
00:54:46
Speaker
first or second chapter to say a Valkyrie profile or a Lunar or Wild Arms 2, I would have a very difficult time saying, oh, I would take Trails in the Sky over that game. Like, if I was comparing the entire body of work, I would say Trails in the Sky. But because they're two disjointed things, it's tough. So, yeah.
00:55:16
Speaker
That's my take on that. That's fair. That's fair, yeah. Yeah, that does make it a little bit more difficult. But yeah, the games are great. I will say the games are fantastic.
00:55:31
Speaker
We'll talk more about them on the actual podcast for them, obviously. But I'm excited. Yeah, I think we can we can wrap this one up. So we do have some other bonus episodes that we're considering thinking about, et cetera, et cetera. And we'll we'll get there. We will get there and we'll get to do those. But I think we are.
00:55:56
Speaker
at a point where, yeah, it'll be the last couple of bonus episodes that we've recorded, and then we'll have the main podcast episode, and then we should be back on schedule to continue on. I think the next game after this is the last story, so that'll be fun.
00:56:14
Speaker
Yeah, I'm excited to see what that is. I've heard a lot of people really talk about it, but I've never experienced it or seen it even played. Same. I watched one person play it, but not very closely, because I knew I was going to play it at some point. And yeah, it should be fun. I've heard good things. Awesome. All right, so we're going to wrap this up. So thanks, everybody, for listening. Another episode of turn-based tangents. And yeah, enjoy.
00:56:45
Speaker
Thank you for listening. We appreciate you. That we do. All right, everybody. Bye. Bye.